tv The Rachel Maddow Show MSNBC June 29, 2018 9:00pm-10:00pm PDT
york. >> it is a big newsy weekend. it is going to be at least one demonstration in every state in the country tomorrow. all of those coordinated demonstratio demonstrations, we think there will be more than 700 of them. now there are a whole bunch of developments of kids being separated from their families.
a whole bunch of officials who actually work at i.c.e. who are currently employed at immigration customs and enforcement coming out with a surprising statement on this issue. we'll have more coverage on that over the course of this hour. i need to tell you we have senator cory booker tonight live and in person, very much looking forward to talking him. senator booker have begun making a force full ca a forceful case in the u.s. senate. justice kennedy have announced his statement in court. no president has made an appointment to the u.s. supreme court when he and his campaign were the subject of the ongoing syria fbi counter intelligence investigati investigation. if the president himself end up indicating on that ongoing investigation which is not an
insane prospect. the president's campaign manager is about to go on trial next month in federal court on multiple felly felony charges. >> that'll in stand to call into question of a whole bunch of legal constitutions that has never been formally settled by the supreme court. can a sitting president be compelled the testify if you give them a grand jury subpoena. can a sitting president be indicted. it does not settle as a matter of constitutional law. that's not the sort of thing that comes up in flederal court. if that possibility arose of this scandal, the supreme court has to settle that matter.
can a president pardon himself while he's continuing to serve as president on that one. the president says on twitter that he can but that does not bind the president yet. tries to do that, the supreme court has to decide if that is kosher. if there ends up a criminal case against the president and serious enough that he tries to invoke never before use hypothetical get out of jail free cards, well, who's on the supreme court and how they view these unsettled matters would be sort of life and death issues for this moment in american democracy. so can the president appoints someone to fill the seat in the supreme court while this investigation is still open and ongoing. just to show this is not some concerns, consider one of the candidates the president is considering, actually the guy who's considered by most observers to be at the top of the short list.
the guy that's considered by the people of the most likely nominee is the judge on the d.c. circuit. judge cavanof. he has expressed in writing that the nighttiindictment of the int would cripple the government. >> that's interesting from judge kavanaugh. it may be a fun thing to chew over with him on the law review. it is another thing entirely that he's considered for the supreme court by the president who's campaign manager is on trial. they're all awaiting sentencing and cooperating with prosecutors in this ongoing fbi counter intelligence investigation. no president picked the supreme
court nominee of looking down this potential liability himself. >> senator cory booker says supreme court nomination under these circumstances should not happy just as a single matter of a legal conflict of interests. senator booker will be here in just a moment to make a case on that point. in terms of how long this is a live issue and how long this is going to go on. the president told reporters that he'll start to meet candidates this weekend. he's going meet with supreme court nominees, potential nominees. he expects to make the announcement who he's going to pick in a week and a half which is really fast and why the rush? to the extent of the counsel's investigation, well, we got a bunch more news today about the
pace at which all of these legal proceedings are unfolding. >> mike flynn pled guilty last year in december. today the prosecutors in the flynn's case and flynn's defense lawyer says in a joint filing that yet again they are still not ready to wrap up his case. they're still not ready to end the legal proceedings involving michael flynn. his guilty plea and his agreement to cooperate with prosecutors in the investigation, those two things were linked, right? >> guilty plea and the cooperation deal. mike flynn did plea guilty so he's expecting some form of punishment from the court. how much punishment he gets depends on how he helps prosecutors in the meantime. this filing today from flynn's lawyer and prosecutors suggest that even after seven months he
pled guilty and cooperat cooperate -- suggests that he's helping prosecutors. they're asking for another two months extension before they wrap up flynn's case. >> the court ordered the party to file a joint status report by no later than june 29th of 2018. the party do not believe that this matter is ready to be scheduled for a sentencing hearing at this time. but actually right below that you can see in the filing, they do ask the court at the end of the 60-day extension they are asking for, they would like the court to move ahead with a presentencing report for mike flynn. and that is the first baby step towards mike flynn finding out what his punishment ultimately will be. it is the first step towards ending the government's government with him here. we saw the prosecutors asked the court on a presentencing report
on george papadopoulos. we don't have a sentence date for flynn. the first sign when flynn's case may start to end just came into view today with prosecutors and defense asking for a presentencing report on him, 60 days right now in late august. that's the pace which things are rolling with cooperating flynn. on the michael cohen's side, the president's personal lawyer, cohen's situation is being handled in federal court in new york city. the judge in the michael cohen's case set a firm deadline of next week by which time all evidence issues have to be wrapped up in terms of whether or not prosecutors will be able to look at the documents and materials that were seized from cohen under a search warrant back in
april. all the wrangling around those materials that were seized by michael cohen has been going on for weeks and months now. the court says it will be over by next week. prosecutors and the southern district of new york by next week should have their hands-on all of the evidence they're going to get in terms of what was taken out of cohen's files and his office computers. if cohen is going to be arrested and charged as a result of that evidence, you may expect that arrest and indictment would happen fairly soon after prosecutors finally nailed down all the evidence. again, the nailing down of all evidence will happen before the end of next week. if michael cohen is charged, he'll then have to make a decision and pretty good time about whether or not he's going to fight the charges or whether he's going to plea guilty and agree to cooperate with prosecutors in their ongoing investigation. that's coming down the track very fast now when it comes to trump's personal lawyer.
