tv All In With Chris Hayes MSNBC November 27, 2018 5:00pm-6:00pm PST
the whimsy of the weak, but on two key factors, one history, the party of power gains average of 29 seats in the presidential midterm. no surprise. two, and this one is big, trump. this president never got past that "access" hollywood tape. people, most notably, heard it, and have spent the last two years watching trump live up to it. that's "hardball" for now. tonight on "all in". >> wikileaks, i love wikileaks. >> new reporting that paul manafort met secretly with julian assange. >> if that's what he said, that's obviously what the opposition is. >> as robert mueller appears to enter a final phase. >> obviously we don't know who's behind the leaks. >> tonight the new thinking about what the special counsel is planning, new incriminating e-mails from jerome corsi and roger stone and what we know
about paul manafort's ties to wikileaks. then -- >> if i'm elected you won't lose one plant, you'll have plants coming into this country. >> as general motors lays off nearly 15,000 employees. >> you're going to have jobs again, you won't lose one plant, i promise you that. >> michael moore on donald trump's broken promise and steve cor knac kornacki with the first results of 2017. when "all in" starts right now. good evening from new york, i'm chris hayes and at this hour polls have just closed in the final election of 2018. the senate runoff in mississippi. in which democrat mike espy is hoping for an upset against appointed republican senator cindy hyde smith running as an incumbent. she has insind area comments. steve kornacki will be here to
break down the results. it's been an election cycle brutal for president trump and his party. as the new congress gets red do i to put a check on the president, tonight there's evidence that the mueller investigation has entered the end game, or at least a new phase. and if you are donald trump, the news does not appear to be good. first, there was the head spinning news that mueller was ending his cooperation agreement with former trump campaign chair paul manafort because manafort had allegedly violated the agreement by lying to the government, by committing crimes in mueller's phrasing. mueller's team is vowing to lay out those alleged lies in detail before manafort is sentenced. "the government will file a detailed sentencing submission that sets forth the nature of the sentenced crimes and lies." that filing could double as a de facto mueller report, a way for the special counsel to release explosive findings from the public without any meddling from
matt whitaker who appears to have been tapped to hamper the investigation. what could manafort have to gain from lying to the government at this point? some speculated that manafort was effectively acting as a spy in exchange for a future pardon, that manafort has a deal that allows them to share legal information. president trump sent out a tweet that appeared to suggest he had inside knowledge of how mueller's team has been interacting with witnesses and targets. complaining about "how horribly and viciously" they are treating people. their plan may also well have backfired in a spectacular way. "the guardian" is alleging manafort held secret talks with julian assange in the ecuadorian embassy. nbc news has not confirmed that,
and wikileaks and manafort are vehemently denying. i if it is true it's significant evidence of collusion, more on that ahead. but there was yet another big development today as the pieces tart to fall into place. this one involving former trump campaign adviser roger stone who appeared to have advance knowledge that wikileaks would release the clinton campaign e-mails that were stolen by the russian government. stone and wikileaks communicated, at least in part, through jerome corsi, now going public. he maintained that he didn't have any inside information at all. he says he simply used his superior powers of deduction to figure out exactly what the russians and wikileaks had planned, he just guessed and told roger stone his guesses and happened to get everything exactly right. if true -- >> i said i bet, what assange has left, is podesta's e-mails
and it was speculation, deduction. i just happened to be right. i believe these podesta e-mails would destroy hillary. now why did i think they were coming out in october? because i said to myself, if i had these e-mails, i'd use them as the october surprise. >> so you essentially told stone exactly what was going to happen? >> yes. >> okay. unfortunately for jerome corsi that story fell apart almost as soon as he put it out. they put out a draft court document laying out what mueller has an corsi, a plea arrangement he has rejected, included in that document are emalgs from corsi to stone about the wikileaks e-mail dump "word is friend in embassy plans two more dumps," one shortly after i'm back, second in october, impact planned to be very damaging.
