tv Morning Joe MSNBC February 16, 2017 3:00am-6:01am PST
version of the seven country travel ban that was knocked down in court. and on capitol hill, the confirmation process continues with votes expected for the office of management and budget nominee for president coming up in for president trump milk musc mercury mulvaney coming up in the senate. >> our thanks to kelly o'donnell for her reporting there. >> that does it for us here. "morning joe" starts right now. >> michael flynn, jen flynn is a wonderful man. i think he has been treated very, very unfairly by the media. as i call it, the fake media in many cases. and i think it's really a sad thing that he was treated so badly. i think, in addition to that, from intelligence, papers are being leaked, things are being leaked. it's criminal action. criminal act. and it's been going on for a long time before me, but now it's really going on and people are trying to cover up for a
terrible loss that the democrats had under hillary clinton. >> why was he fired then if it was just the fake media? >> it could have been a fake firing. maybe he really wasn't fired. >> hillary could have fired him, actually. if i draw the line, hillary fired him. >> i thought he was strong. strong. the fake media could never get him. >> fake firing. >> he is blamimichael flynn's resignation on the news media? >> no. he didn't to do that. >> a messed up way of saying good morning, everyone. it's february 16th. he was treated badly? >> he clearly fired him based on what the spokesperson said he couldn't trust him so therefore it's the media's fault. >> or he was caught in a lying? i'm not sure the lying is actually considered bad. >> he was caught in a lie. >> i think being caught in a lie is bad, which is a great message to send to our children, by the way. let alone how to run a country.
>> got caught in a lie, right? >> how be he fired them because they both got caught? >> they both got caught in a lie. with on the set is mike barnicle and donny deutsche. >> we call mike barnicle the legendary compass. senior editor for "the huffington post." a man who this time of year is absolutely -- go back to sam stein. absolutely obsessed for pick willing his fantasy league for australian rules football, our own sam stein. columnist and associate editor for "the washington post," david ignatius. david, a lot of weeds to clear out. >> i mentioned donny, right? >> yes, you did. >> i brought my weed whacker. >> a lot of weeds to sort through. and it's hard to say exactly what is going on. we have heard reports that there
are parts of this story that the weeds go further and will be more in snarling. we have hear oer sources have also told us the reporting that the stories about the contact, david, during the campaign were actually not extensive and that story may not be as significant of a story but there is no doubt, i'm sure you're hearing the same thing as i am, that donald trump's contacts with russia, the intel community sources i speak with say there still is more to come there. >> there is still a lot more investigation to complete. there is a broad look by the fbi aided by other intelligence agencies to establish what happened during this period while russia was amounting and aggressive covert action against our political system and what contacts were made and how were things paid for, who are the cut-outs that the russians used and all of the things that you
would have in a normal counterintelligence or moving into a criminal investigation are going on here now. these investigations take a long time. i think people need to be very careful about little kind of droplets of information that pop out because it's a big systemic investigation. the best hope is it will be conducted professional and that at the end of the day, we will actually know what happened. we will have real facts and we can begin to make decisions. >> yes. that is is the key. i said it a couple of days ago, let's not get ahead of the facts. let's have the investigations, they need to be extensive investigations, but don't get ahead of the facts. i saw this so many times during the clinton administration. we would always find some information and this was going to be the end of bill clinton and there was a buzz around washington, d.c. everybody always got ahead of the fact. let's not. >> i don't think there is a need to do that. >> no." but it's time to see what we see. >> and we see the need for an
extensive investigation, i think. >> absolutely. "the new york times" reports that president trump is looking to shake up the intelligence community with a broad review of the nation's spy agencies. according to the report, steven fineberg, a billion air executive is president trump's choice to lead the review. but it could be prelude to a larger role in intelligence. quote, reports that feinberg was under consideration to run the service and rocked the inte intelligence community in recent weeks and raising the prospect of direct white house control over america's spies at a time when a trump's ties to vladimir putin are under investigation by the fbi and congressional committees. this as a new report in today's "the wall street journal" alleges that intelligence officials have withheld sensitive information from the president due to concerns it could be leaked or compromised. the paper cites current and former officials. however, the report says the current and former officials
emphasized that they know of no instance in which crucial information about security threats or potential plotting has been omitted. >> by the way, we just have to say this right now again for people who are watching and are trying to sort through this. there is no doubt "the wall street journal" has gone from being the most hostile conservative voice towards donald trump during the campaign to certainly now seeming to bend over backwards to actually much of what the editorial puts out. not to knock any papers or an editorial board but an editorial board that was hypercritical of donald trump during the campaign. yesterday, they used their editorial page to say, oh, there is nothing to see here other than leaks coming from intel agencies. >> with the journal, i just want
to stress, i once worked for "the wall street journal" for ten years as a reporter. the iron wall between the news and editorial side of that paper is stronger than at most. the issue that the journal is struggling with has there been any attempt to shape the coverage as opposed to the editorials which are always going to be opinionated and change over time that is the thing that newsroom has been talking about and worrying about. >> david, were you concerned yesterday, the lead editorial for "the wall street journal" did not even mention any concerns about improper contacts that michael flynn had with russia? but, instead, their editorial focused solely on leaks. it was as if donald trump had written the editorial himself. >> joe, it was an editorial. it's not the editorial position that i would have written. i don't agree with it. i think to argue this is about leaks as opposed to the behavior of our public official is wrong.
it's an editorial. i would be concerned if i felt that that editorial was matched idea for idea in the news coverage and i don't see that happening. >> david ignatius, look at the headline today. this is sort of what we do. we look at media and we pound "the new york times" all the time but that, yesterday, has followed up on the top of the "the wall street journal" "spies keep intelligence from trump." that is a screaming headline. you dig down into the story and you actually find out that they don't have one single instance of where important intelligence was kept from the president of the united states. >> they have a pretty good quote from adam shift, the ranking democrat on the house intelligence story. the story is thinned beyond that quote, so i didn't think it was a blockbuster. >> the story is thin. 'look at this headline, guys. i'll take david off the box but it is an extraordinarily thin story, but mike, again, yesterday, instead of talking
about flynn, yesterday, their lead editorial, "the wall street journal," the editorial page that i've read my entire life, yesterday, they say nothing to see here with flynn. forget the improper ties. forget the lying. forget everything else. we ought to look at the leaks. and now look at this headline today on the front page, "spies keep intelligence from trump." in a story that is thinly sourced and even their thin sources say, well, at the end of the day we really don't have anything here. >> i think david and i are going to come from the same classroom on this. i don't care what is on the editorial page as long as what is in the editorial page seeps into the coverage. >> it appears to be matched. >> also, you write the story and i vaui think david is the same i am. i'm not responsible for the headlines. i don't write the headlines. i write the story, i don't write the headlines. some guy on the copy desk wrote that headline. >> do you think some guy in the copy desk wrote that headline or
do you think it might have come down from above sf. >> i don't think it came from above. i think it came from middle management in the news. >> i don't think it's middle management. >> if you read the story, the story is very thin. the president he is still getting the intelligence -- >> i agree, joe, the way you're covering "the journal." there is something that happens sometimes with employers/employees relationships where you turn to each other and you go, this is not working out. and, you know, where i see right now at day 27, a white house -- >> hold on one second. sam, i think what donny is trying to say is thank you for being with us. you can take the rice a roni at the door and go home! >> my fantasy draft is in 20 minutes, so i would appreciate that! >> no organization skills. you have this russia connection that continues to unfold in a very fuggly way.
the net of it we have a white house not getting nothing done as far as policy when you consider obama and w after 30 days. no matter how you peek at this thing, this feels like a job, a president that doesn't belong in that job. >> i think to tie this altogether. the subtext of the journal story and what you mentioned about steven feinberg taking over this intel review, i think, goes to donny's point that instead of sort of looking at the flynn -- i think you could call it a fiasco at this point, and trying to figure out what exactly was happening with russia prior to the election, the outcome here seems to be pointing in towards a massive purge coming directed by the administration of the intel community of potential leakers. and you're seeing this seep into not just the coverage in "the wall street journal" but also what is going on capitol hill too. last night, jason chaffetz, the
head of the chair oversight committee but out a letter, first call for investigation into the flynn matter. the investigation he wants is whether classified information was leaked to these reporters with respect to flynn's phone calls. and i think what you're -- where we are going with this is sort of a fairly dark place which is a massive tamp down on whistle blowers, a massive purge of the intel community of people who the trump administration feels are unsympathetic to their cause and may have precipitated flynn's dismissal and i think one who is grasping for control and doesn't have a good grasp right now. >> david ignatius, this is someone, this billionaire is also someone with very close connections with steve bannon. so steve bannon put remarkably was put on the national security council where he does not belong. and now they are having a close business tie, they hope to bring him in to purge the intel
agencies? >> this move to bring in the president's personal emissary as it were to review and adjust the activities of the intelligence services is going to really bite -- these people think of themselves as professionals. they do not like being -- they have professionals. they risk their lives every day trying to keep the country safe. they don't get much credit. when military officers walk across an airport, we all stop and we clap and we thank them for their service. these guys, basically, skulk around and don't want anybody to notice them and they are not appreciate. >> when they die for their country, there are no parades. they put a star on a wall. >> joe, this is the president of the united states in a small handful of people in the west wing in the white house going to
war with specific agencies of the government, of their government, of our government. that is what this is. >> it's damn stupid also. >> we have been saying that since november. you pick a fight with the intel community, you're picking a fight with the wrong community and, mika, also, the republicans on capitol hill, i've got to say, i spoke to quite a few senators the other day. it was really impressed with the republican senators who basically said we are here. we are shoulder-to-shoulder. if he steps out of line, our duties are the constitution of the united states. judicial review, you're damn straight. mitch said it on camera. all of the other republicans i so spoke to said it too. this president does not have unlimited powers. this president will be checked by the courts just like we will be checked by the courts. you look on the house side. i'm hearing -- well, paul also. paul ryan also very strong in conversations off the record as well. saying we do our job. if the time comes we do our job.
