tv MSNBC Live With Ali Velshi MSNBC October 15, 2019 12:00pm-1:00pm PDT
despite the dark money campaign, the no surprises act could advance to the floor by the end of the year. if p you see that on your local station, now you know where it's coming from. that'll wrap things up for me this hour. i'm katy tur in washington. chris jansing is in for avel al. >> at this hour, more drama on capitol hill as house democrats are continuing to methodically build an impeachment case around the president's mission conduct. two sources now tell nbc news that democratic leadership is reaching out to members in swing districts to gauge support for an initial vote on opening an impeachment inquiry. then it could discuss it with the larger caucus as early as tonight. all of this following that stunning testimony yesterday where we learned former national security adviser john bolton
characterized the attempt to get ukraine to investigate joe biden as a drug deal. and he described rudy giuliani as, quote, a hand grenade. the most senior ranking current member of the trump administration to testify so far is right now behind closed doors answering questions. his name is george kent. he's the deputy assistant secretary of state and a key witness to trump's firing of the former u.s. ambassador to ukraine, marie yovanovitch. now he's testifying under subpoena. let's start with the latest on capitol hill with geoff bennett. from the white house, hans nicho nichols. jeff, i think one of the most stunning things we learned in the last 24 hours came from fiona hill's testimony, that john bolton was so worried about a rogue effort being run by rudy giuliani and others that he told
hill to notify the chief lawyer for the nsc. as nbc has reported this was seen as a clear counterintelligence risk. how does kent's testimony right now play into that bigger picture? >> reporter: i'll explain it this way, chris. fiona hill offered house investigators an inside view as to what was happening in the white house as rudy giuliani set about his rogue operation as it's described, his influence campaign to do president trump's bidding. george kent offers the same house investigators an inside view of what was happening at the state department around that same time. as you mentioned, george kent is the state department official who is responsible for ukraine and our reporting is that as far back as march he was raising concerns, sounding the alarm, not just about what rudy giuliani was up to but the way in which giuliani and his associates were trying to smear state department officials who raised questions about it, including marie yovanovitch.
she thought if anybody's going to be having conversations with ukraine's leaders about u.s. policy and interests, that it would be her given her position as the ambassador to ukraine. and that is one of the reasons why rudy giuliani according to the testimony tried to discredit her. so this testimony is important. the testimony today and later in the week, it's important because democrats already say the impeachable offense, that is clear as day, president trump, inviting a foreign pow or the interfere in this country's election. they're trying to put the pieces together how it's happened. it's happening behind closed doors because adam shift says he doesn't want the witnesses to potentially be tipped off as to what one or the other is saying so they might want to coordinate their stories. he doesn't want the white house to know the full case that democrats are building so the white house doesn't try to undercut it in real times. >> that's fiona hill's reported testimony, that tlfls this tense
exchange on july 10th between bolton and the ambassador to the european union, sondland. and mick mulvaney working together to press ukraine to investigate the democrats. heres what hill says bolton told her. i am not part of whatever drug deal sondland and delaney are cooking up. she said giuliani is a hand grenade that is going to blow up. the problem for republicans in this scenario is you now have someone who was widely respected on the right, who has key firsthand knowledge to this critical impeachment inquiry. this is not secondhand knowledge as they like to say about the whistle-blower. >> reporter: right. it's such a great point you make. it becomes harder and harder for republicans, chris, if they're being intellectually honest to discredit the whistle blower to try to white wash the president's actions when you have someone like john bolton who is a conservative lion
basically comparing president trump's behavior to some back-alley drug deal. that's one of the reasons why republicans for the most part aren't defending the indefensible, what they're calling out is the process, saying adam schiff shouldn't be doing this in public. we explained why he's not. that is the chief talking point from republicans, that if adam schiff is bringing in state department officials, the counsel should be there, this should be public testimony. what they're not defending is president trump leaning on ukraine's leader to dig up discredited dirt abjout joe bidn and that is born out not just in the wlhistle-blower complaint bt the summary the white house put out between trump and the ukraine leader and the ig memo. there is evidence people can read for themselves despite the spin we hear from both sides. >> every day this week house investigators are hearing testimony from individuals involved in this issue.
