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tv   MSNBC Live with Kendis Gibson  MSNBC  April 28, 2019 11:00am-1:00pm PDT

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we're out of time here on "weekends with alex witt." alex will be back next week at this time. my friend, kendis gibson, picks it up now. you on all yours. >> thanks to you have. a great weekend, good day. i'm kendis gibbon at msnbc headquarters in new york. horror at a passover holiday celebration when a man opens fire in a synagogue near san diego. one person is dead, and three others are injured including the rabbi and yet another act of violence that appears to be motivated by hate. details of an open letter believed to have been left by the gunman just hours before the
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shooting. plus, tensions between william barr and house democrats continue to boil. all of this after the attorney general threatens to skip out on thursday's hearing with the house judiciary committee. and a battle of the ages. now poll numbers have joe biden as a clear front-runner for the democratic ticket. but they also reveal a weak spot for his campaign. is the former vice president lit enough for america's millennials? we are going to get started on the left coast in san diego. we're going to start with the rabbi from that tragic southern california synagogue shooting speaking out for the first time. he calls the gunman a terrorist and says the jewish community will not be intimidated by acts of hate. >> i'm just so heartbroken by the senseless killings. mean, you know, the constitution of the united states guarantees freedom of religion for all faiths. and we are so grateful to live here in this country that protects our rights to live
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openly and proudly as jews. one thing for sure, i guarantee you, we will not be intimidated or deterred by this terrorism. terror will not win. >> it happened in the small community of poway in california. worshippers gathered on the final day of passover. the gunman opening fire in the habad of poway synagogue killing one and injuring three others. in an online letter, allegedly written by the suspect, he says he drew inspiration from the pittsburgh synagogue shooting that took place exactly six months ago. my colleague, calipery, joins me now. he is in poway where there's a growing memorial across the street from the synagogue. this was a celebration of passover that actually started exactly 24 hours ago, cal. >> reporter: exactly. 24 hours ago on that very holy day, last day of passover, when the congregants would have been full inside the synagogue. we're hearing from authorities that it could have been worse.
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the gun may have jammed. the gunman may have come across an off-duty cvp officer. we know for sure the cvp got a shot at the gunman, hitting the car on his way out. we will take a close look at those writings on line, where that hate came from. the other thing, of course, that people are dealing with in this community is gun violence. this is a country where 100 people a day are killed by gun violence. some 40,000 a year. people have been coming by all day and trying to explain to family members what it's like when gun violence comes to your town. take a listen to what katy had to say as she tried to explain it to her son. >> i wasn't expecting that my children would grow up in a situation like this. we are not jewish. we have friends of ours are -- very dear to us, children, and they're afraid. and i never expected that they were going to be in these kind
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of situations, in this circumstance, in this world where you just can't even bob ship -- worship anywhere, you can't go to school, there's many places where this generation -- honestly, i'm just speechless. i don't -- >> reporter: we're starting to hear reports that the gunman may have even had a camera set up to film some of this and broadcast it live. of course, reminding us of the massacre we saw in new zealand. authorities adding yesterday that one of the things they saw on line was a claim the gunman saying that he was part of an arson attempt to burn down a mask nearby. so again, as this is unpacked, we seem to find just more and more hatred at the heart of this gunman and of this act. >> exactly that. hatred at the heart. cal, in the meantime, what can we expect to happen out there in the days ahead? >> reporter: people will continue to come by and remember the person who was killed in the attack. a 60-year-old woman who was at the heart of this community. of course people are trying to rally around the jewish community.
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this was a synagogue built in 1986. a very tight-knit community. again, hitting at a very tough time passover. such a sacred time of the year for the community. >> so tough for the community, indeed, and for the synagogue. the rabbi saying he was shot in the hand. he says that he lost the use of his hand as a result of that. cal perry, thank you to you in poway. and president trump, we should mention, did react at the rally in green bay, wisconsin. >> our entire nation mourns the loss the life. prays for the wounded, and stands in solidarity with the jewish community. we forcefully condemn the evil of anti-semitism and hate which bulb defeated. >> that said, statistics released by the anti-defamation league show there's been a rise in anti-semitic incidents since trump took office. jonathan greenblatt joins us from poway. he is the ceo and the national director of the anti-defamation
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league. and clint vanzant is there, as well. former fbi agent and msnbc contributor. welcome to both of you. jonathan, i do want to start with you right there at that very sad scene in poway. what does it say to you that hate crimes against jewish people are on the rise in this country in 2019? >> reporter: it is incredibly disturbing to think that in, again, this day and age we've seen a surge of anti-semitism without precedent. people are attacked in the pews while they pray. this is not an issue just for this community. this was an attack on the entire jewish community, and we need our elected leaders and all folks to respond appropriately aggressively to this problem. >> clint, in the meantime, we're lucky of to you with us because of your law enforcement background. i want you to listen to what the san diego police chief had to
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sayed to. >> as he was en route, he also overheard chp scanner of a suspect who called in to chp to report that he was just involved in this shooting, and his location which was ranch bernardo and interstate 15. as our officer was exiting the freeway, he clearly saw the suspect in his vehicle. the suspect pulled over, jumped out of his car with his hands up, and was immediately taken into custody. >> clinton, as you hear that, what do you think when you hear that the suspect turned himself in? >> yeah. this is -- this is another loser, another wannabe to get on the internet and gets this trash on the internet that -- that raises him up. it feeds into his negativity. but this is muncy -- and i read his manifesty o -- in his twi 19-year-old mind he believes that he'll go to jail and be
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released again. like every shooter like this, they believe there will be a national uprising to follow their example. of course, this guy, his heroes are the shooters from new zealand, prosecute pittsburgh, and adolph hitler. so that's the three people that he ranks on top of his life. he's no fan of trump's. but he explains that, too. >> yeah. and jonathan, meantime, this is of particular note -- the fbi is also reporting a rise in hate crimes in the u.s. since trump took office. >> yes. >> something about his remarks, rhetoric, that fires up people like neo-nazis? >> reporter: we know that extremists feel emboldened in this moment because they are saying so. they are encouraged and energized by the fact that their rhetoric literally is finding its way into the talking points sometimes of the president and other elected officials. let's be clear about something, anti-semitism is a problem across the aisle. neither side of the political spectrum is exempt from
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intolerance. what we need is from our elected leaders not to trivialize it when it happens, not to point fingers, but to step up and speak out. firmly and forcefully, to say that america is no place for hate, to ensure that our policies go after the global terror threat that is white supremacy because as clint said, there's a throuu through line a we need policies to counter right-wing extremism even as we recognize that how we vote can step up to value, tolerance for all people. >> all that well said. but from a pittsburgh-to-poway standpoint and the head of the adl as you are, give me the emotional ax pekt that you feel as you -- aspect that you feel as you get to the scene six months after some 11 people were
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gunned down at a gag is just like that, just -- at a synagogue just like that, just worshipping. jonathan, clint for a moment. >> reporter: i spent last night praying for the family of the rabbi who was wounded. and i will tell you this -- whether it's an attack on jews in pittsburgh or paris or poway, we will not be broken. we will not be beaten. and we come out of this wounded but stronger, clear about the fact that we will drive for jewish unity, we will speak out for the privileges and rights that we have in this country, and we will not be bowed or broken. anti-semitism is at the core of white supremacy idealogy. like never before, at the adl and across our community, we will stand up and push back against there kind of hate. >> that kind of hate seems to be on the rise, indeed. clint, how important -- you mentioned that you read the shooter's open letter.
