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tv   MSNBC Live With Velshi and Ruhle  MSNBC  June 22, 2017 8:00am-9:01am PDT

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stephanie ruhle. >> it's about 145 pages of the bill. >> speed reading. >>e're going to speed read. i'm ali velshi, good morning. >> i'm stephanie ruhle. i'm not sure i can get through this but let's get started. >> always tierrific to be able o leave the washington swamp, phony witch hunts against me. everything going. we won last night and even the worst of them said that was a big win for trump. i love all people, rich or poor but in those particular positions i just don't want a poor person, does that make sense? solar wall. let's see. we're working it out. panels, beautiful. pretty good imagination, right? my idea. >> if we went and got the single greatest health care plan in the history of the world, we would
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not get one democrat vote because they are obstructionists. they are obstructionists. >> it would be a beautiful, beautiful thing if we could get together as two parties that love our country and come up with that great health care. those seeking admission into our country must be able to support themselves financially and should not use welfare for a period of at least five years. >> we've signed 39 pieces of legislation. that means going through congress, 39 pieces as of today. some of them very important. now, my biggest pieces are yet to come. >> nancy pelosi was a great speaker. she is a great leader. but her time has come and gone. >> there's a fight to be waged in washington right now and it's not with ourselves, it's against the republicans mean health care plan as described by president
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trump. >> and breaking news at this hour, the health ks care bill is out. mitch mcconnell, he's going to be live from the senate floor talking about the senate republicans draft health care bill. they are calling it better care. >> or some might call it trump care or any moment now, we're going to hear from president trump at a tech event inhe east room of the white house and also this hour, house speaker paul ryan will be speaking live from capitol hill and we'll bring that to you as it begins. but of course we begin with the breaking news, senate republicans health care bill revealed moments ago. called better care rereconciliation act of 2017, a whopping 142 pages, we have the best team in the business here at nbc and msnbc sifting through it. here's what we know so far. actually before we get into it we'll tap into nancy pelosi. she is speaking. let's listen in.
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>> that i have in my -- my timing is not about them. it's about the issues that we're here to fight and fighting right now on the health care bill. the expansion of opportunity in our caucus has been great for people who want to take advantage and help us win. maybe they don't want to play in that arena but there is -- i'm very proud of the members who do. they are going around the country listening. 30 somethings listening to the voices of young people and my 30th anniversary is this -- in june and at my celebrations, i have always featured the young 30 somethings -- and they are so impressive. we're paving a way for a new generation of leadership. and again, i respect any opinion that members have but my decision about how long i stay
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is not up to them. >> just to follow up, democrats have lost 60 seats over the past six years. so why should you -- >> yet again, americans could be thrown off their plans in states like missouri and ohio and wisconsin. it sound like obamacare is working? now democrats tell us it would be wrong for the senate to actually address these problems in a serious way while the law they've defended for seven years teters literally teters on the edge of total collapse. they were wrong before, they were wrong again now. because obamacare isn't working by any measure it has failed and no amount of 11th hour reality denying or buck passesing by democrats will change the fact that more americans are going to get hurt unless we do something. i regret our democratic friends made clear early on they did not
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want to work with us in a serious bipartisan way to address the obamacare status quo but republicans believe we have a responsibility to act and we are. for our conituent and for our states and for our country. we long called for a better way forward and we've ben engaged in intensive talks how to get there. through dozens of meetings open to each and every member of the congress, we've had ideas for confronting the obamacare status quo. we debated policy proposals and considered many different viewpoints. in the end we found we share many ideas about what needs to be achieved and how we can achieve it. these shared policy objectives and solutions to help achieve them are what made up the health care discussion draft that we finished talking through this morning. we agreed on the need to free americans from obamacare's
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mandates and policies contained in the discussion draft will repeal the individual mandate so americans are no longer forced to buy insurance they don't need or can't afford. we'll repeal the employer mandate so americans no longer see their hours and take home pay cut by employers because of it. we agreed on the need to improve the affordability of health insurance and policies contained in the discussion draft. we'll do that. we'll eliminate costly obamacare taxes passed on to consumers so we can put downward pressure on premiums. expand tax free health savings accounts and deploy targeted tax credits so we can help defray out-of-pocket costs and ship power fr washington to the states so they are more flexibility to provide more americans with the kind of affordable insurance options they actually want. we agree on the need to
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stabilize the insurance markets that are collapsing under obamacare as well and policies contained in the discussion draft will implement stabilization policies to bring financial certainty to insurance markets and hope to americans who face the possibility of limited or zero options next year under obamacare. and ultimately transition away from obamacare's collapsing system entirely so more americans will not be heard. we also agree on the need to strengthen medicaid, preserve access to care for patients with pre-exiexisting conditions and w parents to stay on the health insurance through the age of 26. i'm pleased we were able to arrive at the draft that incorporates input from so many different members who represent so many different constituents who are facing so many different challenges. the draft containing the solutions i mentioned along with many others is posted online.