joining me now to make sense of all of this news, journalist marcie wheeler who covers national security and harry lipman, whose op-ed today was "what was paul manafort thinking?" . having sort of had a day to digest the news from mueller yesterday, what was your current theory about what exactly manafort was thinking? >> well, you know, everything you think of, chris, seems very implausible so you try to think of what's the least implausible? we've had the resurgence of the afraid of the russians theory and also new supposition about a pardon. but i tried to go through them, and just when you really break them down to their details, each seemed pretty implausible. my best guess, he's a really lousy poker player who got in over his head, thought he could, through some kind of partial
half truths get away with it and was exposed and is now way worse off than he would have been. so that part is clear. he's really a broken man. and my best guess of why he did it is just because he foolishly thought he could slice by. >> marcy, you've been write about this. take me through your best eg educated guess of what mueller is doing here, particularly the possibility of this next filing being an opportunity for him to enter facts into the record without interference. >> so for the sentencing phase he's going to present a report. and since he has claimed that manafort did not cooperate with the plea agreement, he's got to lay out all of the evidence to substantiate that. and we've already seen, with his plea deal, he released 40 pages of evidence of how manafort ran
campaigns in ukraine, by if way similar to how he ran trump's campaign, down to accusing his female opponent of breaking the law. he also, when manafort -- when he was basically saying manafort was witness tampering while he was being prosecuted he not only presented an fbi disclosure to lay that out, but he also included the call records where he was texting and calling people. >> right. >> so that's what we should expect to see in this sentencing memorandum, we should expect to see both the lies that he told, the behavior he was trying to hide about the lies, and the kind of call records and other substantiative evidence he would have presented if this had gone to trial. we'll see a lot, i expect. >> harry, there's a lot of people that felt the indications were from mueller yesterday that they had the goods from manafort. martin gelman, a great reporter who i respect, gave this
opinion. get your response. no way to know how bad this is for mueller, can't be good, manafort will be hammered but the public impobt seems for special counsel has lost evidence he obtained, and anything manafort coughed up may be tainted by new charges. he's a liar. what do you think of that? >> there's something to it. it depends how he wants to use the evidence. as marcy says he'll clearly have now chapter and verse to show the lies. and by the way it may now involve a rich motherload of information about corsi and stone as well. having manafort there to say it as probative value but might make the evidence admissible in a way it might otherwise not be if he has to proceed by jury trial. all that said, though, i think the -- what the paper really shows is he had the goods on manafort already, and he has them in some fashion. >> right. >> and remember, he's ultimately
producing a report. and so that information will find its way in there. i don't think it's the outcome mueller wanted, but i don't think he fears it either. if manafort or any witness is not going to play it a complete straight hand, he'll have no trouble walking away. and ruh rule number one, never try to guess what mueller already has. it always seems to be richer and deeper than we suspected. >> marcy, you've written about what you think might be the significance of mueller waiting until the president had submitted his written answers. until he did this, until he made this public. what do you think it is? >> well, as you said, manafort's lawyers and trump's lawyers continue to discuss what was going on the entire time he was supposedly cooperating. and so if mueller, when manafort lied, didn't correct him, didn't say, look, i've got these e-mails that show you're lying to me, then manafort may have
led -- may have been led to believe as harry said that mueller didn't have the evidence that he actually has. >> right. >> so manafort goes to trump and says he doesn't know about us discussing the june 9th meeting on june 7th, that's hypothetical, but it's a question that mueller asked about. then trump in his answers might have said, oh, sure, the june 7th meeting we didn't talk about russians offering e-mails as dirt. so it raises the chances, i think, that what trump just swore was the truth and handed in to mueller it raises the chances that the stuff pertaining to manafort is actually false. >> that's great, great point, marcy wheeler and harry lipman, thank you both. and now matt miller, a former chief spokesperson for the department of justice, and legal analyst cynthia alexson, a former federal prosecutor. matt, start with you, i want to talk about the corsi developments. i've never seen anything like this, and maybe i just haven't
