tv The Rachel Maddow Show MSNBC July 20, 2018 6:00pm-7:00pm PDT
protections for people with preexisting conditions will be thrown out. i think they try to focus on the issues and assume it will punch through on its own. >> we made it to the end. have yourselves a great week. sleep up, eat your whaeaties. that's all in for this evening and this week. thanks to everyone here. good evening rachel. >> it has been a pleasure to be your successor, to come after you all this week. you done an excellent job. i love having you in prime time. i know you have been working your tail off. thank you for doing it. great to have you here. happy friday and what has been a fast moving news day. we actually have fresh reporting to add to a couple of big stories to the day. first we can report tonight in the trial of the president's campaign chairman lawyers for
manafort and also lawyers for the prosecution, today received from the judge is going to be overseeing manafort's trial, the list of potential jurors who are in the jury pool for that case. we have been expecting the case to start in federal court on wednesday. this indicates that that is on track according to reporting. both sides have this list of potential jurors. we expect them to show up at the courthouse on tuesday when the potential jurors get there on tuesday they will start filling out paperwork. those will be the initial steps in the jury selection process. it is interesting. before those jurors go into court on tuesday there will be one more hearing before the trial starts. that will be monday morning in judge ellis's courtroom. this is the hearing that she delays from earlier this week. it raised a lot of eyebrows.
it raised a little intrigue on whether or not there might be meaningful clang going on. maybe he was considering a potential plea deal. it appears that is not what's going on. again, according to a source very close to the case we are told there are no signs of any sort of plea negotiations going on on the part of paul manafort. we will see the judge on monday morning. he will hold that hearing. at that hearing he will consider what will expect to be the final pretrial motion to delay the start of several months. the caution here is that anything can happen. we'll all find out soon enough when all of these things start to unfoeltd before our eyes in federal court. it seems safe to surmise that judge ellis will not be inclined to delay the start of the trial. it doesn't seem that way with a
judge sending out the list of potential jurors to both the prosecution and defense today. they have been told to turn up on time on tuesday morning. it does look like paul manafort is not going into plea negotiations. we are surmising that it looks like his trial is not going to be delayed. jury selection is about to start. it looks like he will be on trial as of wednesday next week. we have flown this is coming for a long time. the whole way we have been wondering if there will be some off ramp if manafort will cooperate with prosecutors. it looks like we'll get to the trial without that happening. chk -- being tried in open
federal court just outside washington, d.c. we are expecting lots of drama including witnesses that have been granted immunity, wloz identities we don't know yet and they won't know until they appear in court. there is also manafort's deputy. the deputy campaign chair who was previously charged alongside paul manafort. presumably -- now trump is president. this trial is about to start. this spectacle is in gear. it is moving forward and again, i believe we are exclusively reporting that the list of potential jurors has been distributed to the prosecution and to the paul manafort case. it looks like we are on track. also late last night another
1,452 documents, files and other items were handed over to prosecutors in the southern district of new york. these are not special council, these are special proos cute tos in manhattan. they were handed over to prosecutors by the special master who was reviewing evidence in the criminal investigation of michael cohen. the president's long time personal attorney and long-time executive. these 1,400 plus documents are items that cohen's lawyers and/or president trump's lawyers had singled out and said these documents were privileged. they would not be given to prosecutors. she rejected that claim that these items were privileged and instead said no. they not privileged. they are going despite your objections. now, no criminal charges have been brought against cohen,
but he is the subject of an active criminal investigation. it was used to obtain millions of documents some of the documents seized by the government represent confidential kplun cases between him and his clients. therefore they should not be handed over to prosecutors. we have had weeks of wrangling over whether this stuff is privileged. you might remember at the very start of this, right after cohen was rated his legal team started off in court claiming that millions of the documents that were seized would turn out to be
privileged. they would turn out to be covered and prosecutors wouldn't be allowed to see them. that's what they said right after the bat in court. almost everything that was seized has been reviewed by this special master and upon her review ultimately almost nothing has been found to be covered by attorney/client privilege. as a consequence of that almost everything seized has been handed over to prosecutors who as we speak are using that evidence and anything else they turned up in that investigation to decide whether they will bring federal criminal charges against michael cohen. that said you're about to hear new reporting right here right now that says that one very very news worthy item, it actually is one of the few items in this case that was marked privileged, that was considered to be an
