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tv   MSNBC Live  MSNBC  April 1, 2017 1:00pm-2:01pm PDT

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and that unlimited 2% cash back from spark means thousands of dollars each year going back into my business... which adds fuel to my bottom line. what's in your wallet? very good saturday to you. i'm richard lui in new york. thanks for joining us. the russia investigation heats up. vladimir putin has denied any involvement in election meddling. the senate has rejected mike flynn's offer to testify in exchange for immunity. and now the white house is doing damage control. the president going on a twitter rant this morning accusing, quote/unquote, fake news of pushing the phony russia story. not wanting to talk about what he calls the obama surveillance scandal. while senator lindsey graham back home in south carolina talking russia and health care on this saturday. thanks for being with us.
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we're going to start the hour looking ahead to monday. that's when the russian investigation ramps up in the senate. the white house trying to change the subject. next week the senate intelligence committee could start privately interviewing up to 20 key individuals in their russia probe. different from what's happening correct me if i am wrong t across the way in the house. the committee chairs say they may schedule more including public hearings. friday the senate rejected former national security advisor mike flynn's offer to testify in exchange for immunity. two congressional sources telling nbc news that piece of information. meanwhile, the president played misdirection today, if you will. he called the russian investigation phony, attacking the media again. vice president mike pence ignored the russia story when he was on the road in ohio. he was back on the issue of the economy, speaking to business leaders in ohio. all that on the heels of rofepos
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that three white house officials helped house intelligence committee chairman devin nunes to view classified intelligence documents related to incidental surveillance of trump associates without giving the information to anyone else. nunes responded to that report. take a listen. >> yeah, you understand we're not going to get into sources and methods. i mean, if not who's ever going to come to our committee? but i can tell you those reports are mostly wrong. >> and the top democrat on the committee, adam schiff, finally saw the same documents friday. he says there was no reason though for nunes to receive the information instead of the entire committee. adding to the political intrigue no doubt. nbc's kelly o'donnell is at the white house following those developments. kelly. >> reporter: good afternoon, richard. while we've seen vice president mike pence out on the road today talking about jobs and health care and ideas, the trump administration wants to push, it was the president today who used his twitter feed to again bring up the subject of russia. a subject that he says is fake
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news and he is clearly upset about the investigations that relate to russian connections and possible ties to associates of donald trump. he says that the real story should be surveillance that may have been snared members of his own team. no evidence of that yet but the president using the power of his twitter feed and 27 million followers to try to steer the conversation in another direction. of course there are real investigations happening about the russian connections, from the fbi and the committees on capitol hill. and this coming week there will be some behind closed doors interviews done by the senate intelligence committee. they've identified 20 individuals they want to meet with, talk to, try to get information to help them piece together their investigation. very early stages here. we've also seen that former national security advisor michael flynn has floated the idea of immunity. so far no takers. but aides to those committees and those involved in the process say it's just too early
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to be talking about immunity. but that subject may come up again down the line. richard. >> kelly, thank you so much for that. nbc's kelly o'donnell at the white house. joining me now is nbc senior political editor beth. we heard what's happening from kelly really two things that the white house does not want to hear necessarily, any sort of piece of information that may make this story any deeper or longer than it already looks -- that it appears to be. what do you make of what's coming up in this week for the senate intelligence committee? >> yeah, the senate committee seems to be the place where things are actually moving along pretty well. and we know basically because we were told by senators warner and burr last week that they would be giving interviews. these will not be on tv. they'll be private interviews with people they think might have some connection to this story. we know that several people in trump's white house have said they would voluntarily submit to an interview including paul manafort, william page, and two
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senators told us last week they will speak to jared kushner, the president's son-in-law who we learned had some connection and set up meetings with the russian ambassador and with the head of a russian bank during the transition. now, all three of those people have said they will go ahead and testify. so the senate folks are going to decide whether to do that. it seems a much more sort of steady, reasoned, not, you know, exciting stage in the investigation compared to the house side where everything just appears to be, you know, melting down and falling apart because of the personalities, because devin nunes has become so red hot and because there's real incredible distrust between the two chairs of that committee, adam schiff and now devin nunes because of what went down with nunes going down to the white house without informing his colleague and all of the events that took place then. >> we're on the outside wondering what's going to be said in these private meetings and these questions, some very key individuals you brought up there. will we ever understand what is being spoken about during these