but some of these republicans, i'm just going to say, jason chaffetz, some of the things he has been saying have been shameful and a lot of the republicans that were cheering the leaks from the intel community and from wikileaks when it involved hillary clinton, cheering every day. are now suddenly wanting to have a witch hunt and go through town with torches blazing, and have a mccarthy type of purge? >> i want to ask joe a question based on what you just said. you talk to so many people based on republicans. are you getting a sense that literally one month into this, you have a band of republicans who are starting their -- their eyes are starting to pick up above the surface that you know what? there is a point in time we all raise our hand and say this is not our guy any more. >> listen. they are already saying that. but there is quiet. they look back in their
districts and right now donald trump has a 40% approval rateing in gallup and probably higher in their districts, so they will see what happens. but they are all there and they all know, if the time comes, their loyalty is to their country and to their party and not to donald trump. and they said it. >> yesterday, the president also tweeted, quote, the rescandal here is that classified information is illegally given out by intelligence like candy. very un-american! and information is being illegally given to the failing "the new york times" and "the washington post" by the intelligence community nsa and fbi? just like russia. >> wait. is that meant as a compliment, mika? >> honestly, honestly, i don't know. nor should you. >> i don't. president trump wrote a tweet thanking eli lake saying
they should not interfere in our politics. his concern about leaked information and fbi interference in politics was not lost on many. here is that same man on the campaign trail. >> russia, if you're listening, i hope you're able to find the 30,000 e-mails that are missing. the fbi -- the fbi -- the fbi has just sent a letter to congress. new e-mails. some of the 33,000 missing and deleted e-mail and they are reopening the case into her criminal and illegal conduct. this just came out. wikileaks, i love wikileaks! amazing how nothing is secret today when you talk about the internet. hillary clinton tried to politicize this investigation. i respect the fact that director comey. you have amazing people in the fbi! was able to come back after what
he did. i have great respect for the fbi t -- to have the tourcourage -- have the courage to write the horrible mistake that they made. and i give them great credit. >> did he have a butterfly net? >> i respects the fbi and the leaks. >> i loves wikileaks. >> by the way, illegally leaks. the most of illegal leaks. hard to keep score here, david. i guess the question we have to ask going forward, what -- donald trump has tried to delegitimatize the courts and it reminds me of the old eddie cochran song. "i fought the law and the law won." never screw with the officials and they will screw you around. as i always say, don't fight the press, the press always wins. ask richard nixon. the press always wins!
now it's the intel community who he has been fighting. what does the intel community think they do to protect themselves from this mccarthy type purge that steve bannon's billionaire friend in new york is preparing? >> well, it's a longstanding problem for intelligence agencies that are instructed by presidents, by administrations, to do things that they may feel are appropriate or inappropriate. but generally they try to do what they are told. that is part of being a professional. there is now a structure of oversight of intelligence in which the congressional intelligence committees, other review panels that go through this most classified information, help the agencies to exert discipline and be professional. so i would expect that if there are attempts to steer this process where intelligence officers feel they are being told to do something that is wrong, steve feinberg told them
to change things in a way they think is going to weaken the agency, they will go to congress and their committees and explain what they think and we will see what the committees, whether they do their job of oversight properly. but one thing i've seen, joe, is that our structure, our system actually is stronger and more resilient than i might have thought a month ago and that is encouraging. a lot of things are depressing and disorienting these days but that's a good thing. we are seeing, as you said, the court system pretty much works. it reviews. >> it works. >> -- orders and it bounces back things has are ill formed. the media work, you know, we put out information. so i think in the case of intelligence, the place for them to go that is appropriate and they will go there. >> the morning after donald trump was elected, a relative called me up and was really scared. and asked, can you vouch for donald trump? can i tell my friends that
donald trump is going to be okay as president of the united states? and i said, no, i can't. but i can vouch for the system. i can vouch for the republic. i've said this repeatedly. we have a strong court system, we have got a strong first amendment. i was really, for the first time, shaken and nervous by what i heard on sunday when a 31-year-old kid said that this president was above the law. >> and he is now writing the next executive order. >> that this president was not subject to judicial review. i was heartened when i went to the hill and these senators, i love what mitch mcconnell said. he said, you know, they are pretty smart, but we are pretty smart too. there are few people on the hill. we have done this before. there is some pretty smart people in the senate. reminded me of the end of "absence of malice."
when he said, "you're pretty smart but i'm pretty smart too." the system works. >> it's not working. >> sam? >> i understand. i understand. >> when o are you picking this morning? >> for my aussie league football draft or baseball draft or tennis draft? >> what a millennial! he does this and multitasks in between being on facebook with his right hand and x-box with his left! you're baseball fantasy league, sam. >> i got to think who my keepers are and i got to see what the league scoring rules are. as mike knows, each league has different scoring rules. barnicle and i will assess who we should draft and maybe look at the years ahead for future picks. >> you know the difference between you and mike barnicle when you pick your leagues? >> one of us has hair? >> sort of. >> i'm not kidding you. mike is such a cheater that he actually calls general managers.
>> i do! >> i swear to god! >> he do! >> he will call the general managers of about seven or eight major league baseball teams and i'm thinking about -- i swear to god! >> is that cheating or just hustle? mike knows what he is doing. >> all right. >> yet, his two boys still beat him every year! >> i know! >> we have just scratched the surface this morning. >> and it hurts. donald trump nominee for labor secretary removes himself from consideration on the eve of his confirmation hearing. you called that one. >> thank god. >> plus, we go live to brussels. >> can i stop quickly? >> sure. >> it's important. david ignatius, let's just stop for one second. because this bears underlining, the system works, david. >> yeah. >> labor secretary. we talked about the courts, we talked about the press rising up. and we talked about republican senators rising up and telling the president of the united states who is very popular in their states and -- no. no. that is a bridge too far.
he's not going to be labor secretary. >> i hope they pop up more. >> and oprah rose also. >> absolutely perfect example how this is supposed to work. a nominee was not suited for the job. information surfaces. more and more senators say, i can't do this. there were 12 republicans at the last count who said, huh-uh. and mitch mcconnell says this nomination is dead. that's it. plus, we go live to brussels as james mattis puts nato on notice. timing of that is pretty bad. and tonight, "morning joe" music. the show kicks off around 8:30 if you're in the area. don't miss it! it's awesome. you're watching "morning joe." we will be right back. tech: at safelite, we know how busy your life can be. mom: oh no... tech: this mom didn't have time to worry about a cracked windshield. so she scheduled at safelite.com and with safelite's exclusive "on my way text" she knew exactly when i'd be there, so she didn't miss a single shot.
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he is an outspoken advocate against raising the federal minimum wage. what is the minimum wage? you can't live on it! i really think that this position along with a number of other key positions in this administration ought to be focusing on wages and women. as the key to this economy. >> they made those commercials focusing on women but not in a way that -- >> i know! i'm disturbed! because actually -- >> i think we should run them so the audience sned what we are talking about. >> i think this is a real weak spot for this president-elect and a weak spot for our country. >> this guy who -- wants to be labor secretary has talked how he wants robots to take the place of workers. >> it's a problem. >> robots. wants to them to take the place of workers. then he actually called his own employees, quote, the worst of the worst. saying it's hard to get, you know, get a good work force when you're selecting from the worst of the worst. he said it twice publicly. the question is -- how do you
ever let this man be secretary of state of labor? how do you ever let somebody that has talked about his own employees who made him a billionaire or a multimillionaire, calls them the worst of the worst. i guess you don't, actually. >> no. >> fast food executive andy puzder withdrew his nomination to being labor secretary. in a statement he said, quote. puzder had faced fear disapproval from democrats and liberal groups over questions concerning his business record and personal issues also clouded his nomination. footage was provided to senators by oprah winfrey's company of a
1990 episode where puzder's ex-wife appeared in disguise and describie ining allegations of domestic abuse. puzder denied the allegations come during a heat divorce and his wife has since recanted and sending a letter to a senate committee 37 what may have ultimately doomed his nomination is members of the republican party. according to "the new york times," at least seven republicans had expressed concern over his nomination. >> there were so many questions surrounding his nomination that i believe the hearing tomorrow would would have been extremely difficult for him, and there would have been questions that even if he had been able to be confirmed, would have made it difficult for him to be an effective secretary of the department of labor.
>> puzder is out. willie, it raises one question. >> what are you doing? >> do you remember these budweiser fair ads? i love these things. >> i do, i do. >> is there a tie-in here? >> none whatsoever. i just love the -- we were -- >> that is a lizard. >> they are upset because budweiser hired a ferret. >> i do recall. thank you for asking. >> ferret was amazing. i just wanted you to kind of get in the groove of things. he was down at the orphanage and some of the kids would not let you go. >> when you leave and they cling to your legs? it's hard to get out of there. what do you do? >> you have to have time to hug everybody. >> absolutely. i would just say this about mr. puzder. >> you're blowing past that ad? >> i think it's a great ad. donny can go deeper on it. >> don't go to the ad. bring back the ferret. >> they cast 800 ferrets before
they found the right one? >> that is information we don't need. continue, willie. >> handing out favors to big campaign supporters as mr. puzder was to donald trump is something for ambassadorships and not cabinet levels. they didn't look deep enough into anything and he is against raising the minimum wage and against overtime rules and immigration status problem with a housekeeper and as mika just said, the allegations of domestic abuse in a really ugly divorce. there was a lot there that they had seen before he was nominated. >> also the robot thing. i would have robots than workers. i don't know. it's hard to sell that. >> kind of like a guy who is going to sue the epa and you make him head of the epa. similar. up next, stephen hadly had the year of the president as bush 43 national security adviser and he joins us next with his recommendations for a white house doing damage control. "morning joe" is coming right back.
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in germany. he today likely questioned over what the trump's administration america first foreign policy means on the global stage. he'll also meet with his russian counterpart amid increased scrutiny over the white house relation with russia. >> tillerson has been cut out of meetings. he has not met foreign leaders of the white house. he didn't go down to florida. and reports are swirling all around him that he is displeased, that he is getting less access than past secretary of states. >> well, i don't know whether that choice is his or not. but you're right. he wasn't around when prime minister abe from japan was in. he wasn't around over the weekend. he wasn't around yesterday. that was his choice, apparently, to fly early to go overseas rather than stick around for prime minister netanyahu. but his biggest problem seems to be, according to a lot of people that you speak with in washington is that there is nothing beneath hem at the state
department. there is numerous slots under secretary unfilled. he's being aided right now by professional career people, right? but he doesn't have his own people in place to run that department and, as you know, that department, the bureaucracy of that department, they regard the political appointments as literally the christmas help. >> we got a lot to get to. david ignatius, we have to talk about what happened to abrams a little too hawkish for me and ran into problems with iran contra. but he had earned the rex tillerson. and some thought he was a good number two for rex tillerson. he told the president that and worked the president for several days. then the president said, no, because elliott had said a few bad things about him during the campaign. >> this has got to be really bothering tillerson. he is coming into a job for
which he has no experience. mr. elliott abrams was reject by the president, bob kimmitt a, former ambassador to germany, was tillerson's choice. i think obama would have accepted him as deputy secretary and kimmitt decided he didn't want to take the job. this is a strange situation where we have got a lot of global crises and a hallowed out state department with so few of the top picks and i think the fact that tillerson is not drawn into on these important white house meetings has got to worry him. >> also overseas this morning, defense secretary james mattis in brussels yesterday to deliver his first speech to nato since becoming pentagon chief. in that speech he issued an ultimatum to nato allies over their contributions to the alliance. spend more on defense or the u.s. might, quote, moderate its support. the comments came just hours after russia announced it would not hand back control of crimea
to ukraine. hans nichols is live in brussels traveling with james mattis. hans. >> joo this is more of a threat when you twin it with the campaign rhetoric from donald trump. none of these defense ministers here doubt that trump was serious during the campaign when he was talking about maybe pulling out of nato, letting europe fend for himself. that is the message we have been getting here and talking to defense ministers, they are taking trump's message on board and they are taking mattis' message on board. the basic numbers? you should be spending 2% of gdp and very few countries are, only five of nato's 28 members. germany is a big lagger here at only 1.2%. just real quick. speaking to the british defense minutester last night, he was telling me that some of these countries aren't paying enough. you think nato is almost 70 years old. a british defense minister they want to have germany spend more on defense. 70 years ago the founding of
nato, nobody would believe that. mika, i have a nice photo for you. one of my favorite german newspapers. six females here. the title what do these six females have in common? same barber, seven children. no, they all have armies. there are six female defense ministers. >> wow. >> it's the photo of the day. normally i hold up this so i can paen potentially get a little nudity on camera. >> always? >> separated from birth, hans. >> and breaking with stereotypes the one i'm not hold up the one nonblond in that photo? the norwegian. guys? >> i really don't know what to say. >> i love this man. >> i know you love him. the rest of us are very uncomfortable. including barnicle. you think that is great. this is a no more value moment, right? and then he takes it straight down. the way it's called in germany,
the deutsche. >> good job, brother. >> a report from hans is like light a fuse. you start and you're just waiting for the end. suddenly at the end it goes like that. >> we had a report of, remember, mad dog mat physician first day at the pentagon and ended up in a urine sample story? >> thank you, hands. now a former national security adviser. we are not embarrassed here. welcome to the show. stephen hadley. good to have you on board. >> so sorry, stephen hadley, you had to follow hans nichols. let's talk about what is going on at the nsc. what about the candidate that the president has tapped and who is considering taking the job as national security adviser? >> he worked in the bush administration, in the national security council, so he has some experience working in nsc. that's a good thing and good to have an experience in an organization before you're tapped to run it. i think it's a good choice.
