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tv   MSNBC Live With Velshi and Ruhle  MSNBC  October 2, 2019 10:00am-11:00am PDT

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negative on pompeo. he could not carry his blank strap. that's a first in my experience covering the white house, congress, and the state department. that does it for this very busy day on "andrea mitchell reports." be sure to tune in today of rachel machaddow's new book. rachel will be on "jimmy fallon, the tonight show." here is "velshi & ruhle," stephanie and ali. >> andrea, great to see you, have yourself an adventure this afternoon. >> hello everyone. we are following fast developments in the impeachment
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inquiry. white house democrats rather than -- we are an hour away from the news conference where president trump will have more to say about it all. >> you don't know that for sure. >> the stock market is down big time. more than 500 points at this moment. we'll show you why coming up. al major health scare for bernie sanders, he has to have a sudden medical procedure, forcing him to cancel upcoming events. pete buttigieg will be joining us to talk about this and much more coming up. we have a lot to get to to get to at this hour. president trump as you have just seen. you met moments ago with the president of finfinland. he spoke to the press slamming the entire impeachment efforts. i want you to listen to this. >> shifty schiff, he's a shifty
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dishonest guy who was critical of one of the great secretaries of state. graduated number one of his class at west point, graduated one of the top of his class at harvard law school. the most honorable person, mike pompeo. this guy was negative on mike pomp pompeo. he could not carry his blank strap. i won't say it. >> the president also says this country defines the whistleblower because that person is a spy. now the impeachment fight. the democratic chairman of three house committee released a draft subpoena ordering the white house to produce documents relate to the president's effort to dig up dirt on joe biden in ukraine. one of the chairman adam schiff
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appears with nancy pelosi a few minutes ago, he gave the white house a stern warning. >> any effort by the secretary or the president or anyone else to interfere with the congress' ability to call witnesses will be considered as evidence of obstruction of the law. they are going to prevent witnesses from coming forward to testify on the allegations and the whistleblower's complaint, that'll will create inference those allegations are in fact correct. we don't want this to drag on months and months which appears to be the administration strategy. the inspector general will meet with democrats and republican members at the house and senate intelligence and foreign relations oversight and appropriations committee. the meeting comes after urgent
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request to present documents. house democrats have five deposition planned. two depositions have been agreed to. the first one is scheduled for thursday, a former representative from ukraine, kurt volker is scheduled to appear. remember he resigned. and the stunning phone call between president trump and the president of ukraine. >> as for as i was in the phone call. the phone call has been the context of -- i have been a secretary of state for a year and a half. >> before the reporting came out of his personal involvement. >> the wall street journalist reporting president trump pressed the president of ukraine to investigate on joe biden's
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son. what do you know of that investigation? >> you gave me a report abo about -- the whistleblower's complaint of not which i have seen. >> the secretary dug in on congressional requests and calling them bullying saying he would not let state officials be intimidated. t john sullivan, we are writing to you because secretary pompeo now appears to have an obvious conflict of interest. pompeo was named in the call. the chairman writes "if true, secretary pompeo is now fact witness, calling pompeo to remove himself from the decision." >> house democrats are trying to schedule the deposition of five current officials, thus far two of them agreed. the first deposition is set
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tomorrow. joining us now, yamiche alcindor. >> yamiche, again, he slams nancy pelosi and adam schiff should be looked at for treaty and he called the legal impeachment inquiry bs. he did not say bs. >> how different things are from the stressful times during the mueller investigation until now. for us this feels like a whole new ball game. >> this feels like completely now. the president has been angry and lashed out at critics before. he's saying this whistleblower is not someone that deserves the protection.
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i need the see this person and be abilile to confront this per and give them a piece of my mind. people around the president have been saying he's confident and this call is perfect. what we see is someone angry at the coverage of all this and also angry at the fact that democrats are going ahead. what makes that white house speaking so incredible is adam schiff and nancy pelosi same out and said that the president is using dangerous rhetoric and they'll protect the whistleblower. i am going to use the power of my office to go after this whistleblower everyon if it violates federal law. >> i want to slow this down for our viewers. it is hard to follow what subpoenas are being issued for what. there are a few things being issued right now.
