should that be the fbi? should bit the house where the democrats are in control if the senate is not going to approve it? >> if i were to do this in logical order, the first thing i would do is have the house judiciary committee investigate the fbi investigation and find out what they did. you could take the fbi investigation and compare to it a real fbi investigation, and you'd be able to see multiple discrepancies between the way the fbi ordinary -- ordinarily investigates when they're doing a legitimate criminal investigation and this thing they did at the white house's behest. and if i were looking at that, the first thing i'd look at is the so-called tip line. people were coming to us, you know, on the judiciary committee saying i've got evidence. i've got a friend who has evidence. i have a client who has evidence. where do we take to it the fbi? and so when we asked the fbi where should this evidence come to, they kept saying not me, not, this no, not here. >> so you're not yet backing impeachment of

, why it wasn't turned over to the fbi is beyond me. >> when fbi agent jerry clark finally got the notes he thought they confirmed much of what he long suspected, but they were the notes of a prison snitch, of limited value unless they were corroborated. clark knew just who to go to for that. >> coming up, a new witness with something to reveal. >> that solidifies any question. it doesn't get any more important than that. >> when "dateline" continues. t. >> when "dateline" continues you wouldn't accept an incomplete job from anyone else. why accept it from your allergy pills? flonase sensimist. nothing stronger. nothing gentler. nothing lasts longer. flonase sensimist. 24 hour non-drowsy allergy relief ♪ >>> august 2005, two years after the pizza bombing fbi agent jerry clark had jailhouse notes implicating marjorie, but it wasn't enough. he needed a corroborating witness. then a break. ken barnes was arrested on drug charges, now he had nowhere to hide, so clark turned up the pressure. and when he told barnes he had information that he was in on the plot, barnes caved, and he began to

even the top lawyer at the fbi. all these senior people involved in the initial investigation, right? all these people involved in investigating what russia did to try into stall trump in the white house, all these people who were involved in that investigation or who crucially might have been witnesses between what happened between trump and comey, all of them have since seen themselves and their careers systematically targeted by president and the trump administration and their helpers in conservative media. but with andrew mccabe they're now going an extra mile. they are demanding not just the destruction of his career and his reputation but they are now demanding his criminal prosecution. and the proximate charge is related to an internal investigation at the justice department into who at the fbi leaked information to the "wall street journal" confirming that there was an fbi investigation before the election into potential wrongdoing at the clinton foundation. now, i know, why would a possessed anti-trump part

a witness to the allegation, quote, notified senators and the fbi about this account, but the fbi did not investigate and mr. steyer has declined to discuss it publicly. president trump today on twitter seizing on a detail added to times reporting last night in an editor's note saying the alleged victim in the claim declined to be interviewed, friends say she does not recall the episode. concerns unrelated to that incident in "new york times" also raise questions about the adequacy of the fbi's background investigation into cavanaugh. a probe into another sexual abuse allegation raised by debra ramirez may also have fallen short according to the times. miss ramirez's legal team gave the fbi a list of at least 25 individuals that may have had corroborating evidence. but they interviewed none of them. though we learned many of the potential witnesses tried in vain to reach the fbi on their own. two fbi agents interviewed miss ramirez, telling her they found her credible, but the republican controlled senate imposed strict limits on the investigation. quote, we have to wait to get author

others say that in order to preserve the fbi, this is something that needs to be prosecuted. and so today we learn from a source familiar with the decision that now deputy attorney general jeff rosen said, no. in fact, mccabe cannot appeal to avoid criminal prosecution. imminent. but we understand there are still a lot of moving pieces in all of this, but it's something that we're preparing for here. and it's something that we can see both sides interpret through their own lens as this comes closer to a case. >> mike schmidt can you speak to what appears as a twisty turvy day? let me read you some of what your colleagues posted in the last hour on this story. mccabe's lawyers have vigorously denied that he intentionally lied and believed prosecutors singled him out. false statements made at federal law enforcement agencies are typically punished administratively, not by criminal prosecution. hints of the case's weakness have emerged. the investigation was referred about 18 months ago which is an unusually long stretch for an inquiry with a limited set of facts and witnesses.

