tv Meet the Press MSNBC July 1, 2018 3:00pm-4:00pm PDT
educated, highly intelligent people. >> democrats fear the making of a conservative court with little chance to stop it. >> women's access to safe legal abortions on the line. >> they want republicans to delay the vote again until after the election. >> our republican colleagues in the senate should follow the rule they set in 2016. >> but republican leader mitch mcconnell says not this time. >> we will vote to confirm justice kennedy's successor this fall. >> can democrats stop president trump or will he shape the court for a generation. my guests this morning, lindsey graham and maria cantwell. but giant killer a political unknown topples a house leader. a sign of a changing democratic party. alexandria ocasio-cortez is here this morning. and president trump says there's no longer a nuclear threat from north korea. but nbc news reports north korea is increasing its production of
nuclear fuel post-summit. is the u.s. being deceived again by another north korean leader? joining me for insight and analysis are nbc news chief corresponde correspondent, hallie jackson. cornell belcher. david brody, and kimberly atkins, chief washington reporter and columnist for the boston herald. welcome to sunday, it's "meet the press." >> announcer: the longer running show in television history, this is "meet the press" with chuck todd. good sunday morning. happy july. the announced retirement of justice anthony kennedy this week helped make one political reality clear, despite his overall unpopularity, president trump is winning and the democrats are reeling. the supreme court, mr. trump is about to shape the court for a generation by choosing a
possibly tie breaking conservative justice. how about the republican party, the president's approval rating among republicans is around 90%. elected republicans fear criticizing him and the party has become a cult of personality, his. how about fake news. mr. trump has turned that phrase, which initially referred to the russian stories in the election in 2016 into an applause line. how about credibility. if the reporters fact check his statements they consider being biassed if they don't, the statements gain traction, either way mr. trump wins. the mueller investigation. there's the economy, it is doing well, but it was doing well before he took office. but president trump is getting this credit. still much of mr. trump's success is superficial. while he's more popular among
republicans the party is shrinking, the trade war, tariffs, and north korea could turn against him but if the democrat reaction to the retirement of justice anthony kennedy told us anything, it's that they have not figured out how to succeed in the trump era. >> a democratic party largely united in opposition to the president but divided over goals, messaging and tactics. >> i think we will have a plan, and it will be announced by the democratic leader at an appropriate time. >> it's not clear what that plan is. democrats with 2020 ambitions eager to win progressive support are promising the base a fight. >> don't tell me this battle is won that's already lost. i don't believe that. >> this is a fight born out of love of country and we're not going to let anyone take our flag. >> we will fight today, we will fight tomorrow. >> but the senate's democratic
leaders are reluctant to give them that fight. >> the notion we can stop them with 49 votes is not in the cards. >> chuck schumer is stuck on a procedural argument. in 2016, democrats ridiculed mitch mcconnell's maneuver to deny obama appoint knee garland a a vote before the election, now they're adopting that same argument. >> our republican colleagues should follow the rule they set in 2016 not to consider a supreme court justice in an election year. >> meanwhile, four democrats are up for election in the states that they won. >> in tand the calls for pelosi step aside for a new generation of leaders have grown louder.
