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tv   AM Joy  MSNBC  June 23, 2019 7:00am-9:00am PDT

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there is human ingenuity. ♪ ♪ every day, comcast business is helping businesses go beyond the expected, to do the extraordinary. take your business beyond. that does it for me. thank you very much for watching. "am joy" with joy reid starts right now. we are seeing sick children. we are seeing dirty children. we are seeing hungry children. we're seeing children who have been separated from their parents and other family members. children within the facility are being separated from their siblings, which they need to be with their siblings right now. our children are telling us there have been over 300 children in a single room. if that's true, which it appears to be, then literally the united states is warehousing children in a lord of the flies scenario. >> good morning and welcome to "am joy" and happy sunday
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morning. for many american sunday morning means going to church if they happen to be christian or heading to brunch with friends or family or watching a bit of tv or maybe doing lawnry or preparing for the workweek. but on this sunday morning in donald trump's america what you just saw, what you just heard are how migrant children are spending their sunday morning at our southern border. in america in 2019 little kids even babies are being separated from their families by the federal government and forced to live in unsanitary conditions, disgusting, cruel conditions. also trump can keep a campaign promise to the anti-immigration core of his base. according to the associated press attorneys who interviewed 60 did at a facility in alpaso, texas, say the children are being neglected. they say children are taking care of other children and there's inadequate food, water and sanitation for the 2250
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infants, children and teens at the border patrol station. according to "the new york times" a border station in clint, texas, appears to be even worse. a lawyer who visited the facility says, quote, there is a stench. the lawyer goes onto say the overwhelming majority of children have not bathed since they crossed the border. so welcome to donald trump's america. where migrants, refugees -- refugee children are not only not being cared for, they're being treated as less than human. and that's not even the only shocking story that we have to cover on this show this morning. in our next hour we will discuss the 16th woman accusing donald trump of sexual assault or harassment or misconduct, which in any other presidency would be potentially career ending for the president. in this hour we'll discuss the president ordering military strikes on iran only to take it back. again, in any other presidency sham balk. and this sunday morning i.c.e.
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raids were supposed to begin happening. they were supposed to begin happening right now in cities across the country ordered by donald trump and targeting up to 2,000 families. trump announced his plan to deport millions of brown people just to satiate his base, and let's face it to help his re-election bid. he noannouncet at a recent rall. however, he took it back saying he's delaying the raids. trump claims to be the world's greatest fireman, same as every day. meanwhile, two department of homeland security officials tell nbc news the i.c.e. raids were actually called off for two reasons. one because details of the raid plan were leaked to the media, and two because i.c.e. didn't have a plan for detaining 2,000 immigrants, mainly families who they were going to arrest and deport. former hudd secretary and presidential candidate julian castro had this reaction to
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trump's supposed delay. >> he said today at the last minute he called off i.c.e. raids across the country. this is bull [ bleep ]. this is his bull [ bleep ] politics. people need to see through that and understand that this guy a political con man. >> joining me now is the author of "dear america, notes of an undocumented citizen." maria theresa kumar. jose, i want to go to you first. i read two stories this week that were so disturbing to me. i want to read a little piece of one of them to you this morning. this is from "the new york times." no soap and overcrowding at a detention center for migrant children. here's the clip, when we encountered the baby and her mom, the baby was filthy. they couldn't give her any water to wash her, and took a kleenex and washed around her neck black dirt said hope fry who was leading the group adding not little stuff, dirt.
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another quick quip from the huffington post. four toddlers were so severely ill and neglected lawyers forced the government to hospitalize them last week. the children all under age 3 with teenage mothers or guardians were feverish, coughing, vomiting or had diarrhea. some of the toddlers and infants were refusing to eat or drink. one 2-year-old's eyes were rolled back in her head and she was completely unresponsive or limp according to a former florida based attorney. your thoughts on the way the united states government is treating children. >> unconscionable, just flat out wrong. in american history we know this is what we've done. this is happening in 2019 and happening now is just flat out
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wrong. it's hard. joy, we text about these. it's hard to read these details. it's hard to watch any of the footage and what's happening but i think we have to face it because we can't change something we can't face. and i think everything that's happening right now, we have to face exactly what we're doing to families and exactly what we're doing to children. >> absolutely. and it's true and i'm glad to have you all on, some of whom i do text feverishly about this stuff. but aren't there international conventions that govern the treatment of refugees to which the united states is a sigatory? it is shocking to me seemingly no one with do anything. there's a sort of learned helplessness happening, where we read these details, sickened by them and everybody go goes what are we going to do, it's donald trump. we ring our necks and hands and basically go back to watching tv or way of life and it's interesting the u.n. has
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officially declared the united states is violating the rights of children last year let alone the information we're getting. last year, you joined us at the first internment camp of children. we were able to shut that place down because there were protests. what does this president not like, he doesn't like bad publicity, being seen as cruel. we have to take to the streets and make sure we are present, being accounted for. this new sweep he decided he was going to do 2,000 families, these are all sanctuary cities. he was going to go to sanctuary cities because it's a political ploy. this is not about the safety of america but his re-election. and the way we win, the way we make sure this stuff stops happening is we take it to the streets, say we're onto you, vote our hearts out and then we have consequences. because what is happening on our watch is not only cruel, not only unusual but sends a resounding message to the rest of the world they can treat their ethnic minorities however
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they please because we're not doing at best fulfilling the american dream of making sure we do welcome, that we are a continuous beacon of opportunity in this land. and i have to say i've walked to those shelters, i've seen those families. this is -- as a mother it hurts my heart. as an american, it enrages me. but as a american citizen we know better because we actually crafted the rules of asylum and told the world how to be better when it comes to this. zp i still remember those faces of little kids. they didn't know why we were there. they didn't know what we were there for, but that facility, the guy who ran it didn't like the idea. he said this is a dumb policy. there's a sense, michael, in which donald trump taints everyone around him and they have to sign-on to his moral code. i want to play for you and most of the political appointees were accustomed to him debasing themselves for him. here is a career official.
