tv Cross Talk RT September 20, 2019 4:30am-5:01am EDT
crosstalk in the israeli elections i'm joined by my guest philip giraldi in percival he's a former cia counterterrorism specialist who is now executive director of the counsel for the national interest in tel aviv we have gideon levy he's a columnist for hideouts also in tel aviv we have mehlman he is a senior israeli security writer and commentator right gentlemen crossed locals in effect that means you can jump in anytime you want and i always appreciate it gideon let me go to you 1st in tel aviv and ask you your perceptions of this election cycle you know i looked at israeli media in english and of course they go through all the different platforms and ideas that the different parties have but from my perch really far away it really looks to me is that how far right will the next government will be and how much people like or dislike bibi netanyahu is that a fair way to kind of assess this election go ahead get in. it's mold and.
selection and therefore my election will only on one issue benjamin it to the oh yes or no and the choice is really between the nice right doing good and the list nice right doing good or if you make only sent through the right and the right it's a very small choice but that's the choice of the people of his would ok philip going back to you donald trump. supported netanyahu when it looked like he was going to when he distance themselves from him but it was was trump kind of big gateway for netanyahu to go either for even further to the right because of course you know there were these placards all over israel with trump and netanyahu together. did trump make about poor calculation here well i think actually it was it was netanyahu who was making the calculation i think he was delivering the message that he could get virtually anything out of trump and in
seeking to make that impression he was talking about a rather extreme step which would be occupying annexing. much of the west bank and he knew he could get away with it that trump would support him on this where he was mistaken in thinking that this would be a game changer for him on his corruption charges and other problems with them and of course it didn't work out that way ok you know you know tell you let's go back to tell of eve i mean. there's going to be a new government eventually but how much different will it be from netanyahu is government and his long tenure as prime minister i mean it seems to me there's so much focus on personalities here but policy wise again from my perch very far away it looks not even nuanced go ahead and tell. well i think the reason i see change in israel. benjamin netanyahu with defeated. these really
electorate decided to stop is efforts. to undermine these really fragile but still democracy and need that same as. always the loser and doesn't like losers in terrors of policy change that would be much more difficulty but at least there would be some changes externally well i doubt it but there is help getting the same question to you i mean it i guess you know one of the biggest wild cards that could be played that's never been played before in israeli politics is the arab list of 13 seats that the arabs captured in now well obviously they're not going to be made king makers or king breakers but there is
a possibility something that none of us ever really thought could happen if they could be somehow maybe not be in the government but maybe support it and that changes a lot of things i would imagine go ahead gideon. i wouldn't go so far jointly which is this the biggest party these are the parliament after those elections is hardly counted i mean they're really. both. tried to avoid themselves from them. they left center so-called the bloke will have to use their votes but i don't see any guns inviting them to the government part of them wouldn't join his government but both of them i joined the government but. the guns are not ready to live. rare legitimize these early palestinians who invited them into the government there
was dr who gave the support to give them something in return it might be a small tel would normally. equalization if you want but the very very long to go you know if philip it's very interesting with the possibility i think what we could call a mini arab spring within israel parse that with. deal of the century what we know of it which is a farce from what i have seen so far it basically negates the very existence of the palestinians are just not there so you don't have to deal with a problem that doesn't exist but with this election cycle you're going to have some people in israel have to start thinking really hard because this is the 2nd election this year be the main parties they're in deadlock something has to change here but the question of her plan only makes things worse again from what we already know of it go ahead bill. well i think that your assessment of the question
or plan is is extremely accurate the plan is going nowhere and it will go nowhere i think that the. that in washington they've been reading the tea leaves on this for some time the expected money from some of the arab states that was supposed to pay for all of this is not forthcoming and the palestinians are going to say no to it and i think with the change in government which we expect either into a unity government of some kind without netanyahu or with ganske any gann says prime minister will be significant gant says has been while not welcoming the palestinians or the arabs has basically been saying some good things about them discussing them as fellow says. listens and i think it does change the mathematics if you have 13 parliamentarians who are with the arab group and they are not voting
against the government that changes the mathematics of what the new administration might look like go back to the o.c.a. in tel aviv what i think we have to assume at least under certain circumstances that netanyahu is out at least for now he's going to face an indictment in about 2 weeks we don't know the outcome of that what is his long legacy in israeli politics is it a positive or the negative side of the ledger go ahead and tell a b. i think legacy would be. israeli politics. israeli electorate and in a way. he became. on the world stage he. on the very next station. the israeli society.
