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tv   The Rachel Maddow Show  MSNBC  February 1, 2019 6:00pm-7:00pm PST

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new jersey. the new jersey i inherited had those. >> phil murphy of new jersey, thank you so much for your time and candidness. appreciate it. >> thank you. that is "all in" for this evening. "the rachel maddow show" starts right now with joy reed in for rachel. >> have a good rest of your night. >> thank you. >> rachel has the night off. we've had a very busy news day that turned into a busy news night. donald trump pulling the u.s. out of a major region era arms treaty with russia and the rather odd statements the white house put out. we'll bring you the latest news from the russia investigation including roger stone back in court today and the 2020 field got even bigger today when senator cory booker announced that he is running for president and made that announcement on the first day of black history month but we begin with the news still breaking out of virginia tonight where the democratic governor is facing growing calls
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to resign after a yearbook photo showing some truly offensive content surfaced. this page from a yearbook belonging to northam made its way to the mainstream press. northam was a pediatric neurologist. the page is from a medical school yearbook whether he was 25 years old. it shows northam and a friend, one dressed in black face and another dressed as a ku klux klan. it was posted on a right-wing website called "big league politics." the guys that run the site used to run roy moore's senate campaign. after they posted the photo, it was verified by the main stream press. "the washington post" and a virginia pilot were the first news organizations to authenticate it. the medical school says yes, this is the 1984 yearbook but we
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don't know which person in this photo is northam and his friend. is he the person in black face or the person dressed like he's in the kkk because the governor has not said. the governor released a statement in print and moments ago on video. >> my fellow virginians, earlier today i released a statement apologizing for behavior in my past that falls fall short of the standard you set for me when you elected me to be your governor. i believe you deserve to hear directly from me. that photo and the racist and offensive attitudes that represent does not reflect that person i am today or the way that i have conducted myself as a soldier, a doctor, and a publish servant. i am deeply sorry. i cannot change the decisions i made, nor can i undo the harm my
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behavior caused then and today, but i accept responsibility for my past actions and i am ready to do the hard work of regaining your trust. i have spent the past year as your governor fighting for virginia that works better for all people. i am committed to continuing that fight through the remainder of my term and living up to the expectations you set for me when you elected me to serve. thank you. >> that the the virgin's the vi tonight. he amended the statement for that extraordinary statement you saw on video saying clearly there, he does intend to serve out his term. apparently, he does not intend to step down. he release that video amid growing calls for resignation and questions whether his governorship can survive. shortly after the news broke, the republican party called for the governor to resign. what ralph northam did given his statements on the right to life
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coupled with the most recent revelations, he's lost the moral authority to continue to govern and should resign immediately unquote. this virginia story is also reverberating at the national level. the democratic presidential primary kicked into another gear in week and the contenders are beginning to weigh in. julian castro, mayor of san antonio posted this after 7:0 ocho p. 0 p.m. it doesn't matter if he's a democrat or republican, this behavior was racist and unconscionable. camilkamala harris said leaders called to a higher standard and the strain of racism should have no place in the halls of government. the governor of virginia should step aside so the public can heal and move forward. at the state level, as you can
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imagine, the debate is also heating up. the black caucus issued a statement condemning the photo without recommending what the governor should do. quote, we are sill processing what we have seen about the governor but une kwsay it's com betrayal. the legacy of slavery, racism and jim crow has been an a painful history and piercing reminder of this nation's sins. those who would excuse the pictures are just as culpable. the democratic leader in the virginia state senate expressed support for governor northam saying in part while the photo is in quote very poor taste, i would think no one in the general assembly who liked their college conduct examined. i would hate to have to go back and examine my two years in the army. trust me, i was 18 years old and i was a hand full, okay?
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he said the governor northa m's life since the picture is the opposite from what you seen in the yearbook. it's been a life of helping people and many times for free. a different take from the virginia "richmond times" is calling for governor northam to step down. it's a revelation of his photo from medical school with a man in black face dressed next to a person dressed in ku klux klan clothes. we all act foolishly in our youth but a college graduate studying to be a physician in a state with a troubled racial history should know better to reduce that history to a joke. the photograph is a lack of adult judgment. it does not erase his time in the military or compassion as a physician. he should for the good of virginia step down from the highest office and allow justin fairfax to succeed him.
