tv MSNBC Live With Velshi and Ruhle MSNBC September 5, 2017 8:00am-9:00am PDT
>> it's the latest edition of the gop's daunting to do list -- >> when i was in congress, a plate this big in this consequential -- >> the trump administration is warning kim jong-un that enough is enough. >> the possibility of war hangs in the balance. >> south korea carrying out live fire exercises for a second straight day. >> one of north korea's principal aims is to split the united states from south korea. >> stevemunchin said he's drafting the new sanction package. >> russia's president put frn issuing a stark warning. north korea would rather eat grass than abandon its nuclear program. >> truth is they are now a nuclear state. >> we have a lot of breaking news, you're looking at rallies the top two squares on the top of your screen are rallies in new york. the bottom two are washington. in front of the white house, there are hundreds now rallying to save the dreamers.
>> attorney general jeff sessions is moments from announcing that big decision on the dreamers program commonly known as d.aca, those rallies ae being held in support of the program. nikki haley will speak live in d.c. in light of the crisis building in north korea. get your head around all of the news crossing. more breaking news the forecast of course on hurricane irma. exploded to a category 5. that's the highest status, officially calling it potential catastrophe. right now the storm is a little more than 200 miles from the caribbean. the center of irma will pass north of puerto rico tomorrow into thursday. puerto rico is already in financial distress. think of the pressure and panic they are feeling. >> 200 miles east, it is headed west at 14 miles an hour. we've just got new information that is a category 5, not just a category 5, but sustained winds
of 180 miles per hour. look at that thing go. >> when you look at the map, cuba and hispaniola is just the northern part of haiti. they are still recovering from the cholera outbreak that happened last year after a storm. >> the most models showing the eye of the storm will pass between florida and cuba but south florida is within the cone of concern. meaning the storm could make landfall anywhere in that area that includes miami ft. lauderdale and palm beach and florida keys. right now sustained winds are topping 180 miles per hour with even higher gusts. we're going to have a full forecast and the latest from puerto rico's governor who is joining us coming up. >> also now, breaking news, we're awaiting attorney general jeff sessions, let's listen in right now. >> to announce that the program known as daca that was effect waited under the obama administration is being
rescinded. the daca program was implemented in 2012 and essentially provided a legal status for recipients for a renewable two-year term, work authorization and other benefits including participation in the social security program, to 800,000 mostly adult illegal aliens. the policy was implemented unilaterally, to great controversy and legal concern on numerous occasions to this same group of illegal aliens. in other words, the executive branch, through daca deliberately sought to achieve what the legislative branch specifically refused to authorize on multiple occasions, such an open ended sir couple vengs was an unconstitutional
exercise of authority by the executive branch. this a.mnesty among others, tha yielded terrible humanitarian consequences. it also denied jobs to hundreds of thousands of americans by allowing those same illegal aliens to take those jobs. we inherited from other founders and have advanced an unsurpassed legal heritage. as attorney general, it is my duty to ensure that the laws of the united states are enforced and that the constitutional order is upheld. no greater good for the overall health and well being of our republic and preserving and strengthening the impartial rule of law, decided whether the rule of law is treasured or society that tends to flourish and
succeed. society for the rule of law is subject to political whims and personal biases, tend to become society's afflicted by corruption and poverty and human suffering. to have a lawful system of immigration that serves the national interest, we cannot admit everyone who would like to come here. it's just that simple. there's an open -- that would be an open border's policy and the american people have rightly rejected that. therefore the nation must enforce a limit on how many immigrants we admit each year and that means all cannot be accepted. this does not mean there are bad people and the nation disrespects or demeans them in any way, it means we are properly enforcing our laws as congress has passed them. it is with these principles in
light of litigation that we reviewed the obama administration's daca policy. our collective wisdom is that the policy is vulnerable to the same legal and constitutional challenges that the courts recognize with respect to the dapa program, enjoyed on a nationwide basis in a decision that was affirmed by the fifth circuit corporate of appeals. this fifth circuit specifically concluded that daca had not been implemented in a fashion that allowed sufficient discretion and that dapa was for closed by congress's careful plan, close quote. in other words, the immigration law that congress passed foreclosed this possibility of daca. in other words, it was inconsistent with the constitutional separation of powers. that decision was affirmed by the supreme court on an equally undivided basis.
