tv 60 Minutes CBS September 27, 2009 7:00pm-8:00pm EDT
defense to be aggressive. >> jim: got to get it to the 18. cincinnati must right here with one minute exactly. palmer, open man, first down. holmes with the catch. >> phil: plenty of time. stops the clock at 47 seconds. those of you expecting to see the season premiere of "60 minutes" you're watching the nfl on cbs. the steelers and bengals coming down to the wire. jim nance and phills simms here
in cincinnati. with pittsburgh on top. "60 minutes" will be seen right after the game except on the west coast where you'll see it at its regularly scheduled time. >> phil: situational football. two-minute offense before the half. two minutes at the end of the game. ryan mundy comes in. second down and 15. palmer throws, knocked away by wrin clark. >> phil: what a job. i thought for sure it was a touchdown. >> jim: i did, too. >> phil: ochocinco goes down the field, wants to move across. >> jim: i think ike taylor maybe got a fingertip on it. he did. it deflected.
he never makes the pro bowl because he doesn't get a lot of picks. but that's now four times he's knocked balls away. >> phil: there's reason why he's the starter. >> jim: welcome those of you defeat oakland. to the 16. palmer forced to roll out. now throws. to the end zone, he was looking for henry, incomplete. william gay on the coverage. another fourth down coming up. now the bengals call their second time out. >> phil: when quarterback escapes the pocket in a situation like this, you almost always expect somebody to be wide open. gay gets away with a -- grabbing the jersey of chris henry. laveranues coles goes -- he's uncovered. >> jim: wow. >> phil: uncovered. a blown assignment by the steelers defense.
but pressure, palmer has to move the pocket. most right-handed quarterbacks they're going to run right. >> jim: phil, i hate to go back. but on first down here at the 15 they spiked it with 47 seconds. basically just lost a down, were they in that big of hurry to have to give a down away at that time? >> phil: i think i said it. i didn't agree with spiking it. i can't remember exactly, there was -- >> jim: 47 seconds at the end of the spike. >> phil: after he spiked it. something else the defense was pretty far off at least had audible or something like that. who was uncovered. >> jim: got to get to the -- it's fourth down. now pittsburgh time out. >> phil: like nba game here. good time out by the steelers.
here's the story tonight on "60 minutes" where did all of the bernie madoff money go? the man in charge of searching for it some answers he's on the season premiere of 60 minutes. that's followed by "amazing race" and "cold case" all tonight on cbs. >> phil: good time out by the steelers because the formation was different. they had double stacked receivers on each side. mike tomlin, let's go over this make sure everybody knows who they got if they get the same play. >> jim: it's fourth down. have to get to the five. to keep it alive. 36 seconds to go. palmer has the time, throws it at the last second and able to stay on his feet for the first down!
what an effort by brian leonard. now with 20 seconds, clock running. another spike at 18 seconds. leonard a little gimpy, that was looking at walking off the field butine he was going to make it a great second effort by back up running back. >> phil: you think he's going to get caught from behind. he released late. what a job by carson palmer pulling the football down and brian leonard made this football team because he's a good blocker on third down. and he just knows how to play the third down offenses. what a job. >> jim: what a game. with 18 seconds, second and goal. palmer, touchdown cincinnati! andre caldwell!
a drive that included two fourth down conversions. the last one coming on fourth and ten from the 15. >> phil: we talked about things change in cincinnati. caldwell in the middle. he hooks it up, a quick accurate throw by carson palmer. look at the protection once again. the offensive line so much that have job is about working together and truly just being tough and just outworking the people across from you. the bengals offensive line did it. >> jim: one of those who was pushing keisel away to give palmer the open view. here is the two.
>> phil: you talk about all the lessons you learn you work on in the off season, how about this lesson for the bengals. they just hung in there, they mentally hung in there. lot of tough situations they over came. >> jim: last week dominated early and lost. 14 seconds away from a similar fate here at paul brown stadium. second hop to mendenhall. he hall los angeles back to logan. he laterals back to logan. cuts back middle. three seconds to go and he's down in time to get one snap. eight straight times the bengals have lost here at home to pittsburgh. of course no one around here wants to talk about the immaculate deflection here two weeks ago. this is the last time cincinnati beat pittsburgh they came back from 13 down in that one to win.
neil rackers won it on fieldgoal in over time. they were down 13 today. that was in the first half 13-0. until a fieldgoal in the last play of the half. take nothing for granted here after the denver debacle. >> phil: playing this a lot different. winding up heaving it as far as he can, roethlisberger and it's complete the bengals have upset the super bowl champions! the steelers now lost both games without polamalu. they fall two games behind the ravens in addition bengals are one back of baltimore. team that came together at the end of last year, he told us they won their last three, depleted bunch that fought hard.
