tv Charlie Rose WHUT June 16, 2011 9:00am-10:00am EDT
>> charlie: his new film is called super 8. >> charlie: the thing that mattered to me more than that was the heart of the movie, the main kid. this is a kid who's receny lost his mother and left with his father and never had a relationship and has no hope, no joy and the idea is in the course of the movie he has to find his voice and fight for what he believes in and deal with his dad and save the girl. it was a story of this kid going from boy to man and why i said it in '79 the end of an era and
the last moment of encroaching adulthood and there were a lot of issues i care far more than the spectacle but it was fun. >> charlie: and conclude with andrew roberts with the book, "storm of war." >> he kept putting his ideology, his fascistdeology again and again you see in the second world war. he would have done better that a german nationalist would have done better than hitler because hitler when faced with going down the best nazi route or rman route would choose the former. >> charlie: why? >> because he was a one-horse pony. that's all he had. >> charlie: a j.j. abrams mie and a book about the second
>> charlie: additional funding provided by these funders. captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. >> charlie: j.j. abrams is here and written and direct and produced some of the most successful television shows and films in recent memory. [♪] >> i can't believe it. i' officially become a cheater. i am a cheater. i cheated on ben and now the paper. >> fine, don't get caught this time. >> it's getting published.
think i'll do it. where is it? where the hell is it? >> look at me. stay with me. >> i swear to god i'm going kill you. [ screaming ] >> you're under arrest. >> nice work. >> thank you. >> charlie: perhaps the best job of his life came as a teenager at 15 he and a friend were hired to cut togetherst eve spielberg's 30 llimeter movie
and now they're collaborating for real. the film "super 8" is produced by steven spielberg and here's the film's trailer. >> i have nothing against your friends. i like your friends. things obviously change for us. >> i haveo help charles finish his movie. >> be good for you to hang around friends that don't hang around cameras and mster makeup. >> could you close you're eyes, please. and, action! >> an eastbound freighter
derailed. what the cargo w on the freighter we don't know. >> we can' tell anyone. >> i understand you have concerns about our cargo. >> there isn't anything else i should know, is there? >> i can assure you the answer is no. >> it's like they allus jt rara aw .y i've got property damage. i've got theft. i've got nine people missing now. there's things happening around here i can't explain. >> we have to find this thing. >> i don't feel good about this. >> go! >> i saw it.
no one bieves me. >> i believe you. what the hell. >> charlie: super 8 opened june 11th. i'm glad to have j.j. abrams back at this table. welcome. >> thank you >> >> abrams and spielberg. >> crazy. >> charlie: more than that. a dream. >> it's a privilege toork with someone whoas a hero of mine as a kid and to get to work with him and have it exceed expectations is uunbelievable. >> charlie: it exceeded expectations. >> it did, once to get pass the idea of working wit working witi
coul't be a fan and he has so many ideas. he has no ego that the latest idea may not be the right idea. may not fit. he's got another one behind it. >> charlie: you two had developing ideas that overlapped. >> i had a notion about a movie called "super 8" about kids making a movie on 8 film like i did and i called him and he said yes before there was any sense of story and that was the beginnings of . he said he always wanted to put the idea of kids making movies into a film b hadn't figured out the way to do it and that's the beginning of the story >> charlie: and said i'll pruce u direct? first you need a script. >> i said you want to produce this where me and i started meeting with writers to see if there was somebody who wanted to
take it on and the more i did it the more i felt it's not what the movie wants to be and combined the idea with another thing i thought of which is something escaping from a crashed plane more of a monster movie and that idea allows me to make the internal kid the main character is having. >> charlie: joel. >> yeah. and all of an end it started to make sense and i called steven and i said i want to take a crack at writing this. >> charlie: he said you made my day. >> luckily he said okay. >> charlie: first of all you have the idea for super 8 and have something for the kids to be make, right. so therefore you have to create in your script what happens to them. >> the movie they're making or the thing that happens to them in the story. >> charlie: the idea is to have kids making a movie, right. super 8. >> yes. >> charlie: then you have something for them want to do. >> part of the idea is they're
making a zombie moviend the train crashes and -- >> charlie: th's something steven can identify with. >> he loves that stuff and fun rking with him on tt stuff but wh mattered more was the heart of movie. the main kid who recently lost his mother and left with a father whom he never had a relationship and has no hope, no joy, the world is dark for him and the idea is in the course of this movie he has to find his voice and fight for what he believes in and deal with his dad and save the rl. it was a story of this kid going from boy to man and that's why i said it in '79 the end of an era it's all about that last moment of true childhood and encroaching adulthood so there were a lot of issues i care about far more than the speck acca
-- spectacle but it was fun. clearly what happens in the story is fantastical and nuts. but the origin was incredibl in relatable to me and seeing the details the set dressers would leave and guide and i remember reading that issue cover to cover 30 years ago and bizarre seeing the model and posters and games and books and things buthat was sort of the way in but what ends up happeninwas somethg that never happened to me as a kid because it's crazy. >> charlie: we can't give it away. in fact you're so obsessive about secrecy of plot.
