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tv   The Beat With Ari Melber  MSNBC  April 20, 2019 9:00pm-10:00pm PDT

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but yeah, the political risk here is obvious, right? >> tell me. what do they think of having hearings all summer long, bringing out in great illustrative power all the charges brought out in the mueller report against this president, especially on obstruction? >> they think they can do that without launching impeachment proceedings. >> but the subpoenas aren't going to be honored. i understand that the supreme court will honor subpoenas if it's an impeachment exercise. >> that may be the case, but for now i think they're treading very carefully. if the shoe was on the other foot, i think it's very obvious they would have launched impeachment proceedings a year ago. >> she would get burned at the stake if she got help from the russians. >> we can play this game all day long. but i do think there's a great
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opportunity. >> that's a game that should be played by republicans because they should be honest with themselves that this is pure partisanship. >> what we've seen in the report is black and white and in writing, but if you put on the right type of hearings, and i wouldn't call them impeachment hearings, oversight hearings. you bring don mcgahn up, cory lewandowski up, sessions up, felix seder to talk about the russian deal, there are a lot of people who are outside of government who have to answer a congressional subpoena. >> i would do it as an impeachment exercise because then the american people would pay attention. i'd do it in prime time. it's much more serious for some reason. you sit down with your family and you watch these people testify and you get an impact you don't get by reading it in the paper.
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your thoughts? >> well, there would certainly be an impact but i think people like nancy pelosi are thinking to what end. if you can't actually succeed in impeaching the president of the united states, is it worth going through that process in something that could be beneficial and advantageous in many ways to president trump? >> how so? how's the look if he's shown to be basically the bad guy all summer long? >> i think he would use the same play book he's been using in the aftermath of the results, also in attorney general barr's letter and after the full report is out. the democrats hate me, they're trying to undo a legit matly elected president. that will help his base get energized, not that they need any help now. that's part of the political calculation that pelosi and others on the democratic side that have to make this decision are having to confront.
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>> if they can't confront him in '19 are they going to confront him in 2020? i'll tell you one thing i learned from the clarence thomas problem, during the day the women testified against him and at nighttime he got to testify. there's a puer to being on prime time. >> but the watergate hearings were in the afternoon -- but i think to jeff's point trump will do that no matter what. if the democrats ask a -- >> so what's your bottom line? >> i'm saying they shouldn't be guided by the fact he's going to react that way. they should do, a, what's right, but i think you don't have to call it impeachment. you can go ahead and get the facts out there. let him say that. >> by the way, he can say it right now, he'll try to get rid of me. >> there's a flip side about how there's a lot of talk but a lot of democrats want to see the
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people they elected in november hold trump accountable. that's pretty much what galvanized them. >> everyone said we've got to get the house back, the chairs have to be democrat so we have subpoena power. and now they put up these weak subpoenas and they go maybe they won't honor them. >> if they don't watch impeachment proceedings or engage which is serious oversight hearings then i think there's a risk that they face which is that the vote might actually be depressed come 2020. >> give me a vote now, straight news versus whatever point of view and commentary, i want a strict judgment right now. jeff, what would you call this bout right now between the critic of the president including many in the many stream press, the democrats and thoughtful people, and the president? as of holy saturday night, who's winning the fight? who's winning the fight over whether trump is a bad president
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or not? >> oh, man, i don't know. i don't. i really don't. i think it depends on what side you're on. i mean, i think if you look a little bit how the president's response has evolved in the last couple of days then maybe the white house and republicans are not winning in the same way that in the first few hours after the report came out they felt that they were. >> i'm asking a question -- >> let me answer it just with a little bit more color. >> happy this week saying we've missed the bullet, we're okay. we survived. >> kellyanne conway was delighted at the very beginning and that was representative of her boss because she'd been spending the morning with him. and if you look at the reaction over the past couple of days that has trended downward. >> so the democrats should be happy with this solution because as it is now it's no worse a tie
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for the president, he's probably ahead. that means he won. on the whole issue of two years of investigation -- >> unless the democrats continue to, you know, conduct oversight of the president, unless they don't continue to conduct oversight of the president, then the president wins, right? there's this calculation they have to keep making which is how far do we push and at what point does this become more of an ethical responsibility for us rather than a political calculation? >> he looks like a guy who taught the truth and told the truth to the president. i'm taking notes here. if he goes on television during two days of testimony before the house judiciary committee we'll cover it, other networks will cover it, do you think that will sway opinion? >> well, i think there's not a lot of opinion that's swayable. i think there's a very spall margin of people who are baked
