tv Hardball With Chris Matthews MSNBC April 11, 2019 4:00pm-5:00pm PDT
far. >> tomorrow is friday and we have a special segment. clark kent, russian jewish novelist and liz plank will join us for a special fall back friday. i hope you will join us, but keep it locked right here because "hardball" with chris matthews is up next. who's afraid of. >> president trump is doubling down on the assertion that there was spying on his, trump's 2016 campaign and the u.s. justice department is changing wikileaks founder, julian assange with experience. assange was dragged out of the embassy in london by british authorities. he has been living there for nearly seven years until it was rescinded.
he was changed for skipping bail, but he was arrested on a second charge from american prosecutors. an unsealed indictment alleges he conspired with chelsea manning to commit computer intrusion in leaking classified military files in 2010. u.s. prosecutors want assange extradite and his attorneys said they will fight. he has not been charged with anything related to hacked democratic e-mails. that was a major part of candidate donald trump's closing argument against hillary clinton in 2016. >> did you see another? this wikileaks is like a treasure trove. >> this wikileaks is unbelievable. what we have learned about her and her people. >> we love wikileaks. wikileaks. they have revealed a lot.
>> that are wikileaks has done a job on her. >> i'll tell you, this wikileaks stuff is unbelievable. you have to read it. >> this just came out. wikileaks. i love wikileaks. >> he was asked about assange this morning and fained ignorance. >> i know nothing about wikileaks. it's not my thing. i know there is something having to do with julian assange and that will be a determination. i would imagine mostly by the attorney general who is doing an isn't job. >> how dainty. he weighed in on william barr's skme comments who said spying did occur on the campaign. you pleased that the attorney general said there was spying into your campaign?
>> yes, i am. what he said was absolutely true. there was absolutely spying into my campaign. i will go a step further and in my opinion it was illegal and unprecedented spying and something that should never be allowed to happen in our country again. his answer was actually a very accurate one. >> i am joined by caroline fredericks frederickson, the president of the constitution society, washington bureau chief of mother jones and depp deputy adviser in the obama administration. starting with ben, i notice a change of attitude by the president on julian assange. he was his best sidekick going after hillary. he doesn't like to talk about the fact that there was russian involvement in the election and the fact that wikileaks played a role in publicizing all that hacking stuff on the dnc.
especially. what do you think he is afraid of if this guy comes to this country under extradition? >> it was a determination of our intelligence community united. julian assange was a partner in an operation with russian intelligence to publicize the same e-mails that constituted trump's closing argument in his 2016 election. this was not a random rally in the middle of primaries. this was what he was closing on in october of 2016. we know that russian intelligence found a way to get the e-mails to julian assange who published them to help elect donald trump president. if american justice officials are able to ask him questions, they could learn more about how and why that happened. >> david, i want to know who is nervous that assange is coming to america? i would think roger stone. one person is worried. >> the question is whether julian assange will cooperate or
say anything if he gets here. they have to go through the extradition hearing in england. he's in several of the indictments. we have roger stone being -- remember this. roger stone's indictment it said someone directed a senior campaign foshl instruct stone to make contact with wikileaks. was it trump or somebody else? there are things about the connection between wikileaks and people related to trump that have not been determined. maybe, big maybe, it will be in the mueller report if not redacted. >> we know robert mueller did reveal a link between the trump campaign and wikileaks through adviser, roger stone. as david mentioned according to stone's indictment, around june and july of 2016, stone informed senior officials that he had information indicating wikileaks had documents whose release would be damaging to the clinton campaign. after the first batch of dnc e-mails were released in late
july, a senior trump campaign official was directed to contact stone about any additional releases and what other damaging information wikileaks had. stone there after told the campaign about future releases of damaging material by wikileaks. what a relationship. in his congressional testimony, michael cohen alleged roger stone gave candidate trump advanced notice that they would release hacked dnc e-mails. >> i was in mr. trump's office when his secretary announced roger stone was on the phone. mr. stone on the speaker phone. mr. stone told mr. trump he had just gotten off the phone with julian assange and mr. assange told mr. stone within a couple of days, there would be a massive dump of e-mails that would damage hillary clinton's campaign. mr. trump responded by stating
to the effect, wouldn't that be great? >> congressman, i want to take a minute to explain why i think there was collusion and why i think -- these are only reports from the mueller report which we hopefully will get confirmed next week. the special counsel's operation believe that is the russian intelligence people manipulated trump's campaign. here is the example of how they did it. they gave him dirt on hillary. they sucked him in the way any intelligence would. get him in the habit of using it and establish a means of working together. all of a sudden you have got a team. whether that's collusion or not, it is being manipulated by the russians. >> there is evidence assange was cooperating with the russians to help trump. i have never seen a politician other than trump have the amnesia and inconsistencey and get away with it. it would tend any person in
congress's career. of course they are concerned what assange is going to say. that said, journalists should be concerned. the indictment is overbroad. it goes after assange even for sharing information with any source if they share information with a journalist. it criminalizes that and that raises first amendment concerns. >> i think there is reason to be concerned. i would like to go back to whether or not he might want to talk about donald trump now. when you are sitting in a different place, you are the defendant. you can change the terms of what the prosecution is going to look like if you talk a little bit more. he might be more inclined to talk. that might be a peace of all of this that david alluded to. the other thing is what donald trump doesn't like about what he calls wiki who or wiki what, it is changing his story.