we can see what's happening with flynn and george papadopoulos. we just got in the transcripts of the court hearing of paul manafort today. manafort is in jail in virginia waiting for his trial to start next month. manafort has the opportunity to leave jail and travel to court today to be at today's hearing in person. he asked permission from the judge to not attend and complaining about the long two-hour track each way between the jail and the courthouse. which is interesting. but, whatever reasons, paul manafort did not want to make the trip, he stayed in jail today while his lawyers fought on his behalf. there are two things you should know of what happened at this hearing. one, it was sort of a landmark moment. for the first time at this paul manafort's hearing. we got a live witness thi testig
of special counsel's case against manafort. we have not had anybody answering questions and cross-examined and today we got that and it was quite revealing. the other thing you should know about this and i say this as a non-lawyer and i am a catty person. reading the transcripts today, i feel that one of the important things that i have learned is that the judge in the eastern district of virginia, judge ellis, this judge is an unusual appropriate cat. i do not mean to cast dispersions or anything is wrong with him. reading transcripts of his remarks in court are really weird. there are surprising moments. that has to affect how the prosecution and defense approach
this thing in the courtroom, it has to. it strikes me as weird. >> let me give you an example. this is the moment in the transcript, this is the prosecutor, he's questioning this live witness. first time we got a live witness on the stand of the special counsel investigation. he's questioning this live witness of the fbi agent and obtaining the search warrant in the paul manafort's case. did mr. trusto tell you if manafort prooefeviously used residenthat residence to conduct business. did you ask whether he knew if the record were still in the facility now? then the judge interjects and he judge says, quote, "you are
leading, why don't you say what if anything did you ask him." the prosecutor says, "well, judge, i simply did not because the federal rules don't apply in this type of hearing." i can ask it in a more open question if you prefer. the judge says "yes, i would prefer you do that, go." and then at that point in the transcript i won't read that. the judge just himself started asking his own questions to the witness the way he thinks the questions should be asked, demonstrating to the lawyers how he would prefer it to be done to his taste. the prosecutors start asking questions more like that in a more open ended way and a few minutes later in the transcripts, they are taking a break, paul manafort's defense counsel has to look at something that's introduced into everyday. he asked for a second to look at
that and this happened. >> defense counsel for paul manafort's says may i ask for a moment. yes, you may. >> the judge says while he's doing that, mr. zehasonye, whil you you are correct that rules of evidence do not apply. strictly speaking as you will know from looking at the law. individuals of gifts that you have and engaging and verbal atomic footwork and you got a rhythm going and who knows what the witness will agree to. the prosecutor says fair enough, your honor and the judge says he would be surprise what answers you get. i worked for one lawyer when i first aarrived.
