tv Government Access Programming SFGTV February 28, 2019 9:00am-10:01am PST
people of the state did not yield their sovereignty to the agencies who serve them. the people insist on remaining informed so they may retain control over the instruments they have created. and so november 3, we were here to decide whether or not we were going to add tasers to the use of force policy, and there was a disruption, and there was two things that were done. i went back and looked at it, and commissioner turman, first, he terminated the meeting and then he said it was at recess. and then, we were moved -- as you all know who were here, we were moved. you abo but i wanted you to know we were moved surreptitiously. we were moved through the mayor's office and to get on an elevator. we actually hid from the crowd
and went surreptitiously up to the fourth floor. and i was in a cast, and i had difficulty, and i remember how difficult that was. i said it in a statement, you request read it in here, and i -- you can read it in here, and i said it was surreptitious at that time. during the meeting, some people were able to come and sit, some weren't able to come and sit. so when the couple couldn't come, i went outside, and i was able to see that the building was closed. i went down stairs to the front door, and i saw that the sheriff's said it was ten minutes, it was 15 minutes. it was longer than that, and it was people who were just coming through the meeting, and they were yelling at me through the door. i was telling the sheriff, you have to let them in. there's a public meeting going on. it was kind of a -- it was kind of chaotic.
now, i'm -- i'm bringing this up not to chastise any individual commissioner, but we have to be transparent. if we made an error, we have to fix that error. if we violated the sunshine ordinance task force, if we violated the brown act, we need to fix that. we need to be transparent. whether we knowingly or unknowingly do that, we need -- it's our responsibility to really review and understand the task force. and whether we think we violated it or not, the task force said we violated it, three separate sections. and the most people one was statements in it, people who were turned away and left. there were people who were tenacious, and people who were turned away and left.
when i read this, i was just as disturbed then. i also want to point out that since we vote it had in -- i forgot their name -- tasers were -- axion, they've put in new rules, and one of them is not to shoot at mentally impaired individuals. they' they've clarified that, and they had four deaths in the south bay where four mentally impaired individuals were shot with taser's and died. axiom came, and they sowed doubt in the public's mind by saying well, maybe it wasn't our fault, and now, we have four people dead. i think we need to retake this vote. i think we need to be transparent, and i think we need to do it right.
>> president hirsch: commissioner, i want to be clear, we're talking today just about the sunshine ordinance task force letter. >> commissioner dejesus: right. i'm not saying we should take a vote tonight, i'm saying we should fix this letter. >> president hirsch: commissioner hamasaki? >> commissioner hamasaki: i want to thank commissioner hirsch for putting this on the agenda. i do agree with commissioner dejesus when challenges are brought to things that we have done, our procedures, our policies, that we face them in a public forum, and i think that's our duty and our responsibility as commissioners. you know, i've read the materials produced by the sunshine ordinance task force. i was not present, and, you know, i understand for the people who were present across the board, it was a difficult, emotional, and challenging night. and i've also read the
commission's -- or at least sergeant kilshaw's response, you know, identifying what i think is -- what i think is, to me, the compelling information that kind of guides my view of this, which is i don't think there was any intent upon any of the commissioners, the police commission, to hold a meeting in secret. [inaudible] >> commissioner hamasaki: i understand. however, i do think that through the actions of people outside of this body, we did violate the sunshine ordinance, and i think the task force's
findings. that doesn't mean -- i know some people really want this to be a time where we're going to recall a vote of tasers. that doesn't mean that that's the conclusion, and there's no -- or at least i haven't been presented with any authority that we're obligated to, even if everybody up here agrees with me, that's not how the ordinance and the task force works. i will echo commissioner dejesus dejesus' concerns, which are that tasers are a lethal weapon. we all understand that. we have learned, you know, since the policy passed since
the initial vote that we've discussed tonight, that they're a deadly weapon, and they -- when they're used on people, especially people in crisis or mental -- going through mental health crises, that they can be deadly. and as we've discussed on this commission at length, there's, you know, a lot of challenges in this city with mentally -- mental health crisis incidents. and so as a commission, just like with any other policy, procedure, action, i think the consideration of tasers, just like any other policy, is always open for consideration. but this -- it doesn't fall as a requirement of this, and i'm not going to vote tonight to support that. but i do think that it's --
it's -- because of the unique danger that tasers pose to our citizens, we do have a continuing obligation to continue to investigate to make sure that they're safe before we implement it here. but as far as tonight, i do agree that we -- we -- we -- even though i wasn't here, i think we made some mistakes. but what i'm taking away is that's lessons learned, and we move away from this point and try to ensure that this doesn't happen again. i think that the confidence of this city, confidence of the people is dependent on following the sunshine act. >> president hirsch: thank you. i want to address this letter because i was one of the commissioners there at that time. i was one of the three who was still here.