it was great to praise wikileaks when they put out information that helped him win the election. now he wants the story to be he won the election fair and square. that's a story he doesn't want to hear about. >> the cosmos has shifted. caroline got it right. during the election he wanted as much dirt as he could get it through roger or wikileaks. anywhere he could get it. through his son or manafort connections. any connection that could get him dirt on hillary, he loves it. now he denies any such connections. >> here's what i wanted to know and i always have. we were watching this in the white house at the time. it's not just that wikileaks is dumping out these e-mails, but a surprising correlation in what trump was saying and what was in those leaks. in other words, trump was talking a lot about hillary being corrupt and the corruption of the clinton foundation and her operation. you remember that. the wikileaks tended to focus on those types of things.
the e-mails being released mirrored closely what trump was saying on the campaign trail. we found out that a lot of the fake news that russia was creating and pumping into our system and people's social media feeds amplified some of these themes in right wing media and the campaign trail about hillary's corruption or about her health. what i wondered about in terms of coordination or collusion or whatever you want to say it is, how come there was a common thread between the e-mails being leak and what trump was saying and the fake news being produced. just like i want to know why it is the russians were able to prioritize certainly geographies and states important to trump. there is a lot that raises questions and if julian assange is compelled to cooperate, we might get more answers just like i hope we will be able to read the mueller report instead of a
white washed publication from barr. >> it is surprisingly strong showing by trump in pennsylvania which is heavily catholic in many areas. you see how they dumped the dirt by democrats talking to each other that didn't shine up the catholics. let's get this out to pennsylvania. as you say, they were microtargeting using wikileaks information and wikileaks people were getting the right stuff from the russian who is knew what stuff would be useful to hurt hillary clinton in states like pennsylvania. meanwhile, house speaker nancy pelosi blasted william barr for his remark that the government spied on the trump campaign. >> let me just say how very, very displaying and disappointing that the chief law enforcement officer of our country is going off the rails. yesterday and today. >> congressman, i'm impressed by her.
i always have been impressed, but she gets better and better. >> she has the whole caucus behind her. there were doubters, but she is the only one going toe to toe with donald trump and won. on the border dispute, she is the only one. >> she is going after bill barr. i trust this guy mueller, i don't trust you. >> it's ridiculous. we have a country that interfered in the election and bill barr is in front of congress and making stuff up without any evidence about complaining that our intelligence was looking into the fact that we had election interference instead of addressing the fact that we had election interference. that's why she is outraged. >> david, how can you attack someone for catching the bad guys. look at all the evidence and convictions. we have evidence coming out showing they did manipulate the trump campaign and if all of that is manifest, how can you say you shouldn't have dug it
up? >>s these are the flip sides of the same coin. now we know wikileaks was part of a russian operation aimed to help him and he helped wikileaks. he helped wikileaks help himself. we know thanks to the u.s. intelligence and also to republicans and democrats on the intelligence committees, they say this operation happened and occurred while trump was denying it was happening. he was siding with putin over his own u.s. intelligence while u.s. was being attacked. he needs to divert attention from the principal sin of the trump administration. that's to say the real story is the dossier. the spying. that's what really happened. not that we were attacked. this is a hill that the planet fox and bill barr, donald trump, they will die on this that the real issue was the dossier and the spying and not the russian
attacked. we helped that attack occur. >> if you are trump, i don't know how he pulls it off, but you have no not only educate the peanut gallery on the right and you have to reeducate them. we like wikileaks. now we don't. change the ball game there. mar. >> the ball game has been clear when he talked about what he wanted in an attorney general. he want add i roy cohen. jeff sessions wouldn't be that man and he got sent packing back to alabama and he auditioned for the role saying i don't think the president can be guilty of obstruction. why should we be surprised that bill barr turned out to be roy cohen. >> it's somebody who was willing to be ruthless and known as ruthless. smear yourself in the case of your client. do whatever it takes. >> this is a man who believes the president is above the law and then looked at mueller's
report and said i'm going to make a determination that bob mueller didn't make even though it should go to congress for the final evaluation. he took it unto himself and given the president what he wanted the and president wanted a roy cohen and he got it. >> who were his famous clients. mobsters. here's the president saying i want a mob attorney. this is what's happening. >> i want to know why everyone who gets in trouble, they lose their neck. look at this guy. his neck disappeared in the last two months. >> the same guy who got bush to pardon all the folks. he is there to clean up messes. he's the person -- right before bush was leaving office, five pardons. >> president trump said he hasn't seen the mueller report, but based on the scant details based on the ag, he is accusing the democrats of treason.