attorney/client privilege communication that prosecutors could not get. again, in the grand scheme of things almost nothing was labeled by the special master as yeah, that's privileged. this item that you have heard so much about today actually was labeled privileged. this is the tape you have heard so much about today. he is said to have recorded himself talking in september, 2016. they are talking reportedly about $150,000 payment that was made to a woman named karen. nor is it one of his sexual abuse allegations. she rather says she had a long consensual affair with donald trump shortly after he married the woman who is first lady, melania trump. they paid her $150,000 in august
2016. so a month before this taped conversation we learned about today. the question is exactly how? they paid her for exclusive rights to the story of her alleged long affair with candidate trump. they didn't publish that story. bottom line, it is hush money. a few weeks later trump gets elected president. but there's open questions as to the nature of that payment and potential criminal liability that may attend to that payment. now the new york times has broken the story that a tape
exists of them talking about that payment. there's one part of the story that is really important now to understanding why we have all learned about this today and what it might mean and who might be in trouble because of it. deep into their story today the times noted mr. cohen's lawyers discovered the recording as part of the review of the seized materials and they shared it with mr. trump's lawyers. so there's this open criminal investigation into the president's lawyer michael cohen. part of that investigation fbi seizes tons of stuff for him. among the things that were seized is that cohen make of himself talking with candidate trump about this. over this months long back and forth process where this court has been reviewing all of the stuff that was seized to figure out which should be considered
attorney/client privilege they reviewed, came across this recording as one of the items seized. they reviewed it. they shard it with donald trump's attorneys. if this new reporting that we have got tonight is true that this tape was marked privileged, that means a very pacific thing. that means prosecutors would never have gotten it. so that means the only people who would have had access are michael cohen's lawyers. his lawyers apparently didn't leak this thing to the new york times today. it means by process of elimination that president trump's lawyers did. so there's been all of this sort of breathless reporting today, look what they have got. don't get your clan yanked on this one. president trump's lawyers found out this tape existed. for obvious reasons they
realized it may be a pretty ugly thing. so today the president's lawyers themselves appear today have leaked the existence of this tape to get out ahead of this story. and so, yeah, the story appears to be real. today is the day where we get this headline about the fbi seizing a tape of a president discussing a payment to a playboy model. you should know the reason we got those headlines is because the president's legal team decided you should see this story today. they did it themselves. you can think of a few rational reasons why they might have done that. number one, no idea if this was in their mind. it does put something else on the front page for once after five straight days of hey, is the president actively working as an agent of the russian government? the subordination of the president to the russian
with. this is a lot of things. i think the president's lawyers are assuming if they could release this information on their own time and put their own kind of spin on it maybe somebody will be dumb enough to release that. here is another dynamic at work. it makes new reporting that we have got really important. the special master who has been reviewing the evidence in the criminal investigation, she has processed millions of documents already. she handed almost all of them over to the prosecutors in the southern district of new york. they have been weighing that evidence while they decide whether or not they will bring criminal charges. that process has been going on far long time. it will not go on indefinitely. it will come to a close and then if prosecutors are going to bring charges mr. cohen and his lawyers will have to talk about the kinds of charges cohen might
face and the prospect that he might try to get a break from the government in exchange for his cooperation. cooperation doesn't mean he agrees to be nice. cooperation means he agrees that he will give him some information, information that would be of greater value to those prosecutors than whatever value they might see. if they have the goods on you and you're facing serious charges you to have something really good to give them in order to persuade the pr prosecutors to accept that information in exchange for not nailing you to the wall. all right. the worst trouble you're in the better story you have to give prosecutors about something else that really matters. if one of the things that michael cohen had was a recording of the president two months before the election discussing a secret payment to avoid it right before the election after he publicly
