tv Hardball With Chris Matthews MSNBC June 21, 2018 4:00pm-5:00pm PDT
immigration vote not till tomorrow but to next week. that does it for our show. much more coverage of these important stories tonight. "hardball" with chris matthews starts now. >> trump caves and the blame game begins. let's play "hardball." good evening. i'm katy tur in for chris matthews. president trump spent the day lashing out at democrats and the mexican government in an effort to save face after his reversal on separating families at the border. buckling to pressure, he signed an executive order yesterday putting a temporary end to a crisis entirely created by his own administration. shortly thereafter the president who according to reports is worried about looking weak to supporters returned to his hawkish immigration talking points.
>> in mexico, they're doing nothing for us. nothing. you have a 2,000 journey through mexico and walk through mexico like it's walking through central park. one of the reasons i'm being tough because they do nothing for us at the border. they encourage people to walk through and go into the united states. >> in the end it wasn't international outrage, republican pushback or calls by religious leaders that swayed the president. it was these images, bad optics of small children crying that the president could not get away from. according to axios president trump experienced an overdose of the outrage and media frenzy. none of the white house messaging seemed to be helping. so he decided mostly on his 0 own rather than the urging of advisers that some action was required to change the narrative. it the new "time" magazine cover shows how bad things look for the white house. also today, first lady melania trump made an unannounced trip
to the u.s./mexican border visiting a children's shelter and reportedly telling detainees good luck. by signing the executive order yesterday, president trump pushed pause on a crisis he created and then struggled to contain. "the washington post" counted 14 different positions the administration has taken on the zero tolerance policy. let's watch just some of them. >> i have put in place a zero tolerance policy for illegal entry on our southwest border. if you cross the border unlawfully, then we will prosecute you. it's that simple. >> i hate the children being taken away. the democrats have to change their law. that's their law. you can't do it through an executive order. >> this administration did not create a policy of separating families at the boarder. >> hopefully, people will get the message and come through the border at the port of entry and not break across the border unlawfully. >> the president has promised the american people he is going to secure our border.
we don't like the policy here either. >> by the way, today i signed an executive order. we're going to keep families together. >> well, the separation of families is currently on hold. the crisis with these children is far from over. roughly 2400 ids under the age of 12 still remain in makeshift detention facilities and shelters. many of them are toddlers and infants. the executive order contained no language how these children will be reunited. additionally, any future families would still be detained as they await criminal prosecution and deportation, potentially indefinitely. >> for more i'm joined by jacob soboroff, correspondent just back from texas, jonathan lemire, an political analyst, susan page, "usa today" washington bureau chief and ephron, lawyer with the texas civil rights project. i want to get to the detainment centers and kids in a moment. first i want to talk about politics. the president last night at his rally in minnesota only talked
about the executive order for a very short period of time ta, maybe a couple sentences. if he was produced of it, if he had wanted to do it, he would have bragged about it, jonathan, for that entire rally. instead he bragged how tough he is, how tough is he on immigration. it feels like this is something that he had no desire to do. >> yes, you are exactly right. it was one brief passing mention of the order and he spent the rest of it almost frying to reprove his hawkish immigration bona fides. he was in the warm embrace of supporters at this rally. we both know how much he gets a charge out of that back among his people where everything he says they cheer and they scream when he makes fun of a cable network or hillary clinton, they'll spring back the old lock her up chants, on immigration, he was talking about he revived some of the rhetoric from his first campaign kickoff three years ago this week talking how mexico doesn't
send its best people suggesting that he wanted, i've been tough on the border this way. suggested the democrats are more interested in the rights of illegal immigrants rather than american citizens. that is part of what makes this president so frustrated is as this is crisis unfolded up till yesterday, he thought this was good for the republicans and good for the white house. he thinks being tough on immigration is a winner going into the midterms this year and says that's how i won the white house and how our party can do well this november. but the story got the better of him" images can overwhelmed him and he had to cave much to his dismay. >> he got a lot of pushbacking from everybody in the republican party, all the democrats, pundits, columnists, a lot of people in america, as well, he didn't win the popular vote but he still won and survived a lot of scandals nobody thought he would be able to be survive. he survived and thrived off the muslim ban. he thrived by creating this division.