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particular discussions that are in private? >> well, who knows. i mean, we've had a number of investigations going on. >> yeah. >> we've got the senate, the house -- >> the senate specifically. >> well, they seem to be adapting the rule of we will tell you what we need to tell you, but we want to tell you as much as we can. that's what they committed to doing in that press conference last week where they really sort of struck this tone of don't worry, folks, we've got it under control here. we're going through the steps we need to to get to the bottom of this. they insisted it was bipartisan. they insisted they were taking it very seriously. they committed seven staff members to this investigation, which is quite a number. and they were going to see it through to its logical conclusion. now, look, it is the intelligence committee. they doept have a whole lot of open meetings anyway. so we can't expect everything they're doing or even maybe a portion is going to be out in the open. but they did commit to keeping voters aware of what they're finding out. >> always great reporting, beth. thank you so much. beth fouhy with us, senior political editor here to msnbc. joining us now is congressman
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dan kildee, democrat, member of the committee. with nunes in a quagmire it appears, house investigation on russia, seems to be a nonstarter at least by what we see in terms of day by day headlines that we're reporting on here. some have shifted their faith now to the other side, to the senate's investigation. have you? >> well, certainly their investigation is far more legitimate. the odd behavior of chairman nunes is something that has really disqualified him. and unfortunately taken the house intelligence committee really out of the conversation, out of the legitimate conversation about what needs to be investigated. it's my view though we should take this out of congress itself and have an independent bipartisan commission not unlike the 9/11 commission that has subpoena authority, that can call witnesses, that can subpoena documents and that can
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produce a complete and thorough report on what took place with the russians, what their participation was in the election, whether or not there was any connection to the trump campaign and give congress and the american people and the administration for that matter a complete report so that we can take steps accordingly. and take this out of the washington political environment and let congress and the executive branch get back to doing the things we're already focusing on. >> representative, you have a lot of folks on your side in terms of that approach you just described, somebody on the other side if you will, conservative talk show host and msnbc contribut contributor hugh hewitt, you know saying adam schipotentiall overfocusing on the process and not the issue at hand, russia, as you just said, would you say that about your fellow democrat?
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>> well, i mean, process is very important here particularly when there have been longstanding procedures and understandings the house intelligence committee would function in a nonpartisan way. that process has been broken. so i appreciate what congressman schiff is attempting to do. that's to get the committee back to operating the way it ought to. they broke the process and that is what i think has made mr. nunes a less legitimate player in all of this. i still believe that taking it out of congress and taking it to a bipartisan external commission is the better path. >> agree or disagree on this, the reported request of nsa director mike flynn asking for immunity when we talk about the senate investigation ongoing. agree or disagree with that that he was denied? >> well, at this point it makes no sense for them to prejudge who they might grant immunity to in return for, you know, for
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testimony. it is a little ironic to hear mr. flynn seek immunity when he characterized immunity as something generally is an indication that somebody might be guilty. i don't believe that, but that's certainly his position. so it's a little ironic he would be seeking immunity. is that some admission of guilt? i don't know. but i think it's far too early for the senate or anyone else to be granting immunity until they have a better sense of the full scope of what's taking place. >> yeah. >> one would assume immunity is only granted if he's willing to testify or provide information about others against him. >> interesting to say that, chris matthews was saying what goes around comes around because he had said that and now he's in that very situation. as we look forward to potentially the next opportunity for members like you in congress to move forward on some piece of legislation by republicans here, acha obviously dead at the moment, there's a tax infrastructure plan that could come out in the few weeks,