quizzed on that point, pelosi fired back. >> i'm female, i'm progressive, and the rest. so what's your problem? >> the stakes for democrats could not be hire. kennedy's retirement sets in motion the biggest change on the court in half a century. >> almost without exception, if it was a hot button issue, it was up to him. >> from citizen's united, the voting rights act and the trump travel ban this week, to even the death penalty, same-sex marriage and abortion. mr. trump said friday he won't ask candidates how they would vote on abortion. >> that's a big one, probably not. they're all saying don't do that, you shouldn't do that, but i'm putting conservative people on. >> when asked during the campaign whether he wants the court to overturn roe. >> that will happen automatically in my opinion because i am putting pro-life justices on the court. >> joining me are two senators, maria cantwell and lindsey
graham. we'll begin with senator wacan t cantwell in washington state. where do you sit? it feels as if senate democrats in general have all sorts of ideas on how to handle this supreme court fight. what is yours? >> well, this is a very different supreme court discussion, because everyone in the united states senate, who's going to vote on this, knows that it will change the balance of power. so you're not just voting on whether you think trump should have his nominee, you're voting on whether that nominee is going to change precedent when it comes to a whole host of issues of women's right to choose, your access to health care, whether if you have diabetes or asthma, all of a sudden a preexisting condition is no longer allowed and you have to pay more for
insurance. so i think that my colleagues on both sides of the aisle know that this vote could be a -- one of the key votes of their entire career. and they know that no matter what spin comes out of the white house, if they vote for somebody who's going to change precedent, it could be a career-ending move. >> okay. that's fine to say that in the aftermath. but the numbers are the numbers, right? we know what the numbers are in the senate, the rules have been changed, bear majority does this. it sounds like you want to defeat this nominee for sure, or are you trying to inspire president trump to pick a modera moderate? >> well, we -- well, i would love president trump to pick somebody in the main stream of american views who are going to hold up years and years of precedent. the one great thing about our nation is an independent judiciary, in times of intense political debate the fact we have that independent judiciary that will uphold the law is key to what is great about our
country. we're a 51-49 senate. if he wants to throw an extreme conservative who basically says i'm not going to follow precedence, these laws, then yes, that to me is a major change and something the president should be sitting down with moderates on that advice and consent and say what would be good for america. >> but the reality is i think we know where this is headed on a partisan scale considering he's only looking at nominees prevetted. so we know he's going to pick a conservative. so i ask you, how do democrats then -- can you defeat this nominee if it comes from that -- are you hoping to woo senators murkowski and collins? is that the plan here? >> the plan is to speak out about the change in balance in the court. you are not just voting as was with neil gorsuch for one more name you know that justice
kennedy was a swing vote, sometimes he sided with the conservative justices, sometimes he upheld what were very important issues of marriage equality, issues on the environment. so from my colleagues in moderate states, whether that's democrat or republican, you're going to have to decide am i voting for a justice that's going to hold up the clean air or water act? am i voting for a justice that is going to hold up roe v wade or a woman's right to have the freedom to do what she wants with her body. it's not going to be about what they say, it's going to be about whether you believe that justice given what the president has said he's willing to nominate. these are going to be very -- >> i understand that, but there's some democratic activists who think you guys are going to have a confirmation hearing and you're not going to do whatever it takes to stop any justice that the president nominates if it comes from a more conservative era. there was one person --
>> there's -- chuck -- >> -- quoted in the "new york times" saying they'd like to see some civil disobedience in the senate. do you buy into that? >> i'm all for making sure this debate gets every bit of attention. but i'm so anxious to hear whatever this nominee has to say. is the president able to pardon himself? do you believe in the emoluments clause? basically there should be a conflict of interest that if there is one the president shouldn't be able to participate in special self-interest. i want to know what he thinks about the process of how far the mueller investigation needs to go and will they fight to protect that. i'm interested in in hearing what kind of nominee is going to be on the bench and if the president is under indictment, what is that nominee going to do about that? these are momentumal questions and this is a person who wants 40 years on the court, at least 40 years, i want at least 40
