tv All In With Chris Hayes MSNBC March 10, 2017 12:00am-1:01am PST
tonight on "all in." >> this will be a plan where you can choose your plan. and you know what the plan is. this is the plan. >> the hard sell gets harder. >> we're not jamming this down people's throats. >> as the republican calls to slow down and start over mount. trumpcare takes two steps forward in the dark of night. >> the closest we will ever get to repealing and replacing obamacare. >> tonight, are staunch conservatives starting to wobble? plus -- >> crooked hillary clinton, leave this race now! the stunning news that michael flynn was a literal form agent while he was working to elect donald trump. >> i don't believe that that was known.
>> was the tramp campaign guilty of pay for play? >> it's called pay for play. >> and never mind bannon, miller and flynn. >> the era of the pajama boy is over and the alpha males are back. >> from dozens of lobbyists to professional survivalists. >> smash it up. >> pro-publica's exhaustive new report of the 400 trump hires you've never heard of when "all in" starts right now. >> good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. republicans continued share shock-and-awe strategy to slam trumpcare through congress. today despite massive pushback the approach is getting results for now. >> this is the closest we will ever get to repealing and replacing obamacare. the time is here, the time is now. this is the moment and this is
the closest this will ever happen. >> when paul ryan says the time is now, he is not kidding, trumpcare proponents are rushing headlong to pass the bill through congress at an unprecedented pace, prompting objections even from many republicans, among them senator tom cotton who tweeted today "too my friends in house, pause, start over, get it right, don't get it fast." >> senator mcconnell and every other senator is well aware of where i stand and frankly where many republican senators stand who are troubled by the breakneck pace at which the house is operating and the fact that this bill as written today simply would not pass the senate. >> in 2009, the passage of obamacare took more than a year, a time frame that was far too fast for republicans who complained the law was being -- as they liked to say -- jammed down their throats. >> we need to slow down and get it right. like mom used to say, you rush and you make mistakes.
>> i have never seen greater evidence that washington, d.c. is out of touch with the american people than the fact that democrats are going to continue in their head long rush to pass a government takeover of health care. >> that was in november. house republicans say they'll pass their bill in the next few weeks. today just three days after introducing the bill, they passed it through a pair of committees on party line votes after a pair of all night sessions moving forward despite the fact that congressional budget office has yet to score the plan. so we don't know nor have an estimate of how much it will cost or crucially how many millions of americans will lose their health care. today the brookings institution said the cbo will likeliest mate that at least 15 million people will lose coverage if trumpcare passes. the white house is already playing the estimate down. >> the irony of the score is that the cbo was way off the
last time. if you're looking to the cbo for accuracy, you're looking in the wrong place. >> the reason trumpcare proponents are moving so quickly is simple -- with each and everyday that passes, the list of people and institutions opposed to their bill, which already includes the aarp, every democrat on the record, and many congressional republicans, gets even longer. >> look, no one likes this bill -- hospital, doctors, governors, conservatives, liberal, non-partisan groups and, most of all, the people who will no longer have affordable health care. >> this graphic shows some of the non-partisan groups that have come out against the bill. in a remarkable move the chief medical officer for medicaid has come out against it as well. andrey ostrovsky says "despite political messaging from others at awhich he is, i align with the experts from aarp in the opposition to the health care act."