deflied the affair and knowledge of any such payment to her that might conceivably be seen as a valuable thing that michael cohen could provide to him that he could talk to them about. remember, if this recording was in fact marked privileged it means prosecutors didn't have it. michael cohen had it. michael cohen was in a position to make that available to them, but instead the president's lawyers leaked the existence of this tape and made it public anyway. trump's lawyers have taken this away as something cohen might have been exclusively able to offer prosecutors for their pursuit of any other charges or any other people they might be interested in. michael cohen would not to be able to give him something really valuable. all right. this presumably reduces his chances of getting any sort of great deal at least to the
extent that it hinged on this piece of evidence. now, obviously the president right before the election talking about a secret playoff, it is potentially of lured interest. it is of political importance. would it be of interest to prosecutors? we don't know for sure. we probably won't know until we see if this thing comes up in court or in an indictment. there are a number of ways of which this might conceivably end up being legally con again sseq for the president. this is in the abstract given what we know of the described conversation. starting with the least serious this may impact the president's financial disclose sure forms. the president's lawyer suggested that this was about whether or not trump should reimburse the national inquirer nar payment
that the publication made to her. it might indicate that payment was made to her on donald trump's behalf. the payment would be a campaign donation. and not processing that kind of donation properly, accepting a donation that large of federal election laws, that's the sort of thing gets you a slap on the wrist and a fine. if it was a knowing it could be a criminal matter for the president, the kind of thing
which a person could go to jail. stick a pin in that far moment. we will come back to that. further up the chain depending on the exact nature and the contract they entered into with national inquirer on the president's behalf there's also the possibility that fraud could be a relevant consideration here. now, if any of those potential charges were going to be pursued here around this hush money payment far number of them, particularly that campaign finance prosecutors would also
likely need testimony or some other kind of evidence that would show the mind set of the people involved in this alleged crime when these violations were committed. if and when this tape turns up you might expect that michael cohen would end up on the stand testifying as to the authenticity and context of this discussion. you might expect the other person in this conversation might both end up being called to testify as to what this conversation was about, what they understood it to be about, what they meant, whether they acted on what was described in the conversation. i mean learning about the existence of this was good for a thousand and one. the people hearing this tape will result in a larger impact if and when that happens. imagine how the white house must feel about president trump having to testify before a grand
jury as to that payment. the meaning of the this conversation, whether or not it implicates any criminal belaif y haif -- behavior. it really looks like it's the president's own legal team that put this out to get ahead of this story. and maybe in so doing may have reduced the chance that is michael cohen will turn evidence against the president. the prospect that the president will end up about these types of payments and cover-ups, it has to be an uncomfortable process. and that brings us to one last
point. the only way this is not a great source tonight in the white house is if the president is pretty sure that he won't ever get questioned about this stuff. if the president has some reason to believe that push comes to shove we'll litigate this to the end. in the end i know i am not going to be bothered or touched in any way by any criminal inquiry. if the president is pretty well assured of that being the final word on whether or not it is going get to him as president that would be a great load off the white house's mind at a time like this. well, there is a magic wand that the president is try to go wave in order to get that for his presidency. that magic wand is named brett k kavnanaugh. it is for hostility and support for gun rights and religious
freedom. there is one stance that sets him apart and it could not be more timely. his deep skepticism of the wisdom of forcing a sitting president to answer questions in criminal cases. it is in the at all farfetched to think that the question whether president trump must respond could come before the supreme court shortly after the confirmation process for the next justice says former acting solicitor general of the united states. i do not know of any judge who has staked out as strong a position on presidential immunity even from questioning adds jud judge kavanaugh has. this is where these things overlap. the russia scandal, the pending supreme court nomination. she said the white house was the subject when the president went
to the fbi director and pressured the fbi to end that investigation. can the president be questioned about whether or not it was obstruction of justice? yates said she was trying to influence the fbi investigation. was it criminal obstruction? when does the president get asked about that? on the michael cohen case, if on this tape the president is heard planning to reimburse this publication because they wanted to keep her story out of the press was that a criminal finance violation that could put a guy in jail? could that hush money payment which the president lied about, could it further criminally implicate it in terms of fraud or money laundering or anything more serious? completely separate and apart from whether or not he and his campaign were involved in the russia attack, all right. these other things are absolutely active criminal inquiries at this moment.
