tv MSNBC Live With Hallie Jackson MSNBC March 13, 2018 7:00am-8:00am PDT
employees. >> for those workers show them the money. mr. poster i'm sorry we didn't have much time to do. that wraps us up this hour i'm stephanie rahul. i'm headed on assignment so my colleague will be here all day. to halle jackson. this morning, rex tillerson, the department of strkt of state. what happened, why it happened, what's next and woez next? our team is ready with new reporting including our reporting on how rex tillerson found out he was fired in just about the last hour. tillerson barely cleared the jet fumes back from africa. the president apparently not telling hilla telling tillerson himself. we're going to break this down if a couple of different ways.
we'll start at the white house where nbc han's nickels is posted up. bring us up to speed on what you know and what the president said bah he's dark as he flies out to california. >> he said this is about chemistry, finding better chemistry with mike pompeo and hasn't he wanted to have his teams if police for these crucial negotiations with income. >> i've worked with mike pompeo now for quite sometime. tremendous energy, tremendous intellect. we're always on the same wave length. the relationship has been very good and that's what i feed as secretary of state. i wish rex tillerson well. gina, by, who i know very well and work very closely will be the first woman director of the cia, she's an jut standing
person who of gotten to know very well. so i've gotten to foe a lot of people over the last year. i'm at a point where we're getting close to having the cabinet and other things that i want. but, i think mike pompeo will be a truly great secretary of state, i have total confidence in him. and, as far as rex tillerson is concerned, i very much appreciate his commitment and his service and i wish him well. he's a good man. >> mr. president what did you say to rex tillerson? >> rex and i have been talking about this for a long time. we got along quite well but we disagreed on thing. when you look at the iran deal, i think it's terrible, i guess he think it have okay. i wanted to either break it or do something and he felt a little bit differently. so we were not really thinking the same. with mike pompeo we have a
similar thought process. i think it's going to go very well. rex is a very good pan. i like rex a lot. i really appreciate his commitment to this service and i'll be speaking to reck for over a long period of time. [ inaudible question ] >> i can't hear you. [ inaudible question ] >> no, i really didn't discuss it very much with him, honestly. i made that decision by myself. rex wasn't, as you know in this country. i made the north korea decision from other people but i made that decision by myself. [ inaudible question ] >> what? [ inaudible question ] s >> say it again. >> why is mike pompeo the right
man right now? >> i respect his intellect and the process we've don't through together. we have a very good relationship, for whatever reason, come industry, whatever it is why do people get along. i always said from the beginning from day one, i've gotten along well with pompeo. and frankly i got along with rex too. i wish him great things. i think rex will be much happier now. with pike we had a good chemistry right from the beginning. >> you know, halle wen we listen to the president talk about chemistry and the importance of having his team in place. we can focus on the aspect of this. you heard him say there are clear differences on iran. obviously tillerson was much more towards the side of letting this groom, jount comprehensive agreement on our on take place and run itself out.
we need to look at what's happened next in terms of potential difficult confrontation hearings. you had mike pompeo going before the senate. that will be a chance to relitigate. we shouldn't forget been gina, she was very involved in what critics allege was torture during the bush administration. that could all be relitigated. both three days requires senate confirmation. in no means this president trump make his position easier by sacking rex tillerson today. halle. >> our next guess joining us i believe demoted gina haskell. john brennan is with us now. mr. brennan thank you for being with us. i'm going to start with rex tillerson, i want to talk about mike pom way and the incoming
cia director whom you know. let me start with rex tillerson, my colleague, an tree ya much l is reporting that according to state departments rex tillerson found out he was fired through a tweet. do you find that appropriate? >> no. it's not surprising though. rex tillerson was principle and not loyal to donald trump which is why he was shown the door. the way rex tillerson and jim comey has been created is indicative of how donald trump's deals with these people and will dismiss them when he wants and for whatever reason he wants. it's a question of insufficient loyalty. >> so that's the process. you have mike pompeo coming in who has taken a tougher tone towards rush. something we have not soon from donald trump. how does that play out if mike pompeo come in and gets con if i wered as secretary of state?