today, house speaker paul ryan used a powerpoint presentation in an attempt to win over the skeptics pushing the false claim that obamacare is collapsing. >> this law is in the middle of a collapse and people are losing their choices. here is what is happening under a law that is collapsing. it's not working, that's why it's in a death spiral. it's a death spiral. it's collapsing. >> more on that death spiral claim and its dubious province later in the show. as for president trump, he's in what the white house calls full sell mode on the bill meeting with members of congress to talk budget and health care. he tweeted "despite what you hear in the press, health care is coming along great, we are talking to many groups and it will end in a beautiful picture." joining me now, republican
congressman steve king of iowa and congressman, a lot of your colleagues, particularly the more conservative colleagues in the house and senate are in open revolt at the pace and process with which this bill is being considered. are you one of those individuals? >> i'm not in open revolt but i am concerned about us not being able to get some of our conservative principles plugged into this legislation. so i'm with those folks on the policy side of this thing but not on the revolutionary side. >> let me ask you this -- did you feel the affordable care act was passed too quickly? >> we fought it for a long time but in the end it was jammed through us and these are the words i've longed use by hook, by crook and by legislative shenanigan and the democrats will admit that, i borrowed those words from them. but the considered analysis of the public is what we need to have and that needed to happen under obamacare and it needs to happen now. we don't need to be in such a
hurry that the public doesn't get to weigh in and make their recommendations. >> the house version of the aca bill was introduced by nancy pelosi in mid-july 2009. it got voted on the floor in november. it was six months. does six months seem like an adequate or more proper framework to go through hearings? have public airing of this? >> well, that seems like a plenty long time when we look back on that. i didn't realize it was six months before we go to that november 7 vote. i remember that exact date. >> that's right. >> so -- but you know if we had four or five things to work this through, that would be an appropriate amount of time. the country is much more attuned to health insurance policy than they were then. i don't know if it takes as as long as to examine these things plus the public's experienced, they know what they don't want and i don't think we've con to a consensus on what they want. >> when you say we know what they don't want, what do you make of the fact that polling shows majority approval for the affordable care act?
>> oh, gosh, i'd say that's a surprise to me. i'm surprised because the other data that i've seen -- i haven't checked recently, i don't think people would be eager to repeal it if they know folks want to keep it. but i'm eager to repeal. >> it it is the case this bill was unpopular for a long time, 45% support. it's now majority support and 63% want to see it kept or expanded. you want to see it repealed? done away with? >> i want it all ripped out by the roots. i want to repeal every word of it. i wrote the repeal bill in the middle of the night, march 23, 2010. those 40 words end with "as if it had never been enacted." and that's the bill i'd like to see go from the house which it's passed in the past over to the senate and set it on mitch mcconnell's desk so we start fresh. i say we have a bad foundation, we need to start fresh and
rewrite this thing from a fresh start without being encumbered by some of the base work in obamacare. and if there are good pieces of that, we can put them back in by consensus rather than try to save something. >> how many people in your district are on the exchanges, congressman? >> i don't know that number. you may have that in front of you, chris, but i don't know that number. >> it's about 11,000 or so. do you know what's going to happen to them under this replace bill? have you talked to constituents? particularly in rural areas who are going to be paying more on out of pocket under this plan? >> of course we don't have that data because we just got a look at this bill that's been offered. i have a whole series of proposals that i think we should do but i will say on balance if the american people had to decide between continuing with obamacare the way it is and trying to supplement it so it doesn't go under or going back the way we were i'd be for going back the way we were and then start the process of the reform of the existing health care
system and i think more people are better off that way. >> i want to get you on the record here. so you think the health care system before the affordable care act with no changes, back to that, is superior to the one we have now? >> absolutely i believe that. >> let me ask you this -- >> and left us a foundation where we can start to improve our health care and delivery system. >> let me ask you this. the bet that steve scalise and paul ryan and others in leadership are making is that everyone will roll over. that they're going to basically make you walk the plank on this. they won't listen to anything you say. they won't take changes and mccarthy was clear about that today. they're going to make you vote for this bill whether you like it or not. are you going to vote for it? >> well, i have a lean no today and i owe my constituents and everybody in this country my best everyday and my best judgment and i think that we ought to have an opportunity to bring amendments to this legislation. they've got a ways to go before they can say they're close