and trying to talk to the fbi. >> oh, gosh, they wrote memos to the fbi. they were begging to be interviewed by the fbi. they were contacting senator grassley's staff. senator grassley's staff disputes this. they say they talked to my sources, but they sources say that the people who interviewed them were junior staffers and it was a very elemental interview and really didn't get into the meat of what they were offering in their fbi memos. >> in your supporting as well, the staffers were seeming to push the idea there was a mistaken identity involved, even though that is not what your sources were -- >> this was yet another woman, jen klaus, a yale classmate who received a phone call from grassley's staff where they suggested that there was another man, and i won't identify his name, but that there was another man known at yale for dropping his pants. she disputed that, but according to her, she felt like they were trying to push the possibility that maybe debbie had just mistaken him for another person. >> donald trump this morning is tweeting that brett

but if the information had come out early i think you could have seen a full throat fbi investigation but this isn't going away if the nib never even bothered to talk to people surrounding this woman's allegation. >> jacqueline, do you suspect that it's going to go away now or do you think this is something that we are talking about six months from now? >> yeah, i could see this being something we continue to talk about, just as it dragged on for a long news cycle in the trump era, at least, this -- if there is an investigation that commences now, this could drag on well into the primary and be a talking point in the general election. but, again, you know, the trump administration, especially the trump family specifically, has not shown any regard for the me too movement and what it means. and trump himself has seemed pretty impervious to it. as you saw last night via twitter he seized on these new allegations as a way to double down on his support for kavanaugh and attacks on the media. so just in the way that democrats will try to push the ball forward here trump is going to do exac

if the fbi is contacted, the fbi can't seem to open an investigation either because they haven't found enough. we've looked into it. "the new york times" has looked into it. maybe you're right, maybe there's magical missing information here. but at some point, do you not accept all of these entities looking into it to have found the answer? if what hunter biden did was wrong, boy, there are a lot of people with the last name of trump that have some answering to do about their foreign work and their foreign entanglements. >> i'm going to have to disagree with you, chuck, i don't think there's been an investigation of this. >> who would have to conduct this investigation for you to accept there's nothing there? do we have to conduct investigations basically based on partisan fairness? if we do this, we have to do that? that isn't how the rule of law works, sir. >> if you want to be fair, steams in my example that you need to investigate both the alleged bank robber and the alleged violation by the policeman who beat the bank robber suspect. now, you have said there have been investigatio

that's what the fbi said a u.s. army soldier told an undercover investigator in an internet chat room. now federal prosecutors charged that soldier with giving instructions on how to build an explosive device and talking about possible attacks in the united states. nbc news justice correspondent pete williams has been following this and joins me now with details of the latest. what do we know about the story? >> doesn't appear to be specific attack plans and this soldier talked about possible targets and never had any actual plans. he's 24 years ole. his name is jarrett william smith. a private army first class at kansas and according to court documents the fbi said he started talking three years ago about fighting in ukraine with a paramilitary group and joined the army two years ago and even after joining the army the fbi said he was posting on a chat room on facebook instructions on how to make homemade bombs, improvised explosive devices and instructions to use a cell phone to detonate such a device. according t

fbi never bothered. all of this is prompting a revisitation of the kavanaugh confirmation debacle which happened roughly this time last year. it's resulting in new calls that kavanaugh should, perhaps, be impeached from the high court. for among other things lying under oath during his confirmation process including about some of these sexual assault allegations. one of the prominent democrats who's now making that call that kavanaugh should be impeached for lying under oath is california senator and democratic presidential candidate kamala harris. and she joins us next. saturdays happen. pain happens. aleve it. aleve is proven better on pain than tylenol. when pain happens, aleve it. all day strong. you wanna see something thatamazing?ing. go to hilton instead of a travel site and you'll experience a whole new range of emotions like... the relaxing feeling of knowing you're getting the best price. these'll work. the utter delight of free wi-fi... . oh man this is the best part. isn't that you? yeah. and