was he wrong to believe this would work for him? >> very stark political terms, not in any moral terms, just stark political terms. >> absolutely. charlottesville, too. there have been controversy after controversy where the conventional wisdom is this is the end, this goes too far. proven wrong over and over again. i think there is some feeling that the had idea of the thousands of kids taken from their parents for parts unknown and in some secrecy, the administration is being -- is not being transparent where they are, how they're being treated or how they'll be reunited and in some cases i think though don't have any idea how the policy will unfold. in other cases they realize what we keep calling the optics of this are just really devastating. and they're not devastating for some of the president's core supporters who are very much supporting the deaf zero tolerance for illegal immigrants but for swing voters for
suburban voters, for mothers everywhere, i think there are a lot of voter who's look at this and say this is not who we are. this cannot stand. that's why you saw this grudging concession, i think you could tell in his comments today just how unhappy he was he had to reverse himself on this. >> jeff sessions appeared on christian broadcast network today. he said he didn't anticipate is the public backlash to the zero tolerance policy. and never intended to separate migrant children from their parents. here that is. >> it hasn't been good. and american people don't like the idea that we're separating families. we never really intended to do that. what we intended to do was to make sure that adults who bring children into the country are charged with the crime they've committed. i think it's the right thing. we'll work our way through it. and try to do it in the most compassionate way possible. >> the body language right there and the way that jeff sessions
was even speaking is a lot different than we normally see him when he gets on stage or a podium and smiles through whatever policy he is announcing or whatever defense he is giving. that was certainly different in that interview. it's not what the administration originally said was the point of the zero tolerance policy. let's watch that. >>. >> are you considering this a deterrent? >> yes, hopefully people will get the message and come through the border at the port of entry. >> we have to break up families. the democrats gave us that law. >> are department of homeland security personnel going to separate the children from their moms and dads. >> yes, i am considering in order to deter more movement along this terribly dangerous network. i am considering exactly that. >> in the beginning it was always this idea that we're going to separate families so families know not to come over the border. also, it's humanitarian because they shouldn't be making this dangerous journey. >> i'm flabbergasted listening to jeff sessions the first time
i him say that, excuse me while i pick my chin up off the floor. we know he announced this policy and that he wanted to separate children from their parents all along. we know this administration knew the deterrent put into place under the clinton administration resulted in more people dying in the desert. we know deterrence doesn't work and it has terrible unintended consequences. he knew he was going to take children away from families. this is one of the most scarring things i've seen with my own two eyes in my entire life. i hope those images are plastered across washington, d.c. for a really long time to come, including for everybody in in administration that something to do with it and pretended they didn't. >> this is according to the reporting out there was bad optics for. the president stayed ivanka told him, daddy this looks bad. tell us how bad it actually is, not how bad it looks. >> it blows my mind we're even talking about it in terms of optics. we're talking about little children sitting on the floor in
cages on mattresses with mylar blankets with somebody in a watch tower for a security contracting company that is usually reserved for military bases or other stuff like that, sitting there and watching over them like they're in a prison daycare. it's not optics. it's inhumane. the fact that the fact that this could come from an administration or from any administration that claims to care about kids and to claim to care about americans it blows my mind. >> ef rom, the president sign this had executive order. does that mean the crisis is over? >>. >> no, it's not order, far from it. some things have gotten worse because now we're thinking indefinite detention of families. here on the ground this morning we interviewed 17 parents separated from their children. they don't know where their children are and what conditions they're being held or when or if they'll see them again. there's no plan in the executive order. it's silent on anything about reuniting these 2400 children with their parents.