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>> documents related to communications between the president and the ukraine, related to any kind of efforts to move those communications into a classified system at the white house that officials and democrats say should not have happened and so this is kind of the third evolution of subpoenas. it is important to know, ali that we are not expecting the white house to comply with a lot of subpoenas just like they did during the mueller investigation. democrats here in the house feel obliged to go through the process just like what you saw with the meeting with keselow i lewandowski, we are not getting any indication from them that they're going to use other power like content but they do feel
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like it is necessary to go through this process, they're going to get information from other officials. they'll have the briefing from the ig tomorrow. they'll hear from kurt volker who rudy giuliani was corresponding with and may have information of what the white house are up to in ukraine and up these corruption charges against the biden. on friday we'll hear from the intelligence committee inspector general who's expected to have more information how he fill in the blanks on a lot of that whistleblower's complaint that started this entire episode about the president's correspondence and communications with ukraine. >> heidi, we heard that dark warning from adam schiff. the president had been talking about little adam schiff and
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says he's been lying about him. we now heard a warning from adam schiff. the white house is able to block or does say pompeo is going to block officials from justifying. what avenues are available to congress? >> same avenues that are available during the mueller investigation which is to hall people in hall -- haul people into court. it does seem some of these officials deciding on their own to comply. that will set the president. even if they are unable to get the state department officials, democrats will have enough once the ig fills in the blanks on this whistleblower's complaint
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and does so in front of a bipartisan showing even if it is behind closed doors, that's going to be compelling enough for them to proceed with this process. all of it will be rolled into an obstruction charge. they have the same tools unfortunately for democrats that they are trying to unveil during the mueller investigation which is to take people to court. >> if it is go ahead to take people to court. yamic yamiche, a certain warning does not result in anything or how many subpoenas the white house gets. they seem to treat them all the same. is the white house actually that concerned. will they be forced or compel to respond because they have not perform? >> the white house has been saying two things. they have executive privilege and there are all these people who talking about what the president have said to foreign leaders and all of that should
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be wrapped into this large idea of executive privilege and house democrats pushed back on that saying that's not true. we should not have to go through this because it is about people attacking the president for being elected for 2016. that's not going to holdup. the democrats are going to take the white house to court. the white house needs to be formulating a legal plan to fight these things and based on all those sources that i have and conversations i have been having with white house aids and rudy giuliani. the white house have not been able to form a legal strategy. they have been forming a messaging strategies and buying millions dollars of ads through the trump campaign to make the case that president is being attacked by the democrats. you have the president at the top and running all the messaging and he's going to be the chairman of his own impeachment committee.
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that's problematic because as we just saw the president is angry and taking all this personally. we'll see him lashing out and cursing on twitter and eventually saying we want to break u.s. laws in order to out this person that's calling me unethical. >> yamiche and heidi at congress. we wants to bring in kelly who served at the obama ad administration. liz, let me start with you, pompeo has been conflicting from this thing from the beginning regardless if he's now on the call. he was named in that transcript as somebody that the president asked the president of ukraine to meet with. he argued to congress that you
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can't intimidate my people unless they are with a state department lawyer. that's not allowed. that would be the intimidation. if somebody is called to testify with their boss' lawyer, that's the intimidation and not the way around. >> their boss' lawyer. when you hear pompeo saying they're not allowed to rent a lawyer. it is not a lawyer. >> first of all, pompeo ought to recuse himself. he's part of the parcel of what appears to be an impeachable offense and who knows if there are other criminal offense involves here. he's maybe himself violating the whistleblower rules because maybe some of the state department officials want to come forward and want to blow the whistle about the president. he's got to worry about that and he ought to remove himself and he knows better what he's doing.
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it is an outrage for him to be involved here. the house committees are working in a deliberate and smart manner. one of the important thing they're going to do is if the state department refuses to turn documents over or in frercferen. >> we don't respond to these thing in a meaningful way. >> the judiciary committee did not do this. it is not just obstruction. okay, you are not turning over this document about what president trump talked to rudy giuliani about? they can infer the worst kinds of things were said in that conversation. >> kelly, weigh in on this? . >> secretary pompeo took an aggressive approach during his time investigating. there is some irony.
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in august, his own state department's inspector general issuedd excessive political bullying. there is will the a track record bullying and abuse career servants. >> kelly, i want to play a little bit more of what the president said this morning about the whistleblower. it is relevant because it is so stunning. let's listen to this. >> the whistleblower wrote not that conversation, he wrote a vicious conversation, in other words, he either got it totally wrong or made it up or the person giving the information to the whistleblower is dishonest. this person need to find out who that person is because he's a spy. >> he's saying they have to be found. >> hold on.