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this is the ninth circuit court of appeals, this is career lawyer at the department of justice over the conditions these kids are in. take a listen. >> it's within everybody's common understanding if you don't have the toothbrush, you don't have soap, a blanket, it's not safe and sound. wouldn't everybody agree to that? do you agree with that? >> well, i think it's -- i think those are -- there's fair reason to find why those things may be part -- >> what do you say maybe? there are circumstances when a person doesn't need to have a toothbrush, toothpaste and soap for days? >> well, i think in cbp custody it's frequent for shorter-terms. >> i don't think that's the
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situation the court was confronting. those people were there for 12 hours and then they moved onto a hilton hotel. no, they were there for a fairly sustained period and at least according to the evidence the judge believed they weren't getting these things for a very sustained period. >> how does anyone sleep at night supporting this policy in the republican party? >> you know, she sounded stupid, and you could tell that she was caught between probably what her conscience was telling her was right and what her obligations under, you know, the trump justice department required her to say in front of those judges. when you're asked the question, you mean there are circumstances of which a person does not need soap or toothpaste or anything to care for themselves for a period of her time, her response was, well, they're only supposed to be there for 12 hours. if they're there for 12 hours, you don't need that.
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that again speaks volumes how they're looking at these individuals. they don't see them as human beings. they don't see them as individuals who are in a particular circumstance for whatever legal reasons they're in those circumstances. and beyond that that, that they have other needs and concerns that the government in taking on this commitment, making itself obligated to these individuals by arresting them would provide them with the basic accommodations they need in their custody and care. whether it was for one hour or 100 days. there is no difference. i mean, if i wind up at a detention center and i've been on, you know, walking and traveling for 70 days to get there, you arrest me, yeah, give me a damn toothbrush. it's not going to break your bank. >> these are kids. >> how do we get people to see them, then? you yourself face this fear every day. how do we get people on the other side who think we don't care? their parents brought them here
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to who cares or is it even worth trying? >> i think it's, well, here's to me the question. in addition to going on the streets and of course volting your conscience, the question now is what are american citizens willing to risk? like what are you doing with your privilege? if you see someone getting arrested in front of you, ifiosee someone, you're riding on a bus, on a train, they ask for papers, what are you going to do? are you going to protect people on the bus in the train who can't show their papers because they don't have any? a couple of days ago, living in the building where i grew up, the building manager was asking me what do we do when i.c.e. shows up, jose? i live here, this is my home. my cousin before trump made this announcement, my cousin member was saying hey do you want to come over to my home if you don't feel safe in your home? i called her and said this is my
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home. i have a right to feel safe in my home. to all the undocumented people watching, we cannot allow ourselves to be terrorized. we cannot do that. we have to live our lives the best and as full as we can. we cannot live in fear, and we have to remember that we actually have rights. last night actually before going on the show i was reading the constitution. you know, i love the constitution. the 14th amendment, right, section 1, third clause, due protection, due process and equal protection. i am actually as a person protected by the constitution. we have rights. and so all the american citizens who are actually citizens of this country i think the question is you have to figure out how are you going to be a sanctuary to people. what are you going to risk and what are you willing to do? >> we have elected hundreds of people whose job it is to be to govern this country. why is everyone paralyzed and
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saying, well, we're going to consider some legislation. who is going to stop this? >> i think congress needs to step up. we voted them in, and they have to take action. i have to share with you from a wholly calculating political lens, the reason why we were able to bring back white suburban women to the party last fall we talked about health care and made sure they were aware of family separation. and as a mother most women said not on my watch, this is not okay. and we have to make sure as jose said, let's be kind to each other. right before the president announced he was going to stop his family separation 2.0, i started looking around and i would ask most waiters, folks walking how are you, and there's such deep sadness because they came here to contribute to this country. they work every single day and they contribute to give their family just a shot. they are our history, our story.
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and when people are saying these individuals came here undumed, well, they came here with a wink and nod because industry business has been part and complicit in this. and there's not american not complicit when it comes to undocumented labor. they take care of your kids, they're the ones that basically pick your food. we are all complicit and as a result we have to stand together to make sure we're being fair and just, make sure people get due process. and when he says he's going to target two families he's talking about american kids. >> michael, this week donald trump lied to my colleague who asked him about this policy and lied that he inherited the separation policy from president obama and that he ended it, which is just a blatant flat out lie. right, you have members of congress saying the bible doesn't say we're supposed to care for the poor.
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i mean, you actually have a sense of just moral disconnections. honestly in your party that i don't understand, and i need your help. used to be chief of staff for the president is now on the board of the detention facility so he can make money off this policy. people are profiting off this policy that has the clothes taken off babies -- >> anyone who's quoting a bible that says they're not supposed to care for the poor, that should tell you everything about them and the bible that they're reading. so, look, the fact of the matter is i think the theme that comes from this conversation today as i hear it and as i hope americans are hearing this, it's one about auns knss. there are consequences for actions, consequences for decisions.
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and right now we have an administration for the last two years beyond this issue, joy, or many issues you have covered in detail on your show, there are no consequences for them. so at some point we as american citizens have to help our government account up and down the line for the decisions and actions they take. and we too as citizens have to account for that. and when we see, and it's not a question of oh, maybe this is happening, this is clearly documented abuse. it's clearly documented mistreatment. it's clearly documented inhumanity to fellow human beings that's going on in these centers. and we as citizens need to account for that. >> yes, indeed. jose antonio vargas, michael steele, thank you, friends. really appreciate you guys. thank you so much. and meanwhile just to put this in perspective for you viewers out there journalist and novelist michael scott moore who was abducted by somali pirates
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in 2012 tweeted this. somali pirates gave me toothpaste and soap. coming up the truth behind trump's iran bluff. that's next. h behind trump's iran bluff that's next. introducing the first of its kind lexus ux and ux f sport, also available in hybrid all-wheel drive. lease the 2019 ux 200 for $329/month for 36 months. experience amazing at your lexus dealer. shaving has been difficult for me. i have very sensitive skin, and i get ingrowing hairs. oh i love it. it's a great razor. it has that 'fence' in the middle. it gives a nice smooth shave.
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who else could he be? there is the moment. beyond technology... there is human ingenuity. ♪ ♪ every day, comcast business is helping businesses go beyond the expected, to do the extraordinary. take your business beyond. neither iran nor any other hostile actor should mistake
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u.s. prudence and discretion for weakness. no one has granted them a hunting license in the middle east. >> it should not be surprising that is how national security advisor john bolton is talking. tensions promped i should add by the trump administration tearing up the iran nuclear deal negotiated by president obama and signed onto by our national allies. while military strikes against iran in retaliation for shooting down a u.s. drone and alleged iranian attacks on oil tankers have been called off for now, "the new york times" reports iu.s. did caro ought cyber attacks. they happened the same day trump called off the military strikes. i said in the break i'm going to let you talk on this because i will just rant because i know
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you and i both agreed back during the iraq war days on what a deb occul and disaster and what a horrible idea that was. and you remember while that was happening, people like john bolton were saying let's go onto iran, and now he has power. >> he has power. you saw in that clip in saying nobody's revoked their hunting license. temporarily trump revoked the hunting license which a good thing. some on the left and right are saying, well, donald trump doesn't want war and people around them. and trump told an aide these people are disgusting, hold up who appointed all the disgusting people to secretary of state mike pompeo, national security advisor john bolton. by the way, on pence, by the way apparently pence egged him onto attack and when he pulled back pence defended him internally. so pence is both a reckless hawk and cowardly sycophant.