, but the fbi did not investigate and mr. stier has declined to discuss it publicly. we have corroborated with two officials who have communicated with mr. stier. nbc news has confirmed that members of the judiciary committee were aware of max stier's allegations at the time of the confirmation process. the new book makes one more important point about that story. the book gives the name of the woman involved in that story and then specifies that she, quote, has also refused to discuss the incident though several of her friends said she does not recall it. "the times" later on sunday added that line to the end of the paragraph about max stier's accusation. that line in "the times" now reads, the female student declined to be interviewed and friends say she does not recall the episode. leading off our discussion tonight, are robin pogrebin and kate kelly who writes about wall street for "the new york times." they are the authors of the new book, "the education of brett kavanaugh: an investigation," which will be out tomorrow.

. >> you would get the intelligence agencies and the fbi and the fbi works closely with the intelligence agencies on these things to detail experts in the area to the committee and work for the committee. now, the white house can block that if they want to but, again, i think the point where nancy pelosi has to draw the line. >> interesting? >> if the white house tries to obstruct anything whatsoever and give them a very short leash and a very short time line, they move to impeachment proceedings on obstruction on that basis alone. >> very interesting. could be a first test to see how hard the executive branch is going to make this on congress. >> she's got to have the votes to do that. that's what she's doing right now, rounding those up. >> appreciate having you on. thank you very much. good to see you. let me bring in the political side of this argument. doug and john. two creatures of capitol hill at times. >> at times. doug, in some ways the hearing today felt like less necessary once we saw the whistle-blower report. >> right. right. well, the report came out just before -- >> it a

the suspect's rambling call to the fbi tip line. it's hard to talk about good fortune or good luck when seven people are dead. but it seems that we were in fact lucky here that it was state troopers who pulled this suspect over for again what they say was an unrelated traffic offense and what started this incident when we don't yet know where the suspect was going or what his intentions were, except i think it's fairly reasonable to assume they were not good. we also learned that this is somebody perhaps someone who should've been on police radar if he wasn't already. one of our team members here on the ground spoke to a neighbor of the suspect today that said he had threatened her with that same rifle as much as a month ago, that he was known to fire it from the roof of his house shooting at small animals in the neighborhood. the way the fbi described it is that this is not the kind of thing you don't see shootings where a person just snaps. that's not really how this works in real life. instead what you often have is a longer, slo

as soon as they announced they were going to reopen the fbi investigation and that the fbi investigation was time limited to a very few number of days, that was a very clear expression to everyone in the senate, this is going to be an extremely limited investigation. there was not announcement they could have made, which is we're delaying the hearing until the fbi investigation is completed, which would be the normal process for a committee but once they time limited it, what i'm discovering in your book though shocking, is not really surprising to me. the fbi didn't investigate all sorts of obvious people and question people they should have questioned. >> right. part of the consensus that was -- the compromise that was struck between senator flake at the time, senator kunz, and also with the support of moderate republicans, was that it would be time limited, it would be focused. the four of them actually did the walk together about how many witnesses and ideas of which witnesses perhaps ought to be talked to. one person we talked to for the book said that number might be as high as 50.

investigation or lack of fbi investigation into allegations of sexual misconduct by brett kavanaugh during the confirmation process for the supreme court. presidential candidate amy klobuchar will join us tonight to discuss what she thinks congress should do now >>> and we have breaking news on two major stories in the middle east tonight the trump administration is considering how to respond to an attack on saudi arabian oil facilities secretary of state mike pompeo is on his way to saudi arabia scheduled to meet with the governor tomorrow. as rachel said, votes are being counted in israel in an election that's been called a referendum on trump ally benjamin netanyahu. roger kerwin has worked with th "new york times" and has militarized affairs. we are very lucky to have him at this historic moment in the middle east joining us tonight at the end of the hour >>> also toward the end of the hour, cal perry will join us with a really important investigation that he conducted into the potential dangers of process of flaring natural gas in texas you really need to see this. >>> now, if