minutes to hear what they have to say about these important issues. >> you would have an easier time getting your moderate if the rules of the senate hadn't been changed. i want to play for you a remark mitch mcconnell made in 2013 when then senate democratic leader harry reed changed the rules for lower court nominat n nominatio nominations. >> you may regret it a lot sooner than you think. >> do you regret it? >> we're dealing with what we're dealing with today. and i don't that whatever the circumstances of the rules were then or now that they would be proceeding on this with 51 votes. the issue is, there's so many things before the american people and this position will change the balance of the court. the president has the right to nominate somebody, as he says, who he wants to change the balance. >> you want to just ignore that -- >> no. no. >> i guess i disagree with you. that is why we're in this
situation now where a bare majority decides the future of the court. >> it's what we're dealing with today, i'm not ignoring it. i have been around my state this weekend and people are anxious about health care, they're anxious about the detention of people seeking asylum in the united states. they want to know what is going to happen with this court nominee. they are so anxious that key rights that have been bestowed upon americans are going to be rolled back, so yes, they want to know what we're going to do about it, and what i want to make perfectly clear is that this is not a normal supreme court justice vote. you know for sure that your vote is changing the balance and i want all my colleagues to have the time to take, that it's not a rushed process, to know whether this nominee is going to uphold those american rights or not. that is what we deserve to know. >> what's the definition of a rushed process? should it be delayed until after the election or should we know
before the election where people stand on this? >> i think the president is in a hurry because he already said he's going to make a decision by july 9th. what i would say is that advise and consent role, i'd be sitting down with the moderates to say what kind of justice do we need in the united states for this process to make sure that basic rights are upheld -- >> do you want it delayed. >> -- i think they're going to skip that. >> do you want it delayed until after the election or not? >> i would love that because i want to make sure we have enough time and the issues are discussed and we have our rights heard. that's what i would like. >> senator, thanks for coming on and sharing your views. i appreciate it. >> thank you. yesterday i spoke with senator lindsey graham when he was in tur row on a congressional trip to the middle east. i began by asking him what kind of supreme court justice he was looking for, someone to the right like justice roberts or someone that is a centrist like
justice kennedy. >> conservative, solid, i like a john roberts type myself. i'm not picky. president trump ran on the idea of who he'd pick. he gave us a list so i suspect the name will come from the list. and they're highly qualified. >> one of the things to come up will be the issue of abortion. when he was a candidate he said overturning roe v wade would happen automatically because his picks for the supreme court would be pro-life. do you see that connection as automatic? if you're pro-life you're for overturning row v. wade, and that's how the public should consider it? >> i'm pro-life, and the job of a judge is to decide cases before the court, but one of the concepts that really means a lot in america is you don't overturn
precedent unless there's a good reason. i tell my pro-life friends you can be pro-life and conservative, but roe v. wade has been affirmed many ways over the years. i hope the justice that sits on the court, all of them, would listen to the argument on both side but story decisis is a well known concept in our law. >> are you going to vote for somebody that doesn't believe in that? >> i'm not going to vote for anybody who tells me they decide the case before the facts are presented to them. i don't expect them to tell me i will overturn roe v. wade. i have a bill that says because a baby can feel pain 20 weeks during the birthing process there's a compelling interest to protect a child from abortion at that period. that's a novel issue that's
never been decided under roe. i hope the justices, this one and all of them will listen to the arguments before they decide. >> the president's pick may end up ruling on issues having to do with the mueller investigation. and neil gorsuch, he came up before there was a robert mueller special counsel. now he exists. do you believe this nominee needs to commit to recusing him or herself for anything having to do with the mueller probe directly right now if it makes it way to the supreme court. especially given one of the nominees said they don't believe the president should be susceptible to a lawsuit while sitting in office. >> to recuse yourself is proper in some cases. you can't review your own health care -- homework. but the idea you can't judge somebody who picked you is not a ground for recusal. you have to prove there's a connection between the case at hand and the activity of the judge.