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into their position. nevertheless, doing the right thing and trying to figure out how to address the people who might be swayable takes a little time. but i'll tell you, i disagree with jeff a little bit. sorry, jeff. i think the last day was a reset in a way. no collusion became a mantra, he had bill barr as his wing man and it looked like they were doing okay. i think as this report seeps into the consness of those paying attention they see the portrait of a president who lie about an attack on this country, he lied about his contacts, business dealings and then they wa now? trying really in some >> i mean, in the report -- >> but right naid i won. >> well, he's wrong. we're not going judge this by
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what he says. he's wrong. the impression now of trump is worse today than it was two days ago. >> let's not forget also there's -- >> sorry to jump in -- that's reflected a little bit in polling as well. i mean the reuters poll that came out shortly after the report showed that his approval ratings dipped about 3% after that report came out. but i think the polling we're going to have to watch is in those swing states we all know for 2020 and the independents and whether this affects their fieldings about the president. particularly some of those guys who voted for obama and then switched to trump. is this a reason for them to swap back to democrats, that's the question. >> the mueller report is not the be all, end-all of the president's alleged wrongdoing. there's an ongoing counter intelligence investigation. there's investigations going on in the southern district of new york. there are, you know, the hush money payments, the emoluments
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clause violations. all of these things if the democrats were to launch impeachment proceedings were to be wrapped into one. >> what's the hardest one to follow? roger stone and what's coming? >> the stone trial -- >> you've got the stone trial in november, the fight over the tax returns, which is something i think real americans -- average americans --thality may go to the courts and may take months, too, but trump not showing those returns and fighting it and violating law -- >> i think that's impeachable. >> there's so much out there in some that almost helps trump but in the same way if you do these hearings correctly it will chep away their impression. >> let's hope we get something to the supreme court and see if the supreme court will insist on the information getting to the american people, the tax returns, all this information unredacted on the mueller
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report. a lot of this stuff we'd like to see but the court's going to have to insist on it. thank you. we'll be right back with you later. in fact, both of them are coming back. coming up special counsel mueller reportedly wrote the president does not have immunity after he leaves office. he's not going to like that, is he? but then again maybe he can get re-elected and get past the statute of limitations. that's another situation, another court battle right there. we'll be right back. right there. we'll be right back. days. (dad) i think it's here. (mom vo) especially at this age. (big sister) where are we going? (mom vo) it's a big, beautiful world out there. (little sister) woah... (big sister) wow. see that? (mom vo) sometimes you just need a little help seeing it. (vo) presenting the all-new three-row subaru ascent. love is now bigger than ever.
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with mueller's redacted report out, president trump's legal troubles are far from over, of course. prosecutors are still investigating the alleged hush money payments and reportedly money raised for his inauguration. roger stonefaces trial, the new york state attorney general investigating. there's still 11 ongoing cases including mike flynn, rick gates. 14 cases transferred to other u.s. attorneys offices. i'm joined now by msnbc contributor barbara mcquade, former if i special agent frank mantoya, and former assistant director for congressional affairs at the fbi, i'm sure it was a form udable address you
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had there. tell me what you think about life or if you're one of his real lawyers, one who takes notes, a real lawyer out there, what would you be thinking would be where he's exposed post-inauguration say 21 or 25 but some time in that midst when he's exposed as just a regular person. what's he facing? >> again, you have to think of the things that would not have fallen in the statute of limitations, so maybe ongoing offenses, some of the financial offenses that might have extended for years. i think all the stuff in new york potentially poses the biggest threat to the president. that's both the state attorney general and the southern district of new york and not this sort of d.c. investigation stuff. there's a deeper connection which is one of the more recent things. >> what happens if he's found
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guilty, you couldn't have a jury with a trial so they all have to come afterwards? >> it's challenging because even subpoenaing a former president has proved challenging the times congress has tried to do it. nothing bars it. >> what level do they go to, prosecution? do they bring an indictment, do they hand up an indictment while he's president? >> i don't see it pointing that way and this points to the fact no president can have it both ways. a president can't be in effect immune from indictment while president while at the same time thwart congress' ability to get all the information about his allegedly potentially criminal conduct so as to inform the potential impeachment proceedings. and so it seems to me the way the constitution was intended to work is if a president can't be indicted while in office, congress needs to decide if there's enough evidence to
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indict but for his status as president, impeachment is certainly in order. >> they asked the other day for the unredacted mueller report and they get it back from the justice department. they say that's premature. >> we should be clear it's not just about impeachment. the oversight process can cause the president a lot of heartache and actually expose a lot of information about the president and a lot of the wrongdoing and so on. and the argument that, well, they wouldn't comply with congressional subpoenas, wouldn't comply with impeachment proceedings, i just don't think that's accurate. >> i'm hopeful something will get done anyway because i don't trust the court on other stuff. barbara, what do you think if you were the president's lawyer you would be spending your quarter hours right now trying to get ready on? >> i think the financial entanglements that predate the presidency is what is likely to be the area where the president is most vulnerable.
