it's a matter of practice at the irs. so it's important for us as we did this question to get our hands on these documents in order to make that assessment and obviously there are serious other public interests that would be served by having access but principally this is about the policy question that the committee is anxious to look at. >> are you confident your committee has the authority to do this? >> there's no question the committee has the authority. it's been exercised by the committee for many, many years in different circumstances. obviously in this case since the president has broken from this near 50-year tradition, it's being exercised in context of the president's returns but there's no question it is clear in the law that the chairman of the ways and means committee has the authority to seek these from the irs commissioner and that the irs commissioner is bound by law to provide them. so we expect the irs to comply. >> because the chairman, richard neal, the chairman of your committee, the ways and means c

up to the irs how to proceed. but if the general counsel for the irs, i assume that is the person who would be the point of contact. >> or at least might have some involvement in it, yes. but i think it is an example of if that was the president's motive, that is part of a pattern we have seen repeatedly where he tries to install people he perceives as loyalists in certain jobs where there are potential investigative connections. >> wow. that's really fascinating. maggie haberman. thanks very much. we're joined by michael dan tone owe. also laura coats. so laura, first off maggie's reporting the president pushed the senate to fast track his nominee for irs chief counsel. how do you see that? >> i mean, just think about the context of it. within a week of the federal government reopening, i know that sounds like a long time ago, the president prioritizes the chief counsel of the irs. that's top of the list, even over the attorney general of the united states. i mean, think about what the role of that person is. the

that provision in the irs manual. now people are looking at this much more carefully. we need to see, in a very targeted and focused way, is the irs doing its job to actually audit the president and the vice president? there's all kinds of procedures and processes. the president's taxes are supposed to be kept in a special safe, they're supposed to be kept in orange folders, nobody's supposed to look at it except for the people who are doing the audit. have day done that work? so the president has called more attention to this issue by not releasing his tax returns in the first place. chairman neal has said since day one he became chairman, we're going to be very deliberate, very judicious. we're going to make sure we use judgment that will hold up to scrutiny by others and by a court of law. we cannot politicize this. >> i want to ask you, while i have you here, about something that one of your colleagues has said. ilhan omar was talking about presidential adviser stephen miller, who really is pulling the strings at

commissioner, the general counsel over at the irs. what questions does that raise? >> well, hmm, i wonder why he did that. because they have known for months, the democrats have made it, you know, no secret, that they intended to get the president's tax returns, and they found a way ads cs contrivs it may seem to the president's attorneys to do that, and i think the president, you know, was preparing for this. and he was so eager to have someone he knew and trusted who had worked with the trump organization in the past, in that job, that he said, okay, wait, you know, let's do this first before we even get a new attorney general confirmed. so you know, you put one and one together sometimes, and you get two. >> you know, to another question that we're following right now. the president's trip, he's out in california, along the border with mexico right now. watch and listen to what he said today about people coming into the united states. listen to this. >> it's a colossal surge, and it's overwhelming our immigration system. and we can

to be audited by the irs. it was done to take away the discretion. nobody is talking about it. that's why he is doing this. he's requesting these tax returns in the first place because this policy has been in place to take away the discretion of the employees so the employees aren't under pressure that they have to decide whether or not to audit the president. every president, every vice president is supposed to be audited by the irs and the request is to find out in a narrow and targeted way is the irs doing what it says in the irs manual to actually audit the president. >> so when the president says that he always gets audited. for awhile he said every year and then he said two or three years in a row. so a little contradiction there, the idea that you cannot release your returns or nobody would advise anybody to release their returns while they are being audited, what do you make of that argument? >> that's complete fantasy. that's not accurate whatsoever. the chairman has the power to request anyone's tax

the result is a specific request to the irs commissioner. it's provided under section 6103 of the tax code which says the chairman of the ways & means committee can seek tax returns from taxpayers when there is a public interest and a public policy purpose. there very much is one in this case. >> it is not just the president pushing back. it's republican members of your own committee. for instance, congressman kevin brady put out this statement. weaponizing our nation's tax code by targeting political foes sets a dangerous precedent and weakens american's privacy rights. by law all americans have a fundamental right to the privacy of the personal information found in their tax returns. is he right? >> first of all, it's amazing to the extent to which republicans in congress are willing to sacrifice their own obligations. the oath they swore to provide oversight on the executive branch of government in order to defend a president whose standards are taking us to a dark place. having said that, no. the president of the united states is a uniqu