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any time something like this happens, let's say as a private citizen, one may naturally feel this way it is a spy who's out to get you. help us understand this is the ramifications of the president. who's surrounded by lawyers whewith a deep suunderstanding of how ts works. how reckless is it for a president to say this. >> it brings the kind of language that dictators and other governments actually used against those who are accused of wrong doing. we should not get use todd the fact that the president of the united states said today that the chair of the house is a traitor because that chairman in investigating his wrong doing. this is not formal stuff.
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it normal stuff. essentially what we are seeing is the president of the united states trying to operationallize the tools and instruments of american foreign policies and national security to advance his own political agenda. this is deeply troubling to the american public. we have a lot to uncover hoar teher here the upcoming days. >> there is a new york times saying impeaching trump will be harder than impeaching nixon. democrats in congress needs to persuade republicans and the general. there was not a personality in richard nixon that was overwhelming everything else that was going on. >> it is quite different because people respected nixon and he
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had won with anover landing landslide vote. for the american people to support impeachment which they did over whwhelmoverwhelmingly. they had to change their minds about him. the american people has to see and congress has to i am preach thimpeach trump. the american people have to see, this kind of behavior is dangerous to our democracy. it is not just a rogue president being over the top and using vulgar language or being political here and there. as we just said, he's taking the institutions of government that works for all of us whether democratic or republican administration, they protect us. he takes the cia and the fbi, he tries to twist them and turn them into instruments of his
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personal political advantage. that's deep threat to this country. >> kelly, our colleague keir simmons was hosting a panel in moscow where he had a chance to speak with vladimir putin. he asked him about election interference. we want to share what he says. >> is russia as robert mueller alleged attempting to influence the 2020 election in the united states. >> translator: i will tell you it is a secret. yes, we'll definitely intervene. it is a secret so everybody can laugh so it will go big but don't tell anyone please. >> what do you make of that? vladimir putin making a mockery
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of russia interference. we know in the first paragraph of robert mueller's report, i think it was word 14 when they're sweeping systematic interference attempt. i think those are the words. there is vladimir putin who's a leader of the country of italy, mocking all that went on. what do you think about that? >> well, i find it deeply disturnidi disturbing and we should be taking it seriously. last week when the dni testified before congress, he said that election interference is the number one threat facing the united states. that's trump's own acting director national intelligence. this is going to keep happening and the russians are going to keep pressing. what trump is doing with all these actions around ukraine is creating a target rich var environment for the russians to push forward on our country
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politically. >> i want to say one thing before we go. >> trump used the institution of the government that meant to protect us all. kelly, you worked for two different presidents and two different political parties. did you see the attempt to use the institutions this way? >> no, i have never seen anything like it in my entire career. >> and even watching the president sitting in the oval office and subject the finished prime minister of his rants on his political opponents is atrocious. the ukrainians and others into our own domestic politics is profoundly wrong. it is disturbing to most americans. she was on the national security counc counc council under george w. bush and our old friend, liz who favored in impeachment of nixon.
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president trump is expected to be holding a conference at 2:00 p.m. with the president of finland. we'll bring it to you live. >> that was totally different. >> something else that's happening that's very exciting today. the dow plummeting again for the second time in two days. remember when it was closed down last night. it was the worst day we have seen in five weeks. today we are now down 536 points. coming up, how the president's trade war is hurting the economy and president trump reported of the extreme idea to stop illegal immigration. including -- wait for it. snakes and alligators and why the acting secretary of dhs is so frustrated. multiple fatalities have been reported of a vintage world war ii b 17 bomber crashed and burst into flames in connecticut today. at least six people were taken into the hospital. the wings of freedom tour
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call, click, or visit a store today. welcome back to "velshi & ruhle." take a look at the dow. we are off about 525 points. it is about 2%. we seem to hit a low before we got on-air. this follows a couple of things. one is yesterday's slump. it is related to an index
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manufacture index which is an american index but it follows on a bad reading on manufacturing on europe as well. western developed countries tend to be industrial countries. when manufacturing is down. it serves to some as an indicator of a recession. take a look at this manufacturing index. 2009 was the big dip. that was a big dip recessment. any time that number which you see on the right of your screen is below 50, it is a signal of a contraction in the manufacturing industry. >> ali. let's put that aside. because those who are saying listen, you pick a day that you want and you are reading tea leaves or this is about signs that things are slowing. manufacturing contracturing. do you remember what president trump ran on?