commissioner mazzucco is not here tonight, but commissioner dejesus and i were there. the meeting was called by commissioner turman to take place down stairs in room 250. he wanted to accommodate as many people as possible, and he wanted it in that room. if you go back and watch the meeting, for the first two, 2.5 hours, there were subject matter presentations, and then, we started with public comment. and public comment went on for quite a while, and it was disrupted. and it got to the point where the commission could not function, couldn't talk. we recognized -- the public has a right to engage in civil diso disobedience. we have a right to meet and transact the business of the commission, which is what we did. commissioner turman called a recess, and we all retreated. there were 25 of us back in a
very small room behind room 250, and we were there, under the custody of the sheriff's. the sheriff's office, the sheriff's department is responsible for security in this building. they told us we should not leave that room. they didn't feel it was safe. i don't know if that's right or not. nobody challenged it. that was their recommendation to us. [inaudible] >> president hirsch: no, i'm sorry. i want no outbursts here. you'll have your chance. we stayed back there for over an hour. there was no discussion of business. now, there's an allegation that the police commission had discussion during the recess. i don't know where that comes from. we did not discuss anything back there that had to do with our business. i sat next to president turman for more than an hour. we hardy spoke, but at one point, i asked him, what do you want to do, julius?
he said i want to have the vote, and i'm going to get the public to speak. i respected him for that. he had every right to go home and not have the meeting, but he didn't do that. he let the public speak. we were told we could access this room, and so we went through a side corridors to get up here, and a notice was put on the door at room 250. and two sheriffs were stationed outside the door, and they were directing people up to room 400. the notice said we are now meeting in room 400. i've been told since that the sheriff's office also escorted a large number of members of the public up to room 400, and i believe that because they ultimately were there, and if you watch the video, you'll see there were two -- two hours of testimony that were given by both public members and
experts. the task force criticized the commission, and i guess turman for not allowing people to speak. he had every right to shut the meeting down, and he did his best to let as many people as possible to speak. he limited it to two minutes. there was no discrimination among the public. the invited speakers who were subject matter experts are entitled to speak longer. that's set forth in the charter. the public was limited to two minutes. he had a right to do that. the sunshine ordinance task force was incorrect in finding people were not allowed to speak for the time allotted. we were not allowed to speak. we didn't know the front doors of the building were shut. that was not a decision made by the commission. it was a decision made by the sheriff's for security reason, but the task force cannot pin that on the commission. we don't make decisions about
security. in fact, the chief of police was in the back room behind room 250, along with his staff, command staff, along with d.p.a., city attorney, commissioners, our staff. the sheriff told us when it was safe to leave and go. they were in charge of the building. if the task force has an issue with the door being locked, they should take it up with the sheriff. you cannot pin it on the commission. we finally did have our discussion. it lasted for about two hours. we finally did have a vote. we had the vote, we were detained after the vote. we all had to be escorted to our cars, we were told. it was not safe for us to go outside to our cars. i don't know if that's true or not. i didn't ask the sheriff, how do you know that? are you sure about that? i let them govern security. the fine issue i have with this is -- the final issue i have with this is, it has two dates on this. it says date issues, june 6,
2018, order of determination, july 18, 2018. i don't know which date is right. but let's say it was issued on june 6. that was almost three weeks after turman passed away. president turman never saw this, never had a chance to respond to it. never had a chance to give us the benefit of his thinking as to why he decided to conduct the meeting he did. and if you want to talk about fairness in government, i really question why an event that happened in early november 2017 didn't result in a letter until june 6, 2018, three weeks after julius turman died. i think he did a good job under the circumstances, and he received guidance all along from the city attorney who was advising him legally what he could do and couldn't do. i just think the sunshine commission, if they have issues with what happened, they ought to talk to people who were in charge of security in the building. i didn't think the security was unsafe or unreasonable, but if they do, they should address it to them.