first and foremost, how the irs or treasury department which oversees the irs actually responds to house ways and means committee chairman richard neal and his request. we heard from the president's personal lawyers who sent a letter to the treasury department making clear their posture. you've seen from nick mulvaney, the president himself, their posture on this. the question of what comes next will start with that response from the administration officially and whatever richard neal, whatever he does next. the expectation is you're not going to see a lawsuit or subpoena next week. they'll likely create a paper trail for any future legal action, perhaps a followup letter if nothing is complied with. keep in mind what the chairman can do later on. there is subpoena possibility. this is law and some think they don't need to send a subpoena. instead they'd go straight to a lawsuit. the big question as this week plays out, obviously the political football, but also the positioning as well. following this fight is only going to escalate, knowing this fight is likely to end up in the courts,

house democrats sending a new letter to the irs. we'll tell you what we know about it. from any one else. why accept it from your allergy pills? most pills don't finish the job because they don't relieve nasal congestion. flonase sensimist is different. it relieves all your worst symptoms, including nasal congestion, which most pills don't. it's more complete allergy relief. and all from a gentle mist you can barely feel. flonase sensimist helps block six key inflammatory substances. most pills only block one. and six is greater than one. flonase sensimist. >>> breaking news out in just the last few minutes. house democrats want to see president trump's tax returns. they're not backing down and this morning house ways and means chairman congressman richard neal sent a new letter to the irs requesting the tax returns again and he wants them by april 23rd. joining me now, brian robinson republican strategist and scott bowland. gentlemen, welcome back. >> good morning. >> brian, let me start here by reading just from the letter here. t

. >> we followed irs guidelines. which suggest to taxpayers that six years is generally the measurement that they use for advising taxpayers on how long to keep their forms. so we didn't want to have the case perhaps dismissed on a technical glitch. so again i think as i've said to you now, for a long period of time. we've taken a very methodical approach to what will likely be an established court case. >> what do you see in the road ahead on this matter? >> i think he's right. it's certainly going to be an established court case. the trump lawyers are going to fight very hard. they're going to have to make new law. because on the face of it that provision seems like a no-brainer. it's an open-and-shut case, there's no threshold that needs to be established. they can simply request it. so the letter that his lawyer wrote is a grab bag of weak legal argue tomts me. it starts off saying you need a legitimate legislative purpose. then he says, even if you have one, i think it's pretextural. a first amendment argument a

it is the obligation of the commissioner of the irs. so i don't understand in law the statements being made by the white house, or the sol isidute -- the slis tude of the white house administration and i don't understand that in law at all. >> i understand your point clearly. former treasury secretary larry summers, thank you very much. >> thank you. >>> it is being called the purge. and the president denying he's cleaning house. we have compiled a list of the former administration officials who all told the president no before they got headed for the exits. more on our breaking news also this afternoon. actress lori loughlin is charged in that massive college admission scandal and facing another indictment. this involves money laundering. no matter where you are in life or what your dreams entail, a cfp professional is trained, knowledgeable, and committed to financial planning in your best interest. find your certified financial planner™ professional at letsmakeaplan.org. woman 1: this... woman 2: ...this... man 1: ...this is my bod

the irs is also -- that's one way through this. but there's also now subpoenas out to deutsch bank and his accounting firm. >> explain the importance of the accounting firm. >> it's significant because there's an accounting firm that he deals with on long island -- >> they've been doing his taxes from the beginning? >> from the beginning. and they were dealing with a firm they bought, they were doing fred trump's returns. this is a firm that's been dealing with donald trump since he was born. the amount of information they have about him is huge. it's important to understand that tax returns are one piece of the puzzle. you've also got -- you know, there's potential to get bank records and other general ledgers to piece together what's going on with trump and his finances. if you can't get it through the irs, there's other avenues, including deutsch, his main bank. it's like air around a balloon and i think the irs -- >> has the accounting firm said what they're going to do? >> it's been represented that they'll respond to the subp