>> the bottom line, the result is no collusion, no obstruction. that's the way it is. i know a lot of people were disappointed, but they knew the real answer. when the democrats go behind the scenes into a room back stage, they laugh because they know it's all a big scam and a hoax. it's called politics, but this is dirty politics so this is actually treason. >> what are do the words mean anymore? >> it's highly offensive to the american public to be treat said as idiots. what about the national intelligence services and the fbi and department of justice. bob mueller who brought so many indictments who got so many guilty pleas and verdicts. there was there there. there was clearly russian interference with the election. we need to know more about that. we don't need to have the
intelligence services thwarted by this allegation that is just beyond the pale. >> trump talks like he's in a fourth world country with no history of democracy and no culture. it's all screaming these words. it's like moon or pair dor. or bananas. thank you as always. we will have breakfast soon, i think. caroline, thank you so much. david and ben. coming up, the new war room. something back to the clinton era. hit trump where he hurts on his broken promise to the middle class. the blue collar worker and the unprecedented conflict between two living roman catholic ropes. this is a strange story. openly contradicting pope francis on the clergy's sexual abuse scandal and the divide goes deeper. what it means for the future of
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the xfinity store is here. and it's simple, easy, awesome. welcome back to "hardball." throughout the campaign, candidate donald trump promised to work tirelessly for the forgotten man and woman. >> we are fighting for every forgotten man, woman, and child of this nation. i'm asking you to dream big. we used to dream big. >> i see you. i hear you, and i will never ever let you down, i promise. we will never let you down. >> i will be a voice for all of the forgotten americans in this country. i will be your voice. i'm going to be your voice. >> the two years into his administration, the manner of governing seems to be working mostly of, by, and for himself.
>> frankly, there is only one person that is running it. you know who that is? it's me. >> tired of being told no, he is surrounding himself with supporters and purging people who stand in his way. meanwhile, his critics say many forgotten americans are waiting for results. according to a poll, only a small minority notice any benefit from his tax cuts. a majority like the affordable care act. he is trying to kill it. a number of farmers are struggling under trump's trade policies. the dnc launched a war amid that backdrop. the dnc organized a war room aimed at ousting trump. the dnc is making major expansions of the team that will be hyper focused on local
communities. they compiled an archive of thousands of documents through local news and requests that will be used to spotlight promises trump made during visits to specific communities and put a human face on what's happened since then. i'm joined by tom perez, chairman of the democratic national committee. sir, you for the offense it goes back to me in little rock and bill clinton. how are you going to get the voter who is don't like illegal immigration. they don't late term abortion or socialism. how do you get them to focus on the day to day reality. >> we won at scale in 2018 because we focused on the issues that were keeping people up at night. health care, health care, health care. in 2020, 572 days until the weekend, what we are doing is localizing the trail of broken promises from this president. he goes into new hampshire and
makes promises about naval yards and goes into ohio and promises a new bridge to connect kentucky and southern ohio. he goes all across this country, the ohio chevy plant. the trail of broken promises. what you see is two things. number one, from his mouth. those promises, no plant will close. what you see and this is what i think is most important, through the lens of ordinary americans, the forgotten people he said he would look out for. the plants are closing. i don't know where i'm going to get my health care. the kimberly clark worker who lost her job in wisconsin and they got a billion dollars in tax cuts and the majority went to stock buy backs. this is about localizing the impact of trump and also talking about what we stand for. he's fighting to take your health care. we are working to make sure you
can keep your health care. >> can you turn a campaign how it affects me personally with overriding message from care. the elite don't care about you. illegal immigration out of hand. babies killed with late term abortion. the arguments are strong and vivid. can this mundane on the ground effort counter that? >> for has a way of eating into the narrative a little bit. what we did in 2010 and 2009 and that period to sort of begin to rewrite or recorrect the messaging around the gop. what were we about and what do we stand for? we had to make it personal. each the fire pelosi effort. you want better government whether it was a better city council and county council and state legislature. you had to fire nancy pelosi because you made her the symbol