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how important is that open letter to investigators? >> well, it's importance because it allows us obviously to candle this guy's head like the old farmer would do with an egg, to look inside, to see what was making him tick. what we're also concerned with is where did he get his inspiration? it appears from the internet, from other like-minded individuals. but also there's no suggestion that anyone else conspired with him, worked with him. as jonathan was suggesting, i mean, there's been harry reid said recently there's been a 37% rise in these type of activities. and that's not just in the united states. that's across the world. so we may be a hotbed for the white supremacy type of thought, but the anti-semitism circles this globe. there's always someone on the edge of the abyss just waiting for some type of reason. and this shooter's case, he looked at pittsburgh, he looked at new zealand, that gave him
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the impetus. and six months since the pittsburgh case, this was not just a fluke. people like this follow the dates, they want to do something on an anniversary date. so this type of thinking we have to do what we've told people to do for years. if you see something, say something. well, that goes with the internet. if you see someone who's spouting this fiery rhetoric, who's talking about committing some act of violence, that's the time we as citizens have a responsibility -- notify law enforcement, let them figure out if this person should be interviewed or not, and take it from there. the fbi and other law enforcement agencies have stopped people like it in the past by seeing this rhetoric and interviewing them, intercepting them before they act again. america's got to work together on this one. >> it is a very difficult task to fight, indeed. jonathan greenblatt and clint vanzant, thanks to you. ahead, william barr heads to the hill this week, but he could
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okay. it will be a big week on capitol hill. the attorney general, bill barr, is scheduled to -- on thursday to testify before the house judiciary committee where democrats are in the majority. a senior democratic aide is telling us that barr is now
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threatening that he may appear before the chamber over new conditions placed by chairman jerry nadler. the committee now wants to be able to go into executive session to ask about portions of the redacted mueller report. they also want to allow democratic and republican counsels to ask questions for 30 minutes each after all members finish their five-minute question period. house judiciary committee republicans are praising barr's decision. in a statement to nbc news, reading in part, take a look, the attorney general isn't a fact witness and this committee's investigations, as democratic leadership reminds us daily, don't constitute impeachment. so democrats have yet to prove their demands are anything but abusive and illogical in light of the transparency and good faith the attorney general has shown our committee. barr is still confirmed to appear before the senate judiciary committee on wednesday. for more on that, let's bring in politico national security correspondent and contributor
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natasha bertrand and cnbc editor at large john harwood, former federal prosecutor and msnbc legal analyst glen kerchner and politico congressional reporter andrew desedario. welcome to all of you. andrew, you're right there on the hill on a daily basis are. you expecting barr to appear before the house judiciary committee, and what are you hearing from your colleagues? >> right. i think they're going to reach some sort of negotiated settlement. if would look really bad if he didn't show up. as you noted in the opening, he will still show up before the senate judiciary committee. he's not evading capitol hill entirely. i would say from my point of view it would be really helpful to have the lawyers for the republican and the democratic sides of the committee asking the questions because these are people that are really the experts in the subject matter area. they're not going to be up there like lawmakers usually are trying to grandstand, trying to get the made-for-tv moments. they're going to try to draw out actual information. that's helpful to people like me -- >> aren't a lot of them lawyers, former lawyers? >> right. a lot of the members of congress are, but they have their own
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political incentives to jump on the attorney general or to defend the attorney general or to defend the president. so i think we would learn much more in terms of substantive information in a setting like that. if barr doesn't end up showing up to the house judiciary committee, that would be a serious escalation of tensions between the trump administration and congress. it's really reached a level of bitterness, harshness, hostility that it hasn't been in the past. >> one congresswoman described the atmosphere as being in a war zone just yesterday. >> yeah. >> natasha to you. in the meantime, what is barr afraid of? is he hesitant to answer house democrats' questions on the redacted portions of the mueller report, or is he just afraid of something else? >> you know, that's a great we question. it's something -- he doesn't want to be questioned by the staff which andrew was saying. i think one of the big fears is he is questioned about his own motivations for issuing that four-page memo before the mueller report was actually
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released, giving that press conference two hours before the mueller report was released. and this general effort to spin the entire thing before it was even released to the public and to what extent, i think, is something they want to figure out, to what extent is he acting as a personal attorney and defender of the president or as the attorney general of the united states. i think they want to get to the bottom also of the legal reasoning and rationale between his clearing the president of obstruction of justice along with rod rosenstein. that is a big question that people have now because several, many former federal prosecutors say if it were falcon bnip but president -- were anyone but the president of the united states, he would have been prosecuted for obstruction of justice. to leave it in the hands of congress and go a step further and exonerate him of obstruction, i think is something that the democrats really want to get to the bottom of. >> well on wednesday, as you
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know, his testimony before the senate judiciary committee, glen, is likely to be a lot more friendly because the republicans are in the majority there at the senate. but take a listen to what democratic senator amy klobuchar, presidential candidate, as well, had to say about what she will ask when he appears before her. >> i'm actually the one that asks the obstruction of justice questions. and now i'm going to have another opportunity to have him go before me next week where i say, you know, when i asked you if it was obstruction to try to impede the integrity of a witness testimony, you said that it was. i view this as an opportunity to really push him on what obstruction of justice is. >> so glen, justice will be key for the five minutes. what sort of questions do you imagine them asking? >> let me tell you, senator klobuchar is a former prosecutor. i think she will do a heck of a good job cross examining essentially, attorney general barr. i do find it interesting,
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kendis, as a trial court prosecutor rarely did, i had witnesses show up and try to tell the judge how this procedure is going to work. that's what is trying to do. understanding they're co-equal branches of government. it seems that the administration and the executive branch thinks it holds all the cards. and frankly, i -- i don't think this is time for continued timidity and hand wringing out of the congress. the congress needs to exert itself as a co-equal branch, try to hold barr accountable, try to make him appear and testify fully and truthfully and in a responsive manner, not dodging the questions, before both the house and senate committees. >> and in the meantime, what happens if barr decides that he will not testify in front of the house panel? how else could the congressional investigators get the answers that they need for this investigation? >> i think the house judiciary committee would go to court to try to compel his testimony at risk of being declared in