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they're all baying for blood in the middle east. we've had a temporary reprieve, but this all came about as trump tore up the iran deal. those who warned him not to do that, they all said the alternative to this is war, and the republicans said you're being alarmist. the alternative is the maximum pressure deal. >> can i put the time line up because people need to understand the time line. let's go with the time line here. may 8th trump announces he's getting out of the iran nuclear deal because obama was involved in it. april 8th trump announces the designation as foreign terrorist organization, and by the next may, by one year john bolton announces aircraft carrier strike groups in the middle east. it doesn't take long from tearing up the iran deal, and the next thing i want to ask you about is then immediately blaming iran for these attacks on the military, and trump
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normally doesn't believe anything -- when the deep state says that is iran, who told him iran? at this point it's not clear you can believe -- >> a couple of things the japanese government who owned the tanker said we don't buy this. i that you are retaliate against your own interest, another country saying we'll deal with it our way. a few months ago john bolton says an attack on any saudi attacker is an attack on all citizens. a war in iran would make a war with iran look like a walk in the park. he says there's lot of hawks. and then he says all i want is no nuclear weapon in iran. there is no nuclear weapon in iran, and there was a deal to prevent that.
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trump egged on by bolton and because he hates president barack obama undid that dealmature issue is we have to take a step back and say what is the justification for war, what would a war look like, does iran pose a threat to the united states, and then crow see democrats are coming we must come to congress to get permission, so your objection to potentially going into world war 3 cannot be procedural. you have to think and say elizabeth warren has said that, bernie sanders has said that. there can be no war. >> number one saying you must come to congress, make me. would they not have been able to make him get hope hicks come before the cameras, but somehow they're going to make him and please go a bit deeper into this notion that a war in iran of what it would mean, because when the u.s. invaded iraq, i've never been there and you can look at logically and say it was going to be a disaster. please explain.
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>> it was a disaster with a useless president george w. bush who at least surrounded himself with people that looked competent. he wants to do a war, donald trump who can't handle things at the boarder as you've just seen. kids with tath brushes want to handle a war with iran. ten times as many men on their amarms and uniforms. this is military that america wants to fight alone. there's no allies here. this idea of the u.k., it's madness. every general in fact we believe it's the chairman of the joint chief of staff. >> why does saudi arabia, israel, why are they egging us onto do this? >> they claim it's a proxy war. there's a lot of proxy wars in the middle east, and the problem is the united states getting
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dragged in to fight on behalf of saudi arabia or israel or the united arab emirates. the iran-iraq war, the hostage crisis, there are a lot of grievances. there's a lot of history we don't talk about. and then you have trump on "meet the press" saying i don't want to a have a nuclear weapon. and i wish chuck had asked him did you read the nuclear deal, barack obama, the black dude signed it. >> thank you very much for being here. you're going to be my sanity block. somebody else has to besides me. and coming up joe biden keeps trying to explain and explain his comments about the good old days when a white male senator could break bread are other white male senators who happen to be segregationists and get great stuff done for america. that's next. t great stuff done r america. that's next. this is the story of john smith.
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we have a little breaking news to report. just when we thought we had all the democratic candidates for 2020 that we could possibly stand, a new face has emerged. okay, well not exactly a new face. this morning former pennsylvania congressman joe sestak through his hat into the race.
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he says he wants to, quote, serve the american people the way they want to serve. now we have two dozen like roses. up next, the rest of the democratic field, all 23 of them and the role of the race -- the role of race in the race. e race role of race in the race ssie st. first, get your choice of soup or salad. then choose an entrée like our center-cut sirloin. add not one, but two amazing sides. and top it off with dessert. this aussie abundance starts at just $14.99. hurry in now! instate-of-the-artn technology makes it brilliant. the visionary lexus nx. lease the 2019 nx 300 for $359/month for 36 months. experience amazing at your lexus dealer.
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of power by the executive, zero. >> at a new york city fund-raiser last night biden touted his experience with working with two segregationist southern senators as an example of his civility. >> he said it's not the model how we make america a safe and inclusive place for black people and for everyone. and frankly i'm disappointed he hasn't issued an immediate apology for the pain his comments are dredging up. >> cory booker is asking for you to apologize. >> there's not a racist bone in my body. >> i've said my piece. >> to the extent that anybody thought that i meant something different, that is not what i intended. >> it has been quite a week for joe biden to say the least. practically every 2020 democrat running for president zeroed in
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on the former vice president after he refused to apologize for citing his work with segregationists in the senate as an example of his political civility. joining me now is tiffany cross, steve philips, and tim wise. this week it has struck me that the same things that made joe biden useful to president obama when barack obama was running as the first black presidential candidate that had a chance at really winning is that he needed validation, and the people he needed to be validated by are not liberal white americans but a little more conservative, people who may have been archie bunkeringish in the '70s. that guy who was a former cop, that guy needed to know biden was okay. so those things are now the things that are hurting him. >> i'm not entirely sure it's
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hurting him. i think it's possible biden dough knows what he's doing and he's trying to appeal to a particular subset of older democratic primary voters who may not have a similar sensibilities to much of the democratic party's black constituency. look, this is something the democratic party has dealt with for a long time that the bargain that bought the beginning of social democracy to the united states in the 1940s was fdr working with dixie crafts. it's one thing to say look if we don't work with these segregationists we don't get social security. what did biden get working with eastland and tomlij it was worth working with these people who believe these things about black people? >> and the thing so strong about it was he didn't say i worked with strong thurman across the
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aisle. but he's talking about two democrats, so to adam's point you're not talking about bipartisanship. you're literally just talking about civility with segregationists. >> i totally take your point, but i would argue it actually is hurting him because when you try to appeal to those middle of the road people, to some of those more conservative democrats, you do run the risk of alienating your base. nobody's trying to make the argument joe biden is a racist. that's not it. and i think to trivialize it to that is very reductionist. it's really as people of color view this, it's nerve-wracking because we for see these people will not work with you. even barack obama had to learn that lesson. mitch mcconnell is not going to work with you so anytime your message is we should extend a hand to these segregationists,
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it's never worked like that. i think that's what a lot of the base wants to see, someone who's going to come and fight with this administration. and it doesn't end. we act like when donald trump leaves office then all these things will get rolled back. they have have to be rolled out root and stem. if there's a democrat in the white house, some of our new friends are going to become some of our old friends. and when you introduce this argument of, hey, guys, i can work with people who hate people who look like you, that doesn't endear too many people who look like me to your side of the table. >> what strikes me is joe biden is obviously beloved and a lot of his standing in the polls is because of black people, older black people in particular. when we were down at the clyburn fish fry it was pretty remarkable older black people like joe biden. in '88 he was running against jessie jackson.
