tv World Apart With Oxana Boyko RT July 2, 2017 6:29am-7:01am EDT
one of israel's senior peace negotiators mr share is such an order such a pleasure to have you on the show thank you very much for your time i thank you now it's believed that israel has largely stayed out of the syrian war even though occasionally it did conduct airstrikes as well as had some a system assistance program going on to how the n.t.a. government groups operating in and around the golan heights what is your sense about this conflict where is it heading now well it seems that the conflict this terrible tragic bloodshed is moving slowly towards some kind of subsided arrangement and israel has been very consistent since the outset of this conflict it does not intervene in this internal tragedy we've been on the sidelines since the outset as you know except for one thing and
this is treating the war wounded who ever needed assistance or lifesaving got it from israel well mr show you are you mentioned a phrase subsided there arrangement and if you look at the latest events in syria the americans took down the syrian jet a few days ago the iranians have just fired ballastic misspells at some isis targets in syria it looks like things are really heating up or rather of them entering the stage of what you call subsided their arrangement do you take that as a sort of calculated bargaining various players trying to secure a better negotiating position for themselves or is the situation progressively getting out of control no i don't think that it gets out of control and i believe that the. phrase that you used to be a calculated bargaining is what is what we see now unfortunately what we what we're
seeing is. it is us and staying that means that iran has the upper hand which was of course not that something that israel has ever desired and i don't believe that the other parties want it that. and especially not the united states but what russia could not do and what america could not do i believe that israel. not being omnipotent could not and wanted and don't want to do so so that where things are i believe that any any solution any final settlement of the of the conflict in syria should not compensate iran should not award iran any any prizes and should not award assad so left to be seen what what kind of arrangement will be will be put in well absolutely left to be seen but
i'm sure you're familiar with the russian position of each essentially sees it as a choice either between assad to beach you may or may not like and. hardline jihadi oriented rabble is in charge of damascus can you explain to me why is that option more palatable for israel i did not say it's more palatable but you know the fact of the matter is that we do not have. a choice between between one very good option and one very bad option we have a choice between a bad option and a worse option some in russia believe that the first personal meeting between the russian and american presidents on the sidelines of the g. twenty meeting may clarify the situation but i wonder if those hopes are really justified because donald trump just visited israel a short while ago do you think these rallies have. clear impression over where he stands on the let's say the syrian issue or for that matter on any other well if
you refer to the visit the trump president trump just said in in israel last month i believe that things were not. too clear ofter the visit. except for for one issue which is the israeli palestinian conflict in which we do see that there is a kind of a prolonged effort wisdom the. subsequent visit of two envoys of prison trump for a kind of a process that would bring the parties once again. to to talk to one another rather negotiation table or in a more regional outlook of. of talks and i believe that this is what we are witnessing no kind of. an ongoing effort to do. yes the water of. of the possibilities lying ahead
for renewal of some kind of political process now mr sze you're being very very cautious in the way you you phrase. whatever progress may have been achieved but i think and i've seen a number of israeli arab publications coming out with have learned suggesting that the united states was back in the middle east do you think that's really the case to the extent of americans being able to call the shots in the region as opposed to just sending a couple of ad wars or taking a couple of pictures in front of the wailing wall what does it really mean to be back in the region as far as israel is concerned well it requires a. genuine effort to reassemble what we refer to as to quartet needs america russia the e.u. and the united nations in order to have
a more coherent. international approach to resolving the horrible israeli conflict in general and the israeli palestinian conflict in particular and i believe that this has started with. the good relationship that president trump and president putin have between the two of them and some european i would say readiness to to engage in a more. in a more serious manner and and then i would hope for a more binding continuous. process it would have at least three prong. first one would be regional we have a lot of common concerns with certain relatively moderate sunni
regimes around us and then we have also to truly continue the negotiations with the palestinians on a on the basis of transitional agreements and gradual interim processes that would bring us closer to the two state reality before we get to the two state solution and of course we need to compliment that by the third prong which is the independent constructive steps that would compliment those steps and reverse the trend towards the one by a national state which is which would be a disaster for both israel and the palestinians well mr share in the meantime we have another regional conflict brewing this time between cards far and saudi arabia with turkey taking because our side will these while exposed to the consequences sometimes disastrous consequences of the shia sunni rivalry how do you think these intra sunni tensions bursting into the open are going to affect the regional
dynamics look i'm not not i'm. referring to anything like you know a regional conference with a lot of photo ops and i'm talking about is serious process that. relates to countering the iran expects expansionism and a spear ation for possessing. weaponry nuclear weaponry i'm referring to the radical islamist fundamentalism i refer to the countering terrorism isis and other proxies of iran and i believe that that this should be the grounds for for discussing within that framework a beginning of a process of no mali's ation between between israel and some leaders of the