he had a successful litigation life and experience. he's in the great litigation land in the sky now but he did well while he was here. the judge says next question. >> i will pick up from here. >> i didn't edit that. that's how it went. >> anyway, next question. i know a lawyer once who did not ask questions. he's dead now. >> the judge also at one point seems to get hungry. on page 67 of the transcript, no, tell me in a sentence, it is lunchtime. there is also this one moment, do you have anything to say about that. >> the judge interrupts and
says, it is not morning, it is afternoon. that's the point that i want you to have. and the prosecutor says time flies when you are having fun and the judge says yeah, and even when you are not. the prosecutors and the defense lawyers clearly have to try lightly with the testy and hungry judge here which is how he likes things in his courtroom. check out this discussion about leaks. the big picture here is that paul manafort's defense team sort of seems to be running out of steam a little bit to get the charges thrown out or dismissed. they all failed thus far and they tried a lot of different things. what they seemed to be boiling down is a claim that manafort should be let off the hook because of the amount of information about his case that's been reported in the press. his lawyers are asserting what a lot of people in political scandal over the years tried to
argue. the intense politic interests in his case and all the public reporting that's been done around his case resulted essentially in the defendant being tried by a leak. they're so made up about him about all the leaks and the reporting about it that he'll fail the trial so the courts let him go. paul manafort's lawyer says, his case of manafort should be leaked. watch the judge shut this down. mr. downing. may i be heard, your honor. you are going to inquire of what people know about the case, the manner of which they heard and whether or not they could be fair and impartial.
we don't have to take too much time. we like to do some supplemental briefing with you of the nature and the leaks that occurs here. we have highest level of government officials have said to the press that mr. manafort and the judge intervenes, well, have you filed? >> let's assume for a moment that you are right. downing says well, the question becomes how can he have a fair trial when the media has false statement of the judgment. the judge says well, what's assuming that you are right. >> one remedy is certainly dismissal. the judge, no. putting that one aside. mr. downing, i would like to stick with that one briefly. the judge, no, go on. actually in that moment, the judge is saying no to dismiss the case on the bases of the media leaks. mr. downing says your honor, what i am trying to deal with is you kind of glossed over this
issue in terms of you talking to somebody and asking them questions and voire dire. will you listen to what i am asking you. it would have to be a change ovo of venue. >> mr. downing, i was briefed. have you made a motion? >> it is a remedy but i have to determine whether the remedy is warranted. you better marshal al of your everyday on that whether you go some place to try this case. mr. down well, do it right now. do it quickly. i expect to see it by the close of business friday, a week from friday mr. downing. thank you, joyour honor. that was the first time i saw the motion. and he goes onto complain about how honestly it is time for
lunch. this change ovf venue things. now, they're trying to move the trial to another part of virginia, presumably they think they are getting more conservative. manafort's team is going to try that and they start putting up live witnesses to defend the evidence that they are cruising in the case against him. there was an interesting moment from that live witness on the stand today. this is an fbi agent on the stand. he explained today in court that the fbi only learned manafort kept some of his business records in a storage locker. the fbi learned about the
storage locker when eight reporters contacted the fbi to ask them for comment on a story the a.p. were pursuing on manafort's finances. could you please state your name for the record. are you currently employed? >> yes. where do you work? the fbi. how long have you been a special agent? since 2002. let me direct your attention of the spring of 2017, were you assigned to the squad at the time? >> yes, which one? >> international squad. during your corruption squad, were you involved in an investigation relating to manafort? what location? 370 holland land. what is that? that's a storage unit. you testified that you searched
the unit, how did you understand mr. manafort used the unit? answer, i don't recall exactly. it was either through my investigative effort or through a meeting that occurred with reporters with the associated press. a meeting with reporters? did that occur on 2011? >> yes, it did. who was present? members of the fbi and the associated press. what did you understand the purpose of the meeting to be? answer, to receive information from the reporters. to receive information from reporters. not to give reporters information but to get information from reporters. can you explain to the court what happened. kwu k how did the government representative respond? generally, no comments as far as questions involving any sort of investigation. question, based on the meeting, did it appear that the reporters
conducted a substantial investigation with respect to mr. manafort. answer, they had. dou did one of the reporters mention the storage unit associated with mr. manafort? answer, he did. did you issue a grand jury subpoena to a facility named public storage? answer, i did. that's how they found it. why would the a.p. reporter be given information to the fbi? seriously the press later clarified exactly what happened there. they put out a statement today explaining how they think the public should see this meeting. this is from an a.p. spokesperson. in an effort to get information on stories they were reporting as reporters do says lauren easton. during the course of the meeting, they asked the department of justice representatives about a storage