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he was a pretty conservativish democrat, and that is now being revealed through this run for president, things people might not have been been aware of. is there an extent it could end up retusing this kind of reverence people have for him while not necessarily gaining him white voters many of whom are republican? >> there's a real danger that by the premise biden's campaign is that he has one very famous black friend and that if you look at his whole record we run the risk of not inspiring and mobilizing black voters. and that this notion we lost in 2016 because we lost white voters is overridden by the numbers that show it was the decline in the black vote, uninspired, unenthused. so that's what we're going to have to come to terms with. and this is also a person also he served with obama he still will not apologize for his handling of aneaty hill.
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he did not come and support stacey abrams in her primary when she had a difficult challenge and still will not apologize for his offensive use of the word "boy" yesterday. that's now how you inspire and galvanize and mobilize the black vote that's critical to win. >> let me give the senator, former vice president biden a chance for his story. this was the interview he did yesterday in south carolina. take a listen. >> i do understand the consequence of the word "boy." but it wasn't said in any of that context at all. >> but you understood they would never call me son, they would never call me boy. >> no, but they called teddy kennedy boy. that was a distinction. the reason we called me senator was to demean me more -- i mean, son because he said i'm not even qualified to be in the senate, i'm not old enough. and to the extent that anybody thought i meant something different, that is not what i
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intended. >> i had a source tell me that knows biden a little bit and said he's told that story before, but that he's told it different ways and one of the ways he's told that story is eastland never called me senator, he's always called me son as a way of what he was explaining to reverend al sharpton, he refused to use the honorific senator with him, he just used son. it's weird he flipped it to boy in his telling of the story at that fund-raiser. what do you make of all this, tim? >> i think what joe biden cannot understand is you cannot defeat nostalgia with your own version of nostalgia. we know what that's about, it's pretty blatant. but white democrats like joe biden clearly have their own version of that. this nustalgic reverence for
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smoke filled back rooms. you cannot defeat reactionary nosubstantialia with this pseudo liberal nosubstantialia but every time in history that compromise has been reached between white supposed liberals and white racists, you know who loses, after you see compromise after something, black folks are the ones being compromised. there's no question that the programs of the new deal and fdr were excellent for white working people, but for the vast majority of let's say the next 20 years people of color were basically exclude from those programs because of the need to compromise with white segregationist democrats. it doesn't mean those programs were bad, but if we're trying to move forward in this country using nostalgia and looking backward is not going to inspire that new america and new american electorate. you do it with a forward looking
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politic not a backward looking politic. >> the compromises of the new deal era and the linden johnson era were between white men of varying different philosophies, but they were all white men of var similar ages and background, et cetera. they needed to fight civil rights -- i mean get civil rights legislation passed, the new deal. all that was passing with democrats alone with a right wing southern democratic contingent that was the one saying no. so is the nostalgia that joe biden is harkening back to off-key because now the house and senate are not all white men? now that the compromise and the cajoling is between people of different races, ages, generations and genders? >> yeah, i think there is an extent to which this understanding of civility is nostalgia for the period where the only people are white men and now there are people in the room directly affected by the
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things people in power are negotiating and that changes the tone and tenor. but civility isn't essential for democracy. nonviolence is essential for democracy. but civility, that's optional. sometimes it helps and sometimes it doesn't. this idea that, you know, we could go back to when things were civil, when things were civil it's because people like us weren't in the room at all. >> by the way if joe biden is a nominee democrats are going to support him. everyone is going to support him and in the polls he shows he can do well against donald trump. but i think as you said getting people to win or getting people to line up like they did for barack obama might be a challenge. but the guy he'd have to compromise with is mitch mcconnell. he presents a quite southern in his demeanor, but he calls himself the grim reaper.
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i want to play what he had to say about himself on reparations. some of the harms are ongoing, economic, and this reparations debate is about that. here's what mitch mcconnell had to say about that. >> i don't think reparations for something that happened 150 years ago for whom none of us are currently living or responsible is a good idea. we've, you know, tried to deal with our original sin of slivery by fighting a civil war, bypassing landmark civil rights legislation. we've elected an african-american president. i think we're always a work in progress in this country. but no one currently alive was responsible for that. >> here's the response at the reparations hearing this week. >> we grant that mr. mcconnell was not alive for -- but he was
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alive for the electrocution for george stinny, alive for the blienlding of woodward. was alive to witness autocracy in his native alabama and a regime premised on electoral theft. majority leader mcconnell cited civil rights legislation yesterday as well he should because he was alive to witness the harassment, jailing and betrayal of those responsible for that legislation by a government sworn to protect them. he was alive for the red lining of chicago and the looting of black home owners of some $4 billion. victims of that plunder are very much alive today. i am sure they'd love a word with the majority leader. >> that was quite a read, but even in the democratic party, this conversation is difficult to have. most white americans are against it period full stop anyway. so there is this weird conversation we're having in the democratic party. >> i agree. first i have to say that he
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doesn't not like any kind of attention. he considers himself a journalist, and so i apologize to him in advance for saying but he is the james baldwin of our time, and his voice is so baldw time. he's so needed and he captures so many of us felt. it is a ridiculous argument. mitch mcconnell is the most ridiculous thing that he could have possibly say. it is all over. we are even. >> this is ridiculous. >> exactly. >> and the way he treated this president. >> yes. >> jonathan is trying to explain this to people who never gone through life with black skin and never been the descendants of people who are slaves. i am impacted from a system of white supremacy. it is not about what my position is but it is about what's owed.
