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tv   The 11th Hour With Brian Williams  MSNBC  April 19, 2017 8:00pm-9:01pm PDT

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health care. so there's pretty much a lot of nothing. >> he said something very angry the other day about canadian dairy cows and we're going to have you speak for canada next time we have time to do that. charl aey sykes gets the last word. where an aircraft carrier is headed in response to north korea. with so many distractions around the world, what ever happened to the russia investigation at home? there's been a new development tonight. and a seismic shift in cable news as fox news parts ways with its number one star. "the 11th hour" begins now. well, good evening once
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again from our head quarters in new york. this was day 90 of the trump administration. when he said last week he was sending an armoda, while we hadn't heard that word in a long time and conjured sailing ships more than battle ships, it made sense in response to the provocation against north korea. and he made point about the submarines being more powerful than the aircraft carrier and as nuclear weapons launch platforms, they are but we don't normally discuss the movement of our submarines. the phrase run silent, run deep comes to mind. but when hisefense secretary and national security advisor said it, they were all wrong. the carrier carl vincent and the strike group that sails with it, they were thousands of miles away and steaming clear in the other direction. here is the administration last week on all this verses what we
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heard today. >> why the carrier strike force to the korean peninsula? >> well, it's prudent to do it. the president has asked us to be prepared to give him a full range of options. >> we are sending an armoda. very powerful. we have submarines, very powerful. far more powerful than the aircraft carrier. k i can tell you. >> when you see a carrier group, the full presence is through almost every instance a huge detrance. >> as far as the movement of the vincent, she's stationed in the western pacific for a reason. she's just on her way up there because that's where we thought it was most prude tonight have her at this time. >> the vincent sails up and down the pacific routinely. and so i would not read anything into the carl vincent's current locations. >> the bottom line is in our effort to always be open, we
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said that we were going to change the vincent's upcoming schedule. she's going to continue part of her cruise down in that region. but she was on her way up to korea. >> the president said we have an armada going towards the peninse all lu -- we said it was heading there and it was. what part is misleading? >> what's misleading is people thought it was heading there now and now it's going to be there weeks later. >> i understand the question but what i'm getting at is it was announced that it was going. it will be there. we were asked simply a question on that. i think all other questions should be asked of the department of defense. >> meanwhile on the heels of the state department on whether to stay in the iran deal, secretary of state rex tillerson today
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tun turned up the rhetoric on iran and said the deal quote fails to achieve the objective of a nonnuclear iran. he was pressed on those comment said by our own andrea mitchell and an explainer. you're about to hear sec are eitary tillerson refer to the iran deal by the chunkier deal the acrunim for joint comprehensive plan of action. >> i think riltser important in any conversation on jcpla and i think this was one of the mistakes in how that agreement was put together is that it completely ignored all of the other serious threats that iran poses. it is another example o buying off aower who has nuclear ambitions. we buy them off for a short period of time and someone has to deal with it later. we just don't see that is a prudent way to be dealing with iran. certainly not in the context of all their other disruptive
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activity said. >> let's bring in the members of tonight's starting panel. former joint chief of staff during t during the obama years and msnbc chief correspondent by day from washington tonight. jeremy, the carrier story is a second day story because of this insistence that it was this special kind of delayed reaction armada, that when the president says we're sending an armada, he means the one thousands of miles away and going in the other direction. please tell me for starters the navy has the gps technology available in the dash bord of a chevrolet. >> put differently when a carrier goes east, it will
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eventually find its way thousandther side of the globe. this was a terrible mistake. a dropped ball in communication for certain. but really what was -- it was an atmpt by the president to take credit for something that he had nothing to do with. he wasn't even consulted about the direction of them carl vincent carrier strike group. the white house only found out when the navy issued its press guidance. so not only was factually incorrect but was the very opposite of presence. presence means forced posture forward. that's a deterrent factor in forcing an adversary to do something you want it to do. this was absence. we weren't even there and so our allies tonight are questioning our resolve in this particular crisis. >> and this is as jeremy points out more than a messaging foul up. i heard someone refer to this as
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the broken watch theory of carrier strike groups. twice a day somewhere there's a carrier strike group at least in the direction of the korean peninsula. this was a message sent out. a lot of nations in that neighborhood are anxious to know what's in their waters. sea of japan, china and so on. >> not just our allies and neighbors but our 28,000 troops stationed in south korea. this tone has ratcheted up higher than a long time. and this goes back to the nixon administration. everybody has come in all hot about what wathey're going to do about north korea and everybody's ended up with a different plan. we've got service men and women looking for that back up. and if you're not sending them, just don't say you're sending them. they kept on talking about the western pacific. it's a round globe. the western pacific is a very, very big nonspecific area.