if we were to keep the obama administration's executive a. amnesty policy, likeliest outcome is that it too would be enjoyed just as was dapa. the department of justice has advised the president and the department of homeland security that the department of homeland security should be begin an orderly lawful wind down, including the cancellation of the memo that authorized this program. acting secretary duke has chosen appropriately to initiate a wind down process. this will enable the department of homeland security to conduct an orderly change and fulfill the desire of this administration to create a time period for congress to act should it so choose. we firmly believe this is the responsible path. simply put, if we are to further our goal of strengthening the
constitutional order and the rule of law in america, the department of justice cannot defend this overreach. george washington university law professor, jonathan turley in testimony before the house judiciary in the was clear about the enormous constitutional infirmties raised by this action. he said quote, in his testimony in ordering this blanket exception, president obama was nullifying part of a law that he simply disagreed with. if a president can claim sweeping discretion to suspend key federal laws, the entire legislative process becomes a little more than a pretense. the sir couple vengs of the legislative process, not only undermines the authority of this branch, he's referring to the legislative branch, but destabilizes the tri parttide
system as a whole. this is not a little matter. ending the previous administration's disrespect for the legislative process is an important first step. all immigration policies should serve the interest of the people of the united states, lawful immigrant and native born alike. congress should carefully and thoughtfully pursue the types of reforms that are right for the american people. our nation is comprised of good and decent people who want their government leaders to fulfill their promises and advance an immigration policy that serves the national interest. we are people of compassion and we are people of law. but there's nothing compassionate about the failure to enforce immigration laws. enforcing the law saves lives, protects communities and taxpayers and prevents human suffering. failure to enforce the laws in
the past has put our nation at risk of crime, violence and terrorism. the compassionate thing to do is end of lawlessness, enforce our laws and in congress chooses to make changes to those laws, to do so through the process set forth by our founders. in a way that advances the interest of the american people, that is what the president had promised to do and has delivered to the american people. under president trump's leadership, this administration has made great progress in the last few months toward establishing a lawful and constitutional immigration system. this makes us safer and more secure. it will further economically the lives of millions who are struggling and enable our country to more effectively teach new immigrants about our
system of government and to assimilate them to the cultural understandings that support it. the substantial progress in reducing illegal immigration and our border seen in recent months is almost entirely due to the leadership of president trump and his inspired immigration officers. but the problem is not yet solved. and without move action, we could see illegality rise again rather than be eliminated. as a candidate and now in office, president trump has offered specific ideas and legislative solutions that will protect american workers and increase wages in salaries and defend the national security and ensure the public safety and increase the general well being of the american people. he has worked closely with many members of congress, including
the introduction of the raise act which would produce enormous benefits to our country. this is how our democratic process works. there are many pow irful interest groups in the country and every one has a constitutional right to advocate their views and represent whomever they choose. but the department of justice does not represent any narrow interest or any subset of the american people. we represent all of the american people and protect the integrity of our constitution. that is our charge. we at the department of justice are proud and honored to work to advance this vision for america and to do our best each day to ensure the safety and security of the american people. thank you very much. >> you use the personal information of daca recipients -- >> attorney general -- >> that was attorney general