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there is reporting that mueller thought was beyond the scope of his investigation. but the ideas of accepting money from russian businessmen, the idea it may have been laupdered money coming from russia organized crime, the overpayment to the tune of tens of millions of dollars, i think that's the area where he could be the most vulnerable. it appears the southern district of new york continues to look at that, and i also think that state charges could be something that threatens the president. i don't think we're going to see any federal prosecutor charge the president while he's sitting, but remember this rule has never been tested in court. you could see some state charge president trump and take that battle to the supreme court to get an answer on whether a sitting president can be indicted. >> i know they're partisan but i hear a lot about the emoluments clause. they don't like the idea the president comes in as a billionaire potentially making
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money on the job. >> i mean, you know, going back to the original question first, let me answer that. everything's still on the table as far as what can come back to haunt this guy. he's the one that thinks he dodged a bullet and the bad behavior is not going to end, so where's don mcgahn now? who's going to help him or save him from himself? even some of the things that mueller's talked about in terms of had obstruction of justice or outstanding questions that are still out there as far as the conspiracy, everything is still an opportunity for him to step on it himself and to come back and bite him in the butt and haunt him as he goes forward. and we're only two years into this administration and there's two more years for him to keep skruing up. >> well, frank, i like the way you talk because you talk like me. so let's talk about screwing up here. manafort's going away for a long time even though thee got something of a break on two occasions. but he's an older guy and facing
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the rest of his life in the can. and my question is does he have a thing he's holding back that might be useful in terms of -- dare i say the word -- collusion or conspiracy. >> absolutely there's stuff there. you know, the problem is as it was pointed out in the report is that he still probably thinks there's that opportunity for a pardon. but let's look at that cigar bar situation for instance. there's an opportunity to make a charge there except for the fact we don't know what kilimnik did with it. let's say wishful thinking perhaps or putin tries to kill everybody who tries to betray him, if somebody were to come forward from the russian side to tell us what exactly happened with that material, if we were to find something like that, then yeah we've got our conspiracy. so there are a lot of indicators out there. i thought what the special
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counsel said about evidence, it wasn't that there wasn't any evidence. there wasn't specific evidence or enough specific evidence to make charges. but, you know, right after he says that on page # of volume one there's also that information about people lying. and the reason why you can't prove a conspiracy is because there's a cover-up. and the way you get a cover-up is because people lie about what they should be telling the truth about. >> maybe roger stone will talk under pressure. we'll see. i don't think he wants to go to prison. anyway, thank you. up next the house judiciary committee pushing for an unredacted version of the mueller report to get the whole story. i'm going to talk with congresswoman sheila shaksen ja lee. en ljackson lee.