we don't know the procedure that the irs is using. that's an important matter for congress to exercise oversight even beyond president trump, for all future presidents. >> generally you're audited if there are questions about how you've done your taxes. i want to talk about mueller because you have a big push now to get more of this report out and the question is does bill barr go there and will his hand have to be forced? is it a fair argument when barr says the attorney general i'm not going to release this evidence, some because it may be sensitive, but also others because it might sully the reputations of people including the president who haven't been charged here. he's saying i don't want to be james comey saying i'm not going to charge hillary clinton but she behaved recklessly. >> that is a different standard from the starr report where the entire thing was released and made into a book that people can were much in book stores. given the good reporting that has happened in the last 24 hours there are serious questions about th

or convince the irs of that? convince who? >> they have postured their defense as a legal defense for the court. but of course, there are a couple of other forms involved. the politics. and i think that's the notion of picking on the president and the fairness of that. as far as the courts are concerned. the question of legitimate purpose, it's actually a pretty low-bar to overcome in my view for chairman neal and the ways and means committee this committee has as its jurisdiction. the review of the internal revenue service and chairman neal was can clever in crafting his request narrowly to see if the internal revenue service was properly fulfilling its functions in examining the preds and whether or not there may yet need to be legislation to insure that the internal revenue service independently evaluates the president's tax returns without influence. >> the white house says it's ready to take this to the u.s. supreme court. do you see this going that far? >> i think it could. i think another strategy here, is not just the

chief counsel office laying out why they think that the irs should not turn over the tax returns. this source said the letter will raise a number of statutory and other issues, constitutional issues, trying to make their case. so what will happen from here, brooke, is the irs would likely consult with lawyers and with lawyers from the office of legal counsel, the department of justice. this source i spoke to said this person did not believe that the president's tax returns would be turned over any time soon. and an administration official speaking to my colleague jim acosta said basically this is a hill they're willing to die on. that the administration is willing to fight this all the way to the supreme court. 's kn -- as you know republicans on the hill have come out saying the tax law is weaponized and this is setting a bad precedent so as you said the fight is only beginning. >> pamela brown, thank you so much. on the tax returns fight. >>> let's get to had -- to this one. the 2020 campaign and joe biden and the issue here, allegations of inappropriate touching and making wome

then the irs reaudited him and found that, oops, well actually really does owe over $400,000. so do we know whether president trump has been properly paying his taxes and whether the audit system is working? the irs says it's auditing the president and vice president every year, but we don't know whether it's being done on a proper basis. >> so if chairman neil wins and gets his hands on these tax returns, my understanding is he's the only one who will have access to those returns. it's not like they will be made public, right? so then what? >> well, he will be able to look to see what is going on with these taxes. he can go into executive session with us, members of the house ways and means committee. but first he needs to see what is there and he will have the expertise to be able to analyze what keys are key and critical and especially whether the audits are being done properly. >> congresswoman judy chu, i appreciate you joining us. >> thank you. >> pete buttigieg getting personal about his husband. next his message for vice president pence. the risk of another heart attac

this follows democrats' unprecedented request from the irs for six years of personal tax returns. here's how acting chief of staff mick mulvaney is responding to that. >> keep in mind, they knew they were not going to get the taxes. they know what the law is and they know the fundamental reason for the irs is protect our confidentiality >> to be clear, you believe the democrats will never see the president's tax returns? >> no, never, nor should they. this is a political stunt. >> never is a bis shig shift fr this. >> if i decide to run for office, i will produce any tax returns, absolutely. >> i will release my tax returns against my lawyer's wishes. when she releases her 33,000 emails. i will release them when the audit is completed. as soon as that is finished, whenever that may be, and hopefully before the election. i'm fine with that. >> this comes as mulvaney reveals the white house will release a health plan before the 2020 election so republicans request tout an alternative to obamacare. and as democrats want barr to release the mueller report, democrats are doubling down