>> i think what mike has done was reiterate what the agency position has been. i think it's a reflection of the cia analysis and intelligence. which i think pompeo is very smart and shown himself loyal to donald trump. >> do you find that progress mask or an asset in the secretary of state? someone whods to travel the world and speak for the president. >> i found it more -- he want somebody woez gungs to be on the same wave length with donald trump. that does worry me when he says they think like on these issues. >> do you believe -- how to you petitioner sieve this as being received by our allies internationally, john? >> well, i think the allies are trying to figure out whose on first on these issues in it
weres of revolving door that continues at they had senior government levels. i think our allies knew that rex tillerson had a good sense of international affairs and common sense approach to include all business related to russia and north korea. they're going to see pompeo as donald trump's spokesperson and i don't know whether or not they're going to have as much confidence if mike pompeo as they've had in rex tillerson. >> how do you think they'll handle theup coming discussions with north korea? >> well, the only benefit to this i think mike pompeo will reflect more accurately, donald trump's thinking. put i'm pot confidence that'll be the way to resolve some of those difficult foreign policies. >> let me ask you about somebody
who i believe you know, gina haskell, stepping up to pic the new cia director to replace mike pompeo. it's my understanding she had run a secret black site in thailand. came under scrutiny and controvertsy. you demoted her. what happens? >> first of all, i never demoted her. she was one of the acting of operations when i arrived. she had a wealth of experience and background. she has tremendous respect within the remainders. she was involved in a very very controversial program. i know that the sfaet senate confirmation process will look at that closely. she had a lot of integrity, she's tried to carry out her duties of the cia.
in' when asked to do difficult thing and challenging times. >> what is your understanding of her role in the wart boarding program continroversy? >> i can't go into details on what an individual's role might have been during that program. but, as i said she had tried to carry out her responsibility to the best of her ability and consistent with what cia's legal authorities were. don't t forget the attention program was authorized by the department of unite. we all have different views and i have my on view whether or not that program should have pursued. gina, again is a very competent professional who i think deserves the chance to take the seat. >> two quick questions. number one, do you vouch for her as new head of the cia?
>> i vouch for her capabilities, her experience, her expertise. and i do have confidence that she will carry out the duties of drrk -- >> okay. >> i just hope that in this administration woor, it seems as a loyalty seems to be the highest priority that gina has pel -- has spell speaks truth and represents in an honest way. >> is she going to have an issue getting confirmed? >> i think there's going to be closed scrutiny given to her nomination. >> okay. >> i think that's appropriate but at the end of the day she will be and should be con if you remembered. >> former cia drrk, john bring nan sharing his analysis with us. thank you for being on this show.
msnbc garett is on the highly. mike is here with me on the set. mike, quickly with gina, you know are, is she gourng to have a relationship with donald trump like mike did? >> i don't think she's going to be that close. the reason to have pompeo on where he goes at state -- >> do people on capitol hill, garett, feel the same way? i know you're been talking with lawmakers, do they feel like mike pompeo is the right pick? >> democrats are nvs about this. yes, they think he's qualified. i'm talked to tim cane, bill nelson, a number of democratic senator who will be watching this closely. they do feel like perhaps he's
someone someone he's to partisan to do this job. here's what was said. >> to fire a member so close to doing the russia drael deals i'm just -- i'm somebody in the past who had advocating well more dan diplomacy and you're going to see full raelgs, asked about that. >> tillerson was failure well liked by democrats and republicans up here. he's not someone who most of these folks have known for longer than his term of secretary of state. i'm asking questions that start with tillerson and getting lot of answers that deal with pompeo. i think republicans are aware they need to start pushing the if you guy here and live him the best opportunity to get off on the right food. >> have you seen bob horker yet bah hee going to be pretty
critical in all this? >> he popped his head out of his office a few minutes ago. i'm going to try to get him hopefully before the i know of this hour. he's fopg to be the pivotal player in the next few fazes of this. bob corker is on my short list here today. >> garrett i hope to see you pack sometime in the next 40 minute on this program with senator bob corker. we'll be watching for that. mike allen is still with us hire. former specialist with judge w. bush. kera lee, and tim auburn, and i believe our friend akand lana i joining us back in washington. you covered the state department and know rex tillerson. are you surprised by how this went down?