>> phil: veteran players, four veteran players i think they finally just had enough and decided to do something about it. >> jim: a big come back by the bengals down 13-0. they come back to win it with 14 seconds to go. closed captioning provided by cbs sports division captioning by captionmax www.captionmax.com ♪ ♪ tell me who's watching. (announcer) it's right here. it's easy.
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>> martin: this is how general mcchrystal starts his day-- running for an hour at 5:00 in the morning. >> bill, how are you? >> martin: he has the toughest job in the american military as the man in charge of the war in afghanistan. we found him to be blunt, hard- charging, and fed up with the way the u.s. has been fighting the war. can you imagine ever saying to the president of the united states, "sir, we just can't do it?" >> yes, i can. and if i felt that way, the day i feel that way, the day i'm sure i feel that way, i'll tell him that. >> safer: this is the scene of the crime. irving picard gave us a tour of bernie madoff's 19th floor office, an impressive landscape of emptiness. >> his desk was here. >> safer: picard has the thankless task of finding the money, the billions that madoff scammed. it may surprise you to learn some of it will come from some of the victims themselves, and millions more from his opulent
assets. >> your eyes are drawn directly to the chandelier, which is probably worth a pretty penny. >> kroft: when michael jackson died this past summer, he had nearly a half a billion dollars in debt. since then, it's been a very good year for his career. and this is not unusual. decades after their demise, some departed stars draw more income than they ever made while they were drawing breath. and there is a growing legion of agents and managers willing to represent them. >> we're a business agent for about 250 entertainment, sports, music and historical clients. but most of those are deceased. >> kroft: dead. >> dead. >> kroft: they're working stiffs. >> i guess you could say that. >> i'm steve kroft. >> i'm lesley stahl. >> i'm bob simon. >> i'm morley safer. >> i'm scott pelley. those stories and andy rooney tonight on "60 minutes." the same impressive highway fuel economy
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>> pelley: we begin with cbs newsman david martin, on assignment for "60 minutes". >> martin: president obama is rethinking his entire strategy in afghanistan after the new commander there stunned the white house with a warning the war could be lost if he doesn't get more troops in the next 12 months. general stanley mcchrystal is up against an enemy that holds the initiative, and he's working with an afghan government shot through with corruption. even with more troops, he warns, there has to be a "dramatic change in how we operate." that stark assessment comes from a man who is perhaps this
country's most battle-hardened general, and according to those who have served with him, a one- of-a-kind commander. we went to afghanistan to spend a week with mcchrystal as he races against the calendar. we found him to be blunt, hard- charging, and fed up with the way the u.s. has been fighting the war for the past eight years. what you're about to hear is as close to an unvarnished war briefing as you're likely to get. are things worse or better than you expected? >> general stanley mcchrystal: they are probably a little worse. >> martin: what's worse than you thought? >> mcchrystal: well, i think that, in some areas, that the breadth of violence, the geographic spread of violence, places to the north and to the west, are a little more than i would have gathered. >> martin: that violence is catalogued in the briefing books he scans every morning at his headquarters in kabul. but he doesn't trust them to give him a real sense of what's happening out there amid all the ambushes and firefights. two or three times each week, he gets on a helicopter to see for
himself. >> mcchrystal: so you can listen to every radio transmission down to squad level, and you can watch from the predator, you can see what's going on. but you can't kid yourself that you know what's going on. but there's a danger that you do, because you hear and you see it and you think, "okay, i know." but you're not on the ground with that guy. you don't feel it. you don't hear the bullets. you just can't make an assessment. >> martin: flying over terrain that has defeated invaders from the british to the soviets, mcchrystal knows he has to do more than just fine tune a strategy that, after eight years of war, appears on the brink of failure. so he has issued a new directive on counterinsurgency operations, telling his troops in writing: "we must change the way we think, act and operate." protecting the afghan people, many of them living in impoverished villages, is now more important than killing the enemy, even if that means taking more risks.