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contempt of congress. i do expect as andrew pointed out that there will be a negotiated settlement. we saw that earlier today when elijah cummings, chair of the oversight committee, worked out an agreement for a transcribed interview with the white house official who the president had tried to keep from testifying about the security clearance processes at the white house. i think the question that natasha put on the table is, is he functioning as a defense lawyer for the president as illustrated by this very obstruction question we're talking about. the statement by bill barr that he -- there was no prosecutable obstruction case is a purely political statement, purely public relations. why? because the justice department agrees that you cannot prosecute a sitting president. bob mueller in his report noted that it is to congress to hold the president accountable. that's what jerry nadler and the
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various investigations are attempting to do. but the -- bill barr couldn't clear somebody of a charge that he had agreed from the outset he couldn't charge him with. the house is the one with whom that question resides. and i think they're going to push that as aggressively as they can. >> i want to get you guys to weigh in on something we saw earlier. in the meantime, the deputy, former deputy attorney general, sally yates, was on "meet the press." here's what she had to say about obstruction. >> the ones that he found that all three elements were satisfied were with respect to trying to fire special counsel robert mueller through don mcghan. then trying to get don mcghan to lie about it later. not just his own lies, but trying to get someone else to, as well. and then trying to reduce, to cabin the scope of the investigation to what's nonsensical, to campaign
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interference in future elections. >> what do you make of her comments, glen? >> i agree with sally yates. i think one of the first questions i would ask a.g. barr is do you agree with the factual findings and the conclusions of robert mueller. make no mistakes about it, bob mueller concluded by setting out that the evidence supports as sally yates said all of the elements of obstruction of justice. you know, bob mueller was circumsuspect and didn't want to poison the we'll w-- well of public opinion and didn't say therefore the president committed obstruction of justice. but kendis, one and one makes two. he committed it, the ever supports it -- the evidence supports it, and barr needs to be pushed on whether he agrees with mueller's conclusion, although unannounced, that the president committed obstruction of justice. >> kendis? >> go ahead. >> i wanted to say the danger to the president is underscored by what sally yates said. those elements that she pointed
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to -- the snaps instances she p to include the testimony of a highly credible witness to republicans as well as democrats. that's don incomore began. he's -- don mcghan. he's a conservative lawyer but respected in washington. the fact that he in 30 hours of testimony to special counsel outlined these events and would be in a position to affirm his account in public testimony, that is very dangerous for the president because the president's own credibility is very weak, as we've seen for quite a long time. >> it depends on what the congressional leaders decide to do with all of this information. it's going to be a fun week on capitol hill for you guys. >> that's right. >> good luck. thanks to natasha, john, glen, and andrew. appreciate the time. we've been talking barr and the mueller report. let's shift gears a little bit for a lighter moment. it's with former secretary of state hillary clinton. and comedian jordan cleper. the report says that, as you know, russians worked in a
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sweeping and systematic fashion to swing the 2016 vote against clinton. but watch as cleper asked clinton to read a portion of the redacted report. >> i'm raising money to hire hillary clinton to record an audio book of the mueller report. >> the campaign expected it would benefit electorally. the president slumped back in his chair and said, "oh, my god. this is terrible. this is the end of my presidency. i'm [ bleep ]. >>what do you think? >> next time with feeling. what's my motivation here -- pretty good. still ahead, 2020 campaign meddling, but this time it's not russia. how president trump is trying to instigate a fight within the dnc. e a fight withinhe t dnc.
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there is a new poll out from abc news and the "washington post" showing former vice president joe biden and senator bernie sanders leading the pack in the 2020 field. as you can see there. absent from the top three beto o'rourke, who the president had some choice words for just this morning. >> beto o'rourke wants to take down the walls, that means he's finished. i mean, he was finished two
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weeks ago when he started saying certain very stupid things. beto o'rourke has been exposed. >> joining me now are road warriors garrett hague and shaquille brewster. let's start with you, garrett, in san francisco. you're with the former representative beto o'rourke. has he reacted so far to the president's comments? >> reporter: hey, good morning. he'll be taking the stage behind me here in a little bit. and i-95 been covering on -- i've been covering o'rourke long enough to know i don't expect him to say a word about what president trump has said. i think he and his campaign will continue to show strength. they are relatively comfortable operating in that middle tier here. remember, it's april. we're 280 days away from the first votes being cast anywhere. it is very difficult to run wire to wire as a front-runner. but they do want to keep up the enthusiasm, they do want to keep raising money. we're at an event in san francisco. of course, california, this cycle, is an early nominating state. folks will start casting their ballots early in california on
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the same day as the caucuses in iowa. it's an important state for raising money, for enthusiasm. it's important for getting through to the nomination. so i think what we'll continue to see from arourke will be a mix of events like these. he had a rally last night in los angeles. some of the smaller events in the early state where his campaign feels like they can continue to recruit volunteers. they can continue to get people to commit to caucusing, and they continue to build out his grassroots support and, frankly, give him more practice. he is continuing to refine his policy petitions. he's continuing -- positions. he's continuing to refine elements of his platform. we're starting to see him do more national media, creeping out in interviews. the campaign feels like there's plenty of time to keep building and pushing back against criticism like that from the president. >> he's fighting senator harris there on her home turf. in the meantime, senator harris is in cleveland, ohio, where this keel is. what's her -- where shaquille is. what's her plan to court the large segment of undecideds
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there? >> reporter: well, she's continuing to just pound the pavement, talking to voter. she's going to talk to a group of cuyahoga democrats later in cleveland. we came to civilization coffee shop. we've been talking about the "washington post" poll that shows that most democratic voter are still undecided. listen to one voter who explains the dynamic -- >> i liked her from the beginning. she's very intelligent. she has integrity. she has courage which democrats are sorely lacking. she's a strong person, morally, ethically, she'll be able to take on someone like trump who i'm glad to see she's come out to support impeachment. >> reporter: sounds like you're almost decided. >> no. i -- she's a strong favorite. i mean, there's a lot of them out there. i like biden, you know, for years. >> reporter: bob was there with his friend, corey, who is a republican. many democrats are considering or talking about ohio as a state
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that is more red than it is purple. and his friend corey who is a republican, supported the republican governor here in 2018, says that democrats shouldn't give occupy a state like ohio -- give up on a state like ohio because he himself is considering voting for a democrat. >> i get a sense based on the tweets you've been putting out and reporting that you get a sense that elizabeth warren is getting some momentum out there. >> reporter: it has been interesting to watch. i've gone to a couple of these forum events in the last few weeks. these multicandidate events. whether they be for union members or democratic activists, the sheet of people forum in houston late last week. in each of these events, warren comes on late in the day and has really impressed these crowds. she has made a virtue of the idea that she is the person with a plan. she has literally made it a catch phrase for her campaign. she's trying to impress that core base of the party. i have not seen that translate into the poll numbers. and everywhere i go i hear this interesting paradox about her.