>> i'm surprised by how this went down and exactly went. put not that it went down eventually. >> period? >> yeah. >> again we were reporting this for months, the president called this in december, fake news. it's all coming true. >> it is all coming true. however it had appeared in the last couple of month, architectural son had his feet on him. he was out there pg the secretary of state. there wasn't the same kind of constant children of rumor we'd heard from the white house about how much he i noed the president. and there are two pain things coming up that in hind sight it's perfectly clear the president wanted to make a change. the summit that takes place many pai is the deadline on the iran nuclear deal. there the two of them butted
heads. you heard the president say this morning they disagreed. tillerson opposed that closure. let me talk politics ann. how has u.s. politics chaked with mike pompeo ahead of the seat? >> i don't think you'll see someone intuned with the president op specifically iran. if it comes to north korea the president will go into -- if there are talks with the secretary of state who he feels comfortable with. pompeo has a little bit of different view of the president. for instance he's named wikileaks a he or she still state actor. that'll be interesting to see how he navigates that path. he's an ally and somebody the president feels comfortable with and trusts.
rex tillerson couldn't get there with the president just being tried. >> tim was struck when garrett talked about how runs on capitol hill are taking the tillerson question and turn it into a pompeo answer. he's who they want to be talking about. >> pompeo is and was a congressman. >> knows the hill. >> that expand the section trump on the hill. one there was talk of -- so pompeo popular among reporters on capitol hill. worth noting that runs have a smaller mar john for air, having smashed defeat from a job in blaum. that could come into play. you have a little less marcher than you had at the beginning of this administration. >> can we take a beat and explain what happened perform 9/11 and how we guilty here. within minutes president trump tweeted it is our reporting here
at miss b. msnbc news that it was how rex tillerson found out from the posting. tillerson was in africa trying to do some clean up. somebody who was on the plane with rex tillerson, josh letterman whose joining me on the phone. josh, you were traveling with rex tillerson. he came back and talked with reporter hours before all of this went down. >> he said he was up in the middle of night all night having conversations with the president. the first conversation was that one about north korean and the second, kim jong-un. the second one, they won't tell us what it was about. i have to tell you, halle there was no indication in his
behavior or his aid or other people on the plane that this was imminent. he came back to travel us with, he walked about his african trip, and russia. he made some -- on that ex spy who was poidsened in the u.s. saying this had to have come from russia. if tillerson knew at that point this was his swan song and would not appear publicly much longer add secretary of state he sure didn't show it. >> testifies caught off guard as the rest of us seems, josh? >> there had been complainting stories this morning. officials said he was fired on friday. we have officials saying he never spoke to the president about that. how exactly this happened and, you know, how much preparation tillerson had we don't know. we do know he cut short his
africa trip by one fight. -supposed to come bang tonight and he came back a day early. >> mark allen. >> well the -- i disagree with what john bring fan said. the key to success is rapport to the president. your secretary of state flows to the president. tillerson didn't have it, pompeo will. >> i want to bring in michael steel who i now had some thoughts on this michael, give me you reaction to what yu seen unfold. >> i think the key words or phrase inside of this whole thing is what the president said, i'm l finally getting the cab fete i want. i think you pay see more changes in this cabinet over the next few months. i think the president is rey beginnings to settling into the
idea that, hey, i can do this without any help. i don't need people necessarily telling me every minute of the day what i can and can't did or can and can't say. he's looking for people who can be his comfort food, if you will. >> that's weird. cts yeah. but it's trump so it works. >> wait a second michael, i have to correct you gently. the president didn't say he was getting the cabinet he wanted heb he was close to the cabinet that he wanted. >> what's the difference? i'm getting the cabinet i want, i'm close to getting it. for him it's the same. >> it does indicate there's more changes afoot. >> i just said that. >> get specific, whose next? >> you can run the gamut who knows. it's about how the president views the relationship he had with hi cabinet members. is it devos?