yes, commissioner dejesus? >> commissioner dejesus: so look, i don't want to get defensive or anything. i don't want to pin this on commissioner turman. we act as a body, and let's just take it down a moment. instead of pointing a finger at the sunshine task force, all they had was testimony from people who said they tried to come in and were turned away and never had an opportunity to come in and others who were finally able to get in after a fight. but the errors do not reflect on a particular commissioner, the error reflects on the commission as a whole. you never left the room, i did. and everyone in line said we didn't know where you went. and when they found out where you went, they were sending texts to people still down stairs, to room 400. i did not see the sheriff's escorting people come up. and i did go down stairs and saw some people locked up outside. some people were calling to me because they knew who i was.
it was two different groups. you should understand. one group was getting food. food wasn't allowed in, i get that. even though people were outside eating, i get that. on the other hand, there were people just trying to get to the meeting that can't get to come in. let's just take a breath and be transparent. if we made a mistake, we made a mistake. if we knew it was closed or not knowing it was closed, i knew it was closed because i saw it. with the combination of the sheriff locking the things -- locking the doors with the combination of surreptitiously -- and you can't say it wasn't surreptitious because it was. we just can't say we can't create an error, we did. the sunshine task force is a city agency, and they're there to make sure the brown act -- let's go back to the brown act. it's not an individual task force member, it's a brown act.
there's a california attorney general opinion that meetings cannot be semi closed, and that's the problem. it was semi closed. such that certain members of the public are allowed to attend while certain members are excluded. because of the attitude of the thing, because of certain people, yeah, that's happened. they can't reverse our teeth, and make us reverse our vote, but if you want to own up to what happened that night, we should correct it. there's no one saying we did it on purpose or did it anyone, julius did make a mistake, it was this commission that acted as a whole. >> president hirsch: commissioner elias? >> commissioner elias: for me, it was that people were turned away, denied access, and there was a violation. that's sort of what's important to me, in that people whether denied access, and that's sort
of my issue. whether whose fault it was and who wants to point the finger is irrelevant. what's important is a violation occurred and people weren't given access to talk about this important issue. >> president hirsch: okay. thank you. yes, commissioner hamasaki. >> commissioner hamasaki: thank you. and i don't -- i should know this, but i don't know what the form, the acknowledgements of this would take. and perhaps commissioner dejesus does. you know, i don't think the will exists to go back to the vote, but i think, you know, we as a commission can acknowledge that -- and again, i don't think -- just to be clear, nobody on this commission, the -- you know -- and i want to acknowledge the public comment that's to come, but i -- i don't see anything indicating that there was any actions by this -- by the
commission where intent was shown. but the effect was the same, and so i would like to acknowledge that, you know, to the degree that people were shut out or not given access in violation of the code, we should acknowledge that. >> president hirsch: commissioner dejesus? >> president hirsch: >> commissioner dejesus: it is on for an action item. i would move that we accept the findings of the sunshine task force, and we retake the vote on tasers. [inaudible] >> commissioner hamasaki: i mean, i would vote for the second part -- [inaudible] >> commissioner hamasaki: i mean, the first part. >> president hirsch: are you folks negotiating up here? >> commissioner dejesus: i'm making a motion. i'm making a motion that we agree to retake the vote on tasers. >> president hirsch: is there a second? all right. it dies for lack of a second.