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i think it's something we'll see teased out over the next weeks and months. folks say, my gosh, i love elizabeth warren, i would vote for her, but i don't know if she could win. it's still the same electability argument that i'm hearing folks being nervous about warren. so many of these events she blows away crowds who perhaps have lower expectations of her. it's fascinating to watch. >> that has been the key issue for many democratic voters, who can beat trump. garrett, thanks to you. i should mention to you that i counted, there are 11 crossfits there in the san francisco area to help with your obsession. so -- >> reporter: cool. thanks. this has been really fun. >> i bet. shaquille, thank you, as well. so joining me now to discuss all things 2020 are talk show house shondele summer and former assistant to president obama chris lieu. welcome to both of you. want to pop up the new poll from the "washington post" and abc again, biden at the top as we
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mentioned, and then sanders and pete buttigieg. what's your take away as you look at the polls. >> they're meaningful and not meaningful. they largely name recognition -- they're not meaningful in the sense that we're probably only about two miles into a marathon right now. and the toughest part of the race is still ahead. the second quarter these candidates are going to have to figure out how they can raise enough money to keep these larger -- increasingly larger campaign structures going. and then in june and july, you'll start to have the debates where the voters will start to tune in. and these candidates will have to distinguish themselves both on policy and both on message. and so there's a long road to go right now. and certainly it's always better to be ahead. but i wouldn't count out people who didn't make that list that you put up there. >> yeah. still a long road ahead just before the first debates in
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june. in the meantime, shondele, you have your finger on the pulse of what people are thinking, regular folks. do trump voters see any of the names in that poll and think to themselves, hmm, i could see myself voting for that person? >> i think you have more moderate republicans who could see themselves voting for biden. he's clearly the one who's going to moderate the democratic party at this point. he hasn't signed on to the $15 minimum wage, he's stressing economic dignity and talking about the disparity in income between the very rich in america and the middle class. he's a guy who appeals to blue collar americans. he would do well probably or at least the best of all the candidates in the states of michigan, pennsylvania, and wisconsin which are critical to a democratic victory and which, of course, resulted in hillary clinton's defeat in 2016. >> and you don't think there's
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any fear at all of mayor pete buttigieg, right? >> fear, is that what you asked me? i'm sorry. >> yeah. do i think there's a fear on the part of the republicans? >> on the part the conservatives? >> i think they'd be delighted to see pete buttigieg be the democratic party nominee. and i think i was on your show a couple weeks ago where i said i thought that it was a candidate who's so different than the norm, that it would cause most americans to flock in droves to donald trump just because it's a new and different ideas. that's not to say he's not a very bright and capable person. but he's so young, and he's really not had the experience that one would typically see to want to elevate someone to the presidency of the united states. he doesn't have any kind of international experience. he's never run a business. >> he did go to war -- >> he did go to war. and that's laudable. i'm just saying, he's so young,
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i don't think that's the kind of candidate that you're going to see a majority of americans flocking to. i think the republicans would love to see him be elected. >> all right. leave it there with the mayor. we'll -- we have more on mayor pete coming up. chris, i want to ask you about that 35% that we saw in that abc news poll. 35% of democrats have -- haven't fallen in love with a candidate yet. republicans say the democratic field is a mile wide but an inch deep. is this poll an indication that that might be actually true? >> well, again, i'm not tried to read too much into this poll. i don't suspect that you'll have 20 candidates that will make it to labor day. there's not enough money in the democratic ecosystem to support all of these people. and frankly, most voters aren't paying attention right now. and when you look at where the democrat basis, their procedure goal is to beat donald trump. contrary to what your previous guest said, i think that many of these people on this list cannot only re-create the obama
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coalition that won in 2008 and 2012 but can expand that. i think this is a good period of time for the candidates to tested out their messages -- to test out their messages and best distinguish themselves. this is exciting. you see the wonderful diversity of the democratic party playing out in the slate of 20 some candidates. >> chris, thanks to you. thanks. ahead, a sdougz faith and politics after famous reverend calls mayor pete buttigieg to reper repent for being gay. we want to inbound form you of the passing of a political legend. former indiana senator rich ad lugar. -- richard lugar. of course you raise the name and the face. the longtime senator held the seat in indiana from 1977 to 2013 and was known for leading the charge in the dismantling of the former soviet states and securing their nuclear arsenal. he passed away this weekend at 87. s weekend at 87 when you start with a better that's no way to treat a dog... ...you can do no wrong. where did you learn that? the internet...
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faith tradition that counsels me to be as humble as possible, that counsels me to look after those who need dweefending, and frankly it couldn't be more radically different than what i see certainly in this white house. and good night that one of the things -- and i get that one of the things about scripture is people see different things in it. at the very least, we should be able to establish that god does not have a political party. >> that, of course, is south bend indiana mayor pete buttigieg responding to how he planned to uninight liberal and conservative -- unite liberal and conservative people of faith. and franklin graham, one of the most influential evangelical christians and the son, of course, of billy graham, shot back at buttigieg in a series of tweets stating that the bible defines homosexuality as something to be repentant of, not something to be flaunted, praised, or politicized. joining me now is matthew vines, author of "god and the gay christian." and shondele summer is back, a
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conservative talk show radio host. welcome to you guys. matthew, i want do start with you. how extreme would you say the comments were by reverend graham? >> well, they're fairly commonplace in many theologically conservative christian churches. the biggest problem with them is that they're pretty hypocritical because it wasn't long ago that franklin graham was saying that donald trump's adultery is nobody's business, that we all need to get behind him and support him anyway. he's not in much of a case to be making an argument against. he's not in much of a position to be making an argument against pete buttigieg for being gay. that's especially true because donald trump said he's never asked god for forgiveness. that's the core of christianity. graham has never called on donald trump to repent his sins. it's hard not to see his i a aare -- his critique of pete buttigieg in this case. >> does he have any impact across this country as far as evangelicals go? i mean, just 20 years ago he was
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ripping on bill clinton for -- for his adulteress affair. what sort of impact does he have now adays? >> he definitely has a substantial impact among conservative christians, especially white conservative christians, not so much among communities of color. i think that the hypocrisy and inconsistency that is involved in this does undercut his ability to be making that argument to a broader audience. and hopefully pete's candidacy is also raising the question for many christians of whether they need to take a closer look at scripture and the scriptural passages that franklin graham is talking about to make his argument against same-sex marriage to see if in fact the bible is not speaking to committed, loving, same-sex marriages like that of mayor buttigieg's and millions of lgbtq around the world. i hope this will present an opportunity for many christians who may have looked to people like franklin graham in the past
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to recognize that this is not a very principled argument anymore. maybe they need do their own investigation of scripture on this topic. and also recognize the fact that gay christians exist and are an important part of the church. that we need to be thinking more critically about not just scripture but how jesus would treat the lgbtq community. >> and gay conservative christians exist, as well. shondele, pick up from that point. given where the country is on these issues, this is no longer a mainstream view that was expressed by graham. should the republican party worry that they may see an exodus of gay conservative voters? >> from the republican party? >> yeah. >> i don't know -- i don't think there's going to be an exodus of gay republican voters. i don't think there's that many. at least i think it's a constituency that is naturally going to lean toward the democratic party candidates. and clearly pete buttigieg has made this -- his gayness an
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issue in this campaign. he's brought his husband up on stage. they shared a kiss during his announcement for -- >> is it the gayness issue as much as straight people are a straightness issue. he barely mentioned he was a gay person during his speech to declare has con edens -- candidacy, how is it an issue here? >> i disagree. i think he made it a huge issue. >> how? >> he talked about his spouse, chastin, and the fact that they were, you know, married, he -- and let's be real, this is not a typical candidate. we haven't had a gay presidential candidate ever in the history of the united states. and he made it an issue. he could have ignored it. he could have said nothing, and people would speculate about it. but he made it an issue. so he wants that to be an identifier. >> i got to -- >> and he will get a certain constituency of the democratic party simply for that particular
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demographic characteristic, but i don't think you'll see that many gay republicans flocking to pete buttigieg. in fact, i don't know that like i said there's that many to where it would make a a difference. >> i have to disagree in the sense that all he did was do what many other straight couples have done. didn't necessarily make it an issue there. respectfully disagreeing with you. >> they shared a kiss on stage. that's unusual. >> plenty of straight politicians share kisses with their politicians, too. >> we have hit the silly season now. thank you. >> you're welcome. >> thank you. >> thank you so much. >> we'll be right back.