one of the key talking points today, the president tweeted this, his supporters on the hill like matt gets have used it, is that the democrats are hiding these interviews because they don't really have anything. right? >> look, this is all derivative of the strategy or at least the leverage the white house put out a week ago, and that is not cooperate because they don't accept the legitimacy of this impeachment inquiry. you've seen different attacks. sometimes they come at it one way, sometimes another. the lie today has to do with transparency. they think this should be an adversary criminal process where defense
attorneys have access to the witnesses. here's what the president tweeted today. he's saying democrats are allowing no transparency at the whit hunt hearings. if republicans did this they would be excoriated by the fake news. let the facts come out of the charade of people. you'll see this lie from the president because he clearly feels aggrieved about this.
we see it when he talks in front of big audiences or official auld yenss. he wants to question the legitimacy of this proceeding. as jeff well noseknows, that pu you on a collision course to a showdown for obstruction of justice. if the white house keeps stone walling that's the direction democrats will go into so you could have multiple articles of impeachment. >> guys thanks to both of you. while testimony continues on capitol hill, today is deadline day for rudy giuliani to turn over subpoenaed documents related to allegations that he pressured the ukrainian government to investigate hunter biden. and while democrats build their case, the public support for the inquiry has steadily been on the rise. 538 average of the polls since taken in august and found now just over half, 50.3% of americans, support impeachment. joining me now, joaquin castro who sits on the house intelligence committee and the
vice chair of the foreign affairs committee. i wonder if you've been hearing from any of your colleagues about -- can you hear me? he can't hear us. should we take a break, see if we can get that -- let's take a break. we'll re-establish our communication and be right back. ♪ work so hard ♪ give it everything you got ♪ strength of a lioness ♪ tough as a knot ♪ rocking the stage ♪ and we never gonna stop ♪ all strength, no sweat. ♪ just in case you forgot ♪ all strength. ♪ no sweat secret. all strength. no sweat.
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against the advice of the state department, talking about his concerns regarding what some people have said was smear campaign about former u.s. ambassador to ukraine. i want to bring in debra jones, who was most recently the former ambassador to kuwait and libya. she served under five administrations, was one of 50 former female ambassadors, who recently signed a letter of support for marie yovanovitch. good to see you. thanks for being with us. i want to read part of the letter you signed. it says for u.s. diplomacy to be an effective instrument of state craft it is vital that the nonpartisan, nonpolitical work of dedicated public servants be respected and honored, just as we honor the contributions of military service members and other government colleagues. that respect must begin at the highest levels of leadership and be communicated consistently to international audiences in private as well as public communication. to do otherwise is to undercut u.s. diplomatic efforts and the
safety of u.s. personnel worldwide. what exactly are the potential dangers you see that made you sign this letter? >> thanks for having me, chris. when we have a professional foreign service that goes out to represent our country, historically we are carrying the water of a process that has been argued in washington before hand where policy process that represents competing ideas on the security and the safety of the american people, on the interests of the united states of america, and so after a rambunctious dialogue at home, privately, among the agencies and the various political views, we generally, historically have come forward with a unified policy, a foreign policy that is carried out by our ambassadors and their missions overseas. those missions include americans from an array of our cabinets,
from the commercial arena to the military arena to the drug enforcement, you name it, under any mission. if that -- the ambassador speaks for the president. and in fact our letter of instruction says that we are the president's personal representative. if the president, if we are undermined by our own government, that's a problem for us. we have no credibility. i would say similarly, though, that we also -- we do not underu undermine our governments overseas. and that is a professional defect if i can say or factor of being a professional foreign service officer, that you know that you have no credibility if you are criticizing your government overseas. so we don't do that. we're used to compartmented processes. i don't think anyone is contesting the fact that president as commander in chief gets to do what he wishes to do. we've had examples in the past where we've had whether it was iran contra or even co