anything else? if you don't want to speak, please remove your name. >> commissioner dejesus: then i make the motion that we at least accept the findings of the sunshine task force, and that we resolve to do better in the future and really hold ourselves accountable to the public and be transparent in everything we do hi. >> president hirsch: is there a second? >> commissioner elias: second. >> president hirsch: all right. public comment. and this is on the motion to accept -- can you state the -- all right. the whole issue. >> clerk: can i have them say it again? it's really unclear. >> president hirsch: well, let's just identify the motion so we all know what we're talking about. what is the motion? >> clerk: the motion is to accept the findings of the sunshine ordinance sask force and resolve to do -- task force and resolve to do better in the future, to -- i'm sorry, something about the public.
to keep the public informed. >> commissioner dejesus: yeah, to comply -- comply with the brown act and be transparent and keep the public informed. >> vice president taylor: can we say that we agree with it? >> commissioner dejesus: i tried. i didn't get a second. >> vice president taylor: does accepting mean that we agree with it or we just accept it? >> clerk: motion to accept the findings and comply with the brown act. >> president hirsch: okay. so now, we can have public comment. >> commissioner dejesus: the other one didn't get a second, so it's gone. >> brad edwards, excelsior. i'm a little shocked to find that commissioner hirsch rejects the finding of the sunshine ordinance task force. i further believe that while yes, there are temporal issues with any action or complaint, either it's within the statute or it's not, and that's then
perhaps not germane, but what might be is the letter, and that turman no longer being with us, to me, that's more evidence you don't have the availability of his input and that's more reason to retake the vote. for me, the most important thing, i think, is to note that commissioner dejesus is a profile in courage if i've ever seen one, and i'm very appreciative of her. [applause] >> and i have a copy for sergeant kilshaw for the body of the minutes. >> president hirsch: thank you. next speaker. >> oh, wrong one. >> hello. my name is dale again. yeah, i would ask that you not only accept the findings of the sunshine task force but that you retake the vote.
i don't find the transparency if the vote is illegal that you still count it any way. i find it really disparaging given that i was there that night, and we didn't know where the meeting was being held. people had to be locked out of the front door. people had to be begged to be let back in to the sheriff's. i'm sure there would be a lot more people here right now if they actually knew what the implications of this vote would be. so i would please ask to respect the findings of the task force, not only that, but respect that true transparency means that it means you violated the meaning of having a meeting, then the vote shouldn't count? if it doesn't count, you can just vote for everything behind a closed door, and say oh, okay, it's -- i'm sorry. it's just so baffling to me, being completely honest.
commissioner hirsch, i sat in a room with you, and you did actually listen to the community. and then, when you left that day, you were escorted by the sheriff's, but everybody that left left in shame because there were hundreds of people in that hallway, and they were screaming that you didn't make this fucking vote, because a fucking corporation is trying to make money off of murdering people. we've seen that in the bay area. we've seen that worldwide. i'm sorry. this is just ridiculous. >> president hirsch: thank you. next speaker. >> hi. my name's victoria, and i was also there that night of the vote and was also forced out of the room with hundreds of people out in the hall. we were all told we would have the opportunity to make comment. really, we were just held in a line, and so the effects of not only not following the brown act but also not being able to actually listen to public comment when that vote was made, i think that the only remedy here for this
commission's failure to follow the brown act would actually be to do a revote because your intent i think is regardless that the actual process and procedure is against the sovereignty of the people of san francisco. also, i think it's cowardly to ignore that months after this. no on h happened, and over 60% of san francisco voters voted against a p.o.a. initiative that would let the police pretty much have full range on tasers. i think that mr. hamasaki's take that there isn't the spirit for a revote is ignorant, especially considering the no on h vote, especially this commission did not pass the brown act, and i am sure the legislative intent of the brown act was for moments exactly like this,
where people who have the ability to make decisions for the public feel pressure and perhaps want to step on the public's access and right to be able to say what we know, what we think because of our lived experience. so i think that just deciding to accept the findings and try harder ignores 60% of voters who voted no on h because they wanted to vote no on tasers, and ignores the fact that this commission completely stomped over our access to decision making in san francisco. thank you. >> president hirsch: thank you. next speaker. yes, sir. >> my comments this evening are
