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tv   AM Joy  MSNBC  June 19, 2016 7:00am-9:01am PDT

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i feel like a supermodel except like times ten, okay? it's true. i'm a supermodel. i'm on the cover of these magazines -- i'm on the cover of the biggest magazines. i don't even know about it. i can't even read the story because if i did, i wouldn't get any work done. i've never seen anything like it. and it's not about me. i'm like -- i'm doing a good job as a messenger, but i'm a messenger. >> he feels like a supermodel. happy father's day, everyone. good morning and welcome to "a.m. joy." while donald trump may have ended a week of campaigning on a self-con congratulate tore note, people in phoenix have trump dressed up in the robes of the ku klux klan. he is adorned with a nazi swastika and standing next to a sign that reads "make america hate again." trump's falling poll numbers and controversial comments and backlash he's generated have his party worried and it's scaring
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the be jesus out of down ticket candidates. candidates like veteran senator john mccain who's up for re-election in arizona. not that mccain hasn't made some head-scratching comments of his own, like what he said this week in response to the orlando shootings. >> barack obama is directly responsible for it because when he pulled everybody out of iraq, al qaeda went to syria and became isis. >> i want to be clear, are you backtracking -- >> you want to be clear? i'm not backtracking on anything. i am saying that the president of the united states' actions, actions were responsible because of the full withdrawal of troops from iraq, which led then to al qaeda going to syria, which then led to isis. >> although mccain did walk back that comment, the original remark came on the heels of trump's even more shocking allegation that the president was complicit in the pulse massacre. it just goes to show that republicans are scrambling to hit just the right note after the deadliest shooting in u.s.
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modern history and to prevent their party from full-on trumpian implosion. who are you going to call? >> there's an issue in america. too many good docs are getting out of business. too many ob/gyns aren't able to practice their love across t country. >> you teach a child to read and he or her will be able to pass a literacy test. ♪ >> yes. enter former president george w. bush, who's been virtually absent from the political scene for the last eight years. he did not campaign for mitt romney in 2012 and announced that he would not attend next month's republican convention in cleveland. but in an effort to save his party's most vulnerable senators, including those whose
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campaigns had become more challenging with trump at the top of the ticket, bush has headlined fund-raisers for two republican senators and plans to help three more, including mccain. although mccain and bush have had their moments, while eating birthday cake while hurricane katrina ravaged new orleans, the two are plain enemies at times. remember the contentious primary contest in 2000? now they're joining forces to help secure the senator future. it's george w. bush to the rescue. can he clean up trump's mess? joining me now is dr. kelly ward, former arizona state senator and republican candidate for u.s. senate running against senator john mccain. thank you very much for being here, ms. ward. i'll start by asking you what do you make of the george w. bush rescue effort for john mccain and other senators? >> well, good morning, joy. it's great to be here with you. i want to say happy father's day to my dad out in florida. and, you know, there are a lot of things going on. the establishment is trying to
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maintain the control that they have over washington, d.c., over the empire that they have created, and they're calling in the big guns, the big establishment guns to try to maintain that status quo in washington. and i think that the people across the country are fed up with that and that's why we're seeing what we're seeing on the campaign trail. >> dr. ward, you know we've played a little bit of john mccain's implication that the president of the united states was somehow responsible for the rise of isis, but you've had actually some very strong remarks about john mccain himself. i'm going to read you a little bit of a statement that's on your website. you said libya and iraq would not be the harvard of terrorism they are now if it were not for his, meaning mccain's, knee jerk trigger happy foreign policy of promiscuously arming the supposedly moderate militants he says he is intimate with and overthrowing stable regimes. the reason john is currently losing a red state to a rubber
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stamp obama democrat is because he is dangerously distracted with his invade the world, invite the world agenda. do you believe that john mccain and his ideas are responsible for the rise of isis? >> i definitely do. i'm not going to walk it back like he did with the president. you know, hillary clinton, barack obama, john mccain, they are the people that have put us in this position where we are. the 2003 war should have taught us, that was a constitutionally declared war. and we took out a dictator that was a tyrant. but we left a vacuum there that was filled by a radical element and then we did it again in egypt and we did it again in libya. and we did it again in syria. and then the vacuum was huge and these radical islamic terrorists filled in that vacuum. and unfortunately for us here in the united states, john mccain's policy of supporting amnesty and open borders have allowed those emboldened elements to come across our border and bring
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jihad to the united states. >> let's go through a couple of, you know, policy ideas if you were to become the united states senator from arizona. it sounds to me like you would not vote for comprehensive immigration reform, would you? >> well, i think kprens i've immigration reform is code word for amnesty, so no, i am directly, definitely opposed to amnesty. i think that we do need some kind of a physical border. i'm ready to mix the mortar to fix the border and we need to have utilization of technology to the fullest extent. we need to empower the people at the border, the border patrol agents, to keep people from coming into this country. we also need to make -- >> go ahead, finish. >> we need to turn off the goodies like dr. carson used to say. we need to have a strong e-verify system. we need to make sure people aren't coming from free health care, free education, free money on the backs of the taxpayer. >> are you in favor of donald trump's idea of building a wall across the southern u.s. border?
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>> you know, i think we need some kind of a physical barrier there. we don't lock the doors of our homes because we hate the people outside. we lock the doors of our homes because we love the people inside so much and we want to protect them. that's what we're doing by having a secure border. we're protecting our sovereignty and protecting the american citizen that we love. >> let's talk about a couple of other policy ideas. donald trump would like to ban all muslim people from coming into the united states. do you agree with that? >> well, actually i don't think that's what mr. trump said. he said that we need to significantly put a halt on visas from places across the country, across the world, i'm sorry, that have been hotbeds of radical islamic terrorism until -- >> how would you implement -- >> joy, joy, wait, wait. until we have a proven process to vet those people coming into our country. >> let me ask you this. one question because we're short on time. sdmt mean that a delegation from jordan coming to the united states, you would ban that
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delegation because jordan is in the middle east and is a predominantly muslim country? >> i think that it's going to be -- it's going to be addressed on an individual basis and people who are already cleared that are delegations from jordan are much different than radical islamic jihadists who are trying to sneak across our border illegally and come into our country to harm american citizens. >> have you ever heard of an instance from a radical jihadist sneaking across the southern united states border? >> i have talked to our border patrol and they have said that people other than people from mexico and from central america are coming across our border with the intent to cause harm in this country. >> you're saying you have documented instances of that that you could share with us, because we'd love to know documented individual instances of that. >> well, joy, you're going to have to check with the border patrol on that. but i have spoken with them and they have assured me that people that are not from mexico, not from central america, but from countries that want to cause us
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harm are coming across that bourder. cia director brennan said just this week that radical islamic terrorists and jihadists have said they will infiltrate our porous southern border and the refugee process to be able to get into this country and wreak havoc. that has got to stop. >> it sounds like you would be a trump supporter. are you a donald trump supporter? >> i am a donald trump supporter. he's the nominee for the republican party and we are going to win in november with donald trump at the top of the ticket and with dr. kelli ward on the ballot for the u.s. senate. >> we shall see. we'll be following your campaign. dr. kelli ward, thank you very much. >> thanks, joy. let's bring in eric boren, michelle bernard. a lot there put on the table by dr. kelli ward. let's start at the back end of that because you worked with