the day after he fired former fbi james comey. donald trump told the russians quote "he was unconcerned of moscow's interference in the u.s. election because the united states did the same in other country and assertion that prompted officials to limit access to the remarks to unusually small number of people." in an interview with lester holt just one day later, he treated russian interference for seriously. >> if russia hacked or did anything or having to do with our election, i want to know about it. >> well, it is already intelligence virtually for every intelligence agencies that said that did happen. >> if russia or anybody else is trying to interfere with our electio elections, i think it is a horrible thing and i want to get to the bottom of it. i want to make sure will never ever happen. >> now, you may recall there was no u.s. news media at that may 2017 meeting in the oval office. only russian outlets were involved. "the new york times" reported, trump told the russians, firing the quote "nut job." trump's comment about

andrew mccabe was the number two fbi official. he was overseeing that investigation, and certainly that's something that made president trump extremely unhappy. during the course of the investigation, during the course of the hillary clinton investigation as well, which mccabe was deeply involved in, andrew mccabe authorized people to speak to the press. in interviews with the fbi when that was investigated, he was found to have lacked candor about that. he did not immediately say, yes, i did that. he wasn't forthcoming. keep in mind as the number two fbi official, he is more than able to authorize people to speak to the press. but that lack of candor was something that he was criticized for by the inspector general. in an unusual twist, he was then -- that was kicked over and turned into a criminal prosecution. as you mentioned at the top of the show, that very rarely happens. usually it's dealt with administratively. different people have shown all sorts of examples where an fbi or doj employee has been found to have committed s

had a problem with the bidens, why didn't they go to the fbi. that is still a question to me that somebody has to answer. >> and were there conversations between the president and the attorney general about this. he oversees the fbi as well. so all roads lead to him. >> and i think mr. barr knows mr. rudy giuliani's cellphone number as well. so that also feels like a next too a bit. >> i think that it is something to probe. i think -- i get the sense that the attorney general is a lot more careful than giuliani. and so i would expect that there may have been conversations,but given what a loose cannon giuliani has been, somebody with a career like the attorney general's he i think would be very, very careful about what he shared with giuliani. >> and, you know, we may come to the point where he claims that there may be a point where barr might be forced to have to name a special counsel. i imagine mr. barr is looking for every way to avoid that outcome. but i don't -- you know, it is amazing how low he is trying to fly. >> the way that i see it,

was notified about the account but the fbi did not investigate and mr. stier declined to discuss this story public limit more than a day after the article was published the times updated the article to include a key element of the book's account that quote the female student declined to be interviewed and friends say she does not recall the episode. the authors also claim that they found new corroboration for accusations that kavanaugh exposed himself to yale classmate debra ramirez in the early 1980s. nbc news has not been able to verify that reporting. kavanaugh declined to comment. kavanaugh delivered a broad denial of misconduct during his confirmation hearing last year. >> and we have more on the 2020 democrats and how they're responding. elizabeth warren and kamala harris and beto o'rourke and julian castro claiming for kavanaugh to be impeached. and pute beejz reportedly told cnn, if kavanaugh does not resign, he should be impeached and the president defending his supreme court pick tweeting out now the radical left and the lame stream media are a

that's not because i don't trust the fbi. it's because i don't trust attorney general barr or the president to leave their hands off the investigation. so i think that if we get the facts, that can make a difference. >> we're not going to get the facts under this administration. this is all going to have to wait for the next election. and there should absolutely be a new investigation, but it's not going to take place unless the democrats get control of the senate and the white house. some of the people involved in this, by the way, i know who brought some of the new allegations forward and the fbi didn't have time to investigate, is a tremendously credible witness. i have known him for a long time, and he's a person of great ta integrity. so you will see developments in this if the democrats take the white house. >> nbc news has not confirmed the information. but it will be interesting to see who is politically most in danger as a result of this, possibly susan collins. we will be watching. thank you for joining us and givin

and that case gets opened at the local fbi office. it doesn't matter. this reporting we're hearing from sources who are telling various major media outlets, hey, there was no quid pro quo, we never linked it to the military aid. let me tell you something about that. back in the fbi, in the counterintelligence days when i was there, if we found out that three different agencies were getting the exact same story from a source or multiple sources, we would look suspiciously at that source. what am i saying? i think that sounds like spin coming from the white house. oh, there wasn't a quid pro quo. the president just talked about biden. it doesn't matter. it can be implied or indirect. there's a problem here legally for the president. >> first of all, frank, let there be no mistake. i'm calling the fbi and telling them their former head of counter-intel just offered me a quarter billion dollars, so watch yourself there. secondly and more seriously, what would you have be done about this? what's the remedy in your view? >> well, in a system where nothing see