trying to basically kill the israeli democracy and turn into a kind of new arab israeli very stern. and. at least. a little bit more than that. 51 decided enough is enough and i believe. net is on the its way to the grave to the story graveyard of those who did nothing in terms of making the change. and leaving it there are legacy to future generations you know gideon i mean i've read quite a bit about netanyahu is did he move did he was he the trailblazer moving israeli politics of the right or was he a follower realizing that it was
a good vote catcher ok i mean where is he in the dynamic and what's the cause and effect relationship go ahead gideon. i just want to continue your series. yossi didn't mention one thing which for for my point of view is crucial i seeing mitt and he. killed finally finally he didn't started finally the 2 state solution he put it off the table in irreversible way i don't see anyone picking it up again and this is very crucial now. i have some appreciation to not only our unlikely many of my friends because i think that he had the vision and the vision was to kill the 2 state solution i think this man does not believe neither peace nor in any kind of relations with the arabs in
general and the palestinians in particular he doesn't believe in diplomacy which leads to peace which leads to a real peace he believes only only living on the saw living god is a power living on its army or its intelligence or its technology and this is a very depressing vision but that's the thing else vision ok fillable finish out the part of the program where cancer him and he's no doubt of i mean he probably has he'll go down in history and in the for the people in gaza again what is the what is to change what is the continuity go ahead philip. well the continuity is i think that he has pushed the the country to the right. he may have you you could argue that he's exploited sentiment that was already there but his his particular brand of fear mongering mongering and his particular brand of of emphasizing force as
a solution is something that was unique to him and i think this is something that may not be recoverable and of course a good point a commentary that he has destroyed the 2 state solution is completely accurate ok i'm going to jump in here we're going to go to a short break and after that short break we'll continue our discussion on israel's election state with. the tense situation in venezuela is still all over the news the problem in venezuela is not that socialism has been poorly implemented but that socialism has been only implement inside venezuela things look different we're going to announce sanctions against the truest of venezuela so if you. have some of.
them listen. to the man. whose story is a new nixon called henry kissinger to tell him that he would not be tolerated in latin america. an alternative economic and social system could take hold and therefore the policy would be to make. the chilean economy scream so wants to make the economy of venezuela scream. most people think to stand out in this business you need to be the 1st one on top of the story or the person with the loudest voice of the biggest raid in truth to stand out on the news business you just need to ask the right questions and demand the right answer.