locker belonging to manafort without sharing the name and location. that's how it happens. i can't help but think sometimes this is the way these things go. reporters go to the government and they go to get confirmation or comment or whatever information they could get. the government no comments but by accident, the government actually - they did not know about before they heard the question. now we know based on the hearing today that's how the fbi figured out paul manafort had the locker which they raided. manafort had a previously unknown $10 million outstanding loan from a russian oligarch. remember how when he wrote to trump about being his campaign
manager, part of his pitch is hey, i live until trump tower. >> the president's personal jeopardy in this investigation is still an open question. papadopoulos proceedings and flynn and all the rest. the president's campaign manager is going on trial now. proceedings in this case are moving fast and at least thus far. they are proceeding in front of a testy judge who gets hungry around noon and started to get testimonies from the first live witness from the prosecution. will the president be picking a new supreme court justice in this context? hold that thought. this is impr people with asthma. yes. it's a targeted medicine proven to help prevent severe asthma attacks, and lower oral steroid use. about 50% of people with severe asthma have too many cells called eosinophils in their lungs. fasenra™ is designed to work with the body to target and remove eosinophils.
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could end up before the supreme court. if we are not going to thoroughly to discuss what it means to have this ongoing investigation happening who's now going to be able to interview supreme court justices and potentially continue with this tradition of doing litmus tests, we can under mind te the investigation. >> we should look at the conflicts of interests that's clearly clear with this president and we should delay this if the mueller's case is concluded. >> senator cory booker. thank you for being here. >> good to be here as well. >> at the earlier part of your remarks when you said the president is part of this
ongoing investigation, the senator interjected that he's not sure the president is apart of the investigation which is a telling moment. tell me about why you are making the case and how you intend to press it. >> we have seen some bipartisan work that we are trying to avoid a constitutional crisis. lindsey graham and myself put forward a bill to protect the special counsel. we know with this whole investigation of the president is a subject of. what have we seen so far? we have seen 73 charges among 26 people and companies and five guilty pleas and one person sentenced. this is all people around the president. this is ongoing. we have got to avoid a constitutional crisis. what is that? questions going before the supreme court, you covered some of this already. can a president be indicted and pardon himself and can a
president fire a special prosecutor? a lot of questions can go before the supreme court for a man on a number of occasions, we know what he did with director comey who clearly talked to him about loyalty. we know that he said publicly that he would not have hired jeff sessions if he knew he would have recused himself. if you are not loyal to me, i would not hire you. here he's going to hire the supreme court justice and put him before the senate. it is understandable of the pattern of behavior that he's going to look for somebody with that loyalty test, should that person be the balance of the supreme court and the person is going to decide in the favor of the person that gives him the job. >> what's the difference of the supreme court nomination or a circuit court nominee. >> because the supreme court is the final say of the law of the land. this investigation has been going on for a year now and the
president has three more years of his term. we as a senate is a cooling place for the american government. we should put a pause and let this investigation run its course before we move on something so consequential. >> it is all speculation at this point, there is brett kavanaugh, he has written and he's on the record to say that he does not think effectively that a president could be indicted and it would be catastrophic for the country. is that the sort of questio question -- it is almost impossible for me to imagine a confirmation hearing where the question is all about can a president be indicted or can a president fire an fbi director in order to stop the
investigation into himself. there is never been a confirmation hearing like that. should we start to look at the public record of all the potential nominees to see if those opinions are apart of the reasons that's chosen. >> we are a moment where the constitutional questions are coming up. given the president's pattern of behavior is going to be on his mind. he's going to try to take measures to protect himself from this investigation. should the president appoint and the head of the judicial committee decide? he did under president obama agreed the hold hearings. if he decides to hold hearings that there is no constitutional crisis and conflict of interest which i believe there is. i believe that's fair game of the hearing to go after this line of questioning. >> do you think democrats in general have come to a consensus for you that this nomination should not be considered at least until after the election? we heard arguments about that