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that brings us to the democrat who would take over if governor northam would resign, that would be justin fairfax. if governor northam resigns, it would be governor fairfax that would serve out his term and be eligible to run for a full term in 2021. there is only two african american governors in the history of the united states. if ralph northam resigns, justin forfax would become the third. that fact in the potential history to be made cannot be helpful to northam's bid to hang on. the naacp, tim scott of south carolina condemned the photo and said the people of virginia will make their voices heard. meanwhile, amid the calls for northa m's resignation over a photo in his medical school
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yearbook since the governor apologized in print and then video without saying which of the two people he was, a yearbook from his college years at the virginia military institute has also hit the en r internet showing what appears to be two nicknames under his real nail. we reached out to the governor for comment and have not heard back. like i said, lots and lots and lots of rolling developdevelopm. joining us is the director of virginia center or politics and public affairs officers for move larry, i want to go to you first, on two things, onemoveon. larry, i want to go to you first, on two things, one , are you surprised governor northam came out on video saying he intends to stay on and can he hang on? >> well, not really. you know, most elected officials do try and hang on until there is no other possibility. that's been true in our history, you know, the me, too, movement changed that for awhile but this
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is a very different circumstance, and we don't know for sure that he will be forced out, but i can tell you, the people i've talked to tonight both national and state were unanimous, many of them democrats, unanimous that he could not survive this because if he did, he would be hobbled for the remaining three years of his term and not be of use to his party. there is a legislative election for all 140 seats in the legislature coming up this november. >> and not only that, there is a major race obviously coming up in 2020 where democrats hope to carry virginia, not that virginia is necessarily less bluish purple than before but i wonder if he's getting pressure because virginia is important for the 2020 campaign and because justin fairfax is not a republican, he's an african american that would make history if he became the governor and might be a better look in terms of the 2020 picture.
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is that putting more pressure on him? >> that's an interesting way to put it, good way to put it. you're too young but those who are older like me remember that nixon hung on as long as he did because he had an insurance policy in his vice president. ralph northam is much less lucky. he doesn't have an insurance policy because justin fairfax is a very intelligent able guy that would make a good governor. he is african american, which would help to heel the wounds caused by this terrible incident that floored all of us that know ralph northam. i couldn't imagine this could be part of his past, but there you go. justin fairfax makes it easier for those who want to call on northam to step aside. it would make it easier for northam to step aside because a democrat will succeed him and an african american. joy, i have to put in a word for
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my state. virginia is taking a lot of knocks and rightly so over the years, but we would be the only state with two african american governors in our history, doug wilder from 1990 to 1994 and justin fairfax. who would believe virginia might have provided two african american governors? >> yeah, indeed, there have only been three in the entire country. massachusetts was the third. let me corine. the things that built up whether charlottesville, which was started as a disagreement over the statute of robert e. lee. head of the state senate refused to preside over it while a commemoration that's done every year for robert e. lee, he refused to participate in that. he made a statement on that and
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in florida you just had, he was secretary of state for a day had to resign after black face pictures of him surfaced where he was mocking katrina victims. does all of that that sure rosu make it harder and harder for northam to hang on? >> absolutely. i believe he needs to resign tonight. florida and virginia have a dark history of racism as we know and it came in full view with charlottesville with the fight for robert e. lee statutes and white supremacy statutes. here is the thing, today we watched the second prominent african american presidential candidate jump into the race on the first day of black history month. days ago on martin luther king day, we watched the first african prominent african american jump into the presidential race in this cycle. we are in a different time and
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this is not -- in many ways, this isn't about politics but what we saw and ralph -- these pictures with ralph northam when he was 25 years old in 1984 is incredibly disturbing and shameful and horrific because one of the things i agree with with the legislative black caucus, the statement they put out is it a is scab and reminder of the racism, the slavery, jim crow, this country's original sin and that's why ralph northam cannot make it through the weekend. i do not e be leave thbelieve t to happen. one of the constituencies that got him into office in november 2017 was the high turnout with black voters. can you imagine the betrayal that you possibly may feel as a virginia voter? black voter that went out in november 2017 to vote for him? so i just don't see it. i don't see how he can last and not only that, it's just what is
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right and what is wrong. it is about racism and it is about making the right choice, he needs to resign. he cannot be taken seriously anymore and it's not the right thing to do. >> the origins came from the site hunting for dirt? >> thank you. it's clear it was some intense opposition research and he was targeted and they found something and put it out there. he said yes, it's him. >> his statement says the virginia senator, this photo is shocking and deeply offensive, all the more so because of the long and painful history of racism and violence, the governor must listen to the people and consider what comes next and not an out right call to resign. tim kaine who was the vice