it makes sense to me that jeff sessions can't oversee an investigation he was part of, but nothing about a broad rule you can't have anything to do with president trump because he chose you. >> it sounds like there may be instances where you think a recusal is appropriate -- >> yes. >> -- having to do with this investigation? >> yes. >> where is that line? >> it depends what the facts are. i don't know who he's going to pick. i think whoever he will pick will be asked about the connections to the trump campaign pending litigation, any conflict of interest. a conflict of interest in the law is different than just again you can't judge anything trump did because he chose you. that's not a conflict of interest under the law. and we'll see where this goes. >> let me move to your favorite topic, foreign policy. i have a bunch of things to get to, i want to start with maunor korea. we at nbc are reporting that
they believe the north korean regime is already cheating on the commitments that kim jong-un made to president trump, they stepped up production of enriched uranium. is this headed for failure. >> that is a good question. if they're saying one thing and doing another, nobody should be surprised. but here's what i will tell north korea, there's no place for donald trump to kick the can down the road. he offered you a deal of a lifetime -- >> he's already been told this information. does it concern you he's yet to act? does it concern you for instance, he hasn't said the exercises with south korea are back on? >> i'll be honest with you, chuck, i know what i read, i'll follow-up when i get back. it would concern me a lot if they are expanding the nuclear program as they meet with the president. i don't want a war with north korea. it would be devastating. a lot of people would be killed and hurt.
>> let me move to another summit coming up. you were skeptical when a president obama, in 2015, was about to meet with president putin. you thought no, he's going to get walked all over, and president obama was there to confront him about crimea and some of these things. i got to ask you, president trump is already hinting he's ready to get out of syria, he's ready to hand him crimea. how much concern do you have about the summit? >> i'm glad he's meeting but i have a lot. it's not president obama's fault that crimea was taken by russia, it's russia's fault. it's up to president trump to make sure we don't give russia iran and syria. i'm in turkey today, this is a strategic ally, people in this region look at us as an unreliable ally. we allowed isis to rise by leaving iraq. we have them in a good spot but people here are worried about leaving syria and giving it to the russians, which would leave
the region in chaos. i'm concerned by what i hear, when the president tweets russia denies they meddled in their election. when they say they didn't meddle, they're lying. i'm glad the president is going to call him out for lying. but show him the evidence. >> you expect him to present the evidence that we have? >> here's what i would say, in many ways this administration has been tough on russia. we've armed the ukraine, imposed sanctions, kicked out diplomats, but the idea that russia did not meddle in our election is fake news. they did meddle in our election and they're doing it again in 2018. >> one of the messages you regularly have brought back from the middle east during the obama era was you were concerned that you would say that our allies in the middle east, for instance, they don't know if they can count on the united states.
can our allies in europe count on the united states right now? >> yes, congress is firmly in europe's camp. i think the president is trying to get nato nations to contribute more. but there's no serious effort to get out of nato. i think the president appreciates the alliance. i'm not going to be on the show and tell you what he should say and not say, i'll judge him by what he does. i like some of the things he's done against russia but this idea there's doubt they meddled in our election is not helpful at all. the idea of leaving syria means you're going to have isis come back. the only thing i can tell president trump for sure if you leave syria without thinking about it, conditions on the cloud being the reason you leave, isis will come back. if you leave any time soon, you're giving damascus to the iranians. so everything you said about obama and iraq you're going to do in syria. >> this was his first trip in the middle east without his normal traveling companion john
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welcome back, panelists here, cornell belcher, hallie jackson, kimberly atkins, and david brody. all right. david, i want to start with you. this is what michael gerson wrote, he says as a political matter the fight over the kennedy replacement is a gift to the president. it's a reminder of trump's deal with the evangelical. ignore my bigotry and bad character and all the kingdoms of the court will be yours. pretty with you way to describe it. michael has been critical of evangelicals and their blind