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>> tech: you think this chip is well sooner or later... every chip will crack. >> mom: hi. >> tech: so bring it to safelite. we can repair it the same day... guaranteed. plus with most insurance, it's no cost to you. >> mom: really? >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, ♪ safelite replace. duelling event this weekend poking a little fun at the political establishment. one in d.c. one on tv. according to a historian, the rocky relationship between the press and the prez goes back to the first guy that occupied the executive office. here's a bit of each. >> like every future president, washington felt maligned and misunderstood by the press but he never generalized that into a vendetta against the institution. >> there are so many things you could say about the president. that he's vicious, unloved and will die alone but what can we
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say that melania hasn't already said. >> he wanted members of the administration to stay away from the dinner and i was puzzled by the news and then i learned a rumor was circulated in washington i was going to be reading aloud from the redacted versions of the mueller report and everything was explained. >> now look. i know i have to tread lightly with sarah huckabee sanders. she has shiny hair and bright eyes and on the inside hideous as a pin worm in a [ bleep ]. on the inside -- >> this is a glorious tradition. you folks are part of it and we can't have politicians trampling on it with impunity. >> and he got a standing "o" after all of that. ron was funny. let's bring in white house correspondent kelly o'donnell.
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hi, kelly. >> good to be with you. >> good to be with you. what a scene. ron was funnier than i expected him to be. >> reporter: that was actually quite a surprise because when someone is billed as a historian, he has a tremendous career behind him and you don't necessarily associate them with holding a room with humor. it is a dinner in transition in the era of president trump who has not attended. we have talked before about how past presidents have always made it a part of their annual attendance. and that was in part a way to try to bridge the regular divide that exists, the adversarial relationship that is inherent of the press and the presidency and something that's on hold. the dinner is evolving. many ways it is like other professions, other industries. they have an awards banquet, a night to get together to celebrate work done well and that's our version of this. of course, there have been times
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when it's dominated by celebrities. that era seems to be past. we had history lesson with churow last night and was not too tough on the president. it is a positive spirit and not necessarily trying to burn the house down. kendis? >> this dinner and the benefit and the scholarship program is alive and well. it's been there for more than 100 years that they have been doing this. good to see that ron churnow saving it all for us. thank you. >> reporter: good to be with you. >> congrats on 25. >> reporter: oh, thank you. superheroes united. dozen are using the superheroes are teaming up to save the world. doesn't it kind of sound familiar? a discussion on the similarities between america's number one box office film and the upcoming 2020 elections. really. i'm really into this car,
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-maid? uh, i'm not the... -♪ is she an alien, is she a spy? ♪ ♪ she's always here, someone tell us why ♪ -♪ why, oh, why -♪ she's not the maid we wanted ♪ -because i'm not the maid! -♪ but she's the maid we got -again, i'm not the maid. i protect your home and auto. -hey, campbells. who's your new maid? i protect your home and auto. title x for affordable natbirth control and reproductive health care. the trump administration just issued a nationwide gag rule. this would dismantle the title x ("ten") program. it means that physicians cannot tell a patient about their reproductive health choices. we have to be able to use our medical knowledge to give our patients the information that they need. the number one rule is do no harm, and this is harm. we must act now. learn more. text titlex to 22422
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good day, everyone. i'm kendis gibson at msnbc world headquarters in work. now pending. the attorney general is at odds with democrats over his objections to their format. can they get on the same page before thursday? the search for answers in southern california after another hateful attack on a synagogue leaves one woman dead and three others injured. and the people's preference is senator joe biden, at least for now. new poll numbers place him ahead
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of the pack and finds that many voters haven't been won over as yet. we begin today with the new developments on capitol hill. the attorney general bill barr is now threatening to not testify on thursday before the house judiciary panel, all of this over new conditions set by the chairman jerry nadler. the committee is demanding to go into executive session to ask barr about portions of the redacted mueller report. they also want democratic and republican lawyers to grill barr for 30 minutes each after all members finish their five-minute question period. now that last requirement is proving to be a major sticking point n. a brand new stoimt to nbc news, the justice department is demanding for barr to only be questioned by committee members. but watch as house judiciary democrats give a sneak peek of what they have in store for barr. >> people seem not to be talking about is mueller also said that on this roadmap there are some
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barricades that were erected, some roadblocks that ran up against and he says that the best vehicle to get around these barricades and roadblocks is the congress. >> the best person we can hear from is attorney general barr to find out why one his summary or cliff notes version was so different from the facts and, two, why won't he just release the unredacted report? >> if we are not going to do it haphazardly, we have six committees looking at this president. >> congressman clyburn right there. this all comes after house democrats promised earlier last week to veer off the straight road to impeachment while speeding ahead on what they say is an extensive investigation into the president. joining me now is msnbc legal contributor katie fang, the daily beast reporter betsy woodruff and daniel alonzo. welcome to all of you. betsy, are you expecting pbarr o
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testify thursday? >> my instinct is he will end up testifying. this isn't the sort of arm wrestling confrontation between the justice department and chairman nadler's judiciary committee. maybe about two months ago matt whitaker who was then the acting attorney general almost, almost stood up doj when they wanted to bring him in to testify. that was because members of the committee voted to authorize a subpoena and nadler appeared poised to potentially issue that subpoena. doj said if you hold that threat over our heads we are not coming. there was some back and forth. it was very dramatic for an afternoon and then nadler withdrew that threat and whitaker went ahead with testimony so my expectation is that there's some sort of deal made between house judiciary and the justice department. i think it's more likely than not that barr ends up testifying this week.
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at the same time, this is a volatile moment and things could get stranger than we expect so i wouldn't say i have a high degree of confidence but i think more likely than not. >> on the calendar quite sometime and you have confidence he'll testify but what will he testify to, daniel, as i the urn to you on this? what specific question should democrats put out there to barr, especially dealing with obstruction of justice? >> what they should ask and what might happen in the political world, right? i think they'll yell at him about discrepancies of the original four-page let ear enthe report. i'm not sure that particularly moves the ball forward. what i would ask is whether he -- why he didn't yet go to a court to try to get grand jury material unsealed so that it could be presented to the public and whether he plan to do that. i also would want to zero in on special counsel mueller's mention of congress as a particular venue in the obstruction of justice question.