enough to have enough votes to, let's just say, make the pitch that it's the only train and it's leaving town. that's what i think we'll soon hear out of the whips team. but we should not be advancing refundable tax credits. in the end you're borrowing money from china and saudi arabia and the american people to put that money out front. we're better off to make everybody's premiums tax deductible. that's one. >> is it important to see what the scoring -- you're talking about the deficit there. deficit spending. is it important to see what the cbo scoring is? >> that is important, yes. but we know that the cbo scoring was way off on obamacare and so we're confident since cbo scoring isn't so great -- >> it wasn't way off. >> -- but we should get a sense of what they think. joining me now, republican congressman leonard lance of new jersey, member of the house energy and commerce committee which advanced the health care
bill this afternoon. congressman, you're a yes on this bill i take it? >> i was a yes in committee today based upon the bill as it exists today and we've just completed a 27-hour marathon committee hearing. >> why are you rushing so fast? >> i don't think we're rushing. it came out of energy and commerce and out of ways and means but now, chris it goes to the budget committee and it these go through the budget committee and then the rules committee and then it's put on the floor and whatever we do goes to the senate. >> how many hearings -- open hearings with witness testimony and the like have you had on this bill? >> we've had a series of hearings over the last several years on the affordable care act -- >> no, in this congress. how many hearings in this congress on this bill? >> we have gone to the american people with paul ryan's better way and we campaigned on the fact that we were going to improve the system and i think that's what we've done. >> i get that but there's legislative language now.
i'm curious, how many hearings has your committee had on this bill? >> we had a 27-hour marathon session and all of the issues were vetted and i was proud of the committee the in our bipartisan capacity. >> the one that went through the night. but how many hearings with witnesses called to offer their expert testimony, whether doctors, people from the insurance industry, other folks, how many hearings has your committee had on this bill? >> we've had a series of hearings over the last several years on the issue and we campaigned, chris, on this matter over the course of the election cycle. >> but in this congress -- i'm sorry, i don't want to belabor this, but it's my understanding in this congress on this legislation there have been zero hearings but for the 27-hour marathon markup that went through the night. is that correct? >> and also the marathon in the ways and means committee and also the fact that we have explained our position and it was completely transparent over the course of the 27 hours and i think -- thought it was an excellent discussion on both the republican and the democratic side. >> congressman. you're talking about a fifth of
the american economy. you're talking about maybe 50 million people losing health insurance and you're saying 27 hours going through the night is sufficient? >> i think we have to move forward. i suspect when it gets to the senate there will be discussion there but i do think the american people, chris, want us to reform obamacare and i am committed to doing that. >> how many people in your district are on the exchanges? >> i would say roughly 5,000 or so, chris? >> my understanding from kaiser family foundation is it's as much as four times that, it's much more like 20,000. have you talked to them about what would happen to them, particularly, say, a 60-year-old who makes $20,000 to $40,000 who could make $7,000 to $9,000 or more out of pocket. >> i've had a series of town hall meetings as i'm sure you're aware. at one town hall meeting we had 1400 people and at a second we had 900 people and so yes i've tried to discuss these matters with constituents in the district. >> yes, and this is genuinely
commendable, we've lauded you on it for this program. many colleagues did not. those town halls happened before the bill legislation was introduced? am i correct? >> certainly we had our principles but yes it was before the bill was introduced. >> so if i were in your district and i were on the exchange making $20,000, 60-year-old old and saw my out-of-pocket cost going up $7,000, i didn't know when you had the town hall, now that the bill exists i do know that, do you see why it might be important to have hearings or exchanges with constituents? >> i have a series of exchanges with constituents and will continue to do so and i hope that we are improving the system because the system needs improve. so many constituents have come into our offices in new jersey indicating that the -- that it's unaffordable for their health care plans and that their deductibles have increased dramatically, their co-pays have