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today, life-changing technology from abbott is helping hunt them down at their source. because the faster we can identify new viruses, the faster we can get to stopping them. the most personal technology, is technology with the power to change your life. life. to the fullest. if democrats pursue impeachment, it would be up to the house judiciary committee to rule initially whose chairman already subpoenaed the justice department for the unredacted version of the mueller report. as we told you earlier, says the special counsel provided a road map for congress to investigate the president. that's the chairman of the judiciary committee speaking. with me is a member of the
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judiciary committee, congresswoman sheila jackson lee. congresswoman, i'm going to give you the time to illustrate your thinking on this. i'm a little skeptical. i think some members of congress are playing for time here. they want to hear from mueller and barr and mcgahn. after all that is over in a month or so, are they ready, then, to move for a resolution of impeachment or not. i'm skeptical. no one is blowing the bugle in your leadership. your thoughts and reflections? >> chris, it's good to be with you. let me wish everyone a happy easter, to you in particular and those who are commemorating passover. happy passover. chris, you have been deliberating on this as we have. i would say to you this.
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it is no doubt we have received a road map just as ken starr thought he sent to the congress, republicans at that time dealing with mr. clinton and, of course, mr. jaworski who sent to the congress during watergate. the uniqueness of the time in watergate that there were republicans who felt that mr. nixon had crossed the line, here's my thinking. i do believe we need to dig deep and dive deep into the lying, the representations that the president had his staff lie, the elements of obstruction of justice, public corruption, and abuse of power. with that in mind, i am hoping, here are my thoughts, again, that some republicans will acknowledge that this is a political process, impeachment, and that it will precede only when the american people see the congress moving in tandem around the question of whether this is the behavior of a president of the united states. that is what the republicans did not do for mr. clinton's accusations, which were not a matter of state. they didn't seek to have any
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support, didn't want any apparently. it did happen under watergate. so our responsibility in the house judiciary committee, i am one of three on that committee that were here for the clinton proceedings. what we have to do is dig deep, have public and open hearings, and call witnesses. there are so many witnesses that we can call, some will come voluntarily. one of the the most important ones will be director mueller. we need to ask him questions on the record, was it the office of legal counsel's position that moved you not to proceed or an indictment of the president on the obstruction of justice, because he clearly said that he had no confidence, no confidence, or if he had confidence, that the president had not obstructed justice, he would have said so because he did not. we want to ask him under oath what was the moving reason that
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he didn't do it. what was the reason. we want to ask him whether or not he thought the president fully cooperated, and in the report it says we asked the president to speak to us openly, and lawyers presented his defense that it was a national security, that he couldn't speak publicly. we asked him again, this is, of course, his team, the mueller team, and he refused to speak to them openly or under oath in a setting where they could ask questions. that did not happen on either of the issues. the only response the president gave only on the russian issue, not on obstruction of justice, was written answers to interrogatories. i believe our committee has an enormous opportunity, and i hope we do it in a bipartisan matter that they understand our duty and obligation. when we reach that point, i don't think there will be hesitation, but i for one am more able to deep dive, answer the questions, let them hear the
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testimony of people who will say that he or she was told to lie or he or she was told to get rid of special counsel mueller and not tell anyone. all of that in the document. >> i like everything you said. i had the suspicious, though, that because the special counsel feels he's not authorized to indict, he believes, therefore, not morally authorized to charge, it wasn't fair to charge somebody who can't clear themselves in court and it's up to congress to make these decisions. he made these references that everyone will, even under testimony, you ask him do all these cases you mentioned here obstruction of justice, do you believe they constitute criminal behavior, i'm afraid he won't say yes. he'll say i can't exonerate the president. i'm wondering if you think that would be sufficient to garner
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bipartisan action here. >> chris, you raise a very good point. that may likely be his answer, but what he cannot deny, i don't think he would, is the words that were in the report. he cannot exonerate. the other that he might not deny, which is what the attorney general unfortunately misrepresented, is that he did refer this to the congress. so what is the congress authority? we are the only entity that can possibly address these circumstances. >> i agree. >> how do we address it? article 1. the provisions include the