who investigates that the fbi. who's over the fbi? the department of justice and attorney general barr. we already know where he comes down on this. where do i come down on this? the whistleblower may need to report this to the fbi. barr can't stop a private citizen from going to the fbi and reporting a crime. >> joyce, let me reframe on some of the developments from 24 hours ago. it was reported last night around 8:00 i think in both the "new york times" and "the washington post" that this communication was with ukraine. it's been reported in the last 45 minutes that there was a conversation in which donald trump raised digging up opposition research on the bidens about eight times in a call with the leader of ukraine. can you help explain the intersection of those two data points and their import? >> and, you know, i think this is exactly what frank is getting to. the real issue here is whether this conduct alone or in tandem with other conduct would've justified the treatment we now know that the inspector general for the intellige

they immediately picked up the package and took it to the fbi. you don't accept these kind of things. it is ridiculous. as you know, i do a bunch of international campaigns now. foreign actors are in all of these elections and after what russia got for what they did in 2016, why wouldn't they? i mean, they're playing everywhere and the world's police cop, the united states, is out there saying it's okay. president of the united states, george stephanopoulos, just said, great, give me more. like, there is now no discernible position from the united states government on any of this stuff. >> frank figliuzzi, i want to give you the last word, put you on the spot. you were here the day andy mccabe said he opened a full-field investigation into donald trump around these questions because the conduct was so in line with vladimir putin's national security objectives. has anything changed? i mean, post-mueller, donald trump went to the g8 and advocated for putin to be invited, to be welcomed back into the g8. i mean, isn't his conduct exactly in line wit

kids say rachel left play rehearsal to meet with the fbi. mary and dave neese desperate to find their daughter thought the police were wasting their time investigating the girls they knew so well. >> i even went to the police and said will you leave sheila alone, please? you guys are harassing her 24/7. the kid is going through enough. leave her alone. she was like our daughter. >> investigators were convinced the two girls knew more than they were saying. that fall, ronnie gaskins interviewed each girl repeatedly. how was sheila's demeanor in these meetings you would have with her? >> calm. collect. would look at you right in your face, right in your eyes. >> he says rachel seemed distracted. >> she would draw on the desk, play with the pencil. just her nonverbal cues spoke a lot. >> their story never varied. they picked skylar up, drove around morgantown, smoked a little pot, and dropped her off a few blocks from home. >> it was like a recording with these two. >> in the meantime, the officers had begun to collect physical evidence, and it

and fbi. something criticized by many, not just the people in the probe. he was on the program once. i talked to him about that. let's take a look at that. >> in my view the worst thing that the president does is the same behavior and actions he engages in every day. unrelenting assault on the fbi, men and women in law enforcement and having professionalintellig. i think it has an impact on those institutions. >> he is correct. that is the problem. you have the president of the united states constantly raising the issue and asking his political enemies be prosecuted and locked up, it undermines the entire integrity of the justice system and makes people question whether the department of justice is acting fairly in the exercise of their duties. that is a terrible position to have our government in and have our department of justice in. i don't think that ever has been exercised by any president on any department of justice. even when nixon fired the attorney general who would not fire cox and fired the deputy attorney general. things went along as normal.

is the white house asked the fbi to do a follow-up. and in this case we know the white house wasn't interested in getting to the truth, they were interested in checking a political box. so they didn't want an fbi investigation in the first place and then when they finally a seeded to pressure because they forced to ask for one. they said you can only talk to these ten people and these are the only questions you can ask. i've never seen something like that before. >> the president is calling for the judiciary committee to come to justice kavanaugh's rescue. how do you read that? >> because that's what he asked the justice department to do last fall. he asked them to hide the documents from the white house and the george w. bush white house and he's asking for them to do it again. it worked once from his perspective. >> so to conservatives who would say that groups like yours and other activists are working to in their view smear justice kavanaugh because you don't like where he sits and his position on the extreme court, how do you resp