>> how complicated and difficult is it to reunite these families? i was talking to an intercept reporter today who spoke to a woman who she considers to be one of the lucky ones who made it out, had a credible threat assessment essentially saying she could go further with her asylum claim. she was let out of the detention center and able to pick up her 6-year-old son that same day will that happen for everybody? >> it will certainly not happen for everybody because we have many cases in which the parents are detained at immigration facility in new york, seattle, other parts of texas while the children are in shelters with orr in south texas and georgia and many other parts of the country. and the two systems orr shelter system where the children are and the i.c.e. facility facility system are not designed to communicate with each other that that's causing the chaos. >> not only that, we don't know
if there are any of these parents who have already been deported. if your parent has been deported and you're a child sitting in a detention center and now in an hhs shelter and your parent is backing in el salvador or honduras or got mala, you may never see your parent again. >> what about the babies who can't say this is my mom, hearse my name, here's my phone number. >> what if you're one of those babies that was taken into custody in that dhs facility in the interim in between when this executive order was signed and when the policy was put into place? these people are left in imbow hanging in the balance. because of two months of politics basically. >> as i mentioned a little earlier, first lady melania trump made a surprise visit to texas today but as she tried to maybe clean up the mess her husband made, she created a new controversy wearing a jacket with the phase, "i don't really
care, do you." her spokesperson said this is nos hidden message. it was however something her her husband focused on. i tweeted i don't really care do you refers to the fake news media. melania has learned how dishonest they are and she truly no longer xarpz john, what's happening here. >> first of all there's the president directly contradicting account first lady's chief spokes woman. that jacket caught reporters attention as she boarded the plane at andrews air force base when on her way to texas. it became a bit of a stir online when she was there is meeting these children. she was not wearing the jacket while touring the facilities and meeting the workers there and the children there. but then full well knowing it had become a bit of a flap, she put it back on. when she landed in d.c. a few hours later, mind you 85 and humid in washington, not jacket
weather. >> is it a message to the media or somebody else. >> donald trump suggests it's a message to the media. i think there are other possible conclusions. perhaps it's a message to critics elsewhere, perhaps to her husband. we don't know. we can only go on what they're telling us. it is a puzzing choice for this administration what should have, could have been a good news story this becomes a distraction. >> we had no intention of covering this tonight. we were not going to talk about it till the president tweeted about it and made it a bigger story and made us wonder what exactly was going on there. susan though, going back to melania and her visit today and the intention of it, is this a pr strategy by the white house? is it good cop, bad cop or was she going there on her own accord? i ask that because the good will that might have been created by that was stepped on by the president coming out and just spitting anger and lies at where this policy and this law initially came from for 30 some minutes at the white house.
>> you know the first lady's spokespeople say that it was on her initiative that the president was aware she was going to make this trip but it was not at his instruction. i think gimp her behavior in the past, she has been pretty reluctant to be a tool of the administration and of the pr machine at the white house. i assume that's correct that this was a decision she made. i think she might have had an audience of one mind and that audience of one would be the president. her husband. saying this is something i care about. her focus down there was not on people coming over the border or gangs. it was on what is happening to these children, are they being taken care of. i think that was a deliberate message. the jacket i'm sure it means something because we know she's a really careful dresser, a great dresser. i'm sure it wasn't coincidental. but i hope she will wear some additional clothing that expl n explains who she aimed at that. >> maybe my name is tagged. jacob, you wanted to add one
thing. >> i don't care about the jacket but what i do care about is there were two shelters she was supposed to go to today, the other was the detention center where the kids are in cages on the floor. we heard it was because of inclement weather and it was flooding. i got out and i was able to make it here. the fact she didn't go to the shelter where the kids are on the floor in cages is disappointing to me. i wish she would have had the opportunity to see it. >> is there anything you want to convey to me i might not have seen in the coverage we've been doing? >> it is the most -- it is the most unexpected horrific thing that i've ever seen and i never would have thought i would see in the united states of america see little kids sitting by themselves in a prison playground. >> jacob, jonathan, susan, and ephron, thank you very much. a program note, jacob will be reporting on the border crisis on "dateline" this sunday. the dividing line airs at 7:00
eastern. coming up another embarrassing defeat for the party that controls washington. with republicans struggling to find votes for an immigration bill. how much damage was caused by the self-anointed dealmaker in chief because right now, it looks like trump can't get his own house in order. plus is, trump's fixer ready to flip. >> michael cohen is reportedly fuming that trump isn't helping pay his legal bills. now there's a new sign he's fed up with the president. and how much i've role did melania play in the president's about face on immigration? the "hardball" roundtable tackles that and stunning new reporting on donald trump jr. they'll also tell me three things i don't know. this is "hardball" where the action is. t great not having hepatitis c. it's like a load off my shoulders. i was just excited for it to be over. harvoni is a revolutionary treatment for the most common type of chronic hepatitis c. it's been prescribed to more than a quarter million people and is proven to cure up to 99% of patients
who have had no prior treatment with 12 weeks. certain patients can be cured with just 8 weeks of harvoni. before starting harvoni your doctor will test to see if you've ever had hepatitis b which may flare up and cause serious liver problems during and after harvoni treatment. tell your doctor if you've ever had hepatitis b, a liver transplant, other liver or kidney problems, hiv or any other medical conditions and about all the medicines you take including herbal supplements. taking amiodarone with harvoni can cause a serious slowing of your heart rate. common side effects of harvoni include tiredness, headache and weakness. ready to let go of hep c? ask your hep c specialist about harvoni. donald trump's national security adviser john bolt is heading to moscow next week to set the groundwork for a potential meeting between trump and vladimir putin in july. the possibility of a meeting was floated when the two spoke by
phone in march. and we'll be right back. to get excited about things like concert tickets or a new snowboard. matt: whoo! whoo! jen: but that all changed when we bought a house. matt: voilà! jen: matt started turning into his dad. matt: mm. that's some good mulch. ♪ i'm awake. but it was pretty nifty when jen showed me how easy it was to protect our home and auto with progressive. [ wrapper crinkling ] get this butterscotch out of here. progressive can't protect you from becoming your parents. there's quite a bit of work, 'cause this was all -- this was all stapled. but we can protect your home and auto when you bundle with us.