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and i encourage everyone to carefully review it. there will be ample time to analyze discuss and provide thoughts before legislation comes to the floor and i hope every senator takes that opportunity. next week we expect the budget -- congressional budget office to release a score. after that we will proceed with a robust debate and open amendment process on the senate floor, a process i would encourage each of 100 senators to participate in. when legislation does come to the floor, it will present senate democrats with another opportunity to do what's right for the american people and they can choose to keep standing by as their failing law continues to collapse and hurt more americans but i hope they will join us instead to bring relief to the families who struggled under obamacare for far too long. either way, either way, it's time to act.
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obamacare is a direct attack on the middle class and american families deserve better than failing status quo. they deserve better care. that is just what we're going to continue to work to bring them. >> that was senate majority leader mitch mcconnell sort of speaking to the document that they have just released. it is a draft document of the amendments to the house bill which was called the american health care act, this one they are calling the better care reconciliation act, 142 pages or so and it's a lot of amendments to the documents, kind of hard to read if you were to download and read it you would have to the other documents in front of you to do so. >> the first at getting a crack at this. part of the group of 13 isn't seen it yesterday. it was interesting we learned mitch mcconnell before meeting with his own group of senators met with lobbyists from the
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health care industry -- >> before republican senators before democratic senators and before more than a dozen health groups, american cancer association, the heart association diabetes, all of them -- aarp, they wanted meetings with mitch mcconnell, couldn't get them but the lob lobbyist got them. >> the lobbyist and health care industry spend 3.5 to 4 times more than the second largest lobbying effort. there's a lot of money in power. >> the first three months of this year, over $75 million in lobbying spent by the health care industry. >> 78 million, just three months. >> let's bring in nbc's capitol hill kasie hunt and we have michael sparr professor and msnbc chief legal correspondent ari melber. kasie, what are you hearing on the hill? >> reporter: we talked briefly
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and i have not talked yet to any of the republicans that we consider to be key votes on this measure and instead we're getting people basically ducking our cameras. john mccain, richard burr refused to say anything. we did speak to senator pat roberts of kansas and he said this was a difficult bill under difficult circumstances but that he wants to move forward with this. i think -- >> let me stop you for a second -- >> reporter: we are sifting -- go ahead. >> chuck schumer -- this will happen all day i think. chuck schumer is speaking on the senate floor. >> under the senate bill, republicans will take millions off their medicaid coverage and then starting in 2025, the plan will institute even more medicaid cuts and each year those cuts get deeper than the year before. within ten years of this new funding system, the cuts to medicaid could total hundreds of billions of dollars above the
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more than 800 billion the house bill already cuts from the program. ever seen y seen yor in america read, it looks like american seniors could be paying way more. why do this? looking at the bill, the answer is because the republicans want to give a tax break to the wealthiest americans. those making over $200,000 a year and set themselves up to give these folks another, even larger tax cut in their tax bill. even though much of the early reporting says the bill will keep certain protections for americans with preexisting conditions, the truth is, it may well not guarantee them the coverage they need. by allowing states to waive essential health benefits, what the bill is saying to those americans , insurance still has to cover you but it doesn't
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have to cover what you may actually need. it doesn't have to cover all or most of your costs. if you need treatment for opioid addiction, your plan may no longer cover it. if you're pregnant and need maternity care, your plan may have decided that's too expensive. the coverage that americans with preexisting conditions actually need may well become either unaffordable or even nonexistent under this bill. simply put, this bill will result -- not right now at the end of my remarks. simply put, this bill will result in higher costs less care and millions of americans will lose their health insurance particularly through medicaid. it's every bit as bad as the house bill. in some ways it's even worse. the president said the senate bill needed heart.
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the way this bill cuts health care is heartless. the president said the house bill was mean. the senate bill may be meaner. the senate republican health care bill is a wolf in sheep's clothing, only this wolf has even sharper teeth than the house bill. it's clear that republicans know that cutting medicaid will hurt so many people in the middle class, so many in my home state of new york. republicans know that people want essential health benefits. so they've created a disguise by sayi these changes won't occur for a year. but in reality, the senate republican bill is a wolf in sheep's clothing only this wolf has even sharper teeth than the house bill. we're potentially voting on it in a week. no committee hearings, no
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amendments in committee, no debate on the floor save for ten measly hours on one of the most important bills we're dealing with in decades. that brings shame on this body. we won't even know the full cost or consequence of the bill until cbo scores it. and that could take a few days more. how can my friend, the majority leader expect this body to fairly consider this legislation, prepare amendments and debate it in one week with only ten hours of debate? how can he expect his own members to do the same? >> many of them on the republican side are learning the details of the bill the same way we democrats are. they are reading it today. now, listen to what the majority leader had to say in 2009 when we were debating health care. his words.