compartmenting this this dialogue with iran. >> do you think there's a problem or sit new the difference between a career person in the service, diplomatic service like marie yovanovitch, and someone like a gordon sondland, who has been at least named as part of this effort who was a donor, who -- no? you don't think there is a problem or a distinction? >> this is historically been part of our foreign service. we've had, you know, political appointees, we've had professional foreign service. we've worked together over the years. we do have historically high numbers of political appointees right now, which is a bit unusual, and we are unusual as a service in that we have that -- >> do you think -- >> it becomes problematic when the agendas do not reflect a
policy process, when the agendas reflect a personal agenda as opposed to a policy agenda. you know, we've worked with this back and forth for decades. i've certainly worked with it in my career. the question is what is the objective of the policy process? nobody questions the president's right to select his representatives. that is in the constitution. and his right to remove his representatives as he chooses. i don't think that's the issue here. the issue here is the nature of the october ibjective, whatever a policy objective in the interests of the american people and the country or whether it was a personal objective. i think that's the issue at stake. >> deborah jones, thanks for talking to us. we appreciate it. joining me now joaquin castro who sits on the house intelligence committee and is vice chair of the foreign service committee. sorry about the technical
problem. i wonder if you've heard anything from capitol hill today. anything how the george kent testimony is going. >> i haven't had a chance to touch base with my colleagues about it today, but i'm glad that these civil servants, these diplomats are coming forward and courageously stepping forward to tell the truth about what they know about the trump administration, any direction they may have gotten from the president, interactions with rudy giuliani, or anyone else who had a role in the united states' relationship with ukraine and specifically any directions the president may have given that may have benefited him politically or personally. >> did what you hear yesterday from fiona hill in any way change your mind about the way democrats should approach this impeachment inquiry, including what we're hearing today, the possibility that a vote will be considered after consultation with some of the folks in the
swing districts to officially open an impeachment inquiry? would you be for that? >> yes, absolutely. i've been for it for white a while now and i do sense more and more members of congress are convinced there will be articles of impeachment that will be brought forward against the president of the united states. can't tell you exactly the timing on that. but since this story developed going on a month now, 3 1/2 weeks now, the president has only dug himself into a deeper hole and there's been more convincing evidence that has come out that the president has betrayed his office and abused his power. there are folks around him like rudy giuliani that he used to do that. >> i have to ask you since you are in ohio about what's going to happen there. i have to put in a plug for the university where it will be held, my alma mater. >> all right. >> some of the top contenders who will take the stage have not broken through, not broken 2%,
4% in some of nies lathese late polls. your brother julian is obviously going to have the same struggle a lot of folks who aren't in the top three are going to have. this is the largest debate stage we've ever seen with 12 people on it. how does he break through? how much do you hear the clock ticking? >> yeah, i mean, look, you're right, this is a competition that started with like 24, 25 people. so you've got to be up there and make sure that you take the opportunity to describe to americans your vision for the country, if you're elected president. and also you have to be somebody who's willing to challenge somebody else when you disagree on policy. and my brother has shown a willingness to do that, that he's not scared to speak up when he disagrees with somebody else. and ultimately the nominee of our party is going to have to be somebody who's not shy about that. >> we're going to see a feistier castro tonight? >> no.
i think -- i think you've seen from my brother, you know, the ability and the willingness to stand up for what he believes. but what's interesting is that since the last debate, there have been many of the folks that have been running for president who now seem like they're taking shots at each other on twitter or in forums or other things, so i think that you'll probably see some fighting going on amongst some of the other candidates. but putting that aside, most of all i think americans are watching because they want to buy into somebody's vision for the future of this country. they want to know what you believe, what you stand for, and most of all how you're going to make their life better. >> joaquim castro, thank for taking the time. >> good to be with you. coming up, new sanctions on turkey has criticism from lawmakers grows over his decision to put troops in syria.