hi!but we can protect your home and auto are you two getting along? oh, yeah, yeah. [ hiss ] [ gasps ] [ birds chirping] ♪ no matter what you are they're a perfect match. the new ipad and xfinity stream app. hey guys, i'm home! surprise! i got a puppy. add an ipad to select packages for just $5 a month for 24 months. upgrade online now.
so i actually think we're advancing the cause even if something doesn't necessarily pass. i think these are the seeds that will be plants for an ultimate solution, whether they get through today or tomorrow or the day of that. >> welcome back to "hardball." that was house speaker paul ryan trying to lower expectations as his party faced another test of whether they can actually govern. the house was supposed to vote on two competing immigration bills to address the favorite daca recipients and keep families together at the border. the more conservative bill failed to pass this afternoon and republican leadership postponed a vote on their bill till next week. >> president trump seemed to drop a bomb on negotiations this morning suggesting passing any bill is a waste of time. trump wrote, what is the purpose of the house doing good immigration bills when you need nine votes by democrats in the
senate? and the demes are only looking to obstruct which they feel is good for them for the midterms. republicans must get rid of the stupid filibuster rule. it is killing you! >> i'm joined now by new york republican congressman tom reed. what's going on with the president? is he helping you pass immigration. >> well, you know, obviously the president is sending a message we need to fix this. >> just said why bother to do anything? the democrats won't help you. that was him just saying throw in the towel. >> let's be honest, you need 60 votes in the senate to fix it. that will require ten dras to come over and work with republicans to get this done. we can do our job in the house and need to do our job in the house. >> what are the chances right now that this compromise immigration bill actually does get passed? the vote has been delayed another week. >> obviously, that's not a good signal. i accept that. there's going to be work being done over the weekend. we should act on this. i signed the discharge petition
to force the debate on immigration. i know these kids need relief, necessary families need relief today. we should fix this for longer term solutions for everyone involved. >> the democrats said they do want to come to a compromise. they don't want to give the president all of his concessions. they want to make sure the families aren't getting separated and there's likely some protections for daca. are there not things that republicans and democrats can find middle ground on? i asked about the president's tweet. it seems to say even if you're looking to compromise, don't bother. >> the problem solvers caucus the group we represent had a proposal and we coupled -- there are democrats that understand our border is not working not keeping us secure, not functioning. if you can solve the border security problem with these kids, both the families and dreamers that is a winning combination. they want to be there. i do believe there is an opportunity to negotiate a compromise here if this bill doesn't pass next week, but we
have an opportunity to get it done and need it done for the people back home. >> has the president been helpful? i ask that because we heard the other day in that meeting with republican lawmakers that he will trashed mark sanford. he said i want to congratulate him on running a great race. and basically went on to say that he was a nasty guy and trashed him. congressman labrador came out afterwards and said that this was not helpful that, donald trump needs to understand that he may have actually -- that may have lost him votes at this meeting. the reason he was there was to emphasize he had our backs and i think a different message was sent that day. doesn't he have a point that this is a message donald trump sent, i don't have your back if your dare criticize me? >> politics is a people business. we need to do policy that helps people. i think most members can set aside any type of petty personal difference or personal an frof they may have so long as we're
fixing problems for the people back home. that's what he this problem represents. we need to solve this for the people involved because they're the ones being head hostage by the inability of us in congress as well as in both chambers to come to a solution that addresses these issues. >> tom reed of new york, thank you very much. >> thanks so much. and even as republicans struggle with their own immigration legislation, president trump continues to pin the blame on democrats. this morning he lashed out at party leaders like nancy pelosi and chuck schumer on twitter accusing them of being responsible for the nation's immigration problems and in favor of open boarders. the president doubled down on that charge again this afternoon. >> loopholes in our immigration laws all supported by extremists can open border democrats and that's what they are, if you look at nancy pelosi, you look at chuck schumer, you'll see tapes where they wanted to have borders. they needed borders for
security. just a short while ago. now all of a sudden, they're big open border people. it's a whole big con job. in the meantime people are suffering because of the democrats. >> california democratic representative anna eschew joins me now. what do you think of what the president said? do the democrats just want open boarders and want to obstruct? >> i think what he said is pathetic. because he is a master of diversion push something goes wrong, he diverts. and he blames someone else for something. it's so undignified. it's so undignified. there have always been disagreements between the parties, between who is in the white house and who may be in the senate, who may be in the house. but we've never fallen to this low place. and i think this is where donald trump has taken us. so i think it's pathetic.
