tv All In With Chris Hayes MSNBC June 13, 2018 5:00pm-5:59pm PDT
least of te re the now beckoning to trump's allure can't even claim that. that's "hardball" for now. "all in with chris hayes" starts right now. >> tonight on "all in." >> i'll do anything to protect mr. trump. >> the president's lawyer at a legal crossroads. >> michael cohen is a very talented lure. >> could mhael cohen's br attorneys be a prelude to a flip or a pardon. >> are you considering a pardon for michael cohen. >> thank you very much. >> let's go. >> stupid question. >> then. >> il say proudly that the republican party is the trump party. >> trump takeover of the republican party. >> it's becoming a cultish thing, isn't it. >> and the candidates he's bringing with him. >> i'm proud to be here with this flag. >> and nbc news gets inside the detention facility t locke out sena merkley. >> can i go in with you, please. >> i'll talk to the leader of the house freedom caucus about the trump child separation policy when "all in" starts
right now. >> good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. the president's long time lawyer and consigliere is losing his own personal legal team and that could be really bad news for the president. mike willing con who was raided two months ago by fedal investigators in manhattan is about to part ways with his own attorneys according to multiple reports and expected to hire new counsel to represent him the ongoing probe. this comes ahead of a june 15th deadline this friday two days from now to review all the materials seized in those raids, 3.7 million files including shredded documents the fbi agents had to piece back together. the legal scrutiny on cohen unnerved his former boss who lashed out over the raid memorably during an unrelated national security meeting. >> so i just heard that they bre into the office of one of my personal attorneys, good man, and it's a real disgrace.
it's an attack on our country in a true sense. it's an attack on what we all stand for. that is really now in a whole new level of unfairness. >> there are conflicting reports now why cohen is splitting with his legal team and what it means for his case. cohen's lawyers are the ones choosing to quit the case according to "wall street journal." abc reporting a fee dispute is among the reasons which is interesting. "the new york times" citing payment of legal bills to stephen ryan. this development increases the odds that cohen will cooperate with investigators and potentially give evidence against his old boss who happens to be the president of the united states. but uld say it's not cle yet that's the case. a person close to cohen gabe sherman cohen hasn't flipped yet "he's sending up a smoke signal to trump i need help." cohen has no even spoke within
prosecutors to discuss what he could offer them. based on the information already already public without access to the 3.7 million files, he may interesting s to ll.he serve g bag. >> man. >> he represents me like with this crazy stormy daniels deal. he represented me and you know, from what i see he did absolutely nothing wrong. >> we know that cohen used the same slush fund he set up to pay off stormy daniels to take hundreds of thousands of dollars from corporations seeking access to the trump administration and we know he may have key information related to the russia probe. one of the companies that paid cohen is linked to victorer vekselberg who reportedly met with cohen during the transition and during the inauguration. before he was he was pursuing efforts to build a trump tower
in moscow throughout the campaign in 2016 and identified by name in the steele dossier as an intermediary from trump world to kremlin agents. i'm jo christina, what do we make of today's news. >> this is a new phase in the cohen investigation. it's important to say no charges have been filed. we don't -- we still don't know what charges would be brought against cohen. but anytime someone under investigation switches, changes lawyers, they, the investigation enters a new phase. and that's what we're looking at. >> josh, what are you hearing from the folks that you're talking to in cohen's circle or that know him? >> well, i understand that this has been expected for some time. maybe it's been in the works for about a month or so.
what i'm told by sources that are familiar w his thinking is that there was never really an expectation that he would go into a serious criminal justice process with the legal counsel he has right now. the people he had on his team were basically brought on to deal with the con investigations and document production and not really to hash out either a plea deal or to go to trial on some kind of a criminal charge which i think likal cohen had no idea he would possibly face when this process starred. so i think what we're seeing here is some movement in that direction which could lead to a plea deal and maybe flipping on the predent and could be part of the normal process leading to some criminal charges. >> just to clarify, these attorneys are retained by cohen before he finds himself raided by thefbi? >> that's right. they were involved in sending those documents up to capitol hill that were being demanded by various committees investigating the russia trump affair. >> we should say that, what did you want to say, christine?