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are patrolling. the white house decision to withdraw nearly all u.s. forces in the region has produced rare bipartisan concern. even mitch mcconnell warning of a calamity. the washington editorial board calls it trump's syria mess, saying what a fiasco. foreign to policy blunders often take months or years to reveal damaging consequences but the harm from the abrupt withdrawal from u.s. forces from syria is playing out almost in time. as nbcnews.com reports, kurdish fighter who is stood side by side with the united states are being absorbed into the syrian army's 5th corps under russian command and russia will move boo the space vacated by president donald trump. joining me chief foreign correspondent richard engel on the ground in northern syria.
what's the latest happening there? i heard you just spoke with the commander of the syrian democratic forces. what did he tell you? >> reporter: the situation is extremely grave. and yes, we did speak to the commander of all of the kurdish forces, the commander who just made an alliance with the government of president bashar al assad and through that government made an alooliance wh russia. there are two levels to understand what is happening here. on the geopolitical levels, u.s. forces are leaving this country. thefsh ordered to leave. as they are consolidatinconsoli rirnging their footprint, reducing the number of bases they occupy so they can be more safe as they exit the country, russian forces, syrian forces are moving onto those evacuated bases. it is a change of power. some say it is a humiliation for the united states to abandon a country, abandon an ally, and have russia move in and take its
place. that's the geopolitical level. on the human level, we're witnessing a catastrophic situation. the commander of the syrian forces said they are facing ethnic cleansing, a deliberate campaign of ethnic cleansing, one of the most serious charges you can allege in war. a determined campaign to displace a people from their own homeland. they say they are facing this from turkey, that the turkish military and turkish-backed extremist militias are driving people away from their homes. the u.n. says 160,000 kurds have already left this war zone and the kurds themselves say it's closer to 250,000, a quarter of a million people. there are only about 2 million kurds in this area, so that means 12.5% if the kurds' number is accurate have already left. they worry more and more will follow. the situation on the ground, hundreds have been killed according to the kurdish
commander, and he says that president trump, this is the kurdish commander who spoke with president trump by phone last night, he says that the united states would protect the kurdish people. he said in specific that the united states would protect one town, the kurdish general, mazloum, his hometown, but tonight that hometown has been surre surrounded. people have abandoned the town and it has been cut off and under siege. i asked did president trump keep his word to you? he says no, it does not look like it. >> richard, take care there. while the president moves to sanction turkey for its angsts against the kurds in syria, qatar is rushing to turkey's defense. ali interviewed the foreign minister and deputy prime minister there and joins me from the capital of doha. ali, also where you are is a
turkish military base. i'm wondering how the country balances that when it's affecting operations in the american base that has i think 10,000 troops stationed there? >> reporter: at least 10,000 troops here at the base which is the centcom forward operating base for the region opinion, for instance, if the united states were to take a more aggressive military stance against iran, much of it would come from right here in qatar. qatar is under blockade from all its neighbors including saudi arabia and yet it has the largest u.s. military presence in the region. on the other hand, when that blockade came into place in 2007, qatar couldn't fly through saudi air space, had to fly north so iran gave it air space and protection for ships going out, iran provided food and so did turkey. turkey came to qatar's aid and between iran and turkey, two countries of the united states is up against right now, qatar
survives, possibly, because of those two countries. i heard a very different conversation from the foreign minister and deputy prime minister of qatar today as he related to turkey all those things you heard from richard. this foreign minister said it's not ethnic cleansing and that the kurds are a threat to turkey's security and safety and that they believe that turkey should be able to protect itself. however, he realizes that qatar is in a problem as america heats up its rhetoric and actions including sanctions against turkey. here's what he told me he wants to do about it. >> first of all, we don't want to see a tension between turkey and any other nation, not only with the united states, and we don't want to see also turkey's security compromised because of the threat being represented to them from the north part of syria. what we are trying to do is really to listen to the turks
and listen to their concerns, trying to convey the right message for our other allies and partners like the united states and others in europe. in fact, i'm planning to go to turkey in the coming few days to see a way how to address the issue, how we can find a common ground that we can see a way forward and de-escalation to make sure also to get the assurances of turkey that the concerns of the united states is going to be addressed. >> so here you go. you have vice president pence heading to turkey, the qatari foreign minister and deputy prime minister heading to turkey. it looks like people are trying to center in on this and figure out what a solution looks like. as the world condemns turkey or much of the world does for what it's doing, not everybody does and i'm in a part of the world where at least the leader of this country does not.