it's sad for the country. it's sad for the country. >> if you strip away the language, there are people out there who will say why didn't this get done, why didn't immigration get done while barack obama was president? why did that not happen? looking back. >> we were on our way to. we were on our way to. >> and you were on your way. i want to ask this specific question. >> i know. >> let me ask the question. looking back, is there anything you would have wanted your party to do differently, anything at all? >> well, i think that the biggest mistake was on the part of the speaker when he wouldn't allow the bipartisan comprehensive immigration reform bill that the senate had written and passed to be brought to the floor of the house. we should be able to vote. would it pass? some would vote aye, some would
vote nay but we should have the opportunity to vote. and it was not brought to the floor of the house. tan all went downhill after that. it all went downhill after that. and today, you be saw where the majority can't even pass their own bill. and the other bill is delayed. so we're getting nowhere fast. we have a crisis now in our country. we're disgraced in the world community because of what's taking place, the crisis with children being separated from their families and an executive order last night that reunites families in jail. how is that for the united states of america? >> are you favor in. >> i can't believe this is my country. >> are you in favor of the compromise bill? >> no, i'm not because it does nothing about the separation of families. it doesn't speak to these almost
2500 children how they're going to be reunited with their families. some experts say they may never see them again. so that's not legislation that's becoming of the values of this great country. i think it's sad. and i don't think it's anywhere near the best that we should be doing. and it does -- it will take 20 years for someone that has daca stat to us ever have a pathway to citizenship. come on. the president's said a con game? come on. >> anna eshoo, thank you very much. up next, there are new indications that trump's long time attorney michael cohen may be ready to flip. it certainly seems like the president's fixer is looking for a life preserver of his own. this is "hardball." where the action is. this is your wake-up call. if you have moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis, month after month,
the clock is ticking on irreversible joint damage. ongoing pain and stiffness are signs of joint erosion. humira can help stop the clock. prescribed for 15 years, humira targets and blocks a source of inflammation that contributes to joint pain and irreversible damage. humira can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. serious, sometimes fatal infections and cancers, including lymphoma, have happened; as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems, serious allergic reactions, and new or worsening heart failure. before treatment, get tested for tb. tell your doctor if you've been to areas where certain fungal infections are common, and if you've had tb, hepatitis b, are prone to infections, or have flu-like symptoms or sores. don't start humira if you have an infection. help stop the clock on further irreversible joint damage. talk to your rheumatologist. right here. right now. humira.
no matter how much you clean, does your house still smell stuffy? that's because your home is filled with soft surfaces that trap odors and release them back into the room. so, try febreze fabric refresher. febreze finds odors trapped in fabrics and cleans them away as it dries. use febreze every time you tidy up to keep your whole house smelling fresh air clean. fabric refresher even works for clothes you want to wear another day. make febreze part of your clean routine for whole home freshness.
