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tv   MSNBC Live With Ali Velshi  MSNBC  March 19, 2019 12:00pm-1:00pm PDT

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ali velshi, i don't know if you heard that, but looking forward to my interview tomorrow. >> i am, too. >> i am looking forward to it. >> we both are looking forward to it. >> what is the burning question you have? >> i found out 12 seconds ago that you were interviewing him. i need another 12 questions. >> if any of you have burning questions, tweet me. >> he has an interesting story. >> it's the judge just about what has been in the news recently. it goes far beyond that. he dealt with it while he was u.s. attorney. anyone remember that out there? >> he was an interesting guy before donald trump became president. >> fascinating guy. he has a lot of high profile
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prosecutions. you made a big mark on this. you doing that live? >> thank you, katie. have a great afternoon. >> you, too. >> the absolute enemy of the people was one of the twitter attacks the president relaunched into this morning. the enemy he is talking about is the media. the last hour the president took questions from media alongside brazil's newly elected and far right president. previously described as the trump of the tropics. the president had more to say and continuation of his colorful commentary. >> the networks, you look at the news and the newscasts. i call it fake news. i'm proud to hear the period use the term fake news. you look at what's happening with the networks and what's happening with different shows. it's hard to believe. people get all of that, whatever it is they are fed, in the end they pulled the right lever. it's a very, very dangerous
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situation. >> the president went after the media multiple time, lumping in tech giants with this tweet. facebook, google and twitter not to mention the interrupt media. we will win anyway just like we did before. maga. they are coming in unusual frequency on twitter and in front of the camera prompting ongoing questions about the president's mental health and competence from george conway, husband of kellyanne conway who engaged in a continuation of his battle with trump, tweeting you just guaranteed that millions of people are going to learn about narcissistic disorder and malignant narcissim. great job. let's start at the white house. with geoff bennett and the president of brazil has ended. what's the news? >> you had the two anti-globalist leaders of the two biggest economies of the
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america s meeting at the white house. he is known for trump of the tropics for a reason. much like president trump, he is known for bombastic rhetoric and skepticism of science and scorn for traditional government ethics and willingness to attack the press when he receives negative coverage. there was a bit of news steaming from the press conference. president trump said he intends to designate brazil as a non-nato ally which could help that country buy cheaper military development. it's what the president said when he was in the oval office sitting next to him before that rose garden press conference that's making a lot of headlines. the president when asked by our friend and colleague about his attacks on the late senator john mccain, president trump leaned into it. look at what he said. >> why are you attacking senator john mccain? >> very unhappy that he didn't repeal and replace obamacare, as you know. he campaigned on repealing and
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replacing for years and he got to a vote and said thumbs down. our country would have saved a trillion dollars and had great health care. for some reason i understand the reason. he ended up going thumbs up. had we known that, we could have gotten somebody else. i think that's disgraceful and there are other things. i was never a fan of john mccain and never will be. >> it was a quick fact check. the white house had plenty of notice that john mccain was going to vote against that repeal bill and since the late senator can't speak for himself, it's worth noting what his daughter said about all of this. he said the president lives a pathetic life obsessing over general and other political rivals. >> a lot went on in that discussion including discussions about the president encouraging brazil to in some fashion join nato. that's interesting because donald trump himself belittles
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the relationship and he shares donald trump's view about these alliances. >> right, the president has made it clear he sees no real value in multinational global organizations like nato and the united nations. he said he had willing to at least recognize brazil as a non-nato ally in an effort to give that down theory privileges so it can buy military equipment. it doesn't necessarily jive with the president's views on nato, but in the specific instance, he wants to give this overture to brazil and we need brazil for a host of other issues to include the u.s. position and getting their back up towards venezuela. >> second largest economy in the western hemisphere. we are getting new details into the inner workings of robert mueller's investigation. earlier the fbi's warrants used to raid the home and offices and hotel suite of trump's former personal lawyer, michael cohen were publicly released.