i think he will be kind of a traditional national security adviser running an -- being an honest broker and running a transparent process. and acting largely off stage and behind the scenes. that's really the right model and i'm hopeful that that would be the model he would adopt. i think it's good he has some experience and of course the most important thing is he's got to win and have the confidence of the president. >> if you agree that there are questions surrounding this resignation about ties to russia and how far they go, how deep they go in the administration, how far up they go, what would you suggest would be the order of business to try and get the trump administration back on track? >> well, i think first of all, there is an ongoing fbi investigation that will gather the facts about actually what went on. i think we have got to let that play out.
i think calls for 9/11 commission is way premature. we ought to let the established mechanisms in congress work. i would hope they give the lead to perhaps the two intelligence committees on the house and the senate side. and keep the other committees out of it. we don't know. you need six or seven or eight committees investigating all of this, we don't know. let the fbi do its work under the oversight and intelligence committees. people forget this is an enormous distraction these kind of investigations, and we have real problems that need to be addressed. and i think one of the costs of these things is it diverts attention, it diverts energy and administrations are not doing the business that the country really needs them to do in terms of some of the policy work that needs to be done. so there is some cost of these investigations. >> stephen, it's willie geist. the focus around this russia story from the white house and now from some congressional republicans any way has been on the leaks what they call illegal leaks and that is the investigation that some members of congress, republicans are going to focus on.
are you more concerned about the leaks or the content of the leaks, the information we have received about russia? >> well, you know, on the leaks, there are leaks, some coming it seems toust intelligence and law enforcement community but some of the leaks are coming out of the white house. the leaks about the details of meetings and conversations that president trump is having with foreign leaders. so there is a lot of leaking going on. it is not productive. it is not helpful. you know, the russia story is interesting. sometimes i wonder whether if flynn had owned this story if it wouldn't have gone better, if he had just come out and said, y, i talked to the russians about the sanctions and, yes, i suggested they hold on any retaliation. retaliation would have hurt the united states. but it also would have hampered our ability as a new administration to look at russia policy and set our own policy. i wonder if he had just come out and said that is what he did
because it sounds like that is what he did. whether this story would have had sort of 24,8 hours and really gone away. this is the story in washington. it's rarely what you do that gets you in trouble. it's what you do once it starts to become public. and i think that is a lesson once again in the fall of mike flynn. >> david ignatius? >> i want to ask steve hadley whether he thinks that donald trump, himself, the president, is ready for a more orderly process under a new national security adviser? and if he isn't, if we continue to have this, you know, presidency by tweets, is that going to work? is that going to allow for orderly foreign policy? >> you know, it's -- david, i think it's still too early to tell. i think they are in an initial phase. you know, it's people, process, and policy. they don't have all of their people in place. we are not clear how these processes are going to work. is mr. bannon's strategic
initiatives process going to go straight into president trump, or is it going to come up through, for example, when it deals with national security matters? is it going to come up through the nsc system so cabinet secretaries and others can have a say in these matters? it's still very early on in this administration. this is an insurgent administration. they are going to be issuing a lot of executive order to show they were serious about what they said in the campaign and to keep faith with their supporters. we are going to have that phase, i think, for about six months of a lot of these initiatives, sort of political initiatives, if you will. i think it's going to take six months for them to get their people in place, get their processes in place, and i don't think we are really going to know what this administration is going to look like for another four to five months. >> stephen hadley, thank you so much. we greatly appreciate your being with us. >> thank you. >> trump has focused on business 50 years in a certain way and
has nothing to do with process and that is not going to change. he has been a gun-slinger. he has had no infrastructure and he has managed pure byly shooting from the hip and running around in circles. that is not going to change, kids. 50 years as an adult he has been acting this way. >> you also said that donald trump would never win. >> no. three days before the election said i thought he had a 50/50 chance. >> a lot of people said he couldn't win. we have been hypercritical around this show because he has done some extraordinarily bad things. i will just say today what i said every day three weeks going into the election where everybody said he couldn't win. just like i said three weeks is a long time. i'm not going to guess. i don't think any of us can guess what is going to look like six months from now. anybody disagree with that? >> of course, we can't. i think, though, we have to look at what we know. >> right. >> and has anyone seen an administration in this much disarray? >> no. >> let's go back. maybe we have.
>> not just pitching a piece of business and different skills. >> it's very interesting, david ignatius, i am not comparing the chaos in bill clinton's first six months to donald trump's chaos, but there were -- go back to january 21st through the midterm election and you will see one chaos story after another. bill clinton's management style was maniacal. he had, what, two attorney generals that were booted out in the first couple of weeks. you can never -- you never know how a white house is going to turn out, do you? >> clinton wanted to change. he knew his administration was a mess and he hired somebody in leon panetta who could enforce order, and that is the decision that donald trump has not made yet. if he does, things could be very different. >> it all starts there. coming up, jim vandehei says a new committee in washington
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still ahead, we are going live to the white house for reaction to that "the wall street journal" report that claims intelligence officials have kept classified information from the president. plus, the white house plans its own complete review of the intel agencies. and president trump does away with decades of longstanding policy on how to secure middle east peace. it is a two-stage solution, still a priority? that is next on "morning joe." ♪ ♪ everyone deserves attention, whether you've saved a lot or just a little. at pnc investments, we believe you're more than just a number.
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tire rotation, brake inspection and more -- for $29.95 or less. we are in unchartered waters. we have never had a national security adviser lie -- tell false information to the vice president of the united states. we are in areas that, as i said before, from a national security standpoint, we are dysfunctional. you got to go through a regular process of decision making and that is what they are not doing. as i said before, who is making the decisions in the white house? is it the 31-year-old? is it mr. bannon? is it the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff? i don't know. >> a very good question. >> welcome back to "morning joe." >> i mean, that is really good question. >> he is writing the executive order. >> 31-year-old did the end-around everybody else and caused chaos for ten days.
but all i hear is the president saying that he thinks the 31-year-old is doing a good job and that the 31-year-old says the president has absolute power. >> it's thursday, february 16th. >> certainly got talent for bureaucratic infighting for his age and a talent for running executive orders is a very different. >> owe is scratching away at one right now. "the huffington post" sam stein joins us and "the washington post" david ignatius is still with us. joininging the conversation is nicholas confessore and jim van doo high. >> 31. >> no. we were talking about you. >> you're talking about me? >> all right. this morning, the defense intelligence agency has suspended michael flynn's access to classified information. it comes as a senior u.s. official says investigators have determined some trump campaign aides and trump business associates were in contact with russians during the presidential
campaign. but current and former u.s. officials there is no indication those russians were a part of russian intelligence or, so far, no evidence that there was collusion to meddle in the election. now congress is grappling over what comes next with the bipartisan heads of the senate judiciary committee requesting a justice department briefing and documents related to flynn's resignation. >> there is real concern that they my tie up ties to russia that could shine a light on though connections. >> if there is evidence of collaboration between trump campaign officials and russian operatives, that would be very serious, that would be a game-changer and would require different response by the congress. i don't know if that is true or not and i i won't base my decision on a newspaper report but it's something to look at. >> some senate democrats want a 9/11 style commission but it
looks like a bipartisan committee investigation is most likely. democrats are calling on attorney general jeff sessions who played a central role during the campaign to recuse himself from any investigation, saying department of justice guidelines require it. but in the house, oversight committee chairman jason chaffetz, instead, wants to look into leaks. >> we are going to do is send a letter tonight to the inspector general on mishandling of classified information is something we have been keenly concerned about in a variety of settings but you have not only the president's communications, the national security adviser, again, happened before potentially happened before the president was actually sworn in. but you can't mishandle classified information. >> michael flynn, general flynn is a wonderful man. i think he has been treated very, very unfairly by the media. as i call it, the fake media, in many case.
and i think it's really a sad thing that he was treated so badly. i think in addition to that from intelligence, papers are being leaked, things are being leaked. it's criminal action. criminal act. and it's been going on for a along time, before me. but now it's really going on. people are trying to cover up for a terrible loss that the democrats had under hillary clinton. >> that was in the word of pat buchanan, a bit tg fat nothing burger. i'm not sure what he was saying there. general flynn was treated badly but he is the one who fired general flynn. >> that is the question, yes. >> he fired general flynn. of course, kellyanne lied and said that flynn quit. and -- >> or didn't know what she was talking about. >> cascading out of the white house other things. >> not only this. >> 31-year-old lied.