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presidential candidate in the preceding presidential cycle saying this race is from the 1984 yearbook is horrible and causes pain in a state and country with racism have left an open wound. i hope the governor's career as a pediatrician and public official man feifested a committ to justice and equality to all takes time to listen how to move forward. not direct calls to resign. i wonder who in the state becomes the deciding factor and has the poll, if in fact the party decides it's time for northam to go. who has the sway that could potentially force him out? >> well, you were right to mention terry, the immediate past governor. northam was the last governor. he might have something to say. warner and cane left something out there. they could come back with a second statement. i also know of a very senior
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well-known african american official. he can make his announcement, he can call for the governor's resignation and people will know who he is right away. so look, i just think things look dark for northam and the governorship is in shambles and going to be a drag on his party for the remaining three years of his terp. >> does this cause reflex on the commemoration of robert e. lee. these are going on despite it being seen as one of the last of the new south states. >> yeah, well, you've hit a nerve with me, of course. i'm from charlottesville. if i had my way, they would all be gone and i'm shocked -- i'm not shocked that the virginia general assembly has done absolutely nothing about allowing at least local choice for removing the statutes and again, not defending northam at all, what he did was horrible
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but he was terrific on charlottesville. you have to look at the whole record, but i have a hard tile g -- time getting that image out of my head. that was terrible. that was the mid '80s. that wasn't the '50s. that was the mid '80s. there is no excuse for it. >> last one to you, let's talk about it. it seems to be jumping into 2020 but you already had two of the announced candidates come out and make statements, do you expect more of cory booker, i don't believe made a statement yet but does this become an issue among the 2020 candidates where weighing in on northam is important? this is an important 2020 state. >> it is absolutely important. look, we have a diverse incredibly diverse 2020 primary field, right? we have a latino and two african americans and openly gay
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candidate and also, we have women. so issues like this do matter. they need to speak up and talk about this. and they can't stay silent on this at all. we are in a different time. yes, we have donald trump in the white house who is a biggot and racist and we elected the most diverse house in history. we have to speak up and speak out against this. this is racism. he was 25 years old. this is 1984. it is not okay. we have to send a message. >> larry, the dean really of the virginia political world, university center for politics. marie john pierre. thank you both very much. appreciate it. thank you. stories like this tend to move
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very, very quickly. we'll keep our eyes on developments but up next, the democratic 2020 field just indeed got more crowded with the latest entrance kicking off his campaign on the first day of black history month. we'll talk about that when we come back. we'll talk about that when we come back. money. save up to 10% when you bundle with esurance. including me, esurance spokesperson dennis quaid. he's a pretty good spokesperson. ehhh. so when i say, "drivers who switched from geico to esurance saved an average of $412," you probably won't believe me. hey, actor lady whose scene was cut. hi. but you can believe this esurance employee, nancy abraham. seriously, send her an email and ask her yourself. no emails... no emails. when insurance is affordable, it's surprisingly painless. each day justin at work... walk. and after work. he does it all with dr. scholl's. only dr. scholl's has massaging gel insoles that provide all-day comfort. to keep him feeling more energized. dr. scholl's. born to move.
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today new jersey senator cory booker is the latest democrat to jump into the increasingly crowded 2020 presidential poll. he's hoping to take advantage of the political climate and the prospect of taking on an unpopular divisive unevincumben president. resulting in a newly emboldened democratic house and also, this is the time to do it by historical standards it's not that early. >> congressman morris democrat today announced he'll seek the party's presidential nomination, that isn't unusual but two years before the presidential election and that is unusual. >> the 1976 race for president
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actually got underway in the fall of 1974. two full years before the election. president ford had been in office forless th less than thr months. republicans lost 49 seats in the house and four in the senate. as punishment for the watergate scandal and ford's pardon of richard nixon two months earlier. just eight days after those crushing 74 midterms, see the date there, november 13, 1974, the first democratic contender was already in. a month later before the year was up, democrats had a second candidate. you might remember him. >> a second democrat announced today that he is a candidate for president. he's the out going governor of georgia jimmy carter. here is part of carter's announcement of his candidaandi >> as of this time, here in the
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state i love sure roundrounded friends of mine all over the nation, in fact from the moon, i'd like to announce that i am a candidate for president. >> that guy jimmy carter would come out on top of 17 democratic candidates and then ride the anger and watergate of gerald ford in the again real election and the same kind of post 1974 environment we find ourselves in today. which is perhaps why we're seeing more than 20 democratic candidates that announced they are running for thinking about jumping into the race. cory booker announced his candidacy today in newark and a video that's a staple of the modern day campaign. >> in america, we have a common pain but what we're lacking is a sense of common purpose.