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again is it a communication foul up? was it deliberately not meant to be specific? we've heard sea of japan and korea. but this is -- it's weird. it's damaging and it can't possibly have been calculated to have good effect. not with standing that north a thought the was an armada heading towards them and now they found out it isn't. it's bad messaging all the way around. >> and now we come to the subject of iran. if you explain to the folks watching what it is they're now saying on iran and because we're always on guard for shiny subjects. >> i think the president wants to deliver on the promise to rip up the deal but the it reality is it's hard to rip up a deal that six nations plus the it u.s. negotiated and before
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midnight last night they did what they had to do to certify every 90 days of congress that iran is complying or not and what they certified is iran is living up to it. it's not cheating on the nuclear deal. so now they are amping up or raising the ante let's say and suggesting that the bad things iran does is on the state sponsor of terror list. it not only supports terrorism around the middle east and around the globe. so there's a lot against iran right now, thought only terrorism but arresting u.s. citizens. this is one of the few instances where this state department and this president is talking about human rights abuses. the president just praised erdogan. welcomed alsisi to the oval office and never criticizes
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putin and went to bejing without the press core. and in this case they are reaming iran for its human rights abuses. the difference was that the u.s. and the other five countries walled off all those other things. they said it's more important to stop iran for at least 10 years. they're three months to a year away from achieving that terrible goal. so we will ignore everything else bad that they're doing. they're still sanctions by the u.s. for human rights abuses. the u.s. still has these other sanctions but we will focus on this nuclear issue and if they don't have a nuclear weapon or missil wil be less dangerous but we're still sanctioning them for that. and to say they're in the same category is just not accurate. north korea has 13 to 30 nuclear
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bombs. >> that's exactly the point. andrea's last point when you see and hear the secretary of state, it can be scary to americans used to living in a scary world when you hear iran could turn into north korea. the difference today of course north korea has nukes. is that hiperbly or helpful? >> one of the things the new team was brooefed on was the centrifuge tit centrifuge. they were spinning and covertly marching towards a nuclear weapon. at that time all the assessments said we are a year to maybe 18 months away from them being able to create a bomb. that in it sfl is a success in part due to our activities and
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diplomacy towards stalling their capabilities. i don't think the american people need to worry that iran has a nuclear weapon tonight. however, if we were to walk away from the nuclear deal, we would essentially speaking on behalf of six other countries and it's not leadership when you step throughout and no one's following you. we did this deal with other countries. if we were to impose sanctions again, then iran would feel free to abruigate and spin the centrifuges again and march towards a bomb. we have many other ways to get tough on them towards terrorism and we should do that. >> do you see a foreign policy in here? >> it's a tough one because iran, unlike north korea is expansionist. influence outside its own borders. what we learned with russia is it's complicated. we need them for some things we
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don't want them for other things. we really need them for north korea. we really do have to have a more comprehensive approach. this was a complicated deal but everybody including president obama and then secretary of state kerry understood we weren't tackling broader issues. we need to tamp down the heat in the middle east. it's risen in the last several months and this kind of talk doesn't necessarily help. >> andrea, i want you to react to the following. will ay gies talking to senator lindsey graham of a pre-emptive strike on north korea. >> they're close to getting a mistool hit the homeland. now is the time to stop -- >> a pre-emptive strike? >> if that's what it would take. i'm no going to allow, with my
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vote, north korea to develop a missile to hit america. not going to happen. china can stop it if they want to. if they don't, i think president trump will. >> give us a reality check. >> well, lindsey graham is a leading member of the armed services committee and he and john mccain are talking to the president and influential people but last thursday i believe on your program, bryan, warned this just does not make sense. a pre-emptive strike -- first of all, we don't know where all of their nukes are. they have mobile launchers. what would then happen is the artillery -- the people within artillery range of the conventional weapons, if not intactical nuclear weapons, the instant retaliation could wipe out seoul. we have a lot of americans living there, to say nothing of
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our neighbors in japan. >> and a word about our long suffering intelligence community. anyone who's downloaded the americans knows that with any luck you can inject people and have human intelligence sources. it takes a long time and it's better to be lucky than good. north korea is different. you can try eyes above but everything is in a hardened bunker. there's no way you can inject an american who's going to send back reliable intelligence. to the point it's a game of wack amole, that target list would be seemingly endless. >> yeah. it's very hard to know based on the closed nature of that society precisely the entirety of their capabilities. and here's the point, brian is that if i were in the white house, i could only in good conscience recommend pre-emptive
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military action if we knew they were taking it, miniaturizing it, putting on top of an icbm that could hit the united states. in that case, we would have to take pre-emptive military action but so comp rehencely to defend seoul. >> just one quick point about iran. they have an election next month and senator corker and democrats on the foreign relations committee deliberately pulled back on action on sanctions because they do not want iran to get more radical in its election next month. >> it's a point i heard you make on the air earlier tonight. absolutely right that u.s. decisions could cause a turn further to the right there. andrea mitchell, jeremy bash, thanks to our opening panel. and what ever happened to the investigation into the matter some feared could be an