carson? i don't know. but the president is now in a position where he's reevaluating his can net and others around him in light of everything else that's been moving over the last three weeks. i think he's comfortable with that, which in the end may be a good thing. it may settle some thing down. you won't have the certain up ended nature of the state department right now. weal get that ambassador to south korea and fill the other concepts with mike pompeo on behalf of the president. >> if you take the president's reasoning for replacing rex tillerson pause he's heading into potential negotiate, trade, the one that looks like to go next is hr mcmaster. everyone knows that the president finds him difficult to work with, they dobb jell in the
similar ways the president didn't jell with rex tillerson. when a president says he's close to -- you never know with this president. with the other presidents that may be hiding in plain sight. trump, he tends to not necessarily turkish you didn't know if it's a hint at something or how he's speaking. if there were to be a shake up that's the way to look. >> ken, brief final thoughts to you on this. >> halle, i'm struck by the appointment of gina has pel who is as much of a cia insider as you can imagine. one of my -- she was deputy head of what's known as russia house rg cia's russia spying investigation. she has a hard view of russia add appear adversary. that's something mike pompeo was
else spousing. so it's interesting to see this. >> i'm going to ask you for a favor, including you michael steel. stay where you are, don't move. we have to take a break. a lot more to talk about one we get back. new developments this modern involving president trump's informal campaign adviser roger stone. we're talking about the russian investigation and how he may be linked to wikileaks. stick around. ♪ ♪ next chapter ♪
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now you can get it, too. welcome to the party. . we are back with the breaking news we have been following this morning, the zparpt of rex tillerson as secretary of state, announced via tweet by president trump. his replacement, mike mom pay, the currently cia director. he had a closer relationship with donald trump than rex tillerson did, but this is news that caught a lot of folks in washington off guard, at least for timing. we're just learning from our capitol hill team from garrett hank that one of the republican
leader, john cornyn found out about this news on his phone this morning. we are waiting for senator bob corker, head of senate foreign commission to weigh in on this. that could happen in the next 20 minutes so stay here. we want to talk about what this means in the context with russia now that mike pompeo is coming in to lead democratic efforts on that front. i want to bring in ken delaney. ken, i know you have contacts to provide here on what it means that mike pompeo is going to be coming in. >> that's absolutely right, halle. it's interesting, during a political campaign, mike pompeo was a a video donald trump supporter. once he game ci ark director he
began taking a very hard line against russia and against wikileaks. he called wikileaks a non-state he or she still environment. in saens he was else spousing the views he was getting from the intelligence. but nonetheless, he did ar take late that view and now hee going over to the state department. the state department has been marginalized in a lot of ways. jared kushner met in mexico with senior officials do not bring the u.s. ambassador with him. it's possible pompeo ease close relationship. then you have gina haspel, the woman taking over with cia, she's be the first female operator to run the cia. she's got the history where she ran a black site in thailand
where two al-qaeda citizens were tortured. she wasn't confirmed in the job as ci ark director but she had to go around and pleat with democrats and assure them the agency was not going to go down this road again and she'd keep them apprised of any type of covert operations she'd be everyseeing. >> ken, thank you. when we talk about the situation that's happening with russia, the interference in our election we also have to talk about the russian investigation. one cops from "the washington post". one, a guy named roger stone, former adviser to donald trump during the campaign. he reportedly talked to founder of wikileaks. he said the founder told stone the websites had received
e-mails, one of course, john podesta. this happened before wikileaks did anything with those messages. wikilea wikileaks published them in the final days of campaign. this report was catching the eyes of investigations with bob puler. one of the investigations are now over. surprisingly, there's no evidence of collusion between russia and the trump campaign. it did surprise democrats on the committee. some of them learned about the finings either through twitter or on cable. the 150 page draft report will be given over to his democratic colleagues, they'll have a chance to look and comment. with us carrol lining, one of the reporters behind the roger stone piece. also joinings, joyce vanessa.
tim and the rest of the gang still with us herism big group with michael and michael as well. >> so, what our team basically broke this morning was that two different people that we've interviewed said that roger stone told them, at least in april or may, and possibly in june, but at least starting in april, that roger stone told them he was aware of a troef of e-mails that were going to be damaging to the democratic party and to some specific people, including john podesta. the fact that he said in this april of 2016, according to these individuals is striking because nobody really knew any e-mails had been hacked, stolen, on tanned. roger stone is an interesting conservator activist and has
given a lot of shifting accounts about whether or not he had access with asuaje. he told these people that he had a contact with asuaje and that's how he knew this information. >> roger stone, among the people he spoke with is chuck todd. and i want to play a little of what stone had to say then. listen. >> i never had any advanced knowledge of the content, the source or the exact timing of the wikileaks disclosures. i never predicted that john podesta's e-mails would be hacked. i predicted his business activities would come under scrutiny. >> that's roger stone giving his reactions. you have for example, people talking about what comes next when it comes to the democratic side of this.