been around the block enough. it appears that the guy -- he's rejecting a plea. and he is, i think, making public or giving a journalist, it appears, i don't know for sure, his own rejected plea deal, which states out a bunch of incredibly damning stipulations of fact that completely contradict his story? >> yeah, i've never seen anything like it either. people on twitter are trying to come up with logical explanations, but jerome corsi may be a bit of a crack pot. everything about jerome corsi and his intersection with the justice department here, it is kind of, you know, an example of -- it's sort of similar to everyone in trump's orbit where you have this culture that's really from the president on down of people who just lie all the time. people who lie when it makes sense and people who sometimes lie when it doesn't make sense. what you're seeing is what happens when people with -- you know, who just lie for a living, and jerome corsi's case he does
lie for a living. his career is selling books based on lies. and, you know, selling access to his website based on lies. when they -- what happens when those people interact with the justice department where lying is a crime? that's what you're seeing in jerome corsi's case. >> cynthia, this e-mail, what's laid out in the document that nbc has obtained is mueller's stipulation they have e-mails of basically corsi -- of stone telling corsi get in touch with the wikileaks folks. even as corsi maintains i just guessed it. word is embassy plans two more dumps, pretty ambiguous. >> in the documents obtained by nbc news there are three instances where mueller identifies corsi lies to him. the amazing thing about it is he writes the e-mails and then deleted them and then his defense is i forgot about the
e-mails. it's one thing to forget about an e-mail that's a groecery lis that didn't have anything to do with what the entire world was talking about for two years. but these are central to all we've been talking about. he deleted his and then he says oh, i forgot. he tries to come off as this cute little grandfather character. he's the one who pushed the birther conspiracy about president obama. and now, to just try to get away with, i'm just a grandpa and i just forgot, it doesn't work with me and i'm sure it's not going to work with mueller. >> having read the documentation that we've obtained from the mueller team, both the plea and the sort of stipulation of what they say happened, the statement of offense, matt, he seems to be in the same situation as manafort. he's caught dead to right. deleting e-mails, lying about things in amended statements. so they said you can come back of us and refresh your memory by
going back to the e-mails and he still lies to him. he's now -- he seems as caught as manafort seems. >> yeah, he's absolutely caught. that makes me wonder why he's backed out of the plea agreement, that was on track as late as last week. and, it's again you have to ask the same question about paul manafort. possible answers, of course, if you look at what jerome corsi, he's been sharing information -- his attorneys have been sharing information with rudy giuliani. so you wonder if at some point in the discussions the president sent this signal i'll take care of you. for paul manafort the signal wouldn't make sense. state charges would still apply for the money laundering and tax charges he was exposed to. for jerome corsi it's a federal crime. no analog state charge to prosecute him. if he was promised a pardon or dangled the possibility of a pardon, maybe that explains why the plea negotiations would
break down. otherwise it makes no sense. the document he released today makes clear, as you said, mueller has him dead to rites on false statements. >> cynthia, what seems striking to me is that mueller has established allegations in the criminal indictments of a criminal conspiracy to subvert the american election, to tip it over towards donald trump, away from hillary clinton, engineered by a foreign agent, russia under the direction of vladimir putin. open question is, were there american participanted who aided and abetted that conspiracy, members of the conspiracy to commit the federal crime, and what seems clear now is they are clearly zeroing in on some people they think kid did that. >> the e-mail you put up on the screen at the beginning on 2nd where they're talking about the information from assange, on august 3rd, the day after, stone has said he called and spoke with trump on the phone. so -- >> right.