it's going to the irs commissioner. i think there are certain and it's very boxed off and very few people can actually see it, but i don't know -- to fight this one i think they might be facing some peril and they may try to delay it and i agree with dana on this. the one problem is they're so overboard and 80-some subpoenas and now they're making a big deal with the tax returns and i think what happens is he does become a victim and i disagree with mr. dean in the sense that this is a little bit different and they're coming at him every way that they possible deand at some point it's overwhelming and people think, gee, my healthcare is kind of screwed up and i hit 18 potholes on the way to work this morning. i'm not sure what they're doing in washington. that said, i think he may comply and he shoots himself on the foot upon. >> comply, keep it compartmentalize and nancy pelosi, i think she spoke to him two or three weeks ago. the times is truncated now. the democrats should not be focusing on the investigations and ta

the irs commissioner should be handing the tax returns over. that would be our expectation given the clarity and strength of the law, but we have yet to hear back from the commissioner or for the secretary of the treasury, and hopefully we will hear soon this coming week because april 10th is the date that the chairman requested to receive those returns. >> summaries that's a couple days away. meantime it's world health day and we know nick mulvaney had this at camp david and maybe even to use as a campaign point even thought the president says no vote. he wouldn't pursue any kind of vote before the 2020 election. what do you think about this potential alternative to obamacare if indeed the president succeeds in eradicating it all together. >> every person in the united states should have affordable quality healthcare, period. the trump administratio over tried to undermine the affordable care act and the ac gen to many, many americans to affordable quality healthcare. millions of americans since the affordable care act went into place. it's te

and they say the irs is required -- they don't need a subpoena -- that the irs is required to give them this information, and so they said look, we are trying to look at this. and this is a contrived argument in a way because they wanted to make it narrow -- you are required to give us this information because all presidents are under audit. and we don't know what standards you use for presidents when they are under audit. you know, do you look at their businesses? do you just look at their stated income? and we want to codify how you look at presidential tax returns, because we don't really know. that's the narrow argument. and they believe. >> yes. >> obviously this is going to court. but they wanted it stand up. >> for sure. obviously we'll see. because if they get it and are able to get more this is huge, right. it's hard to understate the importance. >> absolutely. >> it comes to the power of the majority is so important. the house judiciary committee approving a subpoena for the full mueller report. what happens there next? >> i think this is -- could go to court. i think what the

of a number of irs employees. but this narrowly crafted request is designed to fulfill our legislative responsibilities, can be done privately to review it to determine if there is any basis for releasing it to congress, a judgment we have not made yet. and it ought to be complied with. the republicans, of course, blocked six times over two years my motions to try to get these returns. they've had one excuse after another. the trump family may have gained as much as a billion dollars from the recent trump tax law. so he has much reason to protect himself and we have much reason to explore whether we're assuring the confidence that american people must have in the tax system and how the tax system is designed and whether it has been influenced in improper ways by the trump family trying to seek personal enrichment. clearly his businesses are very intermingled with the public trust and he apparently believes that every government official is first and foremost a trump employee rather than a employee of the american

they know what one of the fundamental principles of the irs is to protect the confidential alt of you and me and everybody else who files taxes. >> to be clear, you believe democrats will never see the president's tax returns? >> oh, no, never. nor should they. that is not going to happen, and they know it. this is a political stunt by my former colleagues. >> never is a big shift from this. >> if i decide to of course, i'll produce my tax returns, absolutely. >> i'm release, when we're finished with the audit. >> i will release my tax returns against my lawyer's wishes. when she releases her 33,000 e-mails, i'll release them when the you had a sit completed. as soon as that is finished whenever that may be. hopefully it's before the election. i'm fine with it. >> president trump's attorney weighing in saying democrats are trying to use the irs as a political weapon. let's check in with cnn's white house correspondent boris sanchez. tell us more about this escalating fight. >> reporter: hey there, fred. you heard the acting chief of staff nick mulvaney call this a political stunt. dem

the irs has been very professional. >> when the you had a sit complete i'll release my returns. i'll have no problem with it. >> i'm not releasing the tax returns because as you know they are under audit. >> they are under audit. have been for a long time. extremely complex. people wouldn't understand them. >> the first one of those from 2016, i'll release them when the you had a sit over. this is the longest audit, if there is such an audit. the longest audit. >> yeah. >> and one of the questions and one of the things that chairman neal asked for is whether or not that is actually true. the irs would no whether or not an audit is taking place and he's asked for that specifically because the president has made claims that have not been true in the past. >> i don't think the irs usually says who is being audited. >> michael cohen i think in his testimony this came up as well, and he essentially said he didn't necessarily think that the president was under audit, didn't want thing tank type people look over his taxes. >> think tank type people. we'll see how that goes. joe biden s