the parents of kids over here can't be too happy to hear that the commander is telling them to accept more risk. >> mcchrystal: this is something that takes a tremendous amount of understanding. what i'm really telling people is the greatest risk we can accept is to lose the support of the people here. if the people are against us, we cannot be successful. if the people view us as occupiers and the enemy, we can't be successful and our casualties will go up dramatically. >> martin: when we went out on patrol with this squad from the 10th mountain division, they were not going into this village to root out insurgents, but to offer the people protection and help with their daily lives, which the central government in kabul has so far failed to do. the only way to win, mcchrystal insists, is to earn the support of the people. mcchrystal's new strategy says conventional military operations designed to kill the enemy can
never win this war. destroying homes and accidentally killing civilians in the process only creates more insurgents and alienates the population. in other words, for much of the past eight years, the u.s. has been sowing the seeds of its own demise. by mcchrystal's count, 265 civilians were killed by american or allied firepower in the past 12 months. and he told one of the many video conferences he holds each week civilian casualties could make or break his strategy. >> mcchrystal: i knew this was an important issue. but since i've been here the last two and a half months, this civilian casualty issue is much more important than i even realized. it is literally how we lose the war or, in many ways, how we win it. >> martin: to reduce those casualties, he took drastic action, ordering a virtual ban& on air strikes against residential areas, even if hostile fire was coming from the building. >> mcchrystal: we've got some things we absolutely have got to show them that we'll do differently.
if we succeed, some of it will be despite some of the things we've done or failed to do. >> martin: the hallmark of american military power was its overwhelming firepower. now, you're describing a situation in which firepower is almost beside the point? >> mcchrystal: you know the favorite saying of "to a man with a hammer, everything looks like a nail." we can't operate that way. we can't walk with only a hammer in our hands. >> martin: when he walks in public, he doesn't wear a sidearm or body armor. >> mcchrystal: if we are visiting afghans, typically, the afghan governor, district or provincial governor, we see he doesn't wear body armor, and yet we're walking through his streets. i'm his guest. i think that that's important that i send a message that i trust him and that i don't think i am more valuable than i think he is. stan mcchrystal, my pleasure. >> martin: we went with mcchrystal to this market in western afghanistan. he wanted the security thrown up around him to back off. >> mcchrystal: let's just have all the security stay here. >> okay. >> mcchrystal: okay. we'll be good.
we'll be good. >> martin: ...so he could hear firsthand what the people had to say about the war. >> mcchrystal: how can we be better? ask him how coalition forces can be better. >> martin: shopkeepers told him the taliban controls the one paved road. >> ( translated ): if they know you have a business or you have some money, there is no way you can go through that road. >> martin: this man said he was kidnapped by the taliban... >> ( translated ): they kidnapped him and they asked for ransom. >> martin: ... and that security was good only today, and only because the american commander had come to visit. mcchrystal knows the taliban have been gaining ground, spreading into parts of the country where they've not been seen before. and he was not impressed when the soldiers and civilians who man this remote outpost assured him they are making slow, steady progress. >> mcchrystal: the question is not whether we're making progress; the question is whether we're making enough progress fast enough. >> martin: he drew a graph showing the rate of progress he really needs. >> mcchrystal: what if our rate of progress is below that but
it's still up? so then, people come visit, i come visit you, and every time i visit you, you say, "we're doing good. we're doing better. we made progress." it doesn't matter, because at the end of the day, you lost. at some point, you lost. >> martin: his frustration with business as usual was palpable. >> mcchrystal: we could do good things in afghanistan for the next 100 years and fail. because we're doing a lot of good things, and it just doesn't add up to success. and we've got to think quicker. >> martin: in this video conference with the pentagon, he complained about the months it takes just to get officers assigned to his staff when he's up against a deadline from the secretary of defense. >> mcchrystal: the secretary talks in terms of 12 to 18 months to show a significant change, and then we eat up two or three months just on sort of getting the tools out of the tool box. that really hurts. >> martin: he relentlessly pounded away at the pentagon