>> one big unknown right now in the cohen investigation is what his longe bustner so-called taxi king of new york told prosecutors. he struck a deal i b may 22nd to have tax fraud charges reduced significantly. he did a of business wh cohen over many years and so i think th's really a wild right now into what cohen could be looking at when h the tough decision perhaps about entering into a criminal situation or a plea deal. >> josh, one of the things, one of the questions i think here is is cohen facingxposure or interest from investigators for things unrelated to russia or related to russia. i want to read you this. fbi agents investigating russia's interference learned cohen was i frequentwledge
with moscow. it would put him that sort of bit of reporting would put him more squarely in the kind of portfolio of mueller than maybe we had initially thought based on those raids. >> yeah, tnk there's definitely interest in having cohen answer more questions about his dealings with russia during the campaign. there's no question if he cut a deal with prosecutors that mueller's team would want to debrief him on a variety of different subjects. we should remember mueller's prosecutors laidhis case off essentially referred these issues up to new york for prosecutors in the southern district to take over and so it's fair to assume that the thrust of what's being investigated at the moment remains these sorts of fraud issues, maybe the campaign finance issue involving daniels and the russia issue is maybe lurks in the background. >> kristinna, do we have a sense of the timelinehe >> we've numerous reports today that the cohen -- that cohen could be indicted or even people were tossing around the word arrested in the next week.
that seems to me premature as we un that he was interviewing other potential lawyers today. as many as three different firms. so once -- hopefully in the next week he'll decide on his council. i think that's the next step we're looking at. >> josh, do you know if there's a financial problem here for cohen in termsng for these legal bills which have to be mounting up very quickly? >> i've hea from people close to the case there is concern about the financial cost. remember the big task they've been performing over the last few weeks involved maybe dozens of lawyers involved in going through all the millions and millions of pages of documents and e-mail messages and voice recordings that you mentioned as of this search warrant relateded process. that's a lot of legal hours being billed at a pretty significant law firm. must have run up a really large tab for mr. co is that a tab that the trump organization or president trump
himself is helping pay or is mr. cohen on the hook for that whole bill. >> josh gerstein and christina wilky, thank you both. >> i'mned by legal analyst nick akerman and jil wine-banks. nick, i'll start with you. it's worth noting that gates a similarly orturous situation in which he was -- there was interest from investigators and then was he or was he not going to cooperate. he hired new lawyers right before he pled guilty. >> right, but that doesn't necessarily mean that because cohen is gettingrs s cooperating. you have to look what's been going on the last month or so. he has been coopeng with trump's lawyers to go through all of those documents and all of those tapes that were seized in the search warrants. they're getting prediscovery, discovery that they normally wouldn't get. exactly what people saw trump trying to get with respect to
that the informant at that point time spoke to carter page, spoke to other members of his campaign staff. hat's in those docg to find out >> what do they have. >> what liability lies out there for donald trump. skoen cooperating with that. you've g donald trump who has the privilege, the privilege belongs to him. it belongs towho is also involved in this hosteling people on national tv that they should destroy their evidence if they're going in to see mueller. so when you put all of that together, you've got cohen currently and over the past number of weeks cooperating with the trump t try and nd wha is there. and so the fact that he's going to new lawyers, there's lots of reasons why people go to new lawyers. to give you an example again it's speculation. assume that he told meese lawyers the truth about what happened. but now he intends to go and lie. and lie under oath.
those lawyers can't represent them, represent him if they know he's going to lie. so he has to get a new lawyer. >> it also strik me that jill, there's it could be a financial, it could be as simple as fact he can't afford these people anymore. he doesn't strike me as someone particularly liquid. having worked in prosecution, how do you bring in someone like this? what's the process by which one works over someone you're trying to get to cooperate? >> let me expand on something of the t that's going i think on in my mind is that cohen may be being penny wise and pound foolish because the lawyers he currently has know all those documents. they have spent and they will be paid for all the time they put in understanding all the legal liabilities that he has and if he gets new lawyers, they're going to having to review all of ose documents from scratch. so he's doubling his legal fees.