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>> we built this joint for free. if i steal a billion dollars from a billionaire, they're not going to say oh you don't have to pay him back, the billionaire is fine. well, you owe him a million dollars. this whole argument, black people are doing fine, there is a clear line of impact and effect of slavery today. my mother was born at a time where she could not sit anywhere on the bus. her professional opportunities were limiting to her. my opportunities were limited. we didn't have wealth to pass down to generations. we were red lined and all things that could be traced back to slavery. this argument that reparations is old -- >> if barack obama is reparat n reparations -- it does not make any sense. talk about this republican
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party, dos the democrats who become the dnominee has to prepare to fight them and somehow goat the table to compromise. >> and so the fundamental calculus is do we have the majority support of this country. what obama's election showed, overwhelming people of color and the minority of progressive whites of whites who are progressives. that's the fundamental question. do we believe, there are enough white people in this country who'll actually support justice and equal ity of people of all races. i think obama's election shows that we have that majority. if you invest in that group, focus on that grouping, you will have the kind of voter and numbers and support and people in congress to be able to pass this type of policy. >> the other thing that happens
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was mayor pete buttigieg is rising quickly in the democratic field. i am going to give tiffany cross credit. we should look out for him and she was absolutely right. he left to go home and deal with the police shooting of an unarmed black civilian. he had some con frofrontation o protesters when he got back home. >> i do not have evidence. >> you are running for president and you expect people to vote for you? it is not going to happen. >> i am not asking for your vote. >> you ain't going to get it either. >> even progressive white americans are dealing with this and it is a struggle all the way
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around even inside the democratic party. >> it is. you know what i think that encounter and mayor pete inadequate response to what happen happen happened, i am sure he's a good guy. i am from the south and i spent all my life in the south. white progressives who are not southern come to their progressivism without having to go through race. if you are from the south and you are white and you end up on the left, i guarantee you, race is what you are thinking about. if you are a white progressive southerner, you know exactly how to talk about race. if you are a white progressive from the midwest and god love you or the specific northwest or california or the northeast, there is a decent chance you came to your politics through some other set of issues. that's fine, it means you are also uniquely unqualified to
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have a conversation around race. that's problematic for someone like pete who's trying to win a nomination in a party the base of which have been for some time of people of color. >> cruelty is the point be cease and desist becoming a catch phrase when ever some outrage the trump administration has done. when facing a party for which cruelty is the point. what kind of a democrat can actually adequately face that president head on? >> i absolutely have no idea. i decided to be honest, i don't know -- i know historically speaking, generally when moments like this happens, the opposition resolves the multi racial, tends to be less strong
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than those trying to restore an ideal version of the country. i am not sure if that's the case this time. it is clear there is a pretty strong antitrump majority in this country. who is best equipped to harness that? i could not begin to answer but it is there. >> it is harder being the party block party. that's one of the kind of core lessons of american democracy. >> that was true in 1865 and it is true now. >> 100% which ever party has the most different kinds of people in it struggles the most. the democratic party which is more like america at large is going to struggle. >> they have intellectual curiosity. you can go to a magna rally and build a wall. >> they're going to follow
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believers. >> democrats do tend to pick apart things because they have the capacity to do so. are you best equip to deal with this myriad of issues and pick apart. >> adam sewer and tiffany cross. thank you. >> e.j. carey will be here. don't go anywhere, more "am joy" after the break. after the break. shaving has been difficult for me. i have very sensitive skin, and i get ingrowing hairs.
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he shut the door behind us and through me against the wall. i could not believe i. i am laughing all the way in the room and i kept laughing. this is a situation if you laugh at a man or usually crushes his ego. >> good morning and welcome back to "am joy." the columnist became the 16th woman to accuse donald trump of inappropriate contact or sexually assault. in any other news car, ej carol
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story would have been the top as soon as they drop. s she's posing in the photo wearing the same dress that she says trump assaulted her in. they could not be anymore explic explicit. e. jean carol accused trump of the assault. trump denied not just the assault but he also denied having met e. jean carol. you can clearly see carol and her formal husband and donald trump and his first wife at the event. >> joining me now is e. jean
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carol who broke this silence. what do we need men for in modest proposal? >> thank you so much for being here. >> thank you joy for having me. >> it is quite brave of you to come forward with these allegations now. there are six women who accused donald trump of sexually assault including yourself and kristin anderson and jessica leeds and summer zervos and jill harth. you are the only one that's doing it while he's a sitting president. >> i had not thought about that until you just said it. >> yes. >> hopefully everyone on the show watches this regularly. if you can briefly explain what happened for those who may have not seen that interview.
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>> well, i had difficulty writing about this and i am a writer. talking about this is very difficult. you will have to bear with me. >> i apologize for having to ask. i understand that. >> i understand. so, i was leading the most wonderful department store on the face of the earth. they treat you like a queen. so i am leaving them and i see through the revolving door, i see this famous new york man. and donald trump was quite likable during the '80s and '90s. he was like full staff and fella well met and walking up and down the street, greeted everybody. he was like the king of new york. i saw him through the revolving door and he went like this to me and so i stopped. he said you are that advise lady
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and i said you are that real estate mogul. he says come with me, i have to buy a present. i said for who? just charmed. thought it would be just the most fun thing in the world to help donald trump get a present for a girl. i suggested a handbag and he was like -- and i suggested a hat. so we walked over. the hats and the handbags are to the left as you came through the revolving door and they're mixed in. he goes right for a fur hat. i thought and i said out loud, who's going to put a dead animal right on their head. later i found out all of his wives wore huge fur hats. so, he was holding the fur hat and i said how old is the young
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lady and he said how old are you? joy, i wish to god i had said, i will tell you how old i am if you show me your tax returns. of course, i didn't think of it at the time. so i just told him i am 52. oh my lord. oh, you are so old he said. and, apparently he's about my age. and, surely after that i don't remember if we talked much standing in the hats. shortly after that, he says lingerie or underwear. up the escalatoror we when. i am having just the best time. it is something to write about. it is something to have dinner. i am going to tell everybody. so we go to lingerie and this is in the evening and there were
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not many people at the store. when we got to lingerie there were nobody there. there was a counter to the left as you walk in and on the counter were these fancy lingerie boxes that they used to have back in the '90s. you remember the boxes. >> yes. >> they are charming. >> yes. there was a see-through body suit in lilac gray. he snatched it up. he said go try this on. that to me was so delicious. i said no, you try it on. >> he said no, looks like it holds it up and you are in shape. i backed up on that. he's holding up against me and i backup and i picked up one of the boxes and smacked him with it. he says let's go try it on.