her is the president's nominee in this envy ronment. here he is in his own words. we should not burden with criminal investigations or criminal prosecutions. i believe that the president should be excused from some of the burdensover ordinary citizenship while serving in officer. congress should enact a law providing that any personal civil suits be deferred. congress should consider doing the same with respect to criminal ngss. a president while in office should be exempt from criminal prosecution and investigation including being exempt from questioning by criminal prosecutors or defense council. even the lesser burdens of a criminal investigation preparing for questioning, those things are time consuming and distracting. like civil suits criminal investigations take the focus away from his or her responsibilities to the people.
moreover the indictment and trial of a president would cripple the president. how did you pick that guy? but the russia investigation, with the russia investigation, with the michael cohen investigation, with the president's lawyers learning the hard way in the michael cohen investigation there are tapes of the president. how do you think president trump of all people to be his nominee of the supreme court?
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searched on monday, april 9th. this story appeared in the washington post. they worry federal investigators may have seized recordings made by his attorney. that very same day four days the new york times reported mr. trump called mr. cohen to check in. now today the times was first to report one of the many items was
in fact a recording of the president and michael cohen discussing payments made to a former playboy model. a woman who says she had an affair with the president. he denied having any knowledge of any such payment made to her. joining us is senior reporter at vanity fair who reported out an important new piece of this story. >> i spoke with the president's
attorney who said he wasn't sure but effectively they waived privilege by speaking about what's on the tape. >> yeah. you start talking about it. >> detail the transcript of the tape. what is interesting is that the transcript as described by rudy giuliani says one thing and people who are close to michael cohen have said well, that's not how we hear the conversation. >> they have described the content of the tape differently? >> as slightly differently. >> what's the way they are describing it? >> that is different. the difference is that the people around cohen say it's not completely and some of the details about -- that were reported today by mr. giuliani are what he had to say. in fact the issue of who brought
up paying for something in cash versus who brought up paying for something with a check is directly opposite. >> so giuliani is saying part of the reason is that the president want today pay by check rather than cash. >> it is transparent to do so. >> and from the other side people close to cohen are saying it was me saying you should pay by check. >> correct. i ran it by mr. giuliani. he said he saw the transcript which was created by three different lawyers clearly identify this as mr. trump having said -- >> we will find out presumably. >> okay. that's why this sounds like we are talking about the edges of the story. there is this alleged affair and a woman being paid to not talk about it. when it comes down to criminal liability the reason that privilege point seems important to me is that the special master said yeah, this is privileged.
what she is saying is this can't go to prosecutors. the fact that this came in with the president's lawyers talking about it and describing it means that the prosecutors now have access to it that no longer exists from him. this would seem to me to be something that the president's lawyers have done to make it harder. >> michael cohen has been worried for weeks, if not months that it would be an onslaught for people close to the white house that would either defame him, make his legal case more difficult for him. >> it makes his legal case more difficult. >> it is why he hired him to begin with. it is why he brought him a new
attorney to begin with. he wanted to be able to have someone who could defend him from this. the problem is that he can't defend this. now, we may find out that this tape is exactly the way that giuliani said it was and we may find out otherwise and we may never find out. >> and what we may experience is the president's legal team releasing all of the embarrassing things that have turned up to the press and cutting his legs out from under. >> it is also a great narrative change.
wouldn't you rather do that than what happened? >> senior reporter thank you for being with us tonight. i really appreciate it. >> all right. much more ahead. lots to come. stay with us. (vo) what if this didn't have to happen? i didn't see it. (vo) what if we could go back? what if our car... could stop itself? in iihs front-end crash prevention testing, nobody beats the subaru impreza. not toyota. not honda. not ford. the subaru impreza. more than a car, it's a subaru.