so it's not such a good idea toe ve let them go. and in terms of what it means for a potential fut n, it's simply that the government will get all of those documents. remember the special master barbar has found less than 1%. >> right. >> all theuments seized, less than 1%. he's not a lawyer. he wasn't acting as a lawyer. so nothing is reall protected by attorney/client privilege. now the government is going to get all those. and they will be able to determine how many crimes and of what nature those crimes are. and some of them may be passed back to mueller because they relate directly to his travel to prague, for example, which mcclatchy reports they have evidence that supports what was in the dossier. an we need to seeer he state tax charges that could be brought in addition to
federal charges in new york, southern district or in the district of columbia by mueller. >> what do youhink is now from the mueller tea in terms of what their strategy is within? >> i thinkhetr ispretty ightfor. they want to see him the advice squeezed. >> they're squeezing him. >> big-time. they want him to be indicted for as many different crimes as he can just as jill said. if he's indicted in the state, that's great. it takes away the pardon power because trump can't pardon anybody who hasotte crimes. there ar plenty of state crimes here, money laundering, t taxvatitax evasion. if he was involved with respect he democtic in with the e-mails mme, there are new york computer crime laws. he could be tied up all different ways and they're rtainly going to be looking for very side effect evidence tying him into the russian probe. >> yeah, we should say that
ukrainian politics who gave testimony who was given a -- gave a peace deal to mhael cohen and gave to flynn that would drop sanctions on russia which is slightly suspect, says the muellerer grand jury questions focused on mueller, jill. there's recent evidence this piece just published a little while ago that mueller is looking at cohen for his role i that nex us. >> absolutely. and it's now the being done just to squeeze himse haidence, well not might. he surely has evidence about donald trump. but it's be committed crimes. and should be igated. he should be indicted. he should be tried. if those are the facts that turn out to be true. so it's people are saying he's just doing this, mueller is doing this and having the southern district do it so that they can squeeze him to testify against donald trump. and i would say that when you find crimes, they need to be investigated and you need to try the people who commit them. >> i shouldclarify.
in this case, probable cause. the probable cause enough to reach the bar to be signed off at by d.o.j., rosen tine the federal magistrate toaid ala to united states which you got to thin is something. nick, jill, great to have you both. >> thank you. next the president wrongly threat from north korea is over. and calls the journalist who's fact check him enemies of the state. donald trump's attack on the free press after befriending the world's worse dictatener two minutes. let someone else do the heavy lifting.
tripadvisor compares prices from over 200 booking sites to find the right hotel for you at the lowest price. tripadvisor. so you barely have to lift a finger. or a wing. to find the right hotel for you at the lowest price. but climbing 58,070 steps a year can be hard on her feet, knees, and lower back. that's she wears dr. scholl's orthotics. they're clinically proven to relieve pain and give you the comfort to move more. dr. scholl's, born to move.
what surprised you today about kim jong-un? >> really, he's got a great personality. he's aunny guy. he's a very smart guy. he's a great negotiator. he lovis people, no the that i'm surprised by that, but he loves his people. i think that we have you know, the start of amazing deal. >> he staved them, been brutal to them. he still loves his people? >> look, he's doing what he's
seen done. if you look at it. i have to go by today and by yesterday and by a couple of weeks ago. that's really when this whole thing started. >> donald trump looked back kim jong-un's record and decides he likes the cut of his jib. trump has praised kim before and has a well established affinity for strong men and human rights abusers around the globe. after spending quality time with another despot this morning, the president returned to america sounding more and more like one himself. today he declared there is no locker a nuclear threat from the north korea and the true enemy is anyone who would tell you otherwise, namely the institutions which keep the american people involved. our country's biggest enemy is the fake news so easily promulgated byfools. ted lieu joins me now. your response to the president's comments about the folks that are trying to keep americans informed. >> well, today's wednesday.
that means the president is lying again. clearly there's still a nuclear threat from north kore and the parallels to watergate are . the last president that constantly attacked the free press was richard nixon. the press is pointing out the facts what happened at the summit in north korea which is that not very much. so we'll have to wait awhile to see if it was a success or atot >> the phrase enemy of the people, what does that conjure for you? >> it conjures richard nixon and watergate. that is the phrase that richard nixon also used. but it's verylarming for the president of the united states to attack the first amendment and a free press in this manner. unfortunately, when you watch fox primetime news, it looks like it's turned into state tv. thank to you msnbc and oth networks for not doing that. >> there's another interview without today largely a friendly interview in which the president sort of says about kim jong-un, you got to hand it to the guy.
