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tv   This Week With George Stephanopoulos  ABC  January 17, 2016 8:00am-9:00am CST

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plus, hilillary feeling the heat. >> clinton campaign is getting very, very nervous. >> could this underdog shock the potical world in an upset for the ages? >> hillary clinton and bernie sanders are both here, live. plus, insights and analysis from the powerhouse roundtable. it's all only on "this week." from abc news. it's ees it's "your voice, your vote." stephanopoulos. it's on. the bromance between the two republican front-runners is history. the clashes continued this weekend. as trump attacked the values. cruz countering with this video. >> i'm very pro-chce. i hate the concept of abortion. i hate it. still, i just believe in choice and again, it may be a little
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because there is some different attitude and different parts of the country. i was raised in new york and grew up and work and everything else in new york city. >> here was cruz in south carolina. >> i recognize what donald trump says on the campaign trail today fairly conservative. but voters are far more discerning. they have learned over and over politicians don't tell us the truth. >> trump was loaded for bare when i met up with him on saturday. we began with the news breaking the release of those american prisoners from iran. so, we have some news, four american hostages incding jason rezaian released by iran. you said that was never going to happen, you blamed obama, ready to give him credit? >> absolutely not. i said if i got into it it would happen immediately.
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this should have happened years ago, we're giving $150 billion, this shouldn't be happening now and i understand that in addition tohe $150 billion they're getting prisoners. we're taping this a little bit early and it's not sunday morning like your viewers probably think. this thould have happened years ago. >> let's talk about the race, it's now a two-person race between you and ted cruz. >> i don't think so. i don't think ted cruz has a great chance to be honest with you. >> he's doubled-down on this issue of new york city values. he lumped you in yesterday with hillary clinton, andrew cuomo and bill deblasio. >> the truth is he's nasty guy. nobody likes him. nobody in congress likes him.
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that's not good. you can't make deals with people like that. it's not good thing for the country. very nasty guy. >> he's also circulating that clip of you on tim russert. my views are a little bit different than if i lived in iowa. those were your words. >> a long te ago, he's taking money from people that are very much into the whole gay marriage siation and he's taking money from them and he raising funds from them. he got caught the other day on a tape he was raising funds at a law office, talking about things and priorities -- >> are you saying he's a hypocrite? >> he's a total hypocrite. today, it comes out 's borrowing money from citibank and he doesn'tist it. he wants to look like he's the
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banks. and not disclosing it which is illegal. >> tho were your words. talking about how you were strongly pro-choice, your comparison of new york values and iowa views and it's led a lot of conservatives to think, maybe he's going to switch again. >> it doesn't matter what thinks. we're talking about labels. i consider myself to be -- >> you're not con second l serve tif? >> i'm conservative. when it comes to different elements of what i i believe in, i'm going to solve our trade problem, i'm goi to solve our military problem, i'm gng to get ridf isis, i'm going to kraelt borders. >> but they're afraid you're going to abandon conservative issues. >> i don't think too many people are a afraid of that. because if you look at the polls, i'm leading ted cruz by a lot.
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on the upswing. he's on a big down swing. but if you look at what h said and the way he said it and the scorn toward new york, i think it's a dirace. think about the firemen, the firemen that went up those buildings and they were killed instantously and they knew those buildings were coming down and they're going up to save lives. speaking of iowawa, whihi i love and i'm leading in the polls in iowa, we had firemen from iowa which was so beautiful and many other places coming to the world trade center tohelp. you had people from iowa and particular the fire department coming all the way from iowa to help with the world trade center and here's ted cruz putting down that and the great, you know -- >> he didn't put that down. >> he's putting down the great people of new york. who could have done what new yorkers did under that
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>> let's talk about some of the issues, what kind of judges would you appoint, will they be conservative? >> well, first of all, we have a lot of judges that have to be appointed. we have a lot of openings in terms of judges. i'm very happy about that to be nest. i think appointing judges is a very important element of what -- > ted cruz said he's going to appoint conservatives with a paper trail. >> i'm going to appoint people with greatat reputations, great in the legal profession. >> like? >> you know a judge who's totally underrated about not spoken is justice thomas, i mean, if you look at some of the judges that we have on the supreme court, justice roberts turned out to be a nightmare for conservatives. and by the way, ted cruz was the one who really wanted justice roberts to go on theupreme
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you know that. have you heard that? >> he was pushing him hard. justice roberts gave us obamacare. obamacare would have been terminated twice if it wasn't for justice roberts. first time 10 on%. justice roberts couldave lled obama care and should have based on everything. ted cruz is the one that was promoting him. ted cruz andlso jeb sh, but justice roberts was the man that gave us and remember it. he gave us obama care. almost as much as obama himself. >> lot of conservatives skeptical of you saying you support taking private property away giving it to real estate developers. >> let me tell you about that decision, imminent domain, without that, you wouldn't have roads or highways, you wouldn't schools, you wouldn't have hospitals.