in honor of marselle tony, murdered by taser in oakland, california on september 28, 2017, of warren raguto murdered in daly city, murdered by taser on january 27, 2018, and of chenudo okubi, in millbrae, murdered on october 28, 2018. i was there that night as i've been in every hearing surrounding the tasers of sfpd for over a decade. the characterization made by magic oatman, is the accurate one. commissioner hirsch's is a joke. it is a fallacy, it is flat out
false. commissioner hamasaki, the idea that there was any question of intent, there was a very clear and present and felt intent to deceive and remove the public from the decision making process. there is no question that makes it an illegal vote. if tasers are attempted to be issued to the sfpd, we will file for an injunction against this and we will win because of the illegality of that vote. so the only salient issue before this commission is how much contempt do you have for the will of the people of san francisco as has been established by previous commentators. your attempt is disturbing, disgusting, and the people will prevail. >> president hirsch: thank you. next speaker. >> good evening. i was not there that night, but i stand by everything that my friends before me said. and just from being at this meeting, you know, i just find
it funny the way this commission is treating this issue. like, this is the police commission, the commission that oversees the law enforcement body, so it's specifically concerned about making sure the law is enforced. and here in the face of a unanimous finding from a task force specifically created to find things about a specific law, in the face of the findings that a unanimous finding that this committee has violated that law, this committee says that we at best want to accept it or maybe blame it on someone else or say we accept it, but we're not going to do anything about it. i just find it very silly that a police commission would behave in that way. >> president hirsch: thank you. >> magic altman. i have worked on this for years. i've done due diligence. i went to the sunshine commission.
i had evidence, i had proofs from the sheriff's log that they falsefied the log by video that the commission -- that the task force saw. if you do not rescind this vote, you are once again undermine rg the rights of the people under the brown act and the sunshine task force's authority. this is an ethical and moral issue. no, it doesn't have legal teeth. no, you have to care. do you know that the commission has for 13 years and four votes blocked tasers? do you know that tasers were originally introduced as a nonlethal weapon and now there's been over 1,000 people since 2015 killed by them? do you know that sonoma county lost a $2.5 million lawsuit because someone was tased for half an hour? do you know that taser international cannot be sued by anyone except the city?
you are going to have a lawsuit on your shoulders unless you rescind this vote. i respected turman. we communicated with each other. in fact, he was vehemently opposed to tasers and was shocked, president hirsch at the way you talked that night and showed you that. if we want to do something for his memory, you did rescind this vote. i thank you, petra dejesus, i suggest that you rescind that vote. we don't need to take another vote on tasers until the other 271 recommendations by the department of the d.o.j. are evaluated and taken care of. and then, we'll talk about tasers later, so i really suggest that you don't vote on -- i think that threw people off. we don't need to talk about whether we'll vote on the tasers again. that's my suggestion until then, but i suggest you only vote on supporting the brown act and --
[inaudible] >> president hirsch: all right. thank you. thank you. thank you. [inaudible] >> president hirsch: yeah, time is up. your time is up. this is what happened last time. this is what happened last time. thank you. thank you. your time is up. [inaudible] >> president hirsch: thank you. time's up. thank you. okay. on the question, we have a motion pending. can we have a vote -- [inaudible] >> president hirsch: no, i'm sorry. we're not doing that. thank you. thank you. thank you. commission commissioner elias, do you have a comment? >> commissioner elias: well, yes. thank you, i do. >> president hirsch: well, you're on here. >> commissioner elias: i am. it does appear that way. so i guess i do have a comment about public comment because i think it's very ironic what one of the community members set is absolutely true. i'm not sure that we sit here and say that we're going to accept the finding that they violated the ordinance, but yet, the vote still stands.
>> commissioner dejesus: i tried to have a different motion. >> president hirsch: we can't -- that's not on the agenda now for us to vote. but that -- by the way, that was not the only vote we took on tasers. there was a vote months later where we actually approved tasers and passed a policy. so we're not here to address that now. it's not on the agenda. the agenda item, and the only thing we're allowed to talk about under the brown act is the letter. let's follow the brown act. it's what you folks want to do. i just have a problem when the sunshine task force blames the commission for doing something that we had no control over. we did not control security. >> commissioner elias: gu we hawe -- but we have the power to fix it. if a violation of people's rights have occurred, we as the commission have a responsibility to sort of right wrong. >> president hirsch: all right. commissioner hamasaki?
