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tv   All In With Chris Hayes  MSNBC  May 10, 2019 5:00pm-6:01pm PDT

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generations and finally said no. let's hear what is in their hearts and minds in 16 and what's there now. i invite you to watch may 16th here on "hardball." we are calling the show appropriately, the deciders. that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. all in with chris hayes starts now. >> tonight on all in -- >> giuliani plans ukraine trip to push for inquiries that could help trump. >> donald trump ukraine campaign. >> all i want the government to do is investigate. >> the president is at it again. >> russia, if you're listening. >> maxine waters on donald trump's public pursuit of help from a foreign government to get himself reelected. >> we're have a couple things up our sleeve that should turn it around. >> as democrats subpoena the president's tax returns, how a crucial decision just changed the course of the investigation
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into donald trump's finances. plus, how the stalemate in trump's trade war will affect you and breaking the cycle of white supremacist hate in america. >> what are is basically becoming a white nationalist terrorist group. a reformed white nationalist on breaking the hate. >> the ideology is not as important as the desire to belong. >> all in starts right now. good evening from chicago. i'm chris hayes. after escaping the mueller investigation with no direct criminal charges with no charges, the emboldened trump white house stonewalled investigations with just about every turn, refusing to turn over a single white house document, refusing to allow key witnesses to testify and refusing to release the president's tax returns despite a clearly worded law calling for them to do so. now, house ways and means
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committee richard neal issued a subpoena for trump's tax returns following the senate intelligence chair who subpoenaed donald trump, jr. and the house judiciary committee that voted to recommend the household attorney general in contempt for their ignoring subpoena. while the trump administration tries to under mine the government systems of checks and balances, the trump campaign is flagrantly about to run the same play they ran in 2016. openly inviting and welcoming foreign interference in the presidential election. judy giuliani, the president's current attorney because the previous one is in prison said he will go to ukraine in and in his own words, meddle in an vchgz to attempt to solicit foreign intervention to wound joe biden. never mind it's reported, the claim he is making and the story he is pursuing, the story he is making is true. there is nothing illegal about it. somebody can say it's improper.
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that's the lesson the trump campaign learned from the mueller report. they got away with everything they did that was improper and so they will do it again. they got away with request donald trump, jr. responding to an offer of russian assistance that he said if it's what you say, i love it. they got away with lying over and over about trump tower moscow and the president's business ties with russia. they got away with this. >> russia, if listening, i hope you are able to find the 30,000 e-mails that are missing. >> thanks to robert mueller, they were listening because that very same day, russian military intelligence tried to hack hillary clinton's server for the first time. now, the trump campaign is doing it again in front of us. they are doing it not as a candidate and a businessman, but with the full force of the united states government behind them. when rudy giuliani shows up in
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kiev, everybody know who is his client is. the russians are on to it, too. when facebook kicked a bunch of russian bots and trolls oust platform earlier this week, you will never guess what story one of them was amping. joining me is a guess for whom this may feel too familiar. phillippe is a former adviser to hillary clinton and host of the un redacted podcast. your response to say it's not illegal some call it improper. >> i have been screaming into it and watching you recount what happened. this happened so much, we all come on and run out of words and come up with cutesy lines to describe it. you hit the nail on the head when you said donald trump and his kids and campaign and his minions escaped and are embol n emboldened. i'm not a lawyer.