>> what is this? >> charlie: am i write or wrong? >> years ago i wrote a script and it went online and it made me paranoid i have to admit. so i just thought we should be more careful but the truth is i go to the movies and i'll see a trailer and the trailer will end and i feel like why do i have to see the movie. it's done. what's amazingis this is everyone feels so entitled with instant information whenever you want it in your hand the idea of something you aren't being told you feel a sense of entitlement like i want to know why that is and and when they're not told they analyze why they're not be told and go to the theatre. be surprised. have fun. >> charlie: so you recommend people not read reviews before they see a film.
i have friends that don't read reviews of books or films. i ad everhing. >> you do. there are all types. my feeling is -- here's the thing, i like to go in knowing as little as possible. i just saw my wife -- we saw the woo woody allen movie one night in paris and i enjoyed not knowing anything about it and therere movies where i'm on the fence so i think it depends. >> charlie: if you like a movie do you like to go back with your analytical brain >> to see it again? >> charlie: sure. >> i'm sureyou do to go to see a movie and you're a filmmaker you can't help but be aware of the process but at the same time the greatest movies you get lost in which the idea of 3-d can beoolis
beside the points. the great movies suck you in f more than 3 does. it's a story. >> charlie: what's the common denominator of everything you do, story telling? >> i can tell you what it should be and what i'm determined to do is it's got to be something they desparately love and i would truly want to se myself. there e times when you work on something and you think t audience will love this and you are doomed. like if you think you kn -- it's never going to work and if it does which it could i guess was a hollow victory because it wasn't what you love it was a guess. >> charlie: okay. lost is what you wanted to do? >> lost is the very begin and when you mention lost as you did earlier that run was six years by them and i was off doing mission impossible and star trek. to be fair that show -- the
beginning was i wrote it with damon but that show went on for 100-pl episodes more. >> charlie: give credit where credits a due. mission impossible. would you like to direct another one? >> it was fun. i sort of feel like i don't direct movie after movie after movie so i'd want to try something else. >> charlie: when i saw it and knew you had done it and got great reviews my sense was you just wanted to know you can do it. >> e fact you're considering me at an moment you made my day. you have no idea the thing is i'd never directed a movie before. out nowhere and m sayin this -- it blindsided me. i got a phone call that tom cruise wanted me to direct this movie, "mission impossible 3" which was insane to me maybe help on a script but the idea to direct the movie was
preposterous but i did it because it was a chance not just to play in the genre and mission impossible the tv series inspired alias the show i had done so it was an incredible chance tom gave me no one else would have. >> charlie: you never for a moment thought of not trying to do it. >> as soon as i knew it was an oprtunity i knew it was the right thing which is by the way how i felt about star trek though i was never a star trek fan. it wa was right for me. >> charlie: will you do another star trek? >> we're working on another one. >> charlie: what does this breed? is this a series, a television series. >> no, it will end after super 8 is just once. >> charlie: because knowing sense of not everything wanting
to be knowand fresh eyes in the theatre, you want me to show some clips or -- >> if showing clips means i get to talk to you less than no. >> charlie: no. let's just see this of what this man does so well. first clip. >> i didn't put it in. what? >> put it in! go! go! go! [ multiple chatter ] >> get in camera. get the it ready. go, go, go. i hope we don't miss it. >> shut up. i am trying. [ all screaming ] .