[inaudible] >> president hirsch: no, public comment was closed. is there a public comment now? look, folks, we're trying to do this in a way that we're structured, so if you have a public comment, please make it. >> my apologies, this is my first public comment ever, so i'm new. this is my intro, and i've lived in the city a few years now. my name is alexandra malek, and i was not there that night. i -- this is my first time in front of all of you, and i'm here to support what everyone said before me, as well as say this is a really unfortunate time to be introduced to this process. i'm sorely disappointed, and i was really hoping that we'd be able to talk further and in more depth about what was done that night because after hearing what happened, i was disappointed and i was really hoping for a little bit more hope.
thank you. >> president hirsch: thank you. commissioner elias, are you still onto talk? all right. commissioner dejesus? >> commissioner dejesus: i'm just going to say it again, motion to accept the findings of the sunshine ordinance task force, amend motion to amend findings of june 6, 2018 and resolve to be better in the future, be transparent and comply with the brown act in all future meetings, and further move that the commission rescind that vote until the 272 recommendations from the department of justice task force can be met. can i do that? >> president hirsch: well, i'm going to ask the city attorney, but we've already had a motion to rescind that motion. you now can't bring up the same motion in the same meeting. >> commissioner dejesus: but why -- >> president hirsch: hang on. well, you alternated it in form but not in substance. it's the same motion, really. >> it is the same motion, but
again, these are parliamentary rules, and it depends on how the commission would like to govern itself. >> president hirsch: well, there's a motion pending right now, and i think we ought to have -- it's been motioned and seconded, and we've had discussion on that motion. >> commissioner dejesus: no, but i've amended -- >> president hirsch: we're not just going to pull rules -- [inaudible] >> commissioner hamasaki: can we discuss this -- we can discuss this for a minute, can't we? can we have a discussion? >> commissioner dejesus: go ahead. >> commissioner hamasaki: yeah, i mean. you know, i hate to say this, but, you know, one of the benefits of being a new commissioner is that i didn't have to fight this battle, i didn't have to live everything that everybody's been through over the past so many years, and, you know, when i started the commission, i printed out
all of the materials that were on the taser section of the police commission website that were submitted by the public by various individuals and entities. but you know, my reticence to open up the vote is i don't feel i'm prepared right now. but i take -- i do take -- this is -- i'm having a conflict and being reminded of the way the public responded, you know, with the one voice that they have, which is their votes, to tasers, you know, i hadn't thought about that for a while, and i thank the public for reminding me. and i'm -- i'm conflicted right now, and i don't know, you know -- like i said before, i'm always open to revisiting the
taser vote. any vote that this commission has taken, we learn, we grow, we have new experiences. and i -- i don't know that i have an answer here, but i do take what commissioner elias said to heart. i think that, you know, the way i thought about it might have been a bit of a punt in that this is a hard issue, and this is why people show up. and i don't -- i don't -- i don't know what the right move is here, to be honest. i don't have an answer. >> president hirsch: okay. then let's move onto the next commissioner. who's next? vice president taylor? >> vice president taylor: yeah. i just want to comment on one thing. you know, i -- i agree with -- with commissioner hamasaki. i was not there, and i did not
live through those ordeals -- that ordeal, but i did watch the videos. i watched the hours and hours and hours of -- of the -- the -- of the hearings and the difficult process. and i think that it's easy to armchair quarterback, but the people who made the vote did so with a lot of deliberation and a lot of -- people like julius turman getting overserious conflicting emotions. members of this commission voted no on h, including, i'm sure, members of this commission who voted yes on tasers. so voting on unfettered access to tasers as opposed to having tasers with serious, serious restrictions, the idea that those two things are the same is just false. those were not the same issues
that were up for consideration, and the -- the -- the proposal that was passed concerning tasers was not the same thing that was put forth to san francisco voters on proposit n proposition. >> president hirsch: okay. i'm going to put forth the motion that's pending. >> commissioner hamasaki: i'm going to say that commissioner dejes dejesus has a right to -- >> president hirsch: the item on the agenda is the discussion regardtion the sunshine ordinance task force order of determination of june 6, discussion and possible action. i don't think we have the authority to make new motions. now if i'm wrong, i'll ask assistant city attorney cabrera. do we have athe power to put ay motion concerning tasers on the
agenda? >> no. it has to be on the agenda as written. >> commissioner dejesus: i am saying we recognize and accept the sunshine task force which says we violated the brown acting regarding that vote on november 3. the only thing that i'm adding is we rescind that november 3 vote until the 272 department of justice recommendations are met. that's within the confines of things that are here tonight. the whole thing about the sunshine task force is the vote that was on november 3. and even though they can't tell us to rescind it, we can rescind it. are you saying we can't? >> i'm saying that your agenda does not state that you are rescinding and putting back on the agenda to take a revote of the taser decision. >> commissioner dejesus: well, it says action item, and i'd like to resind the vote where we violated the brown act on november the 3.