>> ali in doha for us. thank you so much. we appreciate it. up next, hunter biden defendering his foreign business dealings but admits to using poor judgment when it came to considering the political implications. >> you know what, did i make a mistake? well, maybe in the grand scheme of things, yeah, but did i make a mistake based upon some unethical lapse? absolutely not. >> of course it's not just joe biden whose son has foreign business ties. from luxury resorts and trademarks in china, president trump's children are involved in their share of international business dealings. you're watching msnbc. let's hide in the attic. no. in the basement. why can't we just get in the running car? are you crazy? let's hide behind the chainsaws. smart. yeah. ok. if you're in a horror movie, you make poor decisions. it's what you do.
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it's just right! book your just right rental at thrifty.com. oh! baby bear! in his first sitdown interview since the launch of the impeachment inquiry into president trump, hunter biden admits he used, quote, poor judgment, acknowledged that being joe biden's son was likely a reason he was offered a seat on the board of ukrainian natural gas company. biden noted that while he didn't do anything wrong, he made his father vulnerable to politically charged attacks. >> why did you leave the board in april? >> it's a five-year term. >> you chose not to -- >> yeah. >> why? >> i think it's pretty obvious why. >> this is your opportunity to say why. >> well, because, rg this is what becomes a distraction, because i have to sit here and answer these questions. so that's why i've committed that i won't serve on any boards or won't work directly for any
foreign entities when my dad becomes president. >> of course it's been repeatedly pointed out that the president, president trump, is in a glass house when it goes after an opponent's son for business dealings. and "the new york times" takes a closer look at the trump family business and how it operates overseas. while the president's eldest son, donald trump jr., has insisted the trump organization pledged to not begin new international projects during the trump presidency, "the new york times" makes this point -- quote, for the children of the politically powerful, business personal and public dealings can often be indistinguishable, especially with private projects depending on foreign governments that are looking to bolster ties with washington. er eric lipton to wrote that piece from "the new york times." good to see you. as someone who has closely covered this organization and how it operates, walk us through how donald trump jr. has distinguished himself as a
businessman overseas as not as he says part of the trump administration. >> well, i mean, both eric and don jr. have been quite active in the last several years. don jr. was in india promoting three different projects that the trump organization has and is marketing the sale of luxury condos in cities in india, and then don jr. also was in ind sh nisha in august, two hotel resorts and golf clubs. for example, the project in indonesia, one of them includes a highway being built that allows that project to go ahead. that's the state government supporting that highway project that will benefit the sales of condos and other assets there. so these are international deals that the trump sons are involved with. and they're actively working on them. >> i get a question and i'm sure you do, too, based on the research you've done, but people
offeren a often ask me, is this stuff legal? is anybody overseeing whether family members are leveraging their position. what's your answer to that? >> i don't see evidence in the reporting that i've done that they have gone to government officials overseas and said my dad's the president, we want a special consideration. i have not seen evidence of that. but it's difficult to know at times what other entities do even without necessarily being asked, because maybe they're taking steps where they want to appear to be supportive of the united states or of the trump administration even if the sons have not asked. >> the question always is about whether the nepotism that might be involved, you go back, for example, to the kennedy administration and whether or not the brothers should have been, robert kennedy should have been the attorney general. and rand paul was on this network this morning and he was asked about ivanka and jared trump and jared kushner's role in the white house. here's what me had to say. >> most americans think that
making $50,000 a month for a young man that's had no experience in international relations is really unusual. >> most americans would also say it's strange that bill barr's son-in-law works at the white house, that rudy giuliani's son works at the white house, that the president's daughter and son-in-law work at the white house and that bill barr's daughter works at the treasury. most americans will say the swamp stink ps. >> the president's family is not paid. i think giuliani's son makes less than $100,000 a year, so i don't think anybody's getting rich paid by government nap's all on the up and up. >> that's a very different question from the kind of thing you have looked at. is there a way to track, is there a legitimate way to figure out if -- the president has said he's lost billions of dollars by being president of the united states. is there a way to track what the upside has been for the trump organization? >> we know that the washington hotel, for example, has seen its revenues rise and it is a magnet
for republican candidates, for conservative groups, religious groups, and it has seen millions of dollars of business that has come in because of donald trump in part. that business comes because donald trump is president. that's a place you want to see and be seen. it's way to send a signal to the white house that you're support i ive of president trump. there is a place that has benefited. mar-a-lago has seen a lot of business, although has lost some business as well. overall in the united states, the trump company has struggled. its name has been taken off quite a number of buildings and it was unable to start two new chains of hotels in part because of the reputational issues that have emerged since donald trump became president. >> eric lptoipton, thank you so much. >> thank you. coming up, we are live in
forth wit fort worth, texas, after an officer shot and killed a woman inside her home, that a police officer is now charged with murder. the latest details coming up. plus 12 democratic presidential candidates will wind up on the debate stage in ohio tonight on what many will anticipate will be an extended discussion on the impeachment inquiry into president trump. you're watching msnbc. izza one third of our classic crust is made with cauliflower but that's not stopping anyone o, that's good! ♪ work so hard ♪ give it everything you got ♪ strength of a lioness ♪ tough as a knot ♪ rocking the stage ♪ and we never gonna stop ♪ all strength, no sweat. ♪ just in case you forgot ♪ all strength. ♪ no sweat secret. all strength. no sweat. be right back. with moderate to severe crohn's disease, i was there, just not always where i needed to be.