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you're watching for that. if the white house, if speaker paul ryan reaches out across the aisle on a compromise bill or compromise elements of the bill, are you initially open to working with them so that something does get passed? because they're having difficulties with certain s subsegments of their caucus. >> well, they first have to come to some conclusions about what they believe. and then they can engage with us on improvements to the health care system in this country. there's no question that even among democrats we acknowledge that there will be a need for fixes in the affordable care act. if they're willing to engage us on that, we're all ears. and we have ideas of our own that we would like to offer. but they've got to take it -- they've got to not operate as i unfortunately heard speaker ryan mention the other day, on the assumption that they should not work with democrats. i was really surprised to see the speaker's comment when president trump indicated that he may have to work with
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democrats that the president ought not do that. the american people are sick of this. they want us to solve problems. they want democrats and republicans even though we have differences to try to work those differences out and that's not going to happen if the republicans keep going off into their corner and come up with another plan and never really consult with us, never work with us. we're not going to find a solution if that's the approach they take. we're open to it. we're ready, willing and able to offer our ideas. >> maybe not paul ryan, but other members of congress in terms of a compromise bill should be on getting michigan into the final four. that would probably be a better one. go blue. thank you so much, congressman dan kildee. >> go blue. that's right. >> i had to work that in. since it is the weekend. appreciate it, my friend. staying on the russia investigation, the questions around that, former advisor to -- joins us right now. thanks for being with us. i always appreciate speaking
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with you, molley. there are several silos to be looking at as far as what's happening on the hill and the questions in front of us. there is how is russia involved in affecting how this government operates? it's effect on the election itself, any connection with the trump administration with potentially what was happening in that influence over the election. those three silos you understand not only technical but also the political here, molly. what are you watching? >> well, i think it was a really interesting week in terms of developments. i think there was a lot of sort of breaking news stories. i think the information coming out of the senate hearings were also very helpful to hear. but i think what you're starting to see is that there is this pattern that we can't deny. and i think we get caught up in the who did what in washington side. and it's important for us to understand what this means for russia. and this is part of a pattern of operations -- of tactics and
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operations they've used across europe and other places to build influence, to sort of build how they operate information in other ways, and it's something we need to pay attention to. i think it's really important you look at the freaking out over the russia nerds of what's going on and you really heard that in some of the senate hearings. and it's because there is this new method of subversion that the kremlin seems to have perfected, which is essentially tantamount to the hacking of people. where you have all these discussions about hacking and leaks and disinformation and it's not really the point. it's that there is a sophisticated information architecture that the kremlin has built to use in the united states and in other countries. and in order to use that, you need really good data and really good targeting of information. and they clearly were using that in the u.s. before the election in some connection to the trump campaign knowingly or not and that is really important for us to look at and to understand because it is -- since 2012 there's been evidence that the
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kremlin has been using this. they sort of started trying to use this voter turnout effort in georgia in 2012. they've gotten much better at it and they're using it in the united states and it is still there and they're still using it. >> you are versed on the very technical level of what this sort of espionage might be, the counterintelligence we're going through right now. you're sitting now on the committee with members nunes and schiff, what's the question you want answered specific that will help us move forward in these questions that we have? >> i think the real question is what kind of communication was there between russian officials and members of the trump campaign during and after the campaign? i think part of it is going to be information. part of it is going to be money. part of it is going to be data. but there's clearly a web of relationships and ties that has not been well sort of deconstructed yet or understood.
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but understanding how this was used and knowingly used before the election to target american voters is very important. >> what do you make of nsa director mike flynn and the decision that was made at least initially? because this could always change over time, everything does. but initially that he was not granted in this case the ability to testify with immunity? >> i think it's very hard at this stage in the investigation to give any of the sort of big names that people are focusing on immunity not knowing what there is or what any of it means. if flynn has good lawyers and actually has a case to make that he saw things that he shouldn't have seen but was not willingly a participant, he'll be able to communicate that to the committee. i think he has a big challenge about all the money he's taken and lack of filing as a foreign agent in violation of the rules in the past few months. and that is very difficult for him at this point because the credibility of the source of the information is something that will be accounted for.