bureaucracy. >> mcchrystal: the average organization, when someone asks when you want something, they pull out a calendar.& but in a good organization, they look at their watch, and we really got to get that way. >> martin: he also wants american convoys to stop their aggressive driving on afghan streets. >> mcchrystal: it's perceived by the people as arrogance. it's perceived by the people as not caring about, you know, their right to use the road, and at the end of the day, it's their roads. >> martin: it sounds like you're trying to deprogram eight years of bad habits. >> mcchrystal: exactly. there's an awful lot of bad habits we've got to deprogram. >> martin: mcchrystal's compulsion for shaking up the system even includes the flags outside his headquarters. they used to fly at half-staff every time a soldier was killed. he ordered them raised. >> mcchrystal: we had gotten to the point where the flags were at half-mast all the time, and i believe that a force that's fighting a war can't spend all it's time looking back at what the costs have been. they've got to look ahead and they've got to have their confidence. and i thought it was important that the flags be up where they
belong. >> martin: there's a war on, but a level of comfort has crept into life at headquarters, including this garden, which has become a favorite hangout. you seem to think that life might be a little too soft around headquarters. >> mcchrystal: i think life is hard at the combat outposts, and anything that distracts us from supporting them, in my mind, is something that we shouldn't do. >> martin: what do you think of that little garden out there where you can sip cappuccino under the shade? >> mcchrystal: like to turn it into a rifle range. >> martin: mcchrystal himself keeps a murderous schedule, up at 4:30 and out the door at 5:00 for his morning run through the maze of buildings and trailers that makes up his headquarters. this is his idea of leisure time. how many miles do you cover, do you think? >> mcchrystal: i do an hour, yeah. and it's not as many miles as it used to be. >> martin: he eats one meal a day; anything more makes him feel sluggish.
in another life, he could have been a monk. the lap of luxury. >> mcchrystal: it is. it's good. i mean, what else do you need? it's functional and it's comfortable. you get very used to it. you have what you have, and that's all you need. and you realize you don't need a lot of other stuff. one thing, of course, you miss is family, but besides that, it's pretty much perfect. >> martin: he lived like this for five years as head of a top secret hunter-killer unit which captured saddam hussein and tracked down the infamous terrorist abu musab al zarqawi, calling in an air strike to kill him. being a general didn't stop him from going on commando raids. >> mcchrystal: i won't claim that i was ever any great help on the missions. it was really to go and see what the force does, and to understand just what their challenges are. and also, there's a value to the old man coming along, just to show that he's willing to do that. >> martin: kind of dangerous, though. i mean, what if zarqawi got his hands on you? you know an awful lot. >> mcchrystal: well, we got him first.
hello. >> martin: it's hard to keep pace with mcchrystal as he races through his marathon days. his morning update on the progress of the war starts at 8:30, not 8:31. it's a standing-room-only affair which breaks all the rules about restricting classified information to those with an absolute need to know by using video technology to conference in everyone from the pentagon to the headquarters of the afghan army. >> mcchrystal: one of the things i was looking at just this morning is taliban reporting on their desire to widen the fight. the idea is, as many stations as you can get in here, and as many people in each one to listen. just, it cuts the challenge of communicating. >> martin: must be hundreds of people. >> mcchrystal: there are hundreds of people, that's right. >> martin: do you worry about security leaks when you have so many people involved in these things? >> mcchrystal: i'm less worried about leaks than i am about the people who don't know what we're trying to... you know, ignorance.
so, i think it's a tradeoff and i think i come down on this side every time. >> martin: for all his innovations, mcchrystal still is hostage to geography. afghanistan is bigger than iraq, yet he has only half as many troops. he plans to double the size of afghan forces to 400,000, but that will take years. the only place he can get the troops he needs now is from the united states. are you confident that you will get what you ask for? >> mcchrystal: i'm confident that i will have an absolute chance to provide my assessment and to make my recommendations. >> martin: but you're already under pressure not to ask for more. i mean, how's that affect what you do? >> mcchrystal: doesn't affect me at all. and david, i take this extraordinarily seriously. i believe that what i am responsible to do is to give my best assessment. >> martin: how often do you talk to the president? >> mcchrystal: i've talked to the president, since i've been here, once on a v.t.c.