early on especially from democratic leader chuck schumer saying if we had to wait until after the election to consider mayor garland, we should wait for the election now. is there consensus in your caucus on that? >> i can't speak for everyone. that was the robust hearing in our last caucus meeting. here we have an election, we have different folks on record for not just talking about the election regards to president obama but talking about mentioning a different senate in our judicial committee. we are about to have a new senate, we should wait. given the mcconnell rule, i said this is a ross ro cross road. it is one of those two. if he does not abide by those rules and expose exactly of what
this is about. this is the republican party and will stop at nothing and tramping the intention of our founders. >> the implications of both of them is that the next nomination should be delayed. >> if it was done for the right reasons or the wrong reason either way. the response is not let them go back to the order. >> it is a gut check of the american people. should we get the chance to vote for the election. do we want to take away for individual rights and the right for a woman to control their own body and the right for people to married. there is so many issues and against powerful forces against corporations. we saw citizens united, corporate billion dollars of power and speaking right of ordinary citizens. we see this being eroded and now we can shift to things that you and i in a lifetime would never see the entire state banning abortion rights and taking away
the liberty of women all across the country. this is all in the balance that the american people should have in this election to decide. >> senator, as such i am going to exert cable news host privilege which is a thing that does not exist. i would like to ask you to stay around. there is a little bit of a breaking news nbc just broken on policies. will you stay with us? >> yes, i will. >> we'll be right back with senator cory booker, stay with us. now after booking your flight, you unlock discounts on select hotels right until the day you leave. ♪ add-on advantage. discounted hotel rates when you add on to your trip. only when you book with expedia. with the new chase ink business unlimited card i get unlimited 1.5% cash back. it's so simple, i don't even have to think about it.
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joining us live again senator cory booker in the studio. just to get your response to this kind of shocking new report that broken from nbc news. i will read you the lead. u.s. intelligence agencies believe that north korea has increased its production of fuel for nuclear weapons at multiple secret sites in recent months. u.s. officials tell nbc news that the this assessment is not reported, there was no longer a nuclear threat from north korea. analysts at the cia and other intelligence agencies don't see it that way and according to more than a dozen officials who are familiar with this assessment. what's your reaction to this. >> before we get to this stunning revelation. it was already stunning to me.
a president would engaged with addi a dictator who slaughtered people and calling him honorable. it is basically getting into their propaganda and not about this is defending our allies. things that we already have and denuclearization and no time line and verification protocols. >> and the opposite of that if they are continuing to develop their program. >> absolutely. >> we did not ask them to disclose anything before. now we have intelligence agencies coming out and say they are enriching at a faster pace so nothing the president said is true. we now have off of our maximum pressure strategy. we relief that pressure and we undermine our allies but not informing we are doing some of the actions that we did. this is a malpractice, commander
in chief malpractice plain and simple allowing the leader to get older, it was not happening under previous administration. >> senator cory booker, thank you for being here, i know it is on a friday night and it is tough. >> thank you. >> much more ahead tonight, stay with us. it can grow out of control, disrupting business and taking on a life of its own. its multi-cloud complexity creating friction... and slowing innovation.
happening all over the country and all 50 state including places like that. the biggest is in washington, d.c. where people will gather at lafayette park and at least 50,000 people are expected in d.c. alone. these rallies nationwide tomorrow will be a dramatic combination of the protests that we have seen the last couple of weeks. protesters shutting down i.c.e. facilities and several u.s. cities. and just yesterday hundreds of women were arrested occupying the u.s. senate in d.c. and almost 600 women were arrested. we got a little bit to come of what you should expect this weekend from those rallies and the coverage of those demonstrations this weekend. before that, we have two big news development relate tod to story and that's next. stay with us. two inch bonus.
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ahead of tomorrow's national day of demonstrations against of trump trump administration taking kids away from their parents and have no idea how to return them. there are two big developments today. first from nbc news, a new report of the number of kids here. the government was separating migrant parents from their kids for months prior to the official introduction of the parent/child separation policy. >> a pilot program for the policy in texas.
in addition to the more than 2,000 kids that we know taken away from their parents, according to homeland security, 703 kids were separated from their parents between october of last year and february of 2018. 703. so it is more kids than we thought it was. we don't know how many of those kids are still separated from their parents or honestly any of them have been reunited. the white house of course remains under a court order to reunite families no later than july 26th. if this report is correct, they may have to unite many more kids than we may have thought. now the other development that we have in this story is not a news report. it is a letter signed by 19 top criminal investigation agents at i.c.e., there are only 26 of these top agents totaled in the whole country.