>> what happened in that phone call? it's important to get an overlay of all the e-mails from stone and assange and guccifer and manafort. look at the twitter and the phone calls. >> the time line is lining up incriminatingly in early august if you look at stone, corsi, stone talking to the president. matt miller and cynthia alex , thank you for your time. as someone who sat through hearings, sort of disrupted as they often were, is the information we're learning now surprising to you, expected? what do you think? >> you know, i don't know if anything surprises me anymore. you said this is new to you. maybe you just haven't been around the block enough to have seen someone like this. let me assure you, no one has
seen anything like this. and i had a ringside seat to the testimony of everybody we're talking about with the exception of obviously mr. corsi. it is a very sad chapter in american history. and today's bizarre circumstances, i'm thinking of hunter thompson, the great journalist, what comes to mind is when the going gets weird the weird turn pro. we've got some strange people. the word crack pot was used. i'm not going to use the word crack pot, these are very odd characters and somehow they found each other, all under the trump campaign. working with an entity which for decades had been our greatest adversary, the russians. and somehow that all worked together toward the trump victory in november of 2016. it's just beyond belief. >> you're on that intelligence
committee, of course, the inquiry that was pursued was controversial, to say the least, many felt it was circumscribed, disrupted, subverted. the house democrats plan ongoing after a very obvious red flag, a piece of information which is that after don jr. sets up the meeting in trump tower. he then makes a call, that call was to a blocked number. and the republicans in the majority when they're running the committee didn't want to know what that number was, my understanding is you do. what do you do about that? >> look, i think, let me quote of all people steve bannon. i think in the book, "fire and fury" he said there was zero chance that dad didn't know about this meeting. i don't think we leave our common sense at the door when we investigate these things. right? this is not a weak father/son
relationship. so it's all the more reason for us, as an independent, separate government to conduct and regain our oversight authority. and in january, under democratic control, when we have subpoena authority, subpoena the documents like this, and keep people to come back under subpoena because they didn't have to answer our questions, and often they didn't. they didn't have to appear. and they were often allowed to follow the white house gag order. this wasn't an investigation of an independent sort. it was obstructed from its very beginning. by republican colleagues unfortunately were complicit with the administration in obstructing the investigation. and working hand in glove with them to make this as difficult as possible. and that's just that, but to attack the ability and the independence of the justice department and the intelligence community to do their job. in the final analysis what we may say about all this is what
the russians did to our country was an extraordinary attack. mike morell called it the political equivalent of 9/11. but the trump administration's response may have a greater long-term impact on the rule of law in our country. >> congressman mike quigley, thank you so much. the potentially massive reporting that former trump campaign chair paul manafort held secret meetings with julian assange. going through it in just two minutes. and need cold medicine that works fast, the choice is simple. coricidin hbp is the #1 brand that gives powerful cold symptom relief without raising your blood pressure. coricidin hbp.
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with julian assange inside the ecuadorian embusy in london on several occasions, right around the time manafort joined the campaign. the acquaintance with assange goes back for five years to when manafort was advising the moscow president. and a separate internal document written by ecuador's intelligence agency and seen by the guardian lists paul manafort as one of the guests and russians. manafort, assange and wikileaks strongly deny any meetings occurred. here to help figure out what to make of the report, ken dilanian, and an msnbc contributor, what do you make of this report, ken? >> chris, i have to say, my confidence in this story waned as the day went on. i spent all day reporting on it, talking to counterand former intelligence officials, including people who held very senior jobs and i couldn't find
anyone who was in a position to confirm this report. here's what i do know, that the british had this embassy under close surveillance. they knew, everybody who went in and out, and they would have shared that information had they logged paul manafort's presence at some point with the u.s. government, not necessarily in 2013, because who was paul manafort in 2013, but in the fall of 2016 when they were trying to figure out what happened with the russians and the trump campaign, it's clear to me that the intelligence side of the house was not aware of paul manafort being in that embassy. but the reason we haven't knocked it down is because what i'm told is that the fbi may have known about it and kept it to themselves because manafort is a u.s. person and there were rules about sharing the names of u.s. persons across the government, particularly with the cia. so we haven't knocked the story down and if true it's a game changer, obviously, and it's plausible for any number of reasons. and people might wonder, why would paul manafort be meeting with assange in 2013?