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the fbi's ex-tensitensive investigation into cohen began the summer of 2017 before agents conducted their raid. there are several redactions in released documents, but most notably from the section titled the illegal campaign contribution scheme. tom winter, this is interesting. there were two types of reactions. some are little ones with names and dates of people and some are big ones with everything about them being redacted. is there something we don't know about michael cohen and what he was involve in with campaign pay offs? >> assuresly whenever you see 19 pages of redactions, there is information you don't know. the pages in michael cohen's criminal information that he was involved with when he pleaded guilty to the charges involving the at the same times to karen mac dougal in august of 2018,
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those sections of that only were a handful of pages. there is more in this search warrant than perhaps what we know and what michael cohen al cuted to. that would have to do with the mechanics and who the agents talked to and who provided information to them. it would seem there would be information in there that we wouldn't know about. what we know for certain is this is information that the prosecutors told the federal judge back on february 7th in his order, ordering the do you means to be public. anything that detailed or was tied to an ongoing investigation including the campaign finance investigation could be redacted in these documents. we know this is ongoing and something that is continuing to be looked at and that much we know as well as the timeline in that special counsel robert mueller's office requested at least one of michael cohen's e-mail accounts in july of 2017 and before that, he had all
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sorts of information that allowed him to look into the e-mail accounts and the investigation was started before that point. perhaps even before the summer of 2017. >> let's use july 19th as the date. between july 19th and the time that michael cohen's home, office, and hotel were raided, what is significant about that timeline? the fbi would have been listening in and watching. >> they wouldn't have necessarily been listening to michael cohen's communications, but they did have at various points is what we call a pen register or a trap and trace. there were different period where is they were able to see who was calling michael cohen and who michael cohen was calling. that would give them some information as well as duration of a phone call. they couldn't get the contents and they would have had that and access to his e-mail. they had communications with the hotel he was staying at that described when he would be moving in and the rate so they
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were able to watch this not so much realtime, but they saw the messages coming in and discern what michael cohen was up to. they had a sense of what was going on and they could construct events based on the information they were able to gather. >> i want to continue this information. a former assistant attorney and watergate prosecutor and msnbc legal analyst. nick, what does this mean to you? >> the big take away is there is an ongoing investigation and we know of two people that are the subjects of that investigation. one is donald trump, the president of the united states, and the other is donald trump, jr., his son. what all of this means is that the u.s. attorney's office is still investigating those two people and maybe more. that's the big headline. >> let's talk about the campaign finance sthauf uff that is reda.
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some people say campaign finance laws are not prosecuted all that well. they are working on something else. what do you make of that? >> what they are working on is a campaign finance law violation. that's what michael flynn pled guilty to and the people from ami got immunity on. this is a serious campaign violation. >> this is not a missed file. >> this is someone deciding they will deceive the american people by hiding all of this money they paid to the two women, karen mac dougal and stormy daniels so they wouldn't come out on the heels of the hollywood access tape and confirm everything that donald trump said on that tape. >> we are hearing report that is the white house expects to see the mueller report first before congress gets it so they can look at stuff they consider to be executive privilege and conversations with people in the white house and close to the president and have that removed from what goes to congress. >> i don't think there is going
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to be a report. i think it will be the same report we have seen which is one indictment at a time. unless someone is saying their source is in mueller's office, i don't believe it. there are too many things going on. three terabytes of information that have to be digested in the rommer sto roger stone introduce. manafort is has a 7.5 year sentence. people are focusing on the idea that certain people have left that office. if you did that when i was a prosecutor in watergate, that didn't mean our investigation was going away. people focus on the fact that the grand jury is not meeting regularly. you don't mead with a grand jury regularly. most occurs in an office and outside. maybe 5% of what i did was before a grand jury. unless somebody knows from mueller's office what we will see is one indictment at a time. we have got a huge mueller
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report as it stands. >> i want to clarify something and this was not his mistake. there was misreporting about the three terabytes of information with roger stone. three terabytes of information is being shared. that's the information the office already had. they were able to get certain things as part of the warrant, but a lot of the information was information the special counsel had. i want to clarify that. while i would never ever describe where this information is coming from and the same from my colleague who is cover the department here at nbc news, the fact of the matter is all indications point to there will be a final report that the special counsel's office will be putting together. i want to be clear on that and the times of that report is imminent. what is imminent? is it this afternoon? probably not. sometime over the next probably weeks or next month or two? that's more likely.