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bringing back manufacturing jobs. >> she was speaking in ohio to people who worked at the plant. it is since closed. >> it was not an abstraction. it was real for this president. >> i am going to bring manufacturing jobs and we'll help farmers. we have seen mid size farms closed at record number dieespi receiving $18 million in farming which was needed. >> another piece of data that's bothering markets, the september jobs report. this is not the federal government jobs report. the private sector report. it shows the pace of hiring is slow. 135,000 workers last month, down
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from 157,000. >> i don't know why you are going down this path. trump's economy and manufacturing is strong as a rock. >> he says manufacturing is strong as a rock. he said that to our cnbc colleague. we received a wave of manufacturing data that refuted that. let's bring in our bill griffin of our business report. how much of this is economic numbers and how much of it is this impeachment talk and the stuff -- the market was going down as we hear from president trump. i wonder whether people are thinking if the wheels are coming off this bus. >> the impeachment does not help. the fear that takes away from the work could be done on things like the trade agreement with mexico and canada. that's one thing. you guys laid it out there very well. the manufacturing sector we knew have been in a slump for a number of months.
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what impact will it have on jobs that's slowing down. you show the payroll number from adp was 135,000. last year at this time, that was 214,000 number. we have seen a slow down in hiring. the last piece of the puzzle has been the strongest part of our economy and that's the consumer and last week we got a report on retail sales for august that shows sales slowed in a critical month. that's the back-to-school shopping season. july was revised lower. the dominos are starting to fall at this point and it starts with manufacturing. you have to look at the trade agreement. the trade war and the higher tariffs that's causing it. >> these things don't occur in isolation. >> bill, thanks so much. >> we are not hearing any progress with regards to the united states and china of that trade war. we'll keep an eye on our markets throughout the hour. >> just ahead, the presidential
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candidates are speaking at the gun safety forums right now. we'll hear from pete buttigieg. he'll join us afterwards and we'll hear from senator elizabeth warren. >> plus, this man was appointed by president trump. he's now saying he's frustrated. what's going on in his own department? that's next on "velshi & ruhle" right here on msnbc. 's next on right here on msnbc. performance comes in lots of flavors. there's the amped-up, over-tuned, feeding-frenzy-of sheet-metal-kind. and then there's performance that just leaves you feeling better as a result. that's the kind lincoln's about. ♪
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in an oval office meeting the new york times reports president trump offered an astonishing solution to the crisis of the southern border between the united states and mexico, sending his advisors into a complete state of panic. the president's vision involves shutting down the 2000 miles border by noon the next day, trapping american tourists in mexico and stranding school children on either side of the border and prompting an economic crisis for both nations. this is the first time the president presented his own style to solve the border's
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crisis. president trump advocated for adding a water fill trench to the border which would then be filled with snakes and alligators. the white house aides sought a cost for. if all those methods failed, the president suggested that soldiers to shoot migrants on the legs to slow them down. president trump denied this earlier today. nbc has reported the plan included reinstated the family separation. using border agents to conduct a asylum interviews. that one actually went through. i want to note one thing. if you are remembering, ali, the interview that ivanka trump did
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with abc news where she referenced the child separation policy being a low point in the administration. i wonder where ivanka trump's first daughter senior advisor to president trump feel now since it has been brought up again. >> he was the custom and border protection chief at the time. in a new interview. he expressed among other things of his frustration that his own department is being used for a partisan immigration agenda. he maintains operational control of the dhs and told "the washington post" what i don't have control over is the tone, the message and the public faith and approach the department in a polarized time. that's uncomfortable. joining me now is author of that piece, nick. >> if he's concerned -- he can
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only be talking about one party and that's the republican party and president trump who appointed him to that job. >> that's right. >> you got to remember he was u.s. custom border protection for many years before this. he very much wants to maintain the image and public phase of dhs and immigration more broadly as a neutral law enforcement body. that's very much add odds with the way with the kind of moment we are in in familiar and in a way that the white house and the trump administration want to promote their immigration agenda. the census that anyone who wants to not be partisan and runs the
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department in this administration is soon gone. >> i think he's been at the top of dhs now for nearly six months, longer than any other dhs leaders have been in enacting capacity. there is no sign he'll be dominating for the position and he's isolated in this administration and one of the last remaining figures who tries to talk about and message these things from a neutral career, law enforcement official perspective and you know that left him more and more isolated. you know that was reflected in his statement. >> immigration at the border has been largely out of the headlines, at least in the last few weeks. why do you believe would be speaking so freely now essentially giving that he got the asking title and not
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permanent. >> well, ironically, he's done the one thing that matters most to the president. the always extreme proposals ta came out of these meetings with president trump and the white house that expressed the degree of frustration he had at the border, we can remember back in may, there was a peak and 144,000 people being taken into custody and a single month and macalini driven those numbers down. those levels and border numbers are fallen by nearly two-thirds. the thing that driven the president to a desperate place is now finally becoming this kind of bright spot that he's pointing to and he believes he can once more run on in his reelection plans.