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i used to be the writer at "saturday night live." the whole scene is becoming very comedian to me and very funny. donald trump telling me, a 52-year-old woman to put on some lingerie. what i think is this 52 years old woman wants to see donald trump put this on over his pants. >> right. >> he goes like this towards the dressing room. the odd thing is the dressing room door was opened. it is usually closed and locked. i walked in like an idiot. that was not a smart thing to do. and would you have done it? >> um -- i don't want to characterize it. in the moment who knows anyone would do? you are in the moment and this is a famous person, you are a writer and this is an experience so who knows? you did what you did.
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>> i walked in right in front of him and he shuts the door and bang me against the wall. >> so immediately upon walking into that dressing room, he attacked you? >> yes, right against the wall. i am just going to love kissing this guy. i was so surprised. >> did he say anything? >> no. >> did he try to get consent from you? >> no. i guess this is what he thought he could do. >> he thinks he's a celebrity that he can just kiss you. >> he can take what he wants. >> you allege sexually assault or rape occurred? >> i don't want to use that word. >> i prefer the word "fight." rape is a conclusion that what man has his way with me against my will. this was against my will. it hurts.
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i use the word "fight" because that was what i was doing the whole time. >> did you consider going to the police? >> no. i called my friend right afterwards and i was standing on fifth avenue. >> how did you get out of it? >> did he just leave? >> joy, to get away, it was a real struggle. >> yeah. >> i was wearing four inch heels which put me about 6'1". i was a competitive athlete. i am holding my handbag like this. the only reason i know i am holding my handbag because i discovered it in my hand when i got on the street. i had to stamp and stamp.
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he's big and he's leaning ger against me against the wall. we don't need to go into what happened. the stamp, that's what i call a fight. i got to the street and i don't know if i came down the escalator or the elevator. there were five elevators at berdorf's. i guessing the escalator. i got to the street and i called my friend. one of the first things she says was e. jean this is not funny. this is not funny. she said, "you got to go to the police, he raped you." i was of course was still laughing. >> why were you laughing? did you file hysterical? tell me what you were -- >> i think the adrenaline.
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i just think, it was my reaction. i just think you know i had started to laugh and i think the adrenaline gave me the strength to get out. >> yeah. >> why didn't you call the police? >> didn't have the guts or get assaulted again with a lot of questions at the time and new york police are great and so are the detectives best in the world. it was just too much at the time. i just gotten out alive. it was just too much. >> i am struck that donald trump made a big deal out of responding to the "access hollywood" tape which he bragged as a celebrity he can grab women by their genitals any time he
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wants. the roger stone campaign, women who accused clinton of sexually assault assaults. and he nominated a brett kavanaugh who was accused by a high school friend of sexually assault there. let's listen to that from this saturday, donald trump. okay, we'll have that in a moment. the idea that he has bragged about this and he did push juanita broderick out there. look at her. >> the president is gas lighting america about my accusation. he's distracting their attention by comparing himself to kavanaugh. >> let's play that. we do have that now. >> here is donald trump comparing himself to brett
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kavanaugh. >> people have to be careful because they're playing with dangerous territory. when they do that it is happening more and more. when you look at what's happening to brett kavanaugh and others, you can't do that for the sake of publicity. >> he supported roy moore, he compared himself to brett kavanaugh who got on the supreme court despite the credible allegations against him. clarence thomas sits on the supreme court. are we in a moment when a president of the united states can have 16 accusers including yourself and get away with it? >> well, americans tend to vote -- we would have two elections that are referendum that are on sexual assaults. bill clinton's election and donald trump's election. america voted him into office. we have got to change the
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culture. i like had it up to here with that stuff. just enough that we keep voting sexual sexual harassers into office. it is in comprehensible. >> if you had a chance. >> oh, he followed that. that's first time i have seen the tape. i stayed out of it. >> sure. >> apparently he made a threat after this. >> he's threaten to sue always. >> did he say that? >> i don't know if he's threatening that against you but we can find out. i would love to have you come back. >> my sister messaged me. i don't see him on tv. >> i apologize for making you watch him. i applaud you for coming forward. i think a lot of women see you as very brave to take this chance. your book and you talk about the men you had really terrifying
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encounters with. >> we'll talk about that offline. e. jean carol, thank you so much for being here. i really appreciate you being here. coming up we'll discuss of the children in fill thy filthy cam. so much to talk about for this administration for this president. we'll talk about that next. thank you very much. ent. we'll talk about that next thank you very much. hi. maria ramirez! mom! maria! maria ramirez... mcdonald's is committing 150 million dollars in tuition assistance, education, and career advising programs... prof: maria ramirez mom and dad: maria ramirez!!! to help more employees achieve their dreams.
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the united states is running concentration camps on our southern border and that is exactly what they are. they are concentration camps. >> with those comments, democratic congresswoman ocasio-cortez set up a fire storm. ocasio-cortez referring to the trump policy of children in these camps. children are suffering with rotting food and kids being kept in facilities they are referred to as dog pounds and the freezer. joining me now our e.j.
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dionne and miss pitzer. i am going to go to you first. these camps where babies and children are being housed can be called concentration camp. what's a concentration camp and can these camps be styled as such? >> what a concentration camp is mass detention of civilians without a trial usually on the bases of identity. race and ethnicity and religion and one of those factors. they're rounded up as a group and they're not trying anything criminal. in terms of a border camp when people look back at history and think of concentration camps, it tends to loom very large. i think a lot of people don't realize that the death camps of
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this singular historical phenomenon that we need to be aware of a single moment that can't be repeated. the nazis were in for tenn year. when you look at that system, about 40 years of things that were called concentration camps before the death camps ever existed, this stuff that we are doing on the border fits cleanly inside the tradition of the early concentration camps system. >> the people hear concentration camps and they think of nazi germany. george decay this week said that these camps they were in, at least they got to eat and go to the bathroom and no one served them spoiled food.