>> martin: you talked to him once in 70 days? >> mcchrystal: that's correct. >> martin: can you imagine ever saying to the president of the united states, "sir, we just can't do it." >> mcchrystal: yes, i can. and if i felt that way, the day i feel that way, the day i'm sure i feel that way, i'll tell him that. >> cbs money watch update sponsored by prescription flomax. >> good evening. due to a bump in early retirements, social security will pay out more than it collects in taxes the next two years. gas dropped 7 cents in two weeks to a national average of $2.65 a gallon. and the animated "meatballs" movie stayed on top at the box office. i'm nancy cordes, cbs news. (announcer) sleep can help lighten your mood...
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bonus-stuffed executives laughing all the way out of the busted banks. it's been some year. oh, and we left out the ponzi scheme of ponzi schemes-- bernard madoff's untidy little business that bilked thousands of people out of billions of dollars. while the mastermind is doing 150 years in prison, the big question is, where did all the money go? irving picard, the court appointed trustee-- the liquidator-- is searching for the billions that disappeared, and trying to recover as much as possible from madoff's remaining assets. it is a daunting and thankless task. for while he is suing whoever he can on behalf of the victims, he's also suing many of the victims, those who he says benefited and should have known they were investing in a house of cards. mr. picard and his chief counsel david sheehan have been largely silent about the details of the recovery, until tonight.
last november, just before the whole thing collapsed, bernard madoff sent out statements to his clients. how much were they told they were worth? >> irving picard: about $64.8 billion. >> safer: so the statements were total lies? >> david sheehan: yes, absolutely >> mr. madoff! >> safer: the $64.8 billion that investors thought they had was just an illusion... >> don't push me. >> safer: ... designed by madoff to keep investors investing. last december, the roof fell in. >> mr. madoff, what do you say to all those people who lost money? mr. madoff?& >> safer: mr. madoff has no say in the matter. if the victims want any money back, they'll have to go through mr. picard, the decider, and his bloodhound, mr. sheehan. how much real money do you think went into the whole scheme? >> sheehan: i'd say about $36 billion. and about 18 of it went out before the collapse, and 18 of it's just missing. and that $18 billion is what we're trying to get back.
>> safer: so for the past nine months, picard and his team have been on a global treasure hunt. the first step: liquidation. madoff's boats, his art, even his season tickets to the new york mets, plus bernie's various homes-- all sold or about to be sold with a u.s. marshall as real estate pitchman. >> your eyes are drawn directly to the chandelier, which is probably worth a pretty penny. >> safer: they didn't exactly hide their wealth, did they? >> sheehan: they did have the house in palm beach. they had a place in montauk. they had to have, you know, an apartment here on park avenue in the city, all of which are the accoutrements of great wealth. but it wasn't an extraordinary lifestyle. >> safer: how much does all that total? >> according to the government, it's over $50 million. >> safer: just a drop in an oversized bucket, nothing close to what investors lost. so, picard and his team continue to follow the money. they started here. so, this is the scene of the
crime. madoff's new york offices, an impressive landscape of emptiness. >> picard: his desk was here. >> safer: and close by, perhaps a work of art that sums up the entire story. >> picard: it was called the "soft screw." and it was about four... i guess four to six feet high. and it was sitting right here. >> safer: and sitting on top of the world was madoff himself. >> sheehan: he was much like the wizard of oz, just hiding behind this wall. and no one could really penetrate it, but they sort of really liked the results. >> safer: as far as you've been able to find out, was he ever legitimate? >> sheehan: no, it was never legitimate. and i think bernie, if he told the truth, which he's not capable of, he would then say, "yes, i started out as a crook and i ended up as a crook." >> safer: and a crook who looked after his family. picard's team unearthed records showing madoff's sons, mark and andrew, who ran a legitimate trading operation, and madoff's
brother, peter, the chief compliance officer, took $80 million in compensation over the past seven years, plus millions more in personal expenses charged to the company-- private jet rentals, ski vacations, and country club dues. even ruth, madoff's wife, had a company credit card, and she charged millions, too, on everything from shopping sprees in paris to movie rentals-- all courtesy of bernard l. madoff securities, thank you very much. >> sheehan: they used the bank account at b.l.m.i.s. like a personal piggy bank. >> safer: of all the people that should have known, his brother and his sons, who worked under the same roof with him, should have known. >> picard: one would think so. >> safer: did they know? >> sheehan: my belief is, yes, they knew. and the reason i believe that is they were officers of these companies, and directors, in certain instances, as well, and also compliance officers in a very highly regulated environment.