welcome back to "hardball." even though michael cohen hasn't been charged with a crime, there's been a steady drum beat of reporting suggesting he may be ready to flip on the president. most recently cohen quit his post at the rnc and in doing so, broke ranks with the president over immigration. according to abc news, cohen wrote in his resignation letter while i strongly support measures that will secure our porous borders children should never be used as bar giving
chips. this comes after the "wall street journal" reported that cohen has told friends he is frustrated that the president hasn't offered to pay his legal fees and that he feels mr. trump owes him after his years of loyalty. a friend of cohen's spelled it out more explicitly to cnn saying if they want information on trump, he's willing to give it. i'm joined by aaron blake, an senior political reporter with the "washington post." welcome. let's first start with this new reporting from "the washington post" that the national enquire ker sent over articles to michael cohen during the campaign for his approval before they posted them? >> yeah, this is because it speaks to the relationship between the two the sides. of course, it's always been known that the president and the publisher of the "national enquirer" david pecker have had a close personal relationship over the years. the question though has really been whether there were special favors that were offered
especially aspartames to the magazine stories specifically about karen mcdougal, whether there was any advance notice provided, weather michael cohen was involved in these things. the west tonight is reporting that there were instances after the president was inaugurated in which the "national enquirer" did share digital copies of stories that it was going to run about the president with michael cohen in some cases taking cues from him about things that should be in that article and then running with them before they would go to print. the magazine denies this. they say that this is not their practice. they have said that there was no wrongdoing involved. there was no involvement with michael cohen. as far as killing the karen mcdougal story. but this certainly raises questions just how tight that relationship has been, not just after the inauguration but, of course, before it, as well. >> whether donald trump has a
propaganda arm. true propaganda arm. let's talk about mike cohen and whether or not he's ready to flip. sources are telling the "washington journal" he's ready to cooperate with prosecutors. from all the sources i've had he hasn't had a conversation with the sdny. it would be premature to talk about any deal being made till that happened. usually you wait till a client is indicted to find out what they are charged with and what they would be willing to trade in return. why would these stories be floated out there then? what's the other reason? >> yeah, i think you make a good point. the timing is pretty remarkable because we haven't gotten to that point in this process. i think it's really interesting that this came just a few days after michael cohen had reportedly hired a new lawyer, somebody who used to work with the southern district of new york which, of course, is the office that is in investigating michael cohen. the fact that we saw basically three stories coming out over the course of a day from "the
wall street journal," cnn and this resignation from the rnc, i think it's pretty unmistakable the fact that a word is being put out that michael cohen feels somewhat neglected, he wants a show of support. the "wall street journal" says he wants funding for his legal case to take place here. currently, the rnc is funding some of his case when itps could to the russia investigation but not his own personal case. you know, the fact that all of these came out shortly after hiring a new lawyer who was already rumored might be part of putting together some kind of a deal i think it's all kind of an unmistakable signal at least they want to float this trial balloon and send a signal that perhaps michael cohen is not feeling particularly loved right now by the president. the question is whether or not that's actually a precursor to flipping or just something of a warning shot, something of a signal just trying to get the white house to maybe play ball with them a little bit and send some signals potentially about a
pardon is, maybe about funding his legal case. we don't know at this point but the timing of these is extremely con pick hispanicious. >> thank you, aaron blake of the "washington post." >> thank you. up next, culture wars are now a defining feature of the political landscape thanks to president trump. is this a winning approach for the republican party? that's ahead. you're watching "hardball." ng oo the street when you barely clip a passing car. minor accident-no big deal, right? wrong. your insurance company is gonna raise your rate after the other car got a scratch so small you coulda fixed it with a pen. maybe you should take that pen and use it to sign up with a different insurance company. for drivers with accident forgiveness, liberty mutual won't raise their rates because of their first accident. liberty stands with you. liberty mutual insurance.
welcome back to "hardball." trump's rhetoric on immigration played a central role in this week's coverage of the children separated from their parents at the border. most notably when he tweeted that democrats want illegal immigrant no matter how bad they may be to pour into and infest our country. pay attention to that word. trump has long taken advantage of the culture wars. let's watch. >> they're drug traffickers. they're human traffickers. they're coyotes.
i mean, we're getting some real beauties. >> i think there's blame on both sides. you look at -- you look at both sides. i think there's blame on both sides. and i have no doubt about it, and you don't have any doubt about it either but you also had people that were very fine people on both sides. >> our current president came out of nowhere. came out of nowhere. in fact, i'll go a step further. the people that went to school with him, they never saw him. they don't know who he is. >> you have to stand proudly for the national anthem or you shouldn't be playing. you shouldn't be there. maybe you shouldn't be in the country. >> phil rucker writes in the west that trump is calculating by playing to people's fears and anxieties he can maximize turnout among hard-core supporters to counter balance evident enthusiasm on the kra democratic side, fueling his approach is an unremitting fear of his own that his base cos abandon if he's seemed too weak
on immigration. tonight's "hardball" roundtable, shell bill holliday, mara gay, a member of "the new york times" editorial board and susan delpercio, a republican strategist and msnbc political analyst. why is it, susan, that the through line for all of donald trump's most controversial moments all have to do with race? >> because he thinks that that's a group that will come to the polls for him no matter what. and it is about race and those comments are racist. and he believes he -- he did this with saying he didn't know david duke, the former head of the kkk. >> is he banking on -- is he banking on racism in his votes are that his vote ares are racists? >> yes, absolutely. but here's the problem with his strategy. first of all, he's not on the ballot. so his -- he does not transfer on to other candidates. people don't come out for other candidates because of donald trump.