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he did not see the outrage over calling them such. i had people who lived through the experience of nazi germany and pulled me aside when a woman who was in her 90s pulled me aside and said we need to be careful about this. people are making that association. >> i think first of all, just comparing these to one of the worst moments in our history which is the detention camps of the japanese and in oklahoma where these migrants are being detained in these detentions, that's george bush turnpike a japanese detention camp. it is troubling that a lot of people out there don't want to speak up against the trump policies. they rather argue about the words aoc uses so it becomes a diversion from the issue they ought to be talking about and trying desperately to avoid. i am kind of on the view,
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concentration camp is a generic term that predates the nazis and was part of their system. i think probably we are better off to avoid using nazis-linked terms in general. it is a problem when people think you are comparing x to hitler. we should leave that to history until people start mass genocide. let's leave all of those analogies to the side. detention camp is bat enoud enor me. words don't matter compares to what our government is doing and that's what we have to talk wen
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celebra separated and we had a broken policy towards brown and black migrants for a long time. this president is unique. he's tauting and having rallies about whipping up crowds to chant and hoot about the idea of mass detention of families and taking children away from parents and leaving them to dirty floors and diapers. this is something he's using as a tool. no, i have not seen a president that do that run on whipping rally into a frenzy over the treatments of migrants. >> it is a political tool for donald trump. we saw in 2015 when he talked about mexicans being rapists and drug dealers. in the last three years, he notched it up. he's putting in policies that are horrendous that goes straight and directly into people of color and clearly these young children that are
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being -- many of them have die. multiple have died because of the conditions they are put in by this administration and even when he announced on monday of the raids that were going to go across the country in certain cities, the dhs, people within the dhs says he's doing this for political reasons. they're on the record saying that in the washington post. so this is all about -- this is what it is. the interesting thing of donald trump is he's not doing anything for the people who voted for him. there is a trump's tariffs and tax cuts and they're trying to take away healthcare for the people that put him into office. what he's saying to them is, guess what, these folks, these other people, i am going to dehumanize them and treat them badly and create policies that are inhumane. that's what he's doing and how he's seeing his reelection to suppress the vote and excites
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h base. it does not matter, it really does not. what's happening in our name is disgusting and disturb ing and that's what we should be talking about. >> i am going to underscore one thing. donald trump can't win unless the nation is deeply angry and divided. we had a lot of presidents who obviously played the bison politics one way or another. no one dependant on the decision v i vision as much as donald trump. he's using kids for that purpose. that should bother us as a nation. >> yeah, woodrow wilson, i don't think he ran for is the taoutin
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racism overtly. it is different that donald trump seems to do it now things like i am going to send all the migrants to your state, california, to punish you. and you have these stories, they are horrible. children as young as eight in "the new york times." many of them were in snots and tears and toddlers without pants and teenage mothers with stained clothes. there is no access to toothbrushes or soap. donald trump's base reads this to rally and talk about these facility and people cheer. why does this work? >> it works for numerous reasons and no one wants to cheer when
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children are in trouble. we got 45,000 people from 52 countries who are trying to access our country right now. and they're in detention centers, however you want to call it. ocasio-cortez is wonderful for putting it out there and driving nancy pelosi crazy. it is a sad and disappointing situation. what it does for donald trump is he ran on this. he talked about the southern border and he talked about building the wall for the people and the ability to protest a system and an abysmal failure whether it is abbott or rick perry who continues to talk about the government's failure to protect the country on this. these are children who have children. these are people who have been abused and it is 45,000 people
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from 52 countries. our country can handle this. we have been 540,000 people a year from 1880 to 1930, half of those came from ellis island. our country opened their arms and accepted these people because we wanted them. we had a political environment that wanted them. they fought war and assimilated into our country and they are country. we have the ability to do this. the answer is where is the political will to solve this problem at the southern border. what republicans hear at these rallies are 45,000 people over 30 days over 52 countries trying to access our country. i understand why they are coming. they're coming to the southern border. that's where the outrage is and that's what donald trump got elected on. he's going to be elected on it again. >> it is the way he got elected. it is shocking when you read these stories, it does not
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provoke outrage on people and many of them claims to be christians and compassionate on people. ej dionne and karin, thank you all for being here. coming up, a show's game. that's next. how's game that's next. in my line of work,
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wednesday and thursday of the democratic 2020 facing off in miami. you can catch the action live on nbc and msnbc and telemundo. there is a brand new book. it is my book. it goes on sale this tuesday. please stay for that and including upcoming events for los angeles. next weekend. up next, messing with two can t candidates who can help the majority leader grip the senate. majority leader grip the senate. when you shop for your home at wayfair, you'll find just
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it is part of the a political campaign. it is part of the pride he takes as leader of the senate. as you see what he's wanting to bury, none of these things are going to pass or voted on. for the first time in my memory, i agree with nancy pelosi. i am indeed the grim reaper. >> last fall, the democratic
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scored a major victory. a promising moment that seems to pose a threat for the trump administration. the democrats legislative agenda has been stifled because the senate is still under control of the president. that could change in 2020 when 22 gop seats are up for grabs. six are at real risks are flipping to democrats. joining me now, jamie harrison who's challenging trump ally lindsey graham and teresa thompson who's running for the seat currently in purdue of georgia. >> two states up for grabs, georgia is where stacey abrams, how will you win that state if you were the nominee? >> the road to replace right through georgia. we get tremendous work with stacey abrams came with 1.5%
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with taking that state for the d democrats. we have learned some lessons. 2014 and '16. we know how to turn out our base and we know by running the woman outside the metro atlanta area and well known in central and south georgia. that's going to shape their margins in the central south georgia in about 90 counties. if we can turn out the barack obama margins of 2008, they can't win if we can't turn out the 2018 margins of stacey abrams. >> we know brian kemp is no longer the referee on the field. he still got a clone of himself as secretary of state. >> first of all, we got excellent orders out of the federal courts when stacey abrams filed those lawsuits right before the election in 2018. it was days before the election. they could not be i am elemenmpn
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the way they should have been. never the less it is an improvement. now we have dozens of organizations led by the aclu and the urban league and others that are making certain 159 county up to par. they're not tolerating any sort of voter suppression, they're going into the board of regis r registration and making sure they deliver a better system in 2020. we are there in 2020. so this is real and it is going to happen. we are going to replace senator mcconnell's leader. >> okay. >> very confident, coming out of the former mayor of columbia, georgia here. >> let's go to jamie here. you know your state and you know jim clyburn very well and
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somebody that's under the house. south carolina is tougher though. georgia is 60% white and 32% african-americans. it south carolina is 68% and 27% african-americans. deeply red. if georgia is getting pink-ish, how are you going to win against lindsey graham. >> i don't think south carolina is as red as people think. we flipped the state's senate seat that was held by republicans for 30 years. when georgia in 2008 went for barack obama by seven points, barack obama lost by seven points, he lost south carolina by eight.