>> whole fake media. you have kellyanne spreading alternative facts saying things that aren't true. selling clothing. you have miller describing the powers of the presidency in a incorrect, inappropriate, and lying fashion. >> by the way, also -- >> hold on. >> out of -- >> you got to stop with miller and then go ahead. miller also lying this weekend about new hampshire being stolen. miller also lying this weekend about the three million votes, lying -- one lie on top of another lie on top of another lie. and then the president goes out and says, what a great job he did! and then you're right. the president then lying about a 47-year high cme rate and he is talking about fake news? >> but your question at the top is the right one. if it was fake news about michael flynn, if he was treated unfairly, then why send the guy walking? you could have said none of this is true and this is my man and stand by him and all of these media reports are incorrect. no, he got rid of the guy. >> which would be a very weak
move if that was true, a very tiny weak move. >> general flynn, he knows -- >> the media is lying about you and i'm going to fire you. sorry. >> i had a pause. let me try this again. ready? >> yes. >> general flynn, he knows a lot, he knows a lot about trump. >> now? >> he nous a lot -- yeah, now. go ahead. >> certainly interesting to cut the guy loose in humiliating fashion after he's in the white house 25 days. they have set this guy adrift and it's kind of dangerous for the white house but a problem you could call. >> tried to clean it up. >> look. i just think what you're seeing in the media is not the media -- the media is a reflection what is happening in the news because we cover the news. if they would stop doing the things you were talking about, the press coverage would be less harsh. but, in fact, it's happening every day. >> there is a new lie to cover, jim, every single day. if they would just stop. >> right. >> supposed to go to sam. >> let's take away, just one second. let's live in an alternative
reality and pretend the president didn't tweet. pretend that kellyanne decide to do take a job outside of the white house. >> like i told her to. >> the 31 acted like a 31-year-old and didn't get ahead of his skis and say really disturbing things. >> this is a big stretch. >> if that were the case, a big stretch, we would actually have headlines about the president breaking down boundaries between republicans and union members. a great meeting with the prime minister of japan. a closer relations with israeli than we have had in probably a decade or so. actually, him putting things back together with mexico. you could go through most of these foreign policy visits. the call with china. getting back on the right track on a one china policy. there are so many positive headlines that you're exactly right. that they don't let us cover because they won't get out of the way with one lie after
another lie after another. here is a message to the white house. you keep lying, we are going to keep reporting. you stop lying, we will actually do what every republican on the hill told me quietly, i wished they would shut up so you devise could talk about policy. >> part of the problem is yesterday two polls come out and his favorable ratings are 49%. >> what two polls? >> fox poll and politico morning poll both had it around 49%. a piece out this morning i think on cnbc about his first month stock market performance best since lbj but you're right. >> gallup has him at 40. >> but gallup is always going up. what scares me most, i was talking about this last night. for as tough as the coverage has been and as much chaos as we present, the people like yourself that are talking to them all of the time, the reality is even worse than the coverage. why does someone go out like stephen miller and do what he
did on sunday? that's what the boss wants. you're rewarded. >> sam stein, they are living in a bubble. they think everything is going great. >> yeah. we talk a lot about whether this is three dimensional chess and if they are making these distractions over here so they can do stuff over there. i think the reality it's much more chaotic than we can possibly imagine. to your point, you know, we have talked to democrats on the hill about this a lot. they were deeply nervous that trump would come and ram through an infrastructure bill that they would have to sign on to. cozy up and partner with unions on a fuf these things like the dakota pipeline, keystone. maybe even go through tax reform and basically splinter the democratic party which they did an opportunity to take the sort of working class blue state democrats and call them their own. instead, what has happened they have gone through one controversy after another.
they have had stephen miller come out with the executive order. i have nothing against 30-year-olds. i think it's fine to be 31. and what they have done is essentially they have unified the democrats at a time when the democrats were very susceptible to being splintered and chaos and controversy that the press is obviously going to cover and set a narrative for themselves much less advantageous than what they could have had. this isn't strategic brilliance as someone sort of imparts on them. this is bad strategic moves from the get-go when they had an opportunity to jump out of the gate and start smart. >> jim, polls are completely different. i just did trump approval ratings. the headlines iowa poll trump's approval rating is underwater with iowans and a key state for him. the gallup has him at 40%. >> this week. >> one headline after another headline talk about his poll numbers on historically low. >> but they -- you talk to them.
they don't think things are going necessarily that bad. they always assumed that we are the opposition party and i wrote about this this morning. kind of the media is. like democrats are going to be feckless for a long time and no oversight capacity in congress and no party leaders with hillary and barack obama gone and not an obvious person. where the power has gone now the post, the times, other people throwing investigative resources tag on a labor secretary or bringing all of this russia controversy to light. and this isn't an easy fix for them. what sam talked about, you could still do. they could bring in a tough chief of staff and they could bring order and could divide democrats. just no evidence whatsoever that that the direction they are heading in. >> the democrats now would have no incentive to work with this administration because they let the opposition, the resist move infester like they did early on, the incentive structure for democrats is oppose efg they do and might not matter because they have no power.
but the opportunity to work with democrats and splinter the party i think is past and i think it passed within weeks. >> the cleanup operation is really simple. it really is. you do need as dave ignatius said, you need a strong chief of staff and donald trump has to trust reince priebus to be that strong chief of staff in a leon panetta form, or he needs to find somebody that he does. >> is there a problem with that. here is the problem that reince faces or anybody else put in that position or given that position. i do not seen -- and i've seen it on the inside -- i do not see any evidence ever or any possibility of this president becoming someone who will listen. i have never seen him listen. i have never seen him listen. i've seen him talk. i have not seen him completely listen. you talk and you get in there. people talk to him. they all want a little bit of attention. they are all nervous. they are all kind of kept in a position where they feel like at
any moment everything could be thrown away and they would be thrown out the door, so everyone is nervous. he talks and then he asks a question, and maybe you'll get ten second in there to start a thought. and then there's talking about something else. there is no listening. that's something that fundamentally has to change in the mindset and the personality of this president for any of that to work. you could have the best chief of staff in there and the history of chief of staffs, but if you don't have a president who wants to hear, then you got nothing. >> he does not want a strong central structure. it is almost impossible to get because you can't -- you can't overestimate how much power the bannon/miller wing has inside this white house. they have tremendous amount of suede and even when they sway from the headlines. that is th juice. >> they arrelentless and keep going. they have nothing else. they will keep going until the wee hours of the night pounding away at what they want from this guy. >> and got him elected.
they were saying you can do this. >> the thing is there is where the loyalty is. >> if you win the presidency with a minority of the vote, it changes how you think about who the audience for your policies are. so i think there is a core audience of trump supporters who see the howling in washington about trump and say, good, right? exactly. so the pain and the howling and the chaos and dysfunction is seen in some quarters as a plus, as a feature ash who trump's audience is and have a campaign rally this weekend and hear cheers and cheers and cheers and feel validated he is doing the right thing and theories cheers is what he listens to. >> hard-core trump supporters last night said how is he doing? what do you think about -- i'd go through the specifics. and they would say, you know, yeah. kind of uneasy about some of this stuff but i haven't seen a lot of it because they are working. they walk past the tv set, they see the press is killing trump. that's a positive. they hear about the putin thing.
no, we are not really excited about the putin thing but obama tried to reach out to him and bush tried to reach out to him. so now, suddenly, trump is trying to reach out to him and that is a bad thing? it's sort of the attitude because you can't expect everybody who is working and raising three, four kids to be sitting glued to the tv set and they are not. >> which the way it's supposed to be, by the way. >> it should be like that. >> exactly. >> that is exactly why he continues to say if there is a negative story about him, it's fake news. it's you guys, the media or a story about russia he says the intel community is leaking. he has never been afraid to go after any institution that somehow sheds negative light on him and see it fyou can carry that throughout an entire presidency and every time something bad happens to you you project it on to somebody else. >> i think the president is coming close to having it. i say that with all due respect. but kellyanne conway got to the point where she talked about fake news and alternative facts. but there is absolutely no
credibility. people watch it. and they don't hear it any more. >> i've got to stop and say something. >> things that are true. >> i got to say things that are going to upset everybody and jim, you'll remember this. you were there and ask you to confirm this completely. bill clinton's administration, they would send people to the hill and they would lie. they would come to our committees and they would lie. bernie -- would lie so much that people in the audience would laugh. i forget the guy's name but one of hillary's aides that hillary pretented s pretended she didn't know. he told a ridiculous story and everybody was laughing at his lies. tom lantos said the guy should kill himself in shame. he was a democrat. but it kept going so much that, pretty soon, you would say, okay, we just found out that bill clinton is selling sensitive missile technology to the chinese letting his top democratic contributor sell sensitive which the pentagon and the intel communities and
everybody saying, you'd sit there and everybody would stare at you. we have heard you talking about this stuff for six years. and pretty soon, they just -- they just stop paying attention. and it took something as base as what happened in the oval office with an intern. that is the only thing. people would pay attention to and a lot of us said they are going, seriously? >> right. >> you're worried about this when you didn't give a damn about sensitive missile technology being sold by the top contributor the dnc to china? and that is what is happening here. they lie so much in this white house that, pretty soon, people grow numb to it. >> remember then what happened to him because of that, over time, not instantly, he lost so much authority. remember that famous "time" magazine cover with newt gingrich basically presented as the president that he was overshadowing the president because his credibility had become so low? so it doesn't happen like that. you're not going to see
republicans other than mccain or graham turn on him right away but if you keep having what you're talking about kellyanne and having these incidents every week over time, you do start to lose more of your own people and not just moral authority but real authority. that is the danger. >> joe, you bring up a great point, but i'm certainly not a democrat that sits on the side saying the clintons were perfect. i think clinton and bush and the versions of lies that came out of both of those administrations have brought us to trump and have lowered the bar. >> no doubt about that. >> but he's taking it to a whole new level. i don't know if his presidency can sustain it. >> if you i couldn't people how we got to this point, it began with, again, the attitude that bill clinton had to the truth. >> yes. >> that's why you even had people live a big clinton supporter saying famously the clintons are unusual good liars.
truth was devalued. we were screaming about that and now democrats are screaming about truth being devalued. i remember democrats in congress behind the scene in the house gym laughing how bill clinton could get away with everything. he's just a dog! he can get away -- i can't -- you would sit there going, okay -- >> that is not funny. >> he was purging himself and now it's on the other side. except, david, nobody is laughing at this point because it's not just missile technology to china. now we are actually talking about a very nefarious relationship with russia. something is there. something is wrong. something stinks in denmark and none of us know what it is. i was saying to somebody last night. i know how my parents felt during the cuban missile crisis because this is as unsettled as i've ever been in my life. >> we have a major power, russia, which conducted an attack on our political system
last year. our intelligence agencies are unanimous in saying that. and we need to know what happened. and president trump needs to support that process. he needs to stop talking about leaks and, you know, all of his combative rhetoric and saying i spour this effort to get to the bottom of this. i think if he is going to get the trust of the country in the way that is important. if he doesn't do that, i think the process we are seeing where authority leeches more and more to members of congress. mitch mcconnell's position is more important today than it was a month ago. i think that is true with some of the democratic leadership. joe, i remember a month ago on that january morning when donald trump was about to be inaugurated. would he find language to allow him to govern? i think a month later we have seen the answer. no, he has not found that
moment. >> donald trump had a in a moment on inauguration day and nancy pelosi said at our set in the bar before donald trump was inaugurated her match take a deep breath and let's see what happens. within a few days, donald trump stepped all over that. his white house stepped all over that. there was a mom where he was going to get some time and space to do what he wanted to do but now, here we are. >> jim vandehei, thank you very much. we will read your new piece for a axios. >> it's on fire on. axios. i've heard you have more readers than "the new york times." it's amazing. >> real news. >> the failing "the new york times" strikes again. >> still ahead, nbc's peter alexanderdowns is live from the white house and has new reporting on the administration working on a new immigration executive order. what role does stephen miller play in drafting this one? >> i don't know, but the last one went so well.