so, i think, clearly, they would have to have known what was going on, given their own personal transactions, the longevity of what was happening, and the responsibilities as officers of the company. >> safer: madoff's sons and brother also had accounts with bernie, and their returns were simply spectacular. >> sheehan: there's sort of an extraordinary event with peter, his brother. after 1995, we only see him putting $14 in and he took out over $16 million. we have to take a hard look at that. >> safer: picard says mark and andrew madoff withdrew over $35 million from accounts that were opened with little or no original investment. >> safer: if they turn out to be untouchable, criminally, do you intend to bankrupt them civilly? >> picard: whether or not they have a criminal problem, we will pursue them as far as we can pursue them.
and if that leads to bankrupting them, then that's what will happen. >> safer: picard and sheehan told us they plan to file suit this week against madoff's sons, mark and andrew, his brother, peter, and niece, shana, accusing them of negligence and breach of fiduciary duty in their roles at the company. he will be seeking the return of $198 million that was paid out, loaned or transferred to them. >> sheehan: when his brother took out money, or his sons took out money, they took customer money. >> safer: can you lay claim to the sons' real estate, for example? >> picard: i believe that we can. the money that went to buy these houses, under the law, is called fraudulent transfers. >> safer: maybe, but the madoff sons are claiming they're still owed nearly $90 million by their father's bankrupt company. mark madoff and the other family members declined our request for an interview. >> i have no comment.
i'm sorry i can't help you. >> safer: but in a statement, the madoff sons say picard's allegations are "baseless" and that they had "no prior knowledge of bernard madoff's crimes." >> sheehan: if you were those sons, and you knew what you knew today about where all that money came from, wouldn't you be embarrassed to keep that money? they should give it all back. and if they don't give it all back, i think we have an obligation to go get it and take it all back. >> safer: and that includes mother madoff, ruth. though she has already agreed to forfeit about $80 million in assets, picard has sued to keep her on a very short leash. at the moment, any time she spends over $100, she has to check in with you, correct? >> picard: she reports it to us at the end of the month. >> safer: and how is she living now? >> picard: she's living very modestly. >> sheehan: the most significant amount of money that ruth is currently spending is on lawyers. >> safer: there is an assumption in this case that there is this stash out there, whether in swiss banks or under the
mattress. are you assuming there is? >> sheehan: yes, we are. >> safer: what kind of money we talking about? >> picard: we'd assume it's millions and millions of dollars. >> safer: millions and millions isn't nearly enough to cover the billions stolen by bernie madoff, but here's where the story takes an odd twist. most of the money for victims will not come from the madoff family, but from the victims themselves. most people assume that everyone lost money who dealt with madoff. not true? >> picard: we've found that there have been quite a few people who have gotten out more than they put in. >> safer: in fact, about half of madoff's thousands of victims are what picard calls "net winners," people who took out more money than they ever invested with madoff. >> sheehan: we can tell that if morley put in $100 and he got out $200, he got $100 of somebody else's money. >> safer: so, the guy who's been happily taking $25,000 a year
out over, say, ten years, he's not going to get a dime out of this? >> sheehan: no. >> picard: not if he took out more than he put in. >> safer: well, say he put in an initial $100,000. >> picard: then he's already got more than he put in. he's been overpaid. >> safer: and are you going to try and get the difference? >> picard: perhaps. >> safer: and he's is entitled, by law, to get that difference back. it goes by the nicely nasty name of a clawback. if any investor took out more than they put in over the past six years, picard can legally demand it back to help victims who didn't take money out. for now, picard says madoff's small-time winners are not his priority. he is focusing on the big winners who claim to be innocent victims. >> sheehan: some of the big players, i believe, actually knew exactly what was going on and participated in it. >> safer: picard and sheehan have sued several prominent madoff investors, saying they
"knew or should have known" of the fraud, like billionaire investor and philanthropist jeffry picower. >> sheehan: he got a statement that said his return was 950%. now, this isn't some unsophisticated rube buying these stocks and dealing in this. this is a very, very sophisticated guy. he gets a statement like that; that's off the charts. he doesn't know anything about that? >> safer: so is he a prime suspect? >> sheehan: sure. i think, not only in terms of the monies that he took out, but the records with regard to the relationship, the manipulation and backdating of trades. he had to know, or someone knew it was false. >> safer: the suit claims picower took out more than $5 billion in profits since 1995. picard is also suing another billionaire investor, stanley chais, who withdrew over a billion dollars in profits. both chais and picower maintain their innocence and would not comment, but in court papers, picower characterizes the suit