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there will be a report. we do not know whether or not there will be further indictments to nick's point. it's possible that that could occur, but at this point there is nothing to suggest there is not going to be a final report. >> former district attorney for the southern district of new york and watergate prosecutor tom winter. thanks to both of you. up next, elizabeth warren joins the growing list of 2020 democratic candidates calls for the elimination of the electoral college. i will remind you what it is and why there is so much controversy around it. plus the white house releases the annual report on economic policy and the chairman of economic advisers. kevin joins me to explain why the president's policies are working and why we will hit his forecast of 3% economic growth for the next 10 years. you are watching msnbc. e next 1. you are watching msnbc
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if you are a voter who is almost 30 years old, two out of five presidents in your lifetime were sworn in after losing the popular vote. you may not find it surprising that some candidates are getting attention for calling for an end to the electoral college. this mayor talked a few times on the trail and senator bernie sanders said it should be reassessed in 2016. elizabeth warren brought it up in a town hall last night and
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again this afternoon. >> we have to abolish the electoral college. i am tired of this notion that the president can come to alabama to say i want your vote and let me tell you what i will do. get out there and vote for me. they don't come to massachusetts either. it's all about focusing on just a handful of states where they think the numbers are close. the way democracy works is when they come to ask everybody for their vote. >> what are is the electoral college and why does the statement draw such a strong reaction. it's a process, not a place. it's established in article two, sections one of the u.s. constitution. changing it is actually a big deal. the electoral college was created from keeping elections independent of congress and avoid what the famers of the
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constitution considered to be the risks of direct democracy. more on that in a moment, but let's look at how it works. each state in the union has electors or people that represent your state. there are 538 total electoral votes. when a candidate receives a majority, the magic number 270, they are declared the winner. it's how many members of the house and senate come from that state and these are winner take all. there are a couple of examples. in 2016, president trump won florida by just 1%. because of the rules of the electoral college, president trump received all of florida's total electoral votes, that was 29 electoral votes. this is why the electoral college is controversial. as we remember from 2016, president trump lost the popular vote, but won the presidency because of his electoral college votes. president bush also lost the popular vote in the 2000
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election, but won the electoral college. bradley smith is a law professor and the former chairman of the federal election commission. thank you for being with us. let's talk about what's the main defense for keeping the electoral college in place. most people say it's starting to not make sense. maybe it did once and it doesn't now. >> the proposition that we have about one in 10 elections that go against the popular vote. you have to have a lot of popular support to win the electoral college. nobody wins without it being very close. are we willing to put up with that? are there reasons why people should get fewer votes sometimes winning an election. the most important is that you build a broad base coalition, you can't win the presidency by campaigning in major urban areas or o long the coast or retreating to the deep south and
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trying to gin up as many votes as possible. you have to get out and compete in states across the country in a wide range of areas. in a huge country like that, that is important. the second thing the electoral college does is isolate fraud. we are looking back to the two elections where the winner of the college did not win the popular vote. democrats won the popular vote, but through massive fraud in the deep south. they are suppressing black votes and didn't do them any good because they still couldn't win the nowhere states. that's an example of how it benefits us when it was created. >> let's listen to what the mayor said on the electoral college in march in new hampshire. let's play it and we will talk about it. >> i live in the state of indiana. it doesn't matter most years what we think. our state is too conservative to
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matter in the electoral college. if you live in california, it doesn't matter what you think. your state is too liberal to matter. we would be better served to have a system where the person who gets the most votes wins the election. >> what do you think of that? >> the first thing is you change how people campaign. i'm not sure it's going to matter anywhere. i hate to break it to you, but folks are not going to ft. wayne. they have to get as many votes as possible. nowadays, people have to go to new hampshire and new mexico and iowa and campaign in those states in small towns and small cities and rural areas. it's a national popular vote, candidates spend all their time in the l.a. and san francisco area and new york city. even for republicans, there is more total votes in those cities than going out to other parts of the country.
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the way they are looking at it is a narrow way of looking at the college. not thinking about what the purpose of the college s. the purpose of the college is precisely to say every now and then, it doesn't matter. somebody gets a few more popular votes. it's always very close. hillary clinton only won in plurality and the biggest spread that didn't win the electoral college. they both had a lot of support. the question is, does it matter how you put the coalition together? the answer is that it does. i would say that someone who is full time in ohio wish we could be in indiana and not have so many presidential commercials and visits. >> it's a good discussion, but i appreciate you setting the table for us. a law professor and former chairman of the federal election commission. up next, to achieve that promise, the 3% economic boom, president trump has work cut out for him.