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pipeline, the keystone pipeline they have pages devoted to eminent domain. every conservative. it can't be built without imminent domain, you wouldn't have 25 feet of the keystone pipeline. eminent domain you need eminent domain. you wouldn't have roads or anything. so when people criticize me on that and once people understand what it is, lot of people don't know what it is, without that power you wouldn't have the kind of things you need to survive as a society and as a country. >> so, how are you going to make sure you're not going to get a justice roberts? >> excuse me, how are they going to make sure? bush appointed him and cruz was the biggest advocate. justice roberts turned out to be an absolute disaster.
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disaster because he gave us obama care. you tell me, ask cruz why did he push -- >> i'm asking you, why did he push so hard to have a judge who has absolutely set the conservave movement back and set everything else -- >> whe i interview him i'll ask him. >> i will study it carefully. i will work with people i republican respect, conservative people, we'll appoint judges that wilill be goo i won't have an appoint like justice roberts. >> let's talk about imdprags, senator cruz has come out against your deportation force. governor christie said this would cause an increase in 50 sk >> senator cruz is very weak on illegal immigratn, he only got
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whwhile. the other day, i heard him say he wants to build a wall. we're going to create and have a country again. that's what we want. we want to have borders, to have a country you have to have borders. we have people flowing over freely. >> are you going to enforce it. >> having babies onur land, called anchor babies, you need a new constitutional amendment you don't. you need probably just a vote of congress and you might not even need that. ii said that from the beginning. the real legal scholars that say as an example that cruz has a real problem with his place of birth. many people are saying that right now. since i spoke to you the last time he's been sued. >> the person who doesn't he standing --
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>> you have standing, why don't you follow suit? >> that sounds like a very big case. >> ted was so nice to me, i said he's not a nice guy, he wanted to go to wake, so nice, so nice. when is it going to happen? it happened during the debate, he lied about the polls. the poll came out with a headline, trump wayay up, him way down. he lied about that. i find it very interesting. >> so -- >> listen,et me just say, i don't think he's going to do very well. >> if you really believe in this you should file the suit. >> i'd like to talk to ted about that. when i file suits i file real suits. i'm unloading because he's been very dishonenest.
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hehe criticis the banks and he's going to be robin hood and take care of the banks. he didn't the public to see he borrowed money from goldman sachs. he doesn't want the public to see that, the reason is, because he wants the public to see that he's this wonderful guy protecting him from the bad, vicious baers. he borrows money from the banks and he's got personal guarantees and why that's not done in his personal financial, he said, he made a paper mistake. oh really. he made the mistake with citibank. i have a hundred pages, almost a hundre pages talking about billions and billions of dollars, i didn't make a mistake and they have gone through by everybody, i didn't make a mistake. couple of pages with a couple of
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banks and he can't put that down? that wasn't a mistake. >> let's talk about national security, rubio versus cruz on national security. usa freedom act could have been written by lobbyists for isis. cruz said it's the best way to protect national securitynd prive privivacy. >> i come down on security. we have a whole thing going on whether or not we want to protect our freedoms. to me security is freedom i'm on the side of security. i have been there from day one. if someone is listening to my lls, i don't like it. when it comes toe personally, i would rather have that, i want security. >> you're saying rubio's right? >> i wouould g with the rubio side. >> it sounds like you're worried about cruz. >> i come down on anybody that doesn't tell the truth. he didn't tell the truth during the debate. he didn't tell the truth about new york city.