support for the president trump character. but is he right? >> he's right to a degree. and the degree is this. evangelicals voted for this president predominantly, especially the ones on the fins, not the ones in alabama at the rallies, the ones who came held with their noses held to a degree, they voted for the supreme court. they believe he is god's chosen candidate for such a time as this. this is the word on the street in the evangelical world. and so along comes a second supreme court nomination and they're like, here you go. we, as in evangelicals, have a chance to reshape this court for a long time. it'll be interesting to see murkowski and collins. everyone talks about the big supreme court fight to come, the fight is now. the fight is how is this candidate going to be defined in terms of trump's mind. how much murkowski and collins and potentially others can get to this. >> we did a poll on the issue of abortion with republican
senators from kennedy's confirmation to today. and in 19 88. ten called themselves pro-choice. today it's two. is this the end all be all? >> it is. i spent time in focus groups across the country the last two weeks. democrats will likely lose this battle because the numbers just aren't there and there are only so many tactics can you take. elections have consequences. but i've been looking at gallup data over the last two decades. nowhere do i show where anywhere approaching the majority of americans think that abortion should be illegal. and god help these old men if they tick off these suburban women and -- who have never really thought their reproductive rights are at risk and all of a sudden it's at risk
and it's real. >> i thought lindsey graham was trying to send a message to the president when he said precedent matters. >> it's settled law. >> it was his way of saying he didn't want the headline of saying lindsey graham supports roe v. wade so he started speaking in latin. but i think he agrees with cornell, be careful. >> i heard from sources this week, the president is not going to ask where these potential picks are. he doesn't have to. they wouldn't be on the list coming up from the federal society if you didn't know where they stood on that issue. one way i heard people are trying to inknack lawsuit on that is to pick a woman. he said he's leaning towards two women. including amy barrett. remember she was binged in her hearing for the circuit
judgeship so there's a calculation some people close to the president are making. but i also heard the president is going to try not to think about gender politics. he's going to pick the best and if that's a man, that's a man. >> do republicans want this fight? i don't know. i think some of them do and think it's a worthy fight. i think democrats aren't sure if they want the fight. because if it's too harsh, do you blow the red state republicans? >> i think the republicans think they don't need the fight. the point that cornell made, aside that this could backfire, i think they won the fight. for democrats the fight was 2016, that was when they missed the fight. it was when a supreme court judge was held up. maybe because merrick garland wasn't the one that fired them
up. now it's too late and they can only message the way we saw senator cantwell do the best she could. >> one thing that strikes me so much, especially as someone who covered the campaign in 2016, when you look at the exiting polling data, how much that supreme court opening was such a motivating factor for republicans in particular. >> you just led to a traffic gr prepared. >> i didn't know. >> one of five voters said the court was the number one issue. among those voters, 56% were trump and clinton was 41%. >> that's a problem that the democrats have now. you have groups like demand justice that are mobilizing now because all of a sudden they see the supreme court is important. i think you'll see that number grow for democrats. >> now that there's nothing the democrats can do to stop it. you were talking about the support of evangelicals, donald trump is term limited.
they have him at most eight years. the federal judiciary, it will take a full generation to turn around a court shaps shifted so far to the right. >> that's why this is a 40-year decision we're talking about. amy barrett, who you mentioned, evangelical sources tell me that's the number one pick for me. but beyond that we know donald trump likes optics. can you imagine roe v. wade, five men, 5-4 decision whatever it happens to be, but this is an optics thing and i think it would bode well for this president if he cares about optics, and yeah he does to possibly go with a woman here. >> back to when he was selecting his cabinet, there was talk of optics and would he pick women. this is a president that doesn't like to be told how optics make him look. i'm not sure this is the top motivating factor for him.