and saying the irs should deny the request and the lawyer writes this, congress has no constitutional authority to act like a junior varsity irs rerunning individual examinations or fly specking the agency's calculations. if the irs commissioner does not hand over trump's returns by april 23rd, which is what your fellow democrats have demanded, what are you going to do? >> certainly we should get a writ of man damous requiring the irs to turn them over. >> could you explain what that is. >> a court order requiring them to be turned over and get them from the accountants as well. there are strong reasons why we should look at these. it is the only way to enforce the emoluments clause of the constitution and making sure the president isn't getting benefits and gifts of million dollars from foreign governments. it is also the only way to check the irs is following its policy, which is to audit every president and every vice president and do it in a thorough way. and the only entity that could really look over the irs and make sure they are following their own policy is the ways and means

or the lawyer for the irs. the irs is supposed to conduct an examination of the president's returns. this is a president who has resisted any oversight or inquiry into his affairs. and so, i think the chairman of ways and means has every right to determine, is the irs following its own policy and protocols. but i'll also say this, jake, there is no legal ground for them here. the statute says the irs shall provide these returns to the congress upon request. when the republicans asked similarly for returns when they were running that committee, including the returns of the obama for america organization, he gave no explanation for why he sought those returns or how many returns he was seeking or what organizations. he just asked and the irs says you can have them because we shall provide them. and i think that's how it's going to end up here, too. >> all right. democratic congressman and chairman of the house intelligence committee adam schiff of california, thanks for your time, sir. appreciate it. >> thanks, j

there is no legal requirement that the irs audit a president. it's been a practice. that's one of the areas that we're considering when we look at the legislative approach to this issue. >> born and bred flint, michigan. there's been a lot of movement on the longstanding story about the contamination of the water, you helped secure over $100 million in funding. a judge recently gave the green light to sue the federal government, the epa. given the state had oversight at the time and didn't apply necessary treatments, why is the federal government, the epa particularly, should they be liable? >> the flint water crisis is a failure of government at every level. the vast majority of the responsibility lies with the state of michigan. they lied to the people of flint about the quality of the water when they knew it was bad. but there is responsibility at every level. where i think the epa could have done more is blowing the whistle earlier? when they had evidence that the water was contaminated even though the state of michigan was assuring the public it was not, they sh

look, in five years ago, when they went after the head of the irs, ms. learner, if you remember that, and they investigated 50 individuals, in fact, 51, i believe, 50 individuals' tax returns because they were in a liberal organization. they thought the liberals were getting pumped up and the conservatives were being deflated. they found nothing. they exposed these names. they exposed the facts of their tax returns. and they didn't apologize when they found absolutely no collusion, as someone would say. in what they were doing. and you know what. they're hypocrites. i say it to their face. i don't wait until i get on television. >> and repeat it when you get on television. please come on after next week when this deadline is met or missed. because there's much more to come. thanks for coming on. really appreciate it. >> still ahead for us. as the investigation begins into how a fire almost destroyed notre dame, we're going to talk to a witness who said the cathedral was a disaster waiting to happen. we'll be right back. ♪ pardon the interruption but th

discretion away from the irs because we don't want to force irs employees to have to make a decision, should we or shouldn't we audit the president? and instead every president is supposed to be audited by the irs. >> so you get the can you do it. do you have the right, then you have the is it right to do it. what are you hoping for politically comes out in these and what do you see as the risk? >> i'm not really concerned about the political aspects. i think this is a policy issue that we have to do in the ways and means committee. one great thing about our chairman, richie neil, he said from the very beginning he's going to be very judicious and deliberate throughout this process. he's going to following the rules, he's going to have hearings and he's going to make sure that whatever he does is going to be subject to scrutiny by people and it will hold up in a court of law, so he's been very, very careful throughout this process and he's made it very clear this is not about politics, this is about policy. this is a very narrow and targeted request. >> what happens is -- because we'