joyce vanessa -- i want to get your reaction. >> i don't think it's going to amount to a whole lot at the end of the day this whole house working on the russian investigation are going to determine there was collusion. far more importantly as the mueller investigation, which will be the body that determines whether or not anyone is charged with criminal conduct. although this has been a flurry of news and the release of this report in the fashion that's clearly not bipartisan has caused a stir, long run this will be just a footnote. >> well, what's interesting to me though is the potential of what you may here from other republicans. congressman rudy who's on that intel, he's a republican came out and said this. listen. >> going completely off the rails and now we're basically a
political forum for people to leek information to drive the day's news. as you've eluded to we've lost all credibility and we're going to issue probably two different reports. >> joyce, he's saying his own committee has basically lost credibility. >> yeah, and i think he speaks for many people who believe that the process which did not exhaustly interview witness, excluded many people who were indicted by mueller from testimony. didn't hold witnesses accountable one they didn't answer questions, didn't get documents. the process was exhaustive and the conclusion there was no collusion similar to what we heard of the roger stone story. >> michael, your reaction of what we talked about and what we learned relating to the russian investigation? >> i think joyce put her finger on it.
the work of this competent has become a sham, it was laughable. the congressman was right, the credibility was shot. in the face of all the orr evidence that is about compiled that we know of by mueller and those that we've already pled guilty and under indictment, the fact that they've included, oh, well we have no more work today speaks volume of how this committee had fallen. the other committee op the hill, particularly on the sfaet side will continue their work as best of a bipartisan value that they can. at the end of the day joyce is correct. the real work is going to be don by mueller. doesn't party what any of these congress fall committees will say or do. everyone is waiting to see what shoe will fall next out of mueller investigation. >> tim alberta. >> there are times one investigations are important, this is just not one of those times. it's interesting to us what they come up with. >> the fact that its over is
interesting. >> it's interesting, don't get me wrong. you've talk to folks on the little and staffers on these committees and they're whispering to you, let's just see what mueller has to say. that's where this is going. >> the one thing that this does give the president is a talking point. >> sure does. >> and so if that atmosphere in terms of public opinion, how reporters feel about this, it gives them a strong tool to say look, there's no investigation. >> it's for the best this has been uthanized. this has been a partisan fight and leaks on both sides. so, i think it's for the best that we move on and look forward to a senate report and ultimately the special prosecutor coming out with something more. >> i got to thank michael, michael steel, carrol lee, kind
land ya, joyce for being with us. i appreciate you walking through all of this with us. we have more information for you about the zparpt of rex tillerson. new info from capitol hill about who knew perhaps before the secretary of state that he was out of a job. zbary hicks joining us in three minutes. before you and your rheumatologist move to another treatment, ask if xeljanz xr is right for you. xeljanz xr is a once-daily pill for adults with moderate to severe ra for whom methotrexate did not work well. it can reduce pain, swelling and further joint damage, even without methotrexate. xeljanz xr can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. serious, sometimes fatal infections, lymphoma and other cancers have happened. don't start xeljanz xr if you have an infection. tears in the stomach or intestines, low blood cell counts and higher liver tests and cholesterol levels have happened. your doctor should perform blood tests before you start and while taking xeljanz xr, and monitor certain liver tests.
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to lead the cia, mike pompeo's former job. it turns out, gina haspel will take that role. but before she was announced there was a lot of speculation it was somebody on capitol hill that was going to take that condition. msnbc's garrett hirks joining us from the hill. is supportive, fully supportive the president's choice to bring on gina haspel. and interesting, he was aware before the tweet this morning about this shake-up. that's interesting stuff given that for example, john cornyn, according to your reporting had no idea. >> yeah, that's right. tom was the first republican out of the gate with any kind of statement on this, praising pompeo and haspel, almost
probably within the half hour of the news break. his name was floated for a long time of being a good fit. he has military background, a very close ally of the president on issues up here. he may have had a confirmation problem up here, not because of his positions necessarily but because of the math. most of please people are going to have to get 50 votes. runs have a 51 majority vote right now and john mccain has not been up here casting votes. i'm sure tom could not have voted for himself for con frj. that means they'll need democratic support in a rearview charged position. with a senator who does not have a very good will built up. there was potential political road block for them. he also was in a safe seat from arkansas. he could be the senator from arkansas about so long he want to be, halle.