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very few places on earth could have done and suffered the way they suffer. remember this, george, that was the greatest attack in the history of our country. greater than pearl harbor, because pearl harbor they attacked the military. here, they attacked civilians and thesewo massive buildings came down on top of the rest of the city. thousands of people killed and the day, an hour later, we started the process. great people started the process. people coming, firemen coming in from queens knowing they may die. they all di. we have thi guy, who falsifies his personal financial forms, we have this guy criticizing -- >> it caught the attention of mike bloomberg. you and hillary in it, sources say, it would show a competitive race. >> i would love to have michael join the race. i'd love to. because he would be, i think,
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hilly, it's going to be hillary. you tell me. >> she went to your wedding. >> she had to, ough, you know why, because i contribute. >> so, here's the stor i would say if michael came in, he would take a lot of votes away from hillary. you know why, one of the reasons, guns. michael is very much anti-gun. i'm very pro-second amendment. >> i'd love to have him in the race. very late for anyone to join the race right now. i know the filing requirements for anyone to come in right now is very late. >> a woman named rebecca o'donnell has a 9-year-old son, paying attention to the son, he's adopted internationally, he
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would be taken away from us if donald trump became president. she went on to write this in "the globe." -- what do you say rebecca? why don't you pick out a positiveletter, we're getting so positive letters. people want to take back their country. that young man will be fine, okay, but people want to take back their country. we have to have a country. we don't have a country right now. we have people pouring in, theye pouring in and they're doing tremendous ngerous, if you look at the crime and the economy. ththe real number in terms of unemployment, if you look at the real number, it's over 20%. it could be over 25%. because people look for jobs, they ge up and theeal number is a disaster. and ifou think 25,000 people come to my rallies because we're
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coming to my rallies because the country is doing poorly that includes the economy. the stock market. >> final question, martin luther king y, what do you say to african-americans who believe his dream hasn't achieved in this country. >> i believe with them. we have an african-american president, the african-american youth has essentially never done worse. you look at the unemployment in the '50s, you look at african-american people that are 30 and 35 and 40 at t height of their strength and their lives thehey're doing horribly. president obama an africaamerican has done a terrible job for african-americans. donald trump will do a great job for african-americanans. i'll be back jobs from china and many other places. i will be great for african-americans.
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just a minute and then t democrats. hilly clinton and bernie sanders both join us live this week ahead of tonight's big debate. the attacks are coming hard and fast. "this week" with george stephanopoulos brought to you by pafic life. for life insurance, annuities and investments, choose pacific life. the power to help you succeed. because getting there requires exactly that. a plan for what you want your future to look like. for more than 145 years, pacific life has been providing solutions to help individuals like you achieve long-term financial security. bring yoyour visiofor the future to life wiwith pacif life. talk to a financial advisor to help build and protect your retiremenincome. pacific life. the power to help you succeed. janet? cough ifou can hear me. don't even think about it. i took mucinex dm for my phlegmy cough. yeah...but what about mike? it works on his cough too. cough! it works on his cough too.