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comcast business. built for business. let's[ whimpers ] dog. find ping-pong. okay, let's go. find your awesome with the xfinity x1 voice remote. that's amazing! i'm happy to report our committee is back on track. we've had a number of serious conversation since he took the republican reins. i don't think it will have the public's confidence if they don't see how we've proceeded. so i'm hoping where we can we do as much of this as possible in
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public. >> ranking member of the house intelligence committee talking about this russia investigation when congress comes back from their recess next week and new tooncht the new york times is reporting it was carter page, his viszt to moscow last summer after joining the trump campaign that peeked the intelligence community's interest in him. the times reports quote it is unclear exactly what about mr. panl's visit caught the fbi's attention. meet shz he had during his three days in moscow, intercepted communications of russian officials speak about him or something else. as recently as last week page has denied any wrong doing. jeremy bash remains with us and joining us sam stein, the veteran senior politics editor for the huffington post. we're going to get to you on the politics in a moment but we're going to start with the veteran of the intelligence industry
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first. this article in the times the headline is quite simple. trump's advisors ves toot moscow sent the fbi digging. it's by shane, zigy and goldman. there are so many journalists covering this administration. what interests you in this story specifically, jeremy? >> a great deal and this story sent me back to 50 u.s. code 1801, the fisa statute. it says if you a united states person in america and carter page is, the fbi has to find and show a federal judge probable cause that you knowingly, knowingly engage in foreign intelligence clandestine collection and that you became in effect an agent of a foreign power. so wasn't some guy unwittingly working with the foreign intelligence service of the russian federation.
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he knowingly did this and a federal judge believed it and other reporting we've seen from this story shows that it was in part the dossier written by chris steel that led the fbi to take this case to the fisa court and of course we know that the fisa court would pt just rely on the dossier or trip and so there must be more throughout. >> when jeremy talks about these investigations, let's start with the house. we heard from schiff talking in a hopeful tone about what might happen. devyn nunez has been placed aside. mike conway from texas is in. is that enough of a tde up to make the ranking member sound optimistic? >> apparently. obviously what happened a couple of weeks ago is this whole weird
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saga of devin nunez getting documents he showed to the white house. it really undercut the ability of the house committee to investigate this matter to the point they basically had to step aside. so now we're irin a point where the committee seems to be getting back on his feet. it does seem like they're clawing back into the game. they're still behind what seems to be much more competently run senate committee investigation. you listen to senator burr who are running these things. they steam to be actually collaborating on this matter much more fruitfully than what's going on in the house. you ask how long will this take and the answers you get is somewhere between six to eight months and that is sort of optimistically. so this thing is going to continue. we will continue to incrementally get updates. >> i want to tip toe back to what you mentioned before the
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dossier. it's notable and we should repeat we have never read its contents on the air. a, because we can't match all the reporting tin and, b, because it's a family broadcast and there are sorted details. there's been other reporting and specifically a cnn report has said there are elements in the dossier that fbi may zel confirmed, run down and acted upon on going to a federal court and requesting one of these fisa surveillance warrants? >> and i should be clear it's not just the fbi, it's the united states department of justice with career professionals who are officers of the court and nay have to in a series of pleadings under oath that the information they believe to be true and then a federal judge, senate confirmed, nonpartisan has to find probable
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cause to believe that information is correct. and so for us now to know that at least some elements of the dossier are correct really opens the apture into what this investigation could reach. >> sam stein now to the disconnect that still exists between the president and members of his team. some members of his team speak in russia -- speak about russia the old-fashioned way, the way we used to talk about russia a year or two ago and vladimir putin. this is a piece in the washington post that quotes the president "things will work out fine between the u.s.a. and russia. this is last week on the president's twitter account. at the right time everyone will come to their senses and there will be lasting peace. a, we're greatly relieved to read that. b, there is sam, still this disconnect. >> it's a very bazar disconnect
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where senior members of the administration seem to be not just reading off a different script but having a entirely different geopolitical world view than the president himself. ambassador nikki haley condemning russia's complisancy with the weapons attacks in syria and contrast that with some of the tweets and your ror struggling to come to an explanation. i think this is invite more of the insidious conspiracy minded theorist about the ties to russia. and for instance there's this theory he has an affinity for strong men and there's just no clear reasoning for why he talks this way especially when there's all this clear evidence of russia medaling in world affairs contrary to u.s. interests. >> gentleman, thank you very much. really good conversation. another break for us. when we continue.