>> ready, be ready. be extra loud when the train goes by. action. >> john, ion't like it. the case the murders. >> what do you want know go to michigan with you. >> it's beautiful this time of year. i think you're in danger. >> i don't have a choice. >> you do have a choice. sean, i need to know this isn't the last time i'm going see you. i love you so much. >> i le you too. >> watch out. what the hell -- [ crash ] >> oh, my god! >> run! >> oh, my god! >> charlie: you watch that intently. >> well, it was one watching the kids. >> charlie: you said when it started -- >> the kids were great.
a couple of those kids had never been on the set of anything before and in starring roles in a movie and it was amazing watching them handle it and i remember the scene we shot over a number of days and it was an incredible thing to watch these kids who a few weeks earlier had never been on a set suddenly understand blocking and being sweet to each other and the crew. if was like making movies when i was a kid again. >> charlie: how do you explain it, just that? >> kids in the movie wer real kids not the hollywood kids acting their age. they were actually their age. >> charlie: and how did you find them? >> whad great casting rectors. april webster and alyssa weisberg a what happened is while we were shooting the movie we had had great guy jay falley was running lines with them so when they came to set they were ready to go. like they never came to set
having forgotten their lines. they werready to g that was a wonderful thing. >> charlie: do you want to act at all? >> i wouldn't do that to the people. >> charlie: me on. >>o, i did little bit just so figure itut but i feel ke, you kn, i honestly -- >> charlie: you can't imagine yourself putting yourself in one of your movies? >> no, i would never do that. >> charlie: if spielberg said -- >> please, star in lincoln. >> charlie: is that what he's doing next, lincoln? >> the man is unstoppable and daniel day lewis. >> charlie: that will be unbelievable. >> it's over right now. >> charlie: anyone else competing that year forget it. danielay lewis is perfect. can we see one more scene. i want to see joel played by joel courtney. role tape. >> how am i supposed to be a
zombie. >> oh, some, just be a lifeless ghoul with no soul with eyes that are scary. did you ever have miss mullen for english. >> yeah. >> like her but hungry for flesh. you want to turn somebody into a zoie because that's what they do. i got an idea. it's really good. >> stop it. >> really? >> really.
>> charlie: it makes you feel like you're their age. that fantastic. >> well, that was them. they're amazing. >> charlie: back to spielberg. >> yes. >> charlie: what did you learn from this experience with him? >> oh, my god. first of all it was an education working with him. you know, part of it was learning to trust my instincts. there's a moment we were working on the script after a number of i don't know how many meetings d finally he just said,j.j., go write the script. [laughter] >> because i'd been trying to figure it out so much and he was like stop think go do the thing. i was like okay, good. >> charlie: that's a good principle for life. >> it is but every step of the production -- here's the thing about the magic of steven and it's true in his movies and with
him, he sees the best version of him. >> charlie: in his mind he knows how good it can be. >> when i showed him the first cut he -- he got emotional in the scenes that eventually people get emotional watching and laughed at scenes when you would laugh and saw it in the beginning and in the rough cut he saw it and it was the thing where he just knew. he's just so -- he's just incredibly wise about story and film that he was able to make me relax and keep going because i knew he believed in it and he knew that it was going okay and that gave me comfort >> charlie: the ideao be able to vualize what is really good and know that in your brain so you know if you're not there and
how much better it can be is a huge gift. >> and by the way it's his heart. that's the thing about steven if you tch his movies it's the same thi but even th darkest of his stories that he's told there was always eye sense of being in the hands of someone who is -- who had -- who is humane and going to take care of you. there's a safety in that it never felt sadistic or some kind of overpowering darkness. it was an optomism in everything that he's done and a feel like in working with him it is -- after working for someone as long as we have on thank you g to know who this persois. >> charlie: and might you work together again? >> i would hope so. i would love it. >> charlie: is it inart homage to him because you both have this a-8 millimeter experience and thought it would be nice to
have a film based on like we were making a movie. >> super 8 was inspired by the movies of that time and a lot of those movies ha an influence on me were his production company and this is an amblin production and the fact he put his stamp on it and allowed me to embrace the dna of what amblin movies are and usually they include young characters or empowerment of kids and families that are broken that need to be fixed and other worldly super natura element and heart. even if they didn' always do it but their ambition was to make you feel so you left the movie having you thought more and shreeked more and cried and if you have all the feelings theye the perfect date movie
and if you're adult or a kid and the movies steven was in large part responsible for. >> charlie: how many of your filmmaking essence is something essentially you. >> when i was eight years old i knew i wanted to make movies crystal clear to the point in elementary school and friends would say they didn't know what they wanted to do was like really. i didn't know if i would make a living at it but i knew it was what i wanted and we are all obviously of our experiences and this weird combo of thing but it was clear to me at a very young age what my goal was and so as i went to universal studios with my grandfaer and saw how movs were made and i loved magic as a kid and it was
my obsessi as much as secrecy and i knew it was it because movies are all about the illusion of anything and you can apply magic to a form of entertainment. it was a lucky idea. >> charlie: you know how lucky we are to do what we most want to do. >> these luckiest thing in the world. it's amazing thing to me that i was able -- >> charlie: david brook wrote a column in the new york times which i found appealing where he said everybody looks to find themselves and their identity and the best thing to happen to you young is to lose your identity in something larger than you are and for you lose you are your identify in the films and doing your thing. in this film supe8 the lo story is central. the most important element. the fantasy of making a movie and the love ory.