increased dramatically, and i think this is a step in the right direction. >> it seems to me i hear that problem identified by members of congress across the aisle, high deductibles, high co-pies, -- co-pays, that's the main complaint. >> that's one of the complaints. >> is that the benchmark by which the solution should be judged? are you saying to constituents we will bring those costs down? and can you look them in the eyes and promise that will happen? >> i certainly believe that is the goal and i think we have to improve the system that exists now because the system that exists now has been so difficult for those who have been under health care coverage through their employment and their deductibles have increased dramatically, their co-pays have increased dramatically and i think we have to do a better job. i also think, chris, that we should maintain portions of what occurred under obamacare,
pre-existing conditions, for example, young people on their parents' policies until they're 26 and i have argued internally that we should at least to some extent continue the medicaid enhancement. >> i want to ask you about that medicaid enhancement. final question for you. you have hospitals in your district, i would imagine? >> yes, of course. >> okay. what will be the affect on those hospitals and about the folks who are dependent on medicaid when the medicaid expansion is phased out? >> the medicaid expansion is not being phased out. it's this the percentage paid by the federal government will be at the regular medicaid match. >> but they're going to cut off new enrollee which is is going to set it on the guide path to zero. >> states will have the ability to continue with new enrollees so long as the match will be at the regular match, not at the enhanced match. i would prefer the enhanced match but -- >> what is the affect going to be for the hospitals and the poor folks in your district who depend on medicaid? >> i think they will be able to
continue to have medicaid because i believe new jersey will continue the program. new jersey is one of those states, of course, that expanded medicaid and i hope and expect that that will continue to be the case and privately within my caucus i have indicated i think this should be a continuation of medicaid expansion and that was contained in our bill today. >> congressman lance, appreciate it as always, thank you, sir. >> thank you very much. still to come, we learned the president's former national security adviser worked as a foreign agent during the trump campaign -- and i do not mean that metaphorically. i mean he was literally registering -- he registered as a foreign agent. the stunning details on what it means for the ongoing cloud of suspicion around the president ahead. plus, the death of the death spiral talking point. debunking the republicans' favorite fear-mongering over the imminent demise of obamacare in two minutes.
and taxes to support the population that needs to be served? >> so that says to me, what you're saying there is obamacare functionally is dead because financially it's not sustainable? >> it is in a death spiral. >> the ceo of aetna on february 15 saying obamacare was in a death spiral. that was welcome news to republicans who want to kill obamacare and who jumped on the death spiral talking point. >> the ceo of aetna, another large insurance carrier, said that obamacare is in a death spiral. his words. >> the ceo of aetna said it's in a death spiral. those aren't our words, those are his words. >> the head of aetna says we're in a death spiral. >> the ceo of aetna said obamacare is in a death spiral. >> the ceo of aetna said it's in a death spiral. >> obamacare is in a death spiral. it's not getting any better, it's getting worse. that's the ceo of one of america's leading health insurance companies, aetna, said this a couple weeks ago. >> here is what they are not telling you which is the context in which the aetna ceo said that.
aetna had been trying to merge with rival humana and they threatened to pull out of the exchanges if the obama justice department did not approve the merger. don't take my word for it. a federal judge, in blocking that merger, pointed out aetna's actions and its motives. "aetna tried to leverage its participation in the exchanges for favorable treatment from doj regarding the proposed merger. aetna's ceo bertolini's deposition aetna's counsel stated that if aetna was not happy with the results of an upcoming meeting regarding the merger, we're just going to pull out of all of the exchanges." the judge pointed to a smoking-gun letter from aetna's ceo to the justice department antitrust division. quoting the aetna ceo "we believe it is very likely we would need to leave the public exchange business entirely and plan for additional business efficiencies should our deal ultimately be blocked." now, it's also true aetna had been losing money in the new exchanges, but it must have been expecting that to change.
as late as july 19, 2016, the company was still planning to expand its footprint to as many as 20 states. but, after the justice department sued aetna to block the merger with humana, aetna announced it would cut its participation in the exchanges from 15 states to four. and that's when its ceo subsequently unleashed the death spiral remark. joining me now, congresswoman karen bass of california. congresswoman, your colleagues across the aisle have been making a lot of the death spiral. they quoted the aetna ceo particularly. they kept saying obamacare is collapsing. what is your response to that? >> especially coming from the state of california which is one of the reasons why obamacare is successful nationwide, i think that's the fear-mongering to justify what they're getting ready to do, which is to potentially cut 15 million people off of health care coverage.