arab league and the arab world and within that of course a. a process that would resolve eventually the israeli policy in conflict which is in the interests of both the arab world the palestinians and first and foremost israel well mr sherry if there is one country benefiting from the saudi could terrorists pav it's definitely iran i wonder what do you think is the reigning secret it seems that the rainiest have a knack for turning the failures of that geo political foes into their favor. is it the radians who are so smart that adversaries who are not smart enough it's basically both because what we see is a very shrewd and clever iran playing. very good cards and a not too coherent international policy. led by the united states is of
the iran they are clearly very. very much a source of concern to most of the free world the western world i believe that president trump sorts of quite early in his first term to do is these problems as unpredictable and unexpected as he is on the all the issues but at least we see that in the first quarter of his first term as president of the united states he has put a lot of energy into into the middle east and into the israeli policy in an israeli or a conflict and i hope that this will would signal to boast to iran and to the rest of. the potential allies for countering iran that he is serious in that in that respect you mentioned the free world and i think
it's quite clear to me about the when you look at the region for israel's policy towards iran it compares to only one country which is saudi arabia everybody else has moved on everybody else is flexible could tar turkey jordan egypt not to mention russia the european union even the. united states under the obama administration and there we know that there are still some elements of the democratic administration in power in the united states so i wouldn't count on the united states completely reversing its term i want to ask you why do you think is really still stuck in this position because it has a reputation for pragmatists for flexibility for being able to compromise why can't i find a suitable compromise with iran well it's very simple it's the other way around the south is was very stuck it's iran that is stuck in its. aspiring and call for a meal eighteen israel we have no choice but to be very rigid.
and very firm in our opposing iran any sprogs seas and it's trading terrorism not only in the middle east and because of the israelis and jews but but everywhere over the globe and we know that since ever. i believe that iran's proxies such as as hizbullah and hamas they've also united against one enemy of them which is israel and zionism and the jews and the west in general while mr share we have to take a short break now but we will be back in just a few moments.
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published an interesting article describing how trump can apply his dealmaking principles to these really palestinian peacemaking and you start with this think big advice you suggest that he should include the regional actors particularly the gulf states but again you make no mention of her own beach definitely has an interest in the palestinian question it has a leverage there das excluding iran really represent thinking big as opposed to fame old same old from israel what i can only humbly say that what i tried to do is to take the eleven principles that were mentioned in his one thousand nine hundred eighty six book the art of the deal and apply them one of the principles that you've just mentioned. is to is to get a larger outlook into the middle east and. employ the rules that seem so is is promoting his
book and looking. larger the broader middle eastern ballpark and its might so happen that in the future iran also will be part of that but it depends on how compliant it will be was it a c.p.o. way that. it was signed two years ago and. how genuine would be very implementation of all the measures and provisions within this. mr sze you're doing this difficult israeli thing of dragging a totally separate issue into these really palestinian question i mean i understand that it's kind of accepted that. that the only way to gavin the terms good graces is to quote. he he's own ideas to him but again i want to
ask you the same question again why is it excluding iran going to present any new framework especially now that the regional powers seem to be in such a disarray you call for involving the regional actors but they they can't agree between themselves do you think they would put all their grievances aside for the sake of the palestinians no of course not i don't think that this is intertwined but i believe that the israeli palestinian conflict has to be resolved in a two state for two people. men are and that there should be a boundary between israel and the state of palestine so i believe that this is the right course of things to be looking for. including iran in this process seems to be very very. kind of redundant because iran looks at exactly the other direction how to not
allow this resolution of the israeli palestinian conflict to to be. to become to become a reality because this nurtures. the. the any muzhik t. the hatreds and the and the host time approach of of the iranians towards to was the zionism towards israel towards the jews etc plus you know i'm not i'm not here to provide any any advice is to present trump or to america i'm just thinking through searching and looking for the best options for my country for my people and for the other human beings around us while speaking about your country i mean your futures blamed iran for essentially sabotaging the peace process but let's look at how well israeli negotiators perform because you
know i find it interesting that in most of the business schools around the world you see israeli negotiators former israeli negotiators teaching in the m.b.a. program the art of deal making do you think the deal that israel has so far security for for itself over the last several years decades rather off on and off negotiations is a good deal does it speak to the mastery of israeli negotiators well you know. first it's not it's all the problem of negotiators the problem of you know allowing the interests of two of the two sides the opposing and converging interests to be to become verged together by the leadership success of any kind of deal lies in the in the kurds and the vision. of the. a little clue will of of the leaders in question that's number one number two