, characterizing, sometimes mischaracterizing the fbi. i want readers and your viewers to hear from the people inside the institution. so i interviewed dozens of people for the book, again to put you in the mindset of what they were thinking when they started this investigation, how it progressed and, more importantly, how it feels to be on the receiving end of a campaign of attack from the president of the united states. i will say it is important to note this is not an endorsement of the fbi's actions. i am critical of certain decisions, including my former boss at certain times, but it gives you the unvarnished view of who these people are and what they were trying to contend with as they tried to stop the counterintelligence threat. >> what is your analysis of the implications of the russia investigation for approaching 2020 and election security? >> it is a great question. you know, one thing that i argue is if you are in the fbi and the doj and you thought the last two years were bad, you should buckle up because looking ahead at 20

report report and the fbi fired him. that would be the end of it. there is a very, very long history of internal investigations, gross misconduct where people lie and don't end up in criminal cases. >> there was all sorts of speculation when the morning began and perhaps it is justice department gossip that an andy mccabe indictment was coming. here is what the "washington post" reported this afternoon because nothing came about, but the grand jury did meet. the notification comes as the grand jury was recalled after a month-long hiatus. the panel was let go with no immediate signs of an indictment, a sign they might have balked, return later or filed a determination under seal. it was surprise to someone else i spoke to that they met and returned with nothing. the immediate speculation is oh, my god. did they reject d.o.j.? >> there are only three possibilities and you read them from the "washington post." one, that there was a snag and a are going to come back and do it later. the second, they did something under seal. third possibility is the mos

dial was on the fbi's most wanted list. meanwhile, bobbi says she was in a texas motel at the mercy of randolph dial. >> he bound my wrist. he bound my ankles. and he beat me with a -- his belt. it was a very severe beating. very severe. what i remember him saying is, this is nothing compared to what the people i know can and will do to you. >> what did he say he would do if you tried to get away? >> he would either find me or my family, and he would harm them, kill them. >> by this time they ditched her van. she says dial, who claimed to have mob connections, managed to get ahold of some cash and a gun. >> he put it to my head, and he said, "this is what happens if you don't cooperate." and i just -- i nodded. i wanted to get home. >> instead, they boarded a bus for houston where she says dial locked her in an abandoned apartment, tied her up, and forced alcohol and drugs on her. >> he has complete control over everything, everything. >> he's feeding you? >> uh-huh. >> bathing you? >> yeah. cleaning me. >> having his way w

just fbi agents and a prosecutor. they were searching for evidence to tie them to the string of bank robberies in eastern tennessee. >> when we originally walked in the amount of evidence and items that were in the house was staggering. >> including weapons, electronic dedevices, cameras, fake tattoos and massive amounts of photos. among them this picture. plus anb inadvertent selfie. his face seen in a car side mirror as they cased a bank. whr the agents told brian wigtam what they had, >> he laid out the entire scheme, his role. >> tawas a chill canning criminal enterprise that included learning every detail about their intend itted victim's lives. step by step they gathered intelligence. first they identified the bank. >> go to social media page and hopefully get names and picture oz the people they felt were the targets. >> then they stocked the employees on liep. >> on linkedin, on facebook. >> victims would rise and fall depending on the quality and quantity of social media evidence they put out for the world to

why isn't it fbi and main justice? >> that's a very good question, because the fbi's performance entire investigation including to this moment is flawed. why am i doing it? can't you figure it out? i'm his defense lawyer. i'm defending him. he's my client. >> peter baker, this is a white house that's not a stranger to controversy. it's not a stranger to breaking sort of crisis style headlines. what's breaking out in terms of their concern level about this? do they view this as we have been down this road before or as potentially different? >> i think the president has anticipated this moment would happen. this is the first president we have ever had about whom there was talk about impeachment even before he was inaugurated. at every stage in the last two and a half years people have raised the issue. the only thing really shocking or surprising is it has taken this long. it did happen fast once it started coming together. why are they so willing to release this transcript tomorrow? the president is clearly doubling dow