19 of the 26 have now signed this letter. the job of these elite agents is to oversee investigations of threats of national security and human trafficking and these agents have now written to homeland security secretary nelson asking for their part of i.c.e. to be divorced from the rest of i.c.e. being associated with the administration hard line immigration policy is making it hard for them to do their important work. quote, "our investigative independence is impacted by the political nature of civil immigration enforcement, many jurisdictions refused to work with us of the politics of civil immigration immigrati immigration." those are current federal employees at a senior level at i.c.e. asking the secretary of homeland security to please break i.c.e. apart. please break off what they are
doing from the rest of i.c.e. so they can do their jobs without being tainted by what's going on in the rest of i.c.e. which other people and other jurisdiction wants nothing to do with it. >> secretary neilson, do not forget to check your mailbox, your employees is trying to get a hold of you. joining us is mr. pena. thank you very much for making the time. >> thank you for having me on your program. >> i think a lot of americans don't understand what i.c.e. does and there are a lot of different parts of i.c.e., can you explain what the difference between the kind of work that these agents do and what we have been seeing in terms of agents and employees that may be involved in the domestic immigration enforcement stuff including the separation of families at the border. >> yes, the division that we are talking about, homeland security investigation was established
sometime around late 2009 and it was set up to go after trans national criminal organization involved in the syria's criminal activities and money laundering and narcotic cartels and also enforcement of custom laws and involving intellectual and property rights. anything and trans shipment of goods and countries of threats of the united states, it was set up to do the criminal investigative work involving these major crimes. >> in terms of these agents saying that what's happening at the border and the sort of divisive administration of this is being a problem of the serious crime that you are describing of law enforcement work, i have to ask if this is the sort of complaint or concern that has come up in the past, has there been tensions in the
agency that agents doing the work that you described there have previously felt they should be in a different kind of work or agency and run in some different way? >> there has been certainly concerns about the focus and the mission of the organization instead of being addressing national security threats, threats to the country and threats to the community's public safety that there has been a shift who deal with the low level immigrations, civil immigration enforcement and definitely that's caused problems because there is not a focus on this organization that will affect the newscasecurity united states and it will affect public safety and community. it has been more towards the political statement that immigrants are bad and immigrants are criminals and that all of them need to be looking over their shoulders that they can be picked up any
day instead of using the resources that's been given to i.c.e. and homeland security investigation to go after major threats, threats that oppopose problems to communities where we have law enforcement and agencies wanting to work with us to keep our community safe. >> alonzo pena, i appreciate your time tonight, sir, i hope you will come back. >> that satellite delay sometimes is very awkward. we'll be right back. stay with us. -and we welcome back gary,
who's already won three cars, two motorcycles, a boat, and an r.v. i would not want to pay that insurance bill. [ ding ] -oh, i have progressive, so i just bundled everything with my home insurance. saved me a ton of money. -love you, gary! -you don't have to buzz in. it's not a question, gary. on march 1, 1810 -- [ ding ] -frédéric chopin. -collapsing in 226 -- [ ding ] -the colossus of rhodes. -[ sighs ] louise dustmann -- [ ding ] -brahms' "lullaby," or "wiegenlied." -when will it end? [ ding ] -not today, ron. -when will it end? [ ding ] that's confident. but it's not kayak confident. kayak searches hundreds of travel and airline sites to find the best flight for me.
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and vibrant energy. purina one. 28 days. one visibly healthy pet. tomorrow people will be demming -- demonstrating against the trump's plan of taking kids away from their parents. the biggest rally is expected to be in d.c. i want to tell you that msnbc will be live all day tomorrow with coverage not just from what's expected to be the big rally in washington but from rallies all around the country so if you won't be there you are not looking out your window and may see it right here. that does it for us. time for "the last word." steve kornacki in for lawrence. >> i'm steve kornacki in for lawrence o'donnell and tonight