jeff sessions announcing that daca will end in six months, congress has six months in which to come up with some sort of alternative. the argument here is that it was done illegally as a memo by president obama when it is in the purview of congress to offer legislati legislation. can i show you a little bit about daca -- >> during the six month period they need to figure out what too do with existing participants. >> there a800,000 of them. this was created by president obama on june 5th, 2012 when congress was not able to come up with a viable plan for these people who had come to america as children. it's got about 800,000 people that are young documented immigrants. they are brought to the u.s. by their parents as children. there are certain rules you had to comply with to be part of daca. you have to have arrived in the united states before the age of 16. you must have lived in the united states since june 15th, 2007 and couldn't have been older than 30 when the program
began in 2012, which means you might be up to 36 right now. and your deferral from deportation last two years, you can apply for renewal as long as you absolutely did not commitny crimes during that period and generally speaking you have to be in school or working or in the military. here's where they mostly live. colorado has the largest proportion in the united states and population of dreamers, 223,000. texas has 221,000. we'll talk about that later this hour. florida, 33, arizona, 28 and north carolina 27, georgia 24 and new jersey 22. here's what they are. i think this part is really important, because of the conditions of daca, you have to be working or in school. 95% are working or in school. that's a much higher proportion than the general population. >> you're exactly the kind of immigrants one would be looking
for. >> they were able to get better paying jobs than they were in and some bought the first car and better job with better working conditions and some bought their first home. the point is you know who they are, if they commit a crime they have to leave. they pay taxes but don't -- can't claim government benefits. it's -- the argument about the legality is a separate one and important one. the argument about the economy, which so many people have made they are a drain on the economy, that becomes harder to prove. >> california is the seventh largest economy in the world, okay? >> california has more daca participants than any other state. the impact on gdp would be in the billions. let's bring in a white house correspondent kristen welker in the room with attorney general jeff sessions. you know, it seems that from what we understand the president's own staff was divided on the dreamers program but for jeff sessions, this is his brand and exactly what he wants. >> reporter: absolutely. you heard the attorney general
layout the legal argument for this. he didn't get into the politics, what you guys were just talking about, the very thorny difficult issue of rescinding daca. what we heard from the attorney general was a legal defense of this decision and he said of course the administration is going to delay any action for six months giving congress time to come up with a fix. the administration deeply divided. the president himself was deeply divided because this is a difficult issue. you have a fierce backlash mounting from those on the left and right. those on the left say this is unfairly treating model immigrants, what you're just mapping out. these are folks who are young and getting educated and tr contributing to the economy. on the other hand you have the far right base saying he ran on a campaign pledge to end daca immediately. they say this doesn't go far enough. they are accusing the president of effectively kicking the can down the road and they are
gearing up for a very fierce battle in the fall with congress. bottom line though, throughout d.c. earn really across the country today, you're going to see how politically complicated this is because you have protesters gathering. they are gathering outside the wousz in los angeles and other major cities. >> thanks very much for that. kristen welker at the justice department. >> let's bring in gregory chen, director of government relations for the american immigration lawyers association and jared bernstein, chief economist for biden and served as head of the civil rights division. jared, let's start with you, president trump who touts himself a pro business president, a job creator, has got to answer to warren buffett, mary barra and 300 other business leaders urging the president not to do this. why? this isn't just a social issue for them. this is about business. there's a real economic impact.
>> you're absolutely right. i'll get into the analysis in a second. first i have to say this, what we just heard from jeff sessions was one of the most shameless presentations i've heard and that's saying a lot these days. and some of what he said on the economy as you suggested veered from misleading into lie. and i'll be specific. but if you can zoom in on the statue of liberty right now, i would suspect she would be shedding a tear. this is a dark day for our country. look, when it comes to jobs, sessions just asserted that the dreamers, daca recipients are taking jobs from native born workers, there's zero evidence for that. completely unsubstantiated and in fact not the case based on the numbers that ali was citing, the fact these folks have been here since they were kids and many in the labor market. over 90% -- about 95 working or in school. he mentioned they were a drain on social security.