you can reword it that way -- >> if you'd like to do that, you can put it on the agenda and reword it that way. >> president hirsch: i can't believe you folks want to follow the brown act and now you want to violate the brown act. come on. >> commissioner dejesus: she's wrong. she said it's parliamentary procedure. >> commissioner hamasaki: right. she gave an answer that's parliamentary procedure that's well within our scope and procedure of tasers. she's saying the d.o.j. recommendations, we can move back at any point -- this does fall from this action, and i think the public said it well and commissioner elias also reframed it in a way that it makes sense to me. this doesn't -- what that'll do is give us all -- all of us the time to do our due diligence,
to do our homework, to understand if this is the right thing to do. because like i said, when i started off, i wasn't going to -- under line, i don't know the right answer about tasers. that may be disappointing to some people, i'm not saying vote yes or no, but i would think that allowing us the time as a new commission to educate ourselves, to hear from experts, to read the materials that commissioner hirsch and commissioner -- i'm sorry, president hirsch and commissioner dejesus read -- i think because that is such a hard issue, that is within our obligations. >> president hirsch: what is the restated motion? >> clerk: motion to find the sunshine ordinance task force of june 2, 2018, and resolve to
do better in the future, to be transparent and comply with the brown act in all future meetings and further move that the kpligs rescind the -- commission rescind the vote until all 272 department of justice recommendations are met. >> commissioner hamasaki: i second it. >> president hirsch: we're going to take a vote on that. we're just going to take a vote on it. i'm done with the conversation. all right. can we have a vote on the revised motion. >> clerk: on the revised vote made by commissioner dejesus, seconded by commissioner hamasaki -- [roll call] >> president hirsch: i do say we will be open and do as best as we can, but i will not
support that motion. >> clerk: the ayes are three, the noes are three, the motion fails. >> president hirsch: okay. next line item. >> clerk: item six, general public comment. the public is now welcome to address the commission regarding items that do not appear on tonight's agenda but are within the subject matter jurisdiction of the commission. speakers shall address their remarks to the commission as a whole and not to individual commissioners or d.p.a. personnel. neither police or d.p.a. personnel nor commissioners are required to respond to questions provided by the public but may provide a personal response. please limit your comments to two minutes. >> so my comment -- comment is about how this procedure's happened. i think that commissioner hirsch really tried to bulldoze
what happened here, and it doesn't feel right. by the way, even though the city attorney said something, city attorney said both of my appeals to the sunshine ordinance task force was improper, and the task force upheld both of my decisions. so is this going to be another motion? are we going to be done with this? it means that what i did was worthless, that the public participated in every legitimate way and you're not going to do anything about this, you're not going to rescind the vote -- by the way, proposition h was considered by the public and mandated against tasers. yes, the details were different. i know the nuance was different. also, you're appointed by the mayor, and so are you. just originally against tasers
until her brother was in prison and angela al yoioto called he out on this. what are you doing on this commission? black people are dieing because of this. i've done everything i'm supposed to do. this is what happens when the public does their work. what do we have to do? do we have to disrupt meetings to make something happen? this is heartbreaking. i have put in years on this, years, and i did the right thing and the commission -- and the task force did the right thing. you're not respecting them, you're not respecting the public either. it it's shameful hi. >> president hirsch: did you want to say something? >> hi. i just wanted to echo everything magic just did, and let you all know it is an exercise of what little democracy we have in this