before donald trump was ever running for president. well, paul manafort was representing a ukrainian politician who was aligned with russian interests. wikileaks by 2013 was essentially an agent of the russian government, according to u.s. officials and was acting at the behest of russian interests and was leaking things that benefitted paul manafort's ukrainian client, one reason paul manafort could have been meeting with assange in 2013, chris. >> natasha, what do you think? >> so initially after this bombshell came out i think we were all very quick to leap on it because, of course, it is a huge revelation and it made sense. fitting in the timeline, it made perfect sense that manafort who had all of these ties to the russians maybe would have gone to the ecuadorian embassy to meet with assange and say, hey, look, i've got this heads up from the russian side that they have hillary clinton's e-mails because they stole the democratic national committee e-mails in 2015 and then maybe he was trying to broker a deal with assange whereby he would
release them at strategic moments throughout the election. all plausible. but on the other hand, of course, as ken just laid out, the sourcing is very thin. we don't know exactly where "the guardian" got these individuals who said they saw manafort leaving the embassy. but, you know, there's also the question of -- i've been told that the guardian sources they used for the story are actually sources they've used before for past stories that have not been challenged, have not been questioned. they are good sources. >> right. >> but it almost seems like it would be too good to be true. this just came totally out of nowhere. we were all focused completely on roger stone and corsi and their ties to wikileaks. but roger stone is a close associate of manafort, and has been for decades. there's a link there as well. we don't know as of now. i will note they didn't come out and knock down the story until well after it was released, paul manafort originally said he did
not have knowledge of the hacks themselves, released a statement much later. either they really -- either "the guardian" was wrong about this or paul manafort does not think they have proof that would -- that they could come out and say he was definitively there. >> i think that clarifies a little bit. i should say the last little thing, we do know manafort met with the president of ecuador in 2017. there's reporting today that mueller might be looking at that. that's a confirmed meeting, though, as ostensibly about a chinese investment project. thanks to you both. polls just closed in the last election, we think, of 2018. do democrats have a chance not deep red state of mississippi? steve kornacki will break down the first results next. tax-efficient investing strategies, and a dedicated advisor to help you grow and protect your wealth. fidelity wealth management.
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polls closed a half hour ago in the last major race in the midterms. the battle for mississippi senate. mike espy and incumbent cindy hyde-smith, too early to call. more on the first results we're seeing, head to the big board where steve kornacki is on top of it yall. >> what's starting to come in and what to keep an eye on, overall, south of 6,000 votes coming in statewide. some precincts, desoto county, one of the largest in the state, one of the memphis suburbs that challenges espy from winning as a democrat. precincts in, it's basically 50/50 here. a place where hillary clinton got about 30% in 2016, obama in 2012 got about 30%. one of these few places where you've got these sort of
college-educated swing voters, white swing voters, nationally moving the democratic party, not many pockets in mississippi where you have those voters. but for democrats tonight they need huge black turnout and they need to swing some white voters. this is the biggest place to look in the state. it is early. but you see espy in the early votes getting out of there, he is doing that in the early votes, it looks like. the question is where exactly in the county is this from, what will it look like as more presixti presix precincts report. >> steve kornacki, thank you for that, you'll be at the board tonight as the results come in. bring in cornell belcher, msnbc political analyst. what are you looking for tonight? there's the question of who wins, an espy win would be a shocking upset, frankly. but there's a big difference between espy losing by 15 or losing by two or five in terms
of the shape of what's going on down there. what do you think? >> i think when you look at what we saw, and steve pointed this out, when you look at those suburban counties, you know, and that sort of white college-educated vote, i mean that was a big deal for democrats nationally, especially winning college-educated white women, and hillary didn't win that last time around. you saw that on the national scale. that helped democrats. but i'll you'll see less of that in mississippi. you'll look throughout the south and you saw less of that happening in the south, or lesser margins than you saw overall nationally. and there's less of that sort of vote in places like mississippi truth of the matter, democrats have struggled with the vote in mississippi. es pivot 15 or 16% of the white vote, and senate got somewhere between 15% and 17% of the vote. the white vote is locked in, and is locked in and polarized along
old historical racial lines. race is still, to me, front and center in all of politics in the south, even when they try to cloak it, race is still front and center. >> we should note, there is, i believe, a statewide elected democrat in mississippi, the attorney general. so there has been -- there's some statewide wins, i think, in mississippi, unlike some states that have no one statewide. it is striking to me that when you look at georgia, which is a difference place with a lot more of the kind of college-educated white women, particularly, in the big metro areas, and the booming around atlanta, to provide a margin. but there's a recipe that comes into view, if you look at georgia and texas, it happened in became, a fluke, which is like if you mobilize young voters and voters of color, you get them to turn out and you get enough of that white vote, you can cobble enough to get close to 50. >> the -- >> not in mississippi, maybe, but other places.