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returning to the fox news channel. and o'reilly saying in part it is tremendously disheartening that we parted ways due to completely unfounded claims. but that is the unfortunate reality many of us in the public eye must live with today. i will back back on my time at fox with great pride. in the world of media and big business, this is a seismic event and joining tuse talk about it, msnbc host formerly a veteran of the business world and steve batalia who covers television and media for the l.a. times. author of three books on television, including the definitive biography of david susstain. it is rather to talk about the impact, the stuff you cover on a daily basis. would you have believed if i'd told you two/three years guy
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that roger ailes and bill o'reilly would exit fox news months apart and during a trump presidency? >> that would be quite a trifecta, brian. but we are living through uncharted territory here. and i think what happened, what made this different than other bill o'reilly controversiesas that advertisersere fleeing him. it was a ver easy way to listen on the public out cry by pulling their spots off the show and that really changed this. once an advertiser comes out of a program, then it's very difficult for them to go back in and the clock really started ticking loud when that was happening. and the long-term view is that there's another challenge. this is the number one show in all of cable news. i wrote today this was kind of like when friends left the nbc
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must see tv line up in 2004. it was a big tent pole show, the o'reilly factor which brought viewers to the network every single night and some tuned in early, some late but it was a lot of people. what happens to the rest of the network? many people show up every night, there's going to be a hit of some kind in the ratings. >> rupert murdock's sons did not have such senior positions in the company and money talks. these are forward thinking guys. james murdock is focussed on buying sky tv, a major acquisition in europe. they wanted to buy sky in 2011. they had to pull it amid all of the noise around the phone hacking scandal. that is back up at the plate. it needs regulatory approval. they don't need noise. sohis might be the number one show, a $20 million guy.
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$20 million verses 11 billion can't really compare. >> we also have politics. i heard a political veteran say flat years in ways we kind of stopped noticing bill o'reilly's talking points every night became in a way the surrogate talking points on all of the cable channels and shows it all spawned into the next day and when was the last time you heard the president of the united states describe a prominent cable news host as a friend and defend him? o'reilly did occupy a different part in that politics business nexus. >> bill o'reilly really defined the opinion host on cable news. it used to be when you had opinion, you had to have both sides represented. bill o'reilly said no i don't need that.