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>> and picking up on the obstruction of justice question, katie, obama's deputy attorney general sally yates is said that trump should be indicted on obstruction of justice charges. >> personally prosecuted obstruction cases on far, far less evidence than this, and yes, i believe if he were not the president of the united states he would likely be indicted on obstruction. >> you've seen the road map placed there by mueller. is there anything to stop prosecutors are indicting trump on obstruction charges once he leaves office? >> well, there's really no reason why they couldn't. i have said this. sally yates said this. yet for the title of president of the united states before donald trump's name he should have been indicted and i think the good thing of what they're trying to do on wednesday and thursday in terms of bill barr's testimony, kendis, is we all know that when we have these congressional hearings, there's a lot of five-minute grand
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standing on both sides and i like the idea of spending 30 minutes asking bill barr really probing questions about not only his alleged summary, supposed to be an accurate rera flexion of the mueller report and what does bill barr as the highest ranking law enforcement officer in the united states, what does he think about that road map? is it a viable one and why is his department of justice not pursuing that even though there is that office of legal counsel memo? the question to be asked immediately is what are you scared of? if you're some wise, you know, experienced lawyer that's been involved in the government for as long as he has what is he so scared of of committee counsel? i think that's exactly telling about somebody like bill barr and doesn't want to sit in front of the committee this week. >> speaking of oh people who might be in front of a congressional committee, the mueller report as you know
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famously names don mcgahn quite a bit in there and he quit after trump asked him to fire the special counsel some time ago. chairman nadler is subpoenaing mcgahn to appear before the committee and the white house is now threatening executive privilege to prevent mcgahn from testifying. >> executive privilege is always an option, on table. don mcgahn talked under oath for 30 hours and just presidential harassment. >> he is going to -- >> i didn't say that. i said it's his right. >> betsy, mcgahn expected to appear? >> the argument that the president could invoke executive privilege to keep don mcgahn from repeating things he already said on the record and discussing the matters just from a legal perspective doesn't make a lot of sense. it is very challenging for the white house counsel to argue that an executive privilege
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exists regarding the conversations that mcgahn described to mueller's team. now, the question as to whether or not mcgahn testifies is really important one because you can't have a serious conversation about this obstruction of justice question without looking at mcgahn. he is sort of the hub of the wheel when it comes to the obstruction story surrounding trump. so it's going to be almost impossible for democrats to have a -- to try to do congressional hearings, looking at that matter without mcgahn weighing in. it's my expectation is that democrats will do everything in their power to push to get him to testify and ultimately the decision is going to be between mcgahn and his lawyers unless the white house counsel's office finds a way to litigate to make an executive privilege claim which would be a hard claim to make to keep him from going in. >> katie, i imagine that fight will play out for quite sometime to get don mcgahn to testify.
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>> well, yeah. i mean, it could go to the courts but when's important for the public to know is this isn't fully litigated in the courts. normally you have a negotiation between the witness and white house and the congress but the reality is what betsy said. there's a strong argument to be made that don mcgahn spent hours upon hours with the investigative team and previous production of documents there was no executive privilege asserted. expectative privilege is held by trump and the white house and up to them to assert it but don mcgahn doesn't work for the white house anymore. that's tricky. if you have a current employee, they may think their current job is on the line and he usually goes in. witnesses before congress go in with personal counsel and don't go in with white house counsel and so it will be curious to see whether or not he stays to the course and remember donald trump said he's a liar. donald trump said now don
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mercedes bemcgahn is a liar. >> it does seem as it gets muddled before everything clears up, indeed. our thanks to all of you. still ahead, jewish leaders demand action against hate crimes after a second deadly synagogue shooting occurs on u.s. soil in six months. what's for dinner? bleech! aww! awww! ♪ it's the easiest because it's the cheesiest. kraft for the win win.
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in southern california is reeling following a shooting a. person was killed and three others others injured including the rabbi there. it is labeled by officials as a hate crime. the rabbi from the synagogue is speaking out, he is scheduled a press conference later this afternoon. but told nbc news that terror will not win. >> i'm just so heart broken by the senseless killings. i mean, you know, the constitution of the united states guarantees freedom of religion for all faiths. and you know, we are so grateful to live here in this country that protects our rights to live openly and proudly as jews. i guarantee. we will not deterred by terror. terror will not win. >> this is only the late nest a series of attacks at the fateful. past six weeks we have seen acts of violence happening at places
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of worship all across the globe. nbc news correspondent cal perry is there. what are we learning about the incident there? >> reporter: we know the 19-year-old white male who went into the synagogue behind me had inspirations of a massacre. we know from the online postings before the shooting took place he wanted it to be like new zealand, to be murder on a mass scale. something happened inside the synagogue, acts of heroism, the gun jammed and he fled. he said he was responsible. they cam to him. they found in some of the online post thags he had potentially burned or tried to burn down a mosque a month ago so the deeper we go in this more hay threat we see and raises questions of gun violence in america. this community like so many others are now grappling with the seriousness of gun violence. keep in mind we are talking about 100 people a day killed in
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gun violence in america and learning about the weapon and ar-15 rifle, of course, the gun of choice coming to these mass shootings. it is an assault military style rifle and appears that is what was used this attack. >> i couldn't help but notice behind you somebody impacted by all of this, a young, young kid there dropping off some photos there at the growing memorial. aye long with his mom learning a very early lesson about violence in this country. all right. cal perry, thank you. let's bring in the former fbi double agent. mark potac, an expert on the radical right and a former senior fellow and ben collins, nbc news reporter. ben, i do want to start with you because as i mentioned we have seen a number of attacks against religious institutions in the last six weeks around the globe. >> this one was effectively as close to a copycat as the christ
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church as you can get. the posting was identical to the one sent by the shooter in new zealand. he references in this open letter the robert bauer's shooting in pittsburgh of six months ago to the day. at a synagogue. so this -- the idea that this is going to go away any time soon is probably not true. you saw, as well, this is not limited to far right terror in the united states. sri lanka. left dozens of people dead. this is a moment in time that we are going through right now. >> appears an attack on people of faith. mark, what do nees attacks tell us about the global radical right? >> confirms a number of things. one, it confirms that the radical right is growing and grown fairly dramatically. another thing, it shows is that what has become -- what start as a terrible outlier has become
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very much standard for these kinds of attacks, meaning attacking houses of worship. places where people are gathered to worship. so those are very important things. i think the other piece of it is that we're seeing a kind of tit for tat escalation exactly what the christ church killer in new zealand hoped for in terms of building up as we go back and forth between attacks on muslims, attacks on christians, by muslims and so on. you know? and as i say, the christ church killer hoped very much to start a race war in the united states. and i think that what we are seeing is a continuation. it's more and more young people being pulled into this. this particular young person was a pretty interesting case in that, you know, he played piano expertly and yet pulled into this ideology which when you really look at it is completely
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simplistic. >> as you know, fbi statistics indicate that hate crimes are on the rise in this country, in the u.s. how's the shooter influenced by those global events that mark was referring to just now? >> i just think that mark is right. there's a rise here and important to separate here. just to give an example, if the shooter was in syria or iraq and part of al qaeda or isis, planning an attack, u.s. intelligence could detect it and neutralize the threat but within the borders of the united states we have constitution and due process and what you see is mark is saying. we can build a profile for these type of people, see them young men disenfranchised, very much isis and al qaeda members do to recruit. the difference here is what do we do within the united states? you know, i have to mention, i had a chance to speak a presidential candidate about this and i asked him directly a question about why is it that
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when we have a terror watch list and stop people from flying but we can't use that same terror watch list to stop someone from buying a gun? and there's no good answer to that. these are simplistic, low-hanging fruit solutions to implement today to give an opportunity to detect that something is about to occur and the intelligence community calls it indications and warnings and simple fact to see it over and over again. we know the profile and can't get to that point is incredibly frustrated. >> all right. we have to leave it there. our thanks to you all. now hiring. the president beloved mar-a-lago but will everyone get a fair shot? a new report debunks the excuse why the resort employs so many foreign workers.
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time now for the round-up of other headlines from across the country and the terrible scene in seattle. four people kill when a construction crane fell from a building crashing down on several cars below. two of those killed were crane operators. it's not clear what caused the clapgs. pope francis has pitched in
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to help with the crisis at the u.s. southern border. yeah, the pontiff donating $500,000 to help migrants stranded in mexico trying to reach the u.s. in a statement from the vatican they say the donations distributed because aids to the crisis had been decreasing. the money will be distributed to local projects and dioceses with food, lodging and basic needs. another white house invite declined by championship winners. this time it's the university of virginia men's basketball champions which plays its home games in charlottesville and will not meet with trump at the white house. they won the first championship last month. the head coach in a statement on twitter blamed a scheduling problem saying it would be difficult if not impossible to get everyone back together. that said, three of the key players have already declared for the nba draft. and hearts are breaking across the world.