they'll speak to the attorney general. >> will you direct the irs to do that? >> they'll speak to my lawyers and they'll speak to the attorney general. >> 67% in our most recent poll say the president should release his returns, 67% of americans. but here's something that might go under the heading of things that make you go hmm. listen to this. this is what the "new york times" is reporting tonight, that earlier this year the president asked mitch mcconnell to fast track a vote on his nominee to be chief counsel of the irs. the president indicating that nomination was a higher priority than voting on william barr for attorney general. ultimately, though, the senate confirmed the irs counsel two weeks after barr's confirmation. and for the second time this week the president is suddenly doing a 180. this time on his threat to close our southern border this weekend. now, the president says he's giving mexico a one-year warning to stop what he calls massive amounts of drugs from coming into this country. it's the same old strategy that he used with health care, m

chief counsel, the head lawyer at the irs, the president wanted that to be a top priority. why? why could that be? there are serious questions raised about that. might it be about the president's tax returns? >> no. >> joining us now is one of the authors who broke that story, maggie haberman, thank you so much for being here. also, so what exactly are the questions that are being raised here and how hard did the president push to get this lawyer on and how does he know him? >> there's a lot there. i'll start at the beginning. the president had this conversation with mitch mcconnell in february when this nomination for matt desmond to be the irs chief counsel had been delayed and languishing. desmond had become frustrated the president told mitch mcconnell. he might withdraw his nomination because it was taking so long. at that point the senate was very focused on getting bill barr through as the attorney general and the president told mitch mcconnell that getting desmond through was more of a priority over barr that should happen first if they could make it happen. the sen

the law says the irs shall turn over this tax information. it doesn't say may. it doesn't say should. it says shall. legally, democrats feel they're on solid footing. it's going to be up to republicans to make the case publicly this is a witch hunt and they're going after the president and sway public opinion in that way. democrats point to polls that show something like a majority of americans want to see the president's tax returns. >> we'll watch the fight in public opinion. thanks for joining us on "inside politics." brianna keilar will be here after a very quick break. have a good afternoon. parts of me i didn't even know. i find out i'm 19% native american, specifically from the chihuahua people. what?! that's... i find that crazy. it traces their journey in the mid-1800s from central mexico to texas. learning about the risks they took for a better life... ...it gives me so much respect and gratitude. it just shed so much light in my past that i never even would've known was there. 20 million members have connected to a deeper family story. order your kit

but it should be the irs commissioner reddick presumably, right? so when secretary mnuchin specifically says he is overseeing it. what is that? >> yes, well, secretary mnuchin is ignoring what former secretary larry somers has pointed out. >> that there is a long-standing delegation of authority from the treasury secretary to not be involved in these individual tax matters and give that responsibility to the irs commissioner. >> that can be changed only by giving 30 days' notice to congress. which they have not done. so i think secretary mnuchin is trying to control what happens from the irs commissioner just as president trump from your comments is trying to use every lawyer at his disposal to say that shall does not mean shall and to put himself above the law. >> thank you very much, congressman, i appreciate your time. >> thank you. >>> next, why is president trump defending herman kain? even as member over member is up in arms about kain's nomination to the federal reserve board. >>> plus jeanie moos on president trump's advice for george walk.

it's being justified to see that the irs is doing the job it's doing. i'm not aware that anyone asked for an audit of barack obama or george w. bush. they're drawing the line after everybody is saying not to see what the irs is doing but the president's dealings with russia or other players and that's not the stated purpose of the inqui inquiry. i think they've mixed it up here. once they have the returns i would be curious if they get it broadly make it public. >> that's interesting. i wonder then what you think about this new report "the new york times" first reporting that president trump had pushed for the nomination of the irs chief counsel even before he was pushing for the process, the confirmation process for his now attorney general bill barr and that this is someone who actually had done work for the trump organization before the president trump became president. what you do think about that and the potential implications of politicizing the process through this move? >> i worked with michael desmond. he was at the treasury department when i w