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>> cory! >> what's up? >> amen. >> i grew up knowing that the only way we can make change is when people come together. we are better when we help each other. the history of the nation is defied by collective and slaves and abolitionest and those who were born here and chose america as home and took up arms to defend our country and leaked arms to challenge and change it. together we will common our pain back into our common purpose. together america, we will rise. i'm cory booker and i'm running for president of the united states of america. >> booker announced his candidacy on the first day of black history month. never hurts to get a little symbolism in. last month, kamala harris in the field launched her campaign on martin luther king day. today harris marked the start of
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black history month but noting the congresswoman shirley chism and quoting her. quote, you don't make progress by standing on the sidelines wimpering and complaining. you make progress by implementing ideas. harris noted she stands on the shoulders of giants like congress woman chism. >> not only am i the dark horse, i'm the poor horse. the only thing i have going for me is my soul and my commitment to the american people. >> anyone that's 35 years of age or over and a natural born citizen can run for the presidency. all of us meet that criteria, the people will make a decision. >> the people will make a decision. she came up short in 1972 and did win 28 delegates.
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now her legacy is inspiring campaigns 50 years later when the people will make a decision. democrats already have a good roster to choose from even as another big name candidate continue to ponder their future and map out a path to victory. each candidate will have to choose their particular path and the path iowa and new hampshire have received the lions share of the attention. but in recent years, it's increasingly the paul meadow state, south carolina that played king maker or campaign stopper in this process. in 2008, it was south carolina that rejauf niguvenated barack campaign and today "the new york times" reports booker will focus heavily on south carolina and other southeastern states with large black voting populations. he'll be one of a flood of candidates competing in a state that's becoming a bigger prize with every election cycle and which the african american vote accounts for a whopping 60%, 6-0
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of the democratic primary electret and we have someone that understands politics inside and out, jamie harrison joins us next. jamie harrison joins us next sites but there was always a catch. like somehow you wind up getting less. but now that i book at, and i get all these great perks. i got to select my room from the floor plan... very nice... i know, i'm good at picking stuff. free wi-fi... laptop by the pool is a bold choice... and the price match guarantee. how do you know all of this? are you like some magical hilton fairy? it's just here on the hilton app. just available to the public, so... book at and get the hilton price match guarantee. if you find a lower rate, we match it and give you 25% off that stay. billions of problems. morning breath? garlic breath? stinky breath? there's a therabreath for you. therabreath fresh breath oral rinse
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we have two stories enter connected. cory booker jumped in today and the governor of virginia, democrat ralph northam turning up as either the man in black
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face or the one in the kkk outfit. governor northam apologized but not clear he survives the calls for resignation and now republican senator tim scott of that all important early primary state of south carolina is speaking out about the virginia governor. saying the governor's apology is good but the people of virginia will make their voices heard. i'm betting the people of senator scott's south carolina will have opinions, as well. joining us is jamie harrison, the former chair of the south carolina democratic party, also the author of climabing the hil, how to build a career in politics and make a difference. thank you for joining us, jamie. good to talk to you. >> thank you, joyce. good to see you. >> we have lots and lots of statements coming out. kamala harris called. i'll go to the northam story and senator harris called on governor northam to resign. you have 2020 candidates weighing in.