as "unsupported by facts or logic." sheehan says he thinks they knew all along and simply couldn't resist the easy money. >> sheehan: i think as everyone, you know, was participating in this and just feeding at this trough of greed, at the end of it, what they were looking for was it to continue. they were hoping it was never going to end. >> safer: so far, the trustee and his counsel have filed 13 lawsuits, seeking the return of nearly $15 billion from the biggest madoff investors. in addition, 233 clawback notices have gone out to madoff friends and family who may have profited from the scheme. >> this is a human tragedy. >> safer: thousands of smaller investors who were living off what they believed were legitimate profits now fear that, on top of their lost nest egg, they may end up owing even more. >> i open my mailbox wondering if this will be the day when the letter arrives. >> safer: sheehan is sympathetic, but...
>> sheehan: at the end of the day, they were in a ponzi scheme, unfortunately for them. so all they get, at best, is what they put in. and to claim that they should be getting something other than that is to suggest that some other resource should exist. i'm talking about the taxpayers coming in and funding this. >> safer: so far, picard has found nearly $1.5 billion for the victims fund, and he's hoping to get several billion dollars more. but even then, victims will collect only a tiny fraction of what they lost. >> sheehan: we don't know how much is there. but it's going to be, not necessarily pennies on the dollar, but it's only, you know, a little bit more than that. we're not going to be able to repay everyone, not anything close to what they lost. hello, i'm a mac.
and i'm a pc. and here at pc innovations lab... wait, what? pc innovations lab? well, you know how you have your patented magsafe cord that pops out anytime someone trips over it? sure, sure. well we're protecting pcs with this new air-cushioned enclosure. that's bubble wrap... and you know how you have your revoluntionary new battery that lasts almost an entire work day? well we are offering this new extremely long cord. pc, shouldn't innovations make people's lives easier? well that's exactly why we've developed these. cheers to innovation!
>> kroft: when michael jackson died this past summer, he had nearly a half a billion dollars in debts. but since then, it's been a great year for his career. lawyers for his estate say they have lined up merchandising deals worth $100 million, and surging record sales and other income are likely to produce another $100 million. and it's not that unusual. decades after their demise, some departed stars continue to work on new projects, and draw more income than they ever made while they were drawing breath. and there is a growing legion of agents and managers willing to represent them. dead celebrities can be just as lucrative as many live ones, and in some cases, a lot less trouble. >> mark roesler: i was known for going up and down hollywood boulevard. >> kroft: no other agent in the world represents more famous people than mark roesler. >> roesler: errol flynn-- of
course, robin hood-- natalie wood. >> kroft: stroll down hollywood boulevard, he'll point out 62 of his clients who are immortalized with their own stars on the walk of fame. >> roesler: gloria swanson, marilyn monroe... >> kroft: his client list includes some of the biggest names of the 20th century-- actresses like ingrid bergman and bette davis, baseball legends babe ruth and lou gerhig, singers ella fitzgerald and billie holiday, who all have one thing in common besides their greatness. >> roesler: we're a business agent for about 250 entertainment, sports, music and historical clients. but most of those are deceased. >> kroft: dead >> roesler: dead. >> kroft: they're working stiffs. >> roesler: i guess you could say that. >> kroft: you could call roesler's business a william morris agency for the departed, the c.a.a. of the d.o.a. it's called c.m.g., and it's headquartered far from the glitter of hollywood in an office park on the fringes of indianapolis, distinguished only for the orange wind sock for
roesler's heli-pad and his green bentley. inside is a multi-tiered office lined with memorabilia from his departed clients. first stop, a suit worn by one of the blues brothers. >> roesler: i've represented the family of john belushi-- his widow, judy-- for almost 20 years. >> kroft: it is all tastefully done, and quiet as a morgue-- a shrine of sorts for legends whose time on earth has ended, but whose career still has a pulse strong enough to produce a stream of revenue. it is part of their legacy now, and may be the ultimate show business compliment. they may be dead, but they still have an agent who's finding them work. what do you do for them? >> roesler: well, it's really not that much different than if they were alive. >> kroft: you can't book them for personal appearances. >> roesler: that's correct. we can't talk to them, we cant get their approval, but we'll get somebody's approval. >> kroft: his real clients are the heirs and estates of the dearly departed, who ultimately approve or reject the merchandising deals that c.m.g.