of government not working. the democrats are in a position to make a same argument about how the promises have not been kept. the problem and something that we were keen on is once you do that, you then have to have the follow-up conversation. this is what we want to put on the table. it's not just enough to stop the obama agenda in 2010, but what will republican government look like? similarly, that's going to be the argument the democrats have to make. you have competing forces with two arguments within the party that is emerging. progressive and a center left argument around things like taxes and around big and small government. >> you are talking like a democrat, michael. >> i have been accused of that quite a bit in this land. i'm just talking about the strategy of trying to connect with those voters and what trump
has been the most effective at doing. people want to keep their obamacare. people don't like the way the tax cuts played out. he is still the fighter for a lot of voters. >> according to politico, republicans are trying to contain his worst instirnths. republicans are resting with the administration, trying new ways by taking them places they don't want to go. mitch mcconnell issued this warning to the president. there are two things the administration ought to consider before nominating someone. first, a background check. second, the likelihood of confirmation and better to check up on in advance. i think that's what this is about. 58% of americans like the economy. that's a high number. >> here's the thing. when you talk to people who have
diabetes or other preexisting condition, they see democrats fighting to keep their coverage and see donald trump fighting to take it away. when you have someone with a dollar raise last year, but the cost of prescription drugs or housing went up $3, all those things are irrelevant. when we localize it and tell the story, we get ahead. he marketed himself as a different kind of politician. i'm going to drain the swamp. the trail of broken promises show he is building a bigger swamp. he's in it for himself and he's a liar and we are showing that. the dnc war room and you will see so many testimonials through his words and through the american people who are suffering as a result of those broken promises. >> you have to turn a few
hundred thousand votes in the whole country. go into the neighborhoods who would normally vote republican and talk to the people there. there is a lot of people that you can pick up. you pick up people that are in that crowd. they did it in philly. >> absolutely. >> you go into white working class neighborhoods and you get the union guys and the people benefiting from the machine. you pick them off and what happened? the democrats won again. >> here's the thing. what are you picking them off with? are you saying to them we are going to give you free education and free health care and free food? >> the argument is the president betrayed you. >> they are not buying that argument. that's my point. they are not buying it because they believe he's in their corner. when you look at florida, for example, and other elections in the past cycle, when people get to the point where they are going to vote on the promises that the democrats will be making, how do we pay for it?
you have to have an answer to that as well. >> here's the reality. people want to know who has my back. in 572 days, that's the question they are going to ask. donald trump said i have your back and what we are showing is he had a knife in your back and he keeps twisting it. the democrats are going to save you. >> is it going to be a close election next year? yes or no? >> we should always assume it will be. i think we are going win, but -- >> i will say trump wins in a close election. >> democrats will win. >> thank you, michael steel. pope benedict is inserting himself back into the discussion with the sex abuse that contra addicts pope francis's diagnosis of the problem. this is sticky. where do catholic leaders go from here. do catholic leaders go from here.
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then yesterday the former pope spoke out in a way that seems to challenge the philosophy of the more liberal pope francis. in a 6,000 word letter, pope benedict addressed the scandal by priests saying it was caused by the break down in traditional values. he cited the 1960s sexual revolution that led to sexual freedom that no longer conceded to any norms and led to the rise of homosexual cleeks in various seminaries. this stands in contrast to the approach by pope francis who has taken a firm stance in the promised by a culture of corruption and abuse of powers by leaders. the conflicting views are between the conservative and aggressive views. more on that after this break. s more on that after this break. what if other kinds of plants captured it too?