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ivanka trump tweeted a photo that shows her sitting at the oval office desk with her father and canada prime minister justin troo doutrudeau. did you notice something odd in that photo? zoom in on the bottom right hand corner? you got to be kidding me! >> joining us is peter alexander. good morning. >> how did she get is in there. >> she cleared security. the trump administration hinting for sometime now to new version of that executive order on the travel ban. when could we expect it and how different will it be? >> reporter: yeah, it's exactly one week since that federal court of appeals struck down that travel ban so no
information on what it's going to look like. we know it will likely come out early next week. remember monday is a federal holiday. i was told by senior administration officials here yesterday that those who were involved in the sort of retooling, the recrafting of this new executive order include the attorney general jeff sessions, as well as the department of homeland security. it's notable that jeff sessions was not yet in office when the first executive order went out. and also notable to you, joe, and mika, steven miller, i'm told he is the senior policy director that he and his team is involved in the recrafting of this one as well. what is significant donald trump the president himself said that without this travel ban in effect, the country was basically in peril. another time in a tweet he said it would be up to one of the federal judges who would be to blame in case there was a terror attack. one of the questions a lot of people are asking is if there is such a grave danger, why hasn't there been a remedy any sooner? separately this morning, "the new york times" is reporting
that president trump is looking to shake up the intelligence community. i know you guys are aware of this with a broad review of the nation's spy agencies. "the times "on reports that steven feinberg is the president's choice to lead the review that ultimately they say could lead to a larger role in intelligence. already, we are hearing from some former u.s. intelligence officials expressing concerns about the possibility of the white house basically having direct control over america's spies at the same time that mr. trump's possible ties to russia and russia's inference during the campaign are under investigation. >> a lot swirling behind new that building. peter alexander on the south lawn, thanks. i've been doing some checking up since we were talking about the president's approval ratings, and this is gallup. trump is at 41% at the same point that barack obama was at 64 and 41 at 67 and clinton at
51. if you want to compare with george w. bush who wayne popular bush 57, trump 35 independent and among women bush 35 and trump 25. 18 to 29-year-old bush 55 and trump 30. among college graduates, bush 60, trump 35. so i have not seen positive polls. >> 27 days. >> historically low. >> the wind is at your back. >> yeah. >> and i don't think you could have gone any worse than it has gone in the first month. >> these are historically low numbers. >> what hurts him also on politically is on policy. if red state democrats are not afraid of him because the ratings so low in those states and there is actually a governing consequence. >> take a step further and talked earlier how much
republicans peek their heads up and say i'm to run in office for a year. and may be safe to come out and say this ain't working. >> talk one of the states that -- or one of the biggest swing states and it's iowa. and he only has a 42% roof approval rating. he is you wanted down by seven points. quite a change. by the way, the des moines register poll if i'm not mistaken said he was up seven or eight points so they called it office. >> if you are running for office and wouldn't you rather have mike pence as president? >> well, i can't speak for myself because i am just a humble news analyst here, political analyst. but i can tell you that every congressman and senator on
capitol hill would rather have mike pence. but -- >> we know. he is the vice president. >> there is that pause. >> we will tell you in the aggressive group target democrats if they deem them too soft on the president. the piece that says the president is suddenly looking like a very weak autocrat. knowing where you stand. it's never been easier. except when it comes to your retirement plan. but at fidelity, we're making retirement planning clearer. and it all starts with getting your fidelity retirement score.
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a new political action committee will recruit and fund primary opponents to democratic members of congress that it feels are not aggressive enough in fighting president donald trump. we will replace you.org was formed in part of by members of the bernie sanders campaign and the black lives matter movement. stating, quote, we will only defeat republicans on the local, state, and federal level if we go on the offensive. the pac appears to be the first organized everyday to challenge democratic lawmakers. one of the group founders tells nbc news, quote, our message to democrats is pretty
straightforward. fight trump or we will find someone who will. the group plans to raise money and volunteer efforts online as a hybrid pac, the group can coordinat coordinate with campaigns. joining us now is the founder of tina brown live media and good to have you on board, tina. i think a lot of republicans are increasingly in a difficult position as this presidency seems to lose credibility. >> i think one of the difficulties, real difficulties that the trump administration is going to find as these crazy weeks unfold is when they actually do have a good idea. no one is going believe or pay any attention to it as joe was mentioning before. the court of ludwig but every so often something is lobbed out there like mattis was good. he said you have to care about your kids more than we do. you have to pony up the money that is required.
but all of these -- some of these good things that are happening are going to get completely overwhelmed by this lies and delegitimatizing scrutiny every time trump attacks the media. >> i think some are not as dumb as they think they are when they make charges at media and news organizations while, at the same time, saying things that are blatantly untrue. i could be wrong but i don't think i am. >> that super pac that you just laid out is the latest example of a progressive and democratic left that is as energized as anyone has seen in a generation by donald trump. they realize now the important thing is win those grassroot elections and win state houses lost under president obama and state legislatures. greg sergeant writes a piece in "the washington post" titled "donald trump is suddenly looking like a very weak autocrat." greg writes trump deals with
setbacks by lashing out at other institutions. he lasted the courts and news media for making us less safe and a test round of sorts in which trump was experimenting how far he could go in delegitimatizing the institutions that might act a check on his power later. it's failing. his unchecked antics on multiple fronts is making him look like a week auto want wannabe. he looks weaker and less effective and more ridiculous than anyone might have anticipated and it happened surprisingly quickly too. >> if you're in america and want to feel save. three institutions that will protect us. the judicial. the media, and intelligence. those are the three institutions they go after. the ones that are basically on our side theoretically. >> senator gillibrand was with us last night in our women world event and saying the massive
protests are working. obamacare was the warrior cry of the election. now it's like let's put it off. let's -- it was about repeal and might be repealed but put off trying to fix it. puzder gets defeated. these are the things. it's actually working to push back and i think it's really fueling this resistance movement more keenly and the women's march was this great intersectional platform and women irm the spearhead of the massive resistance what is happening in this administration. >> absolutely. >> rich lowrie writing in "national review." it reads in part.
sam stein? >> yeah, i mean, i talked to a congressman, earl palmer, who lost his seat in 2009. i said when did you know that the protests that you saw that summer were going to cost you? he said he was sitting in a restaurant in north dakota ordering a breakfast, eggs, i believe, and a waitress came by and left a tea bag on his table. not a cup of tea. at that point, he said i knew the protests were hitting a fever pitch. i said do you recognize from then right now? ed, absolutely. in the instinct i had back then was to run away from it. he stopped doing these town hall events and instead he would to
teletown halls so his constituents couldn't front him in person and call in and he could monitor that. he said that was a mistake. i need to recognize the protests are real and deal with them right away. what is happening now is the republican members are dismissing these people saying they are paid and running away from them and doing teletown halls and wrong tactic. >> those people vote and did you see the town halls over the weekend? >> and ten months from now if the jobs do not come back and somebody's health care has gone away, you know how those people will be. >> in a sense the republicans have had their bluff called over this health care because for eight years they have been going on about obamacare and they have nothing ready. no credible plan. >> they are going to end up having a big problem at the voting. tina brown, stay with us. still ahead this morning. >> so we are sensitive to that and we are sensitive to the things like, you know, people being able to stay on the policy. >> would there be a federal guarantee? or would it be a state-by-state? >> we will let you know.
that's what we are in the process of working on. >> so joe pressed the senate majority leader on whether they will keep obamacare that most voters support and don't want to lose. will obamacare go under the knife? a question robert draper asks had nhis "the new york times" magazine cover story. we will speak with him next. nhi magazine cover story. we will speak with him next. inh magazine cover story. we will speak with him next. in his "the new york times" magazine cover story. we will speak with him next. their experience is coveted. their leadership is instinctive. they're experts in things you haven't heard of -
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robert, thanks for being with us. are we looking at a situation where the house passes a bill that the is in the kills? >> so far, we don't see union i am -- rand paul has a bill that mark sanford over in the house is a cosponsor of. but it competes against another bill or at least a program called the better way that speaker paul ryan has been promulgating a while. fundamental differences twens those two. on top of which we are not heard from donald trump on this.
and he has indicated here and there that he wants to keep preexisting conditions that he wants to keep other key elements of obamacare. some of that is missing in these other bills. >> they are at the both speaker ryan and majority leader mcconnell said they want to push that to the states. it will be guaranteed from the states and probably not from the federal government. >> there is another thing too. there is the matter of medicaid expansion. all of these are proposals block grant to the medicaid to the states. but some of the governors, republican governors who have embraced medicaid expansion do not want to see this thrown away and it's well understood that block granting is going to leave millions of people out. i'm not sure president trump wants to read headlines in the newspapers millions of people under trump care is on the
street without coverage. >> is it fair to say what is gospel the republicans have voted to repeal all or part of the affordable care act more than 60 times? i don't know what the number is any more. but never had a plan ready to replace it? that is always the argument. have they had a plan at any of those points? >> they have had plans here and there, but not coalesced around any of those plans. one of those plans was put together by then republican study committee chairman tom price who is now the head of hhs and paul ryan has a plan of his own. but most of these have been piece male. for obamacare for all of its flaws have changed the paradigm. now millions of more people on the rolls and no guarantee that any of these other plans will keep those same people on the rolls. >> tina, as i underline all the time millions of people on obamacare and many of them trump supporters. >> many are trump supporters. they have embraced it and now getting coverage and now able to have preexisting conditions covered. there is just no way -- it really is a scandal to me, an absolute scandal that the
republicans that have made this their war cry for six years, and, yet, not able to come up w something. this is an issue trump will not be bothered with. he hates details and nothing he can solve in, quote, a deal which is the only prism he sees political action. >> part of the reason there hasn't been a plan in the working it frankly was not an effortless thing to keep all of the republicans on board with repealing this. i mean, that is -- after 2010 when it was passed a feeling among some republicans all of whom voted against obamacare, well, we hate this bill but it's passed, we are done with it. through groups like one i focus on heritage action in my story they were pressing everyone. we must repeal it and people take a pledge saying we will repeal it and must repeal it in its entirety. not piecemeal. if we repeal this part and leave the rest of it the coalition of groups against obamacare if they are giving something they want
will fall away and that much harder to achieve a total repeal. so that is an effort unto its own and figure we only complicate the effort by trying to figure out what we replace it. >> let's bring in senator rand paul of kentucky. >> senator paul, good to see you this morning. we offered a bill last month co-authored with mark sanford saying the obamacare replacement act. how much support have you seen from it? >> i think conservatives are - co-alesing around it. i think you would find little objection to any idea i have in my bill. at least half the ideas in the bill came from legislation from congressman tom price. i think it has the ability to become the consensus bill. people often call it a sausage making factory. we have to start making some sausage. we put this forward saying these are ideas most people agreed to. tell what you say you don't like
and what you do like. let's repeal the whole thing. we won the election in 2010, 2014 and the white house 2016 on complete repeal. we voted for complete repeal last year. let's do it again. let's replace it with something that will help people that need help. >> does the bill have pre-existing coverage. for two years you can sign up for pre-existing or not. after that, if you want to have preinsurance, you have to keep it. the insurance model doesn't work if you tell people. this is the fatal flaw of obamacare. if you can get insurance after you are sick, you will. you won't get it when you are healthy and the model fails and you get adverse reaction and blue cross/blue shield lost 400 million in the market. that will get worse if you say people can still get insurance after they are sick.