>> you have three months before midterms, saying i picked up a woman, listen to the fake media saying i'm anti-woman. fake news. it gives him a base. >> overturning roe v. wade is going to terrorize women in the suburbs. >> i'll leave it there. when we come back, meet the woman who may change the face of the democratic party, alexandria ocasio-cortez. r my best even though i live with a higher risk of stroke due to afib not caused by a heart valve problem. so if there's a better treatment than warfarin, i'm up for that. eliquis. eliquis is proven to reduce stroke risk better than warfarin. plus has significantly less major bleeding than warfarin. eliquis is fda-approved and has both. so what's next? seeing these guys. don't stop taking eliquis unless your doctor tells you to, as stopping increases your risk of having a stroke. don't take eliquis if you have an artificial heart valve
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welcome back. welcome back. that sound you may have heard on tuesday night was the sound of a political earthquake in new york city that was really felt more so in washington. alexandria ocasio-cortez, a 28-year-old seemed to come out of nowhere to defeat joe crowley. he's not just anyone, he's currently the fourth ranking democrat in the house and was seen by many as the next speaker of the house if democrats won the majority. no more. as my colleague steve consider knack key put it, the more you
look at the changing face of the democratic party, the more you wonder why didn't we all see this coming. alexandria ocasio-cortez joins me now. congratulations. >> thank you for having me. >> you do have a general election, you're not a congresswoman yet. but it is a strong democratic seat. let me start with something nancy pelosi said about your victory. >> they made a choice in one district, let's not get yourself carried away on the expert of demographics and that within the caucus and outside the caucus. it is not to be viewed as something that stands for everything else. >> she was a bit defensive. a lot of people coming at her saying your victory means a lot more than just a primary win in the bronx. how did you react to that? >> well, i think that there are a lot of districts in this country that are like new york 14. you know, with -- that have changed a lot in the last 20 years and whose representation has not. and it's not to say whether
someone should be voted out or voted in, but i think it definitely speaks to perhaps us evolving in our messaging and at least how we do things. so i do think that -- i do think that there are a lot of districts in america that are like new york 14. >> if joe crowelly had found out you were thinking about running and called you up and said, what am i doing wrong? what would like to see from me? what would you like to see me do that would make you say i'll stand down this cycle and see what you do? >> what would i say to him? >> what would you say to him if he asked for your advise to win your vote before you ran against him? >> i think the problem is that never happened. >> meaning you never saw him, the district it never saw him, is that what you're saying? >> without going too hard, because the congressman has had phenomenal service in our community, i think there was a lack of presence, and that was a big part of my win. there was, i think, a lack of
listening on the ground. a lack of going to the grocery store and saying, hey, how are you doing? that is an important part of representation, because we have a lot of work we have to do in d.c., but that work needs to be rooted in the communities we have been elected to represent. >> some of your energy and some of the energy behind you and some of the energy behind other progressives has to do with the tone and tactics of the democratic leadership. what was your reaction to senator cantwell earlier today in how she described how she would like to fight the supreme court nominee? >> i think what's going on, especially with the supreme court, we have senators and folks trying to figure out the strategy, but in the meantime, the messaging isn't as clear to the communities that we're trying to represent. are we fighting or not? and i still don't have quite a -- >> what do you want to see? >> for me, i'm a fighter. you know, i'm one for a fight. especially when we see what the
gop has done. i feel like they're kind of gaslighting the country, where they want to fight, bend and break the rules and stretch the constitution to its limits, they'll do it. but when they're on the other side of the table it's whoa, decoconsider rum. >> do you want democrats to borrow some of those tactics? it's some of the game, do two wrongs make a right? >> i think i see the points you're making. i look at it as a soccer, what are our positions now? this supreme court seat is important, we have an investigation with direct implications to the presidency, and that presidency is talking about nominating a supreme court pick that is going to essentially hear this case out. this is a very unusual time in this country. when is the last time that a president has been in this position? >> what do you want senate democrats to do that you didn't