i don't believe there's a death spiral. i don't believe it's getting ready to collapse. that's certainly not the case in california. >> you're a congress person. and you're going to have to vote on this at some point. do you have insurance company lobbyists for instance coming to you saying this isn't a death spiral, it's exploding, you need to bail us out your need to do something? >> no, i don't. the insurance companies have not been lobbying us. this has been a big win for the insurance companies. requiring everybody to have insurance coverage? you know, it's definitely been a big win. in california we attempted to pass a couple of ballot measures that would give our insurance commissioner more control over keeping premiums lower? but insurance companies put in tens of millions of dollars and defeated those initiatives. so problems people say are because of obamacare, they're not necessarily because of the affordable care act, it's because there's not enough control on the insurance
companies themselves. >> how long have you been in congress, congresswoman? >> i'm in my seventh year now and i have voted over 60 times against the repeal. >> so let me ask you this. your seventh year now. have you ever seen a piece of legislation of this magnitude being moved this quickly in your congressional career. >> no, and isn't this the same thing the rains accused the democrats of doing a year before i got here? we are voting on this bill and it hasn't even been scored by the cbo. we're expecting the cbo score in the next couple of days but right now we believe the cbo is going to show that about 15 million people will lose their coverage. >> do you think there is any way to stop this in the house? i mean, it's sort of remarkable to watch leadership go to work and i've spoken to some of your republican colleagues, obviously, to basically ram this through. what are your options in the minority there?
>> well, hopefully there will be enough republicans that refuse to vote for it. there weren't enough in committees, but listening to my colleagues in those committees i heard the speaker himself personally had to come to the committee and twist some arms so i don't know if they have the capacity to twist as many arms as needed to pass it off the floor but we'll see. >> one of the arguments your colleagues are making across the aisle, republican, paul ryan called this an act of mercy. his argument is the whole thing is floundering, it's imploding what we're doing will be best for people and we're doing this to look out for the least of these, in biblical terms. >> yeah, and it's absolutely not the case because it's going to be the least of these who lose coverage, especially people who come from expensive states like california or like los angeles or san francisco. so older people, low income who live in high-income areas are going to be the losers and much
respect for the speaker but this is the person who wants to, in my opinion, take medicare and turn it into vouchers. this is going to be an extremely deep cut to medicare so the consequences are going to be severe. it will remind me back to the days when i worked in the emergency room in los angeles county when people would come into the emergency room extremely ill. that, ironically, of course, is what cost so much money when people come in ill. >> congresswoman karen bass, thank you. >> thanks for having me. still to come, former national security adviser michael flynn admits to acting as a foreign agent while working with then-candidate trump during the presidential campaign. those details ahead.
the trump administration's revised travel ban is facing mounting opposition. today several states joined hawaii's lawsuit against the new executive order and the state of washington maintaining that the court injunction on the first travel ban should apply to this one as well. meanwhile, the other executive order the administration issued on immigration, one which expanded the categories eligible for deportation continues to be implemented across the country day by day. and this is what it looks like on the ground. >> immigration authorities arrested a 22-year-old dreamer after she participated in a pro-immigrant news conference in jackson, the mississippi. daniel vargas, brought to the u.s. illegally as a child, asked president trump to protect her from deportation because her deferral expired. >> a veteran faces the fight of his life. miguel perez, jr., was born in mexico but grew up in chicago. he served two tours in afghanistan.