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that being said, i'm sure that he does have information that people are very interested in. >> yes. >> in terms of what happened before and during the election. >> the question is for what, what is the trade, right? >> exactly. >> if you were to give immunity. i want to go back with something you intimated and that is this question of the way russia is being used as an idea and that russian ambassador for instance dmitri paskov saying there's no evidence implicating russia in last year's election and that it is a slander to suggest otherwise. but there's also the extreme which we've heard from other russia experts saying we have to be careful in the way that we do discuss russia as an sbi specifically as being this fall guy in the discussion moving forward. but we do have at least reports that are counternarrative to what the russian ambassador is saying. >> right. you had high level denies from putin and paskov. we had nothing to do with it.
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when the kremlin denies something, the higher the level they deny it, the more likely it is to be true. the fact you had putin dedicate three minutes of a speech saying this is absolutely absurd means they're really nervous about this. i think there are points made in the hearings this week you don't want to make russia this ten-foot tall giant in the room. that's absolutely right. but we also need to understand how they are operating. and clint watts really focused well on this in the hearing how it is they're operating with less money, with less resources, with less technology and still doing better than we are in terms of intelligence and using these tools and tactics against us. that's really important to understand. they don't operate with the rules that we do. they don't operate in the same parameters and constraints we do. they will use hackers, they will use criminals, they will use criminal means to get information and use it, and tactics as well. that puts us at a disadvantage. we really need to think about how we are looking at this, how we evaluate it, how we are willing to accept the truth of what they are doing.
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and then what we can do to counter it. and we're still really at stage, you know, 0.5, maybe, in figuring out -- >> i was so hoping you weren't going to say that. but i knew you were going to get it in the timeline for me. >> sorry. >> always a pleasure. your deep thoughtful perspective. very good stuff. thank you so much, molly. >> thank you. >> now, as the russian probe does continue at 0.5, if that's the stage we're at, the man in charge of the investigation, devin nunes, is playing defense amidst concerns over information that he may have shared with the president. more on that. managing blood sugar is not a marathon it's a series of smart choices. like using glucerna to replace one meal or snack a day. glucerna products have up to 15 grams of protein to help manage hunger and carbsteady, unique blends of slow release carbs to help minimize blood sugar spikes. every meal every craving. it's the choices you make when managing blood sugar that are the real victories. glucerna. everyday progress.
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they're saying he's just too close to give a fair investigation when that investigation might involve the white house. do you understand those criticisms? >> yeah, i mean, i do. but it always goes back to then who else is going to do it?
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because there's only so many -- at the end of the day someone has to do it. i'm sure that all the republicans in congress voted for president trump. all the democrats voted for hillary clinton. that's just how it is. but at the end of the day, we're accountable to our voters. and like i said, this whole issue that we briefed the president -- that i briefed the president had nothing to do with russia. >> all right. house intelligence committee chairman devin nunes on the calls for him to step down as head of the russia investigation in the house. joining me deputy managing editor at the weekly standard, john, senior editor for buzz feed news. great to have you both. kelly, if it isn't nunes, who should it be then? let's try to answer that question. >> that's a good question and it's a bit of a tough one to answer. of course nunes is part of the so-called gang of eight, which is the eight people in congress that have access to the highest levels of intelligence. and those people are the leaders of both parties in the senate,