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i don't know the willing distinction between what they did in trump tower and other things in 2016. they committed moral and ethical treason against the united states. what's interesting is they don't even realize when they did it. the donald, jr. defense is, when we had the meeting, nothing came of it. the truth of the matter is the moment he responded to that e-mail saying if it's what you say, i love it, he was saying we are open for business. he was saying it is open season on our candidates. now, rudy is doing the same thing. frankly, rudy is just because he's another one of the president's crazy lawyers who lost his mind, he is clearly thinking he is speaking on behalf of the united states. when trump has been running around for 24 hours saying john kerry should be imprisoned for violating the logan act because he no longer represents the united states. i want to know and congress should want to know and compel rudy to come in and tell them what instructions has he been
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given? if he is doing this, it's a problem. you got people in china right now and north korea in and iran who are hearing this and they are at their keyboards saying that we can do whatever we want. this is another abuse of power and my fear is that the democratic party will not do anything about it. they will put all our eggs in the basket of election day here and the day after, we will be like it's not fair. he had help from the ukraine. yeah. we are seeing it happen. we watched it happen in 2016 and did nothing about it. we are on the verge of being guilty in 2020. >> you mean impeachment? >> in terms of in hindsight, we saw what he was saying out loud. if you can find her e-mails and five hours later, they were broadcasting. in diplomacy. that was the most undiplomatic diplomat in the department of
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state. your body language and words, you were broadcasting things without saying anything. they are saying do it. the system failed to stop him. our campaign was lighting our hair on fire and the media, some media did and some didn't. the media kind of did and in hindsight, they got away with murder. i'm not sure that any single human being can list three things that are being done to prevent that from happening. i can name ten things that donald trump is doing not only to repeat it, but make it so much worse. >> it strikes me that you said open for business, this was not an accidental disclosure by rudy giuliani. they are calling attention to it for the reason. it's a public trip. what is your individual of what message that is sending not just to ukraine, but everyone else? >> that's the thing. rudy doesn't have to go anywhere. he can sit on his couch and not
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go to ukraine or russia. everyone heard it on television. what rudy did was the equivalent of if it's what you say, i love it. the difference is and the difference between next year and three years ago, we are dealing with an incumbent that can do what the republican party and the right wing did 10 times over. where as they give our candidates health problems and investigations, they give our candidates baggage. now he is going to have the full force of government which he has proven that he is more than willing to abuse. he is going to do it and rudy said have at it. i'm going to have a beer. i don't need to go to the ukraine and meddle in person. he already meddled. he already committed a crime against the united states. >> phillippe, thank you very much. >> thank you, chris. >> joining me now for more on
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the trump campaign's ukraine plan who has covered the russia investigation extensively and matt miller from the department of justice under eric holder, now an analyst. julia, someone familiar with the dynamics here, what do you make of this? >> i'm going to have to agree with phillippe. it's less than a month since the mueller report came out which detailed over the course of hundreds of pages in volume one. all the extended contacts and the trump campaign had with the russians and the rugs had with the trump campaign that anybody reading it was scratching their head and thinking how is this legal and how does this not result in charges of conspiracy or cooperation or, i don't know, campaign finance violations? the fact that as you said in your intro, they got away with it. it's the moral hazard.
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they haven't been punished. why not keep doing it. it helped them in 2016. why wouldn't it help them in 2020? why wouldn't the russians want to get involved? the different question is the ukrainians are probably not on trump's side. >> let me follow-up on that. what's your read there? part of what's crazy is he's the president. ukraine has part of the territory occupied by the russians. there is incredibly high stakes diplomatics question here. >> exactly. they had a new president be elect and this is kind of the first u.s. trip essentially over there. the president's private lawyer saying hey, do you have any more dirt and can you keep the investigation going on our opponent? that's funny because we have been consistently pushing on the ukrainians to deal with corruption in their system. things like this. the other thing is, donald trump
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at last summer's g-7 meeting behind closed doors told the europeans, get off it, crimea is russian. let it go. him now going to the very anti-moscow, anti-putin new president of russia and saying can be help us? it's kind of rich. >> matt, phillippe said it's a crime committed against the united states when he meant in a deep philosophical as opposed to a legal sense. how inappropriate and how improper and how bad is this? >> completely inappropriate. you see trump again operating in the space where law doesn't exist and you use and be governed by norms. it's inappropriate for a president to send a private emissary to rally against his foreign political opponents.
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>> when you put it like that. >> you never thought it would be illegal. the difference is obviously he is an incumbent and he can use the powers of the president to pressure a foreign government. it's also because he uses his powers to follow-up. i guarantee you he will have a conversation with bill to urge him to investigate. the attorney general when he was before congress asked about whether he had been requested by the white house to open investigations and he wouldn't answer or talk about it. this is one of the things the president wanted to investigate. it's important because the way this happens is the right wing gins up the charges and try to get them covered. this is base said on a lie. based on everything we know. there is nothing here. the vice president did nothing wrong, but it will be covered forever and they may get the investigations they want in the
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end. >> by the way, there was just a news alert that trump told politico that he will talk to attorney general barr to urge him to investigate joe biden. >> there you go. >> sorry. >> right. again, this is the lesson learned and a lesson that the key lesson they learned was if you do it in public, it doesn't count. the most incriminating thing that donald trump did was russia if you're listening. that he did in public. if we discovered an e-mail that he sent to the russians saying can you hack hillary clinton, that would have been scandalous. because he looked in a camera, that's the way they run the play to do it in front of everyone and dare someone to stop them. >> that's why you see rudy giuliani bragging about it. go out in the open and do it. it's the same on the other side. not just the president trying to get this investigation started.