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he will need more tax cuts and a huge infrastructure bill that move people off government aid and into full time employment put out by his own counsel of advisers. the chairman of the counsel j n joins me after the break. of n joins me after the break
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we have breaking news from washington. transportation secretary elaine chow asked the inspector general to audit the process for the 737 max 8 aircraft nearly a week after the faa ordered the jets to be grounded following similar actions by other countries. it was involved in the ethiopian flight crashed shortly after take off, killing 157 people and the lion air crash in indonesia last october which killed 189 people. during his final presidential debate with hillary clinton, donald trump had this to say about economic growth under a trump presidency. >> we are bringing gdp from really 1% which is what it is now and if you got in, it would be less than zero, but we are bringing it from 1% up to 4% and i think we can go higher, up to
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five or six percent. >> after the economy grew by more than 4% during the second quarter, he said it was on track for sustained growth of at least 3% a year. >> during each of the previous two administrations we averaged over 1.8% gdp growth. we are now on track to hit an average gdp annual growth of over 3% and it could be substantially over 3%. >> the president often talk and tweeted about how the u.s. economy will only continue to see big economic growth. now the team said the economy may not keep growing as much as the president wants. the annual economic report put out by the counsel of economic advisers finds that if the economy were to achieve an annual growth rate of about 3% for the next decade, the president would need a big infrastructure bill, more tax cuts, more deregulation, and policies that transition more
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people off of government aid and into full time jobs. makes sense. the report said if none of these policies were to be adopted, annual growth would be 2.5% in 2022 and 2% all the way out to 2026. according to the bureau of economic analysis, the economy grew in the 2018 calendar year, that is just shy of the 3% the administration wanted. the white house has been emphasizing the 3.1% growth between the fourth quarter of 2017 and the fourth quarter of 2018. just a little off the calendar year. take a look at the growth over the past few decades. the last time the economy grew 3% or more, this line, was back during 2005. the last time we saw sustained growth of 3% or more was during the late 1990s and into the year 2000. joining me to take a closer look is the counsel of economic
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advisers, one of the people who wrote the report released today. he's the boss of it. kevin, one thing i think confusions the discussion is the interchangeability of quarterly growth numbers and annual growth numbers. how should we look at gdp growth? how do you like to look at it? >> the first thing i want to do is waive this. we signed one for you. if you carry this around at msnbc, you will be the coolest person there. only 700 pages. 2.9 and 3.1, they are insignificant. the three about what we said and three is about what we got. that's my preferred number, something that they have been using going back about 20 years. 3.1 is the right number. it's like a technical thing. 3%. >> that's not the part that i'm worried about.
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we hear we had 4% in one quarter and 1.9 percent nrs a quarter. should we think about gdp on an annual basis and not trumpeting weak and strong quarters? >> that's fair and we are about to experience that. we are looking at a first quarter that will be in the ones and a second quarter around three. if that happens, it will be almost every year since 2010 that seasonal pattern has been there. we think that the 3% sustained growth is something that makes sense and the headline for me is just that if you go back, you and i were talking about this a year ago november. i said 3% growth through 2018 and everyone said that is crazy. blue chip is a two and we got a number that was exactly what we said. capital spending and wage growth. we didn't change our forecast this year and we federal stuck with what we said.
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>> that support suggests that they are going to have to be policy changes that i think people would generally like. there may be people who disagree on the deregulation and the infrastructure project and people getting into full time work who are not otherwise working. that stuff is hard. every president wants high gdp and low unemployment. you have a book that is a caveat that said undercurrent policy, the president's current policy including the large tax cut he implemented, we are not going to see the growth the president promised? >> the thing to echl ecmphasize that they assume the president's desired policies become true. and then show congress what happens if the policies are passed into law. you can go back into the obama administration and i think that the average error overtime for them was in the 1% range, but a
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lot of that was not that they modelled wrong, but they assumed president obama's policy would happened and not all of them happened. our job is to say if we do this, here's what happens to growth. that's what we are doing. it's not the same as a blue chip forecast where you make an assumption about policy. our job is to say if our policies are true, congress can compare the base line and the 3% we say we can deliver if we get the policies and assess our estimates in the policies and decide. >> let me tell you and you probably heard this about economic growth. the aim is that my viewers get an understanding of what should we look for as success? most of us don't think about growth as much as you and i do. i want to play what she said and get your comment. >> we had a period of remarkable growth in 2018. probably around 3%. that just isn't sustainable.