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the house and the leaders of both parties of the house and senate intelligence committee. so nunes is one of those people. and the question is if he knows that his committee is doing an investigation, why would he not share the information he received with the rest of the committee, especially the ranking member of the committee? and make it look like he is doing his job rather than making it look like he is trying to brief the white house before he is told his committee. i mean, the optics. this is washington, d.c. and to ignore the optics and not to do things totally by the book, it just seems to me it is a bit of a bad judgment from nunes. >> yeah. and so far we look at this, josh, building on what kelly jane is saying here on this, is that there is protocol and there is that which is legal and illegal. and so far the republicans are saying this is not protocol necessarily, but this is not illegal. and so as we look at then the
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non-protocol following process he's undertaking, has he lost the confidence of the white house? has he lost the confidence of the speaker? josh? >> i don't think he's lost the confidence of the white house or the speaker, no. but i think he's lost certainly the confidence of democrats, i think a lot of republicans in the house and the senate. and, you know, fair amount of the public frankly. look at this process and say this is not how this should be going, right? they think at a minimum if you look at the senate, the senate's been able to sort of conduct this investigation and look at this. no one is saying richard burr shouldn't be in charge of an investigation of the white house on these issues. so, you know, that makes it even more sort of troubling frankly for him because nunes in comparison to burr looks like the best he's sort of bumbled this a little bit and that's going to really undermine anyone's confidence in him. in the white house i think it helps them a bit and speaker seems to have full support of him right now. i don't think he's going anywhere. >> john, i did not mean josh, i
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meant john. even though i did call you josh. i get called lui all the time but it's lui. kelly, on that note that john's bringing up here, when we look at the senate and i asked again representative kildee did he lose confidence in his own -- in the house's investigation, and is he now looking at the senate for what might be the true closest to an independent investigation into those big questions about the russia connection question. are we there? is that basically where it's going to end up, kelly? >> well, i think it's very telling that we've heard about of course general flynn asking for immunity. and we heard first that the senate intelligence committee made their decision that right now they are not going to offer to him. i find that telling we are hearing from the senate intelligence committee before the house. and you know, you're right, let's face it. nobody has any complaints about the way senators burr and warner, the ranking member, they
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seem to be working together just fine as it should be. they are serious guys, a republican, a democrat working together trying to find out the truth. and i think that nunes by sort of fumbling this as john said, he really has hurt himself. he could come back from it, and i think making -- inviting representative schiff to the white house to see that same information helps, but we are talking now about how he got that information and what he did with it rather than the information itself. and that is not what he should be wanting us and the american people to be talking about. >> also, which is atypical here, we have a president saying, yes, nsa director mike flynn should get immunity, should ask for immunity here. the question to you on this, john, is what do you make of that? that the president of the united states is actually getting his fingers into this. >> you know, if this happened last year when president obama was around, i'd be really,
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really shocked frankly. but at this point the president getting involved in this doesn't surprise me at all. you know, whether or not he felt like he was giving advice or sort of giving him an atta boy or decided he wanted to comment on it, it's very, very odd. it seems in the past this would be viewed as very inappropriate for the white house to be sort of weighing in on these kind of issues. people would have said way out of bounds. but with president trump there's not much that's out of bounds. there's nothing that you can't expect him to do frankly. so this kind of shifting sort of how we see this. which again goes back to the problems i think nunes is going to have. short of nunes coming up with, you know, some smoking gun that shows the white house was doing something nefarious, i think most of the people that don't have confidence in him are never going to have confidence in him at that point. they're just going to say he was potentially covering it up or think he wasn't working hard enough or something or because he bumbled it. so i think this whole thing it's just a mess. >> john stanton, kelly jane