puts together. >> roesler: this is our basement, where we have kind of the archives of the past 27 years of the company. a lot of the different samples. >> kroft: they range from low- end tchochkeys... >> roesler: trashcans to handbags to... >> kroft: ... to the mid-range items like marilyn merlot... >> roesler: rated as one of the best california merlots, year after year. >> kroft: ... to the playfully prurient outfits inspired by the late pinup queen, betty page. they are marketed as halloween costumes, but roesler says they seem to sell all year round. >> roesler: this is the devil costume. >> kroft: is the whip included? >> roesler: the whip is included, yes. and the tail and the horns. >> kroft: the product endorsements run the gamut from paraphernalia to the pinnacle of post-mortem prestige. and roesler has licensed more than 200 deals with the u.s. postal service. >> roesler: here's a boxer, jack dempsey. of course, jessie owens. one of the early stamps with babe ruth.
of course, jackie robinson, a big part of the baseball series. a very successful stamp with malcolm x. >> kroft: so, these are all clients? >> roesler: yes, these are all clients. >> kroft: the agency has created web sites for all its deceased clients, and maintains and revives their fan clubs. >> roesler: we get at least 15 million hits a day that come through this building for the different clients that we represent. >> kroft: it is all part of a legal and entertainment niche that roesler pioneered more than 25 years ago after graduating from law school. where did that idea come from? >> roesler: i thought it'd be nice to be an agent. but i really couldn't... being from indiana, i really couldn't represent anybody famous because everybody living would have already been represented. so, really, the only opportunity was to represent deceased people. and i happened to notice that deceased personalities didn't have really any protection. >> kroft: until roesler came along in the early '80s, a celebrity's right to control or
profit from their good name was buried along with them. their heirs had virtually no say in how their loved one's image or persona was used, and no claim to any of the monies they generated. so, roesler set about trying to change that in courts and in state legislatures around the country, helping to establish what is now recognized as the postmortem right to publicity. the right to publicity-- i don't remember reading that in the bill of rights. where does that come from? >> roesler: we have the right to prevent our name, our likeness, our image, our signature, our voice, from being used in some commercial fashion. >> kroft: now, in a number of states, that right passes on to the heirs, just like a house or a bag of old coins. and one of the first beneficiaries lived right down the road from roesler in fairmont, indiana. marcus winslow is the cousin of james dean, who died in a car accident in 1955 after making just three movies. is this it? but the image of this rebel
without a cause has become a commercial icon. and 50 years after he crashed his porsche, james dean is still selling german cars and italian shoes. but when roesler first showed up at the family farm in 1982, dean's heirs had no idea how big their jimmy had become. until mark showed up, the estate had gotten no money at all from... >> marcus winslow: that's right. >> kroft: ... from james dean? >> winslow: i don't think he would approve of perfect strangers making money off of his name and his likeness if his family didn't have something to say about it. >> kroft: so he's made a lot more money... >> winslow: oh, yes. >> kroft: ... since he died? >> winslow: oh, yes. no question. >> kroft: than he did while he was alive? >> winslow: oh, no, no question. >> kroft: he'd be... he'd be an old man now? >> winslow: yeah. he'd be 77 years old. but he'll never be any older than 24. >> kroft: that image is frozen in time now, and the success of dean's post-career career has helped turn the marketing of dead celebrities into an $800 million a year industry. and advanc