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>> it's funny that you say 3% is remarkable. that for years was the norm. >> that was the norm, but we are in a world of both slow labor force growth and low productivity growth. probably a sustainable pace of growth in the u.s. economy is around 2 or possibly a little under. >> she makes two points. slow labor force growth because we are a low unemployment rate and a mismatch in the people who need jobs and the jobs we have. we have been squeezing productivity out of people for a long time. what do you think about what she is saying? is it more sustainable to have low growth? >> she was a great fed share chair and labor force growth is surprising on the upside. it's surprising on the upside a lot. people who used to be separated are coming back in. 73% of people in the fourth quarter who were hired came from out of the labor force to have the job.
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that surprised a lot of forecasters and something we think is the result of our policies. the second thing is capital spending is surging about 9% in response to the cut from the cost of capital and that capital spending growth will give you a lot more potential gdp than janet, i think, assumes. you get more factor productivity growth and that's something last year was about double because of the spending. if you are right about spending going forward, you see that total productivity numbers. there is a lot of geeky stuff. >> a lot. >> the bottom line is a year and a half ago they said 3% was not a likely thing and not only did we get the 3.1%, but got the details right, too. stick to our guns and our models. >> if there is an award for the most geeky daytime television, you and i should submit. the white house's counsel of economic advisers. acknowledging the criticism of
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his campaign for being too male and too white, bernie sanders realigns the headership and hires former aclu director to run his campaign. the first muslim american to manage a major campaign. joining me after the break, you are watching msnbc. , you are watching msnbc - [woman] with shark's duo clean, i don't just clean, i deep clean carpets and floors, so i got this. yep, this too, and this, please. even long hair and pet hair are no problem, but the one thing i won't have to clean is this because the shark's self-cleaning brush roll removes the hair wrap while i clean. ♪ - [announcer] shark, the vacuum that deep cleans now cleans itself. with a $500,000 life insurance policy. how much do you think it cost him? $100 a month? $75? $50? actually, duncan got his $500,000
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(client's voice) remember that degree you got in taxation? (danny) of course you don't because you didn't! your job isn't understanding tax code... it's understanding why that... will get him a body like that... move! ...that. your job isn't doing hard work... here. ...it's making her do hard work... ...and getting paid for it. (vo) snap and sort your expenses to save over $4,600 at tax time. (danny) jody... ...it's time to get yours! (vo) quickbooks. backing you. bernie sanders's campaign announced 15 new hires in key roles and 29 of them are women. the campaign said that now every
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single one of the teams, management, political, policy, organizing, communications, advance, digital, and fund-raising has women and predominantly women of color in leadership colors. the national team is around 70% women. this as the field of candidates headed across to key states to make their pitch for voters. what are they most concerned about? let's listen. >> i care about what impacts me and my neighbors today. that's getting health care and living wages and having clean water and clean air. these are the things i fight for. >> give me your top three candidates. >> bernie, bernie, bernie. >> joining me as the new campaign manager for bernie sanders 2020, the first muslim campaign manager. i will get to that fact later on. thank you for being with us. >> thank you. >> let me ask you about an
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article published in the "new york times" about the 2020 campaign. this time around, mr. sanders enters the race at a far different electoral moment. much of his agenda has been embraced when many voters are eager to elevate female and white standard bearers. instead his competition will include progressives like elizabeth warren of massachusetts who supported many of the same economic positions for years. what is your response? >> we will have an 11-month campaign before voters begin to voechlt dust is going to be picked up. there is going to be two questions that voters ask. who can beat donald trump and who do we trust to make the change ha happen that we want? over the course of these months, we will hear a lot of conversation, but it is going to be bernie sander who is rises to
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the top because he considers both of the questions in the poll position. >> the polling indicates he's in a strong position. how do you reach out to those new constituencies who feel strongly about having a candidate of color or a woman? >> the last time he was largely unknown and he enters the race as a known commodity. someone who steaked his credibility on the toughest fights and has delivered results. they owe this to the fact that a movement arose that bernie sanders led. people sit in congress, a diverse set of people who sit in congress. you see his campaign reflecting america and the diversity and the talent of it. i think there is going to be an effort on his part to not only showcase that and tell his own story about the fact that he fought in the trenches for racial justice, social and economic and environmental
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justice. i believe it will be far more known and compelling to people this time around. >> me about the criticism that i'm going to get as soon as we finish. bernie sanders is not a democrat, but only plays a democrat when he wants to run for president. >> he pushes the democratic party to be better. he has no concerns about raising issues on trade where he thinks the party has not fought aggressively enough. he fought on economic justice issues trying to raise the fact that billionaires control a lot of peieces of the republican an democratic parties and he is trying to change the way of thinking when it comes to fund-raising. when you are in the white house, you are not held captive and that you are working on behalf of the people. >> speak of which, for people who don't know you, you are a long time -- you were with the american civil liberties union.