we have an fbi agent with us tonight. also my special report tonight on how donald trump is not only profiting off the presidency, but the way the swamp is growing and affecting american consumers. >>> but first a new setback for roger stone's trial. his wing man ready to testify against him. that important mueller story is next. ♪ i planned ♪ each charted course ♪ each careful step ♪ along the byway ♪ much more ♪ much more than this ♪ i did it my way (vo) the most awarded network gives you more. like one of our latest phones for free when you switch to unlimited. that's verizon. i need all the breaks as athat i can get.or, at liberty butchemel... cut. liberty mu... line? cut. liberty mutual customizes your car insurance so you only pay for what you need. cut. liberty m... am i allowed to riff? what if i come out of the water? liberty biberty... cut. we'll dub it. liberty mutual customizes your car insurance so you only pay for what you need. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty

once again -- it was referred to the fbi. >> let me fast forward. it was referred to the fbi by the president who actually engaged in the conversation? >> the -- >> no, it was not. let me fast forward to june 13th, five weeks in advance of that, when the chair of the federal elections commission made the following statement. follow me, please. let me make something 100% dealer the american public and anyone running for public office. it is illegal for any person to accept, solicit or receive anything of value from a foreign national in connection with a u.s. election. this is not a novel concept. election intervention from foreign governments has been considered unacceptable since the beginnings of our nation. do you agree with the fec chair weintraub? >> i agree our elections are sacred, and any interference from an outside source is not what we want -- >> and to solicit or accept it is illegal? >> i don't know about that. i'm not a lawyer. i don't mean to be evasive. >> so you think it is okay for a public official to solicit -- it may be okay. yo

joyce, the fbi, when you knew the fbi at least, what would they be doing under normal circumstances when it comes to ukraine, rudy giuliani going over there, the president's personal lawyer, and donald trump? >> well, this is well within the fbi's bailiwick. as the secretary knows, this is the sort of corruption case they loved best. certainly southern district of new york, other u.s. attorney's offices would have seen news reporting not just on this story but the biden story and would probably be prompted to investigate. so perhaps one of the best guarantees you point out that there's no evidence of wrongdoing by the bidens is why did the president feel compelled to ask a foreign government to investigate if there really was anything to the allegations. it would have been awfully easy to send the information as a referral to the fbi and have them look into it. as to the president's conduct, i think the fbi i know and secretary johnson worked for would have investigated this to determine if there was anything to it. it is extraordinarily unusual that this almost ministerial task the dni

. >> the fbi announced that arrest with the u.s. attorney office in new york as part of ongoing efforts against hezbollah, iranian backed terrorist organization. he is originally from new jersey. this is somebody that started training according to court documents in 1999 with hezbollah, in the early 2000s, conducted terrorist surveillance activities in new york city, boston, and washington, d.c. some of the terrorist surveillance activities were to look at potential targets for a terrorism attack, including here at rockefeller plaza. he also looked at times square. a number of major tunnels and bridges in new york city and key government centers, including the fbi headquarters in new york, on top of that, surveilled fenway park, prudential center in boston and washington monument. those are surveillance activities. in addition to that, he attempted to kill somebody he believed was an israeli spy. he had a handler according to court documents from hezbollah, somebody that was arrested july this year, has been detained. he is in custo

that's what's got to change here. >> a real question as to whether the fbi interviewed eyewitnesss or participants. there was a close circle of buddies who hung out. >> just like in high school. >> they were in touch with them prior to the new yorker story. were they setting the narrative or eyewitnesss who had no participation in any of this who would have no reason not to tell the truth about what actually happened. sounds like max didn't want his name out there but he witnessed something and wanted that to be relay relayed. we know there was a limited number of people interviewed and that was dictate bd by the whit house. >> that's been reported that there was a culture around this and certain people who participated but i can't go beyond that right now. >> was this behavior by an animal house environment? >> the context of the times story in the presentation was looking at it from a so socieconomic. he was a working person and he was a man of elite. yale in the early '80s they got wasted drunk and took liberties with their intoxication. all of this is not to execucusee act. the bi