>> you know, there's a difference between -- you know, the federal dem and the nonfederal dem. but on the federal dem side, look -- democrats, and i'll take heat for this. but democrats have not been able to give a narrative around race that makes moderate whites have skin in the game. >> that's interesting. >> and until moderate whites feel that they have some skin in this racism game -- >> that's interesting. >> it's going to be hard sliding of we sort of avoid the narrative at all. but until those moderate whites who are uncomfortable with racism, they feel as though they have skin in that racism game, that their children are not going to benefit, or their state's going to fall further behind and pay a price, until they have skin in the game, democrats will struggle to get a corner of the white vote. >> cornell belcher, thanks for joining us. still ahead, michael moore on the president's broken
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month, and spent crazy amounts of money on air travel and had the staff get his wife a job at chick-fil-a and -- looking for the lotion he liked. and he tried to buy that used trump mattress. that guy was getting away with all those scandal for a good long time until he found himself face to face with mighty ed henry. >> the average rent in washington is over $2,000 a month. >> not for what i rented. this was like an airbnb situation, ed. >> it's a block from the capital. you only paid for the nights you were there? >> that's exactly right. >> that's a sweetheart deal, your house in oklahoma, you pay a mortgage on that. when you don't sleep there, you still pay the mortgage, right? >> yes, but this is a tremendous difference. i wasn't using the facility. >> as surprising as it was to see scott pruitt on tv, no one
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no matter how much swamp scum scott pruitt got himself into when he was director of the epa, he could always find friends at fox & friends. they were so friendly they even gave pruitt the questions they were going to ask him, thanks to actual journalism from the daily beast which reviewed e-mails. pruitt's team chose the topics for interviews and knew the questions in advance. that led to fox fun journalism like this. welcome, mr. secretary. you're ready to go. what's your big announcement today? tell us how the trump administration is looking to create a red team, because in the military they do the red team, blue team thing. >> we're talking about memos and what's happening in the white house. this is what the american public really needs to be focused on, right, jobs -- >> personal safety. >> protecting our kids from
cancer. >> donald trump wants to build this wall, he's going to have trouble getting funding from republicans, but he might have trouble with environmentalists who think building a wall might hurt the iguana perhaps. >> the jaguars allegedly on the border. >> when you become accustomed to being treated like royalty, no surprise they knocked him for a loop. >> your house in oklahoma, you may a mortgage on that. when you don't sleep there -- >> this is a tremendous difference. i wasn't using the facility. whoa! the mercedes-benz winter event is back, and you won't want to stop for anything else. lease the gla 250 for $359 a month at your local mercedes-benz dealer.
thanks to the trump administration there are more children detained in a tent city than there are inmates in all but one of the nation's federal detention facilities. that improvised camp in texas now houses more than 2,300 boys and girls between the ages of 17 and 13. 2 population has swelled between the 364 children primarily sent there. due to the trump administration detaining people, even minors, who come unaccompanied as long as possible. when the government announced it was opening the camp back in june, the advocates voiced concern that kids were being detained on federal land in order to avoid state-based regulations for people who work in facilities and house children. now those fears have been
confirmed. according to an inspector general's report obtained by the associated press, none of the 2,100 staff are going through rigorous fbi fingerprint background checks, the director of office of refugee settlement gave the green light for this policy, granting a waver to staff up the camp without the required child abuse and neglect checks, which raise a red flag about any potential employee who has a record of hurting a child. so there are no fbi fingerprint background checks for employees staffing this overcrowded tent city for desperate, unaccompanied minors who have come here from central america. and just as there was a deliberate policy to separate mothers from their children, as people were tear gassed on sunday as they tried to cross the border, many of them mothers and children, it's part of a spectacle, one that's frequently lawless, always resolutely cruel and always designed to send a message about the kind of america trump and his base want