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george herbert walker bush. >> and george w. >> they have a long history of pursuing just the opposite of that tack toward the muslim world. what do you make of dr. kelli ward's statement that radical jihadists are using the southern border to sneak into the united states and that she would indeed support the ban on travel to the u.s. >> i would answer that a little differently. just because there may or may not be documented proof doesn't mean you shouldn't protect against it. we all do things for preventative reasons, whether for our personal health or to protect our family and our country. that might have been a better way for her to answer that question. build a wall is not a solution. banning all muslims is not a solution. at the beginning of the clip you showed george w. bush. i'm sure many friends on the left got a good morning snicker out of that but there are many republicans and independents are pining for the day when we had a strong, successful, resilient republican leader and that man
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was george w. bush and i think he can do a lot to bring open energy to the party. >> let's look at george w. bush. he went out of the office with quite high disapproval ratings at the end of his presidency in january of 2009, he had a disapproval rating of 65% and an approval rating of 29%. let's go to the next slide there, which is that his favorables as of 2016 in february, they're pretty even, 47-47%. i think there's a bit of a post-presidential honeymoon for him. michelle, can george w. bush help democrats in a situation where people like dr. kelli ward appear to have abandoned everything that there is -- everything that there was about bush republicanism? >> you know, it's going to be really fascinating to watch how his fund-raisers help. if anything we learned from his brother's presidential candidacy is that money is not necessarily the answer to getting elected, whether it is as the next president or in some of these downstate ballots that we're seeing across the country over
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the year. it was interesting to listen to dr. ward and then also go back to some of the clips that you played of former president bush to really see the fissure and the difference that the republican party has for the country. george bush when he was president did so much work to not only fight terrorism in the country but also to go out of his way to say that under his presidency this is not an america that is isolationist, that is anti-muslim, but when you listen to dr. ward, i heard, joy, i don't know about you, but i was hearing sort of hate words. you know, words to the base that have become quite isolationist. if you're african-american, words that you listen out for that are sort of danger signs, for example, are, quote unquote, state's rights. what we heard from dr. ward, and again i point this out because i think it's important to note the difference in the two visions of what america should stand for and the republican party and
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what did we hear from her? radical, jihadist, islamist, sort of key words sort of speaking to the base of the party that follows donald trump and sort of holding on to this vision of making america great, which means our america and what america should look like. you know, so whether or not the bush presidency and everything that he stands for and his fund raising efforts are going to help, i really question. he was unable to help his brother in south carolina. anyway, it will be quite interesting to see whose vision is going to win out in today's republican party. >> it's interesting to see which republicans he's looking to help, john mccain, kelly ayotte who's in the neocon wing of the party, rob portman in ohio. when you go back and revisit the bush presidency, it's a two-track thing. after 9/11 george w. bush did indeed make a lot of positive
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insinuations toward the muslim world and say we're not at war with islam. at the same time he's also the president that had this sort of cowboy foreign policy and that, by the way, did stoke a lot of anger toward the united states with policies like torture, policies like gitmo. we saw all of those pictures that came out of those prisons that we took over that once belonged to saddam hussein where then you had americans treating people in the muslim faith -- so you had this duel track of what the george w. bush presidency was. how ironic that he's coming in to save the party from donald trump who's taken it to the extreme? >> i'm not sure how much he's going to save the party. the fact that he's going to do fund-raising is different for him. the idea that he's going to try to unify. there's no indication that he sees himself as any savior. why should he? why should he risk his reputation? so many republicans have tried
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to put a stop to the trump phenomena. mitt romney to his credit gave a speech and got flattened by the primary polls. trump just rolled right over him. so there's no indication that bush can pull this off. the news is really that john mccain needs a former president to come in and try to bail him out in a state that trump looks like is going to make a toss-up state in arizona. just one other quick question, you know, for years the far right media, rush limbaugh and sean hannity, said if we could just find a candidate that would echo our rhetoric. now they have one and trump is literally tearing the party apart. >> and extinguishing the neoconservative part of the party. those that occupy the middle of the party is on the ropes right now. >> perhaps. but i think that george w. bush's mission is a very tactical one. he's going into those swing senate races to do two things, to raise money and to rally the republican faithful and to remind them that some of the
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core beliefs that turned those voters into republicans for the first place are still on the ballot in the form of those candidates and they need to turn out, irrespective of how they feel about donald trump. they need to turn out for those types of republicans to maintain the integrity of the party and keep the senate majority. >> they're really just trying to salvage the senate at this point. >> thanks to all of you. coming up, donald trump is not the only one leading a right wing nationalist populist movement. we'll take a look at what's happening in the u.k., next.
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although donald trump fancies himself a singular political force, his populist nationalistic rhetoric that has won over particularly white working class voters is not all that unique. it's more like an extension toward the trend toward right
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wing nationalism in western countries experiencing high levels of immigration. there is the national front party in french, the party in belgium and some of the groups supporting the brexit, the campaign to get britain to leave the european union. the debate over whether britain should stay or go took a violent turn on thursday with the killing of parliament member jo cox, a rising star in the labor party and prominent backer of the effort to keep britain in the eu. according to at least one witness, the alleged killer yelled either put britain first or britain first, which is also the name of a specific right-wing group that storm warning -- strongly opposes immigration. meanwhile, both sides in the brexit debate have resumed campaigning after a three-day moratorium following cox's death. the referendum vote will be held on thursday. joining me is christopher
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dickey, former editor at "the daily beast." christopher, what is the brexit and why do right-wing nationalist groups support it? >> well, brexit is the idea that britain will leave the european union. it's been a member of the common market since 1973. but it has always been a little outside the latest developments in that union. it's not part of the eurozone, it's not part of the free travel zone, and there always have been a lot of people in britain, an island, who want to keep it an island and who feel that it is stronger when it's most independent. they don't like the dictates that come from the european union to great britain. there's all that. there are all those relatively sensible reasons that some brits want to leave the european union. but in addition to that, there are politicians that have played
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on fear, xenophobia, paranoia and anger and that is where we see the similarity with donald trump. this level of hate speak that exists in this campaign has really been extraordinary. and even if the man who murdered member of parliament jo cox was just a lunatic, he was plugged into that level of hatred and anger. and everybody in britain feels it. that's one reason everybody in britain is shocked. >> is the feeling among those who support the brexit, is it their belief if britain were to walk away from the e.u. theat there would be less immigration into england, into britain? >> yeah, but i don't think they have thought that through. first of all, the immigration -- most of the immigration into britain from the european union has been people from poland, france, elsewhere in europe. they're not really the ones that
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are provoking the reaction. the reaction is largely racist. for instance, if you look at the u.k. independence party's latest part of the campaign against eupe leaving the european union, it's a big poster that says breaking point and it shows all these arab refugees not coming into britain but coming out of greece. and they're not headed for britain. but it doesn't matter, because he wants to play the racist card. in fact somebody pointed out that it looks exactly like nazi propaganda from the late 1930s and early 1940s. and in fact what was said in that propaganda, that these people had ruined their own countries, they are going to ruin yours, is very similar to what he has been preaching about immigration. it's a campaign based on paranoia and on hate. >> we want to look at some of the polling that we've seen that appears to have been changed by jo cox's murder.