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he openly tried to get the justice department to investigate hillary clinton. he openly thinks it's okay to urge them to investigate his new opponent. that norm had always been the red line that the president couldn't touch. he crossed it and got a wi with it and there has been no sanctions. he thinks it's okay. that norm doesn't exist anymore. bill in his testimony and his confirmation said it's okay to suggest the types of investigations. that norm is gone. completely gone. you will see the president trampling all over it. >> can i say one thing? the one thing i wanted to add, a, in the barr memo he said this was not obstruction of justice because he was public about it. that's puzzling. the other thing that is troubling is that not only are a lot of things that we do and don't do in american politics based on norms, but laws are not
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self-enforcing. if you don't get in trouble, what do the laws mean? >> thank you both. joining me now, one of the democrats leading investigations into donald trump. maxine waters of california chairs the house financial services committee. let me start on this topic and i want to talk about don mcgahn as well. your reaction to the president now according to politico, i have not seen it myself, but saying he will lobby his lawyer to get dirt on joe biden and support from a foreign government. >> everything this president and his minions do as i said over and over again, this president is a dishonorable despicable human being who is undermining our country and democracy. he is disregarding the constitution of the united states. and this president should have been impeached a long time ago.
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>> i want to ask you a question about that. it has been your stated position publicly on this show for -- do you have conversations with your fellow members of house leadership about this topic in which you make the case to them? >> we talk about what is going on in this country and in this president in our meetings. i talk about it with my colleagues and of course i'm in the caucuses. i'm in leadership meeting, etc. i know that nancy pelosi, the speaker is trying to do everything that she possibly can to steer us to win. i know that she firmly believes that we are on the course if in fact we continue to go with the hearings in our committees and oversight responsibilities and taken care of. she believes this will go to our benef
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benefit. i simply believe that the president of the united states is dangerous. if he gets away with what he is doing now, he will have changed the role of the presidency in the future. i think that is bothersome that he is under mining and ignoring the house of representatives, the congress of the united states, and my own committee where we have sought documents from deutsch bank, he is suing deutsch bank to try to keep them from giving us the documents. we will have to go to court. he vowed that he will fight us tooth and nail and going into court opposing our subpoenas. i don't think that we should not impeach him. we should impeach him. >> a story that just broke before we came on air, the "wall street journal" reporting that the white house reached out to him twice asking him to publicly say the president did not obstruct justice after the mueller report was released and
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rebuffed them twice. what do you make of that? would you like to hear from him before congress? >> i certainly would like to hear from him. i think he does have courage and i do think he's an honest human being who has done the right thing so far and i would like to have him in committee really telling what he knows. >> where are things in terms of the lawsuit? there has been escalation obviously, a parallel thing happening with the oversight committees and subpoenas gone before a federal court? do you anticipate something similar with the deutsch bank situation in terms of getting your hands on the documents you requested? >> absolutely. we are going to have to go to court and represented by general couple. staff will be there. we believe that we have the opportunity to get the documents. we believe that the court will side with us and we are pursuing all of those under lying
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documents and we are going to keep doing the investigations and the chair of the financial services committee, i dowill doy work and at the same time i know that there is growing dissatisfaction with this president. i know that increasingly the numbers are going change. what surprises me more than anything else is that the republicans in particular the right wing conservative republicans are not patriotic. they are allowing this president to have this relationship with putin and the kremlin and russia who are our known enemies and they are working with them and have not stopped. they will not criticize them and he will not do going deal with the fact that they undermined our election system. that has shocked me. that has surprised me even though i said nothing does. the fact that the republicans who claim to be so patriotic and claim to love this country are
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siding with the president and russia against our democracy. that shocks me. >> congresswoman maxine waters, always great to have you. thank you. >> you're welcome. thank you. >> still ahead, the president's efforts to slow walk justice and jam up investigators thwarted by a district judge. that story coming up in just two minutes. tory coming up in just o minutes. man 2: proof of less joint pain... woman 3: ...and clearer skin. man 3: proof that i can fight psoriatic arthritis... woman 4: ...with humira. woman 5: humira targets and blocks a specific source of inflammation that contributes to both joint and skin symptoms. it's proven to help relieve pain, stop further irreversible joint damage, and clear skin in many adults. humira is the number one prescribed biologic for psoriatic arthritis. (avo): humira can lower your ability to fight infections. serious and sometimes fatal infections, including tuberculosis, and cancers, including lymphoma, have happened, as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems, serious allergic reactions, and new or worsening heart failure.