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they successfully gained access to dnc computers. the indictment says that the russian military intelligence officers took snapshots and stole that data from the democratic party. if the russians did that, if they were able to steal basically the math, the analytics. democrats had planned it out. that laid in the game in september 2016. once they had it it would put russian intelligence in a position to deploy that information directly themselves to help trump win or they could hand it over to the traump campaign. it could make its plans accordingly, alter their own plans for having the democrats game plan stolen by them.
this is what's sticking there. from the indictment we know that particular hack of the an lit ilks. it happened september 2016. what happened right after that? campaign spokesman said quote our data campaign is shifting resources from overperforming to battlegrounds within the battlegrounds. they cancelled and for the first time they started buying campaign ads in places they never campaigned before. they started increasing their time and focus on michigan they have bragged behind that decision. >> i moved it to michigan, wisconsin. i started buying advertising.
>> i started saying we need to go. >> maybe it really was pure lightning bolt genius. it is aimed at shrinking rather than expanding, aimed at keeping hillary voters at home. a senior trump official said we have three voter suppression operations underway. they are aimed at three groups that clinton needs to win overwhelmingly. which wl it had anything to do with the fact that somebody had hacked the clinton campaigns and democratic party's data and had all of their analytics, obviously we don't know. as team members are pointing out if they had access to our date to they would have a great road
map for how to do that, for how to sup proepress the hillary cl vote. there is that fight. playing out now on new terms given what we have learned from the big indictment. i want to point out another under appreciated and nerve rattling portion of this mueller indictment. that's next. touch shows how we really feel. but does psoriasis ever get in the way? embrace the chance of 100% clear skin with taltz.
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a little bit down. stop. back up again. is this adequate sunlight for a komodo dragon? -yeah. -sure, i want that discount on car insurance just for owning a home, but i'm not compromising. -you're taking a shower? -water pressure's crucial, scott! it's like they say -- location, location, koi pond. -they don't say that. laes week's military indictment contains one serious and sort of stand alone assertion that sticks out from everything else in the indictment. it describes an unnamed candidate in the 2016 election who asked for and received stolen information on his or her congressional opponent from these same russian military hackers that had been attacking the democratic party. as laid out documents were stolen from the democratic congressional campaign committee in april of 2016. they started being publicly
leaked in june 2016. in august 2016 the house democratic leader informed her colleagues about the posting of those hacked materials and the potential fallout from their release. it was news to democratic members of congress except for one. nebraska democratic congressman had been notified already in a private call the previous month in july that he had been a victim of that hacking. we have obtained this internal document on mr. ashford that was among the items stolen. he would go onto lose his race for reelection in november by just a fraction, by just over 3,000 votes. he was the first warned his material had been stolen in the russian hack. he ended up becoming the only to lose his seat in 2016. former congressman brad ashford
joi joins us now here on spet. what did you make of this and did you recognize your own experience? >> i think it was the dots where it started to be connected. >> i think it came up in our campaign. i'm saying we weren't necessarily engaged with our party on the issue. it was just a normal -- we were busy. we were doing our campaign. it is behind the scenes we were not aware of. >> in terms of your campaign did you -- did it take any weird twists and turns?