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what are you reading there on the ground? do you think that this thing is going to pass? >> i think it's really touch and go. i think the problem with the referendum, this is why so few governments wanted to have referendums or complicated issues like this, is that they're based on emotion. they're based on the emotion of the moment. the emotion that dominated the debate leading up to the end of last week was emotions based on fear of immigration, emotions based on fear that britain will never be the same. and it will never be the same whether it stays in or goes out because the world changes. now we have the element of the jo cox murder and that has changed a lot of emotions. people are shocked, they have stepped back. are they now going to react against brexit because to some extent the murder has been identified with the british nationalist movement? it's very, very hard to tell. all the results that we are
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seeing are within the margin of error, so it could go either way. >> very briefly, chris, on the question of what the brexit would do to the global economy, including the u.s. economy, what are economists are saying would happen if britain were to leave the e.u.? >> well, britain seems to think that it's going to have some kind of favored status with the united states, but president obama has already said that's just not going to be the case. britain is an island that's going to become a relatively small economy on its own, while europe will continue to be probably the biggest economy or one of the two or three biggest economies in the world. right now as part of the european union, britain is the fifth largest economy in the world. if it leaves, it's not going to hold that position for very long. one of the things that's weighing against brexit is this idea that there will be big economic costs. again, those are complicated issues. people look at the numbers and don't really know what to make of them. whereas if they're reacting to immigration and fear, it's a
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much more salient point when you get into a referendum. >> fascinating. thank you for explaining it to us, christopher dickey in paris. appreciate it. do republicans' actions speak louder than their words when it comes to lgbt rights? that's next. it takes a lot of work... to run this business. but i really love it. i'm on the move all day long... and sometimes, i just don't eat the way i should. so i drink boost® to get the nutrition that i'm missing. boost complete nutritional drink has 26 essential vitamins and minerals, including calcium and vitamin d to support strong bones and 10 grams of protein to help maintain muscle. all with a great taste. i don't plan on slowing down any time soon. stay strong. stay active with boost®. hi! hey! i've made plans for later in case this date doesn't go well. same here. wouldn't it be great if everyone said what they meant? the citi double cash card does. earn 1% cash back when you buy, and 1% as you pay. double means double.
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that's why we make more e-commerce deliveries to homes than anyone else in the country. here, there, everywhere. united states postal service priority: you let's also be clear, members of the lgbt community were the targets. they were simply attacked for who they are. >> these are all people just like us. clearly an attack on our gay community. >> ask yourself who is really the friend of women and the lgbt community? donald trump with actions or hillary clinton with her words. i will tell you who the better friend is and some day i believe that will be proven out big league. clinton wants to allow radical
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islamic terrorists to pour into our country. they enslave women and they murder gays. i don't want them in our country. >> some republicans this week sought big league to show solidarity with lgbt americans after 49 people were slaughtered in a gay nightclub in orlando. never mind that speaker ryan blocked a vote on an lgbt anti-discrimination measure and the fact that republicans in washington and in several states have spent years pushing legislation viewed by many as harmful to the lgbt community. >> vaevangelicals out there wan to trust you on traditional marriage. >> they can trust me. they can trust me on traditional marriage. frankly, it should have been state. i was very much in favor of having the court rule that it goes to states and let the states decide. >> the things you talk about like traditional marriage and family and entrepreneurship, these are american values, these are universal human values. >> the voters in 2008 decided
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that we were going to be a traditional marriage state and that's what the voters decided. it's my job as governor to uphold the law of the land. >> and if that would push the change, would you take a position on it? >> i've been married since i was 19. i believe in traditional marriage. >> my panel weighs in when we come back. ♪ (vo) you can check on them. you can worry about them. you can even choose a car for them. (mom) honey, are you ok? (child) i'm ok. (announcer vo) love. (mom) we're ok. (announcer vo) it's what makes a subaru, a subaru. think fixing your windshield is a big hassle? not with safelite. this family needed their windshield replaced, but they're daughters heart was set on going to the zoo. so we said if you need safelite to come to the zoo we'll come to the zoo!
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♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪
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♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ as far as -- as far as gays are concerned, okay, think of it, they throw gays off buildings. they kill them. countries that contribute to her foundation. and she should give all that money back to all these countries. it's tens of millions of dollars. and you know what? lgbt is starting to like donald trump very much lately, i will tell you. starting to like donald trump very, very much lately.
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>> donald trump is just one of the republicans who tried to portray himself as a champion of gay rights after the mass shooting at a nightclub in orlando. joining me now, actress and comedian judy gold, isha mills, new york congressman shawn maloney and rich tafell. i'm going with you first, congressman maloney, thank you for being here. what do you make of this sort of reset that you've seen with donald trump and some other republican leaders who have sought to say we are the true friends of the lgbt community but framed it as a way of saying because we are more opposed to what they want to term as radical islamists. >> right. well, it's -- it's insulting and it's insensitive in light of what happened one week ago today. you know, we in the community know who our friends are and we know who stood with us and we know who talks a good game but who then turns around and votes against our rights. i serve in the house of representatives. for the last three weeks, i've
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been working simply to preserve existing workplace protection in federal contracting put in place by the president two years ago. if one more republican who votes against me comes up and says, but i have gay friends or i'm -- you know where i am on your stuff personally, you know, i -- you know, i'm going to scream. the fact is, is that we are at a crossroads in this country and the republican party, and particularly speaker paul ryan, has to decide whether they are going to go down one path, which is towards racism and nativism and homophobia. whether he's going to rationalize racism and on the house floor by opposing my efforts for workplace efforts for lgbt americans or whether he's going lead up to a place of more inclusion and more tolerance. you know, the danger to people who are different, whether it's their race or it's their sexual
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orientation or gender identity, the real danger is hatred and intolerance and violence and fear. and that's what donald trump is spreading. and speaker ryan has joined him in that effort and it's wrong. >> and, you know, beyond just the federal sort of issues, and i want to come to you on this, steve, because part of the work that you've been doing is trying to bring that kind of inclusion of lgbt people into the republican party, but even if you just look at the states, just come out of the federal part of it, the number of states that have considered on enacted anti-lgbt laws, you can see that map there according to the aclu. the green states is where they have been enacted, north carolina and mississippi, the yellow is where they have been considered and in many cases haven't made it. but look at all of those attempts to enact laws based on what they're calling christian liberty, allowing people to not serve gay folks if they want to have a wedding cake done, et cetera, or laws that are otherwise considered anti-lgbt. how does the republican party reconcile that with these new statements of support for the community? >> well, i think that the
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tension underlying all this confusion that we're seeing right now is that the republicans -- >> sorry, rich. that's okay. it's good to see you again, joy. but underlying the tension here is that the republican party and its base has an evangelical christian party that has in many ways defined itself as anti-gay, which as a christian i find offensive because christianity is at its essence about love and compassion. so that core element has made the gay issue the number one issue. so you'll see many leaders like paul ryan and trump and others saying pro gay things being very much cautious because they don't want to alienate that base. i think the shooting is an opportunity for all of us to reflect on ourselves as a country but particularly people of faith. this is an opportunity to say how did we get here, where a faith is using the political process to push an agenda that is against the gay community. i should also add that even many of those killed in the attack
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who were from the african-american and latino community, they were living closeted lives also coming from traditional cultures where their faith often didn't accept it. so this is a chance to reflect at a deeper level. the republican party needs to evolve. i think many in the christian faith need to evolve to a new level and i think this shows it very clearly. it's chrrystal clear when peopl can't say lgbt or gay and go back and forth on protecting gays and lesbians on this issue. >> one more question before i leave you, rich. some of the people that died in orlando were also married or planning to get married. can one become the nominee of the republican party without taking a stand for traditional marriage, opposite-sex marriage? >> i think marriage is going to be a very important issue in the election and i think the irony of donald trump for all of his weaknesses and i'm not a fan, is that of all the republican candidates, he was probably the most gay supportive. he has certainly changed his
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tune and saying a different thing to appease the republican base to get elected this cycle and i think that's very unfortunate. it's a sad statement that the republican candidate is the most pro gay and up against all the 15 he was running against. >> the ladies are laughing. i'm going to come to the table now. i'll ask the same question to you, judy. can one become the nominee of the republican party -- we know you can in the democratic party now and that was a threshold that was only crossed a few years ago. but can you imagine somebody becoming the nominee of the republican party and saying i support same-sex marriage? >> i certainly hope so, but unfortunately we have been used as the target for them. you know, they do -- i do feel that they do run, you know, using fear. we have been on their ballots, you know, vote for me or the gays are going to take over or some transgender person is going to use the same bathroom. i travel a lot on a plane and i share bathroom -- a bathroom with whomever is on that plane.