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torrance, thanks for making some sense of the mess this saturday. and we'll talk to you soon. >> thanks, richard. north carolina's controversial bathroom bill called hb2, no more the law, this after lawmakers repealed it on thursday. but why now many are saying the replacement bill is falling short. will your business be ready when growth presents itself? american express open cards can help you take on a new job, or fill a big order
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it is an effort that could cost north carolina almost $4 billion over 12 years. its bathroom law hb2 blocked transgender people from using public bathrooms corresponding to the gender that they identify with. well, thursday it was repealed. and then it was replaced. now, the replaced law eliminates the requirement that people must use the bathroom that is reflected on their birth certificate. but it leaves bathroom regulations to the state now. and it prevents local governments from passing any nondiscrimination laws for the next three years. lgbtq advocates and the state's
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democratic governor roy cooper admit that the law, the new one, does not go far enough though. >> transgender people had to go to the restroom of their birth certificate, that is gone. i certainly would have supported and would have wanted a clean repeal of house bill 2. it was clear that couldn't happen. this is the best deal that we could get. >> joining me now is former north carolina state representative chris scroe. also executive director of equality north carolina. thank you for being with us today, chris. was it the best deal that you could get? >> no, absolutely not. what we needed was repeal of hb2. the vast majority of north carolinans wanted it repealed and pulled. instead we ended up on something that doubled down on discrimination. >> how does it double down on discrimination? >> well, it keeps north carolina the only state in the country obsessed with regulating where
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transgender people use the restroom. and it says that cities and towns can't for four years prevent discrimination against gay, lesbian, bisexual and especially transgender people. if the debate we've had over the last year proves nothing else, it's that people need those protections right now. so to say to charlotte or greensboro, raleigh or any city, you can't protect your most vulnerable people, is not antidiscrimination. it's pro discrimination. >> it has to be state entities and that level of government that can do that, correct? >> that's right. and we all know as governor cooper has said that that's not going to happen. >> what do you expect to happen next? >> well, you know, we are going to continue to push for the actual full repeal of hb2. i really hope that governor cooper will realize the incredible mistake that he made by pushing through something that simply doubled down on discrimination. i hope legislative democrats who made that mistake realize it as
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well. i think people thought this was going to solve the business problem that the state is facing. as you said we could lose up to $12 billion over four years. the people who think this is a solution are forgetting that the reason we're suffering this economic harm in the first place is because hb2 was about discrimination. >> i'm sorry, go ahead. >> its replacement is still about discrimination so won't solve the economic harm. >> have you been able to speak with the business community there in north carolina to get their temperature? i know this is just happening over this weekend, but have they reacted at all in the way they're deciphering what has happened? >> we have seen businesses like dow and levi strauss already come out and say this doesn't get the job done. i understand that new york city has said that they are not going to be able to let their nonessential travel ban go. and we are waiting whether the ncaa will say they can bring games back to north carolina.
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i don't think that that's what's going to happen given the fact that the ncaa left in the first place because cities and towns couldn't protect lgbt people from discrimination. >> chris sgrog, thank you. >> thank you. next, getting trump to disclose more details about his perm finances. hbreather. just put on a breathe right strip. it instantly opens your nose up to 38% more than cold medicine alone. shut your mouth and say goodnight mouthbreathers. breathe right. c'mohappy birthday! i survived a heart attack. i'm doing all i can to keep from having another one. and i'm taking brilinta. for people who've been hospitalized for a heart attack. i take brilinta with a baby aspirin. no more than one hundred milligrams as it affects how well it works. brilinta helps keep my platelets from sticking together and forming a clot. brilinta reduced the chance of another heart attack. or dying from one.