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will fast track a ruling on the house subpoena for accounting records and decide the full case next week not just whether to block the subpoena while the case proceeds. i'm joined by jill wine banks. great to have you. >> great to be wa you. >> a lot of people were surprised by the judge issuing this ruling. >> i'm not surprised at all. we had a lot of expedited hearings from watergate and how quickly we got things done. we asked to give the information it is to house judiciary on march 1st and march 26th, they had it. >> that are had gone through the whole process? >> only up to the court of appeals and not all the way to the supreme court. we issued a subpoena for all the tapes for the trial and on july 26th, the court rule and the tapes were released and about nine days later, the president
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resigned. >> that was about two or two and a half months. the courts can expedite if they want to and clearly my take away is the judges understand this is high stakes stuff and there has to be resolution of what is now a stalemate between the two branchs. >> right now donald trump is effective lly eviscerating congress and congress has to act. i really think although i have been cautious in saying we need fact finding, people need to be educate and have the public know what's going on. we need to see live witnesses, not hear transcripts or have somebody summarizing it, but we are getting to a point that the stonewalling is way beyond the mueller report. the stonewalling that you mentioned including immigration and included every possible thing. you can't have witnesses and you can't have information about security clearances that were
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improper in the white house. that's the stonewalling that richard nixon would not have thought of. . >> you have to comply with the subpoena and they will appeal and probably be stayed and might go all the way to the supreme court. what strikes me is people say we are in a constitutional crisis. we have a battle between articles one and two, right? the third branch of government is eventually going to be who resolves it. if the president ignores that, that strikes me as a crisis. >> the total end is if he sits in the white house, looks the doors and said that's it. we're done. >> there was a moment when the judge, when the supreme court orders nixon to hand over the tapes. there was an open question about whether they will comply. >> my memoire will include that fear of who will go into the
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white house and get them. >> you and which army? >> they have guns and guards and the army and secret service. are we going to send in the u.s. marshal? they work for him, too. i have to say in retrospect, we were never as seriously worried that the president wouldn't comply. michael cohen warned us he's not going to go quietly into the night if he loses the election. now we have serious reason to worry that he will not comply. that would be a constitutional crisis. >> do you anticipate this case will be consolidated? whatever happens with this case will be determinative of all of them. there is a burnch of subpoenas. >> i don't want to under state how much of a constitutional crisis there is right now because this is on the road to the ultimate implosion and showdown. i think that there are now a
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number of congressional committees working and we even have unbelievably, some bipartisan support where you have requests. there is a way, but i think yes, these committees will start to work together. some need the immigration information and some neat security clearance information and what happened to under mine our election. part one of the mueller report. everybody is focusing on part two. >> jill wine banks, it's great to be here. >> self proclaimed tariff man and trade war with china and repercussions for the rest of us. next. and repercussions for the rest of us next
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welcome back. i want to clarify something we were talking about. a politico news story about the president instructing william barr to investigate biden. it was an interview where he said it would be appropriate in the conditional sense were he to discuss the biden probe with barr. there is some reporting that perhaps he has already. i want to make sure he got that precise. as of one minute past midnight, the united states raised tariffs on chinese goods, escalating a trade war between the two nations. donald trump sent out a borage of tweets about trade, but talks ended without an agreement. it's unclear what's going happen next. both sides are unable to back down. here is felix salmon from axios. i have been confused by the whole thing. if always feels like the
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apocalypse is around the corner. doom and gloom and wall street willa trade down on stocks because the trade war is coming. >> today is the beginning of the trade war. think of this as day one of the government shut down. the worst happened and now the question is, is this a new permanent state of affairs or is this one side or the other backing down and just going to be here for however many days or weeks? >> that's useful. that's clarifying. the united states slapped $200 billion of tariffs on china. do we expect them to announce those? >> yes. they will be retaliating and they will attack things like american farmers and any manufactured goods that come from red states and powerful members of the republican congress. but they have done that and it's hard to say how much more they can do. they might look at other