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he lost south carolina by nine. we are not far off from our sister staying in georgia. we are going to send lindsey graham home. he's the most powerful and glorified candidate in the country. it is time for somebody go to washington, d.c. and on behalf of the working people here in south carolina. we don't have that. he wants his own personal power and trying to be bff with the president and he does not benefit, the state does not benefit as a result of it. we'll work very hard to do and replicate what state he was able to do in georgia by going into our rural counties and amping up the vote in those counties and engaging with our african-american communities in rural counties where we have not spent a lot of time and energy developing infrastructures. we'll be at the tip of the spear as we see this new renaissance
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in the south. >> what is the big issue that you believe will cause and dislodge these republican senators? is it lindsey graham being best friend with donald trump? is that going to resonate? >> i think the character issue will definitely resonate. this is a guy is a communion. in terms of policy is going to be healthcare. we have four hospitals that are now closed. what does it mean in the community there? it does not matter if you voted for donald trump or hillary clinton the last election. if you have a heart attack or strokes or complications with pregnancy and you need to go to the doctor, instead of taking you 10 or 15 minutes, it takes 35 or 40 minutes. that's a death sentence. instead of lindsey spending his time and energy and figure out how can we bolster our community
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and make sure healthcare is protected for them. he spends his time of brand cassidy that he came with rick santorum at a barbaershop. >> h >> he enable this president to declare terror force on our farmers. two of our biggest crops are soybeans and pecans. then of course 236 days it takes them to deliver basic hurricane disaster relief after hurricane michael. people are losing and declaring bankruptcies. he has failed in his major tenants. he was going to go to d.c. the man delivered on a $1 trillion budget deficit. he's running in the wrong
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direction. that's a message frankly that the people already know that he has failed leadership. >> i want to ask you -- no, i don't. that thing came up saying i am out of time. >> can you guys come back and talk about the race as it goes on? >> okay. >> definitely. >> absolutely. great. we'll have more "am joy" after the break. m joy" after the break. your brain changes as you get older. but prevagen helps your brain with an ingredient originally discovered... in jellyfish. in clinical trials, prevagen has been shown to improve short-term memory.
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the fbi has been examining a violent domestics dispute from 2010 between shanahan and his then wife kimberly as part of a background investigation. both claimed they were punched by the other. shanahan said i never laid a hand on my then wife. >> after withdrawing acting defense secretary patrick shanahan's nomination, donald trump tapped mark us per. the department has gone six months without a permanent leader. the administration is making war like noises toward iran. the departure is one of many stories of dysfunction in the trump administration. in that chaos is the subject of my next guest's book. joining me now author of the new
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book "the best people trump's cabinet and the siege of washington". alexander nazarian. >> thank you for having me. >> congratulations on the book. >> thank you. >> chaos is a ladder. is it for this administration or why are they so cay yachaoticha? >> it's an escalator. the chaos helps them, because it focuses our attention on the surface sort of drama, and while that's happening, they get to do things behind the scenes that receive little scrutiny. that's not to say none at all, but we only have so much bandwidth. we can't pay attention to everything. they know it and exploit it. they told me that. by they i mean steve bannon and high ranking officials in the west wing. they are playing the media and the public frankly, to maximum effect. if people knew what was happening on a day today basis, they'd be more terrified. >> the fact that we have acting
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defense, dha, u.n. ambassador, acting chief of staff. acting fema direct, u.s. cis director, that's planned? somewhat? >> it's purposeful if not entirely intentional, if that makes sense. they have figured out how to use the chaos to their advantage. trump is only the figure head of this -- the executive branch. and in the layers underneath the sort of cabinet chiefs are deputies and assistant administrators who were weaned by the heritage foundation, by the federalist society. they know what they're doing. they're not the ones causing the chaos. they're benefitting from the chaos. >> is this what steve bannon had in mind, breaking government apart? >> you're correct. they are breaking government. they're leaving it vacant. they're turning our government into tra noble.
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i think you know how that ends. >> what do they want? >> they want americans to lose trust in government. >> so they can do what? >> they simply can give away as much -- so that corporations can have as much power as republicans have wanted them to for years. >> yeah. so at the end of the day, donald trump runs and says he's here to drain the swamp and change washington so it changes the little guy. you're saying they're there to break government so the little guy gets nothing and the rich get everything? >> exactly, joy. you've clearly read the book, and i appreciate that. >> the swamp is fuller than it's ever been. it runneth over. and in fact, if anything, the trump administration is a deep state of republican functionaries undoing things that corporations dislike and conservative activists dislike. that goes from voting rights to labor protections.
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these are projects in place since reagan. and finally, of all people, the least reaganite republican, donald trump is bearing fruit for them. >> is the financial corruption you're seeing inside the white house, the jared kushners and ivanka trump making money, are other people, betsy devoss, are they also making money? >> some of them are. or at least they're trying to. the mistake that some of them have made including scott pruitt, the former epa administrator, ryan zinke, think they they're as invincible as trump. they think they can be mbe mini. they can't. no. they have less power. but they've all tried. some of them have fallen by the wayside. others continue to be in this
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administration. wilbur ross, steve mnuchin. those are people who have largely escaped our scrutiny because how much scrutiny do we have? i mean -- >> it's a fire hose. right. we're so distracted with trump's chaos that they are busy being corrupt in the open. >> and trump loves chaos. >> clearly. he's benefitting from it. alexander, the book is the best people, check it out. trump's cabinet and the siege of washington. thank you so much for being here. >> thank you. >> more after the break. >> more. of a lifetime. it's "progressive on ice." everything you love about car insurance -- the discounts... the rate comparisons... and flo in a boat. ♪ insurance adventure awaits at "progressive on ice." tickets not available now or ever.
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that's our show. a.m. joy will be back next weekend. up next, alex witt. we're back together in studio again. >> i loved having you start off the show yesterday. it was great when you got the amy klobuchar interview. i was saying how much i loved our presence there because we'd have great speech, 7 minutes long and then everyone pivots and walked over to joy. >> they walked over. it was good. i thought people were present. i was impressed by some of the speeches and by the fact they were smart enough to come and get their air time immediately after. people were playing it very smart. indeed. have a good show. >> i'll see you later. thank you. good day to all of you from our head quarters in new york. welcome to weekends with alex wi witt. so many questions and in moments the answers from the president's new interview

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