>> it is. yeah. the love story's always the most important thing to me in the movie and it can be between friends and tha and familial th the kid is talking to the main character and he needs the main character in this movie to have a love interest or you won't care about the main character and as he's talking to the main character in our movie he's going i can't believe you talked to that girl meaning in the scene we're discussing how stories work and how love stories are important and all we do is talk about the love story of super 8 and i think it would be hard for me to make a movie that i really cared about where there wasn't a romantic interest. there wasn't -- that to me has always been the most important. >> charlie: rooting for love.
you are a romantic, aren't you? >> i guess am. i think so but i feel this kid in the beginning is alone, lost his mother and devastated and the story -- i always feel like a movie is the dream that the main character goes through to become enlighten and more fully realize and the dream this kid is having through the film is going from follower to leader and has to find his own voice and finds the world can be happy again and there can be joy and confront the father with whom he never had a connecon and the friends he followed around are now following him and confront the thing that scares you the most and does and in this ce it's this creature. >> charlie: as you laid it out did you say to yourself these are the elements i need in my movie? >> no, it was in retrospect.
therwerehings i knew like the creature represented the mourning, the loss of his mom. it wasn't just a monster but a thing he needed inevitably confront and when he does he says words to the things he needs to hear. it's what lets him survived. >> charlie: in your films what roles do heroes play? he becomes a hero. >> but the funny thing about heroes is they're usually the most beaten up character and getting their asses kicked again and ain andagai but don't stop. >> charlie: because of the dream. >> because of what they need to go through to come out the oth side. a lot of time heroes -- people think the guy's always beating up, no, he gets beat up but comes back again and again. the character that gets beaten
up isthe character you are interested in. >> charlie: why is that? underdog. >> the guy that walks in and everyone's like immediately in that scenario -- >> charlie: they say inamerica by people who look at these nds things we love -- in america you can always have a second chance. we love the idea of the meback and we do. maybe it's true in other cultures too. maybe it's true in europe and asia. >> it's very much what you just hit hits the nail on the head. this movie is about a second chance and having gone through this tragedy and realizing you can live another day and be stronger than you were before. >> charlie: a montage of spielberg before we go. roll tape. here it is.
>> charlie: magic. genius and magic. you wanted to tell a story real quick. >> steven has the scripts in the office at only the original scripts from the shoot in his office and once day i saw he had the scpt and i said can i look at one and he said sure and i pulled down the jaws script from the original set. peter benchly wrote the book. the screen play was written by a number of people. robert shaw did work too but anyway there were all these multicolored pens and story board and i open to the middle of the script just to a random page and what i saw was that scene you just showed and what was amazing was there were three speeches in the middle. short speeches thatad all been crossed outway red pen and in it's place is ""brody, we need
bigger boat." and the lines that were crossed out were not memorable lines. we need help. >> charlie: we need a bigger boat. >> maybe the classic line was just the kind of capricious moment that steven wrote the line and it's film history and just another great reminder you don't know where the lasting moment's going to come from. you have to follow your bliss. >> charlie: the doing of the thing too. >> it is. >> charlie: congratulations one more time. >> thank you very much. >> charlie: super 8 opened in theatres on june 11 but if you want to celebrate what movies are about heres a good place to do it. andrew roberts is here as you know a british historian and journalist and most recent book is a storm of war. a new history of the second world war and looks at the axis
regime, hitler and germany's downfall and represents penmanship and reading and was awarded the british army military book award for 2010 and pleased to have andrew roberts back at this table. welcome. >> thank you. >> charlie: this is a book born of the idea of could hitler have won the war. >> could hitler have won and w didn he. one thinks of 1940 how well he did anyone at that time would have been forgiven for thinking the germans would win the second world war and why did he lose. >> charlie: before we talk about the fatal flaw, what was it about him that made him effective before he went bad. >> it's the same as the final
flaw, his monomania and put the thing he wants first and foremost only getting 2.3% of the popular vote in germany he still carried on with his message of hatred and resentment and some were willing to listen to him. >> charlie: some evidence in the press this weekf the earlst rantings of his anti-semitism. >> it goes back early to the readg of the pamphlet back when he was down and out in vienna and he believed it. it was central to his world view and something this over powering hatred and resentment where he was able to use the jews for all germany's ills.