he got the job when he was so young. it's hard to be that young. and the interviewer says well, he killed lots of people. he said lots of coues do lots of things. he has spent the last two the days seeslessly sharing the personality trait traits and the hearts of kim jong-un. >> what donald trump is doing is bizarre. the leader of north korea kill aid relative with poison. he shot another with an anti-aircraft gun. he has labor camps. if someone something wrong, they can take three generations of their family and put them into labor camps. at the same time with the president now attacking canada of all places. what donald trump is doing is make no sense. i'm alarmed more republicans are not speaking up. >> there's this report which i thought was interesting. a trump appointee is looking at the loyalty of federal employees, civil servants, senior advers appointed just
two months ago has been quietly vetting career diplomats, parts of civil service and american employees of internaal institutions to determine whether they are loyal to president donald trump and his political agenda. is that appropriate? >> not only is it not appropriate. that strikes me a it could be illegal because federal employees only take one oath and that's an oath to protect and defend the constitution of the united states. it's gotten so bad with the trump administration that on the house judiciary committee, i now will ask witnesses that appear sometimes if they've taken a loyalty oath to this president. that should never be a question that any elected official needs to ask because everyone needs to understand they did not take an oath to a administration or a party or a particular person. it's all an oath to the constitution. i'm confused. do you ask that because people have take and explicit loyalty oath to the president. >> the public reporting isome officials have taken loyalty oaths to president trump or at least he's demanded from them.
>> all right. i would love to see -- i wonder who wrote the oath. do you think ultimate lit that the president -- that the president's performance in north korea is going to endure in terms of how he thinks about what happened there and has people on capitol hill think about it. >> i previously served active duty under u.s. pacific command. it's clear to me the u.s. has no good military options. i supported the summit and diplomacy. honestly too early to tell if north korea is going to denuclearize or do the sam thing they did with the previous administrations and break all their promises. we do know as of today, north korea has n gotten rid single nuke, missile or any of their chemical or biological weapons. i have no idea how the president can try to tell the american people that north korea is no longer a nuclear threat. >> i don't know how the story can end without kim playing around at mar-a-lago. thanks for joining us.
>> thank you. >> primary voters rejecting candidates that crossed donald trump. they would rather nominate anyone else like say someone that owns and runs a brothel. that and donald trump's maybe subtle takeover of the republican party next. onus. for this new stepdad, it's promising to care for his daughter as if e's his own. every way we look out for those we love is an act of mutuality. we can help with t financial ones. learn more or find an advisor at massmutual.com we can help with t financial ones.
you always get the lowest price on our rooms, guaranteed?m let's get someone to say it with a really low voice. carl? lowest price guaranteed. what about the world's lowest limbo stick? how low can you go? nice one, carl. hey i've got an idea. just say, badda book. badda boom. badda book. badda boom. nice. always the lowest price, guaranteed. badda book. badda boom. book now at choicehotels.com wwow, this is quite the busyo. place. right? this is the product for you. (vo) the new bissell crosswave pet pro vacuums and washes at the same time. it's better than ever for homes with pets. there is a history of injustice in this country that goes back to the very first day. but there's also a history of people pushing for justice. when we think about fighting the injustice that is thisdent, i think we should take pride in trying to be part of that tradition. we have a president that has lied over and over again.
last night brought another round of primaries and the overarching lesson for republicans fromesterday's primaries was this. you can do just about anything and still win so long as you don't dare utter a negative word about donald trump. consider the man who won a nevada state assembly nomination dennis hof, author of the book titled "the art of the pimp."
they were the subject of the adult reality sears called "cat house." he took home a republican victory last night claiming it was because donald trump was the christophe columbus for me pep found the way and i jumped on it. virginia despite best efforts of gop leaders, republicans ch their senate nominee cory stewart, a man who defended monuments to the confederacy and wrapped himself in the confederate flag. >> i'm proud to be next to the confederate flag. that flagging is not about racism, folks. it's not about hatred. it's not about slavery. >> heritage of treason and slavery. cory stewart's heritage by the way is from minnesota. where they didn't have the confederate flag or if they did, it was as a thing they're boys were fighting.
he's made a habit of palling around with some of the worst people in america. onmp was inaugurated he described pul me t knee land as one of his herosen an appeared with the guy who organized the rally in charlottesville that ended up killing a woman. he disavowed them. on the other side is mark sanford who managed to win a house seat five years agofter had is affair with an argentine woman by falsely claiming to have been hiking the appalachian trail. he left as governor. i guess he never resigned. what he could not overcome was his criticism of the president. he lost hisrimary yesterday to a relative unknown w made sanford's anti-trump comments the centerpiece of campaign. there now no daylight between trump and the party he leads according to the rnc. >> there was a shift with president trump. il say proudly that the
republican party is the trump party. >> for more on donald trump's takeover of the republican party, contributor jennifer ruben, conservative columnist manager of the conservative website the blaze. erlogically conservative, extremely conservative, tea party guy once talked about as a presidential nominee before the affair fall from grace. he basically said some moderately truthful things about how he felt about the president. that's it. >> one of his grave offenses was asking for the president to release his tax returns. it the horror of it. you know? this is the problem. and this is why you see in the words of people like bob corker that you have a cult-like party at this point. they follow trump wherever he meanders because he's incoherent and inconsistent. there's incoherent and inconsistent. the problem comes when you hit the general election.