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non-tariff options as well. no one want this is. the chinese don't want this and the americans don't want this. this was just partly a problem with donald trump's own making that when he was complaining about the fed keeping interest rates too high. the chinese took that and understand that too mean he was worried the economy was weak and he was in a weaken saed positio and everything blew up. >> him bullying powell to keep rates low sent a message that meant he had a weak hand and strengthened their position in their mind. >> the consequence is that all of the chinese imports will be more expensive because they have a 25% tariff on them. that raises consumer prices that increases inflation that makes it harder for jay powell to cut interest rates. >> we have seen so far that it
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is at a lower level and there has been targeted real issues for farmers and farm exports. i guess the question is, how widespread do you anticipate seeing the effects of this? >> it's going to be everywhere. honestly it's largely invisible. there will be goods and services that will be more expensive and you are not going to be able to point at one specific thing particularly easily and say that's because of the tariffs. i now have to pay more for sneakers. one or two things you might be able to do that. for the farmers, it's very obvious. what they don't want is to just get a check for the soy beans they would have otherwise sent to china. they have the relationship with china and they sell soy to them every year for decades and they had a whole trading relationship there. getting a check this year or next year is not going to make up for the fact that they lost
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the relationship now and there is a good chance they will never get it back. if donald trump thinks he can pay off the farmers, i don't think he can. >> it's a crazy system and we have tariff subsidized and now we will cut a check to make up for the tariffs he imposed. >> we are borrowing that from the chinese. >> in part. i want to read this. this was an article published all over state media. if you want to talk, we can talk. if you want to fight, we can fight. chinese people are unafraid of confrontati confrontation. we afraid to fight back. it does seem like a chi shay, but it's a game of chicken. the cars crashing is the worst for both economies, but it's important to each to not knuckle under. >> donald trump is the only president that i can remember who could credibly threaten this
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kind of tariff on chinese goods. now other president would destroy domestic sdrindustry. president trump loves tariffs and he can threaten this credibly. that put him in a strong position. now it's like he's gone and pulled the trigger and has nothing to show for it. >> that's a great point. felix salmon, thank you. that made me understand this better. >> thank you. >> the fight against white nationalism in america. we will talk to a neonazi trying to break the cycle of hate. tonight's thing one, thing two, next. tonight's thing one, thing two, next living with hiv? ♪ keep being you. keep loving. keep aspiring. keep striving. and ask your doctor about biktarvy.
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thing one tonight, donald trump might fancy himself an athlete, but he's not much of a sports guy. this was evidence the when the white house welcomed the boston red socks. he admired tiger woods or vladimir putin. a 66-year-old president of russia and hockey phenom playing in an exhibition game in sochi. putin is number 11 on the legends team. the other team, when you go against putin, no one wants to get themselves dragged out and putin managed to put the biscuit in the basket about eight times,
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a hat trick of hat tricks. if you are on defense and putin has the puck, you have serious life choices to make. the president took a victory lap around the rink and down he went. not even putin can ice skate on a red carpet. someone will pay for that. try playing golf with donald trump. that's thing two in 60 seconds. s calling all sunscreen haters. you're gonna love this.
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was out of the country meetinging with in singapore. trump was playing a round and spotted the guy who won the championship, a businessman named ted virtue. kind of funny. he drives his cart over and said congrats on winning the club championship but you didn't really win it because i was out of town. trump is dead serious. we are going to play the last six holes for the championship. ted said i'm playing with my son, but thanks anyway. he said it's okay, your son can play, too. both ted and his son hit the ball on the green and trump hits his in the water. trump is lining up the son's ball only now it's his ball and the caddy switched it. the son is like that's my ball. the caddy said no, this is the president's ball. your ball went in the water, the son stopped arguing about it. it's like playing defense against putin. it's not worth it. that's how the man stole a rinky dink championship title.
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bye dennis quaid! when insurance is affordable, it's surprisingly painless. the most radical antiabortion bill in the country is making its way through the alabama state legislature. we showed you the chaos that erupted in the state senate that debated the bill. >> all those in favor say aye. any opposed? motion passes.
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>> whoa, whoa, whoa. there was no motion! there was no motion. >> he made a motion. >> he didn't make a motion. he did not make a motion! he did not make a motion! there was no motion from the other side. >> he made a motion. >> heck no. he didn't even make a motion! >> what you are seeing, democrats were objecting to an effort by the all male senate republicans to ram through an amendment removing exceptions for women who are victims of rain or incest from the already extreme ban. that would make it a crime for doctors to perform abortions with 99 years in prison. they signed a law by alabama's republican governor. the same lawmaker is pushing that bill proposed another that make it a felony to falsely accuse someone of rain or assault. it targets false allegations that are malicious and it's a crime to file a false report.