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this is a very important issue. we shouldn't try to do it in the dark. and whatever final bill is produced, should be available to the american public and to members of the senate certainly for enough time to come to grips with it. and we're going to insist and the american people are going to insist that it be done in a transparent, fair and open way. is 5 or 6 days enough time for the american people and members of the senate to come to grips with a bill that affects one sixth of the economy and lives of every american in this country? i don't think so. neither do the american people and neither do a whole bunch of republican senators. senator cassidy, would i have a preferred a more open process? the answer is yes. senator collins, i don't think it gives enough time to
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thoroughly analyze the bill but we'll see when it comes out. there's member after member, rand paul, lindsey graham, jerry more ran, marco rubio, bob corker, who repeatedly have said this process in their words and now in mine, is unfair, is trunk ated and rushed. for my dear friend the majority leader to say we're going to have an open amendment process is turning truth upside down. i would ask our leader rea torically, because i know the answer, can we allow at least one hour on each amendment, not two minutes? will we have more time than ten hours to debate the bill? i hope so. but if not, please don't call this an open and fair process.
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you want to rush it through, mit the consequences. >> now, mr. president, the debate over health care has been fierce. we know that the republicans and democrats had differences when we debated the affordable care act, at least we had a debate. at least we had committee hearings and a process. and more broadly than that, at least we democrats were trying to pass a health care bill that helped more americans afford insurance and try to bring costs down and end some of the most egregious practices of the health care industry. what is this bill, trump care trying to achieve? it seems designed to slash support for health care programs in order to give tax breaks to the very wealthy. and when the cbo score comes out, i believe it will verify
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that millions of americans in this great country will be unable to afford insurance or the insurance they can afford won't cover the services they need. somewhere in america, mr. president, there's a family who takes a trip each friday to visit grandma or grandpa at a nursing home. who sacrificed all of their savings to pay for their health care until they had no more savings. and now relies on medicaid to help pay the cost of long-term care in the nursing home. somewhere in america, there's a father who is eaten up inside watching his son struggle with opioid addiction, who knows in his heart that his son would be able to go on and live a healthy and fulfilling life if he could
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only afford treatment to get him out from under his devastating addiction. somewhere in america, there's a parent whose child has cancer and mother and father who stay up late at night worried their insurance will either not be available or run out when the family needs it most. the america that my republican friends envision with this health care bill, those americans and many more beside might not get the coverage and care they need. we live in the wealthiest country on earth. surely, surely we can do better than what the republican health care bill promises. and now i have a unanimous consent request. going to have to -- from asking questions until we finish our
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unanimous consent request. i ask unanimous consent that any substitute or perfecting amendment offered to calendar number 120, hr 1628, not be in order if the text of the amendment has not been filed at the desk and made available on a public website for at least 72 hours, along with an analysis by the congressional budget office of the bill's budgetary coverage and cost implications. >> is there objection? >> reserving the right to object, my colleague, senator cornyn was going to ask the question, which i'll answer which was, the majority leader is referring to a bill that he hadn't seen a copy of because hadn't yet been released. the speech you just heard was about a bill he hasn't seen. with regard to his consent, i object. >> mr. president, parliamentary -- not
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parliamentary privilege, leader time. >> the senator has the floor. >> thank you. >> 142 pages thus far of this supposed bill have been printed online and that's what i have used -- >> minority whip. >> mr. president, several weeks ago the house of representatives passed a bill to repeal the affordable care act and replace it. it was placed without hearings and an amendment process and passed before the congressional budget office provided the traditional analysis, which we count on before we take up a measure of such magnitude. that measure passed with a party line vote, all republicans, two republican senators voted the other way it would not have moved forward. after it passed the president of the united states decided to have a celebration at the white house. we saw him on television, gathering the republican members
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of the house of representatives -- >> senator dick durbin, deputy leader in the house, you are hearing we heard from nancy pelosi, mitch mcconnell, chuck schumer. everybody is sounding in on this piece of legislation, you'll hear it called by different names, this is the draft of the republican legislation. >> it is and mitch mcconnell was saying don't listen to chuck schumer he hasn't seen this. it is 142 pages but remember within the last 14 or so hours, we've gotten pieces at least bullet points of having an understanding of what this reform would do, what it would look like, i don't know if kasie is still there at capitol hill -- >> reporter: i am. >> that seemed to be some statements and some procedural stuff that chuck schumer is trying to do that mitch mcconnell didn't want him to do. >> you're going to see a lot of that through the next week or so
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as the health care process winds through. everything in the senate, if they do something, it has to be agreed to by everybody. what chuck schumer was asking for was hey, we want 72 hours to read this and review this and we want those 72 hours to also be while there is a cbo score available on the bill. essentially he's saying, look, i'm asking that everybody agree we should spend three days reading this bill, knowing how much it will cost before we vote on it. as we know, the republican plan is contrary to that. that's why you saw mitch mcconnell object. we know we expect that cbo score to come probably on monday. the timing is a little fluid. it could come earlier or later than that. not much later because mcconnell does plan to put it on the floor late next week. what we don't know is whether he's going to proceed with that if in fact it becomes clear there are not 50 votes to pass this bill. there's a suggestion he may do