the social security act wearies have told us in fact the opposite is the case, same with cbo's budgetary analysis, daca recipients seem to contribute more in revenues than they cost in spending. these are folks who disproportionately spend taxes and start businesses and this is a really a kicking in the own goal when it comes to helping the economy. >> let me ask you something, on the left you're seeing dnc chair tom perez outside of the white house leading a protest. work through this with me, this is some of the criticism that the administration has had. number one, that this wasn't president obama's job to do, that immigration is the purview of congress and congress should have done it, that they are facing legal challenges from a number of states so something would have likely happened. congress should actually be the ones to fix this. on the face of it, are those criticisms fair? >> i think that that he saw jeff
sessions make a deeply political appeal being sanitized in legal arguments. i don't buy it for one second. the daca program has been in existence for five years. it's been a very successful program. and it's entrepreneurs and university graduates, folks who are really contributing to the economy have come out and are part of this program. and what jeff sessions is doing is hiding behind legal arguments. this program has withstood all prior legal challenges to date. to suddenly introduce this sanitized legal picture, there's a real reason why the trump administration put jeff sessions up with the department of justice's emblem behind it. don't question for a second this attorney general and steven miller on his staff and steven bannon with him president has been talking throughout last week had an anti-immigrant agenda that has -- what they've been doing. >> put their agenda aside. do they have a legally do they
have an argument to make here? >> look, they are preempting a decision, the justice department before defended the daca program and absolutely could have here. this is a question of prosecutorial discretion, even defending the muslim ban, executive authority over immigration policies. and so they absolutely could have and should have defended the daca program. and they are being bullied by states attorney general. this was entirely a creation of the trump administration, this crisis. they did not have to be -- put themselves into the situation and now congress needs to act. they should not wait for six months. there are 800,000 people's lives at risk and congress should pass the dream act. the concern now is that the trump administration is going to try to use the dreamers as bargaining chips to try to say that congress won't enact or shouldn't enact daca legislation to protect the 800,000 without funding the border wall. there's a deeply anti-i am
grantd agenda, that is the same of those of the white pr supremacists of those marching in charlottesville. >> we've had a lot of conversations with a lot of people who claim to be representing the administration's perspective here and they are talking about get rid of these people and you even heard it in jeff sessions comments, it's hurting american jobs. one of the interesting things that has come out of this announcement is that they are talking about a six-month delay asking congress to do something. and the suggestion is that the administration priorities in which they said they are getting rid of bad hombres and gang members, that's the priority. >> those aren't the participants. >> my point is for people who are participants in daca, those 800,000 people, you deal with this as immigration law. what should they be thinking right now? should they be worried they have just moved up the list in terms of potential deportees? >> thank you for having me on the show.
the truth here is that the 800,000 daca recipients are very much at risk now. they have actually already been at risk during the past several months of the trump administration and he has deported people who have received daca participation. these are dreamers. one important point i want to point out on the legality issue, that past presidents, eisenhower, president reagan, bush senior, all used the same kind of authority deferred action, for this president and attorney general sessions now to say this is an unconstitutional act, that is preempting congress, that is just not accurate as a matter of historical fact and it's been done by both parties, democratic and republican administrations. but back here to your broader point. we're talking about a question of compassion, the attorney general used the same word and what is happening with the lives of those 800,000 people? what this their answer here? they don't have a solution and they are effectively kicking the political football down the field saying congress needs to
take responsibility and it's true. congress does need to act. it's not going to be that difficult of a thing to pass. we have both republican and democratic members in both the senate and house that have sponsored legislation to provide permanent residence for the dreamer population. that's exactly what americans want. if you look at the polls overwhelmingly americans understand that the dreamers are people who have come to the country through no fault of their own as young people and they have contributed in meaningful ways across the country and also economically as we heard before. so this is a very compelling population and has contributed to our country and using the enforcement mechanism against them now is not the right way to go. congress should pass legislation, a clean bill that allows for these young people to get legal status, they shouldn't be looking at other types of deals to add to it. that's playing footbapolitical
football with the lives of these young people. >> we do that. we play political football but with hurricane rescue, it would be nice if every bill were just a clean bill. >> political football politics. >> that's what it is. >> one thing about the politics, i think what it's going to take for congress to -- i think what it's going to take for congress to fulfill greg's optimistic protection there, i hope he's right, legislative functionality and courage and i have to say, those are two characteristics i haven't associated with this congress for a while. >> we'll see. we'll try to be optimists. thank you all. joining us now live, attorney general for the state of new mexico, a democrat, one of the 20 state attorney generals who sent a letter to president trump in july urging him to keep the dreamers program. sir, there's more than 8,000 dreamers recipients, daca recipients in new mexico. what's going to happen to them? clearly they are in panic but is