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i don't ask, i don't care. it is -- we are constantly being used to push their anti-lgbtq agenda and it's unfair. and for these republicans to not even dignify these lgbtq people who were killed by saying this was done at a gay bar, you know, it's their whole notion that we should just shut up, be quiet and go back to the closet and don't talk about it. well, you know what, this is it. this is it. we are -- this was -- this was an unconscionable tragedy and it is going to change the entire spectrum of what is going on. >> but at the same time, you know, isn't part of the issue fear as well of the backlash against themselves? you did have a pastor this week who literally withdrew his support from donald trump, his name is james manning, of a harlem church and he had i am
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saddened to withdraw support for real donald trump. my bible beliefs are deeply held. sodomy is more dangerous to america than radical islam. that is what republicans fear, right, the withdrawal of support from conservative christians. >> what donald trump is doing is just a page out of the republican playbook. they have been dividing communities, literally dividing and conquering for years as a way for them to win. what we've seen is they have real difficulty of creating a big umbrella of acceptance for all and being able to win ein that way. so they try to pit the african-american community against the lgbt community. now they're trying to pit the lgbt community against the muslim community and they think that that's going to serve them and their whole anti-terrorism and boost them in some way. the republican playbook has time and time again shown that they have sought to dwight communities as a way to win, and that is not a winning strategy anymore for them. i think that's what they fear. i think they realize they don't have new tactics to actually
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bring all americans together so they're going back to the well and it's not working this time. >> i have to go back to the congressman before we exit and ask you, do you think that there is a moment here now, some space, that you could actually see legislation begin to move through, things like the employment nondiscrimination act that have been held up in congress? can you see your republican colleagues moving on these issues as a result of what happened in orlando? >> well, one of the ironies is that in the days leading up to this tragedy in orlando, i was successful in securing the votes of 43 republicans for my legislation that would preserve workplace protection for folks who work in employers covering 28 million people. those are the president's executive orders. so there is significant bipartisan support for this. of course the future of our rights will be a bipartisan movement. but we are at a crossroads. and you know it's father's day so i've got to say hi to my three kids at home. my partner and i have been together, now married for 24
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years and we've been parenting for 23 of those years. and we're getting a little tired of waiting for people like donald trump and paul ryan to make up their minds about whether they really believe in anti-discrimination. you cannot simultaneously say you're good on race issues and excuse the racism of donald trump. you cannot say you're getting there on lgbt equality and then time and again vote against our rights, fail to mention lgbt in the moment of silence on the house floor that's supposed to be honoring these victims. i mean, you know, yogi berra said when you come to a fork in the road, take it. the fact is, is that paul ryan and the republicans are going to have to decide whether they want to go down into more hate and more division or they want to come up into the light and into the modern world of the united states that is a diverse and tolerant country. and they need to choose. >> i'm just going to poll the table before we go. do you think there will be substantive change in terms of republican policy as a result of orlando? >> i have lost all faith in the republican party.
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i always want to know how my life and my children have any effect on their beliefs. how i am living and bringing up two wonderful, wonderful people has anything to do with destroying their families. it is -- >> no, i don't think we can expect any change which is exactly why we need to vote them out and put new elected officials in place who will do all they can do for the lgbt community. >> rich, do you think there will be substantive change? >> i think the republican party is going through a terrible crisis and we may see a new party coming out of it after this election. a new center right could be evolving. so while it's a period of chaos, something good could come out of it. >> rich has made some news here. brand new party coming out of this election. thank you all for being here. coming up, my exclusive interview with former ohio governor and current senate candidate ted strickland. you don't want to miss that.
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joining me now from columbus, ohio, is former governor and current senate candidate ted strickland. thank you very much for being here, governor strickland. let's get right to it. the polls show you neck in neck with rob portman within the margin of error, essentially tied. let's talk about donald trump. does he help you or will he bring out white working class voters, rust belt voters who are frustrated with the economy who would then vote against you? >> well, i think donald trump presents a real problem for rob portman in ohio. ohioans are not bigoted racist folks. we are common sense people and we reject donald trump's ban on muslims coming into the country. we reject his calling women pigs. we reject so much of what donald trump says and does.
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and rob portman has wrapped his arms around donald trump. and so i think that's a real problem for rob portman. >> and you're going to see the republican convention take place in cleveland, of course. we're expecting it to be a hot one, particularly if republicans try to oust donald trump from the nomination. how do you expect that spectacle in cleveland that we're expecting to impact the race for the united states senate? do you think it will have blowback on your race? >> well, i think i will do well as a result of the fact that the republican party with rob portman's blessing has chosen donald trump to be the leader of their party. he's outside the mainstream. he is not a person that ohioans by and large will find acceptable to be the president of the united states. and rob portman, unlike governor john kasich, rob portman has embraced donald trump. he's even said that he thinks that donald trump's leading the ticket will be beneficial to him
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in the end. i don't know what he's thinking, but i know ohio very well. and ohio is a common sense kind of state. we reject extremes on both the right and the left and ohio will reject donald trump and i believe ohio will reject rob portman as a result of his ' embrace of donald trump. >> why do you believe that donald trump -- i believe he won the primary there in ohio. why do you believe he's polling considerably high? you said he's not somebody who would play well in the state but he does seem to be competitive. >> if you look at the primary results, john kasich cleaned his clock in ohio. there were a few areas of the state where donald trump did okay, but by and large, governor kasich beat him badly in ohio and i think hillary clinton is going to do well in ohio. i think i'm going to do well in ohio. you know, rob portman does not fit ohio very well. he's a washington insider. he opposed the auto rescue. can you imagine a senator from
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ohio opposing the auto rescue? he's wanted to privatize social security, to voucherize medicare, cut student loans and pell grants. he's voted for all these trade deals. he's sent jobs to china when he was george bush's trade representative. i call him the best senator that china has ever had. ohio needs someone to fight for ohio jobs and not someone to give in to china. that's the difference between rob portman and ted strickland. >> what about gun, how will that issue play in your state and do you think portman will watch for gun control measures up for vote on monday? >> we'll see what senator portman does. you know, he voted against the feinstein effort in the senate and then he called a press conference and he implied that he would now support keeping guns out of the hands of terrorists by keeping them -- those on the no-fly list from
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getting a gun. and then his staff called the press apparently afterwards and said well, his position had in fact not changed. so he is twisting himself into a political pretzel. he's trying to have it both ways on nearly every issue. and ohioans are starting to throw salt on that pretzel, i can tell you. week sick and tired of this kind of washington double speak. i think it's going to hurt rob portman and his support for donald trump may be the nail in his coffin. >> all right, former governor of ohio, governor ted strickland, thank you very much for being here. >> thank you for having me. >> so much more in our next hour. paul ryan's problem with donald trump. america's islama phobia problem and the one issue that affects every american. more after the break. most revol. a car that can see trouble
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balls and strikes and just play it by the rules. so it is not my job to tell delegates what to do, what not to do or to weigh in on things like that. they write the rules, they make their decisions. all i want to make sure is it's done above board, clearly, honestly and by the rules. >> that was house speaker paul ryan on nbc's "meet the press" this morning saying he would stay neutral to any dump trump movement by republican delegates. trump calls the effort a hoax and told hallie jackson he can win in november even without a unified party. >> it would be nice if the republicans stuck together. i think because i'm a different kind of a candidate and, you know, paul ryan said that, i'm a different kind of a candidate, i think that i win either way. i can win one way or the other. >> with them or without them? >> i do believe that because i obviously won the primaries without them. i'm an outsider and i won the primaries. i do believe that we can win either way, but it would be nice if we stuck together.