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it any way and put people on the spot and say you voted or you didn't to repeal and replace obamacare. of course, this major promise, but one thing i want to underscore that's very different about this than when we saw democrats pass the affordable care act, even from the process in the house. they did have a handful of hearings and speaker paul ryan spent a great deal of capital trying to sell the bill. there was press conference after press conference, speech after speech on the floor defending what is going on. you're not seeing any of that from republicans today. we're not showing you a press conference of republican leaders gathered around to celebrate something, you would think if this is their significant campaign promise and achievement that we might be hearing more of that. we are hearing them speak some publicly about the dangers of theffordable care act, the way it's collapsing and changing, et cetera. is is so dferent to have senators running from the cameras when we're trying to ask them, do you support this or
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not? instead of having them come and say, we're behind this and here's why. i think that tells you a lot about where this process is. mitch mcconnell, does want to do something but he also really wants to be done with this. he knows there's a lot of peril around this. he watched what happened in the house where it was litigated publicly, huge speaker for paul ryan and i think we are going to learn over the course of the weekend what is the fate of this bill going to be? you're having republican members that will go home to their districts and spend the weekend talking to people. you'll get those slings and arrows thrown at this bill. this is senator rich walking by the cameras -- >> we're going to leave it there. keep your sneakers on and laces tied. anybody walking by, if they don do want to comment, we want to get that on air. we'll bring our panel in to break it down. >> kasie, just interrupt and
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tell our control room if you have somebody there. michael, you wrote an open-ed in the new york times talking about how medicaid is a good place to go if you're insistent on eliminating obamacare, medicaid could pick up a lot of this. we just heard chuck schumer saying medicaid under this bill continues to get hit. >> absolutely. let's remember two things. let's remember the context here. a few weeks ago the house passes a bill and cbo says it will cut 23 million off insurance. there's a significant backlash whathe senate is trying to do now, o the one hand come up with a pie of legislation that is not quote/unquote mean as the house bill to use trump's term but not lose conservative votes. >> which is obviously tricky. you have two very different factions as well as a president who offered a lot to the american people. >> what they do in the legislation as i've quik quickly taken a look at. on the one hand they say already
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this was not going to be as mean, we'll phase out more slowly the elimination of the medicaid expansion and we'll have income based tax subsidies, not age based. >> so you don't get penalized for being old. >> there's an argument that the senator is saying let's try to have somewhat more generous subsidies and longer phaseout of medicaid. on other hand, some of the down the line cut backs in federal funding for medicaid are much more restrictive under the senate bill. >> doesn't that timing look highly political. if you're looking to make massive cuts and we're not going to do it in four years but in six, doesn't that point directly at those who need to get re-elected. let me make sure i get re-elected before my constituents get hit with health care. >> there's concern about a backlash. the more you phase things out, the less the immediate response against you but more you see the benefit down the line. in response to your question about the medicaid buy-in versus
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exchanges. one of the most controversial elements, might get a piece of legislation passed is they've been able to make the argument that the exchanges, this vehicle through which folks are act to buy private healt insurance, subsidized private health insurance, they are exploding -- >> diminishing, death spiral. >> they are going to come in and rescue it. what i argued in that piece, number one, those changes cover about 10 or 11 million americans. you've got a medicaid program that covers 75 million americans. we can debate whether the trump administration and hhs should be doing more to help the exchanges survive. you can clearly have that debate. i think the insurance companies worry about risk and want the cautionary subsidies. on the other hand, if you have a program like medicaid with 75 million people in it, letting
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those -- >> hoeld that thought. there's protesters being removed outside of mitch mcconnell's office. many are in wheelchairs and referring to medicaid. they are representing themselves as medicaid recipients. >> millions of children whose care is under medicaid and women who have baby under that and senior citizens. people's understanding of what medicaid is and who it provides care to gets confused like in the outline to simply defund planned parenthood, there's a lack of understanding with what planned parenthood does and who it takes care of. people are quick to market off and say that's about abortions. it's a lot more than that. women's health, that's their primary caregiver. when you think of your primary caregiver, i think of the general practitioner, it's their gin any kol gift, to lose planned parenthood affects millions of amerans, not a
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conversation about pro-choice and pro-fe. >> i couldn't agree more. >> medicaid is the safety net health insurance company for 75 million americans right now. >> that's going to have an impact. the cbo said the house bill would cut 14 million people off. those are real people and many of them have preexisting conditions and many we might see on the screen. >> let's listen in to this protest outside mitch mcconnell's office for a minute. [ chanting ] >> no cuts to medicaid! no cuts to medicaid! >> can't make out the chanting but it does look like one by one you can see here security trying to remove these protesters --
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there you go, here's somebody being carried out. >> oh, my goodness. >> you know, i think this is pretty dramatic footage here on capitol hill. there's been a lot of talk about this being a secret legislative process and it has certainly been less secret than the passage of obamace that had 25 plus hearings and 30 days of debate on floor. what's not secret is people speaking and protesting and apparently protesting in some violation -- clearly the capitol police finding reason to remove them. there are rules that govern the public spaces on the hill. there isn't a secret. people around the country can watch this and watch this part of the debate. you were pointing out signs that say medicaid and we were discussing that in the bill. we know what a bill is called has a great impact on its popularity and whether it passes, there's a reason they call it the patriot act or freedom act.