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people want to hear -- walter chronkite said that's the way it is. on my show people want to hear what i think the way is. he was remarkably consistent in the topics that he chose, in how he delivered them. he did with such confidence and bluster and he was able to fill an hour and make the it compelling and it's worked across fox news with other personalities. it's worked very well on msnbc with rachel maddow and lawrence o'donnell. he really changed the way what people expected from cable news. cnn always said that the news was the star. that wasn't the case once bill o'reilly came along. personality became what cable news is about and he was the biggest, certainly on his side and he had a lot of influence. you wanted him to be on your si if you were a politician. >> weren't we saying this when
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roger ailes was leaving? that this was the man who built fox? roger ailes left the building and the beat went on. >> 50 corporate logos. some among the most recognizable on the planet. these are the sponsors that took off, that left bill o'reilly. you're saying if the credit for this goes to the sons of rupert murdock, this spoke loudly, these logos, female employees, the power of the female consumer melded into the decision. >> murdock's wife who was a model put pressure on her husband. this is no longer a people don't feel good about this. money is talking. advertisers are so concerned bot what their brands represent and it is women in the homes doing the spending and when you see the money walk out the door, then you kind of have to move with it and bill o'reilly a
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major name but tucker carlson, who may be a conservative but has a more nuanced positions has been welcome in that place. >> that's all we have for this segment and the time to discuss it. coming up after a break, a political veteran takes a wack attan ancswering the question w just happened to american politics? and are we now a nation of political tribes? it's how well you mow fast. it's not how fast you mow... ...it's how well you mow fast. woooh! it's not how fast you mow... it's how well you mow fast! it's not how fast you mow... it's how well you mow fast. they're nojust words to mow by, they'rwords to live by. the john deere ztrak z345r with the accel deep deck to mow faster, better. take a test drive and save up to 250 dollars on select john deere residential ztrak mowers.
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this network tonight. joining me veteran political strategist for both bush/cheney campaigns. out with a new book "a new way embracing the paradox as we lead and serve." though if you ask us he spends far too much time hanging around msnbc news. matthew, welcome. fist time ever at our humble studios here. >> great to be here. >> we wanted to run that little snippet of the interview. democracy has elasticity. think about it. mccarthyism and cormautsue happened in a democracy. how much elasticity -- are we testing that? tell the folks the thesis of your book and especially about tribalism, which is a troubling term. >> i'm a big believer in the cycles of history and there's a book that steve bannon has talked about qucalled "the four
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turning." in our country's history, every 70 or 80 years we go through a moment where all our instushzs are in question, where major crisis happens. the last time was 80 years ago in the midst of the depression and world war ii and before that civil war moving to an agreerian based economy to an industrial one. and in many ways very destructive and it also means we have a chance to create new institutions to meet the demands of the century. and it's happened before in our history makes it very difficult to have a functional democracy because we can't get together for the common good and if we can't get together for the common good we have no ability to have a common set of facts. that's why government is dysfunctional. >> that is a huge problem today. who do we see about the large
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percentage of americans who wanted a change? who had a problemith the way things were and that has made us grow further apart? >> we've had a couple of battles on election day that were undecided. and one of the battles was between people who wanted transformation of the country, its changing demographically, institutions need adapt. and the other half wanted a restoration. which is i liked the way it was before. i like the country when it looked like this. and that battle took place on election day. one person won the popular vote, one person won the electoral college. yes, it was a change election but one part said i want a change j move forward and the other part said yes, i want a change and move backward. >> that place you're familiar with, i think a lot of americans
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would tell polsters that's probably the institution that has let them down, hasn't served them. do you see in your daily travelled and reporting any hopeful signs? >> this notion of tribalism is a fascinating one and i get where matt is coming from in it is bad and has terrible outcomes to it. but it can be harnessed in good ways too. for instance. trump supporters for instance. five years ago if you polled vladimir putin, he was toxic but vladimir putin gave a gateway for them to warm up to him. u could harness that type of tribalism. for instance, donald trump is one of the first republican candidates to come out for a maternity leave child care policy. that is not republican orthodoxy. he could then go to capitol hill
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and present that plan as some sort of compromise between democrats and republicans and would have a better chance of passage precisely because of tribalism. there is a good and bad side. you just need leaders to work in constructive ways around it and that's where i think we have the disconnect. >> and the thing i think most frustrating for most people and i think it bill o'reilly situation is evidence of this. which is the political leaders are behind where the country wants to go. and they're behind where many of the businesses and corporations are going. and if you think about the fundamental change that's being pushed and watch what happened with bill o'reilly, that was done not by political leaders, that was by people who said there was business interests not being served. so he was moved aside. it was a monetary decision, not a moral decision. you see that in north korea with everything transgender. it was led by businesses that