one by the nonpartisan staff of the joint committee on taxation and second by the irs again. and those two -- the second and the third audits both showed that president nixon actually owed almost half a million dollars in tax and interest. so there is -- there is a history of problems in that area. there is kind of an inherent conflict of interest when an agency like the irs has to audict -- has to audit effectively its bossish and the chairman has given the irs until april 10th to comply with the request, six years worth logistically is that even possible? >> well, i -- i thought chairman neal's request is pretty targeted and that is a smart move on his part. and so it is just a question of how difficult it will be to assemble the returns. i would think that if the irs has some of the returns readily available and some not, i'm sure the chairman would be very happy to take a partial set since it is going to take some time for him and his staff to go through the material anyway. >> sure. professor george wen, thank you. >> thank you. >>> coming up next, i'll be joined live by

will the irs release the president's tax returns. we'll speak with someone who once held this top spot. >>> and just in, we now know how elizabeth warren stacks up in terms of fundraising. stay with me. you're watching cnn. i'm brooke baldwin. ners on greae can be expensive, and sometimes ineffective. for better value, tackle grease with dawn ultra. dawn is for more than just dishes. it provides 3x more grease cleaning power per drop, which cuts through tough kitchen messes, pre-treats laundry stains, and even tackles grease build-up on car rims. tackle tough greasy messes around your home, and save money with dawn ultra. brand power. helping you better. run with us on a john deere 1 series tractor. beacuse changing your attachments, should be as easy as... what about this? changing your plans. yeah. run with us. search "john deere 1 series" for more. woman 1: this is my body of proof. man 1: proof of less joint pain and clearer skin. man 2: proof that i can fight psoriatic arthritis... woman 2: ...with humira. woman 3: humira target

the irs commissioner at that time resisted that. so did the treasury secretary. in this case we have democrats trying to, i think, use the irs as a political cudgel against a republican president. i'm not saying there couldn't possibly be legitimate reasons to see these tax returns, but i think we have to be very careful that the two parties don't start using the irs, no matter who is in power, to go after their political enemies. >> look, i think that the american people absolutely have a right to know whether their president, whether the most important and most public figure in the world is running the executive branch for americans' benefit or for his own. and we could answer these questions easily if trump abided by these nearly half century norms that have been in place, and he voluntarily released those documents himself. no one would need to be, quote, unquote, using the irs as a political cudgel if, in fact, trump just volunteered the information that has been widely expected of presidents with much less conflicted portfolios within their private ownershi

we didn't go to the president's lawyers and really they've never rejected a request like this, the irs, and we think the laws behind us which is part of the code, 6103 f, people should read it before they talk about it and it's very clear that the ways and means committee and the chairman of that committee have the right to ask that the taxes be released, not in public, but in private setting and the law's very clear about what needs to be done if we get them, that this is a private setting and then there's a vote down the road if we want to release any of it or all of it. it's very clear what the law is. the president could say all he wants. he's not going to comply. he has nothing to say about this, according to the tax law. you have to comply, i have to comply, the president has to comply, period. >> it says the authorization to request the president's tax returns from the irs is valid as follows, if it can show, one, it's part of an investigation or two, it's fulfilling congress's oversight role. is it applicable here? >> no, it isn't applicable here. yes, you can get these documen

the irs does not confirm that. we know trump lied when he said this. >> if i decide to run for office, i'll produce my tax returns, absolutely. >> washington investigative correspondent, mark is with us and cnn legal analyst, ross garber. is the law on the president's side of this fight or not? >> it gets complicated. there's a statute that says, if the chairman of the ways and means committee asks for somebody's tax returns, the irs shall give it to him. in law, shall is probably the strongest word that can be used. shall means, it's got to happen, but, the overlay is the constitution. there is a but. it's the law. the overlay is, but, the constitution. the constitution says, yeah, okay, shall, but it has to be for a proper legislative purpose. by the way, that statute applies to the president, you, me, all of our viewers. it applies to everybody. the constitution says there's got to be a legitimate purpose. that's where there's an issue. the president's lawyers have said this is about politics. there is no legiti

cnn first to report that house ways and means sent a letter to the irs wednesday. he's citing a little known section of the irs code to request the president's personal returns from 2013 to 2018. he wants tax returns from eight of the president's business entities. the president reacting with humor and a familiar excuse. >> mr. president, the chairman of the democratic ways and means committee moments ago asked the irs for six years of your tax returns. >> is that all? >> that's all. >> usually it's ten, so i guess they're giving up. until such time is i'm not under ordered, i would not be inclined to do that. >> democrats insist the request is about oversight. republicans see it as a political escalation. the ranking member of the ways and means committee, republican kevin brady sending a letter to treasury secretary steve mnuchin. weaponizing the tax code by targeting political foes, sets a dangerous precedent and weakens privacy rights. >>> "the new york times" reporting some of the special counsel's investigators have been complaining to associates that bill ba