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this debate over what this bill is called and what's in it is still going. is it trump care, obamacare repeal or the doctor was explaining something much broader. what we're seeing here as we continue to digest the legislative language, it is a drastic cut to medicaid as it currently operates and through the budget reconciliation process a reformatting of aspects of the aca. medicaid is how about half of the total number of babies are delivered every year in america. medicaid is about two-thirds of what seniors in nursing homes are covered by. you're talking about 7 0e-year-olds near the end of life and one day olds -- >> 40% of children. >> conservatives say some of these programs are too expensive and they have a debate over at. i would note this is broader than obamacare and that will be where the debate goes. >> let's listen in to paul ryan.
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>> we saw the waiting list and the scandals, things clearly need to change at the veterans administration and this bill is going to help deliver the kind of fundamental reform that is needed to solve those problems. it will help veterans get the world class care and treatment they deserve and that they have earned. we still have a lot of work to do but bewe're going to keep at until we can say we're really and honestly keeping our promises we have made to our veterans and later today, today we expect a big bipartisan vote for glenn thompson's bill to improve career and technical education. this initiative is going to make it easier for people to get the skills they need to feel better higher quality, higher paying jobs. a good technical skills job can mean everything. it can be the foundation of a successful career and great future. i see this everywhere i look in my own home state of wisconsin. this bill can make a real difference for american workers. so bottom line, every day here
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we're working to address the problems that people face in their daily lives. these are just two more examples of us coming together and delivering on our agenda. questions? i've been briefed on senate version. >> can you give us your reaction? >> look, believe me, i know how hard this process is from personal experience, from what i understand, their bill tracks in many ways in longs of the line of the house bill, that's very good. i'm not going to opine on their process. they gave us the space, the last thing i want to do is be disrespectful to their process. the bottom line is i want them to pass the bill so we can all get down with keeping our promise. you've got to mb, the system is collapsing, anthem
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blue cross pulled out of wisconsin, that's one of the flagship health insurers we've had for many many, many years, it's in a tail spin. i'm very happy that the senate has gone through the work of putting together a bill that keeps that promise and so yeah, i'm eager for them to pass it but not going to opine on the details as they go along. >> you talk about -- open, you were proud of that, are you comfort ablg -- >> you release legislation after you drafted legislation not while you draft regullegislatio this is a talking point in search of a problem. you write the bill, then you release the bill. that's what the senate has done. >> they want to vote next week, is that enough time for the american public to digest and debate it? >> do you think the increase in discretionary spending appropriation should be matched by spending cuts elsewhere?
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the budget? >> yeah, if you're asking for if we have a cap adjustment should we have offsets in mandatory, i think the answer is yes. the question is quality and quantity. because it tracks so closely with the house bill, do you anticipate that the house would take up the senate bill? >> it's premature to say -- we haven't made that decision yet, they are getting the process. can you address the blue slip problem? >>ow many of you know what the blue ship problem is? this is a technical issue but it's the constitution so we take that seriously. my understanding is ways and means is giving the technical assistance the senate needs to make sure they can form what the origination clause and blue slip.
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ed royce has indicated he's eager to move the bill. we need foreign affairs to do their scrub of the legislation. but chairman royce wants to get moving quickly. >> are they going to markup that bill or -- >> don't know the answer to that. we want to get moving on it but we've got to honor the blue slip, which is a constitutional original issue, this is why we asked ways and means to make sure they give secretary foreign relations the technical work they need to get this right. >> do you personally support -- >> i always support sanctions. i'll let foreign affairs do their scrub to make sure that the bill is written the right way and in good shape. ed wants to get moving and i support doing that. >> do president trump -- i apologize. >> who are you with? >> cns news. >> so president trump's 2018 budget calls for eliminating the
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federal funding for the corporation for public broadcasting. do you support that proposal and will you follow the funding elimination of the outlined in the president aetsz budget? >> i have to refer you to the appropriators, just getting started on bill. i don't get too deep in microdetails of that. >> thank you mr. speaker, a budget question for you. diane black, the budget chair woman is really supportive of these idea of doing $150 in mandatory cuts and some of the other airm not so comfortable with the idea coming up with those savings. i know you're still having your family discussions but how do you envision sort of going -- >> paul ryan quickly changing the subject and as important it is to talk about technical skills and tech jobs, that's certainly not what's in focus today. >> the senate just dropped 142-page on health care and this was paul ryan's thing. he's not speaking about it.