you have to fix that. doesn't sound -- nobody is excited that we are taking away something, fwu insurance model does not work if we are in the model. we have to be honest with people. >> it's robert draker with "the new york times." my understanding is part is going to be paid for by cutting spending. are you going to be able to get democrats on board? >> there's no cost unless you call reducing taxes a cost. there is no expenditure. it's not a federal government program. we let people keep more of their own money through tax deductions to save into their health savings account. if you call that a cost, yes. unfortunately, the talk in washington is if you cut someone's taxes you have to raise someone else's taxes. we don't accept that. if you cut taxes, make government smaller, send power and authority back to the states and the people, we are for smaller government. that's what it takes to be a
conservative. >> where do you stand on the president's relationship with russia and what's happened with the national security adviser. are you on the side of we should focus on the leaks or we should take a closer look into inappropriate ties with russia between the president and members of this administration? >> i think law enforcement should and is looking at this. they should determine if laws can be broken. before you jump further into a political investigation, i think we ought to find out, was a law broken? there needs to be discuss if a law was broken. >> you are talking with general flynn talking to the russian ambassador? >> right. >> we jumped past that, haven't we? you have media outlets talking about a potential law broken, then legal experts saying nobody's ever been persecuted under that. that would be a good place to
start, like the senator is saying. >> there were two great articles this week. i know you review a lot of journalism. they had a great article talking about what kind of world it would be if secret intelligence agencies record our phone calls and release them to the media. that is not just a leak. we are not talking about juicy gossip and whether the president wears a bathrobe or not. we are talking private information between high ranking officials. if we are going to release it to the press, that is very, very worrisome. in the process of that, we are going to destroy people who are critics of the intelligence agency. that alarms me. that's not just a partisan shifting of blame, this is concerning for a free society. >> senator rand paul, thank you for being with us. >> robert draper, your piece in the new york times magazine is online now. thank you as well. >> the only thing i have to say, the republican complaint that
this was just poor michael flynn plucked out of a sea of officials that people didn't like. actually ignores the context around a man who went to russia, who sat next to vladimir putin, who people believe received payments. >> he has pre-existing condition. >> he has an audition with russia back during the campaign. people were afraid, tina, he was too close to russia and it would be a national security threat. so, if your intel agencies aren't monitoring his phone calls with russian agents, that's a problem. >> also, what possible reason could there be for the republican leadership not to want a bipartisan investigation for this? we are in a situation of crisis over this. in europe, we are facing, you know, a possible russian hacking of european elections. there's a huge desire in the world for this whole question of russia to be cleared up.
>> thank you very much. still ahead this morning, donald trump couldn't get enough of wikileaks during the campaign. >> loved it. loved it. >> now that the leaks seem to be coming from his own white house, he's singing a different tune. we'll show you st evolution. we knew he could evolve. 100% fresh mouth. just ask listerine® users. the very people we studied in the study of bold. people who are statistically more likely to stand up to a bully. do a yoga handstand. and be in a magician's act. listerine® kills 99% of bad breath germs so you can feel 100% in life. bring out the bold™. also try listerine® pocketpaks for fresh breath on the go. and the wolf huffed like you do sometimes, grandpa? well, when you have copd, it can be hard to breathe. it can be hard to get air out, which can make it hard to get air in. so i talked to my doctor.
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as i call it, the fake media, in many cases. i think it's really a sad thing he was treated so badly. i think, in addition to that, from intelligence, papers are being leaked, things are being leaked. it's criminal action, criminal act. it's been going on for a long time, before me, but now it's really going on. people are trying to cover up for a terrible loss that the democrats had under hillary clinton. >> why was he fired if it was just the fake media? >> it could be a fake firing. maybe he wasn't really fired. >> hillary could have fired him, actually. >> i thought he was strong. >> could have been a fake fire. >> i thought she was strong, the fake media couldn't get him. he is blaming michael flynn's resignation on the news media? >> no, he didn't do that. >> this is a messed up way of
saying good morning, everyone. it is thursday, february 16th. >> he was clearly fired him himself based on what the spokesperson said he couldn't trust him. therefore -- >> i think it means because he was caught in a lie. i'm not sure the lying is actually considered bad. >> he was caught in a lie, yeah. >> i think being caught in a lie is bad. which is a great message to send to our children, by the way, let alone how to run a country. >> we got caught in a lie. i thought he was fired because they both got caught in a lie. >> they got caught in a lie. is was, veteran columnist -- donny deutsche, moral compass. >> mike barnicle. senior political editor for the "huffington post," this is taking way too long. a man who, this time of year, is absolutely -- i'm still on sam
stein. he's obsessed for picking teams for australian football. columnist for "the washington post," david ignatius. david, a lot of weeds to clear out. >> i mentioned donny. >> i brought my weed whacker. >> a lot of weeds to sort through and clear out. it's hard to see what is going on. we have heard reports that there are parts of this story that the weeds go further and will be more -- we have heard other sources that told us through reporting that the stories about the contacts during the campaign are actually not extensive and that story may not be as significant of a story. there's no doubt, i'm sure you are hearing the same thing i am, donald trump's contacts with russia, the intel community
sources i speak with say there's still more to come there. >> there is a lot more investigation to complete. there's a broad look by the fbi aided by other intelligence agencies to establish what happened during this period when russia was mounting an aggressive covert action against our political system. what contacts were made. what did the russians use? all the things with a counter intelligence or moving into criminal investigation are going on here. the investigations take a long time. i think people need to be very careful about little, kind of droplets of information that pop out because it's a big systematic investigation. the best hope is it will be conducted professionally and at the end of the day, we'll actually know what happened. we'll have real facts and we can begin to make decisions. >> yes. again, that's the key. i said it a couple days ago,
let's not get ahead of the facts. let's have the investigations, they need to be extensive investigations, but don't get ahead of the facts. i saw this so many times during the clinton information. this is going to be the end of bill clinton. there was a buzz around washington, d.c. everybody always got ahead of the facts. let's not. >> i don't think there's a need to do that, but it's time to see what we see. >> we see the need for an extensive investigation. >> absolutely. "the new york times" reports that president trump is looking to shake up the intelligence community with a broad review of the nation's spy agencies. according to the report, stephen fienburg is president trump's choice to lead the review. it could be a prelude to a larger role in intelligence. reports fienburg was under consideration to run the service rocked the intelligence community in recent weeks, raising the press back to direct
white house control over america's spies at a time trump's ties to russian president, vladimir putin are under investigation by the fbi and congressional committees. this as the wall street journal alleged they have with held sensitive information from the president due to concerned it could be leaked or compromised. the current and former officials. however, the report says current and former officials emphasize, they know of no instance crucial information about security has been omitted. >> we have to say this for people who are watching, and they are trying to sort through this, there is no doubt, the wall street journal has gone from being the most hostile conservative voice toward donald trump during the campaign to certainly seeming to bend over backwards to actually parrot
much of what the administration puts out. if you looked at their editorial, david ignatius, not to knock a paper or editorial board, but a board that was hypercritical of donald trump during the campaign. yesterday, they used their editorial page to say, oh, there's nothing to see here other than leaks coming from intel agencies. >> well, with the journal, i just want to stress, i muworked for the wall street journal for ten years as a reporter. the editorial side of that paper is strong, at most. has there been attempt to shape the coverage as opposed to the editorial which is always going to be opinionuated and change over time. that's the thing the news room has been talking about. >> david, were you concerned yesterday, the lead editorial for the wall street journal did not mention concerns about
improper contacts that michael flynn had with russia but, instead, their editorial focused solely on leaks, it was as if donald trump had written the editorial himself. >> joe, it was an editorial. it's not the position i would have written. i don't agree with it. i think the argue that this is about leaks as opposed to the behavior of public officials is wrong. i would be concerned if i thought that was matched idea for idea in the news coverage. i don't see that happening. >> david ignatius, look at the headline today. again, this is sort of what we do. we look at media and pound "the new york times" all the time. that, yesterday, is followed up on the top of the wall street journal with spies keep intelligence from trump. that's the screaming headline. you dig down into the story and you actually find out that they don't have one single instance
of where important intelligence was kept from the president of the united states. >> they have a good quote from adam schiff, the ranking democrat on the house intelligence committee. the story is thin beyond that quote. so, i didn't think it was a fluff -- >> the story is thin. look at this headline, guys. it's not david. i'm going to take david off the hot spot. it is an extraordinarily thin story. mike, again, yesterday, instead of talking about flynn, the wall street journal, the editorial page, that i have read my entire life, they say nothing to see here with flynn. forget the improper ties, forget the lying, we ought to look at the leaks. look at this headline on the front page, spies keep intelligence from trump in a story that is thinly sourced and even their thin sources say, at the end of the day, we don't have anything here. >> i think david and i are going to come from the same classroom on this.
i don't care what's on the editorial page as long as what's on the editorial page seeps into the coverage. also, you write the story and i have always, i think david is probably the same as i am, i'm not responsible for the headlines. i don't write the headlines. i write the story. some guy in the copy writes the headline. >> you think some guy in the copy wrote the headline or do you think it came down from above? >> i don't think it came from above. i think it came from middlemanagement. >> i don't think this was middlemanagement. >> if you read the story, the story is very thin. they are still getting intelligence. >> i agree, joe, but, there's something that happens sometimes employers/employees you turn to each other and go, this is not working out. you know, what i see right now, day 27, a white house -- >> hold on a second.
hey, sam, i think what donny is saying, we thank you for being with us. if you can take the rice-a-roni and go home. >> fantasy draft is in 20 minutes. i would appreciate that. >> you have no organization skills. you have a russian investigation that unfolds in a fugly way. on top of that, we have a white house that is getting nothing done as far as policy, when you prepare what happened to obama after 30 days and "w" after 30 days. no matter how you peek at this thing, this feels like a president, a guy that doesn't belong in that job. >> jump in. >> i think to tie this together, the sub text of the journal story and why you mentioned stephen fienburg taking over goes to donny's point. instead of looking at the flynn,
i think you could call it a fiasco at this point, and trying to figure out what happened with russia after the election, the outcome here seems to be pointing to a massive purge coming, directed by the administration of the intel community of potential leakers. you are seeing this seep into not just the coverage in the wall street journal, but what's going on on capitol hill, too. last night, jason chaffetz put out a letter, the first call to investigation for the flynn matter. the investigation he wants is whether the information was leaked. two of these reporters in respect to the phone calls. where we are going with this is fairly a dark place, which is a massive tamper on whistleblowers and people they feel -- >> of course -- >> firing or whatnot. >> yeah. >> i think that suggests someone
grasping for control and doesn't have a good grasp. >> still ahead on "morning joe," senator amy klobuchar and information on russia, like the one on 9/11. we'll ask if she thinks she can get that. after negative reports, andy is out as labor secretary. you are watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ sfx: engine revving ♪ (silence) ♪ except when it comes to retirement.