i've seen conflicts intractable protracted conflicts all around the world and throughout history for dozens and hundreds of years finally being resolved so ours is not that different we've been negotiating for now i know for twenty five years or so since the early ninety's ok but throughout those two and a half decades we've only been negotiating permanent status or a comprehensive peace in a period of maybe two two and a half three years so we might need more i'm not sure the palestinians have another hundred of years to wait out until we all need those issues i have interviewed the number of high ranking palestinian negotiators myself and they all independently say on the record that the way the israeli side behaves itself is very off putting for example foreign minister of the palestine every other molecule told me that
behind closed doors he saw israeli negotiators dancing on the table if he saw them singing i've never i've never i'm sorry to interrupt you i've never ever seen such a scene during negotiations never and i've negotiated with the palestinians under oath official and unofficial heads for hundreds and thousands of hours never ever have i seen that what i have seen is the palestinians negotiating an all or nothing. kind of over to you rather then negotiating compromising and agreeing on certain concessions that would bring eventually peace we have we have tried to do that and we are still ready to make the story concessions in order to make peace in order to end the conflict in order to get
finality to all claims but i haven't seen that approach from the palestinian side until every time that we reached a juncture in which there was a possibility to resolve the conflict even not entirely but most of its parts the palestinians just walked away and i don't know what will happen next well i think it's clear what will happen next they've probably still means i'm now trying to internationalize the conflict simply because they don't want to deal with these rallies anymore they're willing to deal with anyone but israel i wonder what do you think israel can realistically do to instill to sort of rekindle dire faith in the pragmatism of those negotiations do you think anything could be done so that the palestinians see if value in continuing those talks with you look let me be very frank with you i believe that the gaps are getting wider and wider but i
believe that what we need is to be. to be in one room. continuously in a binding manner and talk to one another and i believe that we need to compliment that with a regional process that would that would sustain the bilateral process and to compliment that was acts and steps measures that would be taken independently by by the respective parties and low to a states reality to start to evolve instead of the one by national state reality that we are both deteriorating into i believe that what we need for vets is a facilitator that would. put together by dint process that is a continuous one and understand that this will not be done as
a one time deal this is a gradual process that will have layer over layer until everything is stable enough and sold enough to walk over and and and look for a coexistence between israelis and palestinians it's one in its own land while mr sharon while you are talking about coexistence israeli prime minister famously said and he sticks still sticks to that point of view that they would be no palestinian state under his watch and as cynical as that may sound the the i think that statement actually is true because nobody in visions that that's going to happen within the next decade i saw what do you think needs to change in israel for these really leaves for people like yourself or the political leaders to understand that they don't have that much time for the incremental approach that you seem to be advocating that sooner or later the deadline will calm and then it will be late
well i'll tell you one thing that is obvious you cannot do you can to do. it is at the same time. that a trace of terrorism and an incitement and hostilities is of the israelis and jews internationalizing the legitimizing. israel demo nies inc israelis etc and say well let's make peace now. and you cannot do anything that is similar to negotiating when you are under these kind of. circumstances so i think that for the palestinians i would would not. hope for a one more resolution on the table that is in favor of the palestinian state because this will not form or establish
a palestinian state i believe that that only through out discussions talks and negotiations we could we could advance towards a mutual future of understanding of of compromising and for israel's i believe that it is our duty it is my only to ship duty and in our own civil society and constituency duty to look for every way. to preserve the jewish democratic corrupter and identity of israel this is what's of the founding fathers of israel seventy years ago in mind this is what i believe would be the best for for israel in order to encompass its core values its you many tarion values its jewish values. within within recognized and secure boundaries we are open to negotiating that but we cannot accept the old on
nothink plus terrorism that comes along with this formula when i negotiated in camp david and taba and afterwards and also during the other rounds of negotiations on permanent status what we had as a as a leading formula was nothing is agreed until everything is agreed and i think that it's time that we change that into whatever is of greed or mutually co-ordinated should be implemented now mr sharon fortunately we have to leave it there i really appreciate your being here and sharing your insights but as you've been very gracious with your time and i invite all our viewers palestinian israelis americans russians to leave that commons now twitter facebook you tube pages and i hope to see you again same place same time here and i will depart.
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i. learned. that. evidence to share with us this potential. preparation for the use of chemical weapons was. right and nor would that be layed out. washington accuses the syrian government of a chemical attack without providing any evidence to support the claim the move a provocation aimed at paving the way for u.s. intervention in the country. c.n.n. is left to read. the videos reveal the true feelings of some of its top employees towards russia. the start of the week so will the british prime.