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elizabeth warren weighed in. how do you think this winds up playing out? a lot of candidates are practically living in your state in south carolina trying to appeal to an electret that's 60% african american. does their stand on northam become a factor in how much support people can gain in south carolina? >> listen, joy, i think that this will be one of the many factors that some of the folks in south carolina will look and gauge where our candidates are in terms of democratic party. i believe that they are stupid, there is dumb and unconscionable and these images and the things that we're seeing with coming up with the nickname, those things are unconscionable and it's in the best interest, i think, for the people of virginia for the nation, for the governor to just step down. >> i mentioned the statement by elizabeth warren. i'll read the statement that just came out. these racist images are deeply disturbing and hatred and
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discrimination have no place in our country and must not be tolerated and must resign. we know that elizabeth warren is spending a lot of time in your state and cory booker is prepared to spend a lot of time in your state. let's talk about what this race is going to look like in south carolina. obviously, you have to win, place or show to come out of south carolina with at least something, some momentum. is there a candidate in particular that's got an early good read on the electret? >> well, i can tell you the actions that i've seen so far in south carolina, joy, one senator harris and senator booker have been spending a lot of time down there. they are talking to a lot of staffers or potential staffers and with a lot of the community leaders in south carolina, but, you know, this is also a state with strong dies to vice president joe biden and so i also have seen a lot of action lately from senator warren.
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you know, eric was down there. you have all this action in south carolina. it not clear at this point whether there is a definite front runner in the state, but nonetheless, you know, everybody is doing a little dating right now. >> yeah. >> to gauge and see where these candidates really are on the issues that are most important to them. >> let's go through a couple of them quickly. senator -- congressman clyde burn you know well, very important politician there in south carolina said biden is the candidate to beat. and at the same time, kamala harris had some challenges with some parts of the african american electret because of her background as a prosecutor. how does it play out between his ties to a bill that's unpopular for hillary clinton and kamala harris' time as a prosecutor? are either of those going to become problematic for voters? >> one of the things, the crime
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bill was front and center in the 2016 race. you know, that was an issue that bernie sanders brought up repeatedly in the contest with hillary clinton. and i see that that particular issue breaks down on -- there is some differences generationally. a lot of younger people, this is an issue they are very believing and people i talked to in south carolina that have an approach where the bill is considered. on that particular issue, you'll see some generational divides, but in the end of the day, you know, for any of those, the senators or anybody that actually voted on that bill is working in the criminal justice space, they have to talk about their stance and the things that they have done previously because for a large section particularly the up and coming african american electret, that is a very, very important issue for them.
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>> i'm sure there will be a lot of talk about the issues of crime, tough on crime, mass incarceration, associate chairman of the democratic national committee. thank you so much. appreciate your time. >> thank you, joy. good to see you. when we come back, trump associate roger stone goes before a judge and she's not here for his signature antics. more on that just ahead. ignatur. more on that just ahead. ♪ carla is living with metastatic breast cancer, which is breast
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each day justin at work... walk. and after work. he does it all with dr. scholl's. only dr. scholl's has massaging gel insoles that provide all-day comfort. to keep him feeling more energized. dr. scholl's. born to move. the one-man show that's roger stone had a court episode today but you might want to binge watch it. stone was in court for a status hearing on the case charging him with sen counven counts of lyin congress, obstruction of justice and evidence tampering. they are considering slapping stone with a gag order and wasted no time laying out why. quote, i noticed there is considerable publicity fueled in
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large part by the extra judicial statements of the defendant himself. i recognize that the arrest and indictment were public and the defendant may have justifiably felt the need to get his story out but there is no question at this point he certainly had that opportunity. quote, since this is a criminal proceeding and not a public relations campaign, i believe that it behooves counsel and the parties to do their talking in this courtroom and in their pleadings and not on the courthouse steps or on the talk show circuit. she reassured stone that thing gag order would prevent him from taking to his case and stone would still be able to quote discuss foreign relations. immigration, or tom brady as much as he wanted. we love a little judge humor. judge jackson warned stone treating the buildup to the trial like a book tour could taint the jury pool and offered this ominous warning for the famously loose lipped