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if the audit is not the reason -- >> i didn't say -- right, but you also remember that taxes aren't due until the 15th of april. >> so can we expect them? >> i don't know. i haven't gotten into -- i'm worried about getting my own done. >> tax day, yeah, it's a couple weeks away from today. but the president's tax information could be concern for congress, not just the irs. an op-ed by former white house ethics lawyer in the "los angeles times" suggests this, quote, congress should use its
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subpoena powers to get the president's tax returns and to demand other relevant information from the trump organization. this cannot wait. end quote. richard painter, chief white house ethics lawyer under george w. bush joins us right now. richard, always a pleasure to talk with you. what is your sense at the moment that might happen at any point? >> well, we have a very urgent situation with respect to the russian espionage that occurred in this country last year during our election. and the hostile acts of russia that is also sought to disrupt elections in other western democrats. and now including france. this is a national security issue, and we need to find out what the business relationships are of any of our senior officials in our government and russia. and this requires going beyond the financial disclosure forms that are public and looking at
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companies that are owned by government officials including the president of the united states, finding out where they're borrowing their money, who their business partners are, whether sovereign wealth funds are involved with those business operations. it is critically important to our national security to know what type of financial dependencies there are of our highest officials and foreign governments and various oligarchs working closely with foreign governments around the world, particularly russia. so i would urge that the house and senate intelligence committees as part of their investigation look at the trump organization as well as other companies owned by high ranking officials in our government. and look at their finances. find out where the money is coming from. that needs to happen right away. if they need to use the power of the subpoena, they should do it. >> you are focusing on a specific form, form 278, what will that tell you? >> the form 278 is financial z
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disclosure form. and assuming they told the truth you know what companies they own. but if they list stock of a privately held company they control, you do not see information about where that company is borrowing its money, who the other business partners are of that company, whether that company is going into joint ventures with foreign sovereign wealth funds or borrowing hundreds of millions of dollars from the bank of china or from some obscure russian bank. you don't see that on the form 278 financial disclosure form. i have urged the congress amend the statute to require such disclosures of the senior officials who are responsible for national defense and intelligence and for trade negotiations. we have a right to that information. but in the meantime i feel strongly that with respect to the russia investigation they need to find that information out now about everyone who is high up in our government who could be financially dependent on the russians or some other
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foreign power. >> might you expect the senate intelligence committee to do that? >> well, if they're doing their job at the house or senate intelligence committee, both of them, they need to find out all of the facts with respect to potential influence on our government from russia. russia has engaged in a hostile act by hacking the computers of one of our political parties, disrupting our election. we need to find out all of the facts. this is part of the mix of facts they need to know. >> you also make the point here, and we have president trump meeting with china's president, president xi, this coming week. and you say we also need to understand the potential financial linkages to china and those in the middle east. >> absolutely. china is now the second largest economy in the world and may soon become the largest economy in the world because of our current trade situation where we
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are running a big deficit with china. and we have people importing clothes such as ivanka trump from china and so forth. we're going to negotiate trade agreements with china, hopefully get a better deal for american workers. but we cannot have the president of the united states or anyone else in the white house receiving money under the table from the chinese. we need the facts before those trade negotiations begin. >> quickly as we go here, steve bannon, we now have some financial disclosure information on him and where he has earned millions in a global client base, if you will, from cash flows that are not just domestic. we also have ivanka trump, jared kushner, over $700 million we understand at least in terms of their worth at the moment. quickly, what did you take from those recent disclosures that we got in the last 24 hours? >> well, we have a lot of people at the white house who have
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worked their way up from being millionaires to billionaires. and i don't know how much they're going to do for the middle class in america. but once again we need to have more information about the privately owned companies that these people control. because we do not know where those companies are borrowing their money and their other financial relationships. and it is intriguing to see that a campaign that was focused so heavily on anti-globalization is bringing in people who have financial connections all over the world and we have no idea what they are because those financial connections are all down at the corporate level. and none of that's disclosed on the form 278. >> richard painter, chief white house ethics lawyer under george w. bush. thank you, sir. >> thank you. >> all righty, next, want to talk about a shakeup that could be on the horizon at the white house. and presidential son-in-law jared kushner could be the one to lead the big change. whether it's bringing cutting-edge wifi to 35,000 fans...