hear from senator cantwell? >> i would like the senate to delay. we need to delay until after the midterm elections, that's my personal opinion. i think at the very least, we need to -- if we are going to -- if this appointment is going to happen. the least we can do is delay the time line in which women's health care is going to be taken away. let me talk your positions generally, but first explain this to me, you were endorsed by a group the democratic socialists, you embraced this. what is your definition of democratic socialists? >> for me, again, and there's so much focus on this endorsement. i think it's important that an important part of my strategy in winning is building a broad based coalition of people, so while there's a focus on one aspect of the coalition. for me to answer your question,
the definition is the fact in a modern, moral, and wealthy society, no american should be too poor to live. that means every working class american in this country should have access to health care, be able to go to a doctor without going broke, you should be able to send your kids to college and trade schools if they choose, and no person should feel instable in their access to economy. >> some democrats are afraid of the s. words. older americans hear it and tie it to ugly governments in the past. >> yeah. >> how do you sell this to an older generation? >> i think, you know, as the clip from schumer showed earlier, democrats are a big party. i'm not trying to impose an ideology on all several members of congress. but i do think once again it's not about selling an schism or
an ideology, or a color, this is about selling our values. >> are you a democratic socialist? is that what you call yourself or you don't want that label? >> it's part of what i am. it's not all of what i am. that's an important distinction. i'm an educator and organizer. >> you defeated a potential future speaker. should nancy pelosi be the next speaker of the house or the next generation? >> once again, i want to see the options on the table. i'm not an i elected member of congress yet first of all. secondly, i think we need to see what's going on. it's premature for me to commit to any decision on this. i was elected tuesday. >> fair enough. i'm going to leave it there. alexandria ocasio-cortez, congratulations on your victory. i imagine we'll see you here again. >> thank you so much. when we come back, we'll see
why alexandria ocasio-cortez's victory may be more of an outliar instead of a trend. before we go, we want to remember the five victims of the shooting at the "capital gazette" shooting very close to us here, in anapa lus, maryland. s like concert tickets or a new snowboard. matt: whoo! whoo! jen: but that all changed when we bought a house. jen: matt started turning into his dad. matt: mm. that's some good mulch. ♪ i'm awake. but it was pretty nifty when jen showed me how easy it was to protect our home and auto with progressive. [ wrapper crinkling ] get this butterscotch out of here. progressive can't protect you from becoming your parents. there's quite a bit of work, 'cause this was all -- this was all stapled. but we can protect your home and auto when you bundle with us. dependability award for its midsize car-the chevy malibu.
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14 wins and 19 losses. what's when you look at the districts where the bernie wing won. only one, and the republican candidate is favored to win. the majority of the wins are coming in safe republican districts and a few in safe democratic districts where the democrat would win regardless of who won the nomination. in other words, these are not the districts where control of congress is being decided. so what about the districts where the democratic establishment is carrying the day? guess what, of the 19 districts where establishment candidates prevailed, 11 are rated competitive by cook. these are some of the races democrats have to win if they're going to take control of the house in november. so is the sanders wing of the party having an impact on the democratic party and its
politics? sure, progressive candidates in safe districts like alexandria ocasio-cortez will likely be serving in congress this year and wins equal momentum for the movement. and fox echo chamber is helping the cause, they want to claim to moderate voters look the far left is taking over the democratic party but in the places that matter most in 2018 it's been a good year for the so-called democratic establishme establishment. when we come back, end game and the nation-wide protests over immigration. how each party sees the issue as a potential winner in november. because you've made sure this sensor and this machine are integrated. & she can talk to him, & yes... atta, boy. some people assign genders to machines. and you can be sure you won't have any problems. except for the daily theft of your danish. not cool! at&t provides edge to edge intelligence. it can do so much for your business, the list goes on and on. that's the power of &.