there legal action for you to take? >> well, i can tell you being a law enforcement officer on a border state, coming from a state that invented the atomic bomb, this is really a black eye, jeff sessions speech currently as stated is something that will threaten our national security. these dreamers contributed to our local economy but more importantly, rather than president showing some real leadership, he's choosing not to defend those who are now teachers and law enforcement agents and military personnel, i'm optimistic the congress will weigh in but truth be told this is a black eye for this country. >> attorney general, i'm trying to get to the bottom, if you're a dreamer, what you're thinking about today. this administration continues to say even though some of it -- surrogates on our air say otherwise, it is only targeting at the moment undocumented immigrants who have committed crimes other than the crime of
being undocumented, gang members, drug dealers, bad hombres, does anything as far as you know change as a result of this? in other words, daca was never amnesty, even though i think i heard jeff sessions use that term during his speech, it was never amnesty, renewable avoidance of deportation. do you think anything changes for dreamers right now? >> well, i believe is that the legal fight has only begun. there are many state attorneys general that will defend the dreamers and believe this is a constitutional program. look, these are americans who are just as american as melania trump. brought here as children, passed background checks and not only do they check in with homeland security, these are now functional members of our states who cooperate with local law enforcement and simply are living the american dream. they are teachers, law enforcement agents and members of the military. they deserve constitutional protections and i believe you'll
have many states attorney general defend the health safety and welfare of the individuals within our border. >> as concerning as this is for you, as devastating as it is for participants in the daca dreamers program, do you really think it's going to come to fruition? the president is actually doing is punting this to congress saying work it out. we know the homework list from the president is massive at this point. whether it's tax reform the debt ceiling, funding harvey relief and now health care and now he's putting the dreamers program on their plate. is this something you actually think six months from now is going to be a real problem or is this just part of a narrative that the president could be creating to say blame them not me? it was just a few weeks ago we thought we were not going to see the transgender ban and general mattis said hold your horses. >> traditionally washington has always played politics and president is punting, there absolutely is a real public safety urgency within our border
states. you have dreamers now that are fearful because we've created a set of rules where they've come out of the shadows and we've already invested millions and millions -- if not billions of dollars in their education, in their employment security. and now we're simply willing to put them on the unemployment roles, deport them and i believe it's created a public safety crisis. i don't believe at this point that we -- that communities are going to sit idle and let washington play politics. we have first responders who are dreamers saving lives in houston right now as we speak. this is an unfortunate black eye where their political delay created a sense of urgency for families who i believe are as american as melania trump and are contributing to the national security of our country. north korea, china would love to know we're kicking out the best of our best after we invested in them.
it's a public safety crisis and i'm hopeful that washington and the president will quit playing politics and put our national security first. >> thank you so much for your thoughts and time this morning. new mexico state attorney general hector muldares, there was a first responder dreamer who lost his life this weekend, trying to rescue people on a boat and it cap sized. >> these people are in our military. there's a compassionate side to this thing. i really understand the legal argument and those who say that this wasn't perhaps done the right way and i hope you're right when you say you're optimistic that congress might take it on. under normal circumstance they have six months to fix this, they'll do. this is this congress that doesn't tend to get its head around things. >> the president is putting them yet again another massively difficult position. >> let's bring in jacob sodoroff, with pablo, a student at cal state fuller ton.
>> reporter: hey, i just heard you talking about dreamers are in our military, in our businesses. they are also in our colleges and universities, pablo garcia goes here, there are 4,000 students here, 900 students here are dreamers, undocumented immigrants. pablo, we were watching this announcement together in the dreamers resource center, they have a center for the dreamers, six months until daca is over. we're walking to buyology class right now, what's going through your head. >> so many lives are on the line. we're not going to again on it, we're going to find ways to survive and make it happen and make it -- make our goals and dreams happen. >> you don't have a choice, right, you've lived in the united states your entire life. i was here this past friday with you when we heard that president trump attorney general sessions was going to make this announcement. and you were saying this is our day to day life. this is what we do every single
day. you're literally walking to buyology class right now but you're faced with the idea of being deported to a country that you never known. you've never lived there. you've lived in the united states your entire life since you were 5 years old. how do you process the idea of leaving here and having to one day go there? maybe within six months from now. >> it's heartbreaking that i could be deported any time any time within six months or after the six months, it's unknown. this unknown is -- it's shocking. >> when you were standing there today and we were looking at the screen together watching jeff sessions talk about the fact that you for all intents and purposes, you're the same as me. grew up in southern california. your family is in southern california, you go to school in southern california. all of the things are the same. you're the one now that's facing deportation. when you're watching the attorney general of the united states say that, essentially about you, and 800,000 other people, what do you think?