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responsibility of impeachment or oversight. and so we have the responsibility to deal with high crimes and misdemeanors and abuse of power. with his testimony, and i hope with republican members of congress being in that room, that they would ask him sufficient questions that would give them at least the belief that if no one in congress takes up the responsibility to uphold the rule of law, then who are we as a nation? what is the world seeing and understanding of our high principles of democracy? i'm sure i'm not the only member of congress that has been sent overseas to observe another election of a country of which we believe they can do better in their elections. i'm sure many members have done that. we do that and we take the call because they believe america has a pure sense of democracy and justice and free elections. if there are members on the other side of the aisle that cannot see from this 448-page
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document what has occurred in the administration or, in fact, from the questions that they may ask of director mueller, which i know he will not be able to disagree with his own words about lack of confidence and the fact that people lied in the administration, then we are at a position where you may not be able to move this political process, which is impeachment. but if we are able to move it in that way where there is a bipartisan approach to this, then i don't think there will be any lack of courage to do what is right. let me be very clear. i'm going to say it publicly. this should not be a witch hunt against this president or attacking this president for the sake of doing so. but if we read in the depth of this document, get the supporting documents, recognize that there are 14 other investigations, i don't think
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we'll have any problem with looking at the facts and then coming to a fair conclusion as to what we're supposed to be and how we nurture and indicator to the very principles that are embedded in the madison papers that have to do with the sanctity of this office of the presidency and also the process of democracy. >> well said. by the way, i keep think of you and one of our predecessors, barbara jordan. i know you worship her. but let me say something. one of the great advantages of the judiciary committee back with nixon, prime time, never underestimate timing. if you guys have hearings, if you people don't have on that committee don't seize the opportunity to grab prime time hours to talk to mcgahn, mueller, the entire country will watch you. i'm giving up my time for this. i'm telling you, prime time hearings by the house judiciary committee with robert mueller deserves prime time coverage. thank you, congresswoman. i guess your committee has to make those decisions, but timing is everything. the american people work during
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the day. at night they'll be watching. thank you. sheila jackson lee, the great congresswoman from texas. thank you. up next, nbc news reporting former vice president joe biden is finally ready to throw his hat into the ring. i don't know if he wears hats. we'll talk about him. what's new with joe biden coming up. up let's be honest. it's kind of unfair that safe drivers have to pay as much for insurance... as not safe drivers! ah! that was a stunt driver. that's why esurance has this drivesense® app. the safer you drive, the more you save. don't worry, i'm not using my phone and talking to a camera while driving... i'm being towed. by the way, i'm actually a safe driver. i'm just pretending to be a not safe driver. cool. bye dennis quaid! when insurance is affordable, it's surprisingly painless. essential for the cactus, but maybe not for people with rheumatoid arthritis. because there are options. like an "unjection™". xeljanz xr. a once-daily pill for adults with moderate to severe ra
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i think your setup was exactly right. this was the long windup. we've been waiting for him to make a decision of the i was interested in seeing the reporting that he didn't even make a decision as recent as a few weeks ago when he was in the middle of his whole, you know, kerfuffle with lucy flores. so it seems like the vice president is really taking his time. i was talking -- >> but it worked for him. he got two weeks of distance from the stories that were not going to help him. >> i was talking to a political friend of mine and they were saying which biden are we going to get? like ali in the jungle versus foreman or ali versus ver bic in the bahamas? >> you're so cruel. how about joe biden pulling the ultimate upset at the age of 29, being a two-term senator, two-term governor, three-term congressman, beat a guy that was never going to get beaten. i think joe hasn't gotten over
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that. let me go to ashley. i think he's still operating from the principle and also because the tragedy that came to his family, losing his -- horrible traffic accident, it wasn't her fault, baby daughter killed. i think he thinks life is totally unpredictable, so why not try it again. >> he always sees himself as the underdog who always comes out swinging because he's ready for a fight. that's what intriguing me the most about joe biden. as a former republican voter, he appeals to me. he's my first choice. i would love to work for his campaign if i could. he's one of those people who really can speak to blue-collar america, if we go to the suburban voters, that's what won trump the election and they always swing. if biden can get in the race, speak to them, stay focused, i really think that he has a fighting chance against trump.
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he's polling right now very high with women, which is shocking given the allegations. clearly it's not impacting him. >> how does he get out of the briar patch of the democratic primary fight. all these litmus tests. are you for full right of a woman to have an abortion whenever she wants basically, forget roe v. wade. a lot of people are pushing for that, complete rights up to the women on abortion and decision-making. basically an open borders policy, you shouldn't arrest. a lot of people in the democratic party take a broad view of immigration. and the world socialism, are you comfortable having major leaders in your party advocating a socialist manifesto out there? i'd probably hit all three of them, and biden is not going to be for abortion late term.