country. you might think this falls into rhetorical language, but this country was founded on racism and genocide. when you have the president of this commission -- and doesn't have an actual -- doesn't have an actual system to hold officers accountable when they have been found of misconduct, when they have been found to be bigots. although -- essentially, transparency doesn't matter. you can make votes however you want, and that essentially means that, like, this whole process is bullshit, but i don't know what i was really expecting, coming here being real. just more of the same, i guess. >> president hirsch: next
speaker. >> jeremy miller, director, interstellar foundation, member, cop watch. i'll be very clear. a huge segment of this city and county of san francisco as well as less implicated peoples around the nation and the world do not view this body or any other body like this as anything legitimate. they view these bodies as band-aids, as relief valves to keep the people from rising up and taking their rights. every time a mockery of the people's will like what happened tonight occurs, it
reinforces that feeling. and the people, not just the people of the city and county of san francisco but us included, as well, have sovereign right as people to self-defense. when war is declared against our persons, our bodies, whether it be by a gang, by a law enforcement agency, by a government or by an army, we have that right to self-defense. so it amazes me that sitting up here on this dais, outside of a have you examples of worth -- a few examples of worthy courage, you feel so safe in lighting this match. there is no situation here. there is a situation that's beyond my power, and chief, it's beyond your power, too, it's beyond the mayor's power. but it's extraordinarily dangerous to confuse kindness with weakness. if the people are pushed,
people are tortured, tasers are a torture device, if the people are murdered, at some point, the chickens are going to come home to roost, and then, whatever happens will be on your shoulder. >> president hirsch: next speaker. >> i just want to back up what was said. i think it is important to go back to the historical record and especially look at the intend no on h. it was one of the times that you saw many groups all on the same poster. it was one of the times you were able to go through your guide book, voter guide look over 13 comments of people speaking very honestly about what tasers do to people. they kill. they're not a replacement for a gun, they're used up until a gun is used mp.
i think we saw that as a wedge, a taking away as a complete robbery, assault of our rights on that night that our brown act rights were violated. and i think that, you know, a five-minute quibble moved commissioner hirsch from saying we have to follow the brown act to throwing your hands up and saying we have to take this motion. i think it goes to show how quickly motions can run our decisions here. but i think we have an opportunity to move around axon. axon has gone around every political body in this country. and every single day, i didn't see you, commissioner taylor, actually talking to voters during the campaign. i talked to hundreds of them on no on h. had broke my -- it broke my heart when i had to explain,
this isn't about tasers, it's about taser policy. what kept me going even though i felt like i was fighting for this watered down bill, was kids being killed by tasers, about people who looked like my grandma being killed by tasers, and people who look like me being killed by tasers. and i will keep fighting -- [inaudible] >> president hirsch: okay. thank you. thank you. [inaudible] >> president hirsch: no, no -- thank you. no public -- [gavel]. >> president hirsch: i'm sorry. [inaudible] >> president hirsch: you have a comment? [inaudible] >> president hirsch: okay. next agenda item. >> clerk: item seven, public comment on all items pertaining to item below, closed session,
including item eight, vote whether to hold closed session. >> president hirsch: public comment ongoing into closed session. hearing none, public comment is closed. >> clerk: item eight, vote on whether to hold item nine in closed session. san francisco code section 67.10 action. >> motion. >> second. >> president hirsch: all in favor? [voting] >> president hirsc >> do we need to do anything other than -- ♪ we have to vote to elect whether to disclose anything in closed session. [indiscernible] >> second. all in favor? opposed? >> item 11. adjournment action.
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