us to be. all right, there is breaking news, i'm being told, in the mississippi senate race as results are coming in. let's go to the big board and steve kornacki, what's the latest, steve? >> chris, still early, starting to come starting to come in. we have a complete county that is going to give you a sense of what we're going to see. warren county, you see in blue. this is vicksburg. you see statewide espy slightly ahead. 54% of the vote here, just to give you a sense of that means, compare that to what democrats typically do here. hillary clinton got 48% here in 2016. the interesting one is in 2012. barack obama, barack obama, kind of the high watermark for democrats in mississippi. obama got 44% statewide. the thing you want to keep in mind as the county results come in tonight is espy running on average six points or better above what obama did in 2012. so you see in warren county, there is improvement there
forspy over what has been the high watermark for democrats. it's four. on average, he needs to get six. it's not six. but then look up here we flagged this one earlier. 60% of the vote in desoto county. this one of the largest counties in the state. this a very republican county. take a look here at what we've seen in the past. this is a big jump here. clinton's 31% last time around, espy at 46. that high watermark for a democrat, obama in 2012. 33, espy at 46. we're trying to find out what precincts have come in desoto, what's left to come there are, they more tilted to republicans, what's to come back. again, starting to get a picture. you can see just a little bit more vote has come in as i've been talking about this. but starting to get a picture here of the votes coming in about only a couple hundred votes between them right now in interesting early picture. we'll put it that way. >> yeah, that's useful. we're seeing some indications, i remember when i was in texas on election night where you started to get early indications, and
things weren't exactly going along the groove lines of easy blowouts that had happened before which is what i'm hearing from you now here. >> it's very early. but i tell you, especially in desoto, and i want to see more votes come in here. put it this way. if all of desoto comes in and espy is still sitting around 46%, i think things get very interesting. if this slides back as the rest of desoto comes in, it's kind of more what we expected coming into tonight. we'll see. >> steve kornacki, thanks for that. we will keep our eyes on that. meanwhile, nine days before the 2016 election, president trump made this promise in warren, michigan. >> if i'm elected, you won't lose one plant. you'll have plants coming into this country. you're going to have jobs again. you won't lose one plant. i promise you. i promise you. . that was just over two years ago in warren, michigan. this week general motors announced it was shutting down production at their factory in warren, michigan, and four other
factories in north america, laying off almost 15,000 workers. joining me now academy award-winning filmmaker and activist michael moore. pretty stark what's going on in warren, that pledge and the news today. >> well, obama, you know, he saved -- he saved general motors. we paid for it. and now general motors is doing what they've always done. this is the thing about trump is that he -- he doesn't understand how he's been played by gm. gm's been doing this for a long time where give us tax breaks. give us tax abatement so we don't have to pay property taxes and we'll create all these jobs. that particular plant in detroit, it's call the poletown plant, they promised 6,000 jobs. there is about 1600 that work there. they never -- they never got the 6,000 jobs. they never followed through on the things they promised on. so if trump had any sense of
history, had study anything about corporate america, which he should have, because here's the thing with him. his indignation today, it sounds right. >> right. >> but he should know better. he gave them a historic -- all the corporations, a historic tax cut last year. >> that's the thing that sherrod brown pointed out today. gm, like all american corporations saw an enormous tax cut. their tax rate dropped 15 percentage points? >> they made last year -- their profit was $6 billion, general motors. >> wow. >> this is not a company that's hurting. so, so -- i've wondered in these two years why corporate america and wall street have been kind of quiet about trump, because he has never been one of them. he -- in fact, remember when he first ran he was going to make those hedge fund guys pay more in tax. he hates wall street. >> he series he hates.