are these people now so tightly wrap around donald trump and his tax plan and his effort to take away protections for pre-existing medical coverage, are those people electable in a general election? in some places they will be. it may be in south carolina you can get away with that kind of stuff. but not in a lot of places. there are going to be a lot of competitive seats where all that trump hugging comes back to haunt these people. >> i thought the two responses to cory stt's win, a lot of people feel he is not a strong candidate. cory gardner who runs the senatorial campaign says it's not on our map. you've got former lieutenant governor of virginia, bill bowling republican i'm extremely disan opinioned cory stewart could win the nomination for u.s. senate. every time i think things can't get worse, they do. here's the president of the united states congratulations to cory stewart for his great
victory for senator from v virginia. he runs against a total stiff tim kaine. don't underestimate cory, a major chance of winning. thatums it all doesn't it? >> c stewart is probably going to lose by double digits in virginia. i won't be sad about that result i would point out, just to throw a little bit of nuance. we did have barbara comstock won in virginia against a guy and trump was kind of loyalty was the focal point ofhat race. comstock an us could of being insufficiently loyal to trump. id win in ohio recently, the less loyal to trump and martha mccolely will probably win over two people much more trump. it's a le less monolithic. >> to the point about barbara comstock, she only got 60% of the vote against this guy who is a extreme trumper. so is a prime target and she has pry tried to walk this tight
rope and doesn't want to offend trump voters too much but on the other hand, she is one of the top targeted seats in the country. >> i would also say to lyon's point, it's good to introduce that and definitely the case that not every race has been a referendum how loyal you are to trump has broken the president's way. all you have to do to instill in politicians is win a of those. that's the point. it's hard to challenge incumbents anyway. what you are seeing is enough of a pattern wouldn't you say, leon, that everyone who understands where the political incentives are understands there's no upside in going against the president. nd to thpoint, i don't think that is all nah that unusual. you think of george h.w. bush in his first term raised taxes appointed aeral justice to the supreme court. i did research on this. i couldn't find a single elected official whon in 1992 even though a large part of the voting base was opposed
to that. publiy against t nd officials president. trump is so far outside of presidential norms you would maybe like to see that more. i don't think it's unusual to not see it more. >> that's an interesting example. the point is buchanan, it is his party now. and in som ways buchanan understood the base better than george h.w. bush did or understood the future of the republican party. right now it is buchanan's party. here's steve king tweeting, europe is waking up. will america in time? and that is a link to british neo-nazi mark -- he is admirer of hitler self-avowed. that is a u.s. congressman tweeting out nazi propaganda. >> it is mazing. due cannon's problem is he was too early. he saw the wave rising but he was a decade org two early. the problem is that there isn't
a republican party that bill bowling and jennifer ruben can look at and say those are decent people with good policy ideas. it is the party of trump. i think suspecting or hope org wishing that it were different is simple r not realistic. >> i want to make clear that the calculation, to stick with trump is the correct one politically. from a diagnostic perspective, that is correct in the short term. in the long-term, it may all end in tears. we'll see. >> thank you both for being with me. >> thank you. still ahead a repor on what life is like inside a detention facility pa holding over 1,000 immigrant children. plus scott pruitt's residency continues in thing 1, thing 2 next. e new ego string trimmer with powerload™ technology. feed the line. push the button. and get back to work. with an industry first, carbon-fiber shaft...
lawn care has never been this easy... ...or this powerful. the new ego power+ string trimmer with powerload™ technology. exclusively at the home depot and ego authorized dealers. billions of problems. dry mouth? parched mouth? cotton mouth? there's a therabreath for you. therabreath oral rinse and lozenges. help relieve dry mouth using natural enzymes to soothe and moisturize. so you can... breathe easy, there's therabreath at walmart. we're listening to what matters most to you.