now perez faces a deportation hearing because of a non-violent drug offense. >> romulo gonzalez has lived in the u.s. for more than 25 years. i.c.e. agents took him as he was dropping off his 12 and 13-year-old daughters at school. >> people will tell you that people being handcuffed and carted off broke the law and this is part of the president's way of making good on his promise of law and order. >> when i take the oath of office next year i will restore law and order to our country. in this race for the white house i am the law and order candidate. [ cheers and applause ] >> over the past year and a half, i've been working on a book about law and order called the colony and a nation. what i come to realize what i argue in the book about law and order as defined by richard nixon through donald trump isn't
about law, it's about order. because if it were about law, well, then how can you explain a president who admitted to and boasted about repeated sexual assault and was accused by multiple women of the same? a president whose company, according to recent reporting in the "new yorker," very well could have violated the foreign corrupt practices act, a president whose own attorney general stands accused of perjury by a u.s. senator for deceiving a senate committee under oath. heck, if you want to be literal about breaking immigration law, there's decent evidence that the first lady of the united states herself was paid for work while in the u.s. on a tourist visa which is, you guessed it, against the law. so don't be confused. it's not about law. what it's about is order and promising his most ardent supporters their place in that order. if that means deporting veterans and snatching fathers on their way to drop off their kids, well, then so be it. ♪
former national security adviser michael flynn has admitted that while working as a top campaign adviser to the trump campaign, he was working as a foreign agent. the associated press reported just this week flynn filed paperwork with the justice department to retroactively register as a foreign agent for $530,000 worth of lobbying work that "could be construed to have principally benefited the republic of turkey." you see, flynn used to have a company called flynn intel group, registered with congress as a lobbying organization and from august through november of
last year -- meaning during the campaign and even after the election -- flynn's consulting firm was hired by a turkish businessman with ties to turkey's president erdogan and, according to the paperwork flynn filed with the justice department, part of his lobbying contract including pressuring u.s. officials to take action against a political opponent of erdogan, fethullah gullen. on election day, the hill published an op-ed written by flynn calling on the united states to extradite gulen writing "we should not provide him with a safe haven." flynn's final payment of $145,000 came on november 14, 2016, six days after the election. mind you, all of this was happening while flynn was working as a topped a visor for donald trump and while that campaign was accusing hillary clinton of engaging in pay for play with foreign governments. >> one of the main things that hillary clinton was hiding she
was hiding her pay for play scandal as secretary of state. hillary is the one who engaged in a corrupt pay for play scheme at the state department. we've just learned she tried to get $12 million from the king of morocco for an appearance, one appearance, more pay for play. >> joining me now, charlie pierce, writer at large for "esquire." i have to say, honestly, honestly. it's stunning. the guy was -- he was working as a foreign agent without anyone knowing apparently -- sean spicer today saying the campaign didn't know it. >> well, i don't believe that the president of the united states didn't know. for a long time it was just him and michael flynn on the campaign trail. at the beginning, very similar to what's going won the cabinet
now, he couldn't get people to work for him. he was running that campaign on a skeleton crew. jeff sessions came aboard early and michael flynn was there from -- michael flynn was present at the creation. he's surrounded by a bunch of people who seem very comfortable working in the universe of kleptocracies so i'm sure he just found -- you know, he found a way to get paid and he took it. >> the question i have here -- there's two avenues. one is it shows the importance of legislation that requires disclosure, we know this confirmed because of the foreign agent registration act. we don't know the president's tax records, we don't know his foreign business interests. all of the same things that may apply, lord knows what is out there. this happened you should everyone's noses. there was some reporting, chuck ross at the daily caller and mike ross at yahoo! we don't have these for the president of the united states.