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a bit more now fm donald trump. we talked backstage just before his appearance with former senator scott brown in new hampshire. you have changed a bit over the last several months. a littltleit more disciplined, a little bit more focused, what have you learned about campaigning in the last several months. >> i think i did very well in the beginning. don't forget, i have been at top of the polls from the very first day. i'm an intelligent person like you are, we're intelligent people, probably i toned it down
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but sometimes you can't tone it down. when you're dealing against china who's just killing us and mexico they're sending us and other groups of people thatre doing big numbers on us and we're losing a fortune as a country and we're losing our heart and we're losing our soul. you have to be pretty strong. you don't want to tone it down too much. >> you're all in now? you're going to do everything you can? >> i'm here. i'm number one in every single place, including iowa, by the way, all of the latest polls have me number one in iowa. i have a great relationship with the people and the evangelicals and the tea party. no, we're looking to do very well. february 1st we start. >> what do you think of that theory if you lose iowa, it all spirals down. >> i think'll do well in iowa. if i don't make it at iowa, at a minimum i do think it's going to
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but i think i'm going to win iowa. and n hampshire. south carolina, it's going to be great. i think i'm going to do well. >> democrats up next, both hillary clinton and bernie sanders here live in just two minutes. the future belongs to the fast. and to help you accelerate, we've created a new company... one totally focused what's next for your business. the true partnership where people,technology and ideas push everyone forward. accelerating innovation. accelerating transformation. accelerating next. hewlett packard enterprise. our digestive systems handle a lot over the holidays. 20 hours of anxiously fighting crowds to find the perfect gifts. cooking for family meals where we eat over 15 pounds of turkey ansides.
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there are two democrat oik visions for regulating wall street. one says it's okay to take millions from big banks. >> president obama who as you might recall took a lot of money from the financial industry when he ran in 2008. so, it's a funny kind of charge. >> i think anybody who looks at that ad understands that it's not a negative ad. it's absolutely truthful.
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clinton going at it this week. as we begin this campaign in 2016. secretary clinton joins us now from charleston, south carolina. good morning, madam secretary. >> good morning, george.. >> i want to get to that bacack and forth between you and bernie saers, but first the news that american hostages are heading home. donald trump not give inging credit to the president. >> well, look i'm pleased like i hope everybody is, we have american citizens coming home this morning from iran. they were unjust held there and i did a lot of work on these issusues whenmericans we being picked , falsely charged and imprisoned to get them home, i applaud the fact that's happened. we still don't have bob
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unfinished business. i think this is a part of what we're going to be pursuing, persistent, patient diplomacy, today is also the day we have verified the iranians have followed through on the requirements under the nuclear agreement. they have shipped out the vast majority, i think it's up to % eir enrich uranium, they have poured cement into one of the reactors we worried about because of a plutonium potential threat. they have destroyed centrifuges. so thshg so, this is the kind of smart dip lo masy i was proud to be a part of in the first obama administration. we have a lot of problems with iran, their aggressive bevior, their destabilizing of neighboring states, their continuing military support for assad and so much else. but the fact w we put the lid on
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fact that we got our prisoners back, i think is reason for good news. >> les get to the campaign right now. strange series of events yesterday. they put out word the would demanding the release of the sanders' health records. it appeared to go away. what is relevant here and what's not? should aging health be an issue this this campaign? >> i put out my medical records. george, this is all part of the expectation. but, i think it's fair to say i share a lot of the same goals with senator sanders about what feed to do on behalf of our country. but we have differences and that's what i'mocusing on now, we're goingo have a spirited debate, i expect, tonight in charleston. certainly, senator sanders has been pointing out differences. on issues i have drawn a stark contrast on is guns, i have
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think it's a criticalish sue that senator sanders has for years voted many times on behalf of the nra gun lobby position and one of theost egregiuos of those votes was to give immunity all liability to gunmakers and sellers. -- well, he flip flopp last night saying he would sign on to a bill that is currently pending in the house and senate to repeal that liability and i'm delighted that he has had a change of heart. i think that's all to the good. i hope hll take a hard look at the charleston loophole that's a provision he also v voted for that gives a gun to a potential buyer after three days whether or not the background check has been completed a and it's called the charleston loophole because thatat's how the killer in
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if more time, information would have come to light he was prohibited. he used that gun to murder nine faithful people at bible study. i want to see movement a against ththgun lobby because we can't continue to lose 90 people a day to gun violence and i welcome senator sanders moving on one of the issues he was wrong on. >> we'll ask him about that in a few minutes. another big difference is health care. are you against that, because it's a bad idea because it's not practical, would a single-payer system be better if you could get it passed? > first of all, i share the goal of universal health care. i threw myself into that back in '93 and '94 and still have the scars to show for it. so, the goal is, we want everybody to have access to quality affordable health care.