and we're committed to improving every ride. starting with features designed to make it easy for your driver to find you... taking the sess out of pickups. ♪ we're putting safety at the heart of everything we do... by making it easy to verify your car, and driver. uber hasdership, a new vision, and is moving in a new direction... forward t'sd to remember a time
when anyone has ever seen a major government official as brazenly unethical as scott pruitt. he's a sight to behold. there he is stillloyed. todaanother edition to his list of can dales. last week we learned he enlisted e of his epa employees to set up a meeting with the ceo of chick-fil-a try to land a sweet franchise for his wife. mm, chicken. >> look, my wife is an entrepreneur herself. i love, she loves, we love, chick-fil-a is a franchise of faith and it's one of the best in the country. so that's something we were very
excited about. the gig didn't pan outy because the lawyers at chick-fil-a were like there's no way you can give this gig his wife. today we learned from "the washington post" that pruitt kept the job search going. thise with repubn donors. again he enlisted a government paid aide, an employee of the federal government and eventually through some of those wealthy support ares mrs. pruitt got herself a job starting with a groupd the judicial crisis network l the previous dozen pruitt scandals that would normal result in investigations or indictment ofs but pruitt fe as long as nothing republican cares. some developments on that front are thing 2 in 60 seconds.
pruitt's friend jim inhofe who brought a snowball on the senate floor to prove global warning isn't real is having some >> afraid my good friend scott pruit has done some things that surprise. and i'm one who say this because frankly, he's a good friend of mine. i see these things. they upset me as much as they upset you. i think something needs to happen to change this. one of those alternatives would be for him to leave that job. >> maybe the worst sign for pruitt comes from his own epa spokesman who is no longe even trying t defend the straighter referring all questions to pruitt's outside counsel. i just hope pruitt had theoo sense not to hire michael cohen. dear future us, we have a mission: to help hand everyone a better world. that's why we, at the coca-cola company, make shore breaks with actual cocs. tea, organically. treats for celebrations.
i'm guessing that's about what's to happen. >> i think that's what they're doing. what is your name again. >> senator jeff merkley, u.s. senator jeff merkley. i've now been asked to leave the property. so i'll comply with that. >> two weeks ago is, senator jeff americacally tried to get a tour of a detention center at an abandoart that houses children. he was not allowed inside. no one would grant him an interview. today for the first time since he was asked, jacob sober rof finally did get a tour. jacob, you were with a few other journalists let into the facility. whid you see? >> you know, chris, i have been
inside federal a federal prison before, i've been inside s county jails. this place is called a shelter but effectively these kids are incourse rated there are over 1400 of them that are spending not weeks, months inside this place. they're not actually literally in canes in or in cells but i kid you not, one of the first things an employee said to me is when we walked inside, can you try to smile at these kids because it's weird to see people from the outside. they feel like animals locked up in cages being looked at. it was an extraordinary thing to see. >> talk me through what's it look like. it's a walmart that's been refashio is it open air rooms with beds like. >> it is. these kids are free to move around. there are four -- it's beak a dormitory structure. it's not nice by the standards of a place to be incarcerated.
fresh paint everywhere. a cafeteria for kids to go to, about 300 at a time. there are four beds per room. but right n there are five. they i have an variance from the state of texas sinceay because ofovercrowding crisis that's been created. manufactured basically. it's a self-inflicted crisis our colleague julia was saying earlier today because the trump administration is taking children from their parents and making them unaccompanied minors. this place used to be just for kids that would walk across the border for the most part 100% on their own. now you're get m more kids, up to 30% as of right now according to one official inside that have been separated from their parents over the last couple months. they have recreation but allowed outse where we are in the fresh air for two hours a day and the 22 hours a day, they're inside a former walmart. >> you have 1400 kids in there and maybe 70%, unaccompanied
minors is something that started and the government struggled to figure out what to do with them. a 15, 16-year-old walking across the border. kids taken from their parents who tend to be younger. do we have a sense of the age range of the kidsere. >>hey're all boys and from a 10 to 17. the thing that strikes me as a parent of a 2 nafls-year-old boy, what about from zero to 10. this is one of a hundred facilities like this across 17 states. this is the largest facility of its kind in the country. but there are 99 other ones. and we're only talking about 10 to 17-year-old boys in here. >> i got one boy. two girls. you got a 2 1/2-year-old boy. you gottish 14 00 buys aged 10 to 17. the ideal ratio would be 2800 adults to look after 1400 becomes how many adults are watching after that many boys?