>> we felt we were going to win the race. we had a significant lead going into the last three or four weeks. high approval ratings. i can't tell you if this hacking had anything to do with the eventual loss by 1.1%. it slipped away pretty fast. >> and we don't flow -- and i don't mean to suggest that you were definitely the victim here. you were the one sited in this indictment. have you ever been contacted by law enforcement about it? >> i have not. >> your opponent who defeated you in november 2016, he says it definitely wasn't him. there rb a number of other republican members of congress that have come out and said it wasn't me either. what do you think about this as on ongoing controversy? it has to exist in a strange sort of parallel story. >> nebraskans were trusting
people. i think it's a terrible tragedy what happened in 2016. what's really a tragedy is it's continuing to go on. it's critical that congress achlact. congress -- congress needs to pass the relevant laws to say that if a political party or a candidate is made aware of these things that they're required to turn that information over to congress. >> right. a must notify. >> you must notify. this is insane. a lot of what went on after august we now know was happening behind the scenes. i think leaders of both parties were trying to make some kind of an arrangement where they would not dy vivulging this informati. but nothing happened. >> democrats asked the republicans, let us mutually pledge not to use this informati information. and the republican campaign committee said they're not interested. >> we can't leave it to that.
this is tragic for the country. this has to be resolved. it is going on now. without commenting on the trump piece of it, congress needs to act ir respect i have of what the president does or doesn't do. for me, the reason i posted we had been hacked just a few days ago was primarily to set the record straight. i didn't say anything during the campaign because i didn't know what was happening particularly. i didn't say anything after the election. i didn't want to be sour grapes about it. i didn't want to say we lost because of the russians. but congress must act. and on some of the initiatives that are out there that would address it. so it's very serious business, rachel, and i appreciate you bringing it. >> democrat of nebraska. i imagine it's been a little bit of a through the looking glass couple of weeks for you, sir. thanks for helping us understand. we'll be right back. stay with us.
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a more powerful way to stay connected. it gives you super fast speeds for all your devices, provides the most wifi coverage for your home, and lets you control your network with the xfi app. it's the ultimate wifi experience. xfinity xfi, simple, easy, awesome. this week has marked a new era of nightly protests across the street from the white house. this has been every night this week now. ever since president trump returned from his meeting with vladimir putin and this national outcry of the president's subordination to the russian president. there have been people out across the people from the white house every night. they're there tonight as well. this is tonight. tonight's version, as you can
hear, features a brass band. it's been loud on purpose. do you see the treason sign there? they have been as loud as possible, trying to be loud enough for the president to hear them when he's home. tonight of course they would have to get a lot louder to achieve that because the president went to his golf course in new jersey for the weekend. but there it turns out are some people there, too, who are also hoping to catch his attention. the group called the people's motorcade said they plan to deck out their cars and do a loop around the president's golf club. they also do this pretty much every saturday. but soon they are expected to up their game because they expect to receive and start implementing operation baby trump blimp. they're get ago 20 foot tall baby trump balloon like the one that british protestors flew last week, the one that the president said made him feel unwelcome. between the folks across the street in the white house and the folks circling the
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you might be missing something.y healthy. your eyes. that's why there's ocuvite. ocuvite helps replenish nutrients your eyes can lose as you age. it has lutein, zeaxanthin and omega-3. ocuvite. be good to your eyes. if you thought this was a big news week, just wait. on monday that last exit before the freeway final pretrial hearing we have been talking about in the paul manafort case in virginia. on tuesday, maria butina is expected back in court and she's
the russian citizen charged as acting as a secret agent to target the republican party. manafort's trial will start the following day on wednesday. so hydrate this weekend, right? eat your fiber. rest up. take good care. i will be spending part of my weekend in my own very special happy place with my friend joy reed. i will be with joy reed on a.m. joy. i hope i see you there. see you again on monday. i'll see you again tomorrow. then i'll see you on monday. now it is time for the last word. >> rachel, that's the stuff that we know about. let's not forget there is always breaking news and something pops up that we have no idea. rest, hydrate, sleep, drink a lot, whatever you got to do to get through the weekend to prepare yourself for next week. >> because the craziness never ends. >> it does not. >>