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he's on the record on, what's it called? >> the decision. >> late-term abortion, yeah. he didn't do that. he didn't support that. also he's no socialist, but can he take those arguments into the streets starting next week? >> chris, i think ashley actually, her setup was so interesting. she said as a former republican, she would want to work for him. that is not how joe biden is going to win the democratic primary. i know he appeals to the moderates in the middle of the country, but he's got to get through a rough and tumble primary where you have booker calling for reparations. >> if he started talking like even kamala harris, she's not
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hard left, but she's over there. if he starts talking that tough, do you think people believe him, joe? >> i think people will not believe that he wants to run that kind of campaign. we know who joe biden is. he told you in his article he wants to run for the third term of barack obama. we have to figure out whether or not democratic primary voters want that right now. do they want a buttigieg? they want a complete change. it would completely be against voter history if voters go backgrounds. voters usually in this situation want to go forward and they want something different. >> if we're going to move forward, we need to get rid of trump and the democratic party needs to think who's best to do that. if we want to win an election and beat donald trump, you need to take it to the suburbs. we need to think about messaging to their audience. >> do you know who's going to lose for sure against trump? >> i bet you have a guess. >> i have guesses, but i'm not sure. >> elizabeth warren definitely does. >> i mean, look, i'm not a big bernieite, but i wouldn't say he couldn't win. i don't know because the mood of the country on super wealth is really changing, so i don't
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know. >> i don't know if any of these candidates have really disqualified themselves. all the main top tier democrats have shown themselves to be people who could put up a good fight. elizabeth warren, cory booker, pete buttigieg, bernie sanders, joe biden, beto o'rourke, they could all plausibly beat donald trump. so i wouldn't say that biden is the only person that could win here. >> if you look at what happens with the democratic primary, we saw this with sanders and clinton, the issue there was that sanders wasn't able to make it to the finish line because they stopped him from doing that. >> i don't agree with that. >> joe, if i were making bets, i would bet on kamala harris to place. you know why? because everybody i can think of who might win the nomination wants her on the ticket. >> she's got a good stake as anybody. joe biden love to approve he has the endurance to do this.
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i'm not sneaking coded language. not as much as his age as how will he fare on a debate stage with donald trump? >> the two will go toe to toe. >> one factor is who do you like. i think biden will win the like fight. >> who do you want a beer with? >> let's not forget that, he's run three times and it always hasn't been the easiest thing. i was there in 2008. i got to see a lot of those speeches. vice president biden is limited on the trail. and i think that's important to elevated. >> if you listen to his speeches, you were there for a while. have a nice weekend. happy easter. stick around. we'll talk more right after this. what could republicans have done? imagine what they would have done had hillary clinton played footsie with the russians. if even the russians had helped her win, if she'd won in 2016, imagine if she'd fired the fbi director for looking into her russian dealings, imagine if he tried to fire the attorney
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general, imagine just think have done to that person. talk about two-faced. let's talk. we'll be right back. two-faced let's talk we'll be right back. look limu. a civilian buying a new car. let's go. limu's right. liberty mutual can save you money by customizing your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. oh... yeah, i've been a customer for years. huh... only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ you wouldn't accept from any one else. why accept it from your allergy pills? flonase relieves your worst symptoms including nasal congestion, which most pills don't. flonase helps block 6 key inflammatory substances. most pills only block one. flonase. for people 50 and older colat average honey have you seen my glasses? i've always had a knack for finding things... colon cancer, to be exact.