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act. it's a historic achievement for this country and president obama. we are making progress. i want us to protect us to defend it and improve it. the republicans keep trying to repealt and offer nothing in place e of . rather than tear it apart or get rid of it and start all over again, let's do what i'm proposing to get costs down, get more sport for families who face big medical costs let's dea with the rising costs of prescription drugs. that's the right way for the country to go and certainly it's what i'm advocate zblg you have your differences over wall street. i was strk this morning, american cross roads the super pack founded by karl role has
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>> hillary clinton has gone 54 times. hillary rewarded wl street with the $700 billion bailou wall seet made her a multimillionaire. >> i respected wall street. >> yep, you sure did, hillary. >> are you worried that your ties to wall street are weighing youu down? >> well, first, let me say, it shows how desperate the republicans are to prevent from becoming the nominee. that's an inkreshlly flattering comment on their anxiety because they know that not only will i stand up for what the country needs i will take it to the republicans, i have a track record which shows i know how to stand up to them and i will win. i think this just proves my point i'm the strongest candidate to gop against any republican. with the back and forth on wall
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look, i have stoodod up to wall street even though i did represent new york. i have advocated for changes. bubut what find sort of strange is, numb one, the ad that senator sanders ran was against all democrats that took contributions from anybody associated with the financial industry, that would include president obama who took more than anyone had in 2008, that did not stop him from turning around and imposing the toughest rules on wall street since the 1930s. same with barnney frank who has written about this. that is just a false charge. but in addition, i think it's important for us to look at our respective plans, everyone who has offered a plan for the plan that senator sanders put together. they say mine is tougher, more effective because it tries to
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yesterday but the potential problems tomorrow, going after shadow banking and investment banks and big insurance companies, like what we saw in '08 where leihman brothers were principal causes of what happened to us. finally, have gotten maybe 3% of my contributions this time from anybody associated with financial industry activities. i have gotten so much more from students and teachers, 90% of my contributions are from smaller donors and 60% fro women. so i'm just -- you know, i didn't know about karl rove's ad against me, it kind of boost me up, because it assumes i'm going to get the nomination. >> madame secretary, thank you for you time this morning.
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later our powerhouse round table takes on the rowdiest week yet on thiss always-surprising campaign. >> the powerhouse roundtable is brought to you by vote4, let's gethese dayquil liquid gels and go. but these liquid gels are new. mucinex fast max. it's the same difference. this one is max strength and fights mucus. mucinex fast max. the only cold and flu liquid gel that's max-strength
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we're joined now by senator bernie sanders. thank you for joining us again this morning. senator sasanders, cered a lot of groun wit secretary clinton. let's go over some of the issues yesterday with you. the back and forth yesterday whether that super pac was going to demand the release of your health records. secretary clinton has released all of her records, will you? >> absolutely, of course, i mean, i think she released a two-page statement on her health records. we'll do the same. >> she welcomes your support of the gun liability. called it a flip flop. time now for you to closing this charleston loophole, will you? >> ll, first of all, george, as you know, i have a d-minus voting record from the nra, in 1988 i probablyost an election because i was the only candidate who said we should ban assault
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what i said months and months ago was, there were things in the liability bill that i liked and didn't like, wanted to take a look at this bill, now that's going to bentroduced to review it and make changes to it. i think the bill makes a lot of sense. what we will do i supportive of this legislation, there's an amendment, though, that i want to see incorporated that's noncontroversial that immonitors the impact of small gun shops i rural america. bottom line is, when a gun shop sells a gun legally to someone and then something bad happens i don't think it -- >> the three-day waiting, the person gets the gun after three days of waiting no matter. well. the issue is, my view has always been and most important is that we have a strong instant
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supported that from day one. i want to see that expanded and improved. look at the end of the day, what every american understands we need to keep the guns out of hands of people shouldn't have guns. >> on health care, you shouldn't tear apart obama care. people should be defending the affordable care act. so, how high will the top tax rate go to pay for it, when will those detailils be out. >> very shortly. here 's the point, bernie is going to dismember health care in the united states of the america, he's going to do -- millions of people will no longer have the insurance they have, that's nonsense what everybody understands, a medicare for all program is