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he and h he's standing on that record. >> nick, thank you very much. >> bernie sanders is off the campaign trail until further notice because of a health scare. >> pete buttigieg joins us live to talk about the impeachment inquiry and president trump's heated rhetoric. we'll hear from elizabeth warren live, you are watching "velshi & ruhle" on a very busy day. usy d.
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welcome back to "velshi & ruhle." bernie sanders is cancelling upcoming presidential campaign events until further notice after under going a procedure for a blocked artery. weaver released a statement, sanders experienced discomfort at an event in las vegas last night. >> after a medical evaluation, the senator was found of a bl k blockage in one of the arteries. he's now resting up. let's bring in ali vitali. she just spoke to elizabeth warren. >> reporter: yes, i did catch up with senator elizabeth warren. we talked about senator sanders, she texted him and has not heard back. of course he was suppose to be here at this gun control forum
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this morning. we also talk about how you can get washington who's so focused on impeachment now. how can they focus on measures on gun control. she says they should be able to do that. of course, the focus is on impeachment and we had that conversation as well. i think your control room is going through that footage. we'll be able to show you a little bit of it the next few minutes. >> what was the take away from what he said of everything that's unfolding in the last week and a half basically. >> can you answer that in 15 words or less? >> reporter: yes, i will try. >> i did ask her about the whistleblower and the way president trump had been talking about that person. adam schiff says that could be witness intimidation. when i brought up to her that trump wants to meet that person, yeah, i am sure he does. she ended that person saying no one not even the president is
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above the law. that was definitely more than 15 words. i will send it back to you. >> ali, great to see you. >> what was elizabeth warren reaction to some of the things that are unfolding? >> maybe a few minutes. i am eager to hear what he says. ali, great reporting. they figure out whether you have a blockage or not and they put in a superintendeten stint in ad playing golf. how could that cardiac procedure be a small thing? >> modern medicine. >> mayor pete buttigieg joining us to talk about the impeachment inquiry. we'll get his reaction to president trump's latest comment. we'll hear again from president
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ruhle." our next guest just finished participating in the nbc gun safety forum which is under way in las vegas. joining us now mayor pete buttigieg of south bend, indiana, and democratic presidential candidate. mayor pete, let's start by getting your reaction to the news about bernie sanders, who is now canceling events until further notice after this heart procedure. >> well, of course, wishing him and his family the best this heart disease came to my family last year, and i know that everybody is going to be eager for him to be back in fighting shape and on the trail as soon as possible. >> mayor pete, it's ali here n recent weeks the president suggested that democrats could, some should, be arrested for treason. he's compared to whistle-blower and those who gave him information to being a spy. he said it again today. he said multiple times that democrats are launching a coupe to overthrow his government and suggested there could be a civil war if they're successful and
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this morning he tweeted that what democrats are doing b.s. instead he didn't say b.s., he used the whole word. your thought on what's going on. stephanie are thinking that this feels like a shift. >> well, the simple fact is that these rantings are not the words of the leader of a democracy. when you are being criticized, let alone, when you're being called out for wrong doing. responding by describing somebody who is calling you out or disagreeing as being disloyal to the country because they're being critical of you, this is the stuff of tin pot dictatorships, not the presidency. it's sad, not just for the president, for the presidency itself, the country. remember, this is the president of the united states. your life and mine depend on the wisdom and judgment of the president of the united states and these rants are a bad sign for all of us. >> you actually have a personal experience with that because when you say that a lot of people, maybe even some of our
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viewers whether say, this is just trump being trump. but you served in the military of this country. something that is at the hands and operates at the whims in some cases it seems of the president of the united states. so the implications of this from a national security perspective are serious. >> you know, when you raise your right hand and agree to serve in the united states military, you are putting yourself in a chain of command that goes all the way up to the president. and the president makes decisions that are life and death. they're life and death for every american, but especially for those in uniform. and when you think about the crises of instability that are happening around the world, instability in the oval office, let alone in the president himself is literally life threatening to our troops. and another thing, you know, when i served in the military, i did so believing that the flag that was on my shoulder and that i saluted at daybreak was a flag that symbolizes our