and what he's -- when he does this, even if the base does cop out for him, it increases the turnout much more for democrats. you keep the base an extras 5% but the democrats are turn an extra 12%. it's a losing strategy. >> the terms he's using when he goes out and talks about immigration, we played some of them a moment ago, terms like infest. >> so that's actually extremely scary. that's how you dehumanize a group before you go after them. anybody hob studied history knows that and that's what makes it so terrifying because one of the things that you do to set the stage for oppressing people and victimizing them is to dehumanize them because it becomes easier to mistreat them. it becomes i think harder for other americans in this case to empathize with them because they're not like us. i want to say to susan's point, she's right but racism is not
under the purview solely of the republican party. i think the really insidious thing that the republicans have done not just with donald trump but for years, i mean in some ways this is the end game, the apex of race-baiting in the republican party under trump, but this has been going on for a long time. what the republicans have done is use race i think which is already there to get votes and to divide us for years. >> it's to keep the votes they have and get every last one because instead of expanding the party, they're just relying on getting every last person out there. >> let's talk about that. before donald trump was elected there was talk of expanding the party, trying to appeal to younger people, to a more diverse crowd. that was the gop strategy. why are -- why are leaders of the gop sitting quietly in the shadows when donald trump goes out and says these things? >> that i can't answer but i do know that everyone's jaw just
dropped on election night when republicans took the house, took the senate, donald trump had this big victory. people did truly believe that donald trump helped the republican party that night more than anyone could have imagined. i will never forget being in pennsylvania before the election and speaking to people, there was one man in particular who said i've never voted in my life and i'm going to the polls with blews and whistles and my donald trump flag. those are the kind of people that show up at rallies. president trump just had one of the worst weeks of his presidency and people are lining up to get into his rallies. it's very hard to judge how this will impact elections but i do think turnout, yes, is definitely important for the president. >> he got a really big crowd last night. >> huge crowd. >> those are the hard-core. those are the people who will show up for him if he does shoot someone on fifth avenue. those are the hardest core people. you're never going to change their minds. >> they're still chanting build the wall. >> lock her up. >> and they still -- here's the funny part.
they still believe oh, so mexico will pay for it. i like hearing him say it. they get charged off of just his rhetoric more than anything else. policies they don't care as much. >> it's emotional, cultural, tribal. there's nothing about it intellectual. will as though there's a fever in the country among his supporters. >> the roundtable will stay with us. up next, gq takes a deep dive into donald trump jr.'s struggle to get out of president trump's shadow. you're watching "hardball." foud age-related macular degeneration, amd, i wanted to fight back. my doctor and i came up with a plan. it includes preservision. only preservision areds 2 has the exact nutrient formula recommended by the national eye institute to help reduce the risk of progression of moderate to advanced amd. that's why i fight. because it's my vision. preservision. try areds 2 + multivitamin.
the world is full of different hair. that's why pantene has the perfect conditioners for everyone. from air-light foam, to nourishing 3 minute miracle, to the moisture-infusing gold series. we give more women great hair days - every day. pantene. ♪ now that i'm on my way ♪ do you still think i'm crazy standing here today ♪ ♪ i couldn't make you love me applebee's 2 for $20, now with steak. now that's eatin' good in the neighborhood.
epa administrator scott pruitt has been plagued by controversies. the seemingly endless list involved chick-fil-a franchises, the acquisition of a used trump hotel mattress, seriously, a particularly fancy lotion offered to guests at the ritz carlton, as well. today, we have yet another documents obtained by the intercept show that pruitt spent more than $4.6 million of public money on security that includes more than $2700 spent on tactical pants and tactical polos. apparently that type of getup does not come cheap. we'll be right back with more "hardball" and the roundtable. stay with us. (anna) show me the movies.