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>> joining me is dean obadalla, republican strategist and former white house aide john and raul reyes and michelle bernard. i'm going to you first, michelle, since you're not here with us at the table and we do miss you, wish you were here, is it fair of people to question whether paul ryan, he is speaker of the house, he is in a sense the leader of the party in washington other than in the senate, to walk away from his party's nominee? because there does seem to be a lot of pressure on him to say if your principles are opposed to trump, you should walk away. >> i think it's, quite frankly, he is the standard bearer in the house. and on top of that if you assume, as many people are doing, that republicans are going to lose the senate with donald trump at the top of the ticket, he really does become the standard bearer of the republican party and in that respect he has the power to
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define what today's republican party stands for, what the republican party's vision is for what america is, what america should be and what america can be. and in that sense, you know, i feel that the criticism that he's playing it a little bit too safe right now is a fair criticism. the way he's telling people to vote their conscience, it's safe in the sense that he allows members of his caucus to vote their conscience as he has said but it also allows him to not necessarily anger donald trump. he finds himself in a very difficult situation because at first he was sort of anti-donald trump, not really endorsing him. now he's conditionally endorsing him. and it is one thing to come out and say as paul ryan does, to sort of decry the racist statements that donald trump has made but then to sort of temporarily or somewhat and somehow tie himself to him by endorsing him, he's also giving
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a nod to the public that maybe that really is the vision for what today's republican party stands for, and i think if he wants to save the republican party, he needs to discontinue playing it safe and come out very clear and make a statement as to what the republican party stands for, what is right, what is wrong, and tell people, you know, how he feels they should vote. >> to that voint, and i'm going to come to you on this, jean carlo. >> the last thing i would do is tell anybody to do something contrary to their conscience. believe me, chuck, this is a very strange situation. this is a very unique nominee. but i feel as a responsibility institutionally as the speaker of the house that i should not be leading some chasm in the middle of our party. because that will definitely knock us out of the white house. >> so, you know, this is i think the problem a lot of people have with that formulation.
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you have paul ryan saying that if your conscience won't let you vote for a nominee that he hasn't just called unique, but he has accused of being racist in his statements about judge curiel, if you believe that this person violates your fundamental conscience, how can you then say but i'm going to vote for him because we're republicans and we need the white house. >> in normal times, the job of speaker of the house is articlely the most difficult in politics. you have to assemble a coalition as disparate as can be in terms of house republicans in this instance. you have to manage and lead essentially the legislative branch of the u.s. government. added to that, the curveball monkey wrench that donald trump has thrown into our political system, at least on the republican side by virtue of his being the presumptive nominee, and paul ryan is in a uniquely difficult spot. >> but let me give you a hypothetical before i get to the panel. let's say david duke gets to be the nominee of what -- we won't
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name a party, of a major political party. could you then say that david duke is a former member of the can y ku klux klan, but i'm going to vote for him because he's in my party. >> if paul ryan comes out aggressively against donald trump, he may or may not -- by the way, which he has the times that trump has stemmed over the line. let's give ryan credit where it is due. the times that trump has said things that are against people of a certain mind, ryan has called him out on it. but to proactive ly antagonize trump and his supporters makes it that much more difficult and ryan has to balance those two. >> but that begs the question which i think is what you're getting at. we've seen paul ryan. he came out months ago and criticized, condemned trump. the first time he brought up the proposed temporary ban on muslims. he condemned trump for those
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remarks on judge curiel. he condemned trump's remarks in the wake of orlando. if you are continually condemning someone's behavior, then why would you endorsing him? that's like this pretzel, he's contorting himself into. and also for anyone that would think he's going along with it because he's going to pursue his agenda, paul ryan and the republicans have been so against obama over the last seven years saying that he has exceeded his executive authority. what trump's vision for america, if we believe his rhetoric, is a radical empowerment of the executive branch saying he's going to do this, he's going to do this. so that alone is at odds with paul ryan's philosophy. so he's in an untenable position. >> the reality is, though, let's be blunt. donald trump represents the rank and file republican party as it stands. 70% of republicans support the muslim ban. 65% of republicans did not think calling judge curiel was -- a mexican was racist. a majority of republicans poll after poll support getting rid
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of undocumented immigrants and building a wall. paul ryan has a problem because he does not agree with the base of the gop. the base of the gop has moved to the right. when i'm with trump supporters i ask them what do you like best, his sexism, his bigotry or his racism. and they get upset. if a democrat was nominated and i'm a democrat, i would not support that candidate. i would leave the party until that candidate was gone. >> i would say the same thing but it's easy for us as democrats, as liberals to say that because it's not our reality now. >> when george wallace wanted to run again for president, he had to run as an independent the second time he ran because democrats said you can run as president if you want to, just not in our party. >> number one, i believe there is a large percentage of trump voters that are as horrified by some of the things that he has said -- >> trump voters? >> absolutely. i've talked to them and i see that. >> why do they vote for him? >> they overlook the stupidity that comes out of donald trump's mouth on occasion and saying the
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overall issue of throwing the baby out with the bath water is worth what we have to swallow. that's not a bargain that many in my party, myself included, are willing to make but many of them have. that's point one. point two to what you just said, i would love to see prior to cleveland a poll that questions republican primary voters and says a simple -- poses a simple question. are you satisfied with donald trump as the nominee of the republican party, yes or no? and if that number starts to approach 50%, then the neutrality that speaker ryan just mentioned, neutrality is the new black now. if you're not going to be against trump or for him, if you can be neutral, that sends a signal that, hey, republicans, if you're not happy with trump as your nominee, then do something about it in cleveland. >> this guy is the gop. >> i want to get michelle back in because this is the kind of threshold question that i have. if in fact gian-carlo's formulation, we did that poll and even half of trump voters said they're unsatisfied with their choice and unsatisfied with him, i still go back to
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this conscience question. ten years from now when people are asked did you support donald trump, did you vote for him, does this become a threshold sort of moral question. if you really do believe that the things he said are offensive and are bigoted, i just wonder how people can hold those two. is it so important to have him sign tax cuts, for instance, that it's okay to look past those other things? >> absolutely. one of the questions i always pose to people is do you want to be on the right side of history? if you are a member of congress and 100 years from now people are writing about you in the history books, do you want to be one of the people who will be known in world history as someone who supported someone who is overtly a racist and a bigot, and if that answer is i want to be on the right side of history, then your conscience has to come into play and you have to do something about it and say something about it now. you know, with regard to the muslim ban, for example, paul
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ryan has answered questions about donald trump and his statements on banning all muslims from the country. what he has said is that he would sue any person, any president, whether male or female, who is sort of going over or exceeding their presidential powers. for those of us who are lawyers and even for nonlawyers who listen to that, we understand that there are three co-equal branches of government. but do we really want to stand by someone who people are so worried could exceed his presidential authority in such an unconstitutional and racial way that they would go ahead and vote for him and wait for paul ryan to sue him, and then are you really going to try to get some sort of a restraining order against the president of the united states. the only way to stop that is to stop it right now by coming out and saying it's better to lose the party and lose the race and build a better moral republican party. >> and there are conservatives who are saying that right now. isn't paul ryan at risk of being
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just that person that goes down in history as having said i oppose donald trump but i'm with him? >> and that's the trump phenomenon. you cannot be partially for trump if you are associated with trump, you are all in. to this notion that paul ryan has lately been talking about about potentially suing donald trump if he takes some actions that he finds objectionable, he can't do that. legally he does not have the standing. he has not suffered personal harm to sue the president. so that might be an idea that he's throwing out there, but legally he would have to find someone else to do it. he as speaker of the house cannot sue the president. >> just quickly, to me, it's not about the presidential powers and making executive decision or asking for laws, it's setting a tone. that's the biggest thing the president of the united states does. president obama sets a distinct tone of this nation about inclusiveness. i stand with the lgbt community, i stand with african-americans, i stand with muslims. loretta lynch, she said you're not alone, we stand with you. donald trump stands against every community of color in this country. that's the tone he'll set. and that message is going around the world.