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responsibility to protect things like free speech and the idea that nobody is above the law. and i think when a whistle-blower blows the whistle on official misconduct, that is an act of loyalty to the republican for which it stands. patriotism requires us, and so does the law, to honor it as such. >> your fellow democrats on the hill, while they're talking impeachment inquiry, we heard from nancy pelosi talking about usmca and gun legislation. you're in las vegas talking gun safety. you recently said this could be a golden moment in gun safety gun legislation. do you think we're going to get something done? there is a lot of focus on impeachment. what is your message to mitch mcconnell, to president trump because it sits in their hands. congress has already passed, and that is in the house of democrats, now it's in their hands. >> that's right. this was already passed in the house. background checks, common sense
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gun law that the vast majority of the american people support, including by the way republicans and gun owners. so the simple question to mitch mcconnell and to the president is -- why are you defying the american people and refusing to give us the measures we are asking for overwhelmingly in order to keep our children, our schools, our places of worship, our shopping centers and your neighborhoods safe. you have a chance to save thousands of lives. why won't you do it? >> mayor, i want to get your take on "the new york times" report on the president discussing the border in march, throwing out the idea of putting snakes or alligators in a border trench with spikes on top of a wall. it also says, quote after publicly suggesting that soldiers shoot immigrants if they threw rocks the president backed off when his staff told him that was illegal. but later in a meeting aides recall he suggested they shoot migrants in the legs to slow them down, that's not allowed either they told him.
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mayor, this puts into stark relief the degree to which the president takes this issue to heart as a campaign promise. what do you make of this, if true? >> i mean to call it child-like is an insult to children. and it also reflects the basic mentality this president, which is he doesn't regard human beings as human beings. we can absolutely manage our border in a way that is consistent with our laws and with our values, but alligator-fitted motes, spikes, this kind of nonsense obviously does not make america safer and it raises profound questions about the fitness of this president to serve. that being said, i think we've had profound questions about this president's fitness all along. so the best thing that i can do about it, as a candidate for president, is to make the case for a better way for the kind of country we will want to live in, after this presidency comes to an end one way or the other. >> mayor pete, take us to the u.s. economy.
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republicans think it's one of the president's strongest winning arguments, but we got some pretty dark numbers from the manufacturing index this week. how do you see things? >> well, this is really urgent for the part of the country i live in, the industrial midwest. it appears now that the manufacturing sector is officially entering a recession. and you can see it when you talk to workers and different folks who are impacted by this trade war that has really done nothing for the american worker. obviously it's harmed american farmers. it's harming american consumers as our prices go up and that's going to have consequences with the economy. there's also a bigger question which is how well is this economy working for us? when i'm president, i plan to ensure that we stop manufacturing the wrong things. and the number one measure that i would look at to let us know if the economy is doing well would be the income growth of the 90%. right now even when the numbers
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on a page look good, more and more americans are fighting just to hold on to what we've got because if incomes are growing, it's not as fast as the cost of prescription drugs and saving for retirement, housing and education. and that's when the numbers on a page are looking good. now that we're starting to see a downturn coming out of the manufacturing sector, it just demonstrates how out of touch the president is and how destructive his policies have been. he's managed to hang on, tack on an extra couple years to the obama recovery. that might be good news, but now we're in a very precarious position as an economy and as a country, especially in places like the industrial midwest. >> mayor pete, thank you so much for joining us. mayor pete buttigieg of south bend, indiana. reminder, mayor pete is at the 2020 gun safety forum in las vegas. the forum presented by march for our lives and giffords and moderated by our own craig melvin. watch it streaming on nbc news now and msnbc.com. see you back here at 3:00 p.m. thanks for watching "velshi & ruhle." >>

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