>> we don't and at this point would you be surprised if michael flynn announced today he was a registered agent for one of the moons of neptune? we don't know a lot about a lot of people in this administration and as i think you mentioned at the top of the show, we're just now finding out the people they are hiring under the radar maybe wilder than michael flynn was. >> that's exactly right and we also have the problem of, you know, this is him coming -- first of all, by the way, the timing on the hill op-ed is amazing. it's election day in america. this guy is the most prominent national security adviser, everyone's heading to the polls, what's going to happen to america and he's publishing an op-ed being like we should extradite the dissident opponent of the guy paying my paycheck to lobby for because i think he did it on that day because he thought trump was going to lose and he was at peak influence on election day. >> either that or he thinks there are a lot of erdogan fans
in michigan, ohio and wisconsin because there clearly aren't any in pennsylvania because that's where this guy is, right? so i think he was pitching for the erdogan vote in milwaukee. >> and you have to fact that we don't know about the allegations of collusion with russia, whether they happened or not. this is another revelation of contact, collusion with a foreign government in this case documented in front of our faces that we did not know about before. >> right. i mean, obviously the ethics of dealing with foreign governments within the trump campaign were not the conventional form of ethics of dealing with a foreign government. pretty much it seems like it was get it while you can from whomever you can. >> charlie pierce, thanks for joining us. >> thanks, chris. chris, good luck with the book. >> thank you. still to come, if you liked having michael flynn in the white house, you're going to
thing 1 tonight, all week press secretary sean spicer has been forced to defend the gop health care bill before the white house press corps and yesterday he found himself making this promise. >> this was a full effort to reach out to members in the house and the senate. it's going through regular order in the house. every member of the house and the senate will be able to have their opportunity to have amendments offered -- well through the committee process then on the floor. >> taking heed over the republican health care bill, spicer says everyone gets to offer amendments, which sounds pretty good, right? democrats thought so. >> the white house indicated today we would have an open rule on the aca repeal bill. mr. spicer said "every member of the house and senate will be able to have their opportunity to have amendments offered well through the committee process and on the fear."
we are very excited to hear this news because he said every member so that translates to an open rule. >> but not everyone on capitol hill was very excited by sean spicer's comments. actually, the chairman of the house rules committee, pete sessions, was absolutely not very excited. that's thing 2 in 60 seconds.
how did pete session react to the claim that every member of congress respond to the health care bill? watch for yourself. >> under your definition of "every member" would democrats be included in that? >> i'm sorry, my definition? >> in the rules committee? i mean -- >> let me ask you this, are we in preference to what the press secretary said? >> yeah, the press secretary said that -- >> well, that is an entirely different article of the constitution. >> would you be saying that the press secretary was wrong in making the declaration that we would essentially have an open rule?
>> you know what? i will just point blank say that i would encourage mr. spicer if he thinks he's going to start talking about my business give me a darn call. >> i'll pass that on. [ laughter ] >> i try not to get in his business and i don't appreciate him getting in my business. >> okay. but that's not all. congressman sessions couldn't resist adding one more little comment about the new press secretary. >> i've known sean and his parents, i think he's from rhode island. fine young man.
>> last may, a guy named curtis ellis was a guest on steve bannon's radio show. he wrote a column titled "the radical left's ethnic cleansing of america" for a fringe web site world net daily which popularized the theory that barack obama wasn't born in the u.s. fast forward a few months and curtis ellis is now an employee of the united states government serving as special assistant to the secretary of labor in the trump administration. that's according to a new report from pro-publica which obtained a list of more than 400 new political appointees to the federal government. we'll tell you about some of the other new appointees, including a survivalist at the treasury department next. why are you deleting these photos?
>> who do you envision? >> i thought 14-year-old boys that want to go plink out in the backyard would snatch this thing up. preppers would snatch it up because of the other thing we added to it. >> that's john purdue, a self-described guerrilla warfare expert, author of "the war of all the people, the nexus of latin american radicalism and middle eastern terrorism" and inventor of the pack bow featured on cnbc's make me a millionaire inventor. it's a bow and arrow that doubles as a compass, tent pole, walking fish, spear fishing rig and water purification tablet receptacle. according to a list of trump administration liars, purdue now works for the treasury department. there's also danny tiso. his linked in page says he graduated from high school in 2015. local new hampshire paper reported he made honor role in 2010 when he was in sixth grade.