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i've spoken to state department people who said ambassadors are saying what's happening in your country? what happened to the promise of the united states of america? and donald trump is undermining the promise of this country. that's what's going on. so the damage is already done around the world. it doesn't matter if he wins or not. >> and isn't the damage done to your party, gian-carlo. >> as a republican we take a deep breath and look at history. in 1984 to 1988 -- by 1988, democrats lost three monumental presidential races, okay? irrespective of what happens in november, it is unlikely that donald trump will lose by as much as walter mondale lost in 1984 or michael dukakis lost in 1988. democrats in the lifetime of everyone at this table lost three presidential races in a row. if we lose our third in donald trump, there will be a mess. but out of that mess, we can regroup as a party. we can say our opposition has been here before. they regrouped, they figured out a formula for winning and they won the next time around and the republican party has an
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opportunity to defeat to do the same thing. >> but do you want him to lose? >> i want the republican party to pull together a coalition -- i want my party to learn a lesson, that's what i want. >> i'm going to e-mail you later and get you to answer that question. >> on father's day, no less. >> that's cold. >> up next, the mass shooting in orlando has reignited the debate over islamophobia. stay with us. you can go ahead and stick with that complicated credit card that limits where you earn bonus cash back. or... you can get the quicksilver card from capital one. quickson ev-e-ry purchase,mited ev-e-ry-where. i shouldn't have to ask. what's in your wallet? try your favorite ranch with a fresh taste so crisp,
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this is not a gun control issue, folks. if gun control could protect the country from attacks by radical islamists, there would be no paris. the french have the strongest gun laws on the planet and over 100 french citizens died at the hands of radical islamists using weapons. bombs, planes, guns.
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it's not the instrumentality, it's the attitude. >> senator lindsey graham this week defaulted to what has been become the standard setting when a person claiming allegiance to an islamic terrorist group commits violence on american soil. it has once again put islam under scrutiny. details are coming about the shooter and his motive including an internal conflict about his own sexuality. president obama pressed back against the critics. >> what exactly would using this label accomplish? what exactly would it change? not once has an advisor of mine said, man, if we really used that phrase, we're going to turn this whole thing around. if there's anyone out there who thinks we're confused about who our enemies are, that would come
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as a surprise to the thousands of terrorists who we've taken off the battlefield. so there's no magic to the phrase "radical islam," it's a political talking point. it's not a strategy. >> dean obadalla is back with me and malcolm nance. before i come to you, malcolm, i have to ask you, dean, about whether it struck you as it did me the irony of lindsey graham standing up there and talking about it being about the ideology of islamist terrorism one year almost to the day after charleston. >> it's remarkable that the way charleston is not talked about now. dylann roof walked into a church, a white supremacist, executed nine african-americans. but the other part about lindsey graham, oh, gun laws make a difference. florida, according to guns and ammo, has some of the laxest gun laws in the nation. how come there is a mass
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shooting there. these guys don't want to talk about the real issue. islam might be a part of the issue but guns are a big part of it. why not make it harder for access. one more step in the chain. maybe that one step is where we catch them. that's the key to this. >> one year after charleston, malcolm, does it strike you that it took a guy calling 911 and pledging allegiance to isis to get congress to even consider voting on gun safety measures? >> you're absolutely right. i think right here on this program about eight weeks ago i said my might nar scenario was a man buying a gun legally in the united states, declaring his allegiance to isis, walking into a theater, shutting the doors and killing 100 people. i was only off 50%. anybody can make a claim of isis. how did the person acquire the equipment to carry out that act. it can be christian terrorism or muslim terrorism. it's really up to the shooter to determine whether killing these innocent victims was designed to impact a community far greater
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than the victims that he had killed. >> is it possible that if you go back and you look at a killer like the one in orlando, that isis was not necessarily a part of their ideology going in but once in the act they decided this is something i can add to it to add to my own glory? >> sure. i think this guys a psycho sexual crisis going on which conflicted from his fundamental religion. he was from a family that was religious. most muslims have very conservative values, even if they are slightly socially liberal. and this may have played out a conflict within his family. it appears that he was active to a certain extent in the gay scene. he and his wife had gone to this place. but he had also had this comment with his father that he was upset about seeing gays. that may all have been a mask. and when he reached a point in this conflict where he could not deal with his own personal self internal self loathing, he acted out in a violent manner in order to definitively show that he was not one of them. and then he chose isis as the
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fig leaf to a certain extent to mask that and to cleanse his soul religiously. but this could, again, this could have been christian, this could have been a cultist. this happens in other societies. >> in this case, of course, he was muslim. so of course we come right back, dean, we've been here before. we come back to this threshold question. listen to president obama sort of getting at the fact that even though you have these unique bands of horror over charleston, over sandy hook, when you throw in the muslim element, there is a special extra fear that it puts into americans. this is president obama reacting to that. >> we will not give in to fear or turn against each other. there's no magic to the phrase "radical islam." it's a political talking point. it's not a strategy. you can't break up the world into us and them and denigrate and express hatred towards groups because of the color of
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their skin or their faith or their sexual orientation. and not feed something very dangerous in this world. >> hillary clinton basically echoed that same sentiment. you see how many times he had to say it because it doesn't seem to sink in. >> some people on the right think if president obama says radical islam, the terrorists go shut it down, they got us. last year i had the honor of meeting with president obama and 12 other muslim leaders and other administration officials there. he does not use radical islam not for political correctness, for correctness. there's no such thing as radical islam. it's a term made up by the right that if i don't say, somehow i'm not in the war against terrorism. the number one victim of isis are muslims. we want isis eliminated, neutralized, we want them gone. this does not change things. the idea of donald trump
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demonizing muslims, first, you can tell he plays in isis' hand. second has a human impact in this country. you've seen the last few days, shots fired at a mosque. there's bullet holes in it now. a muslim guy in new york getting punched in the face. it's not just now, it's before this. there's a man convicted last august in federal court 25 years to life. for what? for planning to get a weapon of mass construction to kill muslims. there's another man going on trial to plotting to kill muslims. there are people plotting to kill muslims in my community and donald trump is ginning up the fear, making it worse. sadly, the media doesn't cover that story until somebody breaks through and kills us. >> in terms of things that freak out and scare many american, it is this idea that the average muslim guy that works at the deli down the street will go on a website, get radicalized and
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kill people. is that a bigger threat or is it workplace affinity killings. people going to their own workplace, the bar that they frequent like the orlando shooter did, the school they went to, as in sandy hook. is that actually a bigger threat regardless of the religion of the shooter? >> of course being shot in the united states, the statistics are off the chart. you could be shot and killed in the united states for random workplace violence, domestic violence, many other things there. with the statistic of you being killed in an act of terrorism, i believe it goes that you have a better chance of drowning while being struck by lightning and surviving both than you have to even see an act of terrorism. the average muslim in the world, and certainly the very integrated muslim population in the united states, which most of you don't see until you see someone in a hijab, they want nothing to do with islamic terrorism. the use of the word is a tool that plays directly into the hands of terrorist groups.