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idris elba is off the market. the 46-year-old actor married in a secret ceremony. he was named "people" magazine's sexiest man alive in 2018. all right. president trump unplugged again in his rally in green bay the president rushed to condemn the andy semitism in the wake of the southern california synagogue shooting coming one day after he doubled down on his defense of the white nationalist in charlottesville. >> if you look at what i said, you will see that that question was answered perfectly. and i was talking about people that went because they felt very strongly about the monument to robert e. lee. >> well, joining me is liz plank, host of consider it and michelle goldbergings columnist
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and jessica garrison, senior investigative editor. thank you all for being here. just this morning trying to defend the president's comments. >> but for joe biden, when's been in public life, elected at 29, to come out and have no vision, no accountability for the obama/biden record didn't mention president obama but mentioned charlottesville and try to use it for political purposes. >> it is a simple question. >> it is not. it is a complicated topic. >> was the response perfect? >> when president trump condemned evil, violence and then took it many steps further and called out neo-nazis -- >> was his response perfection? >> darn near perfection. >> you get a sense that the president trying to play it both ways? >> yeah. that's always what he tries to say. there's good people on both sides and obviously saying that neo-nazis who are good and in
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the same sort of idea sentence is a same idea and what the republican party wants to do. this is always what they've been around, using the moral issues, using culture war it is really rein in the issues they care about talking about the economy, they talk about anything else, it's a losing battle for their base. >> as you know, trump touched on a number of topics in the rally last night in green bay, including late-term abortion. >> but your democratic governor here in wisconsin shockingly stated he'll veto legislation that protects wisconsin baseballs. the basebalby's born, they take of the baby. and then the doctor and the mother determine whether or not they will execute the baby. i don't think so. >> what do you make of that? >> i think that, look, we are used to the president making up,
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you know, on scene lies and incitement but i think it's worth pausing for, you know, just what a kind of disgusting fabrication that is on so many different levels. it's inkritding violence against abortion provider who is are frequent targets of terrorism and also think about what -- you know, he is -- the kind of grain of truth, not even a grain of truth there is that when a woman, for example, has pr pree-eclampsyia making a decision to resuscitate or wrap it in blankets for the parents to hold and demonizing the parent who is are making an excruciating decision, the bar for him is so low but i think it is in some ways, you know, a --
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>> it seemed as a very, very, very low moment. jessica, i want you to weigh in on this. yes, clearly unplugged but was it unhinged? >> well, i mean, i think that's in the eye of the beholder but i think it was a shocking, shocking comment. and i can't imagine why he said it. >> well put. >> yeah. so let's talk about abortion is a minor surgical procedure. there's no cutting or knife involved and no this involved. none of that is involved. abortion is a normal procedure. and 1 in 3 women will have to go through it, you know, during their lives. and it's really fascinating to see the republicans are really going in on this strategy. right? calling it infanticide or a late-term abortion and invented by republicans and not doctors
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and interesting to see them go full-on when access is never more popular. reached a peak of popularity since 1995 and there are 7 out of 10 american who is want to keep roe v. wade a reality in this country and it's actually -- access is more popular than the president. >> trying to see if something will stick. >> it's extremely emotional. a horrific image to paint and distracts the argument from -- what we are seeing now is a barrage of six-week abortion bans, total abortion bans, huge restrictions and rather talk about this fantasy of depraved women and doctors than really doing to curtail abortion access. >> i think the comments come at a time when abortion is curtailed in all kinds of places and this plays right into the rationale for that. >> all right. something else he touched on. touched on a number of different things and claimed that the merit-based immigration laws to
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prioritize skilled workers. listen to this bit. >> and we're doing a plan based on merit where people come in, maria, based on merit to help us. tha they have skills, talent. we have people coming in under the crazy laws that if they need welfare or if they need handout for the next 50 years they're almost incentivized. those are the people that we are supposed to be taking. >> jessica, you wrote an article that found that despite trump's immigration rhetoric, the mar-a-lago resort mainly hires foreign guest workers. tell me more about the findings. >> all right. well, so the mar-a-lago and several other trump resorts hire all kinds of people. "the new york times" and others have reported that, in fact, in some cases undocumented workers but another thing that these resorts have done for years is that they have sought guest, foreign guest workers on temporary visas and under the
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law you are only supposed to get guest workers on temporary visas if no u.s. workers want those jobs. and what we found through an foia request is that, in fact, nearly 60 u.s. workers had sought jobs at mar-a-lago and other locations. but were ultimately not hired and instead they sought guest workers instead. >> some would say it's a little bit of a hypocrisy. michelle? >> of course it is. but, you know, i don't think hypocrisy is anything new for this president and i think his subpoe supporters glory in the blatant hypocrisy and drive everybody else crazy pointing it out and for him to suffer no consequences. that is part of the sick thrill that the supporters get from this administration. >> yeah. and speaking of immigration, he talked about babies being ripped from their mother's arms, only baby who is are being ripped from their mother's arms are
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children at our border because of his policies and so again it is easier to talk about this fake idea of what he thinks an abortion is than to talk about the policies and the harm they have. >> well said. liz, michelle, thank you. as well as jessica. thanks, as well. record number of women are running for president but can any of them beat president trump? we are on the campaign trail after the break. but it's also great for finding the perfect used car. you'll see what a fair price is and you can connect with a truecar certified dealer. now you're even smarter. this is truecar.
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can you imagine sleepy joe, crazy bernie? you look at the candidates -- i think pocahontas is finished, she is out. >> president trump there with the greatest hits in prime time at the rally in green bay, wisconsin. the president falling back on a trio of old nicknames for his perspective 2020 opponents and
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while i'm sure they don't relish, the labels, could it be that the candidates are happy to hear the president actually attack them? joining me now is shaquille in -- >> reporter: hi there, kendis. it's funny because many candidates almost the opportunity for an attack or a tweet from president trump. i think many times you see the campaign after being attacked fire out an e-mail to supporter list saying, hey, this is how tough we are, the other side is paying attention. that's not the benefit that senator harris has gotten. you think bernie sanders, directly attacked by president trump by president trump said of harris, one of the toughest candidates in the race so not getting that direct attention. senator harris is here in
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cleveland right now. she is going to be talking to a group of democratic cuyahoga party democrats, a dinner having here and making the point that she is the best candidate to take on president trump and having the opportunity to talk to democratic party officials and leaders here, county chairs who are able to mobilize democrats here in this county and we have been talking to peel in the coffee shop all morning long and one thing you hear a lot of, goes to that original point of the engaging with president trump, but one thing you hear about is they want a candidate to take on the battle to president trump, take the fight to him directly and a risk there, as well, because they want a candidate not sucked into the battles and hear about the issues, talk health care and immigration and a risk that the candidates to play there where they want to take the battle to president trump and focus on the issues. kendis? >> the president still hasn't
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found a nickname for senator harris as of yet. >> not yet. >> shaquille, our thanks to you. want to bring in the panel. noelle nickpoor and managing editor of above the law ellie nistel. i'm sure that you have seen the new poll out there on the 2020 field. it is early, granted. but you have biden up on top. bernie sanders at 11%. mayor pete and kamala harris and warren about the same level and are you surprised to see with the strong women it's two white men at the top? three white men at the top? >> for the presidential election, two people whose best experience is losing presidential elections. never change democrats. never change. you're totally on point. right? look. i am -- i thought that
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brewster's report almost made me cry. we are at the point in the country where to get coverage in mainstream media women need to be attacked by a crazy white man and only get -- like the moons and only get light if some crazy orange sun is like blazing down on you. it seems to have been so hard for the women to rise above the white noise of all of these other candidates and i don't really know what they're supposed to do. elizabeth warren putts out a plan like every day. right? she keeps dropping hits like every single day and she struggles to get kompcoverage. >> she is not a connectible female. >> i beg to differ. our garret haake is on the road with her and he's marvelled how much reaction she has gotten. women's conference last week where she -- >> do you know how hard it is to make tax law interesting?