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we still have 29 billion americans who still don't have health care. we spend far, far more per capita on health care than other countries. i want to fulfill the vision of people like harry truman and say health care is the right of all people. i hope secretary clinton would join me on that saying that and tell the pharmaceutical industry they can't continue to rip off the american people and charge us the hhest prices in the world. >> isn't it fair for voters in iowa to know now you're going to pay for it? >> you know w what, george, i mean, sometimes, theiscussion becomes really absurd is that, we'll increase medicare premiums
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away with all private health insurance premiums and sometimes, it disappoints me that the clinton campaign is sounding like republicans. the truth of the matter is, we spend far more per person on heal care and second of all, medicare f all, single-payer system, it wouldld lower the cost of health insurance for the middle class of this country. so, to say yes thereill be medicare premiums, yeah, of course there will be, it's not free. >> don't voters have a right to ose details before they vote? shouldn't th come out before the iowa caucuses? >> the answer is yes and they will. the answer is bottom line is, yes, a they will. >> secretary clinton's campaign has been making the point of leblgtability. karl rove's campaign is now running an ad again her.
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going to get scrutiny hp how do you respond about ads circulatg about your past positions? you urged congressmen to give serious thought the nationalization of the oil induststry. sanders said, all yutties must be under public ownership. >> that was a long, long timime ago, before i ever was elected to anything. i was mayor of burlington. people can go bk and look at the fact that hillary clinton was i understand it was a supporter of barry goldwater. who cares that's aong time ago. >> i was going to ask, what was your thinking then and what changed your mind? >> what i sai 40 years ago is less important.
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if you look at all of the poll -- almost a all othe polls out there today, today, what you find is bernie sanders defeats donald trump by a much larger margin than does hilla clinton in the last national poll, we beat trump by 13 points. if you look at the battle ground states in new hampshire and iowa, we beaeat them. our appeal is not only to democrats, young people, working-class people but to independents as we. if you're concerned or if the american people are concerned about which candidate has the best opportunity to defeat right-wing republicans i think you're looking at him, bernie sanders. >> those positions you completely disavo them? >> you know, george, i have been unelected official for 25 years. yes, those positions are what
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i have a record of eight years as major of the city of burlington. and in the senate. i'm very proud of that record. going back 40, 50 years, that's fine. i don't think people give much kreecredence to that. >> thank you. >> thank you. our powerhouse roundtable in just 30 seconds. >> aouncer: the powerhouse
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you by time now for the roundtable. i'm joined by jon karl, republican strategist sara fagen. ej dionne from the washington post and kevin madden and keith ellison who has endorsed bernie sanders. let's begin with the republicans. john karl, is it a two-person race between trump and cruz? >> absolutely in iowa. george i have t say when ted cruz came out with this new york valuesattack, it looked like it was a gaffe, what it's done since, it's drawn everyone back to that interview 20 yearsgo to tim russert, where trump is pro-choice.
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by ted cruz. >> who's going to get the better of this exchange? >> i think i the person who may get the better of this exchange is the person who finishes third in new hampshire. think about these establishment candidates. there are five points that separate marco rubio and jeb bush and three in between candidates in between, christie, kasich and cruz. this is so early right now. it feels late and yes, there's massive fight going on between trump and cruz. it's definitely far from over. >> kevin, you look a at iowa, right now m marco rubio in third or fourth place, if these two go at it, trump and cruz, is it possible he could rocket up? >> i think the iowa race is between trump and cruz. to jon's point, i expected they would drop the new york values attack. the biggest risk forrump right
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attack. this feels like it's new at a time for a lot of voters making up their minds in the last 14 days before the caucuses that the idea of a new york liberal could be their nominee would start to worry them. >> keith, soo f anyone who has tangled with trump has g gone down. >>ew york liberal? trump? news to me. i have to stand back and say they're all anti-immigrant. th have tried to divide based on religion i support bernie, but any democratic candidate that can compare him orerse with these guys is a good thing. >> let me bring that over to ej, the republican establishment, coming around to the idea that one of these two could really be their nominee. >> it's amazing. think what it speaks to the transformation of the republican
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the party made promises to conservativeves thathey couldn't ke, rolling back cultural change. trump is the revenge of those voters and the if you look at the primary electctorate liberals have left the republican party, moderates are gonene. that's why we're talking about cruz and trump. >> it's hard to know what the establishmt is now. >> lot of them have gone over the tea party. one thing about new hampshire, independentss can pick up a republican ballot. >> and a democratic battle lot. >> certainly put that question to you, as i said, you did work for george w. bush. if they're forced to choose between trump and cruz, who do they choose? >> i think they would support ted.