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pushed for change. the minimum wage is being pushed by businesses. so there is a group of people, a large grass roots of people around the country. but what's happening is the political leaders have not caught up to where the country wantso go. >> we'll extend ts conversation a bit. we're justng to take break. we've asked both gentleman to stay with us. more of our conversation when "the 11th hour. " ♪ if you have moderate to severe ulcerative colitis or crohn's, and your symptoms have left you with the same view,
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we are back with the 11th hour specifically a conversation we could have for hours at a time. i want to show you a graphic. this is the job approval rating. let's call it rounding 40/60. if you are the democrats as some like to call the resistance party read something about bernie sanders today questioning
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ossoff's membership in the progressive wing of the party. how would you advise the resistance not to screw it up because that is 60% of the audience that is receptive to your message. >> i would say they have donald trump's negatives in the bank. that is going to motivate people. what i don't think they have done is put together a set of values and policies that connect with the middle of america. they still do not have a platform or model that fits in all the parts of the country that aren't the coasts and major cities. that is a problem. they have the negatives on donald trump. that will drive turnout. they have to have something to convince voters that were reluctant trump voters. they didn't think he was qualified. how are they going to convince th to go to the democrats? >>ow do they lose? how did the democrats lose those voters? take a ride through michigan. take a look at trump yard sales
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in what used to be democratic front yards. >> they nominated a candidate that was almost as disliked as donald trump. that was one part of the problem who was viewed as an insider. i think fundamentally because they haven't been speaking to the voters. they basically bet on demography. we will go with demographics and how the country is becoming more progressive and forgot about geography. >> sam stein, dual question to you. is the trump administration sustainable at a very basic level? how do the democrats prevent from screwing up 60% opportunity if looked at another way? >> so sustainable in a basic definition they are not going anywhere. i don't know what the future holds for some of these senior administration officials. steve bannen is clearly on the oust.
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we don't know what reince priebus's future holds. he is the chief of staff. so they are not going anywhere but it's unclear what the direction actually is. a lot of -- there was a previous discussion about this, they are not out there selling anything. it is unclear what is actually happening in the administration. let meeviate a tiny bit. i preciate optimism about the need for constructive agenda. i think the democrats will look back to 2010 which is the closest parallel and say how do republicans win back the house? the republicans win back by being antiobama and saying we will stop his agenda and will not cooperate and we will vote against stimulus bill and health care bill. it worked. it is the closest parallel. you get the sense that there is zero appetite to work with donald trump. >> the problem with that is that
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democrats don't have a base of geographic support around the country in state after state that they can go to. they have urban areas and coasts. until they break through in places like michigan, wisconsin, pennsylvania and those places where fundamental way and in south texas they are not going to be a majority party until they break through there. >> if they did that the problem is that would be the old way. i couldn't help myself. thank you both for joining us. great conversation. coming up after one last break, the federal judge famously criticized by president trump back in the news for an interesting reason tonight.
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for an erection lasting more than four hours. if you have a sudden decrease or loss of hearing or vision, or an allergic reaction, stop taking cialis and get medical help right away. ask your doctor about cialis. last thing before we go here tonight, you may have read the story about the first of the so-called dreamers to be deported by federal immigration agents. dreamers were the undocumented immigrants brought here as children and protected during the obama years. juan montez is 23. the federal judge assigned to the case you may remember the name of judge, the president talked a lot about him during the campaign. >> i have a judge who is a hater of donald trump, a hater. he is a hater.
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h i think he should be ashamed of himself. i think it's a disgrace that he is doing this and i look forward to going before a jury. >> why did you refer to his ethnicity? >> because his heritage is mexican. >> why? >> i want to build a wall. i'm building a wall. i will do very well with the hispanics. >> so no mexican judge can be involved? >> he is a member of society very pro mexico. >> i want to build a wall. i'm going to build a wall. >> he was born in indiana. high is a federal judge appointed for life just like donald trump's sister, the federal judge. he provided over the trump university case. the court says the assignment was random and coincidal. that is our broadcast on this wednesday night. thank you for being here with us and good night from new york.
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massachusetts senator elizabeth warren is here tonight for the interview. she will be here live in the studio with me. i'm very much looking forward to that conversation. elizabeth warren tonight for the interview. we start tonight with the founding of the family research council. the family research council was founded as a very conservative hard line religious right activist group in the early 1980s. james dobson has always been the figure head and prime mover of the family research council. its initial founding came in large part from a michigan businessman, a man named edgar prince. he ran a manufacturing company that made auto parts and other stuff through the '60s, '70s and '80s and '90s. what he became famous for was not his business acumen in michigan, what he did with his fortune.

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