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welcome back to "morning joe." we want to dig into more of the president's relationship with the intel community. yesterday, the president also tweeted, quote, the real scandal here is that classified information is illegally given out by intelligence like candy, very un-american. and, information is illegally given to the failing new york times and "washington post" by
the nsa and fbi, question mark, just like russia. >> is that meant as a compliment, mika? >> you know, honestly -- honestly -- honestly, i don't know, nor should you. >> i don't. >> president trump wrote one tweet, in which he thanked columnist eli lake for writing the nsa and fbi should not interfere in our politics. the irony of the statement expressing concern of leaked information and fbi interference was not lost on many. here is that same man on the campaign trail. >> russia, if you are listening, i hope you are able to find the 30,000 e-mails that are missing. the fbi, the fbi, the fbi has just sent a letter to congress, new e-mail. some of the 33,000 missing and deleted e-mail. and they are reopening the case
into her criminal and illegal conduct. this just came out -- wikileaks, i love wikileaks. amazing how nothing is secret today when you talk about the internet. hillary clinton tried to politicize this investigation. i respect the fact that director comey, you have amazing people in the fbi, was able to come back after what he did. i have great respect for the fbi. to have the courage -- for having the courage to write the horrible mistake that may made. i give them great credit. >> a butterfly net. >> he respects the fbi, and the leaks. >> he loves wikileaks. >> illegal leaks. >> david ignatius, it's hard to keep score here. i guess the question we have to ask going forward is, what does
the intel -- donald trump tried to delegitimize the courts. you know, it reminds me of the old song, i fought the law and the law one. the courts one that round. he's trying to delegitimize the press. don't fight the press, the press always wins. ask richard nixon. now the intel community he's been fighting. what does the intel community think they do to protect themselves from this mccarthy-type purge that steve bannon's billionaire friend in new york is preparing? >> well, it's a long standing problem for intelligence agencies that are instructed by presidents, by administrations to do things they may feel are appropriate or inappropriate. generally, they try to do what they are told. that's part of being a professional. there is now a structure of oversight of intelligence, which is congressional intelligence
committees, other review panels that sit or go through this most classified information held the agencies to exert discipline and be professional. i would expect, if their attempts to steer this process where intelligence officers feel they are told to do something that is wrong, if steve fienburg says to change things in a way to weaken the agency, they will go to congress and their committees and explain what they think. then we'll see what the committees, whether they do their job of oversight properly. one thing i have seen, joe, our structure, our system actually is stronger and more resilient than i thought a month ago. that's encouraging. that's a good thing. we are seeing, as you said, the court system pretty much works, it reviews orders and bounces back things that are ill formed.
the media, we put out information so, i think, in the case of intelligence, a place for them to go that is appropriate and we'll go there. coming up on "morning joe," divisions within the republican party over plans for a border assessment attacks. >> a border adjustment tax, which sounds like something from orrwell. a look in business on "morning joe." >> we bring in nbc capitol hill correspondent, casey hunt. this is the story of green mountain coffee and fair trade, told in the time it takes to brew your cup. let's take a trip to la plata, colombia. this is boris calvo. that's pepe. boris doesn't just grow good coffee, boris grows mind-blowing coffee. and because we pay him a fair price, he improves his farm to grow even better coffee and invest in his community, which makes his neighbor, gustavo, happy. that's blanca. yup, pepe and blanca got together. things happen. all this for a smoother tasting cup of coffee. green mountain coffee. packed with goodness.
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donald trump's choice for labor secretary, andy puzder, the ceo of a fast food company, carls's jr. and hardies. he's outspoken against raising the federal minimum wage. what is the minimum wage? you can't even live on it. i think this position, along with a number of other key positions in this administration ought to focus on wages and women. >> yeah. >> as the key to this economy. >> focus on women, mika, but not in a way that joe would approve. >> i am disturbed. i think this is a real weak spot
for this president-elect and a weak spot for our country. >> this guy, he talks about how robots want to take the place of workers, robots, want to take the place of workers, then he actually called his own employees, quote, the worst of the worst. saying it's hard to get a good work force when you are selecting from the worst of the worst. how do you ever let this man be secretary of labor? how do you ever let somebody that has talked about his own employees who made him a billionaire or a multimillionaire, calls him the worst of the worst. >> fast food executive andy puzder withdrew his nomination to be labor secretary. i ham honored to be considered
to lead department of labor and put businesses back on a path to sustainable prosperity. puzder faced fierce disapproval over questions concerning his business record and personal issues also clouded his nomination. ahead of his hearing, scheduled for today, footage was provided to senators by oprah winfreys company of a 1990 show where his wife appeared in disguise, discussing political abuse. puzder always denied that and his wife sent a letter to the committee. >> what may have doomed it is the increasing opposition from members of the republican party. according to "the new york times," at least seven republicans expressed concern over his nomination. >> there were so many questions
surrounding his nomination that i believe the hearing tomorrow would have been extremely difficult for him. there would have been questions that even if he would have been able to be confirmed would have made it difficult for him to be an effective secretary of the department of labor. >> handing out favors to big campaign supporters is something for ambassadorships, not cap net level. they didn't look deep enough into anything, including he's against raising minimum wage, he had an immigration problem with a housekeeper and as mika said, the allegations of domestic abuse and an ugly divorce. there was a lot there. >> also the robot thing. >> the robot was big. >> i would rather have robots thand workers. i don't know. it's hard to sell that. >> a guy who is going to sue the
e.p.a., then make him the head. still ahead, more contentious votes in the senate with more republican defections. >> voting in favor of the nomination would be asking secretary mattis to spend less time fighting our enemies overseas and more time fighting inside the beltway budget battles with an omb director with a deep commitment to cutting the resources available to his department. >> we are joined by democratic senator amy klobuchar, next on "morning joe."
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and trump is not happy about it. he went on twitter saying msnbc and cnn are unwatchable. he said i know because i spent all day watching. >> joining us now, the dean of the johns hopkins school of advanced international studies. >> i think that's called the mike barnicle show. >> no, it's not. on capitol hill, amy klobuchar of minnesota. good to have you on the show this morning. >> great to have you here. >> thank you. >> dean, tell me, you obviously traveled a great deal across the globe. what is the atmosphere globally for leaders looking toward the united states? >> i think they are listening, obviously to every word the president says. they read every tweet. it worries them greatly, the
united states willing to wreck the international system. also, there is no government in the u.s. >> what do you mean by that? >> most of the actual personnel they do day-to-day business with, where information shows up is not in place. there's no assistant secretary or middle east or asia in place. they don't know who is going to be in those positions, many positions in the white house are not filled. a lot of business of the world is not at the level of crisis on the front page of newspapers, the day-to-day give and take. you have the korean leader that killed his brother. nobody knows where the united states stands. who is going to implement the policy? who is calling them? who is calling the different places around the world? this gives them a sense the system is gradually decaying and getting broken. >> dean, what was the reaction yesterday at the joint press conference, president trump said he supports the one-state
solution, going against generations, really, of washington. bedrock policy of the two-state system for middle east peace. were you surprised by that? >> it was surprising he would say it with the israeli prime minister next to him in a controlled manner, which means he thought about it and been briefed about it. i think it changes the middle east dynamic completely. if i were the israeli prime minister, i would get very nervous with this. he has benefited from this industry of two-state solution and peace process. now, essentially, he owns it in some ways. when the president says both sides should be happy about a deal, how do you make them happy about a one-state solution? you either have to give them full status or down the path of
voting rights and suppress them, which is where they don't want to go. he encouraged the domestic fashion of israel was enthusiastic about the west bank and it's going to be more difficult for prime minister netanyahu to control them. >> let's listen to what the president said yesterday. >> so, i'm looking at two-state and one-state. i like the one that both parties like. i'm very happy with the one that both parties like. i can live with either one. i thought for a while the two-state looked like it may be the easier of the two, but honestly, if b.b. and if the palestinians of israel and the palestinians are happy, i'm happy with with the one they like the best. as far as settlements, i would like to see you hold back on settlements for a bit. we'll work something out. b.b. and i have known each other a long time. a smart man, great negotiator. i think we are going to make a
deal. it might be a bigger and better deal than people in this room even understand. that's a possibility. let's see what we do. >> doesn't sound too optimistic. good negotiator. >> it's the art of the deal. >> there is such a cross current of things said there. talking about a one-state or a two-state solution, mike, but also saying hold off on the settlement in front of the israeli prime minister, who looked to most observers surprised he would blurt that out. >> the expression on prime minister netanyahu's face spoke volumes. senator klobuchar, that clip we just showed, we have the obvious, that you referenced and other members of the senate referenced, russia, general flynn. this beneath the surface, i think i picked up a series of
concerns among members of the senate, your colleagues, about competence in government. what exists in the senate about exactly that today. are you concerned about the level of competence in this government? >> i think everyone is concerned because of the chaos we have seen when we have senator mccain having to step in and sue one of our allies, australia, after that call had been made. when you have announcements being made by twitter. it does concern many of us. i think that's one of the reasons that we move quickly to get some of the cabinet members in, like general mattis, so at least the agencies from the cia to homeland security had people in charge that had some experience. that aside, the president is the commander in chief. the world demands some kind of consistency and some kind of alerts when things are happening and negotiations and diplomacy.