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the police officer who shot into a fort worth home and killed a woman baby sitting her nephew is now facing murder charges. geojef atatiana jefferson was playing video games with her nephew when a neighbor noticed a door open. the responding officer shined a light into her yard and her window before opening fire. today at an emotional news conference, the fort worth police chief said the department must work harder to restore trust with the community. >> it's very emotional because the officers, they try hard every day to try to make this city better. i likened it yesterday to some of our officers that are out there every weekend and most weeknights, that they're out
there trying to build these relationships, and i likened it to a bunch of ants building an ant hill and somebody comes with a hose and washes it away and they have to start from scratch and build over. >> the officer aaron dean is out on $200,000 bond. nbc's gabe gutierrez is in fort worth where he has been covering this story for us. gabe, the arrest warrant says jefferson's nephew told investigators he saw her pull out her gun. texas is an open carry state. what did the police chief have to say about that? >> reporter: hi, there, chris. that is first time we heard about those moments leading up to the shooting through investigators from the eyes of sadly that 8-year-old boy who witnessed this shooting. that arrest warrant, as you mentioned, the 8-year-old nephew says he saw his aunt take out the gun from her purse, point it at the window, and what the police chief said today was that it made sense for atatiana jefferson to have a gun in the first place if she believed
someone was on the property. you'll remember that the officer, police say, did not identify himself and today the police chief reiterated there was no excuse for what happened and that that's why the officer is now charged with murder. as you mentioned, out on $200,000 bond. >> so what happens next? >> reporter: well, we are actually still awaiting to see if any attorney is representing this officer, officer dean. he was -- le grahe graduated fr police academy last year, had no major disciplinary actions against them. so now the question is what does happen next. the largest police union in the state, we're waiting to see if they might represent him since he's no longer an officer. there are some questions about that. he'll face a murder charge, and that is obviously a very serious crime as it works its way through the legal system. you know, we spoke with the victim's family yesterday and
today. they had been asking that he not only be fired but face criminal charges. that is what happened today. and, chris, you know, you've covered many of these officer involved shootings, it is somewhat unusual for charges to come so quickly in these type of investigations. usually they can drag on for weeks or months. today i asked the police chief specifically whether in his career he'd ever seen a police officer charged this quickly, at least in his jurisdiction. he said no, he hadn't, that this was the fastest in this investigation. so this community is reeling as you mentioned. there is some anger from the victim's family, and from their attorney about this information that came out in this arrest warrant today about atatiana jefferson pointing the gun at the window. the victim's family said she had every right to do it and lee merritt, the civil rights attorney, he accuses the police department as putting that as a sort of defense in this case, but hearing from the police chief, he said there was no excuse for this. the mayor of fort worth yesterday in the news conference said that the gun was
irrelevant. so certainly a lot of questions still to be answered about the future of this officer in fort worth. >> gabe gutierrez, thank you for that. i'm joined for more on all of this by bart of the black law enforcement alliance and retired nypd detective. it's good to see you. look, you heard -- >> thanks, chris. >> -- what gabe just said, the folks there saying there's no excuse for this. but you have a situation where a well-intentioned neighbor, who now, by the way, sounds devastated by all this, sees an open door, makes a phone call, using, by the way, a nonemergency number, what do you see that went wrong here? >> the biggest thing that went wrong is that you had a police officer who used whatever judgment he can pull from to make a tragic decision and kill someone. i mean, listen, the fact of the matter is that we can have a
discussion, if needs to be, about the police protocols, about how police should respond to situations -- >> identifying yourself. saying you're the police. yes. of course. >> right, right, but i think those are all side issues that may distract us, the same kind of a side issue that would be a discussion about whether or not she should have had her handgun pointed up. those are side issues. the real issues are the issues that the family has addressed, spoken about, and even the mayor and the police chief have spoken about. that is, the question of not only individual accountability on the part of police officer the but institutional accountability. the ability for institution, police agencies across the nation, specifically here, to hold their members accountable and to insist on higher level of standard, professional standards, for their police officers. i think that should be the area in which we kind of work toward because i think that's what the family wants. obviously, that's what the administration wants as well.