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back now with "end game" and the debate over immigration. hundreds of thousands of people in cities across the country turned out to demonstrate against the trump administration's stoelzero-tole policy, especially separation of children from their parents at the border. the issue one both political parties see as a potential advantage for them. the question is, is it for the democrats heading into 2020 or november and what about the republicans? so, let's talk about this. cornell, i want to talk about this movement to get rid of i.c.e. and what this means. here's what the president claims that it means. this is what he said today. i think we have that on tape. >> i hope they keep thinking about it because they're going to get beaten so badly. you get rid of i.c.e. you're going to have a country you're going to be afraid to walk out of your house. i love that issue if they're
actually going to do that. >> and i do already sense a split. the 2020 democrats are all on this program already, cornell. do you see this as a good issue for the democrats? >> i think broadly it is a good issue for the democrats, because of the optics, right? those pictures of kids being torn away from their families at the borders, whether you are a democrat or republican or middle of the road, those images do not settle well particularly with women voters. i think again we're going to have a year of the woman voter. it's going to make '92 pale in comparison. overall the optics don't look good. i'm not for getting into the weeds in this and getting into the policy weeds on this. we should take it from the big standpoint of these are bad optics, these are not our values and not get in the weeds on this argument. >> i think the president would love to make this about i.c.e. he wants to make it about i.c.e. >> of course he does. what you've already seen from the president and administration officials is then for every discussion that comes up about abolishing i.c.e., they bring out i.c.e. law enforcement officers to talk about the
sacrifices and their service to the country, which is a message that resonates with a lot of people in the country who have a brother or cause inwho ousin whe to this for the president. >> he's already linked it to law enforcement. do you want to get rid of the police? you're seeing this polarization, push to the left. this is the perfect demonstration. >> the irony is you have people inside of i.c.e. that actually say the thing needs to be reformed. >> yes. >> you have actually messed up this -- nuance is lost. >> when you said push to the left, this is the kind of macro version here. look, the democratic party has been pushed to the left. forget socialists for a minute, forget democrats. the democratic party has been pushed to the left and that's why trump got into wisconsin. you can make the case that hillary clinton didn't claim wisconsin. doug kammerer tha
you can claim that. they say we left the door open. that's important to realize. >> okay. you're going to make my head explode. here's the problem. wisconsin, he didn't win the majority, right? pennsylvania he didn't win a majority. his problem wasn't picking up -- >> hillary clinton didn't win a majority, either. >> barack obama did. that's my point. the problem in pennsylvania, the problem in wisconsin were a lot of these obama voters who quite frankly broke third-party, protest vote and millions sat home. guess what, how is that not voting working for you, guys? it's a problem. his winning in wisconsin and pennsylvania quite frankly against obama was a loss, right. he did not go two points above what mitt romney did in those states. he picked up a couple points, but that cannot be a win. >> i'm saying you cannot discount the fact that blue collar democrats went more to this president than any other republican president before, not just from personality, but also it was on personality, but it was also because of the left ward shift of the democratic --
>> i can make the same argument quite frankly there are romney-hillary voters. he did worse among white college voters in a long time. >> you're missing the left ward shift of messaging belies the fact the democrat party is divided. not between two different camps, multiple different camps. >> which alexandra pointed out. >> you have seth mull tin recruiting military folks. tim lion talking about middle class voters. and the old guard like pelosi at the top. there is no overall messaging bringing it together. that's why the arguments abolish i.c.e. catches fire because there is no other counter message out there from the democrats. >> i have to take up for democrats. this is all very reminiscent of a lot of conversation we heard in 2008, old versus new guard. look, where are democrats on the
major policies? minimum wage increase, majority of americans are there, right? she ran on it, cortez ran on people over the money. that's a winning strategy, left, right. that's a middle of the road winning strategy right now. this bernie movement, is it really a movement? if you look some of the data download, is it a really movement? i don't see it. >> i'm here to report from the front lines. you will know with this whole idea of make america great again, i'm telling you in democrats, independents, republican households it has resonated because democrats culturally -- culturally made minimum wage. it's a cultural issue. culturally socially they've moved to the left. >> on what? >> on abortion for sure, on same-sex marriage, i could go on and on. >> on abortion, you're the outlier on a borks. nowhere is there a majority of americans who want abortion out lied. >> i don't think there is an outlier on abortion where the polls show it is evenly split.
>> it's not evenly split. i have gallup right here. >> we'll leave it there. the polls -- i have to go. unfortunately i have to go. the majority had said they wanted to keep roe for what it's worth, the fact check which will happen. before we go i want to share this e-mail we got from a florida viewer he said he and 22 of his friends are going to be purchasing online subscriptions of the online gazette. we thought it was a great idea. support your local free press at home. go buy that subscription to your local paper. that's all we've got for today. we'll be back next week. if it's sunday, it's "meet the press." more "doing chores for mom" per roll. more "doing chores for dad" per roll. more "earning something you love" per roll. bounty is more absorbent,
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