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tell me what you bring to the campaign in this time being a muslim american. >> under donald trump he told us that we want to wall you out and ban you and deport you and surveil you and separate you. he tried to separates and you make us feel, look at my skin color, i must be different than you. what i hope i bring to the table with regards to senator sanders is he see what is bonds us and that we are in the fight together. i'm motivated for one of many reasons to kick donald trump out of office. he is sitting on the greatest platform of hate in the world. he needs to go. i believe bernie sanders is going to defeat him and sit in that oval office. >> thank you for being with us. bernie sanders, 2020. the first muslim american manager of a major presidential campaign. president trump's complicated ties to deutsch bank. the billions the bank loaned him despite the red flags surrounding questionable business dealings. d flags surrounding questionable business dealings.
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but when i started seeing things, i didn't know what was happening... so i kept it in. he started believing things that weren't true. i knew something was wrong... but i didn't say a word. during the course of their disease around 50% of people with parkinson's may experience hallucinations or delusions. but now, doctors are prescribing nuplazid. the only fda approved medicine... proven to significantly reduce hallucinations and delusions related to parkinson's. don't take nuplazid if you are allergic to its ingredients. nuplazid can increase the risk of death
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in elderly people with dementia-related psychosis and is not for treating symptoms unrelated to parkinson's disease. nuplazid can cause changes in heart rhythm and should not be taken if you have certain abnormal heart rhythms or take other drugs that are known to cause changes in heart rhythm. tell your doctor about any changes in medicines you're taking. the most common side effects are swelling of the arms and legs and confusion. we spoke up and it made all the difference. ask your parkinson's specialist about nuplazid. financial services and in l intelligence are requesting copies from deutsch bank to investigate ties with trump's businesses that involvement that goes back decades and amount to
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billions of dollars. according to the "new york times," it all began in 1998 when trump, whose previous bankruptcies cost hundreds of millions of dollars secured a $125 million loan to renovate his 40 wall street property. he quickly obtained another $300 million to build what is now trump world tower across the street from the united nations. and he was back again for hundreds of millions more for the trump marina casino in atlantic city. but that loan never went through and the bank found the name of a credit officer had been forged. although the loan officer overseeing trump's previous borrowing was never accused of forgery. now, by 2005, trump was looking for another $500 million to build a tower in chicago. the bank agreed to that loan, but made the businessman personally guarantee $40 million of that loan, allowing it to pursusue trump's personal asset if he defaulted.