question. thousands of american men and women choose to serve in the country's military and the decision. every song came to a complete. to be instructed you know told a shot to kill me and i see how it destroyed my life any scream didn't come in my arm and he right mean. if you take into account that women don't report because of the extreme retaliation and it's probably somewhere near about half a 1000000 women have now been sexually assaulted in the us military is a very very traumatizing. but i've never seen trauma like. women who are veterans who suffered military sexual trauma reporting rape is more likely to get the victim punished and the offender and almost 10 year career which i was very invested in and i gave
a sex offender who was not even put to justice or put on the registry this is simply an hour in violence male sexual predators for the large part of target whoever is there whether that's a man or woman. welcome back to crossfire all things considered i'm peter we're discussing israel's recent elections. ok i want to go back to give you an intel of eve i want to continue a theme that you start in the 1st part of the program here. if it's we heard from our other guests in tel aviv. the legacy of benjamin netanyahu might have damaged the israel's democracy i think a very strong argument for that here but you point out it's the end of the 2 state solution 1st so i will ask a very obvious question and it's a question that israel gets furious about on the international stage and i suppose
even internally that if there isn't a democratization. that includes arabs that are israeli citizens then you do have b. word that they hate apartheid now how do you square that circle go ahead gideon. it is very problematic to talk about israel as a democracy where needs becky half an hour away from the studio that i'm sitting here. exists one of the most brutal military tyrant today so within a 20 hour or without the 30 hour litany of didn't start the occupation by all means know that it was labor which started it it was labor which established the it was labor which put it all the power and the settlers and the means to become not contemporary phenomena but the permanent federal media so 1st of all it's really problematic to talk about israel as a democracy even now now. israel claims that it's not an apartheid state
because of the. law of israel is quite a democratic law there is a parliament palestinian israeli palestinians are part of the parliament or this is very dies it is true partly for sure for jewish citizens israelis a liberal democracy an attorney out tried to harm this but by the end of the day we are playing to his words because we sold the respect to the democracy the only democracy in the middle east which refers to me as a privilege jew in this country if half an hour away from here people are living without any rights over 50 years what kind of democracies it's a joke it's not a democracy ok it's going to go back you know seen in tel aviv i mean is it under is this one of the legacies of netanyahu is that the 2 state solution is over so if there is no 2 state solution then there's
a one state solution can israel's political right deal with a one state solution or. or are they going to be just like jared cushion and just pretend they're not there go ahead and tell it. well there are a year from now probably would not be a. second me is released as solid lead vital democracy. obviously the result you patient alongside these men is democracy i don't think he needs story where are the rivera. moves and i i would say that's not the end of the 2 state solution but you need. to put all that label in israel for docu patient and and for their war it's wrong you need to for for for an agreement all this thing is for many many years blow it. off their time so if we are
a very new beginning maybe do resent all change and i think it's a good it's a good sign did you always going out ok philip we were talking about the 2 state solution i mean and all of this goes back to which i think at the end of the day my personal opinion it was just a con job that's how it's been worked out and i'm not giving any kudos to the palestinian authority because i think that they were actually if they were actually involved in seeing it failed that's a topic for another program but the united states has not done the peace process no good because it is basically dismissed it is if there is no conflict again this hope concept of just dismissing things away and then you don't have to deal with them i mean what do you gave netanyahu is extraordinary oh of it against international law by the way but american citizens are never told about in the
media i would say that you know of passage in american administrations and particularly the trump administration has actually hurt the prospects for settlements. for example the conflict between israel and the palestinians go ahead philip. well i think the united states has of course the the 600 pound gorilla in the room the fact is that since. the reagan administration or even before the united states has been lined up completely on the side of israel so when people talk about the peace process or peace negotiations here you have one immensely powerful state of israel backed up by the united states debating issues with the palestinians who have no power at all and are also under occupation so you know this whole thing is a farce that's been acting out my personal belief is that the united states is singularly at blame for what's been going on the united states long ago should have
acted on the policy that it claimed to support which was opposition to the israeli settlements on the west bank and never did a damn thing so the on the contrary we have an ambassador david friedman. in israel right now who was against the law against american law providing support financial and otherwise to the settlers and so this is you know this is this is ridiculous it's a farce of high order donald trump is just acting out what every other administration has done obama did not like netanyahu clearly enough but all he could do was abstain in a vote in the u.n. on the settlements and he gave he gave netanyahu 3000000000 dollars plus every year which he didn't have to do ok feel about it maybe just one kind of qualification is that the united states had a partner who coud partner that they had a partner in