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welcome back to "hardball." as the catholic church continues to defend their handling of the numerous sexual abuse allegations towards the clergy, pope benedict spoke out yesterday on the letters on the causes of the abuse. it contradicted pope francis and highlights the divide between the progressive and conservative wings of the church. ben ticket remains an icon in the church and they feel besieged by francis, a pope they consider a liberal radical and threat to church doctrine. "vanity fair" contributor john corn well said the rift frein francis's loyalists threatens to have the biggest split in the catholic church. joining me is ann thompson who covers the church and columnist at the national catholic reporter. you first. about the news of a former pope
coming up and basically challenging the philosophy of the current pope. >> but that is not how benedict sees it. he writes that he is trying to help. he understands that this is a crucial moment for the church and he thinks that by his experience in talking about what he sees, he can help the church into a new direction. here i think it's not just so much a political divide, but the two approaches of these men. benedict is the intellectual and looking at external forces. france's is the pastor. he is looking for the internal forces that have caused this crisis. >> michael, i think it's good to see on the show. thank you. we have talked about this years ago. why was there a cover up? >> well, you know this scandal first emerged under pope john
paul 2. i wrote in 2002, we started covering this in 1985. in 2002, it exploded with coverage of the situation in boston. i wrote cat that this started, the crisis started about sex the way watergate started about a burglary. it was the cover up that shocked people. the rich ops would move them around and not hold them accountable and send them to a rehab and put them back into ministry. there are cover ups because people don't want their dirty laundry showing. there was something more. in john paul's approach, he identified with the priest and saw these cases as a priest breaking his vows. it was a sin against chastity. when you listen to victims, when francis had the summit with bishops from around the world, they started by listening to the
victims. when you start there, you see there are issues of justice and this is a crime. i think that is the mentality that is going to get us to the place where we need to be to make sure this never happens again. >> at the beginning of his papacy, he ordered anyone gay to be banned from seminaries in the priest hoot. pope francis said it in 2013 about this, sexual orientations of priests. >> who am i to judge. there is a difference. >> it is a big difference, but on the flip side of that, chris, is they see part of the problem in the seminaries of the catholic church. the priests were not properly formed, if you will. they didn't do a good job of weeding out pedophiles. benedict in his letter blames it
on the homosexual cliques that you refer to. francis was asked that question. i was on the plane when he was asked that question and the form of the question was, did he believe there was a gay lobby in the catholic church and francis said no, i never met anyone who has. i am a member of the gay lobby. it's a different point of view as to what's happening and what the root cause is. they see where the problem is. it starts in the seminaries and they have to do a better job of determining who is sutd for this life and who isn't. >> great question. the big one, the power house question. the "hardball" question. is it reasonable for the church, the 21st century to assume there are a lot of males out there who are willing to give up sex for life, whether straight or gay. that's the vow of chastity. is that reasonable to assume that would work or not? >> in religion, it's swimming
against nature. normally people are ill-advised and we are founded on the belief that a man was raised from the dead. we are swimming against nature at the get go. i believe there is still a role for the witness of celibacy and priests are formed. they weed out the sexually immature men that were passed through in the 50s and the 60s who went on to become pedophiles because they were sexually immature, not because they were gay or straight. most child abuse is heterosexual. i hope we will still get them. if not, the requirement can be changed tomorrow if the pope wanted to. >> thank you so much, my friend. it's good to see you. of course my colleague, ann thompson. this is a sticky business to be talking about, but we did it and did it well. we will talk to tulsi gabbard about the arrest of julian
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what about this? changing your plans. yeah. run with us. search "john deere 1 series" for more. . welcome back to "hardball." as i mentioned earlier, wikileaks founder julian assange was arrested for his alleged in hacking classified u.s. military files. assange spent the past several years living in london in the
ecuador embassy. experts are looking to extradite him. tulsi gabbard of hawaii, thank you for joining us. i don't know what your view is on this. what do you make of the effort to extradite and punish julian assange? >> we look at the obama decision not to extradite assange and charge him because of the concern about how this government action would impinge on freedom of the press. this is a blow to transparency and a blow to a free press when you have a situation where our government is in a position where they can basically create this climate of fear against somebody or those who are publishing things that they don't like or saying things they don't like. that's the concern here.