>> garrett you've also talked with orr lawmakers there on the hill regarding the development we've seen specifically as it relates to the next battle you eluded to, the confirmation battles coming up with pompeo and haspel. >> reporter: yeah that's right. democrats don't know haspel as well. they're much more familiar with pompeo and democrats i've spoken to are concerned. i talked to kerstin who had this to say about pompeo. >> very serious concerns about pompeo. i voted against him. he's someone who has supported torture in the past. i not think he's the type of leader we need for the secretary of state. >> reporter: so, halle even if republicans can get the votes together, they don't break rinks they probably will. these are type of thing are op signature party members are less likely to play politics because
they understand how important it is these roles be filled by some individuals. the fact we're going to have two confirmation fights while the senate is trying to get of work done there will be a distraction. it's another thing on they're plate that they're not as able to work an, gun legislation on t the dodd frank they're doing this weekend. it's another thing for the senate to be focused on. >> garrett, any sign of bob corker has he come out of his office in the last 30 minutes since we've talked last? >> reporter: no, but he will not be able to do so without me seeing him. >> garrett haeck, thanks. tim and ann are here. reaction to what you heard from garrett? congress sucks a lot of time to get these done. >> you would think that a couple
of confirmation hearings have come in prided leverage support for senators rmd who has concerns about hot spots around the world. north korea, sank with russia, latest news on syria. it's going to be interesting, i would think to garrett ret's point, even in this political environment, are still positions that would attract some bipartisan support. i don't think you're going to see either of these nominees derailed in the process, that's yu from the outset sort of the outlook on this. boy, even for folks within the republican party, a jeff flake, certainly a bob corker, i think this is an opportunity for some of those people to make the president and white house scorn a little. >> i do think if -- that we would be covering, we will be covering which is the poisoning of that british ex spy.
this is a serious attack against the ally, the british say it's highly likely russia was bind it. russia denying involvement. you know who didn't point the finger at russia, sarah sanders. >> she was asked several times simple question, does the unite agree with the theresa may, british prime minister, wen she said it was likely russia was behind this. not only did the attack itself bare the hall marks of previous attack on british soil by the intelligence has traced the nerve agent to a type developed by russia. so, it's a circumstantial case but a fairly per swaifr one. persuasive enough for theresa tomato go on television in se so. sarah was asked if she agreed with that and she would not say
yes. rex tillerson, in a press conference if africa said -- on the plane rather on the way home said, yeah we think they did it and put out a statement to that effect. >> mike pompeo will be pressed on this. >> absolutely. >> pompeo, a -- you got the recertification upcoming. all of these different hot stops around the globe again. seems like it's not only going to be a opportunity for democrats but also republicans. >> we have senator bob corker let's listen in. >> the president called, you know at 9:58 or so to let me know what had happened. i had talked to him on friday night and talked to tillerson on thursday night last week just about what was happening with north korea and had not talk to either one of them until this morning. again, pompeo called and, you know, i think he was excited
about his new role and -- or he has designation. i told him we'd move through the confirmation process as quickly as we could. we've tried to reach tillerson, and we've had some, you and we some, just got in at 4:00 a.m. this morning. i haven't had chance to talk with him. i really enjoyed working with him also. i've heard good things about pompeo and shared that with him. he's probably going to come over later this week and talk. we talked about some of the noms that were under way just to ensure he would want confirmed if he's confirmed himself. any way, there's not a lot more to share. >> democrats have been very nervous about pompeo. do you anticipate problems with him getting confirmed? >> i don't. i've never really had much, in any dealings with him. i'm not sure we've even met.
i think we might have met once. i don't really know. he's well educated. was at west point. again, i've heard nothing but positive things about his background and that kind of thing. i just don't -- i've not had any interaction with him. i look forward to sitting down and talking with him. >> you said the president called you this morning. what did the president tell you? >> he just let me know how highly he thought of pompeo and how much he thought we would work well together. talked to me a bit about secretary tillerson. i let that go and -- >> his criticism of tillerson? >> you know, i've talked to the president many, many times and secretary tillerson. i'm very aware of the relationship and as i've mentioned publicly, thought
there was a reprieve that was under say since the beginning of december. i think secretary tillerson has served our country well. i was a big fan of his nomination and have appreciated the advice that he has given to the president and the way they have worked together. >> how hard is -- >> you said last year that getting -- tillerson was among three officials separating this country from chaos. are you concerned this country could go into chaos? >> pompeo seems like someone who has distinguished background. i just need to know him and sit down with him. >> how hard is it for anyone to do that job of secretary of state when the president seems to want to do so much of this himself? >> i think with any secretary of state, let's face it. with any of them, it's the one
cabinet that position with you're in the president's lane. you're not going to be in the president's lane as head of cia or homeland security or treasury. secretary of state is the one position you're constantly in the president's leane. it's the more difficult of all the cabinet positions. secretary kerry, let's well documented. he was in a different place than president obama on almost every issue. it's the more difficult place. the president's very entrepreneurial in his activities and secretary tillerson comes from place where process was a big deal. they laid everything out in advance. what's happened has happened. i do look forward to talking to rex a little bit later today and i appreciate the call from the president and pompeo.