>> it's just -- it doesn't fit in my mind, a piece of paper that determines whether we're americans or citizens or not. it shouldn't be that way. don't have a -- don't have words for it. wish there would not be so much political and be living more seeing humans -- human beings and not just seeing them on a piece of paper. >> well, we're going to keep in touch. ali and steph, we're going to continue to follow this here. there are people getting together in downtown los angeles to protest what we heard out of washington, d.c. pablo, thank you very much and throw it back to you guys. >> we appreciate you bringing us the face of these young people. i want to just tell you there have been a lot of tweets and messages from members of congress who despite our x skepticism are saying we'll get this done. john mccain said he believes they should not be forced to return to a country they do not know. while i disagree with president
obama's unilateral action on this issue, i believe rescinding daca at this time is an acceptable reversal of the promises and opportunities conferred to these individuals. >> that's the thing, think about the trust factor, all of these individuals and thousands had in the u.s. government, the government said -- >> they went forth and registered. >> the government said come out from under the shadows. they registered. they are paying taxes. they are living and working in public and now this. >> now they are on a list. >> this is extraordinary. think about a college student, just said the first thing said to jacob, we'll find a way to survive. >> on his way to class. >> you have two kids in college, i'm pretty sure they are not thinking they are on their way to class. >> they have enough problems and deportation is not one of them. it's a tough situation. we'll stay on top of it and more breaking news right now, the national hurricane center warns hurricane irma is potentially catastrophic. it is a category 5 hurricane. it's now over water and
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welcome back. we have breaking news at this hour. hurricane irma strengthening to a devastating category 5 storm. the national hurricane center now warning of potentially catastrophic effects. >> this is a big storm. it's over the water which means it could even gain strength from here. it's packing 180 miles per hour, those are the winds in it with a life threatening storm surge. millions are on alert with states of emergency in effect from the caribbean to florida. satellite images shot early this morning showing the size of the storm from above, several major airlines are canceling flights and waving rebooking fees. >> steve sos na from our nbc station in new york has the latest on irma's path. break down the next 24 hours. >> this is a complicated storm and have a lot of issues as we go along. the here and now is that we have a category 5 storm. and the strongest atlantic
hurricane that we've ever seen. their records go way back, strongest hurricane we've ever seen in the atlantic basin. let's show you how impressive this storm is. this comes from our satellite that we launched into space back in november. and it grabs images every single minute. we're sampling the storm constantly and look how impressive this storm is. hurricane force winds earlier this morning extended 45 miles outwide from the center. now they are 60 miles. the tropical storm force winds extend 160 miles per hour. it's not just a point with this storm, it's an area, huge area that has to deal with the hurricane force winds and storm surge and of course the battering waves. the latest stats, 180-mile-per-hour winds, again, never seen in the atlantic ocean before, it's been seefrn in the caribbean sea and parts of mexico but never in the atlantic. it is chugging west at 14 miles per hour. here's the projected path. you can see as a category 5
storm coming into areas like antiggua and angill la, north part of puerto rico and continues as a 5 or strong 4 will fluctuate in between a 4 and 5 for the next couple of days and takes a turn towards southern florida. that would happen by friday night, saturday into sunday. some of the tropical storm force winds could arrive in south florida as early as the time friday evening into friday night. again, this is the projected path we're looking at. all models have begun to consolidate here. they are in a straight line of the earlier on they were curving out to sea, now we're seeing more consensus here that this will be the path. so the only hope right now would be if the hurricane traveled over part of the island of cuba. it's very mountainous there. that could help tear up the center of the storm. this is very warm water and not a track we want to see. >> all right, steve, very warm water. we know that was a recipe for
disaster when it comes to harvey. just think about this, purtd rico is battling towards purt reek tosh rico and 500 emergency centers open. what stuck out to me, the governor said there's 15 million set aside for emergency run, $15 million in the scope, think what we're seeing in harvey, is nothing. puerto rico is an island under financial distregs. i spoke to one of the largest real estate developers in puerto rico last night who said we're worried about this nationalist thread that goes through the white house that steven bannon and miller flavor, cwhat could happen if a place like puerto rico needs real relief and we have an administration that says puerto rico who? >> that is a massive problem we're looking at. it's going to barrel down on puerto rico by tomorrow. so that's going to be something we're going to be keeping very close look at. >> we know already tomorrow congress is going to be voting
on hurricane harvey relief in the billions. imagine if that's added on a week from now when places like puerto rico and haiti get a storm like this. >> we've got d.r.e.a.m.ers and hurricane irma. north korea tested an h bomb and can now hit the u.s. mainland with a nuclear weapon. is their hope for diplomacy. >> it's 11:43 and now we're getting north korea, haven't mentioned tax reform yet. we'll hear from nikki haley and dig into strepz on the strategy against north korea. it's tunistunning, what could k jong-un do that forces military action. you're watching "velshi & ruhle" right here on msnbc. they really appreciate the military family, and it really shows. we've got auto insurance, homeowners insurance. had an accident with a vehicle, i actually called usaa before we called the police. usaa was there hands-on very quick very prompt.