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i only have been counterterrorism in the middle east for 35 years, so what do i know? but i know my opposition loves islamophobia because they say, see, we told you this is what the americans were like, they don't adhere to their own values, they hate you, come to us. they have been very successful in recruiting christians. i just returned from brussels, belgium. they have a problem there with converts but most of them are mentally ill who will switch over. the shooting of the parliament in ottawa, in canada, the man was a catholic a few weeks before. swore his allegiance to isis. went over and shot and killed people inside the parliament there. that is a factor that comes from this variant of cultism that is certainly not islamic but it just happens to be using the trappings of islam and we are afraid of it, which means we allow isis to dictate how we respond to their actual terrorism. you empower 0.001 of 1% of the
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world and you let the terrorists win every time you open your mouth with islamophobia. >> i'll give you the last word on this, dean, because i do wonder if this sort of awkward and lonely and isolated teenager, who is muslim and who hears this kind of rhetoric and who feels even further isolated, do you see instances where in fact we're creating more of a threat that that kid becomes enamored of this kind of an ideology just because they feel completely on their own? >> to give some statistics about what you're getting at, about 20% of american students complain about bullying. there was a poll done in california, 52%, 53% of muslim students in california are bullied and harassed for their faith. worse, 20% of the bullies were teachers mocking them for being muslim. so yes, if you hear islam hates us, this drum beat that we don't want you in this country, we're going to ban every one of your family members from coming here and isis says they do hate you. look at the words of donald trump. get back at the people that hate you, get revenge.
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it's a very human motion. they're alone, it leads to radicalization and the sales pitch being more accepted. you're right, they do hate me. look at the leading republican saying islam hates us. and isis is saying the west hates us. they're a mirror, that's the problem. >> one thing we've learned from columbine to orlando is really the biggest threat to human life is the isolated angry person with access to high-powered weaponry. malcolm nance, thank you very much for being here. dean will be back. what should would be president hillary clinton do first? stay with us. our new cocktail bitters were doing well, but after one tradeshow, we took off. all i could think about was our deadlines racing towards us. a loan would take too long. we needed money, now. my amex card helped me buy the ingredients to fill the orders. opportunities don't wait around, so you have to be ready for them. find out how american express cards and services can help prepare you for growth at open.com.
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be the you who talks to your dermatologist about stelara®. what is happening is a sweeping effort to disempower and disenfranchise people of color, poor people and young people from one end of our country to the other. >> that was hillary clinton delivering a speech on voting rights last year in houston.
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voters of color overwhelmingly support democrats, especially with donald trump at the top of the republican ticket. what are republicans in several key states doing? voter suppression. adding voter i.d. laws, cutting back on early voting, reducing the number of polling places. so if hillary clinton wins the white house, what should she do first? well, she should use the bully pulpit of the presidency to demand that congress restore the voting rights act which was gutted by the supreme court in 2013. she should also make sure that the next supreme court justice would uphold voting rights. clinton has proposed automatic voter registration for everyone over aged 18 unless you opt out. plus a minimum of 20 days of early voting. while clinton enjoys strong support from voters of color, actually getting them to vote is crucial. a look at that when "a.m. joy" continues. you can worry about them.
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hi! hey! i've made plans for later in case this date doesn't go well. likewise! but, funny story. on top of that? my mom is my best friend. uh oh. yeah. oop! there's the rescue text from my roommate saying she needs me. wouldn't it be great if everyone said what they meant? the citi double cash card does. it lets you earn double cash back: the citi double cash card. i really hope that hillary clinton will win, although i am
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not 100% supportive of hillary clinton, i'm not excited as i was with the obama 2008, 2012 election. i am just accepting what it is right now. >> no, i'm not excited about it. i think that if anything, i'm just going to see what happens to our nation moving forward. i think that -- i think what -- i think the only good thing that's coming out of this election is that it is reminding young people and reminding brown people where we stand in our nation and it is reminding us that we have some work to do. >> i am excited to make sure that donald trump does not get elected because i think that he is poison. >> voters of color are a key part of why hillary clinton is the democrats' presumptive nominee and they will be key to democrats' chances in november. 66% of nonwhite voters say they have a favorable view of clinton while only 12% have a favorable
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view of donald trump. turnout will be critical, both for the presidential race and for those at the state level. a new report takes a look at how democrats in senate races are doing in reaching out to voters of color. joining me, one of the people behind that new report, steve phillips, founder of democracy in color and power pack and he's also the author of "brown is the new white." also joining me, senior writer at might have 38 and raul reyes, contributor at nbcnews.com. thank you all for being here. steve, this is your survey. you looked at these senate candidates, ted strickland we interviewed earlier in ohio, russ feingold, michael bennett, katie mcginty and katherine matso. >> it reflects how the candidates are doing in terms of their polling and overall strategy and do they understand and are they building on the road map that obama showed on how to win in a multi-racial
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electorate. that's about inspiring large blocks of voters of color and not spending money on tv ads targeting the white swing voters. >> let's go to colorado and talk about michael bennet. he got one star for his overall strategies. on polling he did pretty well, three stars. only two stars on community issues. what do you think is going wrong and right in that campaign so far? >> so the challenge is do they understand how diverse that the state has become and that the voters of color represent the cornerstone of victory and really need to be the first thought and not the afterthought. that's why we lost in 2014 was that there was dramatic democratic dropoff but the republican dropoff was not very high. and so if you're a stat gist to win over the white soccer moms rather than mobilizing and inspiring the latino voters, you're not going to be successful. >> let's talk about ted strickland. i interviewed him earlier in the show in ohio.