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he actually responded to a reporter by saying my staff has seen it, we're aware of it. >> paul ryan knew he was going to be speaking today right around now. he could have -- >> does this regularly, clearly, this isn't just what the reporters want to talk about. it's what america cares about. >> we have been talking about it, mike r michael has been studying this and studied obamacare very well and house replacement and now you've had a chance to dig into this one a little bit. your major impressions? >> the comment we heard before we went to congressman ryan was really important about how this bill is framed over the next week. the debalt is who gets to identify what the bill is about. on the one hand paul ryan when he talked about it a little. obamacare is exploding, et cetera, et cetera, we're saving the aca. on the other hand the democrats will argue and we'll have to see what the cbo says and interest
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groups say and publics say. this isn't about -- the medicaid expansion is doing fine in obamacare. this is about fundamentally destroying or at least adversely impacting seriously the medicaid program. we have to see how it's framed. >> the republicans want to push this this thing through asap. at the end of the day we know president trump has a strong base that seems to accept, forgive, support him no matter what. if so many trump supporters that were unhappy with the affordable care act and wanted something different. if they lose health care and if their health care is more expensive, isn't it going to be massively detrimental to republicans pushing that through? at this point the voters will say i need my health care. shouldn't that matter? >> it's a great question. a large percentage of the folks who might lose health insurance
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under the republican proposal voted for donald trump. the republicans are concerned about a potential backlash at the polls. that's why it's so important for them to frame this now as legislation that's fixing the aca and blaming anything that happens to people down the line as sort of cause by aca itself and obamacare. that framing debate -- as a political scientist, i could tell you that if the aca repeal happens, this would be the first time in american history that the federal government has taken a benefit like health insurance away from 23, 24 million americans. that is extraordinary. that is a reason why a lot of folks say it's not going to happen. on the other hand the republicans have been arguing for seven years, this is the worst bill since whatevernd we've got to get rid of it. >> ali, do american people care what it's called, if it's obamacare, trump care,
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affordable health act? i know when my kids get hurt i need an emergency room, i want to afford to go. >> people on our screen care what's going on. those are people who it appears are on medicaid. you're seeing their feet. a lot of people in wheelchairs and some have been carried out full body by capitol police. others are being wheeled out. obviously, they care, the issue is when you have complicated bills like this and speeches like the one from paul ryan where everybody is on fis indicating what's in here, there are a lot of people who will not have been able to dig into it and that is something we promise you here at msnbc we're going to do. >> let's bring in a doctor and democratic congressman from the state of california. mitch mcconnell said before democrats have been unwilling to work with republicans on this and republicans are saving america under failing obamacare. what do you say to that? >> i think that's a bunch of
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hogwash. there's two democratic doctors in congress. they know how to get in touch with me. and they are doing this in the dark of night, releasing this bill and trying to push it through. paul ryan is not being honest with the american public. stephanie, you were talking about families sitting around the kitchen table, worried about health care, when they get sick they want to see a doctor. affordable care is not perfect, let's make it better and make it more affordable but let's not take health care away from 24 million americans. we talk about families and one of the conversations we've been having has been about medicaid aechb the number of people who are covered by medicaid. i want to put the screen up here, 20% of all americans are covered by medicaid. to miker spierer's point, we talk about how the state exchanges are imploding and 39%
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of all children are covered and 49% as ari melber said of all births and 64% of nursing home residents are covered by medicaid. it has its problems but in fact in terms of a distribution of health care mechanism it's not bad. >> it's not. it's working for a lot of americans, particularly your oldest sickest americans, that need health care the most. the affordable care act is working in my home state of california. cover california cut the number of ininsured folks in half. it's working, take what we're doing in california and spread that across the countries let's get democrats and republicans working together on something that affects every american. without being tongue in cheek, truly, when you look at the republicans what they are trying to do with this bill, what do you believe the ultimate goal is in you have to get inside the mind of mitch mcconnell if you have a chance to work with him and something in the bill that
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you want. >> i think they are looking for a political victory. there's a reason why people hate washington, d.c. this is not the real world. it is not what is happening around the kitchen table. i want to get to that patient i'm seeing in the exam room and making sure they can get the coverage they need. >> what can you do to get there? with t exception of saying this doesn't work, don't do it, is there a solution? we have to be pragmatic. we don't have a choice. >> absolutely. what we ought to do is get the next 20 million in the health care system we know if someone gets sick, they are going to access coverage. why not get everyone covered and figure out the best way to afford and pay for that coverage. >> i want to ask about a point stephanie brought up. i'll ask the control room to put up this health insurance industry and how much they spent on lobbying.