>> but in the meantime, you have this big picture question that you know well, and that i'm not surprised in the "washington post" eugene robinson put very bluntly, the column is titled "what can a black person do to keep from getting killed by police in this country?" he writes, it appears staying at home while black is such a threatening activity you might get killed for and said the quick release of the body cam video may be progress of sorts. we heard gabe gutgutierrez. they charged the officer quickly. as you see it, what's the bigger question here when you can be black, be home, minding your own business, and you end up dead? >> yeah. we can look at this case and say there appears to be some positive movements toward the demands for overall criminal justice reforms, specifically, police reform. we can address those issues, but until law enforcement, the law
enforcement profession and the criminal justice decides to examine the role that race plays in enforcement, in prosecutions, we'll be spinning our wheels and these incidents will continue to occur. time after time again, you'll find that being black and doing anything places you at a high level of risk. we have to examine and get down to the core issue as to why, and until we have a real honest discussion about the role that race plays in an enforcement of laws, we will continue to have these human tragedies, and it's the black and brown communities that are more at risk than any other community, and those communities have been demanding that conversation for quite some time. >> marq claxton, thank you so much. appreciate your time. we have to go to breaking news now with the vice president and secretary of state leaving for turkey tomorrow as the white house is facing fierce criticism from both parties for withdrawing troops from the turkey/syria border. hans nichols joins me now from
the white house where the president just spoke. this is part of a larger delegationi delegation, right? >> reporter: chris, mike pence bill leading the delegation that's leaving tomorrow. crucially, the white house says they have a meeting with president erdogan scheduled for friday this friday. this is pence's first visit to turkey. he'll be accompanied by the secretary of state mike pompeo as well as robert a bo'brien. national security council adviser. their goal is to get a cease-fire. what administration officials are telling us they wouldn't have done this trip unless they didn't have some expectation for a truce, a cease-fire, however you want to phrase it. one challenge they're going to have is that by the time he leaves, the time pence arrives there, the facts on the ground will have changed. it's clear that turkish forces, as all reporting from the region is indicating, are pushing further to the south, at the same time you have russian-backed forces as well as the assad regime coming up from the south as well putting potential u.s. forces into a squeeze, potentially being trapped. vice president taking some
political risk going there for what is obviously a very volatile political and political situation across the board. chris? >> without a doubt. hans nichols at the white house, thank you for bringing us that breaking news. syria obviously will be on the minds of the candidates tonight in the biggest debate so far. a dozen of the 2020 candidates will take the stage at odderbine university in ohio hours from now and comes as the race is shifting. no polling from quinnipiac has senator elizabeth warren leading nationally with 30%. joe biden 27%. if you take the margin of error into account, that is a statistical dead heat. senator bernie sanders third with 11%. mayor pete buttigieg next with 8%. senator kamala harris has 4%. and no other candidate in this "q" poll is above 2%. of course, it is individual states that will determine the nominee. and tonight's debate could very well change the calculus. i'm joined now by congressman ruben gaiego, a campaign
surrogate for kamala harris who of course will be on the debate stage. it's good to see you. in the first debate senator harris was aggressive against joe biden. she gained ground. she's fallen back since then. how do you gauge the importance of tonight's debate and how does she maximize what will be ex exposure once again to millions of people, something, this is the only opportunity you get in these debates this early on? >> well, first of all, thaur th for having me. look. every debate is important. let's not kid ourselves about that. right now, this is a very special time i think in our politics. i think this is the candidate that's going to be able to prosecute the case against donald trump. every day we see some new type of embarrassment. if you look at the history of who's been on the front line pushing ba ining back on donald it's been senator kamala harris. she's the one who actually prosecuted a really sincere and strong argument against attorney general barr. potentially actually getting him in the cross hairs when it comes to whether or not he's been used as a political tool by this administration. and i think she's going to be