he then goes on to say, i quote, expect a reply from the irs by 5:00 p.m. on april 23rd, 2019. please know that if you fail to comply, your failure will be interpreted as a denial of my request. now this, of course, is just setting the ground work for that legal fight that we expect to see in upcoming months, but again, richard neal wants to see the president's tax returns. he's argue that had under the law the irs statute he has the authority to do that, whether or not the administration agrees, we know the administration has said that democrats are never going to see the president's tax returns. so we are setting up this fight, again, between congressional democrats and the trump administration, the showdown, of course, over the president's tax returns that he has refused to turn over, both during the campaign and when he entered the white house. frederica? >> all right. keep us posted. thank you so much. >>> house speaker nancy pelosi is calling out the president today saying he's wrong for his recent attack on freshman congresswoman ilhan omar. pelosi is coming to her defen

the irs commissioner at that time resisted that. we have the democrats using the irs against a republican president. i am not saying there could be legitimate reasons the see these tax returns. we have to be careful that the two parties don't start using irs no matter who's in power to go after it politically. >> the american people have the right to know whether their president and most public figure in the world is running the executive branch for american benefits or for his own. we can answer these questions if trump abided by these yearly half a century norms in place and he voluntarily release those do you means himself. >> i am out of time. thank you both. >>> boeing the manufacture of the ethiopia flight crashed last month killing everyone on board apologized today the crew followed all instructions. what we are learning about what went wrong and questions about the 737 max's safety. pardon the interruption but this is big! now at t-mobile buy any samsung galaxy s10 and get a galaxy s10e free! ♪ she's doing it again. no co

the irs should respond. nonetheless, we will see what happens with secretary mnuchin's letter on may 6. but we expect that the law should be complied with. it is a 100-year-old law that says that the chair of ways and means shall have these tax returns, not may. we do expect to have them. >> the president just this morning said that he assumes that mueller looked through his taxes and mueller, bob mueller special counsel looked through his financials. if that's the case, do you take from that that they didn't find anything? >> no, i don't. actually, it is the oversight duty of ways and means to see that the law is properly complied with and the chair is exercising his duty to make sure that the returns of the president were done properly. we know that it is a practice of the irs to have an audit of the president every year, but we do not know whether that audit has been done properly or correctly, and it is our duty to make sure that it is being done that way. and we also want to know whether the president i

by using the irs. one of the reason why we always have to be careful that our politicians don't politicize the irs is that it is a very dangerous instrument if used improperly. >> there is a brand-new episode of "tricky dick" airing right after this show. top of the hour. exploring how nixon won the presidency in part because of a promise to end the vietnam war. here's a quick preview. >> we are protesting richard nixon's stupid action of expanding the war in southeast asia. >> president nixon doesn't want peace. you're not going to tell me that somebody escalates war that wants peace. he's just lyinging to the american people. >> you know, you see these bums, you know, building up the campuses. >> listen, the boys on the college campuses today are the luckiest people in the world and here they are burning up the books. i mean, storming around about this issue. i mean, you name it. get rid of the war, there will be another one. >> you can't have the president of the united states alienating students, r

the six years was chosen because that's why what the irs says you should save six years of taxes and that might be what the normal person would have readily available. that's what they say is the reason they chose that number right there. susan, i do want to get your take on one other piece of news that we learned overnight and that's michael cohen and his team are apparently asking for more time. don't send him to jail next month because he's finding more information on his own as he gets access to his hard drives and his information. let me read you this. mr. cohen was only recently able to access the hard drive with important documents. that's what his lawyers say. said drive contains over 14 million files which consist of all emails, voice recordings, images and attachments from mr. cohen's reporters and phones. a legitimate request at this point, do you think michael cohen has found out more in this last few weeks than say the fbi or southern district found when they had all kinds of search warrants and digging through his stuff? >> certainly it raises the question of when they