>> you can keep going. we're going to have garrett keep walking. >> are you concerned what this bheen means? >> not really. >> when you spoke with the president did he express his policy differences with tillerson? >> no. look, i'm not going to -- as you all know after 11 years i don't really share personal conversations. as i said to the president when he called, every cabinet person serves at his pleasure. it's his decision. doesn't really matter. >> what message do you think this sends?
>> what do you think of the reports that tillerson found out about this by president tweet this morning? >> i'd rather talk to secretary tillerson before i comment on that. >> this kind of instability within the administration, what m message does it send to the world? >> i don't really know. it's been a very busy period of time for the last 14 or 15 months. we deal with it as it comes. again, i look forward to meeting with pompeo. i thank tillerson and i thank all of you. see you later. >> thanks. >> i don't know if you're still with me there but that turned into a running situation. >> it's a good thing you're seven foeet tall. >> the wingspan is sometimes
useful. sorry to see him go. clearly not wanting to get into the details of his conversations with the president about this. that's the kind of thing that he tends to hold pretty closely. as we heard all morning long especially from runs trying to push forward on pompeo and trying to up sell mike pompeo, to the degree he knows him. the most interesting thing was the acknowledgement there is this stress with anyone who tries to do that job of secretary of state because you're so obviously in the president's lane. this is a president who guards the purview of what is in his lane. that tension with tillerson, we'll see if it shows up as attention with possible secretary of state mike pompeo
who will have to do the exact same thing in terms of being in the president's lane from time to time. >> who bob corker says he met maybe once which was pretty interesting. those two will have to get up to speed on that relationship quickly. >> absolutely. this will be another heavy lift for the senate and for the senate foreign relations committee to have to confirm a nomination when they have so much other work to get done. ambassadors to get confirmed, oversight on these big issues that the senate does take seriously. now you have another potentially contentious fight dropped in the middle of that in an election year. the degree of difficulty just keeps getting raised higher and higher. >> coming through in the clutch. getting us bob corker like you said you would. thank you for that. much appreciate it. guys, interesting here that corker, senator corker stepped
back when asked, secretary tillerson might have found out during a tweet. they haven't spoken. they two guys are buddies. >> that was a disappointed man, senator corker. he has become very close to secretary tillerson and served as an interpreter and helper for tillerson in his troubled relationship with the president. you could see written all over senator corker's face there that he feels bad for his friend but he also -- he wasn't -- it was odd he had not yet talked to tillerson and he didn't want to get out ahead of -- he wouldn't reveal much of what the president said about secretary tillerson and he didn't want to get out ahead of what will be painful conversation when he has it. >> senator corker looked like a boxer who just took a round house. he looked completely first dazed for the first 90 seconds or so
on camera. he looked like he was completely caught off guard. >> i think the president called him 9:58, which would have been about an hour after the tweet. we were all in rolling coverage of rexit and corker was probably watching it on cable. >> probably heebs. >> two extraordinary things saying he had not spoken -- this is the chairman of the senate foreign relations committee saying he had not spoken with the recently dearly departed secretary of state. >> dearly to who? >> to him and not to the president. secondly saying he's never met mike pompeo. maybe about once. >> he talked about his west point days. really extraordinary. he does have deep relationships with a lot of republicans on capital hill, does not have one with corker which is really fascinating.
>> where it goes next. >> it's confirmation fight. it's one of the things people at the white house were saying was a concern for them. they didn't want a big cabinet shake up because they swrould to have confirmation. >> they got one now. i'm glad both of you brought your seat belts because it's been a ride for the last 60 minutes. picking up where we left off is ali. have at it, pal. >> i've been watching you all morning on this stuff. i'll try to carry the ball. see you later this afternoon. thank you. good morning. i'm ali velshi. stephanie has left for assignment. >> breaking news out of white house. a major shakeup inside the trump administration. nbc news has confirmed the president has asked secretary of state rex tillerson to step aside. he will be replaced with the current cia director mike pompeo. the president has announced the first woma