able to prove that case tonight during the debate. >> there's a lot of people who would argue, look, you have to have an affirmative case, have to tell americans how you're going make your life better. i was reading her local paper, the "san francisco chronicle," had an article, said, look, what she's going to have to do tonight is have a clear, coherent message of what her campaign stands for and why voters should choose her over others. do you have an answer for that? >> certainly. look, she's said consistent ly, we are very strong in this messaging, we're putting justice on the ballot, justice for communities affected by the trump administration. justice for all americans who need to understand what happened with this last election, what's currently happening with this administration. she's going to lean on her experience both as a district attorney, attorney general, as well as senator, to really push that issue. >> let me ask about -- >> we believe that is the winning message. >> i want to ask you, congressman, about a different kind of experience. syria sure to be a topic tonight. >> sure. >> russia, of course, announcing
they have troops patrolling between turkish and syrian forces today. and even a lot of republicans have expressed deep concerns about the president's actions there. do you think this crisis could play into the strength of candidates with, frankly, far more foreign policy experience than senator harris or who, like you, a marine corps veteran, served their country? >> well, look, i think it's not fair to say that she doesn't have foreign policy experience. she is a sitting senator, 1 of 100 that actually has to interact all the time with both the department of defense and also foreign government. she was a statewide elected in, you know, california. a state that deals with a lot with other international -- deals international relations. of course, experience is important, but, you know, at all levels of government, whether it's been the district attorney, attorney general, or u.s. senate, she has had the experience that she needs to basically be a great administrator when it comes to department of defense.
and, look, i've seen both ends in terms of the military. i was enlisted, actually served with a unit based here out of columbus, ohio, which, unfortunately, saw the most casualties of the iraq war. and i've been a member of the armed services committee for six years and the experiences that i've gotten in the armed services committee by being in office really do matter. and they augment a lot of what i learned. in the field in iraq. >> we literally have just 30 seconds left before we have to go. i don't know if you've given her advice or she asked you for advice. would you say it's the time to go after an elizabeth warren, is it time to be feisty? what do you expect to see out of your candidate tonight? now i've taken ten of your second, so in 20 seconds. >> well, fortunately, i give advice all the time to her and she is, you know, very well experienced. and my only advice i've continued to say is, like, be the best that you are. and i think when she is natural, she is talking about it from her strengths and experience that she shines through and i think that's what we're going to see tonight. >> congressman ruben gallego, good to see you.
thank you for taking the time. appreciate it. >> thank you very having me. >> that wraps up this hour for me. can always find me on twitter @chrisjansing. thanks for watching. "deadline: white house" starts right now. hi, everyone, it's 4:00 in new york. turns out the whistle-blower had plenty of company in his concern about donald trump asking the leader of ukraine to dig up dirt on the bidens. from none other than conservative fixture and former national security adviser for donald trump john bolton. according to the testimony from one of bolton's deputies, fiona hill, a russia hawk who worked for donald trump until this summer, bolton claimed, "i'm not part of whatever drug deal sondland and mulvaney are cook bing b i cooking up." mulvaney. and sondland, of course, donald trump's ambassador to the eu who's in the middle of trump's pressure campaign against the ukrainian leader. the source tells me today that sondland was, quote, trying to deliver hunter biden to