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i think i had it a second ago, $78 million. >> $78 million. >> in the first quarter of this year. the insurance industry other than health care has spent $40 million in oil and gas $36 million. what are these people spending their money doing on capitol hill? why did this the health industry get meetings with the american public and diabetes association didn't and aarp didn't? >> that's a great question. the health care should be about the patient. taking care of americans, it shouldn't be for profit. it should be how do i as a doctor take care of the patient. >> in a perfect world. what are thet meeting about. >> they are going to offices like yours, maybe not you personally. what is that conversation? >> they are talking about how they maintain profits and how they are talking about how -- not talking about the patient sitting in front of the doctor
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and family sitting around the kitchen table. they are talking how they protect profits and we ought to all be angry about that. >> we're going to -- donald trump has made comments this morning. i don't know yet whether he commented on the health care bill. he did i'm being told by our control room. >> it was a speech that was actually making at the tech event but given the importance of today we're going to share that right now. president trump. >> how do you le the health care, folks? it going to be very good. >> little negotiation but it's going to be great. >> president trump being very brief, we already heard from the white house sort of saying the president really isn't involved with policy. he's made slight comments and needs more heart and more inclusive. but like you boys over there,
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you work on it and clearly today being rather brief. the one person whisper in his ear, the president as economic advicer has nothing to do with looking at the -- >> unlike what donald trump says where he opines on something, what do you think of the health care bill? he's in a listening mode, part of the problem here is the democrats need to -- and this is a question for you, the democrats -- republicans need to have a bill that does not have to get 60 votes. at the need a bill that needs to get 50 votes because they've only got three to spare at the moment. there are a lot of republicans who didn't like what was in the house bill so the senate bill has got to make a lot of people happy. >> we've heard about process as a reminder for people, there is generally the use of a super majority requirement that is historically been in the senate because of the use of the filibuster. this is not that. this is a use of a budget process where you only need 51 votes. the practical implication of that legislatively is there are things you can do around the math and money here that you
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can't to elsewhere. so you are seeing more focus on the money cuts and tax cuts we mentioned and lesson other things that would involve what we call substantive changnd you go to what's going to happen with the president. i young administration, and the question is -- >> hold on. it is a new administration. they're not young. >> well, you're right, you're right, stephanie, depends how diplomatic you want to be. it is a new administration. here we're looking at some of this ongoing dramatic -- >> pulling people out. these are protesters in front of senate majority leader mitch mcconnell's office, many in wheel chairs refusing to leave. capitol police are finding ways of escorting them out. many more people earlier and they have been doing this now for -- >> we have been seeing them clear this over time. here is another individual that does not look like she -- >> they're going to lift this person. >> they're lifting her back into potentially a chair or -- yep, into a chair there, and removing her from the hallways. and the capitol police, we have been reflecting recently on the brave work they do.
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and you thought about that horrific shooting, the capitol police are simply enforcing the rules about keeping hall i was cle ways clear, which is their job. but people who want to do civil disobedience and have their voices heard and upset about the content of the bill and the process, which has been so secretive -- >> having your voice heard is one thing. i like to read the bill. we just have gotten this bill. and this is supposed to be done by july 4th. in what world is this democracy? >> so i think briefly there is a question about legislative strategy. this is politics. lbj used to run the floor and say, you don't bring it to the floor until you have the votes and hold a quick vote and get out of town. i think both parties do this. i think it would be misleading to suggest that the republicans and the senate are the only ruling party to ever try to push along the process. >> take yourself to 2010 twitter and whether it is mike pence, mitch mcconnell, you know, pick your poison, the criticisms they have for the way democrats push
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through obamacare, you can see the same thing. obamacare was far more transparent. >> having said that, this is a critt sex y criticism you could apply to both parties in history. the numbers are fairly problematic for the republicans in the sense that there were over 20 public hearings of the original obamacare rule. that matters to more than politics. the second point i would make here, it looks, as we're watching this, it looks like they have gotten the hallways fairly clear, but there is a policy impact to that, you have public hearings, you let the stake holders and the experts weigh in. in the executive branch, that's an agency rule-making process. it is tightly regulated under agency law and provides opportunities to fix things and comment on things before they have the force of law. >> let's listen -- >> here you may not be getting that process. >> something is developing here. >> we still have the congressman
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with us? congressman, it would be great if you could weigh in on this. ari mentioned a few moments ago that mitch mcconnell only needs 51 votes, only needs 51 votes. given the special elections that took place this week, in south carolina, in georgia, they were very -- one could say it was an -- they were national votes, the candidate you saw, for example, in georgia, it was, like looking at president trump and hillary clinton all over again, especially with all the money that went to that state. so from your perspective, did democrats need to employ a different strategy because there is a lot of republicans who could have been sitting on the fence, whether to vote for this bill. but after president -- after we saw that election go down, and karen handel win, both president trump, his administration and other republicans feel really emboldened here. excuse me. we're going to casey hunt with rand paul. >> we'll have a statement in about an hour. and my concern at this point from what i've been able to see so far is it looks like we're