i'm joined by justin elliot investigative reporter for pro-publy a and seem seder, host of majority report. this is a great list. normally you would haven't to go through a lot of effort to find this out. normally administrations tell you who they're hiring. >> right. the other thing that's different is trump is not nominating people for roles that require senate confirmation. he said the other day that he thinks a lot of these jobs like deputy secretary of x don't need to be hired and these people on the so-called beachhead teams in different federal agencies are the only representatives of the white house in these agencies so that's what this list represents. >> so you've got these folks like john purdue who wrote this pretty kooky book, i read it, the nexus between jihadis and latin american radicals. this guy is basically there in treasury we think as the white house's, like, eyes and ears. >> right.
we're not sure what many of these people are doing. some of them seem to be like 23-year-old trump campaign staffers who ran the campaign in kentucky. some are real washington people. >> lobbyists. >> we found around 36, at least 36 registered -- former registered lobbyists. this is not a swamp-draining group of people. >> 36 lobbyists working in the agencies, including a guy from a luge defense contractor on the tech side now at the department of defense. >> that's right. there's a guy named jeff burr, the head of government relations through the construction industry trade association is who is now at the department of labor and trump during the campaign -- this doesn't get brought up -- but he told several interviewers he would haven't a problem banning lobbyists from his administration so there are many lobbyists, a lot of campaign people, former hill staffers and some of these fringe types. >> sam, i want to talk to you about a guy who's not in the agency named sebastian gorko.
we played a clip of him at the top of the show. he's friends with frank gaffney, a notorious anti-muslim bigot. what should we know about sebastian gorka? >> dr. g., as he refers to himself. he -- i mean, he is the guy who was a breitbart writer, i think had donald trump not won the election he would be lobbying to get on world net daily television or internet television which is, you know, just gives you -- it's not a criticism of world net daily television, just an indication of where he slots in in terms of his idea set. he is both a self-proclaimed counterterrorism expert and an anti-sjw alpha male. he's like a real breitbart dude. he's been criticized by actual terrorism experts.
>> he's called one of them and berated them because he was getting attacked on twitter. >> yes, and that audio leaked? >> he is very high up in the white house. >> he's very high up in the white house. we should also say to be fair to him he carries around a medal that his father received for his ain't -- well, it depends on -- the history, frankly, it's a medal that is widely associated with anti-semitism from hungary. he argues that he can't possibly be a neonazi because he's not a communist. he's done that on hannity's show. he's an odd figure but he's highly placed in the administration. you can look at some of the things he's said on television and donald trump repeats those phrases. >> he is a trump whisperer. the point with gorka and this guy on the honor role in sixth grade, there is an entire sort of level of the professional government that isn't in there right now, right?
>> right. >> the key point here is these people we're talking about are there, the whole level of, like, well, i served in previous administrations, i know what i'm doing, i can be confirmed by a senate to be a deputy, that doesn't exist in the government right now. >> as we've seen with these cabinet nominations, off public debate, you have scrutiny by congress, you get to have a decision what about is the policy of the administration on x. the concern of some people is that by installing these beachhead teams who wouldn't even tell us their names, we had to file foia requests, these are people that have not been exposed to the scrutiny of the senate. it's hard for journalists to report on themes. in many cases we don't know what they're doing. >> we only learned about them because of you guys putting them on the public database which you can find at pro-publica. justin elliot, sam seder, thank you both. that's "all in," the rachel maddow show starts right now. good evening, rachel. >> good evening, chris. thanks, my friend. >> you bet. thanks at home for joining us.
we have a big show tonight. i want to tell you in terms of the way the show is going to go. we've only got one guest booked for this evening, we feel very lucky to have him. he's the longest-standing senior member of the u.s. foreign service. >> he served under president obama and president george w. bush before that and under president clinton before that and under president george h.w. bush before that and under reagan before that and under carter before that. he has been there a long time. he is a pillar of the u.s. state department, he's part of its institutional memory. he has been in the room for basically every important negotiation, every standoff, every big development, particularly between the united states and russia for decades. we've got him here tonight because he's out now. he's gone. the trump folks chose not to keep him on.