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self-described dirty trickster. quote, the defendant should be aware to the extent any public pronouncements turn out to be inconsistent with each other or bear on the facts of the case in any way, the office of special counsel will be free to introduce any of them as evidence against him at trial. maybe roger stone wants that gag order after all. remember, this is the same judge amy berman jackson who presided over roger stone's old pal paul manafort. he was contacting potential witnesses and today the judge warned stone not to pull any of what manafort did. quote, it's a condition of your release you may not contact any of those individuals or any individuals that you believe are witnesses in the case in person by mail, by phone, electronically, that includes e-mails, text messages, instant messanger, instagram, what's app
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or any other encrypted or unencrypted app and the ban on contacting directly including communication through any ent intermediary other than counsel that entered an appearance in this case. is that understood, mr. stone? yes, your honor he replaies. the government wants okafor sto -- october for stone to go to trial. for all the reporting special counsel robert mueller is about to wrap up, the roger stone time frame suggestions maybe not. joining us now is elliott williams. thank you for being with us. >> hi. >> let's talk about the timeline first. there is all of this scuttlebutt and it happens every couple weeks i feel like, it's almost over, the mueller investigation is going to wrap up and a.j. whitaker hinted at that but if the judge says october as a date for the stone trial, does that
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mean by default this is not ending any time soon? >> we don't know what this is going to end and could take a significant amount of time. under the law, mr. stone would be entitled to a trial within 70 days but because of all of the evidence that was uncovered, you're talking about terabytes of data and hard drive information and e-mails and texts and so on. the government felt they needed more time to go through it. so presumably -- mueller could have been wrapping up but they needed more time or might still be going on. remember, let's not forget in the grand scheme of special counsel and independent counsel investigations, this hasn't gone on for that long. we're really only at the two year mark and if you think about white water, that started in 2004. and the charge so even the end
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isn't coming tomorrow, it may be at some point in the relatively near future and following a great deal of success. >> and the judge is pointed in trying to warn roger stone not to hurt himself by speaking out of turn and potentially contradicting either his own statements or statements by other witnesses. we know that michael cohen has not been subpoenaed by the senate intelligence committee for closed door sessions on february 12th, that is going to happen. we know that per a cnn article, the house oversight committee is in talks to bring cohen in on february 7th and that would be an open session, that's the day he was originally slated to testify. how much jeopardy does that in your view put really either roger stone or even donald trump in because now you can have cohen telling one story and ronlronl ronler -- roger stone putting himself out there and interviews and talk a lot.
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could that be problems? >> yeah, it puts potentially all of them in jeopardy. number one, every time one of these individuals opens their mouth, they seem to tell more lies. cohen has been charged with lying. roger stone has been charged with lying. paul manafort has been charged with lying. if you notice there is a trend here and frankly, they are tied to a president that i believe in 2018 was found to have lied 15 times a day over the course of 2018 and so the jeopardy is number one they can contradict themselves, which that becomes evidence at court. they can commit acts of perjury that is a new crime and so, yes, every time they talk, they seem to get themselves in more trouble. the other thing is that congress as a body can also hold them in contempt for lying or prosecute them for lying and this can mess up the prosecutions, too, because they are running mouths and getting themselves in more trouble. again, it's when people are path logically untruthful, they are
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going to get themselves in more trouble the more they testify and speak and they are jeopardizing frankly their own chances of getting fair trials. like every time roger stone opens his mouth and this is what the judge is trying to protect him from. he's harming chances of getting his own fair day in court. >> i'm not sure who told him to go to the media tour. the judge said don't do any more of that. it's not a good idea. thank you very much. appreciate it. coming up, the president checks off yet another item on vladimir putin's wish list. stay with us. putin's wish list ay with us hi guys, this is the chevy equinox. it offers a lot of great technology inside. oh, this is fancy. yeah, that's the available hd surround vision camera. the top of your car? it helps you see dangers around the vehicle. what is that? what the? wait wait wait... what is that? oh my god. he's harming chances of getting vladimir putin's wish list. he's harming chances of getting vladimir putin's wish list 're s. so who's getting out first? i don't know but we're keeping this camera on. [laughing]
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the president of the united states and the general secretary of the communist party of the soviet union signed the inf treaty. >> today i for the united states and the general secretary for the soviet union have signed the first agreement ever to eliminate an entire class of u.s. and soviet nuclear weapons. we have made history. >> in december of 1987 ronald reagan and mikhail gorbachev came to a dramatic agreement. at the height of the cold war they agreed that the united states and the soviet union would eliminate all land-based missiles with ranges between a few hundred and a few thousand miles. after the treaty was signed more than 2,000 missiles were destroyed between the two countries. for over 30 years the intermediate range nuclear forces treaty or inf has served