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president trump's west wing could be in for a bit of a jolt in just about 18 days. and his son-in-law, jared kushner, may be the one leading that disruption. political reporting today that senior advisor jared kushner wants to give mr. trump a plan for improving the white house some time around the administration's 90-day mark. kushner's already large workload is growing, but so too apparently is resentment for him according to some reporting. quoting politico, everyone is jealous said one person close to the white house, kushner is the ultimate decider, mostly people are jealous. mike allen wrote this morning about the leak as well suggesting that kushner and his wife ivanka trump who now carry an official white house title are both opposed to policies championed by chief strategist steve bannon. according to infighting, a surprise departure this week, katie walsh suddenly quit to
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join a pro-trump group. white house spokesman sean spicer using one word to fight speculation that a dam has burst and if it hasn't already that it's coming. >> walsh's departure today, are you expect anything more staffing shake-ups in the west wing? >> no. >> with us in new york, direct are of progressive programming for sirius xm. and new york republican party chair ed cox. thank you both. zirlina, the reporting -- this is not necessarily the first time we've heard about jared kushner and his if you will, growing portfolio. now we're seeing this morning because we've had a series of falls and failures from this white house of perhaps jared kushner has new impetus. >> they're looking to jared to fix everything and i don't know he has the experience and work to come into the white house and do that. he doesn't have a considerable amount of experience in
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government and so it's interesting to see that they're putting this all on jared. i don't think they should pin all their hopes on him because he doesn't have all the experience. there are questions concerning russia that tie direct loo to jared. he's going to come before the senate and house committees to answer questions about his relations with the russian ambassador. there's a dark cloud over everything that's going on because the election may be over but the investigation into what happened in the election is not over. it's just beginning. >> i guess what we're seeing if this is correct here, ed, that president trump is turning to the folks he trusts most. jared kushner, his son-in-law and to his daughter ivanka at the moment. if he's doing that, how much are they floundering. as we saw, he was there to sign an executive order when he was questioned about russia. potentially because he was challenged. he forgot the focus of what he
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needed to do which is sign the executive order. >> i wouldn't say the dark clouds. yes, he does trust his son-in-law and certainly his daughter, but he also trusts steve bannon. certainly trusts reince priebus who has a lot of experience in washington and he trusts the other members of his administration. so i wouldn't write too much into this. i know kayte walsh having been a part of the rnc now for seven years and worked with her closely. she's extraordinarily cableable. and the administration is right. when they said there was no air cover for what they were doing in congress, so they are sending her to work with a superpac to give them the air cover they need to -- >> out in the field. >> -- the laws this country needs. >> putting her in the field. >> they weren't doing what was needed, and she knows what the administration is thinking about. got to send an experienced person throughout to do it. they chose a very good foreign do that. >> one potential with jared kushner and ivanka trump getting
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closer in terms of the process here is they are more moderate. that's going to be a question for steve bannon and his side, if you will, of the white house. >> there's definitely a power struggle going on within the west wing. that's very clear based on some of the things happen with steve bannon and certain aspects of the staffing on the national security council. a lot of controversy around that. there are a number of things that are going to come to the fore in the inviting with the more moderate wing. the reince priebuses and sean spicers of the world versus the steve bannons of the world. i don't know how that's going to play out. if i were someone who made predictions, i don't know how long reince is going to last in terms of that wing given what happened with his number two. >> steve bannon gott n onon not his bedside manner. ed, what are you seeing?
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>> bannon is a very gentle, soft-spoken person. i wouldn't talk about bedside manner one way or another with him. the president trusts him and while there may be differences of opinion -- i hope there are differences of opinion in any white house. i'm not sure that there are big power struggles. i know there are not big power struggles going on in this house. they are really working closely -- >> how do you know? >> i know the people involved. i've worked with them over a long period of time. i was involved with them in the campaign. involved with a lot of them getting together, and i was just down in the white house -- >> does that include any of the names -- >> i was in the west wing earlier this year -- earlier this week, and i have to say, i don't see what the speculation that we're hearing at this table. >> there's plenty of leaks coming out. that's what i'm basing the speculation on is the number of leaks talking about the inner workings. >> zerlina and ed, thank you very much.
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that does it for this hour on msnbc. you can catch me on social media at these handles. my colleague yasmi n picks up coverage after this. what's the best way to get two servings of veggies? v8 or a fancy juice store? ready, go! hi, juice universe? one large rutabaga, with eggplant... done! that's not fair. glad i had a v8. the original way to fuel your day.
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and you're about in to hit 'send all' on some embarrassing gas.

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