this is a threat to journalists, but also something that threatens every american because the message that we are getting and the american people are getting by what happened here today is be quiet, tow the line, otherwise there will be consequences. >> what happens if the mueller report if we get a get look at it and it's not too heavily redact and it shows that wikileaks and assange worked with the russians to put out attacks on the democratic candidate, hillary clinton in 2016. is that journalism? >> i don't think it's helpful for any to deal in hypotheticals. i think it's important and i called from the very beginning for the mueller report to be released so that we in congress and the american people can take a look at it and see what's in there. >> in an interview on cnbc, mike pence said embattled venezuelan president nicholas maduro must go. >> the people of venezuela have
been suffering through deprivation and the dictatorship of nicholas maduro. from the early days president trump made it clear that maduro has no legitimate claim to power and he must go. >> i wonder about the concept and whether they see an opportunity in latin america. do you think there is a real danger of a wag the dog situation. you don't like hypotheticals or here's another one. do you think they are up to something? everything is on the table and military action and everything. the thought of the united states army going into venezuela. what do you make of it? >> this administration and the neoconwor hawks that surround president trump made no secret about what the efforts are to further the regime change effort in venezuela and iran. we are hearing the war drums beating. president trump is acting not with our interests in mind. not with the american people's
interest in mind, and moving forward with something that will prove to be very, very costly. >> i'm sorry to interrupt you. i always do. i am so hot to trot on this one. how can a president run against stupid wars. i'm against stupid wars and he hires john bolton. his pick. let me bring elliott abrams in. he brought the neos in to do their stuff. how do you explain that switch? >> that's a great question. the reality is that we are facing that we do have a situation with a cabinet full of neoconwar hawks whose history is very well-known in leading our country into one regime change war after the other. to great expense in american lives to trillions of dollars coming out of our taxpayer's pockets as well as the lives and the suffering and the
devastation of the people in the countries where we waged these wars. >> how did you explain that every major democrat in the u.s. congress? people i generally like, joe biden, hillary clinton, john kerry, they all supported the iraq war. they haven't apologized that i know about it. they backed that stupid war. why do smart people back a stupid war? they did. >> it's unfortunate to see the establishment in washington and the military industrial complex so often goes and wages these regime change wars under the guise of humanitarianism and say we will try to help people in these countries when in fact every single time what we see is these regime change war that is our country leads increases the suffering of people in those countries and increasing the devastation and as we have seen in the middle in countries like iraq and libya and syria the regime change wars made our
country less safe by strengthening groups like isis and al qaeda. the threat we are facing right now is existential threat with this lightening of tensions between the united states and countries like russia and china. nuclear-armed countries that propelled us into this new cold war. this is a serious threat that we have got to address and that's why i'm running for president. to take this on. >> as good of a reason as i ever heard. tulsi gabbard of hawaii. up next, the important lessons we can learn from netanyahu's victory. that's scary. the victory, i mean. victory. that's scary the victory, i mean. (client's voice) remember that degree you got in taxation?
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israeli prime minister netanyahu gave a lesson to voters in this country to president trump donald trump and to trump's critics. lesson one, you can with win reelection while not changing your off putting style. you can be narcissistic and bullying and the works. if oppose the person, you can sure as heck lose to them no matter what you think of them personally and no matter how bad their image is in the world. whatever else you can say about him, this person you see is a villain is seen by other people as the lone tower of strength. the one politician is willing to take the heat by defending the country the borders and
sovereignty. if you are seen as the man willing to defend the country and you are a candidate and party are not, don't be surprised at your country's contract. he was seen as strong on the issue of defending his country. the borders and the sovereignty. by refusing to promote a strong alternative for border protection, they allowed trump to position himself so far as the lone protector of the country's sovereignty and brand his enemies for being for open borders. as jerry brown sized it up, he made the wall a metaphor saying hey, the lefties and socialists are against it and i'm for it and it's protection and that will protect you from closing down the factory or these strange social experiments. like trump, netanyahu dealt in images like getting the u.s. to move their embassy to jerusalem.
it worked. he just won reelection. trump's opponent can pay attention. you bet he has. that's "hardball" for now. all in with chris hayes starts right now. tonight on all in -- >> i'm proud of the fact as a business man, i want to pay as little tax as possible. >> the trump family tax shenanigans. >> i have no obligation to do that. there is no law whatsoever. >> one trump is out of a job and why house democrats are not giving up on getting the president's returns. >> i fight like hell to pay as little as possible. can i say that? >> the push to get big companies to pay their taxes. >> families do it, we want the corporations to do it as well. >> elizabeth warren joins me with her plan to craze a trillion dollars. >> then -- >> wikileaks. i love wikileaks. >>