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keeping obamacare, not repealing it. >> are you a no then? >> we're going to have a statement in about an hour. >> is that going to be with you and others? is that enough to kill this bill? >> we'll see in about an hour. >> thank you, sir. >> sounds like a no. >> they don't have a lot of nos to go around. michael speakerry, what have you been seeing? >> this is an extraordinarily interesting process. you'll point out, you pointed out all the hundred that the insurance industry poured into lobbying. what is not clear is they had much of an impact either. one thing amazing here is this small group of republican senators has been drafting this bill, that's been opposed by almost -- not only by seconds of the public. the house bill and senate bill have extraordinarily low polling rates. that's amazing. but they also have been opposed by almost every interest group, the doctors, the cancer societies, et cetera, also the insurance industry, the pharmaceutical industry, almost universal opposition here and
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what is amazing is that even despite that, the republicans have come out with a bill i think fundamentally changes the way health car could work in the united states. >> i think senator rand paul made some news here on velshi and ruhle. he just told casey hunt on camera, his first comment since this bill was dropped that senator rand paul, this does not look like obamacare repeal. that's an indicator from a conservative libertarian senator of the argument for conservatives against the bill. which is it doesn't do enough and doesn't deal with repealing obamacare in a responsible way. and what is interesting is that overlaps with some of the legislative factual analysis we have been doing in our hour discussing how if anything this bill is more focused on i think tax cuts and a widespread medicaid repeal than it is on some of the owe kacaobama care provisions, though it does both. so this doesn't look like obamacare repeal. >> to ari's point, the bill, we're calling it -- they're
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calling it the better care reconciliation act. the official name of the bill is elimination of limitation on recapture of excess advance payments of premium tax credits. this is a financial bill, that's how it has been -- >> can you say that one more time? >> elimination of limitation on recapture of excess advance payments of premium tax credits. that is the name of the senate health care bill, which should be very telling to all. as you said, this is a financial bill, it is a tax bill, it is a tax credit bill, and it is not being done the way you were involved in obamacare. >> what is it motivated by? >> what is it motivated by? >> it is motivated by a seven, eight year republican sort of platform of we got to get rid of the aca, we got to get rid of this legacy of president obama, and i think it is also motivated somewhat by a philosophical debate over the role of government, the perception among trump voters and others that government is out of control, this is a big government bill,
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and that somehow or another this is going to -- >> well, philosophical debate, that is -- that's rand paul to a t. >> rand paul what is interesting about the senate bill, senate proposa proposal, what you read over the last week or two is that rand paul was probably going to be a no -- >> very little he could do. >> what the senate is trying to do here i think is appeal more to the moderates right now. trying to keep -- see if they can get colin, murkowski, they got the planned parenthood problem. >> they can get some moderates, a better chance of possibly getting any possible democrat, they have no chance of getting a democrat if they go the way o rand paul. >> to your point about planned parenthood, if you want them, collins, murkowskis, women look at planned parenthood differently. we have framed this whole thing as planned parenthood being an abortion factory. but in fact, for many women, it is primary health care. you made this point for -- >> for millions of women, it is their primary health care. we like -- people like to give the quick and dirty, planned
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parenthood stands for abortion, it doesn't. it stands for women's basic health. women think of basic health, that's the doctor they consider. my husband can tell you everything he knows about his cholesterol, about his heart rate, he knows all those things. when he gets the flu, he has a doctor to call. women, it is their obgyn. to say we're going to defund planned parenthood, that's millions of americans. >> -- in the republican primary -- >> donald trump. >> donald trump made that point. he said, i don't like the abortion part, but planned parenthood serves a lot of women and basic health needs. he actually said that. he seems to -- >> he also said i'm going to have a program that provides health insurance to every american. >> think about this -- >> not going to die on my watch. >> teenagers in europe and the united states, data tells you, have the same sexual habits. now, the care they're given, what they're provided in europe is significantly more than we have here. and teen pregnancies are three times the amount here than they are in europe. so it is about education and
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prevention, simply isn't, well, planned parenthood is where you head over for abortion. as soon as we get our head around what it actually is -- >> while stephanie is lking, this is what planned parenthood does. i want to skip over the abortion for a second so you can concentrate on the other things. educational programs and men's health services, abortion is one of the things planned parenthood does. >> you want to wipe out cervical cancer? the best chance you have is if women can consistently get health care. and to simply say we're going to get rid of it is extraordinary. >> we are going to spend the rest of the day on this channel going through -- >> the day? i love that ali thinks -- >> we have to have this passed by july 4th. we're going to be studying this, talking to people all day. thank you to all our guests and contributors and casey hunt and ari melber and michael sperry,
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thank you for watching this hour of msnbc live. >> i'm ali velshi. >> and i'm stephanie ruhle. now to washington, d.c. for "andrea mitchell reports". >> the big reveal, people in wheelchairs saying they rely on medicaid being hauled from a protest outside mitch mcconnell's office moments after mcconnell's see celt healcret h bill is revealed. >> the president said the senate bill needed heart. the way this bill cuts health care is heartless. the president said the house bill was mean. the senate bill may be meaner. >> obamacare is a disaster. it is dead. totally dead and we're putting in a plan today that is going to be negotiated. we would love to have some demoatsupport, but they're structionists, we won't get support, we won't get one no matter how good


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