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>> here's the thing -- you know, ted is a brilliant man, he can be very as bracive. but we also forget that, you know, oututside teltway people don't know any of this. what they see is a young conservative who's very articulate on issues they care about. i don't think that's going to matter to the average primary voter. >> you did see, kevin, this week speaker ryan choose nikki haley to give the response to the statee of the union. >> there was also a backlash, so many voters out there felt like they were being scolded by this establishment, they feel there's a cannon between them and the republicans in washington. they feel eir anger is legitimate and their voices
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they don't want another establishment leader in washington to tell them their anger is not legitimate, that's why you saw so much in thealk radio world and so many among the grassroots conservatives to start to push back on nikki haley. >> trump s showed restraint against nikki haley. >> that was disciplined restraint. >> more and more polished as a result of that. >> i thought kevin made an excellent point earlier, when he talked about ted cruz introducing this new york values argument, i think this was very smart b ted,d, it was strategic and it allows an avenue to put forth new information about donald trump which there is much, which his record is quite liberal. >> new york used to he a lot of republicans, demrats in
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ellison, we saw from the interviews with hillary clinton and bernie sanders, they're going to at it on very different issues. what are you most conrned about? >> i think bernie can hold up under any of these question he's been very clear that re recognizes the problems with guns. but i think the bigger worry is, how do we really address the real problems of the american people? which is stagnanting pay, feeling that the whole system is rigged against them, anyone associated with that, they got the main problem and bernie sanders is picking up on this. you meioned and some of these conservatives out to look at bernie, he's straight up, honest. >> the other thing he has going for him, ej dionne, this des moines register poll showing
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goers in iowa identify themselves as socialists. >> they have gone out to see the big short. i think right from the beginning i think it was a mistake to think that bernie couldn't win iowa, as you know, those are very progressive democrats that show up at the caucuses. in new hampshire he's right next door. clinton has torivate to the argument, lot of them expect to vote for her, i need you know, don't just send a message send a precedent. >> she's got to win. right exactly. >> bernie sanders is in this. he's legit. the numbers are showing it.
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are some inevitableility has to be wiped away. >> if karl rove is going after me they must be worried about me. you'll haveo find them on a milk carton >> hillary clinton hasas been at her worse playing prevent defense. looking like she was inevitable. now, she's railizing, look, bernie sanders can win in iowa and new hampshire, she would be still the front-t-runnern south carolina. >> let's not forget, nevada comescome s comes before south carolina. you could have a scenario where bernie sanders has won three contests. if she loses three contests. it's going to bee hard for her to
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>> the bernie sanders and hillary clinton are r competing on the issues. >> and one is calling for a massive tax increases which the country can't afford to pay for any of this stuff. >> kevin, a little bit of time left, a lot of people are going to look at this and see bernie sanders and hillary clinton on the democratic side, donald trump and ted cruz on the reblican side, michael bloomberg is going to take a look at this, does ts make a third-party rurun inevitable. >> if donald trump is a nominee, you'll see the republicans looking for someone who can actually govern. many of those establishment republicans particularly the
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only is donald trump bad for the party but fo if the country. >> ten seconds. >> rather trump lose and split the party than have him be president. >> lot of talk about paul ryan we'll be right back after this fro that's all for us today. sunday with us. check out "world news tonight."
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