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that was nearly a billion dollars the bank invested in donald trump. so let's take a look at the financials. around the time of the chicago project, trump told deutsche bank that he was worth $3 billion. the bank looked at his financials and estimated he was actually worth $788 million. leading an kpe executive and sel others to loan to him. trump and the bank ended up suing each other over the chicago project, settling in 20 so and he was back looking for $100 million to buy the durall government resort in florida, despite bankers finding that trump overinflated his real estate holdings by up to 70% b, a nonstarter for everybody else. the loan, again, went through, along with another $48 million for that contentious chicago trump tower. by 2015, the bank agreed to another $170 million loan for trump to transform the washington, d.c., old post
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office building into a hotel. just as the loans we've listed total nearly -- just the loans we've listed total nearly $1.25 billion, half what reporters found to be the total amount of loans from deutsche bank to donald trump reaching well over $ billion. "the new york times" reached out to the white house who referred questions to the trump organization. a company spokesperson declined to comment. okay. this is a lot of stuff. so joining me now is the reporter on that byline, david enrich, finance editor for "the new york times." david, this is a lot of reporting, but that's kind of what's necessary to get to the bottom of this, the fundamental question, one financial reporter to another, why on earth did deutsche bank keep on doing business with donald trump who at no point showed enough evidence to get the money that he should have been loaned? >> they were desperate. it's that simple. the bank was so eager to make money and to enter, to get a foothold in the united states market, that they were willing
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to take risks and cut corners that no other bank in america, frankly, no other bank in the world, was willing to take. that was not an accident. it was a conscious decision by the bank to be more aggressive, to make bigger, more complicated loans, to riskier kind of further in the reaches clients than anyone else would and donald trump fit the bill. >> even though, as i just listed from your reporting, there were numerous examples of donald trump not paying things back on time. >> numerous examples. i mean, even before deutsche bank entered the picture, donald trump had developed a well-earned reputation for defaulting on loans and saddling his banks with hundreds of millions of dollars in losses. deutsche bank started the relationship knowing full well that that was his m.o. and then sure enough, he did it at least on two occasions to the bank in very acrimonious ways that led to litigation and led to a huge public embarrassments and black eyes for deutsche bank and, yet, time and time again,
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the bank came back for more, and remarkably, with the support of its very top executives. it's two of its ceos on different occasions signed of or at least were supportive of these loans and reflected real institutional support for a relationship that several years later would prove the biggest embarrassment of all for deutsche bank. >> so it's a lot of problems for deutsche bank in the way it runs its business for people who observe it. is there a legal issue here? >> well, there are a lot of legal issues here. i mean, think the biggest one for donald trump is what investigators in washington and new york are now looking into, which is whether he committed bank fraud by greatly overstating the value of some his assets. and i have no idea if he actually did commit bank fraud, but what i do know is there's a lot of evidence, having spoken to dozens of people inside the bank who are involved with these loans, that trump was a serial exaggerator when it came to how much he was worth. and not just his personal wealth, but the assets his
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company has and he would go and assign ridiculous values to real estate assets that were, you know, these are subjective valuations and reasonable people can disagree, but he was valuing them such astronomical levels that it became a joke inside the bank that this is another example of donald just assigning these crazy out of touch levels to his values and they were okay with that because they, the bank, felt comfortable, they could go in and say, we're just going to chop 70% off the value of that asset and that they could reach a conservative enough valuation that it still made sense to lend to him. >> david, i didn't do justice to your piece. it's worth a read to fully understand it. it is that detailed. but important to understand. david enrich is a finance editor at "the new york times." all right. we'll be back after this quick break with a check of the markets. places in america. and home to three bp wind farms. in the off-chance the wind ever stops blowing here...
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let's see, aleve is than tylenol extra strength. and last longer with fewer pills. so why am i still thinking about this? i'll take aleve. aleve. proven better on pain.
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looking like we were going to have a better day on the markets than we ended up having. got fed news in the 12:00 hour and tempered things a little bit. thfs some buying and selling then a bit of a selloff in the last hour but it's coming back, so who knows n the next minute or so we may end up at the zero point. we're just off a little bit right now. the dow is off about 20 points at the moment. that wraps it up for me. i'm going to see you right back here tonight at 10:00 p.m. eastern. for "the last word." always find me on social media, twitter, facebook, instagram, snapch snapchat, and linkedin. thank you for watching. "deadline white house with
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nicolle wallace" starts right now. hi, everyone. it's 4:00 in new york. against the backdrop of donald trump's escalating war of words against the late john mccain, stop it for a second, and let that sink in. donald trump today confronted with new reporting that robert mueller's investigators began investigating the trump organization's ties to russia just months after trump was sworn in as president. hundreds of pages of court documents unsealed today in the michael cohen case giving us a rare peek inside the investigation's earliest phase. and offering us tea leaves about what that part of the investigation yielded and what drove the decision to send other cohen cases to the southern district of new york where the president has already been identified as individual 1 in michael cohen's sentencing memo, and is widely believed to face ongoing legal exposure. "the new york times" reports, "federal authorities investigating russian interference in the presidential

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