russia is so concerning, of course, that is basically been a moment where there appears to have been an effort to undercut what has been long standing america's view. we are not going to let foreign powers enfluns our elections and undercut sanctions and other things we have done. that is what happened. when that call was made, by most accounts, waiting to see the transcript, some of us, that was an effort to undercut sanctions that were put in place for a good reason. >> senator klobuchar, more on that point, head dean nasser beginning this conversation about how we are seen globally and many positions are yet to be filled, important positions and we lost the national security adviser under what appears to be concern, maybe suspicion that there's more. how important do you think an investigation is and what
exactly should be investigated? >> well, i think, first of all, we need to know about that conversation. who else the national security adviser had spoken to and how far back it went with the reports there were multiple contacts between the trump campaign and russian intelligence. that is very discurbing. i was just in the baltics and ukraine with senator mccain and lindsey graham, they have seen this before. russia has been trying to undermine their democracy, breaking into computer networks and trying to hack in and listen to their conversations. this is about our democracy and our allies and security for the world. >> dean, let's talk about the russia, the possible russia investigation. what are your key concerns right now? >> i think number one is the intelligence committee has to be able to do their job and we want to be bipartisan.
i'm someone that believes we also should look at an independent commission down the road where you have experts that can look at not just exactly what happened with intelligence, but also how we can fix things going forward in terms of russia not influencing the election or any power. >> senator amy klobuchar, thank you. >> thank you so much. >> dean, what are your concerns over what we have heard about russia over the past couple days and the past 18 months? >> i think the biggest worry, i would say, the degree of risk taking the russians have been willing to engage in. that should worry us that putin has felt very comfortable to not only to interfere with our elections and european elections. the audacity of his elections, at some point would demand a tough response from the united states. >> why do you think he has that comfort level? >> i think under the previous
administration, he calculated president obama did not want to go to war. there might be sanctions and push back but how much he would get involve in ukraine. against president trump, he has an open door to push against. president trump is not concerned, but he dismisses them and he's willing to go to war with his own intelligence agencies to dismiss them. the way he talks about cooperating with russia on syria or on europe, the way he down plays the importance of nato, that he's even against the european union. all of these are essentially gifts on a silver platter to putin. even if you are putin, you calculate you have two years, four years to push as hard as you can to get as much as you can and in the process, you may actually change the political dynamic of the united states and europe. when the dust settles, russia will be in a very different
place. >> all right, dean, thank you very much. >> thank you so much. >> it's time for business before the bell with dominic chu. yesterday, the president met with retail executives who are concerned about a border adjustment tax. tell us about that. >> the border adjustment tax, the idea you could put a surcharge on imported goods coming in. that would go into the final product. it would be for final product that is are made. if you tax imports for the companies that use those imports, the overall cost of their goods goes higher. that's why the retail industry is so concerned about it. those ceos, the guys like autozone, target, all these guys that met with president trump, the focus of the industry is pushing back on this republican proposal. that boost in taxes could impact the retail industry more than a lot of other ones because they import a lot of goods, more so than other industries.
the former sachs ceo said this could be the biggest deal they have seen in quite some time with regard to the impact of their business. that's the reason everyone cares about the border adjustment tax. immigration is going to be a focus. various parts of the country, we will see immigrants and groups in washington, d.c., new york, houston, chicago and others. a lot plan to stay home from their jobs. this is called a day without immigrants. it's meant to say how businesses could be impacted. it's going to be a policy thing to watch as well. on the business end of things, the social media front, snap inc, it owns the snap chat platform, it sees a public offering between 14 and 16 bucks a share. it could value the company at over $22 billion at the high end of the range. joe and mika, that would make it the biggest tech ipo since 2014.
>> dominic chu, thank you very much. up next, we bring in casey hunt live from capitol hill with the latest reporting. also ahead on "morning joe" -- >> do you have confidence in him? >> not a good job, a great job. >> i hope that doesn't mean like bless your heart. >> that was president trump on monday striking an optimistic tone despite the political storm that is swirling around the white house. >> "time" magazine put it one way, nothing to see here. so how old do you want to be when you retire? uhh, i was thinking around 70. alright, and before that? you mean after that? no, i'm talking before that. do you have things you want to do before you retire? oh yeah sure... ok, like what? but i thought we were supposed to be talking about investing for retirement? we're absolutely doing that. but there's no law you can't make the most of today.
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and it's empowering anyone to stop a job if something doesn't seem right. at bp, safety is never being satisfied. and always working to be better. yesterday, the senate voted to roll back an obama era regulation that makes it harder for mentally disabled people to buy guns. this was after sandy hook in newtown, connecticut. we are going bring in casey hunt with reporting on that. first, a look at the ground we have covered this morning. >> the intel community forces i speak with say there is more to come there. >> there needs to be more discussion on what law was broken, if a law was broken. >> calls for a 9/11 commission are premature. it's rarely what you do that gets you in trouble, it's once
it becomes public. >> you dig down into the story, they don't have one single sin stance of where important intelligence was kept from the president. stk outcome seems to be pointing to a massive purge coming of potential leakers. >> a lot of republicans that were cheering the leaks, from wikileaks are suddenly wanting to have a witch hunt. >> andy puzder withdrawaling his nomination. >> something for am bass torships. >> rex tillerson is not happy with how things are happening. >> there's numerous slots under the secretary not filled. >> i don't think we are going to know what the administration is going to look like for four to five months. >> he's been treated very, very unfairly by the media. >> it was fake news. >> every republican on the hill told me quietly, i wish they would shut up so you could talk about policy. >> if they stop doing the things you are talking about, the
coverage would be less harsh. >> i did not see evidence of this president becoming someone who would listen. >> joining us now, casey hunt. casey tell us about the senate vote on gun regulations yesterday. a lot of people talking about it. >> hi, willie. in the first month of the trump presidency, they are moving quickly. it was written in response to the tragedy at sandy hook elementary. it took years to write and was implemented in december. republicans already rolled it back. basically, it would have added 75,000 names to the background check data base. they are people who are considered mentally disabled fwi security administration. and who also have been deemed incapable of handling their own financial affairs. republicans say it would have infringed on their rights. aclu opposed saying it fed into
stereo types that mentally disabled people are violent. chris murphy of connecticut has newtown parents as his constituents. he say this is is a sign of rough things to come for people who want more gun restrictions. take a look at what he had to say. >> the ong thing congress has done on guns since sandy hook is make it easier for very mentally ill people to get guns. think about being a parent in sandy hook and knowing the only thing congress has done is to make it easier for people like adam lanza to get their hands on assault weapons. this is outrageous. >> this is really a fundamental change here. problem and joe biden made pleas. they didn't take action. now, of course, republicans have a republican president in the white house. they expect him to sign issues like this, legislation like this. guys? >> nbcs casy hunt. >> can i ask casey quickly?
>> reporter: yeah. >> you stee headlines. they look horrifying. after sandy hook, we were extraordinarily, we went on for a long time to get guns out of the hands of the mentally ill. >> reporter: of course. >> but, is it not true, with this legislation yesterday you had everybody from the nra to the aclu to a lot of mental health advocacy groups that said this law was overwritten, it was too broad and would ensnarl people who, again, had problems with their finances? >> reporter: right. look, i think there was a broader constituency of people saying look, this regulation is going to sweep up people who quite frankly should retain their rights to be able to buy a firearm. there are reasons people may be considered unable to manage their own financial affairs that may not relate to this, whether
or not they should be able to buy a firearm. you are right about that being broader. >> all right, casey hunt, thank you. s at cia headquarters president trump talked about what he thought was a historic achievement with "time" magazine. >> "time" magazine. i have been on their cover 14 or 15 times. i think we have the all-time record being on the fronlt. if tom brady is on, it's one time for winning the super bowl. i have been on 15 times. i don't think that's a record that could ever be broken. >> that's an alternative fact. >> what's an alternative fact? >> it belongs to -- >> richard nixon. 55 times. i'm not sure it's a record he's looking to break. >> he has made the cover of "time" magazine, again. the cover of nothing to see her,
the editor of "time" magazine joins us now. i love the title, chaos theory. >> what is the story about and what is your front page telling us? >> there is a theory to this. if you win the office having continuously done thing that is everyone told you you can't do, why would we expect that to change? the difference now is the people telling donald trump you can't do that are not just tv talking heads or political opponents, it's judges or people with subpoena power or the intelligence community. so, you wonder, and i think we are watching, what would it take to conclude what worked so well for him in getting the office makes it impossible for him to do the job. >> that is a problem, not to this degree, but many insurgent candidates. >> it is. >> if you are barack obama and everybody told you you could not beat hillary clinton and you
ended up winning, you get into the white house and suddenly, you think you are smarter than everybody else as did reagan, kennedy's team, carter's team. >> absolutely true. >> insurgents that win always go in and think they are the smartest people in the room. >> that is absolutely true. it is true when we sent reporters around the country to get outside of this conversation and finding, i loved one woman in pennsylvania who said i'm so glad he's treating this as a job, not the presidency. there is -- this is actually something that a portion of the electorate that voted for him sees and engaged and energetic leader doing what he promised to do. he is aware of that and the fact that a lot of people are saying he is violating not just norms and political conventions, but serious, high stake imperatives. that's what has him steadfast in
the eye of a storm that is remarkable for anyone who followed, you know, what president's can and can't do for the last 40 years. >> all of us, we are in the middle of this storm. sometimes an hourly storm each day. do you, as a news person, as an editor of an iconic magazine, do you worry about an exhaustion level among consumers of news? they get so tired of this daily stuff that nothing shocks them? nothing really registers with them because we move on from one thing to another so quickly? >> that is exactly one of the things we were asking about. in fact, we talk about a poll done by the american psychological association that has 6 in 10 americans saying this political environment is causing them significant stress. that is the first measurable up tick in stress they have found in a decade of doing these kind
of measurements. people are, even among trump voters, people are experiencing a significant level of anxiety about the future of the country, about the tensions created within our systems. i think that's a very real issue. how much of this can people take? you hear about people unfriending people on facebook so their social experience is not one continuous political bar fight and trying to find a way to manage what has become an almost addictive pace of news junkie infusion. >> that's next week's cover? >> there you go. nancy gibbs, thank you very much. that does it for us this morning. if you can believe it, another -- >> no -- >> one day has gone by. just one day. the incoming is incredible. >> tomorrow, he's going to make it on time. >> willie, you are fine. leave him alone. he's such a bully. he's such a bully. >> no apologies. not my kids. >> hug them.
sometimes the hugs are lingering. all right -- >> you have to hug it out. >> made it so much worse. thank you, appreciate that buddy. >> thanks, stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage on time, right now. >> thanks, joe. thank you, mika. good morning, i'm stephanie ruhle. breaking news overnight. demanding answers. listen to this. republicans officially calling for an investigation into the leaks that took down general mike flynn. >> it's criminal action, criminal act. >> amid bipartisan calls to investigate the russia connection itself. an intel overhaul. president trump reportedly set to put this guy, a billionaire businessman in charge of revamping the spy agencies. as brand-new secretary of state goes face-to-face moments ago with russia's foreign minister. he is out. trump's labor secretary calls it quick. the