but what everybody should do is call for the fbi investigation that should've happened before. i think that's what deborah ramirez was owed. i think that's what the senate should've insisted upon. and let's see whether we can get that done this week. >> again the president tonight earlier today said that the department of justice should intervene on justice kavanaugh's behalf, not for a thorough investigation. >> i think the justice department has other things to do. >> let me get your thoughts, sir, about the debate stage that took place a couple days ago. you were not on that stage not qualifying for it. how do you see where you stand currently in the race given everything that has transpired over the past week? >> i was obviously disappointed not to be on the debate stage. but i think the dnc's criteria where arbitrary and didn't make any sense. and i've been spending my time in iowa and new hampshire. i don't have unlimited resources like some people in the race. so i had to make a decision whether i was going to spend money communicating with voters in these early states.

one thing he did say, he said the committee will talk to fbi director wray, he will app investigation into kavanaugh. that's one thing critics are intent upon, the fact that this investigation into kavanaugh at the time was not thorough enough. but that was also the point. the point was that the investigation was limited in scope. they only interviewed about ten people. it was not an extensive investigation, and that's the way it was supposed to be by the directive of the white house. now, senator chuck grassley, then chairman of the senate judiciary committee took to the senate floor and defended the investigation, defended the fbi's investigation, and defended his own committee's investigation saying it was thorough and that there was no corroboration, but katy, there's a lot of talk about this, it resurfaced, and i don't know how fast it is going to go away. >> multiple different facets of the story. there's whether it was reported correctly in the first place, politics of whether it is a good idea for democrats to get on this impeachment wagon for another person, and the question

when that didn't happen, the chief turned his evidence over to the fbi. >> they said this is an easy case. this was a horrific situation. we'll put him away for the rest of his life. >> and then that's when the assistant u.s. attorneys told us as well. >> virginia was raising a family on the other side of the world in australia. she said she didn't know anything about the investigation until her phone rang one day. >> i was in shock. and she said, listen, have you heard about this investigation going on about epstein? >> i said, no, i don't follow the news. i watch the wiggles most days. she said, are you going to talk? i said if i don't know about any investigation going on, how am i going to call. >> the next day there was a call. this time it was epstein with an offer. >> he goes, okay, we'll take care of you if you don't talk. i said i don't want your money. i really don't. i'm living with good life over here. i just want to be left alone, guys. >> back in florida, the police chief rider was getting frustrated again, this time by lack of progress in the fbi case. so he went to se

there were 25 potential corroborating witnesses to that, none of whom the fbi talked to. so i could see why the president and his enablers would focus on the one witness who doesn't remember what happened. ic see why they do that, totally disregarding the 25 witnesses the if facebook should hafbi sh. i concluded it was a sham investigation. and the "new york times" article really points out that all of these potential witnesses were never interviewed. so it's just appalling but it is par for the course as far as i'm concerned, because mitch mcconnell's goal in life is to have as many as the heritage foundation people on the court at every levels. court packing is a huge threat to women's right to choose to voting rights to voter suppression issues, health care. all of these issues are going to come before the judges that mitch mcconnell and trump is busy places on our courts at all levels. >> thank you so much. it's a wonder why it's not becoming more of a campaign issue on the >>> coming up, the motorcycles politics of race. can joe biden hold onto support after some con

him, or these people tried to reach out to the fbi, and the fbi didn't follow up. that is causing the presidential candidates on the democratic side to go ahead to talk about how they might have to impeach justice kavanaugh, and you have mr. castro, and senator harris on that side of the ledger, and the president weighing in calling it a libel. this is what the president said this morning in a pair of tweets. he said that brett kavanaugh should start suing people for libel or the justice department should come to his rescue. the lies told about him are unbelievable and false accusations without recrimination. and so in some ways we have both sides digging in, and the president defending the supreme court justice, and mr. kavanaugh through the spokesperson has declined a comment to the new york times and they could not reach out in any arrangement of how he would talk, and there is not a lot new in coming from that side of the ledger. so i think that we will follow this story, but the president is clearly supporting his justice. >> thank you for that, hans. and we w