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she can do it. >> not a lot of people meet her one on one and not have an opportunity in a fund-raiser or rally and the only contact is probably over a television and it's just not a connectible in my opinion, not really a connectible female. >> i want your sense on a nbc news piece that is out right know saying a 2020 election can a woman beat trump? some democrats wonder if it's worth the risk. it writes here in conversations with dozens of democratic primary voters, told nbc news that hillary clinton's loss in 2016 made them rethink how willing americans are to vote for a woman for president. especially when pitted against trump. is that really the case? where we are right now. >> i don't know. you know? it's kind of an unknown because, first of all, the tactics that trump uses to campaign, his style, is unlike anything we have ever seen. we are not really used to, you
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know, third grade level tactics of name calling and, you know, catching people off their guard. with that said, is it better since we now know how he campaigns to put a female in that position to go against him or put an experienced male up against him? i don't really know. it's a chance that, you know, back to your original point, it is a chance that the democrats are going to have to take. i think it would be better and more of a fair fight to put them together as a pair. i think that when you get the final nominee and make sure that no matter what you've got maybe a female/male, you have both genders represented on that ticket to maybe combat it. >> two presidential candidates have gotten more than 65 million votes in history. i think we are ready. one was a woman. one a black guy. the argument that the country is not ready to elect a woman is
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made entirely by people who are not ready to elect a woman. i know how they vote. i'm kind of concerned about the rest of us. >> this is the feedback that a lot of democrats are fearful about. >> yeah. >> i don't think wind let the worst people pick our nominee. >> i think it has to do with the message. rez natding. bernie sanders has a lot of people and mo moan tum. like him or not. >> leave it there. thank you. >> sure. >> appreciate it. ellie, stick around why don't you? game on. captain america, thanos, do they remind you of anyone? after the break, the panel share their thoughts of the new "avengers" movie and the 2020 race. these letters used to mean something. letters earned in backwoods, high hills and steep dunes. but somewhere along the way, suvs became pretenders not pioneers.
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more than $1 billion in the debut worldwide. the premise of the action film is simple. 16-plus superheroes who team up and return to defeat thanos. doesn't the goal and the mission sound similar to the candidates in the upcoming 2020 election? >> donald trump has got to be defeated. >> by the time we get to 2020, donald trump may not even be president. >> i believe that i'm going to bring a vision for the country that represents the future. >> i'm prepared to fight and i believe it will be a winning fight. >> a winning fight? their opponent doesn't think so. >> the democrats are trying to win 2020. they're not going to win with the people that i see. and they're not going to win against me. >> okay. i know you're still not convinced. they have an action to grind. both parties will need to
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support one another but only one will come out on top. joining me -- do you see the graphic on the right? joining me right now is alexandria petrie and ellie mystal. earning a bar degree right here with this. okay. so it's striking how similar the movie is in comparison to the 2020 election. let's start with, say, thanos. who is he? >> i feel like it's a snap of donald trump for lack of a nonpun comparison. he didn't have a good plan and wanted power to execute that terrible plan. get rid of half of things and that's one way. he thought the universe was full. he wasn't right about that and did something horrible. i don't feel that thanos surrounded with the best people. he had that wizard that needs to moisturize. i don't feel like it's optimal
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and i think that there's commonalities there. >> ellie, who's biden who just entered the race? >> okay. so -- i have a slight disagreement. thanos was willing to sacrifice and i don't think president bonespurs sacrifices anything for his presidency. my pick for biden is ironman. the rusty janky ironman clearly past the prime and can't treeat women like he did and still good to have on the team. >> you said kamala harris is more like ironman and biden is like thor. >> just learning how to interact with people even though he's hundreds of years old and a certain commonality there.
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people love him. scandinavians worship him. with ironman, you know, californian. made a big impression and the stark industries been on this side of the prison military until complex? there's a lot of discussion around both of them that's similar. >> kamala, that was heartless. >> meantime, there's a character to mention that you both agree on and it is bernie sanders as the hulk. what? the hulk? >> all right. so bernie sanders kind of an awkward professor type has used to be a loner but now he wants to be part of the team. he's super useful to have on your team. just don't make a supporters angry. you wouldn't like his supporters when they're angry. >> he likes to smash. he smashed a session of wall street. that's what bernie's all about.
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because he's a man the anger is seen as a source of strength and become stronger and stronger. >> have we seen the david banner version of bernie? >> i think vermont sees it. right? he is the lovable guy. bernie sanders. we love that guy. >> oh, okay. all right. let's talk about captain america. one of the biggest avengers out there. you think that's mayor pete. why? >> i'm always like why is this guy in charge of things? he is really just inspiring and his plan seems to be there's engineers on the team and he's like my plan is to say the word freedom but i'm not mad. he's captain america. there's a connection there. >> i've got elizabeth warren as captain america. because captain america and liz warren always have a plan. that plan always involves protecting the little people an the people who can't fight for themselves and captain america
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would absolutely punch a nazi and as would liz warren. the best match. >> where does that leave beto and booker? >> well, so beto i feel like reminds me of hawkeye sort of jumping up on prom tories. and similarly, i think with booker he's sort of spiderman like in the current it ration where he's rescuing kittens from trees and helping put your bicycle away and stuff like that. but people being like was he in the movie? he needs to have people be like, yes, he is in fact, in this movie. unless that's a spoiler in which case i said nothing. >> look, i have to a little bit flipped. beto as spiderman because as she said he is a wall climber. beto loves to do that. he has what it takes to be a hero but not ready for prime time and might be better as a friendly neighborhood presidential contender opposed
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to leading the whole team and corey booker, a deep cut, agent phil colson. he just doesn't have any super powers. >> gillibrand? >> hawkeye. >> he loves family. probably brought a bow and arrow to a superhero fight. >> i would say captain marvel but i didn't see it and supposed to be excited yet and i hear great things. speaks mandarin. has a cat named juice. i'm excited the find out more. >> if it makes a difference, nobody really saw captain marvel. do we have the graphic of the contenders and the avengers? it is pretty cool. pop it up as we say thank you to alexandria and ellie. take a look. this 2020 candidates. as the avengers.
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pretty awesome. we'll be right back.
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that'll do it for this hour of msnbc live. i'll be back next saturday. now to richard liu. no spoilers when it comes to the avengers of who's winning. >> you are a superhero. >> in my own mind. i'm richard

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