i don't know if he hates wall street. >> he doesn't. but they've always hated him. to corporate america to wall street, trump's been the trailer trash of the millionaire class. they never let him in to their club, their exclusive high-end club. >> which is the source of a lot of seething resentment that he has. >> that he has. >> which i think he effectively channeled as a faux populist thing. >> but he gets into office, and what does he do? he gives them a big tax cut. he eliminates federal restrictions for fuel efficiency, for air pollution. he does all the things they want him to do as their boy. >> yep. >> and then this is what they go do, and he's all today -- it's like you're such a fool, trump, and you've been played again by these people who have never liked you. >> well, here's my theory on this. have i always thought that the thing -- the real achilles heel of this president in this moment in some ways is the economy if it starts to fall apart. that basically, the generally
good macroeconomic news, unemployment fairly low, there is a little bit of wage growth, again, a lot of people hurting. the american economy is broken in a lot of steep structural ways, but cyclically in a decent spot, that if that starts to go away, that's a real kind of jenga piece in his support, particularly in a place like warren, michigan. and then will are people who say you're out of your might mind. it doesn't matter what happens. >> three weeks ago tonight, the people of michigan and wisconsin and pennsylvania were all part of this rust belt, they already knew that they weren't benefitting from the trump presidency. they already knew that, well, they had done the job i told you two years ago that they were going to do. they don't like trump in places like michigan, but they saw him as their molotov -- >> fu. >> yes. to blow up the 178. message received. everybody now understands the people in the midwest and the rust belt have been hurting for some time. so when they had a chance now to elect other people, to do the
job better i think than other democrats that were running two years ago, now we're going to see the change. this is what happened with general motors. people in michigan today are -- they're angry at trump and they're angry at gm. they're angry at both of them. >> right. >> they're not going to tolerate this treatment anymore, and they're going to elect people like the rashida tlaibs who is now our new congresswoman from detroit. >> right. >> who is going to fight for the workers in detroit and not like the old guard that used to fight for general motors and get their tax breaks through congress and keep the michigan delegation, the democrats would always vote against any bettering of the air quality standards. it was an embarrassment for democrats. >> because they were going to bat for gm. >> they were going to bat for gm, which meant they were going to bat for jobs. >> right. >> i think now, especially with the younger generation, they see the lack of future that's in front of them, and they know it's all a bunch of bs, and they are going to take out their
revenge against both the company and the person who sits in the white house. >> you know, it's also there was that carrier deal that happened in the transition. >> yep. >> which was a moment of peak political deafness for the president which has basically been all downhill since. the whole thing turned out to be largely a con. there were huge tax incentives, the jobs number was way lower, the jobs went away anyway. but as a spectacle it was pretty effective. >> it was piece of tv he is good at. >> but that has not been replicated in many ways. and today it's interesting. it's interesting to watch him as you say impotently flail against gm, having already forked over billions of dollars to them. >> after they gotten all this from him, how would they do this to him? are you crazy? this is what they've been doing to everybody. this is what they've been doing to the very people that you said -- there will not be another plant closing. and he says it right there. >> in warren, michigan. not one more. >> not one mile from the plant that closed today.
>> here's my thing. those people in that factory. >> yeah. >> they're -- my sense is reality outs in that situation. >> uh-huh. >> people will be angry at him. >> absolutely. absolutely. but don't forget, he's our current problem, but he's sort of the bastard, you know, birth of capitalism. >> right. >> where it's ultimately we have a system with general motors and these other companies that are calling the shots. >> yeah. >> and that's what we've got to get in charge of. that's what these new democrats in congress have to get a hold on. we've got to get back to mississippi. >> there might be something out of mississippi. >> we've got get back to kornacki. >> you're not allow at the board. >> one last thing tonight, we are celebrating a new milestone. today we surpassed 5 million downloads of our podcast "why is this happening". >> i don't have that. >> today ta-nehisi coates put us over the top. the first time recording the
show in front of a live audience. a ton of fun, really enlightening. wherever you get your podcasts, get this one. >> it's a great one. >> if you would be interested in going to a show in your hometown tweet us. that's is "all in" for this evening. "the rachel maddow show" starts this evening with rachel. good evening, rachel. i didn't know if you were in tonight and i see you there. >> look, it's me. or somebody hiding behind an incredibly life like max of me. not to give you an existential crisis or anything. did you say 5 million? >> we have 5 million downloads of the show, yeah. >> that's friekin fantastic. >> it's been great fighting. >> you're really good at being on tv, but you're also really good at that other thing you do. you've got a knack. >> thank you. >> well done, my friend. thanks. thanks to you at home for joining us this hour. it is good to be back with you. there is a lot going on in the news right now. we've changed up our show like 17 times in the last hour and a half. one of the things we are watching tonight, which is not necessarily on the national radar in a w