(male friend) thanks for the invite! (anna) front row? nobody puts baby in a corner. yippee ki yay movielovers. (vo) download the atom app and get $5 off your first ticket. theseare heading back home.y oil thanks to dawn, rescue workers only trust dawn, because it's tough on grease yet gentle. i am home, i am home, i am home
trump jr., julia writes all he ever wanted to do was to make his proud. she adds donald trump was never keen on bequeathing his name to anybody. it was ivana who wanted to call him donald junior. you can't do that, trump is quoted as saying in her memoir, raising trump. what if he's a loser? julia notes trump junior's once private desires to win approval now come packaged as angry tweets and memes tearing down his dad's opponents. what do you make of that, susan? >> i think it's basically true. i think this is a young man who always wanted to get his father's approval. if you read the story from when he was a child, when he didn't hate his father, he south approval. that's what we saw when he worked on the campaign whether it was even holding that russia meeting. it was to try and get something to give to his dad, like i good this for you, dad. >> i've heard that from folks who know him.
they believe don junior would have done anything to make his dad happy and proud and impressed. they doubted if anything came out of that meeting he would not have gone up to his father immediately, the fact they even had the meeting they doubt he wouldn't have told his dad about it. >> certainly when i'm reading the article, the question is -- is he doing something now perhaps covering up what happened at this meeting to also help his father. if you look back at some of the transcripts and timelines surrounding the trump tower meeting response innocence 2017, there were a lot of messages between donald trump jr.'s lawyer and the russians involved as well as the rob goldstone, the british man who was connected to the russians and it just -- the way that the response came out, the way that we are continuing to learn more about this meeting makes you wonder, is he covering something up to help his father. he just wants approval. he just wants to help him. and. >> he's covered up. >> russia investigation. >> during election, there was
one moment where donald trump jr. gave a speech an the rnc. a lot of people talked about his own political future. a few days later, he donald trump said russia if you're listening, find the e-mails. no, he would never do that, no, he can't do that. >> mara, take it away. >> hard to say if that's because of something he did or just because his father had it out for. >> doesn't want to share the limelight. >> that piece was extraordinary and enough to almost make you feel sorry for don junior. honestly, a lot of people have tough child loods. not everybody grows up and you know, engages in some of the complicity and bigoted behavior and really ugliness and vitriol he has. and i think some of the details in that piece were just kind of brutal and gives you a sense of what the family is like. >> the roundtable is staying with us. up next, these these will tell
me something i don't know. you're watching "hardball." i only speak to raptors. hey blue. i brought you something. okay. whaa! am i dead? not yet kid. aahh! if i don't make it back, remember you're the one that made me come here. i'll be alright. [ roar ] rated pg-13. wemost familiar companies,'s but we make more than our name suggests. we're an organic tea company. a premium juice company. a coconut water company. we've got drinks for long days. for birthdays. for turning over new leaves. and we make them for every moment in every corner of the country. we are the coca-cola company, and we're proud to offer so much more.
use febreze every time you tidy up to keep your whole house smelling fresh air clean. fabric refresher even works for clothes you want to wear another day. make febreze part of your clean routine for whole home freshness. a peaceful night sleep without only imagine... frequent heartburn waking him up. now that dream is a reality. nexium 24hr stops acid before it starts for all-day, all-night protection. can you imagine 24 hours without heartburn?
we're back with the "hardball" roundtable. shelby, tell me something i don't know. >> there is an old settlement that could really sink donald trump's new attempt to keep families together. it's called the flores agreement that ghompbs how children are supposed to be cared for when they cross the border illegally. this could cause the administration some huge problems. >> i've heard that too. >> mara. >> you knew it. >> that's why i cover this.
>> i.c.e. has been conducting checkpoint stops on the northern border as it turns out. some local maine newspapers have been writing about checkpoints in kind of in the middle of nowhere in maine. it gins you a sense of the scope of the agency. >> totally switching it up, jared kushner we know he's in charge of solving middle east peace. well, the administration's proposal peace proposal is out in about two or three weeks they suspect. and this is like do or die for jared. he's got to deliver this because he can't take another ding from the president. >> what's he going to do? >> depending how it comes out. >> the flores settlement, the thing i heard about it was you can only keep children in detainment for so long regardless of whether or not they're with their family, 20 days. there will be a hart point somebody will sue and it will go to the courts and donald trump will either have to push forward with the lawsuit or roll it back and say listen, my hands are
tied. >> an obama lawyer bet me $75,000 he would not be successful. >> wow. >> shelby holliday, mar rare gay, susan, thanks for being with us. "all in with chris hayes" starts right now. >> tonight on "all in." >> they walk through mexico like it's walking through central park. it's ridiculous. >> the president's catastrophe continues. >> what happens to the kids now they've been separated from their parents. >> tonight, new confusion and chaos. as an administration that stripped 2,000 children from their parents cannot answer how they plan to reunite the families they tore apart. then "all in" expleusive video. migrant children led through an airport without parents in sight. plus, through the propaganda. >> president t