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if the accused were proven innocent, the person making the allegations can be responsible for paying the accused's legal fees. the fast major of assaults and rains never get reported at all. only 23% are reported to police a and .5% lead to felony convictions. the whole nation watched kr eed christine blasey ford watch why she didn't report as a teenager. >> brett's assault on me affected my life. i was too ashame and afraid. i didn't want to tell my parents that i at age 15 was in a house without parents present drinking beer with boys. i convinced myself that because brett did not rain me, i should
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just move on and pretend it doesn't happen. >> she did come forward. the man was confirmed in the supreme court anyway. now he can be the deciding vote to the constitutionality of bills like this one out of alabama and overturn women's right to make their own decisions about what happens to their bodies. you wouldn't accept an incomplete job from any one else. why accept it from your allergy pills? flonase sensimist relieves all your worst symptoms, including nasal congestion, which most pills don't. and all from a gentle mist
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a 19-year-old suspect in the synagogue shooting in poway, california, that killed one person and injured three others last month now faces more than 100 civil rights and hate crime charges. it appears that he, like the mosque shooter in christchurch new zealand and the tree of life synagogue shooter in pittsburgh were radicalized online. there is a sub culture of white supremacists and kneeneo nazis find themselves immersed in a
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violent ideology. christian picalini has made it his mission to help them escape that life. he's noticed other patterns and he's trying to help. >> i've been working with extremists for nearly 20 years. in that time i've noticed a behavior pattern i call cult hopping. it's when vulnerable people are so desperate to find a sense of identity or purpose that they jump from one extreme group to another. ideology isn't as important as the desire to belong. >> christian's efforts to divert young white supremacists from this path are documented in a se series called "breaking hate". joining me now is christian who is devoted to helping them exit -- he's also the author of "white american youth". good to have you here. i thought that was interesting insight that the way the people find themselves into these sub
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cultures isn't necessarily seeking out the ideology of the sub culture, but seeking out a group that makes them feel like they belong. >> nobody is born a hater, so we all seek identity, community and purpose in life. those are the three pillars that allow us to make every decision that we make. and as young marginalized people are looking for a purpose, if they can't find it, if they have what i call potholes, the traumas in life that they bump into, whether it's poverty or abuse or mental illness or it could be a million things, those lead them to the fringes where they find these narratives and there are people waiting for them. >> you were active in a white supremacist group. you broke away and you've done this work for 15 years. how much is the phenomenon of people finding these sorts of ideologies through, say, like, hate chan and different websites? how recent is that? how much have things changed over time? >> the advent of the internet
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changed the ball game. it made it a 24 hour hate buffet. i had to be handed a pamphlet in an alley. that doesn't have to happen anymore. young people can be on a message board and start laughing at some of these memes and get desensitized by them and then they're sent to these other places where it ramps up a little bit more and where they're told certain words and if they don't react in a certain way, if they use the "n" word, recruiters are keyed in on whether they can take them a little bit further if they start to laugh at those jokes. >> so there is this slow process of boundary pushing with people. >> yeah. and they know they're not going to recruit everybody, so they cast a wide net. they look for the ones that laugh back at the anti-semitic jokes or who aren't phased by them and then they tighten it up. >> it seems the case of some of what's happening here is not even some active recruiter. it's almost like this horrible
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dark orr ganism of no one is there, i'm here from this nazi group. >> but somebody is putting that out there. so much this is coming from eastern europe and russia. so many ever these troll farms are putting out prop began daag. russia has been known to do this since 1903 when they put out the fraudulent book of protocols of the elders of zion. this is a tactic of theirs. they're trying to sew seeds of discord. >> this sort of -- i saw this clip i want to play which is that people go to train outside the united states is fairly common. take a listen. >> he's crying and i said what is going on? he said chris, you're not even going to believe this. he bought a one-way ticket. he had a fake passport. he bought a fake passport from ireland, $500 it cost him
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because he thought his u.s. passport may fail. he arranged for a hostel in kiev. he flushed the money into his account and out the same day. i never saw it. >> tell me more about this. what was that source? >> this is the family of a young man who was a white supremacist. he got involved in a white nationalist group. very dangerous group. it's responsible for five murders in just the last two years alone. while he was never violent, he was very close to some of these people and he was -- his family not only lost him to this extremist ideology but also to an extremist bullet. he was murdered by one of his comrades who ended up going from a neonazi to an isis supporter and that's what cult hopping is. >> oh, really? >> yeah. >> whoa. what was he doing training in ukraine? >> well, he didn't actually make it
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