a party now within a state i would say because if you look at that the neo cons circles around the united states they they're starts with they are ok maybe i'm quibbling here gideon earlier you were disagreeing with our other guest in tel aviv why. because they seeing that after having $700000.00 settlers including east jerusalem there will be never an israeli statesman who will be able to evacuate them and without their creation you don't have any viable palestinian state you have been to stance but you're going to have a viable palestinian state the minimum would be the $67.00 border and the $67.00 borders are a raise from them a long time ago and continuing to talk about a 2 state solution for 52 years while israel is doing everything possible to prevent it by the way there was never an israeli prime minister who really meant to
put an end to the occupation all ways and means to an ease the situation and to gain more time but there was not a single israeli prime minister who meant it seriously and there was no american president ever who really wanted israel to put an end to the patient would it be i think we wouldn't have been there anymore so all together there was a coalition no matter who was the president there a tour exchange but no american president president really took measures against israel in order to push it to put an end to the patient no israeli prime minister put an end to the settlements project and as long as those 2 things didn't happen you can take all those talking seriously except of lip service says by the end of the day we have now 70700000 settlers one of the more powerful political groups in israel nobody is going to evacuate them you have just
to travel along the west bank and see how it became israeli this is irreversible and instead of continuing to talk about something which will never take place we have to start to talk about the 30th ok you're saying go back to you and tell me if so what is the alternative i've already talked about the single state solution because that's what you're that's the default position now what do you do. well i don't i don't accept. you to toss all the blame to accuse israel is the only called for what is happening it's wrong these rebel. conflict has been. cultivated by due to site publishing is and these israelis that's that's why well i mean but but but that wouldn't you agree the 2 sides are not of equal power i think
that's pretty. obvious agree with you when israelis the occupying power so it's obviously stronger but things are changing their reality in the middle east is completely different the arab states don't care about the palestinian issue the arab states are much more concerned that these this sort of states are much more concerned that doesn't. ok just because the arab states think differently doesn't mean the palestinians own have a right to self-determination philip let me jump in because i agree i ok i accept their force and you'll be the i didn't say that but to put all the blame on the israeli wrong if he doesn't lead you doesn't lead us to a solution ok well philip cooney we're all rapidly running out of time but it is the united states that is allowed israel just to kick the can down the road the you
know the united states if it was determined enough without the influence of the lobby and even jello coals and all that kind of stuff there could have easily. pointed israel in the right direction and in syria would be a safer place and so would be the middle east i would argue ok one minute let's go ahead philip. ok it's very interesting i met a congressman a couple weeks ago and we had a discussion about this and he said you know things will change only when the united states treats israel like it treats every other country and that's why i believe if the united states from the beginning had applied the same standards it was applying to south africa the same standards that was applying to other places where there were agreed use human rights violations then the united states might have actually done something about it if the united states were concerned about actual american interests in the middle east it would have done something about it it would have pressured israel to change its policies but that hasn't happened israel lobby is extremely strong and we have
a president right now basically who feels it is but it is easy is it is most profitable for him as a person who can deal with the status quo and that's a tragedy for americans for israelis and for palestinians couldn't have said it better myself here a lot of a lot is ahead gentlemen the government in israel new government israel has in the middle stablish here many thanks to my guests in tel aviv and in personal and thanks to our viewers for watching us here at r.t. see you next time and remember. the process of constructing this was to train as a biodegradable scaffold which is porous and this is
inserted beneath the skin when the skin is suction over the scaffold over a period of about 6 months you have to shoot in growth and invest in occurring in other words the cells in your body grow into the scaffold it grows its own blood supply so now this is fully integrated as part of it's a living will. you .
and very well might continue watching on since last. this is a story about what happens auster a stray bullet kills a young girl in the streets. what happens to her family my daughter's in florida alone my other daughter is buried in a cemetery it meaning messes with your head what happens to the community the public was screaming for a scapegoat the police needed a scapegoat so why not choose a 19 year old black kid with a criminal record who better to pin this on than him and what happens in court be. shocked shocked as far as i feel. we don't know she'll share this truth on. the end of this trial unfortunately you truly
will still love no chill just. legal case brought against facebook by someone it bans could have liability implications for the social network which claims it can do it like as it is a publisher of morphine and painful to pull the plug on a huge trade deal between latin america and the e.u. over 5 is in the amazon yet multiple european firms are working with companies linked to the destruction of the rainforest plus. a major international military exercise in central russia rents in spinal stay in china and india among the disciplines and the american street where brands each by using the.