only block one. and 6 is greater than one. rethink your allergy relief. flonase sensimist. ♪ welcome back. you're watching quts velshi and ryu. nikki haley, ambassador to the united nations speaking a few moments ago. you speak about the crisis situation we're facing, this comes a day after telling the u.n. security council that north korean leader kim jong-un is begging for war with his recent provocative acts. amid that warning, growing speculation that north korea is preparing to conduct another long range missile test days from now. joining us now, lindsay ford, political affairs for the asia policy institute and former pentagon adviser on asia and
pacific security. you heard nikki halley's commens yesterday. how concerned are you kim jong-un will take her on, you want a war, i've got one for you. >> with all respect to nikki haley, i think it's misread of the situation. i think they are trying to demonstrate they have the ability and the will to respond in such a strong way with an operational nuclear program that they are going to prevent the united states from considering attacking it. i think actually what north korea wants is to make sure the united states is going to take military options off the table and preserve their regime. i don't think what they are actually looking for is to nish yalt a conflict. kim jong-un is not crazy. he recognizes if it actually came to a conflict, he would lose. his regime would end. and that's not what he wants.
>> let's just listen to the latest comments from nikki haley, this was just moments ago at the united nations. >> i think if you look at north korea now, the reasons we're pushing for so many sanctions, do we think more sanctions are going to work on north korea? not necessarily but what does it do? it cuts off the revenue that allows them to build ballistic missiles. with what we did with iran, we cut off the revenue so they couldn't improve their technology. we cut off the revenue so they couldn't do bad things willingly as much as they want d to. we gave this influx of money that suddenly allowed them to do whatever they want with 24 days notice if we're going to inspect a site and there's a problem there. i think we just need to be honest with ourselves that when the jcpoa was passed and when the resolution was passed, when the corker cardin law was passed, that doesn't change the
iranian culture and belief of the government. they are still who they were prior to the deal. >> one of the things that you mentioned -- >> we're listening to nikki haley. lindsay, she talked about iran and in iran we did two interesting we did two interesting things, we took them off the swift banking system. you couldn't use credit cards to pay for anything, couldn't use wires, anything like that. we put pressure on banks around the world who did any business with iran. it really helped. north korea doesn't help taking them off the swift banking system because they're so isolated. but there is power in leaning on the banks, particularly the chinese banks that continue to do work with north korea. it seems to me there is a lot of distance between where we are and war. >> i think that's true. i think we need to recognize when we're talking about the idea of secondary sanctions, there is two targets here. and one is north korea and one is china. and the goal with the idea of secondary sanctions and going after companies and entities
that are doing business with north korea is not just about making sort of increasing the pain point for north korea, it is also about getting the chinese to change their calculus about how they see the north korean situation and deciding that at the end of the day, they're not willing to prop up this regime anymore. >> all right, but in that -- to that end, donald trump tweeted a couple of days ago that we're going to cut off all trade ties with anybody who does any business with north korea. china has to know that's a bluff there is zero chance of america cutting off trade ties with china. >> yeah. that's not realistic at all. but the chinese have seen a lot of tweets from the president at this point. i think they understand that there is sometimes a degree of hyperbole involved. >> how about vladimir putin, he called it useless rhetoric. >> yeah, you know, we have seen statements coming from both the chinese and the russians in the last couple of days that have not been positive in terms of where they are on the idea of sanctions right now.