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very important state. cuyahoga county, heavily african-american, you've got to win it. he's doing, it looks fair to middling. community issues only a two. what's going wrong in your view? >> i'm from ohio originally and ted, i know him well and i hope that he wins. the challenge he faces is that he's got to realize when he looks in the mirror that he can't -- he's not ted strickland anymore, he has to see obama. he comes from a congressional district that was 95% white. he got 58% of the white vote in 2006 but only 37% in 2010 so he has to reorient his thinking and mobilizing black voters. >> this has been the challenge for the democratic party for decades. you wrote about it in your book, this idea of do we focus your strategy on assuming we have voters of color in our camp and going after white suburban voters or do we need to energize black voters. you saw those voters in our clip coming in, people saying they
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weren't excited. >> well, you know, it's interesting. i just for 538 was out reporting on trump voters in ohio, in this case in trumbull county. in trumbull county, the gop primary basically got twice as many people as they had on the voter rolls as republicans pause there were a lot of reagan democrats and union members who switched over. i would argue that there is a real concern for someone like strickland because there are a lot of white democrats who are really looking to vote on the republican line and that may trickle over into the senate race. so i do think there's an effect. i cannot predict how you manage both sets of expectations, but at the same time i also reported in cleveland on young black voters and found that many of them were sanders supporters who were not enthusiastic about clinton. so how you triangulate between all of those expectations i can't even begin to say, but i can tell you what i found on the ground. >> how do you think that hillary
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clinton's embrace and really wrapping her arms around barack obama, it helped her at least with black voters over 40, over 50. did that help her in any way to move along and make voters of color in general excited about her, and did it hurt her in any way with white reagan democrats? >> you know, it remains to be seen. i certainly think that among the very specific demographic i was talking to from ohio's rust belt, there was not a lot of enthusiasm for clinton. there was more enthusiasm for sanders. you know, people were looking for a populist. so i don't know how that's going to play out. i think that there were -- you know, there have been many conversations about the crossover between sanders and trump voters in places like the rust belt. >> and let's look at hispanics in sort of a similar way because there's been this presumptive that with donald trump at the top of the ticket, with the judge curiel remarks, him being slammed for that, his comments
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about building a wall, that the latino vote was baked in the cake, that it would be high and enthusiastic. is that the case? >> it could be, but not necessarily. and that is potentially risky terrain for the democratic party and hillary clinton going forward because, yes, we have seen intense interest in the latino communities in this election cycle because of trump. we've seen this surge in naturalizations, i think 14% at the end of last year. all of this energy and the nonprofits working. but yet you cannot rely on people being angry at trump to come out and vote. number one, they need -- hillary clinton needs to put forward a very targeted and much more aspirational message, not just rely on anti-trump sentiments. also they need to work on their ground game because it's one thing to have people fired up and attending rallies and being angry right now, but it's a totally different thing -- in our latino communities, we don't have multi-generational histories of voting. you do need a certain amount of hand holding and you do need
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nonprofits to explain how the process works. in different states you have different procedures of how you vote and the registration process. you do need people to walk the communities through that process. you can't just make the assumption, well, look at the alternative, they're going to be with us and donald trump will motivate people. no, you do have to go out and bring them in. >> what should democrats be more concerned about in your view, lack of interest among voters of color or white voters going to donald trump? >> voters of color. there is, if you look at the exit polls going back to 1976, i believe there's a floor of white progressives and there are more white progressives than people realize. the average white vote for democrats is 40%. obama got 39%. obama would have won with 36.5% of the white voters but that's only a winning formula when you have large turnout of voters of color. that's the kind of thing we're looking at. how are you spending your money, which groupings are you going after, is it all 30-second tv ads going after white swing voters. are you putting people on the
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ground to do the voter mobilization work. >> i think you all agree the ground game will be key and that's what democrats will have to do. steve phillips, thank you for previewing these numbers. stay with us, more "a.m. joy" after the break. ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ customer service!d. ma'am. this isn't a computer... wait. you're real? with discover card, you can talk to a real person in the u.s., like me, anytime. wow. this is a recording. really? no, i'm kidding. 100% u.s.-based customer service. here to help, not to sell. if you have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis
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is a day to celebrate black family, to celebrate survival, to honor the elasticity and sustenance of the black family structure and to praise god that we're still here. >> we are still here indeed. happy juneteenth from all of us at the "a.m. joy" show. rd from . with it, i earn unlimited 2% cash back on all of my purchasing. and that unlimited 2% cash back from spark means thousands of dollars each year going back into my business... which adds fuel to my bottom line. wh's in your wallet? (wfight heartburn fast. with tums chewy delights. the mouthwatering soft chew that goes to work in seconds
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show me "previously watched." what's recommended for me. x1 makes it easy to find what you love. call or go online and switch to x1. only with xfinity. so what will be the big stories we'll be talking about this week? i'm going to you first, michelle. what's going to be the big headline next week? >> i think the big headline next week is going to be a continuation of what we just saw in your last segment, young people, people of color really coming out and telling us what's at stake in this election. we've got two valedictorians from the state of texas. they garaged from high school last week. one is going to yale, one is
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going to ut. they gave speeches. they talked on online media and they also explained they are undocumented. the reaction by the public has been pretty amazing. one of the young students, she said in her speech at least as being reported out of texas that -- her name is marissa martinez. she said that america can be great again without having to declare a war on undocumented immigrants. she said america can be great again without the construction of a wall built on hatred and prejudice. again, she's got a full scholarship to yale. she wants to go to medical school. i think these students are going to put the immigration debate on the front burner. we will see what's going to happen within the republican party to determine whose vision for the future of latinos and all of america's immigrants is
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going to win out. >> we saw three cases where there was immigration issues even in the orlando shooting situation. very interesting headline choice. dean, what's going to be the big headline? >> donald trump apologizes to muslims, mexicans, women. he says he's just going through a phase. he lashed out and he's sorry. >> i didn't say in the onion. i said in real life. >> in real life it will be involving donald trump. the exact thing i'm not sure. donald trump can't help himself. he will say something. he's offended every group but white supremacists. it will be something with donald trump, something hopefully not horrific but very well he could up it and go to places we can't even imagine next week. >> do you think the media has suffered a sort of self-revulsion sort of effect because of how codependent we
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have all been? >> i think the media has a black eye in that bolstering donald trump, the $2 billion in free media access. donald trump might not be good for america, but he's good for rates. it puts it out there for everyone. but i think the media has become much more responsible. >> following on dean, i would say the headline will be trump is the best thing that ever happened to the gop. >> what? >> because he is exploding notions of the two party system. what we have is a two party system in a country of extreme diversity that can't really fit everyone into a two party system. and he's the right pop list and leaves no room for a right establishment. i have a lot of republican relatives who are now in a position where they don't really see a gop they can vote for. there are a lot of socially conservative african-americans who feel shut out of a two party system because there's not a
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party that represents their interest. that's true for socially conservative latinos, asian americans. i think donald trump has basically exploded the notion of what the gop will be. and there will have to be a future gop that's inclusive to survive, inclusive of immigrants, people of color, lgbt, et cetera. >> that happened with barry goldwater. you had black republicans who said they could no longer represent the party. there's going to emerge out of this mess kind of a new republican party. i always said if colin powell runs for president, it's going to throw everything into the wind. >> mine is pretty serious. i think headline for the week is latinos call for action on gun reform. because it's just a week since orlando. when you talk to people, you know, this was a horrific event. and people were in shock. but i think already that shock is turning to a sense of wanting
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to be involved, wanting to mobilize, wanting to have some access so this doesn't happen again anywhere. and even when you look at the polling on gun reform, gun control, latinos haven't really typically been polled on this issue. yet the latino communities support in higher percentages than the american public, things like background checks. really the latino community is looking at this like a galvanizing moment saying we want to be part of this. >> i think you're seeing the lgbt community getting proactive on guns. this was huge for the latino community what happened in orlando. the pretzel award for the am joy show winner. goes to raoul reyes.
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this is the unofficial theme of father's day. have the pretzels. >> i'd like to thank the academy. >> quickly, nba predictions tonight? who wins? >> i haven't been paying attention. >> curry. >> give me back those pretzels. >> curry. >> lebron. >> who's going to win tonight? >> hey, my husband is from san francisco. so we are giving it to steph curry. >> if he doesn't win, somebody's going to say it was rigged. by the way congratulations to dean. everybody listen to his show on sirius xm. that is our show for today. thank you for watching. alex witt picks up the coverage on the other side of the break. stay with us on msnbc. developed our most revolutionary feature yet.
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