>> one to eight is the ratio. there is one staff member for every incarcerated shelter resident is what they call them. and it's organized chaos in there. it's it's hectic but it is organized. and like i said, 300 kids at a time are going to the chow. it's like looking at a prison or a jail. they're all led to chow. there was a group of kids doing again, i kid you not, tai-chi or recreation or a group of boys sitting in the former loading dock of the walmart in a theater watching the disney movie "moana." they go to class for six hours and learn about american hist one of the most striking things i saw is this place has a lot of american history all over the place, inspirational quotes from former presidents. the first one that you see when you walk in is donald trump. >> there's a mural of donald trump. >> it's a mural of donald trump with quote from donald trump.
i'm paraphrasing talking about if you don't win the battle, there's a way to win the war. strange does not do it justice. what it's like in there. it's let me ask you this. let me ask youthis. this is a nonprofit that has been contracted with the federal government to run this facility. what is the level of training of these grown-ups who, you know, watching eight boys per grown-up for 22 hours day, that's very serious work that requires very serious training. >> yeah. and i want to be really clear. i think that there is very serious work and very serious training that goes on. these are accredited, licensed professionals, not just by the state of texas. this is a licensed facility. and it brings up the much larger question. you have a licensed teachers, clinicians, three on-call doctors around this facility at any time, a 48-person medical staff that's inside here. but what's being talked about with the administration is
moving or bringing children away from facilities like this, licensed facilities and on to tent cities on federal property. and what i was told tonight is that those tent cities that are being looked at here in texas and throughout the state of california aunlicensed facilities. it won't require necessarily on federal property because it's an emergency situation, the level of training, the types of professional. >> wow, they are taking care of the kids that are in this facility tonight. when they go lights out at 9:00 p.m. >> so final question. do you know -- unaccompanied minors are one thing. but the ones who travelled with a parent or guardian or dparent and were taken away from them, are there regular contacts they get to have with >> they wouldn't say regular, but they said it's basically up to the penal institution where they are. because, again, these kids, before this policy was
announced, most of these kids would end up in i.c.e. family detention with their families, whatever you want to think about it, they were together with their families. >> right. >> now they're being separated from their parents. they're being taken to the federal courthouse here in south texas. thparents are being remanded to the u.s. marshall's custody and they go to federal prison. so if the federal prison or the department of refugee resettlement in hhs says that that parent can call the child, the parent is allowed to call the child. but it's up to the penal institution. it happens, but it's not hoang a regular basis. >> well, jacob, this is fantastic reporting. thank you for giving us a glimpse inside. i really appreciate it. thanks. >> thanks, chris. thanks for staying on this, man. as the trump administration continues separating children from their families at the border, speaker paul ryan are allowing two bills to come to a vote. one a compromised bill that is still being hammered out, but is expected to include a provision to end family protection as well as offer protection f
dreamers. and one hard line bill that plans to clamp down more forcefully on illegal immigration. th chairman of the fedomcaucus garamendi of california. congressman garamendi, let me start with you on the compromise bill. >> sure. >> you would be excused for thinking the whole thing's a sucker's bet given there is nothing actually concrete yet. why are people who think it is a sucker's bet wrong? >> well, we're hopeful. we're hopeful. we know there is a problem. >> i heard a lot of suckers say they're hopeful in mytime. >> well, i'm going to be hopeful because we know we have a serious problem. you just talked about a very serious problem that's occurring in brownsville. mark and i would both agree it's a problem. we have to find a solution. it's our job to do that. right now mark and his team are working on a compromise, and i'll let him talk about it from his perspective, from our perspective on the democratic side, we've not been involved yet in that process. that would really be a true
compromise. but some of the things we have heard that may be discuss and perhaps mark will share some of that with us is in a positive direction. details we don't know. but i'm hopeful. i'm hopeful we can solve this kid problem that is a very serious thing, one i know i hate and mark and i were discussing this earlier. >> congressman meadows, let me ask you on that. >> sure. >> there is a way in which this shocks the conscience, almost unanimous. i saw a story about a breast-feeding mom who had her child literally taken away from her. she was nursing, a 4-month-old baby. what is your position on the current u.s. policy of taking children away from their parents across the boarder? >> obviously, i've been vocal on making sure that families stay together. and chris, let me just say this. my good friend matt fuller with "the huffington post" said this is the smartestle tv, and i had to come on tonig just to figure that out. >> well, thank you, matt. it's only because we've had him on and i paid him for that.