they both supported the u.n. sanctions in august, i suspect if, you know if ambassador haley does try to go back for further tightening of sanctions, there will be some degree of support, but the north -- the chinese and the russian position is not going to change, which is that ultimately they want to see people get to the table and negotiate sooner rather than later. >> lindsey, thank you so much. is it not stunning on a regular basis, you say, well, maybe it is hyperbole, the president has become the boy who cried wolf, but we're talking about countries with nuclear weapons. >> we have general after general coming on. by the way, including mattis, the defense secretary, saying war with north korea, nuclear war, it is just too impossible to imagine. we need to have a lot of options between here and there. if it came to war, america can get involved. but the fact is, we need to slow this down. >> help me with this, mr. president, if you're watching. if it wasn't -- don't take him literally, take him seriously. what are we to do? stick around, everybody. congress returned to work this
morning with a whole lot to do, only 12 days this month and they face a heck of a list. we're going to be live on the hill with the biggest battles including the border wall. remember that? and harvey aid being voted on tomorrow. thank you so much. thank you! so we're a go? yes! we got a yes! what does that mean for purchasing? purchase. let's do this. got it. book the flights! hai! si! si! ya! ya! ya! what does that mean for us? we can get stuff. what's it mean for shipping? ship the goods. you're a go!
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u.s. hispanic chamber of commerce, javier palamarez resigned from the diversity coalition. i'll speak with him today at 3:00 p.m. eastern right here on msnbc. >> i got a feeling he's got something to say. congress returned from recess this morning. and i hope they ate their wheaties facing a massive to-do list, including funding for victims of harvey, keeping the government open, they also would like to pay some attention to tax code and health care reform and possibly hold hearings regarding the ongoing russia investigation. maybe this is the week don jr. is supposed to be there. who knows. >> in session for 12 days. >> 12 days. >> garrett haak is live on capitol hill. i hope you ate your wheaties. >> we talk about this as a month, but it is really 12 days, a short period of time. they're going to get to work quickly. we expect the house to vote on this harvey aid package tomorrow. and kick things over to the senate. i can tell you now multiple
sources involved in the drafting process on the senate side now say they do expect to attach the debt ceiling lift to that harvey relief bill. they have this big bill for harvey relief, they know they need to get it passed, there is bipartisan support for it, they'll give them a bitter pill and kick it back to the house and hope the house decides no to the have this fight get that done. the other must do thing is they got to fund the government. at least for a short period of time. they'll probably kick that down the road, through a continuing resolution all the way out to december. that leaves all this discretionary stuff that republicans kind of have to decide what they want their prirtz to be he priorities to be here, take a crack at health care, they have to try to do that this month, we know they'll have hearings on some of the other issues, they can do that this month. all of this is going to be going on while the russian investigation continues, while north korea continues to be an issue. and, by the way, i haven't even talked about tax reform yet. that's the big, big, big legislative priority for the trump administration. it is difficult to see how they
find any time this month to get started on that in a substantial way. >> all right, garrett. we'll be spending a lot of time with you over the next 12 days/month. >> i love the washington post piece that detailed the conversation president trump had with mitch mcconnell, just going silent and the president saying, are you there? mitch, are you hear me? he says, yes, mr. president. >> now let's get back to the bill. >> this is one of two people that the president is going to really -- in the best of circumstances, if you had the best relationship with the house and the senate leaders, this would be a tough lift to get all this done. >> joe scarborough says mitch mcconnell is the most powerful guy in washington. the president is doing a good job distancing himself from congress and blaming them for getting a lot not done. >> or as my partner stephanie ruhle says, donkey kicking. >> thanks for watching this hour of "velshi & ruhle." i'm ali velshi. >> i'm stephanie ruhle. check us out on social media and connect with our show.
tell us an american hero we should be honoring. now to an american hero of ours, andrea mitchell for "andrea mitchell reports." >> thank you, right now on "andrea mitchell reports," broken dreams. president trump ending the dreamer program, allowing nearly a million undocumented immigrants brought here as children to stay in the u.s. unless congress replaces the act in the next six months. >> the nation must set and enforce a limit on how many immigrants we admit each year, and that means all cannot be accepted. >> military threats, the u.s. warning of a massive military response to any north korean threat as south korea holds live fire exercises at a north korean diplomat warns of still more to come. >> the u.s. would receive more pictures from my country as long as it relies on