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as a check on ambition goes of the two largest nuclear powers on earth, until today when secretary of state mike pompeo announced that the trump administration is suspending the treaty effective tomorrow. in six months if they don't find that russia has come into compliance with the terms of the inf, they will terminate the treaty all together. the president managed to put pa positive stand on the affair saying, we stand ready to engage with russia on arms control negotiations that meet these criteria, and, importantly, once that is done, develop, perhaps for the first time ever, an outstanding relationship on economic, trade, military levels. this would be a fantastic thing for russia and the united states, and would also be great for the world, unquote. european allies are understandably very, very nervous. after all, the missiles regulate it out of existence by the treaty could reach europe within minutes from russia. now it is widely acknowledged russia is violating the terms of the treaty and it was the obama administration who first
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confronted putin about missile tests back in 2014. but it is the response to that violation where things get more complicated. i mean why not work harder to get russia back into compliance rather than issue ultimatums? who will benefit most from demise of the treaty and are we headed for a new arms race? a nuclear weapons policy expert and president of the plows fund argued in an op-ed, when someone breaks the law, the answer is not to repeal the law. there are well-established methods of bringing an offending nation back into compliance. he joins us tonight. thank you for joining us. let's answer the last three questions. who benefits most by the u.s. backing out of the treaty? >> vladimir putin. it is a gift to vladimir putin. he's the one that gets to deploy as many weapons as he wants because there are no longer or won't be in six months limits on what he can do.
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it, of course, produces great trains in the u.s./european alliance system. that's to putin's favor. the u.s. kicks the blame for this also to putin's favor. this is not standing up to russia. this is a gift to russia. >> was there some other way that the u.s. could have encouraged compliance if the obama administration was also complaining that they were not complying? >> absolutely and ronald reagan showed us the way. treaties often have violations in them. one state or the other accuses another party of violating the treaty. in what ronald reagan became president, he accused the soviet union of violating another treaty, the anti-ballistic missile treaty, but he didn't pull out of that treaty. he didn't kill that treaty. he pressed the russians for six years. in fact, while he was pressing them, he negotiated with them this inf treaty. and after mikhail gorbachev and reagan signed that treaty, the soviets admitted that they were in violation of the abm treaty
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and think tore down the offending radar. that's the way you get somebody into compliance. you don't let them off the hook, you press them into they give in. >> kind of scary news. thank you for breaking it down for us. thank you. >> thank you, joy. still ahead tonight, something you want to keep your eyes on this weekend. stay with us. stay with us
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entyvio®. relief and remission within reach. >> okay. one quick thing will. i said at the top of the show there have been two african-american governors in history of the government. during reconstruction, governor of louisiana for about a month. since then we had governor duval patrick in massachusetts and douglas wilder from virginia as well as i can't believe i forgot david paterson from the great state of new york. if the governor of virginia resigns and his lieutenant governor justin fairfax takes over, he would be the fourth african-american governor in modern times and the fifth in our nation's 242-year history. got to make that correction. but let's talk about an historic
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first. this tuesday for the first time in its more than 50-year history, a black woman will deliver the response to the president as state of the union address. i'm, of course, talking about former democratic nominee for georgia governor stacey abrams, who emerged as one of the 2018 cycles democratic stars. she lost her race in a nail biter and wasted no time after the race getting back to her life's work, fighting for voting rights and against voter suppression by starting her own pac dedicated to increasing voter accessibility. she is gearing up for what could be the biggest speech of her career so far and will make an appearance at the superbowl in an ad that will air on georgia stations. >> smile. >> i'm republican natalie crawford, county commissioner in north georgia. >> i'm democrat stacey abrams from atlanta. >> we don't agree on everything. >> but we love georgia. >> and want fair elections. >> every vote should be counted
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from every corner of our state. >> counting first, i think it will make abrams first person ever to deliver the state of the union response less than 48 hours after appearing in her own superbowl ad. fact check that, twitter. i will see you to on my own show tomorrow morning at 10:00 a.m. eastern. ali bellshi is in tonight. >> we should make time outside of this, joy. as you said when you started the show, it is a busy night. we will pick it up now. >> i'm in for lawrence o'donnell. the president of the united states is living in an alternate universe with this border wall. house speaker nancy pelosi said repeatedly and unequivocally that she will not give him the money he wants to build his wall, and so it seems that the president is okay with simply pretending to have a wall. in the oval office today president trump actually tried to claim, falsely,


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