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she played them. would lawmakers be divided on impeachment right now or would be hearing calls to remove her from office? laegs, i have no doubt in my mind it would be string her up, burn her at the stake. >> lock her up. >> she'd be lucky to go to prison and now they look at us and say this isn't anything. >> the hypocrisy is insane to me because the same republicans chanting lock her up and yeah he's been complete exonerated somehow even though it had shoed in so many ways, i mean how many times did he answer i did not recall. it shows he's guilty when all of those around him were able to recall certain instances where he did have an influence. >> 9 out of 10 republicans support trump, and nobody's calling for his impeachment but i believe the democrat party is different. i'm not saying they're more moral on everything, but on governance, i think democrats take governance more seriously,
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and i think democrats, some of them will come out against hillary. >> they want the government to do things. they believe the government can be used with health care and education and public service is honorable. republicans have been going out there since the days of reagan and said government's the enemy. so they don't care who comes into office and smells it up, and basically depopulates government and doesn't have an interagency policy process. they're fine. they want to blow things up. they care about tax cuts and judges. >> and cashing out. >> with hillary we had 17 benghazi hearings, we had, you know -- >> the e-mail. >> i mean, donald trump was with the enemy as it was attacking
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the united states, and he had the largest conflict of interest he covered up. he was working to get a deal with russia while talking putin is a good guy. those two things alone should bother republicans. >> compare white water with the moskow project. >> and he has his family members working for him, which was there biggest critique of hillary clinton saying chelsea could be in the white house and trying to run, and we've got jared and ivanka -- >> it turns out ivanka was at that june meeting so imagine if chelsea, i don't want to besmirch her name, imagine if it came out chelsea was meeting with the russians. >> and the clinton foundation was meeting with the russians. it was another salacious thing here. >> but also we see on twitter every day now videos of lindsey graham and others who were around during the clinton impeachment saying things if you lie that's impeachable, if you besmirch the office, that's all we need. we don't need a grand conspiracy with a foreign power.
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if you do something untoward, then we can impeach you. so here we are now not even saying this is impeachable, they have their hands over their ears, i can't hear this, i can't see this. they refuse to recognize. i don't know how you read this report and walk away and think this man ought to be in office. >> right, and the problem too to go back to that, the clinton foundation was the biggest crux of i think scandal at the beginning of her candidacy because she was dealing with foreign governments and that was a tainted thing. and now we look at this, and you can easily point to this being a huge issue. >> the total partisanship with which the right looks at this stuff. let me finish tonight because we have a few minutes. the next couple of months between now and say the end of may we possibly will have testimony by robert mueller of the house judiciary committee, possibly testimony by barr and
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look at the unredacted version at least going to the committee to share whoever he has to share with. and we have don mcgahn the president's lawyer. is it your sense anything will be changed in a public, in a democratic calculus not to impeach? will they change? >> i don't know. i think to your earlier point, though, if it is televised i think they have to do something because i think it will show that there was more than enough there there -- >> televised during the daytime or -- >> at night. at nighttime people will sit at home and watch. >> listen, when michael cohen testified it was during the daytime. when james chemotestified it was during the daytime and it got tremendous attention. i think it's the nature of the hearing. who you have up there, how you answer the degree -- if democrats can pull this off in a mature, reasonable fashion --
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people don't hold congressional hearings the way they used to. >> why don't they just let the general counsel pick a general counsel and have them ask the question -- >> i want to see trump answer questions because the i do not recall doesn't cut it for me especially when those around him are answering questions truthfully. that shows right there they were being influenced by him. >> you can call on donald trump, jr. and ivanka about the deal on russia. they can't claim we work for the white house. they're private citizens. >> i don't think they're coming. >> well, if they don't come they have to plead the fifth. let them plead the fifth. show the american people these people -- >> the justice department just yesterday said they're not going to respond to the request by the chairman of the house judiciary committee to give the unredacted report. they just said that's premature. >> get bill barr up to compare what's in the report to what he said at the press conference --
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well, fine. you know how this works. you've been up there. not answering the question sometimes makes you look worse. >> in the real world. but not now. >> well, we'll see. >> i still think they've got to go with impeachment because the only time the american people pay attention, the only time they get prime time coverage on the big networks including here is impeachment. they want somebody else to do it, mueller's not going to do it. no, i want a verdict. thank you. tune in tomorrow night 9:00 p.m. eastern here on msnbc for continuing coverage and analysis of the mueller report with ari melber. the guy knows what he's talking about. join me monday and every weekday night at 7:00 p.m. eastern for "hardball." there we are. we'll be back monday. (mom vo) it's easy to shrink into your own little world. especially these days. (dad) i think it's here. (mom vo) especially at this age. (big sister) where are we going? (mom vo) it's a big, beautiful world out there.
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he had deeper feelings for me than just friends. he managed to get me to care about him. he had my whole life wrapped up. >> she's at the center of a riveting courtroom drama. the wife whose entrepreneur husband was found murdered one cold autumn morning. >> our whole family has lost its brightest light, and we don't know why. >> he's the one accused of the crime. so why is she under the microscope?


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