>> charlie: as a political argument. >> a racl scapscapegoat. >> charlie: the reason you lost is not because of you. >> the reason we have inflation is not because of you, it's because of these people and we can blame them. >> charlie: okay. as a militar a military strateg good? >> he was good at giving the generals their head and telling them he could decide on how to invade poland and wouldn't interfere. >> charlie: is that true? >> absolutel and through the forest in may 940 in which the germans came up with the plan to go through the english channel with btzkrieg was a brilliant plan and knocked france out of the war in six weeks and something hitler specifical
supported. >> crlie: why did he lose? >> he kept putngis nazi believe before the best interest of the war. he would havedone better that a german nationalistwoul he done far better than hitler because hitler when faced with going down the nazi route or german route would choose the nazi. >> crlie: why? >> he was a one-horse pony, that's all he had. he started to believe he the super warlord of all time and the propaganda about him and though he would listen to his generals and we have this word for word what was being said in the meetings in east russia and listen for up to an hour and then do precisely what he intended to.
>> charlie: why are we so fascinated by world war ii. >> it still molds our world. look at the united nations it's th victors and powerful ideology. >> charlie: the further you get from it and the further you get from 19 and what happened after that and the more you get to a paradigm of shifting of power to the east it's less than. >> it wi be but then look what happened to the east aselland japan took one-sixth of the land's surface in one year and your country having built 40 aircraft carriers destroying it and have paradigms with powerful records. >> charlie: and there's mething about the nazis. >>the sheer level of their evil is -- charlie: hanarathic. >> she talks of the el and she was right and yet it seems to still be something that we must concentrate on. i believe we have to concentrate
on it because so much of the forms of evil you do see again. if you're looking at rwanda and yugoslavia and others you see the way in which people's sense were dulled and genocides took place in some way the holocaust was the template. >> charlie: when could is have been vented? >> march 26th. if they'd listened to churchill and stopped hitler. >> charlie: they being -- >> the french and the british governments. really it would have been wonderful if you're country becamizelationists after the treaty. if you joined the league of nation and played aart in the politics then i couldn't think he would have gotten away with
it. >> chaie: when y look at what it s, what was hisskill. what unabled him to take over a nation? >> oratory. in t age of television he wouldook like a ridiculou ridic person but he was able to keep an audience wrapped in the rallies was something that hadn't been seen before. >> charlie: how did he do it? >> he practiced a lot. >> charlie: and churchill does. >> churchill would spent as many hours practicing as minutes in the speech. >> charlie: so if the speech was 30 minutes he would spend 30 hours practicing. >> marching back and forth to music. >> charlie: church hill. >> yeah.
>> charlie: and churchhill understand pause more than hitler. with hitler was the tempo. >> and the srtening of seences. he would start off with long sentences and by the end it was different. this was something ao in a 40-minute speech nobody would be able to pick up. you wouldn't notice it so the heart rate would be pounding by the end of this oratory. >> chaie: churchhill would diagram his speeches in the most interesting way and his son in law woul build in the pauses almost as if he was searching for the word. it made a sense he was not reading a prepared speech as clearly hitler was doing but
thinking and talking extemporaneously. >> you can see it psalms form. it looks like psalms. you have an important letter. >> it was a very important letter. i came across it in my research. >> charlie: how did you find it? >> in a collection none of us knew we had it and 100,000 letters, papers, libraries and no one knew and when i came across the letter and the director of nations and hitler headquarters it explained that hitler was expecting to capture the hole of the bf.