but i appreciate it nonetheless. >> but john is actually a good friend. we've been actually working on this. we represent two very separate districts, very distinct differences, north carolina, california. and yet we can come together on the fact that families need to be unified. so the decision that really has complicated thing along with a 307% increase in what i would say fraud, you know, trafficking, human trafficking, are they families, are they not, we've got to get to the bottom of it and make sure families stay together. but let me just say this. in the compromise bill, there is distinct and legislation that will address this very issue, and it's something actually that john and i have talked about a number of times. >> okay. first of all, i want to be specific here. >> yeah. >> in terms of are they families are, they not? and there has been some sort of post talk rationalization even in court that can be resolved with a dna test. if that's the concern --
>> that's part of it. but chris, you got a bigger problem. you've got 1400 people in a rehabbed walmart. obviously, we've got a problem at the border that we have to address, and we have to hopefully do that in a bipartisan way. >> but let me ask you this. want to conce that frame. problem at the border. what is the problem? people are coming here because they're fleeing horrible persecution and want the come to thisamazing country that you and i bothlove. >> listen, i love the american way there is a legal way to get here. there is a way that's not legal to get here. and as we look at that, if we let everyone in who wanted to come here, i can tell you that's just not a sustainable path that we can do. >> wait a second. asylum is legal. right? >> right, right. >> well, there is a couple of different pieces. you hit upon one of them. asylum is legal, and they present themselves and seek asylum >>t's right. >> that is one set of issues. there are others that sneak across the border illegall and we need to differentiate there.
>> sure. >> for those who are coming from asylum, there is no way that they should be separated from their kids. similarly, if they're c here illegally, they shouldn't beseparated, but that is a dierent question than is the asylum issue. >> wait,congressman, noddedad i want to get this on the record. if they're coming seek asylum, there is no way they should be separated from their kids. you agree with that? legitimate asylum, certainly i would agree with that. >> they don't know in advance whether they clear the review. >> sometimes they do. and, chris, you're smart enough to know that there are a number of people who game the system. and i'm not saying that the vast majo them do, you can on the internet and find it right now. but real asylum, am i supportive of th keeping families making history. john and i agree on it. >> i just wt to be clear. i know this sounds procedurbut >> right. >> what's ing right now, as far as i understand, and things are murky, and i talked to different lawyers. >> right. >> the prosecution is happening before anreview.
so my point is when you're talking about real asylum, these pele are coming. they're being prosecuted as criminals for entry. their children are being taken away before an asylum review. >> yeah, i don't know that i would agree with that, chris, be but go ahead. >> this is something that is clearly procedural. if somebody comes to the border and seeks asylum. >> yes. >> they're not sneaking in. >> correct. >> they're presenting themselves in what is an international legal way, seeking asylum. now, they may be cheating, but that can be adjudicated. >> yes. >> later. don't separate the kids from the parents. go through that legal adjudication, their hearings. and there is a whole series of questions about the hearings. that needs to be resolved also. but we should never separate. even if somebody is coming across illegally, you shouldn't separate them. iand you've got to deal with those who have presumably broken the law. again, you a legal process that you have to go through. i think part of our task is to make sure that the resources are la just with the police at the border, the
agents, but also i the legal review process, that there is sufficient resource, human resources, but also the physical resources for the kind of care that we should as human beings offer to another human being. >> so far this is encouraging on this issue. >> that's a good thing. >> i do find it encouraging. >> i really do think -- i do think there is sort of unanimity on this. >> sure. >> there is obligation people have morally that you don't take a 4-month-old away f her mother. final question for you, congressman meadows, there is do you understand this as a policy explicitly to deter people from seeking asylum here? to the secretary of department of homeland security as recent as a couple days ago is that it's not being done as a deterrent. that was a direct phone cosation i had with because i was concerned. but in the end, we're going to have to come together, republicans and democrats to try to make sure that what happens
is we find a solution. >> i might add something to that, chris. whether it is is not a deterrent or meant to be, it certainly is. but the real solution here is to deal with the problems in those countries from which they come. >> that is true. >> and that is something that the united states needs to pay attention to. >> congressmgoing to te you both back on the day you pass compromise legislation next week to end the practice. really serious than. i would love for you to take a collective victory lap here. mark meadows and john garamendi, thanks for being with me. >> thanks, chris. >> that is all for this evening. sh "the rachel maddow show" starts right now. it is a pleasure to watch you work and juggle those plates, man. nks. >> and thanks to you at home for joining us this hour. happy hump day. you know, we knew in advance that this was going to be a week with an impossible amount of news in it. that is definitely proving to be the case. but congratulations, you have reached the top of the mountain, or at least the top of the hump.