>> charlie: bf is british expeditionary force. >> he put his forces above the town and held them up four days and not sent them into the town and various reasons and one conspiracy theory is that hitler wanted to make peace with britain and didn't want to capture the bf. this letter destroys all that. >> charlie: so why would hitler knowing the lessonsof napoleon go east. >> well, the eastward attack takes place becaus of three reasons. first, hitler wanted to have a final reckoning against the bolsheviks and then he knew that overalf of germany's jews -- sorry, europe's jews lived in the ussr in 1941 and finally of course he wanted living space
for s german peoe and so because he believed they were a master race because he believed the slavs were sub humans and said we will kick in the door and it will come crashing down. he believedis storm troops would be strong enough to get through thrussian winter even without winter clothing. >> charlie: he thought he was better than napoleon or the winter wouldn't be there. >> he thought the mechanism would get him further than horses wereble to get napoleon but napoleon got moscow and it wasn't the answer. for every five germans killed in combat four died in the eastern front. what we were doing and britain d america and canada were doing were killing the fifth
german. the r is won and lost in the east. >> crlie: if he hadn't gone to the east he'd have won the war. stahlin was hi ally. >> he needed to knock brit tan out of egypt. >> charlie: beyond the megalomania and semitism and evil, he would have won if he doesn't go east. that's a huge if. could have won and captured all of europe before he failed in britain. >> and then north africa and had he taken 80% of britain's oil from iran and iraq what he could have done with the tiny fraction of troops to russia he could have gone to stahlin got 80% of
his oil. and the idea of trying to take stalingrad is madness. >> charlie: how many people thought hitler was going to win in the west and act add accordingly. linberg being one. >> and the french. a large number of vissy french and one must never doubt for a moment the courage of the resistance french who didn't leave. there we some in the government that up until june 1940 wanted to make peace with hitler because and mussolini joined forces with him.
one of the interesting people is general franco who didt go in withhe nazis. >> charlie: because? >> because he was an extremely wiley operator. he said negotiating with him was like having your teeth pulled so they stayed out of it and frao lived until 1975. charlie: and that led to the return of the monarchy. >> that's right. yes, exactly. >> charlie: before he died. the kinds of things i'm fascinated by is how people make the decisions they make. if the holocaust had no not exid and the genocidal qualities were not there how would it have impacted the war? >> the second world war ended becae of the use of a bomb created largely by jewish scientists that escaped. i once interviewed winston
churchl's privatsecretary and he said i think the real reason we won the war is our german scientists were cleverer than their german scientists. there's something to be said about that and the gat brain drain betwe 1901 and 1932 germany won 31 nobel prizes. from the period after hitler throughout the time of killing the jews and the whole thing is different because from 1950o the year 2000 america won 67 prizes to germany's 16. that's the size of brain drain and as a result so you have a situation where by in 1939 when the war breaks out hitler has 39 million people working in his war production factories. and he lose as a quarter of his
people at the same time he's killing six killing of his most educated -- >> charlie: did anyone make that argument to him? >> no one. it's more sense to have them working and that wiping them out and knew jews fightery well and he himself got a commendation. >> charlie: anything to the idea if hitler hadn't been a failed painter he may not have pursued politics. >> that's obviously pyscholocally deeply within a lot of furious resentment gens the world for not having appreciated his gius in music orainting or artistic-cultural sense. it would have been better for everne if we all hadaid what a woerful pater he was.
>> charlie: when did churchhill first understand the menace of hitler. >> very early on. much earlier than everybody else. he was making speechebefore hitler came to power in 193 warning of the threat of this man. >> charlie: the nazi movement. >> he'd actually gone to in 1931 he'd gone to the germany in order to research the book on his great ancestor and had nearly met hitler that the time. so he'd done his homework on hitler. >> charlie: and knew what his intentions were. >> he'd seen the antiseemnism and wanted to tell hitler face to face it was a terrible era. >> charlie: and if there had been no churill? >> that's appalling for a nion to consider. i don't believe the battle of britain would have gone differently so we wod have still been able to survive as an independent nation but would we
have fought backn the way we did. would have been able to create this fabulous alliance with the united states for example. >> charlie: now looking at chchill and clearly the inspiration he was to fight on land and alls the things -- did he write it himself. >> every word. he didn't have a speech writer. every word were written by him anhim alone. >> charlie: so his primary genius was the ability to inspe britain at the time of its greate peril. >> yes, that's the primary one but one must not estimate his strategic sense as well. >> charlie: that's what i was coming to. >> though his generals thought he had a bad strategic sense. >> charlie: and heavily criticized for decisions before. >> and he was responsible for some mistakes.
>> charlie: and he was wrong about india. >> well, in the context. time. not sur he was. from today's point of view of course. but 25 years on from the dartinells was still coming up with 100 ideas a day. he was a restless, energetic man on how to win the war and the generals had to knock off most a day. >> >> charlie: who was the greatest general to come out of the war. >> he won the battles of moscow, stalingrad, and berlin and . destroyed hitler. >> charlie: the book is called "the storm of war" by andrew roberts. thank you very much. >> thankou.